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The Merchant Man

M
mamaluk

Who does the merchant represent in Matt 13:45?

Anyone please? This is a genuine question, I'm a bit confused from reading several different views.

C
Christinyou

It is as if I had a great sailing ship and was a merchant going all over the world looking for treasure, seeking all I could find, then when I found a pearl or diamond or sunken ship full of Gold that was worth all that I ever had our would ever have, That is what the Gospel of salvation is to the believer, God Loves me so much that He gave His only begotten Son to be killed in my place because I was seeking great riches that will parish in my death. In finding out the the Gospel is truly what I was looking for, that is a complete new person, with Christ in me born again into God's family and now I am a son of God who own's all the riches of all time and they are mine because He has made me a son by His Son He has birthed in me. The greatest treasure of All, Christ in me the Hope of glory. That is the Pearl of great price found by the merchantman.

In Christ: Phillip

M
mamaluk

Thats sort of how I have always understood it this parable. With the lost sinner being the merchant, and the Savior being the pearl.

I heard recently that the merchant is Christ, while the pearl is His bride??

thanks Phillip


C
ChrisJD

Hi Mamaluk. I personally see in this parable the Lord Jesus giving all to purchase His Bride. :-)

If I could share this also, I see in John 4:23 something of the Merchant seeking and in Malachi 3:17 that we are His precious jewels. I see in it too that we are bought for the Kingdom rather than purchasing the Kingdom ourselves, 1Cor 6:20 - Acts 8:20. And just now Rev 5:12 comes to mind also.

Just my impressions. Hope they are helpfull to you also. I'm certainly open to hear why you may not agree :-)

Chris

M
mamaluk

Yes, I am more drawn to this interpretation very recently, just as the one lost sheep in the other parable, And, it seems more so of a Calvinistic approach.

Please let me hear more of this, I haven't made up my mind yet.

thanks

C
ChrisJD

Hi again Mamaluk,

just as the one lost sheep in the other parable

Right, and there too we see the Lord comes to seek after us, even as the prophet said

[b]All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the Lord hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.[/b]

Think too we could look at the two parables which surround this one you brought up, the treasure in the field and the net in the sea. In both cases I find the Lord drawing out His people unto Himself, His treasure, and His good fish. What do you think?

I think too, doesn't it seem hard to imagine that feeble man could offer up something worthy to be called [i]a price[/i] for something so unimaginably valuable as Heaven and eternal life, or for One so incomparable as the Son of God?

O
OverSeer

Hi Mamaluk: You wrote:

Who does the merchant represent in Matt 13:45?
A common interpretation of this parable is that the sinner finds Christ and gives up all that he possesses to gain Him and be saved. But this interpretation presents several problems.

First the Bible teaches that the sinner does not find Christ but that Christ finds the sinner. “There is none righteous, not even one; there is none who understands, there is none who seeks for God; all have turned aside, together they have become useless; there is none who does good, there is not even one” (Romans 3:10-12). Notice - [b]there is none who seeks for God[/b]. Sinful man doesn’t want to find Christ for the same reason criminals don’t want to find a policeman. Sinful man doesn’t want to find Christ for the same reason that Adam and Eve didn’t want to find God after they sinned. We don't find Christ; Christ finds us.

Second, the Bible teaches that the sinner is bankrupt – the sinner has nothing to sell and nothing to purchase with. Salvation is a free gift, and if we are going to be saved it has to be, because we have nothing to purchase it with. To teach that this parable means that the sinner finds Christ and sells all that he has to purchase Him is to make salvation by works and not by grace. The sinner seeks – which would be a work, and the sinner sells – which would be a work. The water of life is a gift to the thirsty sinner from the seeking Savior who invites him or her to come and drink. “Let him who is thirsty come; let the one who wishes, take the water of life without cost” (Revelation 22:17).

Keeping the Bible in context gives us the true interpretation of these parables. It is the Savior who seeks and the Savior who sells in order to purchase or redeem the hidden treasure or the pearl of great price.

Here are two New Testament passages that speak of our being transformed into God's possession (special or peculiar treasure)- Titus 2:14, "
[b]Who gave Himself for us[/b], [i]that He might redeem us[/i] from all iniquity, and purify unto Himself a peculiar people (special or peculiar treasure), zealous of good works." See also 1 Peter 2:9-10.

Before He sought us and bought us we were trash headed for the eternal garbage heap called Gehenna - but then He gave Himself four us, that He might redeem us from all iniquity and transformed us into His special or peculiar treasure. Praise be unto His Name! From trash to treasure - Oh! What a Savior!

Grace and peace
Olan

L
Logic

mamaluk wrote:

Thats sort of how I have always understood it this parable. With the lost sinner being the merchant, and the Savior being the pearl.

I heard recently that the merchant is Christ, while the pearl is His bride??


I agree to this interp. This is why it should be understood that way:

The theme to this chapt. is The sower of seed (Evangelistic) then the wheat & tares ([b]apocalyptic[/b]).

[u]The mustered sead[/u] is about denominations.
A mustard sead does not become a tree unles it is mutated and becomes something that it shouldn't in witch the birds(devils) nest in its branches ([b]denominations[/b])

[u]The woman took and hid leven in three measures of meal[/u]:
The Three measures of meal is the Basic Doctrines of Christianity while a harlot hides leven into it, which is never good. ([b]False doctrines that creep in[/b])

[b]Matthew 13:44[/b] [color=990000]Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto treasure hid in a field; the which when a man hath found, he hideth, and for joy thereof goeth and selleth all that he hath, and buyeth that field.[/color]

If the field is the world and [u]the hidden treasure[/u] are the souls of man, that man who sold everything to buy that field is the Christian that gives his life up for the Kingdom to preach the Gosple. ([b]Evangelistic[/b])

The field is the world in the Parable of the Wheat & Tares, so then the field is the world in this parable.

Further more, if this parable about that Man who sold everything to buy that field is Evangelistic, This parable of [b]the Pearl of great price[/b] is about a man who is looking for the truth and when he found Jesus, who is the Truth, went and sold all that he had, and bought It. ([b]the effect of evangelizing[/b])

[b]Proverb 23:23[/b] [color=990000]Buy the truth, and sell it not; also wisdom, and instruction, and understanding.[/color]
&
[b]Job 28:12[/b] [color=990000]But where shall wisdom be found? and where is the place of understanding?[/color]
[b]Job 28:18[/b] [color=990000]No mention shall be made of coral, or of [b]pearls[/b]: for the price of wisdom is above rubies.[/color]
&
[b]Mat 7:6a[/b] [color=990000]Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your [b]pearls[/b] before swine,[/color]

The next Parable of [u]the drag net[/u] is apocalyptic as the wheat & tares.

Outline of Mat.13:
1) The sower of seed (Evangelistic)
2) Wheat & tares (apocalyptic)
3) The mustered sead (reality of the Kingdom)
4) The woman and leven (reality of the Kingdom)
5) A treasure hid in a field (Evangelistic)
6) the Pearl of great price (the effect of evangelizing)
7) The wheat & tares (apocalyptic)

O
OverSeer

Logic wrote:

If the field is the world and the hidden treasure are the souls of man, that man who sold everything to buy that field is the Christian that gives his life up for the Kingdom to preach the Gosple. (Evangelistic)

The field is the world. Notice that in the parable, the man purchased the whole field and not just the treasure but the whole field isn’t the treasure but only certain items in it.
The Bible teaches us that Christ is our advocate before the Father and that “He Himself is the propitiation (satisfaction) for our sins; and not or ours only, but also for those of the whole world” (1 John 2:2).

Christ died for the whole world but the whole world will not make appropriation of His atoning sacrifice.

Christ’s death is sufficient for the whole world but efficient only for those who make proper application with His death.

No evangelist has ever "purchased the world". He doesn't have the resources. Christ did purchase it and then commissioned His [b]treasure[/b] to proclaim His excellencies in order that others may also become the people of God. "But ye are a [b]chosen[/b] generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people (special treasure); [i]that ye should shew forth the praises of Him who hath called you out of darkness into His marvelous light: [/i] which in time past were not a people, but now are the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy" (1 Peter 2:9-10).

The hidden treasure are the redeemed; God's special and peculiar people (Titus 2:14). See also Exodus 19:5-6; Deuteronomy 14:2; and Psalm 135:4.

The immediate context of Scripture never violates the over-all context of Scripture. The two are in agreement and establish a faithful witness.

Grace and peace
Olan

L
Logic


OverSeer wrote:

The field is the world. Notice that in the parable, the man purchased the whole field and not just the treasure but the whole field isn’t the treasure but only certain items in it.

&
No evangelist has ever "purchased the world". He doesn't have the resources.
The subject is not that he purchases the world, but that sells all that he has. for that treasure in wich God treasures(His creation)
It is not what he bought that is the subject but what he sold for it.
Would you sell all that you have to "go and sell that you have? [b]Mat 19:21[/b]

The immediate context of Scripture never violates the over-all context of Scripture. The two are in agreement and establish a faithful witness.

I know, that is why I Outlined it
Mat.13:
1) The sower of seed (Evangelistic)
2) Wheat & tares (apocalyptic)
3) The mustered sead (reality of the Kingdom)
4) The woman and leven (reality of the Kingdom)
5) A treasure hid in a field (Evangelistic)
6) the Pearl of great price (the effect of evangelizing)
7) The wheat & tares (apocalyptic)

O
OverSeer

Logic wrote:

The subject is not that he purchases the world, but that sells all that he has. for that treasure in wich God treasures(His creation)
and
If the field is the world and the hidden treasure are the souls of man, that man who sold everything to buy that field is the Christian that gives his life up for the Kingdom to preach the Gosple. (Evangelistic)
According to the logic that you are using then the evangelist (Christian who gives his life up for the Kingdom to preach the Gospel) is the one who purchases the souls of men. In that case they belong to the evangelist (who gave his life) and not the Lord (who gave Himself up that He might redeem us and transform us into His special people/treasure).

In Matthew 19:21 Jesus was dealing with a man whose God was his money. In other places where the Lord says that we have to love Him more than father, mother, wife, husband, etc.; the purpose is not to show that we can actually "buy" treasure but that what we "do treasure" can keep us from "becoming His treasure."

The purpose of the gospel is to transform us into His treasure so that we treasure Him above all else. We love Him because He first loved us - not the other way around. Then, because we love Him for His purchasing us, we no longer live for ourselves, but for Him who died for us and rose again (2 Corinthians 5:15). Evangelism is an assignment and purpose of the treasure that Christ has purchased - "and hath committed unto us the ministry of reconciliation" (2 Corinthians 5:18). We who have been sought and bought are to proclaim the excellencies of Him who sought us and bought us (see 1 Peter 2:9).

Grace and peace
Olan

C
Christinyou

1 Corinthians 3:21-23 Therefore let no man glory in men. For all things are yours; Whether Paul, or Apollos, or Cephas, or the world, or life, or death, or things present, or things to come; all are yours; And ye are Christ's; and Christ is God's.

Ephesians 3:8 Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ;

Colossians 2:3 In whom are hid all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge.

Isaiah 33:6 And wisdom and knowledge shall be the stability of thy times, and strength of salvation: the fear of the LORD is his treasure.

1 John 5:11-12 And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

The Father is the One that gives us to the Son. If God were the merchantman He would not be seeking, He knows those that are His, and Christ said he would loose none except Judas to fulfill the scriptures. He will loose none else that are given Him.

Christ is the Pearl of Great Price, in fact Priceless and unable to attain unless the treasure map by His Father is given those that find it.

In Christ: Phillip

M
myfirstLove

hmmmmm......seems like a calvinist and arminiast battle going on here ;-)

O
OverSeer

Hi Phillip: You said:

Christ is the Pearl of Great Price, in fact Priceless and unable to attain unless the treasure map by His Father is given those that find it.
Which is the greatest: the treasure, or, the One who purchases the treasure? Actually the church is the Pearl of Great Price and Christ is the One who sought and bought. T Austin Sparks has a great message on this parable under "Audio Sermons."

Grace and peace
Olan

O
OverSeer

hmmmmm......seems like a calvinist and arminiast battle going on here
Not really. John Macarthur is a calvinist and he interprets these parables differently. I am not a calvinist as seen in one of my previous posts on this thread. I believe that Christ died for the sins of the whole world.

Grace and peace
Olan

C
ChrisJD

Beloved brothers, what wealth do we have with which to purchase anything? Will God sell His incorruptible riches for that which is corruptible?

Is not our possesion of the Kingdom upon our confession of being poor in spirit?

Did not the Lord say [b][color=660033]freely you have received[/color][/b]

What, will we give up our entire lives then? Indeed, but then what is that

[b][color=000000] I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.[/color][/b]

but our [b][color=000000]reasonable service[/color][/b]?

And so, having done even this would not the Lord tell us

[b][color=660033]So likewise ye, when ye shall have done all those things which are commanded you, say, We are unprofitable servants: we have done that which was our duty to do.[/color][/b]

How then shall we purchase anything, having no currency with which to spend? What is the reply of the prophet?


[b] Ho, every one that thirsteth, come ye to the waters, and he that hath no money; come ye, buy, and eat; yea, come, buy wine and milk without money and without price.[/b]

[b]Wherefore do ye spend money for that which is not bread? and your labour for that which satisfieth not? [u]hearken diligently unto me[/u], [i]and eat ye that which is good[/i], and let your soul delight itself in fatness.[/b]

[b] [u]Incline your ear[/u], [i]and come unto me[/i]: [u]hear, and your soul shall live[/u]; and I will make an everlasting covenant with you, even the sure mercies of David.[/b]

[b] Behold, [u]I have given[/u][/b] [b][color=660033]Him[/color][/b][b] for a witness to the people, a leader and commander to the people.[/b]

M
mamaluk

Saints,

This does seem like a bit of a debate between the Arm. and the Cal. Just by reading each of your posts warm my heart and mind tremendously, I can't tell you why, to see that you all loving and caring about the Scripture so much, studying It, defending It and sharing It so beautifully, I am very touched indeed.


I held the Arminianistic view in my younger Christian years, but now, I embrace Calvin's views of high grace thoroughly, and seems like there's no going back. God's grace is so so so so precious and must never be undermined, and that has to be to the jot. However, I wouldn't want to label myself a Calvinist anymore than Calvin would have wanted anyone else to call themselves by his name. (Knowing what little I knew of this humble saint, he most likely would be the last person who condones to sectarianism.)

Overseer, ChristJD, I think you have convinced me of this new found view in my mind. :) No, no, it's the doctrine of election really. For us Christians, everything , EVERY littlest thing that's good, comes from above. This is why, in my mind, this merchant has to be Christ, with His sacrifice for the elect given to Him by the Father. Lost sinners, as much as they labor to be the merchants, will not be able to seek out this pearl on their own.

Looking at this in the active or passive mode,
if the merchant is the active one, he has to be Christ. The fundamental comprehension and conviction of high Grace often permeates into one's application and interpretation of Scriptures, hopefully along with sound hermeneutics.

Phillip, this is probably the first time I have to disagree with you in interpretation, and with myself really,to my old way of thinking, but I fully appreciate the spiritual application behind your exegesis. Because that interpretation can carry a degree of exhortation for sinners ( the merchants ) to repent and come to Grace.

Logic, I like your outline on these parables, since I have a compartmentalized mind and tend to enjoy outlines a lot. I agree with a few of them as well.

I feel so blessed to be able to solicit answer this way. Praise God so much for you all !

ever so sincerely thankful

S
sermonindex

Beloved brothers, what wealth do we have with which to purchase anything? Will God sell His incorruptible riches for that which is corruptible?

Jesus says if we give up everything we can be His disciple.

M
myfirstLove

like what he told the rich young ruler, to sell all and give to the poor and then you will have riches in heaven. and, like when He told the crowd that we must forsake all in order to be His disciple.

M
mamaluk

:) :) God is too good, isn't HE?

L
Logic


OverSeer wrote:
According to the logic that you are using then the evangelist (Christian who gives his life up for the Kingdom to preach the Gospel) is the one who purchases the souls of men. In that case they belong to the evangelist (who gave his life) and not the Lord (who gave Himself up that He might redeem us and transform us into His special people/treasure).

It is a parable, not real life.
Furthermore, he buys the field in which the tresure is hidden, he does not buy the tresure itself.
mamaluk wrote:
Logic, I like your outline on these parables, since I have a compartmentalized mind and tend to enjoy outlines a lot. I agree with a few of them as well.
Thanx

I am neather a calvinist nor an arminiast, I tend more to Molinist.

M
myfirstLove

Molinist- God allows us to choose our actions yet knows in advance what course we will choose. Key is the idea that God possesses total knowledge of how any free agent would act in any given circumstance. Thus, given agent A and circumstances C, God is said to know what action that person would freely choose.

i've never heard of the name molinist, but i agree with the definition.

i'm not an armianist or calvinist. i don't even know much about either of them, just the basic. i just believe God's word, but most people would call me an arminian.

sorry to label you guys. i don't like labels either. i can see some truth in both and i also can see some wrongs in both cal/arm.

God bless,
lisa

C
Christinyou

1Cr 6:20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.

We are not the price or the pearl. Matthew 13:45-46 Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a merchant man, seeking goodly pearls: Who, when he had found one pearl of great price, went and sold all that he had, and bought it.

Who sought goodly pearls for over 5000 years? It was God and when God found the One Pearl of Great price God, He gave all that He had, that is His only begotten Son, then paid the price, that is the precious blood of His Son and bought bought forgiveness for all that believe, with the greatest price of all the death of His Son, being the only price that could be paid for the redemption of the sin of the world. Not to purchase mankind or the church but pay the price with His Son to save man and the church that would believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of the living God. Christ was the price paid for the sin of the whole world. Not the Body of Christ His Church upon which He will build His Church on the Revelation that Jesus Christ is the Son of the Living God.

Goodly pearls could not do it by the Law. The Pearl of Great Price was the only One that could do it, by His Life given for His Body the Church. Jesus Christ is the Pearl of Great Price, not the church. We are His Body, born of God paid with the price that was Paid for by all that God had, His only begotten Son. WE are that important to God but we are not the Pearl of Great Price that bought us, bought us with His Death. There is no Pearl that had or has any greater price than Jesus Christ Our Lord.

God was looking for the only Pearl that could pay the price and we like Him are also looking for the Pearl that will pay for our sin. That is Jesus Christ Himself our Pearl of Great Price also and He paid the Price on the Cross for our sin. Again we are not the Pearl. God Paid the Price with the Pearl.

In Christ: Phillip

O
OverSeer

Logic wrote:

It is a parable, not real life.
Yes it's a parable and according to Jesus, parables are for giving understanding of the mysteries of the kingdom to those who have received the truth and for concealing any further truth from those who have rejected the truth (Matthew 13:10-13). Therefore the truths revealed in parables line up with real life - real kingdom life!
Furthermore, he buys the field in which the tresure is hidden, he does not buy the tresure itself.
Why does he buy the field? The answer is plain as day - he buys the field for the joy of the treasure which he has found.

Grace and peace
Olan

M
mamaluk

Phillip,


All well and perfectly said! I agree with all that you said except that, the Church in Christ is that Pearl !! :)

The Pearl is the Church redeemed by Christ's Blood, wherein Him It dwells.


[i]46Who, when he had found one pearl of great price, went and sold all that he had, and bought it.[/i]

I read it this way,
The Merchant, the Son left all that He had in heaven , came down to 'buy'/redeem the Church , with His Blood.

Since this is a kingdom parable, the Merchant, can be seen as the Messiah, coming to die for the Elect Israel who would repent and be baptized as well, I think.

In Christ, mamaluk

:-) mamaluk

L
Logic

Christinyou wrote:
Who sought goodly pearls for over 5000 years? It was God and when God found the One Pearl of Great price God, He gave all that He had, that is His only begotten Son.

The father never had to find the One Pearl of Great price for He was always with Him, therefore He never had to pay for It.

then paid the price, that is the precious blood of His Son and bought bought forgiveness for all that believe

In your view, with the greatest price of all being the death of His Son, this would be paying for the world of which He bought, not for the pearl. He did pay for the world but that does not make sense with the concept of this parable.

Here, you are saying that the One Pearl of Great price is the forgiveness for all that believe, so then the Pearl of Great priceis not Jesus but us.

Further more it is not only for those that believe but for the whole world.

Not to purchase mankind or the church but pay the price with His Son to save man and the church that would believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of the living God.
Your contradicting your premis here. These two statements are the same but you are trying to make the diferent.

Christ was the price paid for the sin of the whole world.

Here you are makeing the Pearl of great price the sin of the whole world. Please make up your mind.

and He paid the Price on the Cross for our sin.
Here, you say it again, our sin is the Pearl of Great Price for which He paid.

This parable of the Pearl of great price is about a man who is looking for the truth(pearls) and when he found Jesus(Pearl of Great Price), who is the Truth, went and sold all that he had and bought It. The great price is our very life (sold all that he had)

This is the only way to make sense of this parable in context of the whole chapter.

M
mamaluk

The great price is our very life (sold all that he had)

Logic, no no, this is where it does not fit !!
We have nothing, nothing but loads of sins! We have nothing to sell to buy this Pearl, according to your view!!

O
OverSeer

Phillip wrote:

1Cr 6:20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.
We are not the price or the pearl. Matthew 13:45-46 Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a merchant man, seeking goodly pearls: Who, when he had found one pearl of great price, went and sold all that he had, and bought it.

1 Corinthians 6:20 shows exactly what this parable is teaching - [b]we are the ones bought[/b] and after we are bought [b]we glorify God[/b] - we proclaim His excellencies - not ours! In both parables, hid treasure and pearl of great price, there is a purchase made to obtain the treasure and the pearl. There was a purchase made to obtain those who would proclaim the glory of God - "Knowing that you were not [b]redeemed[/b] with perishable things like silver or gold from [i]your futile way of life[/i] (we were trash before we were redeemed and made into treasure) inherited from your forefathers, but with [i][b]precious blood[/b][/i], as of a lamb unblemished and spotless, [i][b]the blood of Christ[/b][/i]" (1 Peter 1:18-19).

God Paid the Price with the Pearl.
According to the parable it was the pearl that was sought and the pearl that was bought - "he went and sold all that he had [b]and bought it[/b]".
Not to purchase mankind or the church
Acts 20:28 - "...shepherd the church of God [b]which He purchased with His own blood[/b]."
Christ was the price paid for the sin of the whole world.
That my brother is exactly what these two parables are teaching - hence He buys the field (world) and out of it redeems His treasure (that at one time lived in futility). Christ was the price not the treasure which makes Him greater than the treasure or the pearl. It is the price He paid that transforms us into His treasure or pearl (see Titus 2:14). Therefore these parables in no way exalt the value of the redeemed over the Redeemer. He is the worthy One and the only reason we have any worth is He sought us and bought us with His redeeming blood! O victory in Jesus! "Worthy are You to take the book and to break its seals; for You were slain, [i]and purchased for God with Your blood [/i] men from every tribe and tongue and people and nation. You have made them to be a kingdom and priests to our God; and they will reign upon the earth" (Revelation 5:9-10).

Keep exalting the Lord brother - He is worthy! You are right, "There is no Pearl that had or has any greater price than Jesus Christ our Lord." He is not the pearl - He is greater than the pearl - He bought it!

Grace and peace
Olan

L
Logic


OverSeer wrote:
Why does he buy the field? The answer is plain as day - he buys the field for the joy of the treasure which he has found.

Yes, the tresure is the very thing that God tresurse, His own creation(the souls of man).
The field is the Mission field.
Since we have the haert of our Lord, we prize what He prizes.
[b]John 4:35[/b] [color=990000]Say not ye, There are yet four months, and then cometh harvest? behold, I say unto you, Lift up your eyes, and look on the [b]fields[/b]; for they are white already to harvest.[/color], [b]Matthew 9:38, Luke 10:2[/b]


mamaluk wrote:
All well and perfectly said! I agree with all that you said except that, the Church in Christ is that Pearl !! :)

The Pearl is the Church redeemed by Christ's Blood, wherein Him It dwells.

The Pearl of great price= Church in Christ.
The Merchant= the Son who is the Christ.
Therefor The Pearl of great price is in The Merchant and/or Church in Christ is in The Merchant

You are saying the [u]Church in Christ[/u] is that Pearl and The Merchant(the Christ) buys that Pearl(the Church in The Merchant), therefore, the Merchant buys that which is in Himself. :-?


mamaluk wrote:
The great price is our very life (sold all that he had)

Logic, no no, this is where it does not fit !!
We have nothing, nothing but loads of sins! We have nothing to sell to buy this Pearl, according to your view!!


We have our life. [b]Luke 17:33[/b] [color=990000]If anyone makes an attempt to keep his life, it will be taken from him, but if anyone gives up his life, he will keep it.[/color] The word life in Greek is translated as your soul, your life, or your self.

Me thinks y'all are over spiritualising this

O
OverSeer

Logic wrote:

This parable of the Pearl of great price is about a man who is looking for the truth(pearls) and when he found Jesus(Pearl of Great Price), who is the Truth, went and sold all that he had and bought It. The great price is our very life (sold all that he had)
Is there no way that this parable is about a man who is looking for treasure/pearls (peculiar/special people) and he (Jesus), went and sold all that he had and bought it? "You know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that though He was rich, yet for your sake He became poor, so that you through His poverty might become rich" (2 Corinthians 8:9).

Grace and peace
Olan

M
mamaluk

You are saying the Church in Christ is that Pearl and The Merchant(the Christ) buys that Pearl(the Church in The Merchant), therefore, the Merchant buys that which is in Himself.

:-?

Distort or make light of what I tried to say is fine, but making the face, that's rude ! (edited , not Pastor Olan, my apologies)If I were sitting there with you, and wanting to learn from you, would you make that face at me? Even if my knowledge is totally wrong or immature? Attitude, my dear pastor, its always attitude, not who we are, how much we know, Christian or not Christian, be respectful, always !!

If we all overspiritualized the parable, would it call for your judgment?


edited

L
Logic

Phi 2:5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:

Read these parables from prayer in context with the theme of the whole chapt, not preconcieved theological concepts.

[b]Mark 4:13[/b] [color=990000]And he said unto them, Know ye not this parable? and how then will ye know all parables?[/color]
Jesus is asaying here, if you don't understand this parable, you can't understand any of them. In other words, The parables that are explained are the keys to all parables.

[b]Matthew 13:24[/b] [color=990000]Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field:[/color]

If the feild is the world then the treasure would be berried in the world also. What does God treasure but his own creation. Who are in the world but sinners. Who are to go into all the world but us, and make desiples.

Who are merchants [b]in this world[/b] but people, [b]James 4:13[/b], [b]Isa 55:1-2[/b]
What are pearls through out the Bible?
[b]Proverb 23:23[/b] [color=990000]Buy the truth, and sell it not; also wisdom, and instruction, and understanding.[/color]
&
[b]Job 28:12[/b] [color=990000]But where shall wisdom be found? and where is the place of understanding?[/color]
[b]Job 28:18[/b] [color=990000]No mention shall be made of coral, or of [b]pearls[/b]: for the price of wisdom is above rubies.[/color]
&
[b]Mat 7:6a[/b] [color=990000]Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your [b]pearls[/b] before swine,[/color]

Distort or make light of what I tried to say is fine, but making the face, that's rude ! :)Pastor Olan!! If I were sitting there with you, and wanting to learn from you, would you make that face at me? Even if my knowledge is totally wrong or immature? Attitude, my dear pastor, its always attitude, not who we are, how much we know, Christian or not Christian, be respectful, always !!

I do appologise, it isn't an ugly face but a confused face

Further more, it isn't a distortion but a literal of what you explained.

I was useing a logic called If-Then Statements These kinds of if-then statements are called conditional statements, or just conditionals.

M
mamaluk

Logic,

I read your previous post into Overseer's, and got totally confused. Those little faces, which I recently learned to use but avoid using, can come across unbecomingly sometimes. Sorry for being edgy earlier.

No no, discussions are part of the learning process. What triggered that bit of emotion was frankly due to my past experiences with many prideful pastors at where I live. ( near a prestiguous seminary ). One gets nothing but major attitude from many 'pastors' from that school.

Sigh..something about this new generation of pastors from this seminary !

sorry for the mix up, Logic and Olan!

O
OverSeer

Logic wrote:

Read these parables from prayer in context with the theme of the whole chapt, not preconcieved theological concepts.
I have done that not only in context with the whole chapter but also in context of the whole of Scripture. I said before and I say again that immediate context and over-all context are in agreement to establish a faithful and true witness. It is when these two line up that you can know for sure that you have accurate interpretation of what God has said and not "private interpretation".

So let's deal with Scripture and logic - Jesus used both - He is even the Logos! Here is the interpretation that I have offered as being in line both with immediate and over-all context of Scripture:

Is there no way that this parable is about a man who is looking for treasure/pearls (peculiar/special people) and he (Jesus), went and sold all that he had and bought it? "You know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that though He was rich, yet for your sake He became poor, so that you through His poverty might become rich" (2 Corinthians 8:9).
This may violate your theological framework but it does not and will not violate Scripture because this is what Scripture teaches - we are the one's sought and we are the one's bought - we are not the seekers nor the buyers. You said:
This parable of the Pearl of great price is about a man who is looking for the truth(pearls) and when he found Jesus(Pearl of Great Price), who is the Truth, went and sold all that he had and bought It. The great price is our very life (sold all that he had)
First of all it cannot be that we are the man seeking and finding - "There is none who seeks for God" (Romans 3:11). And Jesus said, "I have come to seek and save that which is lost" (Luke 19:10) and "No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him" (John 6:44). We don't seek Him, He seeks us and we don't find Him, He finds us - that is the testimony of Scripture.

Secondly, we don't sell all we have and buy Jesus - we are bankrupt sinners - we were poor and He became poor so that we could become rich (2 Corinthians 8:9). We could sell all that we had and never have enough to purchase Christ - He is the King of Glory! I don't minimize His value - I magnify His value - the One who sought and bought is greater than the ones who were sought and bought. We are redeemed; we have been bought with a price - then we no longer live for ourselves but for Him who loved us and bought us (see 2 Corinthians 5:15) - this is where giving up all and following Him comes in - after we are bought, not before.

Grace and peace
Olan

C
Christinyou

Ok, my study has led me to another conclusion and I believe the Holy Spirit is confirming it in me. Jesus Came to redeem the world and pay the price. The merchantman must be Jesus Christ, and the Pearl of Great price must be the Bride of Christ. The pearl to the Jewish person is of very low status in the realm of jewels, especially during this time of Jesus. The Jewish nations upheld rubies, diamonds, and other colored stones that were of jewelry grade, but for the gentiles the pearl was their symbol of expression of status.

Now Jesus isn't the pearl of great price, that you have to sell everything and buy Him. The gift of Jesus is by free grace to you. He is the one, who gave everything, in order that He might redeem you.

The Pearl of Great price is the Bride of Christ. Even in the new Jerusalem our Fathers house where Jesus is preparing a place of her and will come again and get her leads to this conclusion ever more. Now Jesus isn't the pearl of great price, that you have to sell everything and buy Him. The gift of Jesus is by free grace to you. He is the one, who gave everything, in order that He might redeem you.

Think about the severely gates in the New Jerusalem. Rev 21:21 And the twelve gates [were] twelve pearls; every several gate was of (one pearl): and the street of the city [was] pure gold, as it were transparent glass.

Quote: "One Pearl" Mat 13:46 Who, when he had found (one pearl) of great price, went and sold all that he had, and bought it.

What a wonder He is and what a perfect Teacher we have. Thanks to every body that an old traditional song that lead me to believe the Christ was the Pearl has been corrected.

In Christ: Phillip

L
Logic

This parable of the Pearl of great price is about a man who is looking for the [b]truth[/b], not Jesus and when he found the truth, went and sold all that he had, and bought It.

[b]Proverb 23:23[/b] [color=990000]Buy the truth, and sell it not; also wisdom, and instruction, and understanding.[/color]
&
[b]Job 28:12[/b] [color=990000]But where shall [b]wisdom[/b] be found? and where is the place of [b]understanding[/b]?[/color]
[b]Job 28:18[/b] [color=990000]No mention shall be made of coral, or of [b]pearls[/b]: for the price of wisdom is above rubies.[/color]
&
[b]Mat 7:6a[/b] [color=990000]Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your [b]pearls[/b] before swine,[/color]

Sinners can & do seek for truth.
We must us scripture to interpret scripture and use what we are give:
We are to read pearls, nothing else and don't read anything into it but what we are give
I have shown what the Bible sais pearls are. you should make them what they are not. don't call the Pearl of great price Jesus because as we see, it is the truth or wisdom, instruction, and understanding, which comes from truth.

We are to buy and to purchase which means that we have ability as the above Scriptures say and these: [b]Mat 25:9[/b] [color=990000]But the wise answered, saying, Not so; lest there be not enough for us and you: but go ye rather to them that sell, and buy for yourselves.[/color]
[b]Rev 3:18[/b] [color=990000]I counsel thee to buy [b]of Me[/b] gold tried in the fire,[/color]

You are correct that we don't seek after God(Jesus) and we can not buy Him. However, one can seek after truth. When God reviels Himself to that one, that is when he finds the Truth.
I did give consessions before saying that Jesus is the Pearl of great price but only because He is the Truth and only because of that.

O
OverSeer

Logic wrote:

This parable of the Pearl of great price is about a man who is looking for the truth, not Jesus and when he found the truth, went and sold all that he had, and bought It.
But you said ealier : "This parable of the Pearl of great price is about a man who is looking for the truth(pearls) and when he found Jesus(Pearl of Great Price), who is the Truth, went and sold all that he had and bought It. The great price is our very life (sold all that he had)

This is the only way to make sense of this parable in context of the whole chapter."

Now you say: "I have shown what the Bible sais pearls are. you should make them what they are not. don't call the Pearl of great price Jesus because as we see, it is the truth or wisdom, instruction, and understanding, which comes from truth"

And: "I did give consessions before saying that Jesus is the Pearl of great price but only because He is the Truth and only because of that."

But: mamaluk wrote:
Quote:

Thats sort of how I have always understood it this parable. With the lost sinner being the merchant, and the Savior being the pearl.

Logic said: "I agree to this interp. This is why it should be understood that way:"

But now notice the inconsistencies of your interpretation that are in no way in line with the immediate and over-all context of Scripture. About the parable of the hidden treasure you say: "If the field is the world and the hidden treasure are the souls of man, that man who sold everything to buy that field is the Christian that gives his life up for the Kingdom to preach the Gosple. (Evangelistic)" So according to your interpretation the evangelist (man who sold everything to preach) buys the field (world) and that by giving his life. Which means that the evangelist sought and the evangelist bought the "souls of men." So you have lost men who are being sought and bought by evangelists and they would now belong to the evangelist and not Jesus.

In your interpretation of the parable of the pearl of great value you say: "Further more, if this parable about that Man who sold everything to buy that field is Evangelistic, This parable of the Pearl of great price is about a man who is looking for the truth and when he found Jesus, who is the Truth, went and sold all that he had, and bought It. (the effect of evangelizing)" Now you have lost men that are not being sought by the evangelist but lost men who are seeking truth - and you claim that this is the "effect of evangelizing." In your interpretation the two parables actually contradict each other and do not establish the truth that is taught in Scripture. You are getting closer though - at least now you know that Jesus is not the "Pearl of Great Price" and it won't be long until you realize that He is the merchant who seeks and buys. O what a Savior!

Let the redeemed of the Lord say so!
Grace and peace
Olan


L
Logic


OverSeer wrote:
Which means that the evangelist sought and the evangelist bought the "souls of men." So you have lost men who are being sought and bought by evangelists and they would now belong to the evangelist and not Jesus.

[b]Prov 11:30[/b] [color=990000]The fruit of the righteous is a tree of life; and [b]he that wins souls is wise.[/b][/color]
If we can win them, what is wrong with buying them?
However, it does not say that he bought the tresure, as I have already said, he buys the feald and therefor gains the tresure.

Now you have lost men that are not being sought by the evangelist but lost men who are seeking truth - and you claim that this is the "effect of evangelizing."

Say that God wants to reviel the truth to a man who is seeking it. He will send them an evangelist to give them the truth and then they will find it.

M
mamaluk

Phillip,

The merchantman must be Jesus Christ, and the Pearl of Great price must be the Bride of Christ. The pearl to the Jewish person is of very low status in the realm of jewels, especially during this time of Jesus. The Jewish nations upheld rubies, diamonds, and other colored stones that were of jewelry grade, but for the gentiles the pearl was their symbol of expression of status.

Glad you came to the same conclusion. Thanks for the bit on the valuation of pearls as well, interesting.

What a wonder He is and what a perfect Teacher we have

Yeah, you can say that over and over again! Praise Him!

O
OverSeer

Logic wrote: "Prov 11:30 The fruit of the righteous is a tree of life; and he that wins souls is wise.
If we can win them, what is wrong with buying them?"

1. Winning and buying are two different things
2. According to Proverbs 11:30, who are the souls won to? If to us they belong to us; if to Jesus they belong to Jesus.
3. How do we win souls? Do we win souls by "giving our very lives", or do we win souls by "being the Lord's special treasure, proclaiming the excellencies of Him who called us out of darkness [b]into His glorious kingdom of light[/b]?"
4. If we win souls by "giving our lives" then they are our converts and not the Lords - "Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites, because you travel around on sea and land to make one proselyte; and when he becomes one, you make him twice as much a son of hell as yourselves" (Matthew 23:15).
5. If we win souls by "being the Lord's special treasure, proclaiming the excellencies of Him who called us out of darkness into His glorious kingdom of light", then they are His converts and He receives the reward of His suffering.
6. If we buy souls, they belong to us - if He buys them they belong to Him
7. This is the difference between doing something for God or God doing something through us. This is the difference between the gospel infected with philosophical humanism (evangelism for the sake of man) and the gospel of the glory of Christ (evangelism for His sake). Doing evangelism for His sake has a by-product of being for man's sake; but that is not the prime product ("May the Lamb that was slain receive the reward of His suffering")

What is a pearl?
1. A valuable jewel
2. A value-less grain of sand transformed into a valuable jewel through the suffering of the one doing the transforming (the oyster)! The greater the suffering the greater the value - therefore - the pearl of [b]great value[/b]. "[i]As a result[/i] [b]of the anguish of His soul[/b], He will see it and be satisfied" (Isaiah 53:11).

However, it does not say that he bought the tresure, as I have already said, he buys the feald and therefor gains the tresure.
The purpose of buying the field is to buy the treasure - no treasure, no deal! [b]But[/b], the Lord knew that magnifying His glory by suffering for our sin would yield its reward - "As a result of the anguish of His soul, [b]He will see it and be satisfied[/b]" (Isaiah 53:11). This is in-line with 1 John 2:2 where the Lord paid for the whole world but only those who make proper application with His sacrifice are transformed into His treasure.

If your interpretation of these two parables are correct then "seeker-sensitive" is the way to go. If you are incorrect then exalting the glory of Christ through the gospel and living for Him and no longer for ourselves is the way to go.

Grace and peace
Olan

L
Logic

If you can't understand that the parable says that we buy the field and not the treasure, I don't know what else to say.

If Jesus intended for it to mean that the man buys the treasure, He would have said that "he went and sold all that he had, and bought the treasure." as Jesus said about the Pearl of great price.
Stop reading into it. Read only what it says.

Further more, if he found the tresure, he would own it then by default. There would be know reason to buy what one has found.

One can say that we buy mission field as giveing ones life for the missions.
We would do that for we know the value of the souls(the tresure)

O
OverSeer

, Logic wrote:

If you can't understand that the parable says that we buy the field and not the treasure, I don't know what else to say.
Does the world belong to you? Have you bought it? Psalm 24:1 "The earth is the Lord's, and all it contains, [b]the world[/b] [i]and those who dwell in it[/i]." Maybe in your studies of Scripture you have never noticed the flow of Psalms 22, 23, and 24. Psalm 22 is about the crucifixion of the Good Shepherd who lays down His life for His sheep. Psalm 23 is about the Great Shepherd raised from the dead leading and feeding His sheep. Psalm 24 is about the Chief Shepherd - who owns the world and all it contains - as the King of glory entering Zion. My interpretation does no violation to any other portion of Scripture - your's does!
If Jesus intended for it to mean that the man buys the treasure, He would have said that "he went and sold all that he had, and bought the treasure." as Jesus said about the Pearl of great price.
I am not reading into it; you are. The true logic and intention of the parable is not that the man bought the field for the sake of buying the field, he bought the field because of the treasure which means that he also bought the treasure by buying the field - once again this is in-line with the Word of God - see 1 John 2:2.
Further more, if he found the tresure, he would own it then by default. There would be know reason to buy what one has found.
So let's say that I come on some property that you own and find oil flowing from the ground - does that make the oil mine because I found it? - no! You own the property. Should I find gold will the gold belong to me by default? No! What if I take it? Then I am a thief. What if I buy your land? Then I own the mineral rights also! So you could say that when I bought your land I also bought the oil or the gold. There is a reason to buy what one has found if you want to own it in a righteous manner. There is a story of a little boy who once made a toy boat and lost it in a stream and then one day saw it again in the window of a toy shop. He went in and bought his toy boat and said, "My little precious boat, you are now twice mine; once I made you and once I bought you." He found it in the hands of someone else and then redeemed it. Does that sound familiar?
One can say that we buy mission field as giveing ones life for the missions.
You can! I can't! The Bible doesn't teach such nonsense. I have given my life to follow Jesus - and I don't own nor have I bought the mission field. I'm just one of the redeemed of the Lord (hidden treasure) bought by His blood which was and is sufficient for the whole world (field), proclaiming His excellencies. I do that because I know the value of Him who sought and bought - He didn't send me out there for them, He sent me out there for Him. Isaiah wasn't asked, "Who will go for them", he was asked, "Who will go for us?" He was sent to a people who would not listen and was told that was going to be the case. Missions are for the Lord's sake with the by-product being for the sake of those who will listen. "May the Lamb that was slain receive the reward of His suffering." If you have not listened to [i]Ten Shekels and a Shirt[/i] by Paris Reidhead then I would highly recommend it.

Grace and peace
Olan

M
mamaluk


excellent, Olan, it's always encouraging to see one 'thinking' through Scriptures by faith and prayers as well

for i dont know how many of my ex-believing years, i was only a spoon-fed child of God, never took the time to think and reason but just blindly 'amen' It down into my heart, in turn, all just dissipate guickly..

thanks

L
Logic

OverSeer wrote:
Does the world belong to you? Have you bought it? Psalm 24:1 "The earth is the Lord's, and all it contains, [b]the world[/b] [i]and those who dwell in it[/i]." Maybe in your studies of Scripture you have never noticed the flow of Psalms 22, 23, and 24. Psalm 22 is about the crucifixion of the Good Shepherd who lays down His life for His sheep. Psalm 23 is about the Great Shepherd raised from the dead leading and feeding His sheep. Psalm 24 is about the Chief Shepherd - who owns the world and all it contains - as the King of glory entering Zion. My interpretation does no violation to any other portion of Scripture - your's does!

Still, the parable sais he bought the field. I am soon to give all for the missions to the Philippines. I will have nothing to call my own. It might be at the cost of my very life with the Muslems there. All for the Glory of God. I know the tresure in that field which Jesus is worthy to recieve for His sufferings.

I am not reading into it; you are. The true logic and intention of the parable is not that the man bought the field for the sake of buying the field, he bought the field because of the treasure which means that he also bought the treasure by buying the field - once again this is in-line with the Word of God - see 1 John 2:2.

No, He [b]gained[/b] the treasure by buying the field. We must look at it like this and not as buying the tresure with the field, that would increase the price in which he can not afford because he would be buying both.

Buying the tresuer is more than he has or is worth. He couldnt buy the tresure, that is why when he found the tresure hidden in a field he buries it again and goes and buys the field & not the tresure.

I am not reading into it; you are. The true logic and intention of the parable is not that the man bought the field for the sake of buying the field, he bought the field because of the treasure which means that he also bought the treasure by buying the field - once again this is in-line with the Word of God

Like I said above, but He does not directly buy the tresure as you are implying, It is much better to say that he gains the tresure by buying the field. I know that I will gain souls [b]for my lord[/b] in the Philippines.

So let's say that I come on some property that you own and find oil flowing from the ground - does that make the oil mine because I found it? - no! You own the property. Should I find gold will the gold belong to me by default? No! What if I take it? Then I am a thief. What if I buy your land? Then I own the mineral rights also! So you could say that when I bought your land I also bought the oil or the gold. There is a reason to buy what one has found if you want to own it in a righteous manner. There is a story of a little boy who once made a toy boat and lost it in a stream and then one day saw it again in the window of a toy shop. He went in and bought his toy boat and said, "My little precious boat, you are now twice mine; once I made you and once I bought you." He found it in the hands of someone else and then redeemed it. Does that sound familiar?

O.k you got it there. I do apologise.

One can say that we buy mission field as giveing ones life for the missions.
You can! I can't! The Bible doesn't teach such nonsense. I have given my life to follow Jesus - and I don't own nor have I bought the mission field. I'm just one of the redeemed of the Lord (hidden treasure) bought by His blood which was and is sufficient for the whole world (field), proclaiming His excellencies. I do that because I know the value of Him who sought and bought - He didn't send me out there for them, He sent me out there for Him. Isaiah wasn't asked, "Who will go for them", he was asked, "Who will go for us?" He was sent to a people who would not listen and was told that was going to be the case. Missions are for the Lord's sake with the by-product being for the sake of those who will listen. "May the Lamb that was slain receive the reward of His suffering." If you have not listened to Ten Shekels and a Shirt by Paris Reidhead then I would highly recommend it.
Partly Amen!

The fact is that I realy am selling all that I have for the Philippines. In a way, I am buying the Philippines Because all the proceeds go for the missions. Furthermore, of what I give of myself(my life, my time, my future).

One can say that it realy isn't my life that I am giveing because Christ owns it. But that is another way of looking at it all together.

However, I think this is a matter of semantics and the point of view.
You are correct in one way, while I can be correct in another.
An example of views:
Pharaoh's vission of the statue in one view. The four beasts in another view.
Same meaning to two vissions or views.
Buy the way, I love that sermon by Paris Reidhead.

C
Christinyou

We have nothing, it is all the Lords and what ever He has given us it is our responsibility to make it increase like the gold talents, which He gives.

The field is white for harvest. Who's price has made the field white by the red blood shed, that is righteousness, it is Christ in you, for He that is in you has been made righteousness for the ones in white garments, a field of white, ready for harvest.

The World is the field, the treasure in the field is that which is ripe for harvest.

Who plants the seed? All we do is water, and even in the watering God is the One who gives the increase and gets the increase. We have no honor in any salvation of any person, all the Honor is to Christ, that is the way God see's it and that is the way it is going to be. The Philippines are not mans', they are Gods and any one that is saved is His responsibility, His doing, His drawing, His placing you there, Him giving you the ability to feed His sheep, Him placing His Son in each believer, Him answering the prayer of His Son and giving each believer the Comforter Teacher to understand who this Jesus Christ is and what He has done for each of us who believe. We cannot purchase the field, we cannot purchase the treasure, Christ did it all and He is the only one that can make the fields white for harvest and He says when the harvest is to take place.

This is the Kingdom of God we are seeing in all these parables, it is not the kingdom of this earth. All that is done for the Kingdom of Heaven is done by The Father, by the Blood of Christ, by the Holy Spirit.

This is what happens if we try to purchase or take credit for the field. Act 1:18 Now this man purchased a field with the reward of iniquity; and falling headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all his bowels gushed out.

The field is the Lords. Jhn 4:35 Say not ye, There are yet four months, and [then] cometh harvest? behold, I say unto you, Lift up your eyes, and look on the fields; for they are white already to harvest.

The Gospel of Christ is the only treasure we can acquire by giving everything we have for Him. He is not treasure which can be purchased, but when we see it we know that all we have is not enough to acquire it, for it is His Work that we are saved by, His Grace through His Faith by His Blood that this treasure in man is obtained.

In Christ: Phillip

L
Logic


Christinyou wrote:
We have nothing, it is all the Lords and what ever He has given us it is our responsibility to make it increase like the gold talents, which He gives.

I do believe any mature Evanglist would regognize these truths.

This is what happens if we try to purchase or take credit for the field. Act 1:18 Now this man purchased a field with the reward of iniquity; and falling headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all his bowels gushed out.

Fortunatly, this is not how the mission field of the Philippines is bought.
I am only gaining more of what HE already gave me. [b]Mat 25:15-30[/b]

You know, I am not disprooveing your views because yous are valad, why do you not think there is a valiadation to the view that I also hold.

Can not parables be seen manifold when not given the interpratation?

Hear is how I get my perspective on the mustard seed parable & the the woman who took and hid leaven in three measures of meal.

[b]Mark 4:13[/b] [color=990000]And he said unto them, Know ye not this parable? And how then will ye know all parables?[/color]
In other words: Don't you understand this parable? How, then, will you ever understand any parable?
This means that the parable of the sower of the seeds is a key to other parables. Furthermore, the parable of the wheat & tares is a key also since he explained it also.

Therefore when you see birds in the Parable of the sower of the seed being devils, then they must be devils in the parable of the mustard tree.
[b]Matthew 13:4[/b] [color=990000]and when he sowed, some seeds fell by the way side, and the fowls came and devoured them up:[/color]
[b]Matthew 13:19[/b] [color=990000]When any one hears the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catches away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side.[/color]
Here, the bible tells us birds are devils

Remember the "law of first-mention" is the principle in the interpretation of Scripture which states that the first mention or occurrence of a subject in Scripture establishes an unchangeable pattern, with that subject remaining unchanged in the mind of God throughout Scripture.

Therefore, as the mustard seed parable came first in the mentioning of a mustard seed, so the law of first mention should have this as the rule of the mustard seed. When Jesus gave the parable of the mustard seed, we shouldn’t relate it to the mustard seed type faith, we should have it the other way around.

Having the faith as a grain of mustard seed is having the purest most humble faith just as the Kingdom of God started, from the mustard seed parable which says, is smaller than all of the seeds on the earth.

As for the woman who took and hid leaven in three measures of meal till the whole was leavened.
Notice that Jesus didn’t say, “a virgin took and hid leaven.
A “woman” in this parable is more of a harlot.
[b]Mathewt 16:6[/b] [color=990000]Then Jesus said unto them, Take heed and beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees.[/color]
&
[b]Mark 8:15[/b] [color=990000]And he charged them, saying, Take heed, beware of the leaven of the Pharisees, and of the leaven of Herod.[/color]
This next verse tells us what leaven is.
[b]Matthew 16:12[/b] [color=990000]Then understood they how that he bade them not beware of the actual leaven of bread, but of the doctrine of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees.[/color]

Furthermore, we have this Scripture:
[b]Exod 12:19[/b] [color=990000]Seven days shall there be no leaven found in your houses: for whosoever eats that which is leavened, even that soul shall be cut off from the congregation of Israel, whether he be a stranger, or born in the land.[/color]

The three measures of meal is Likened to when the three Angles(the Lord) came to Abraham to give him the promise of the son (Israel).

[b]Gen 18:1[/b] [color=990000] And the LORD appeared unto him in the plains of Mamre: and he sat in the tent door in the heat of the day
[b]Gen 18:2[/b] And he lift up his eyes and looked, and, lo, three men stood by him: and when he saw them, he ran to meet them from the tent door, and bowed himself toward the ground,[/color]
[b]Gen 18:6[/b] [color=990000]And Abraham hastened into the tent unto Sarah, and said, Make ready quickly [b]three measures of fine meal[/b], knead it, and make cakes upon the hearth.[/color]

The three Angles represent the trinity as the three measures of meal would then represent our basic Doctrines, hence, the trinity.

C
Christinyou

If the smallest amount of faith, that is, as small as a mustard seed and that small amount of faith would move mountains and transplant trees, and we don't even have that amount, what are we to do?

We must realize that it is not our faith that will move mountains and transplant trees. We cannot build on hay and stubble. We must build on the Rock, the Chief Corner Stone. That is Christ and it is His faith we must muster upon. It takes the faith of the Son of God to make all things pertaining to the Kingdom of God work for His Glory.

If we try to get people to build up their faith, we are playing right into the hands of the destroyer of seed. Just like the Seed that is planted by the good Sower. That Seed will take root and produce fruit because it is His Seed, and it will not return void. Isa 55:11 So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper [in the thing] whereto I sent it.

If your field is the Philippines, and God is the One that has prepared it for His Seed, it will produce fruit. If the Incorruptable Seed of Christ in you is the One that is being planted in the fruit bearing Ground, His Seed and God the Husbandman is doing the gardening then it will produce abundant fruit. Let us know that it is not us but the Christ in us by the Father through the Holy Spirit that has all the Glory. We are just containers to bare what has been planted. All that Abraham did was not of his own, it was given him by God the Father and that is also His keeping track of the seed of his loins that would bare through Mary and Joseph the Seed promised by the Father of His Seed, His only begotten Son Jesus Christ.

When "The Seed" that is in us is the One that we are allowing to use this container that we live in then the container becomes consecrated to the Seed Sower. It must be the Incorruptable Seed of the Father planted in good ground that He has prepared and sown.

1 Peter 1:13-16 Wherefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and hope to the end for the grace that is to be brought unto you at the revelation of Jesus Christ; As obedient children, not fashioning yourselves according to the former lusts in your ignorance: But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation; Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy.

This is not just the end times revelation, it is also the now times revelation. If we are called, it is Him that calls us to be Holy, even as He is Holy. When an evangelist gives the children of God, for they are certainly not the children of the evangelist, the truth that Christ is in them and they before God are perfect and stand perfect in Christ's Holiness, and they are to be Holy as He is Holy, instead of them being the ones that are making themselves holy by the works they do, then the Body of Christ will accomplish what God intended it to do from before the beginning of Time, that is a Person that is in them and that Person is Christ that is in them and they are now son's of God, by His life that is now birthed in them. No longer seed of their father the devil. Then the evangelist can proclaim them as his children begotten through Christ by God the Father.

What we do for the kingdom of God is a good thing, but will not make the kingdom to be fruitful. The Fruit must come form the Vine to the branches, for the Vine is Christ and we are His branches producing the fruit thereof. It is no longer we who live to produce this fruit but is is Christ in us the Hope of Glory that is now the life and fruit of the believer, so if their be any glory in anything we do let it be the Glory of God in us to give Him all the Glory for all that He has done in Christ Jesus our Lord.

1 Peter 1:21-25 Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead, and gave him glory; that your faith and hope might be in God. Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently: Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever. For all flesh is as grass, and all the glory of man as the flower of grass. The grass withereth, and the flower thereof falleth away: But the word of the Lord endureth for ever. And this is the word which by the gospel is preached unto you.

Wherefore we are made ministers like Paul as of this Christ in us, that we might produce fruit by the Christ that is in us and present every man perfect by the Christ that is in them not by the works of the Law.

Colossians 1:25-29 Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, to fulfil the word of God; Even the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints: To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory: Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus: Whereunto I also labour, striving according to his working, which worketh in me mightily.

Are we made ministers? If so it is His that is producing the the fruit by the labor of our preaching that makes every man perfect in Christ Jesus: Paul labored, you labor, I labor, striving according to His working, WHICH WORKETH IN ALL THAT LABOR.

Is Christ in you, are you allowing Him to be your life, are you allowing Him to be the power of your life that brings forth the Fruit that is able to be used by God, are you God's son by the Son that is in you? All the you's apply to me also and all that I do in Him. This is my labor, that I make Him my life.

Galatians 2:20-21 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me. I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

May God richly bless His field in the Philippians. May you labor in His Field that He bring forth fruit, by His Son in good ground.

In Christ: Phillip

O
OverSeer

Logic wrote:

The fact is that I realy am selling all that I have for the Philippines. In a way, I am buying the Philippines Because all the proceeds go for the missions. Furthermore, of what I give of myself(my life, my time, my future).
I believe you have confused categories. You are speaking of the cost of discipleship - the cost of following Jesus, not the cost of redemption for the Philippines. The way you are looking at it and the way that you are interpreting the merchant man is the cost of discipleship is the same as the price for redemption. However these are two separate categories. The price of redemption is paid by Christ and Christ alone. The price of discipleship is paid by all who have been redeemed - "and He died for all, so that they who live might no longer live for themselves, but for Him who died and rose again on their behalf" (2 Corinthians 5:15). You are selling all you have to follow Christ; not for the Philippines; unless you are "trying" to do something for God instead of "joining" Him in the work He is doing.

Here is a run-down of how I see the context and meaning of these parables in Matthew 13 which [b]reveal [/b] [i]the mysteries of the kingdom[/i] (Matthew 13:11).
1. The Sower (Matthew 13:3-9; 18-23) = the mystery of various responses to the true gospel (word of the kingdom). Not everyone who hears the true message will be saved - responses range from outright rejection to full blown acceptance.
2. Tares among the Wheat (Matthew 13:24-30; 36-43) = the mystery of iniquity (counterfeiting) - false preachers and false gospel "among" the true. This parable also teaches a coming counterfeit revival before the Lord's return - http://www.devcobaptist.org/templates/System/details.asp?id=31831&PID=386851
3. Mustard Seed (Matthew 13:31-32) = mystery of iniquity - false outward growth where the kingdom "appears" larger than it really is and becomes a hide-out for evil.
4. The Leaven (Matthew 13:33) = the mystery of iniquity - false inner growth through false doctrines. Three pecks of flour calls for three pinches of leaven = (A) leaven of the Pharisees (love of self = philosophical humanism) (B) leaven of Sadducees (love of money = materialism) (C) leaven of Herodians (love of pleasure = philosophical existentialism/hedonism)
5. Hidden Treasure (Matthew 13:44) = mystery of godliness in regard to Israel. The treasure is the nation of Israel (Exodus 19:5; Psalm 135:4). That nation was placed in the world to bring glory to God, but it failed. It became a nation hidden, a treasure not being invested to produce dividends for God. Jesus Christ gave His all to purchase the whole world in order to save the nation (John 11:51).
6. The Pearl of Great Value (Matthew 13:45-46) = the mystery of godliness concerning the church. A pearl is a [i]unity[/i] and it is the product of [i]suffering[/i]. John 11:52 says, "And not for the nation only, but in order that He might also gather together into one (unity) the children of God who are scattered abroad." John 11:51= hidden treasure; John 11:52= pearl of great price.
7. The Dragnet (Matthew 13:47-50) = the mystery of separation and judgment; the mystery of God is finished (Revelation 10:7) because there has been a full and final revelation of the differences between the mystery of iniquity and the mystery of godliness.

Grace and peace
Olan

M
mamaluk

Overseer,

I copied this 'run down' for my personal quick reference for future parable study. Right division in bible study is really all the more helpful.

It has been such a joy to know our soverign GOD giving us much sufficient grace with His Scripture, maintaining our sobriety with much needed warnings in the present time against falsehood and deception throughout.

Nothing has changed really, since our Lord ascended to heaven, as things are getting worse and worse in areas of false doctrines and evil religious yoke.

Phillip, the glory of Christ manifested in your Christ-exalting post was no small thing, may God reward your love and labor to His grace manifold.

Allow me to borrow Paul's prayer word for word to each of you, brother Logic, you too,:}

[b]6Cease not to give thanks for you, making mention of you in my prayers;

17That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:

18The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,

19And what is the exceeding greatness of his power to us-ward who believe, according to the working of his mighty power, ...[/b]

Praise the name of the Lord Jesus Christ!!

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