MIRACLES ARE a MUST!! -by Andrew Strom - COMMENTS??

MIRACLES ARE a MUST!!
-by Andrew Strom.

If anything I am known as a 'word' preacher. For years and years
I have prayed for a 'Revival' anointing on my preaching - and in the
last 3 - 4 years I have certainly noticed an increase. But I am
well aware that this is only half the story. As Revival history shows
us - the 'word' by itself can have tremendous power to convict
and transform lives. But without MIRACLES I have to question
whether we really are representing true New Testament Christianity.
I am totally convinced that we must have BOTH - the 'WORD' and
the MIGHTY DEMONSTRATION of God's power.

In 1947 Smith Wigglesworth gave a prophecy about 3 coming
moves of God. Concerning the last (and greatest) of these he said:

"When the new church phase is on the wane, there will be evidence
in the churches of something that has not been seen before: a
coming together of those with an emphasis on the word and those
with an emphasis on the Spirit. When the word and the Spirit
come together, there will be the biggest move of the Holy Spirit
that the nation, and indeed, the world has ever seen. It will mark
the beginning of a revival that will eclipse anything that has been
witnessed within these shores, even the Wesleyan and Welsh
revivals of former years...."

-There it is- "The WORD and the SPIRIT" joined.

Let me ask a simple question: What did people "see" when they
came across Jesus' ministry? -They saw a simple, piercing
gospel being preached and also the 'kingdom' being domonstrated
through healings and miracles. -That is basically what they saw.
And what did people "see" in the ministry of the apostles and
evangelists of Acts? -They saw the same thing. -An anointed,
piercing gospel and mighty demonstrations of God's power - both
together. In fact, we really should ask ourselves- Is it possible to
preach the gospel (in the full New Testament sense) without
signs and wonders? -If we are being truly scriptural, surely we
would have to answer- "NO, IT IS NOT."

Another question- Why is the casting out of demons so important
in demonstrating the 'kingdom'? Well - what it is showing is the
greater AUTHORITY found in the name and the 'king-ship' of
Jesus Christ. Even demons have to obey Him! Suddenly everyone
sees this beyond a doubt when a demon is cast out before their
eyes. I remember the first time I saw this happen as a teenager -
before I was a true Christian. The person screamed and writhed as
the demon was cast out - just like in the Bible. And what was the
result in me? -CONVICTION! Suddenly everything was 'REALLY
TRUE'! I felt like running forward and surrendering to God on the spot.

And this is why I am opposed to casting out demons in a "back
room" somewhere. Notice that Jesus never did this. He cast out
demons in PUBLIC - so that the 'kingdom' was demonstrated and
God was glorified. Notice too, the absence of "3 hour marathons"
in casting out demons in the Bible. They had the anointing and
authority from God - and deliverance was mostly quick and decisive.

We have got to see the 'Word and the Spirit joined' like this in our
day. In fact, I would love anyone on this List who moves powerfully
in these areas to email me. -We have got to encourage and bring
forward these kinds of giftings once again.

When I was in Michigan recently a leader there gave me a word.
God was deeply moving in people's hearts that weekend - we had
people getting baptized and everything. Yet he said to me- 'Last
night I got a word for you. You need to hook up with others who
move powerfully in miracles and healings - so there is a balance.
Not just in preaching - but powerful "demonstration" also.' -That
was the gist of his word to me. And my spirit said, "AMEN!" I got
a strong sense of confirmation that this was a "Now" word.

I immediately thought of a brother in Arizona whom I know moves
VERY powerfully in these areas - without hype or any of the other
nonsense. -Just pure power of God. -And already we are talking
about ministering together.

So please be aware that I fully intend for our meetings and
gatherings in the future to be just as full of 'DEMONSTRATION' as
they are of the "WORD".

And I am serious about wanting to hear back from others who move
powerfully in these giftings. It is time to see a "joining" of that which
God has always wanted to bring forth. (-Simply reply to this email
to get in touch. My email is- )

Could this be the hour for the joining of the WORD and the SPIRIT,
my friends? Is this what God has been wanting to do?

God bless you all!

Andrew Strom.

God is truly wanting to move in these last days. His power is just as real as it was when Jesus was here, it is us who has grown cold. We have allowed too much of the world into the church - thus we are rendered powerless. I believe this is why we don't see demons cast out. They are comfortable to be in our church services. We are powerless to cast them out and we are so self centered and concerned with prosperity and blessings that we are desensitized to the demonic forces that functioning. They are so comfortable in our church services that they have no need to manifest. Why manifest when there is no presence of God? If we are living in a more wicked and perverse generation than we were 20 years ago, it only makes sense that there would be a stronger demonic stronghold and possession of people. We must repent as a church and separate ourselves from sin. The "Old Timers" used to call it "sanctified" from the world. It's time for some sanctification to be present again. God is wanting us to join the WORD and the SPIRIT. AMEN! AMEN! AMEN!

Cindy Antwiler

I'm with you Cindy.

We have allowed too much of the world into the church - thus we are rendered powerless. I believe this is why we don't see demons cast out. They are comfortable to be in our church services.

I believe in divine healing and have graciously been the recipient of it but the conviction and the subsequent deliverance from sin is much more miraculous in my view.

We must repent as a church and separate ourselves from sin. The "Old Timers" used to call it "sanctified" from the world. It's time for some sanctification to be present again. God is wanting us to join the WORD and the SPIRIT. AMEN! AMEN! AMEN!

The thing that strikes me is that many on this site - like myself - have become so focused on 'PREACHING' as our major concern - that we have relegated "HEALINGS and MIRACLES" to a lesser place.

Yes - anointed preaching is massively important. But if we look at Scripture we see that "signs and wonders" were almost EQUALLY important. Can we really come to that realization? Can we truly come to grips with how VITAL it is to have healings and miracles accompany the word?

I wonder if we can actually come into Revival at all without this realization. -It may be the very thing God is waiting for. -The WORD and the SPIRIT joined.

-Andrew Strom.

I believe that miracles are important, but equal with preaching? I think of this Scripture.

1 Corinthians 1:21-23 [b]"For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.
For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:
But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness."[/b]

Well - all we know is that Paul described this
as "fully" preaching the gospel-

"By word and deed, Through mighty signs and wonders, by the power of the Spirit of God; so that from Jerusalem, and round about unto Illyricum, I have FULLY preached the gospel of Christ" (Rom 15:18-19).

In Scripture we also find the record showing that indeed there were signs and wonders continually accompanying and confirming the gospel wherever it was preached. Jesus started this pattern - and his followers continued it. So yes - I believe it was vital.

-Andrew Strom.

So yes - I believe it was vital.

I agree, but maybe i'm missing something here, is preaching without signs and wonders is not fully powerful?

Well, I myself am a 'Revival' preacher - and I see God do a lot of wonderful things in people's lives simply through preaching the word. (-I have to pray a lot before I preach - because it is only GOD who can pierce people's hearts like that).

But lately God has been reminding me of "signs and wonders". Of course there is a lot of 'flakey' stuff around - and I am not into that. But He is reminding me that true miracles are very important and MUST accompany the word.

This may well be a key to the coming Revival. -It certainly was in Acts.

God bless you!

-Andrew Strom.

I see the point in that. "These signs shall follow them that believe."

But He is reminding me that true miracles are very important and MUST accompany the word.

But what if they don't though? I've seen lives touched without miracles being performed, and i've seen miracles and no one get saved. John the Baptist did no miracles.

I too am hearing the same thing in prayer and have been praying that God will revive us as a people who live in the miraculous. I also have been praying that the miraculous be of such a type that could not be counterfeited. That God would manifest the exceeding greatness of His power to usward who believe in such a way that no man or program would dare take credit for it and which would cause such an overflow from His church to the community and that we would see the fruit of that. We are also asking God's presence to be so thick that it is almost tangible and that people would drive their cars into our town's limits and say wow! what is that! And be changed somehow because they they have entered a place where it pleased God to manifest His Holy presence in response to His own word that if we who are called by His name will humble, pray, seek, turn, that He will hear, forgive, and heal our land.

IF....

I am convinced that the IF of that verse is impossible for us except He initiate it and finish it!

Please Lord start your people humbling thenselves to pray! In Jesus' name

Yes,I too am scripturally convinced that miracles are a must. For the Kingdom of God is not in word only but in power. And it was the signs and wonders that bore witness to the gospel that the Apostles were preaching "God working with them!".

I am from Calvary Chapel and have gone through there school of ministry. But shortly will be going out to Kansas City to wait for the promise of the Father for the glory of God and for empowerment in street preaching and evangelism.

It seems scary or weird to me that many are oblivious to this and they are "sola scriptura" in a radical sense to where they dont believe in gifts or at least subtly dont earnestly emphasize the seeking of them anywhere near their contending for the word. How can they be so scripture saturated and then not see the scripture!?

so what then needs to be done?

Pray for neither preaching nor signs and wonders will stand without prayer.

History is silent about revivals that did not begin with prayer. ~ Edwin Orr

Mar 16:17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;

Mar 16:18 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

Joh 14:12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.

Is there anyone here who is under a true biblical ministry, or is aware of one anywhere?

Are you perhaps experiencing this kind of walk with the Lord?

Where is the genuine sold out, walk on water, raising the dead, healing the leper believer/ministry today?

Blessings Greg

Father, Where is the genuine sold out, walk on water, raising the dead, healing the leper believer/ministry today? Bring it to my church and all the churches of my community, unite us in this, so all will know there is a God in Farmington. And so I ask this also for our nation and for this world. In Jesus Name

"MIRAClES A MUST" ??!!!

Yes, the Cross and the Shed Blood, what more miracles can one DEMAND ?????!!!! A MUST?? ??!!!!( Support this demand with Scriptures, that is, rightly/accurately divided please )

Quote Andrew_Strom

But lately God has been reminding me [b](??) [/b]of "signs and wonders". Of course there is a lot of 'flakey' stuff around - and I am not into that. But He is reminding me that true miracles are very important and MUST [b]( that's a big leap of assumption on one's part)[/b]accompany the word.

[b]Matthew 24:24
For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

2Thes. II. 9, 10.

Even him whose coming is after the working of Satan, with all power, and signs, and lying wonders, and with all deceiveableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. - 2 Thes. II. 9, 10.

James 4:3
Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.[/b]

SI "May God rise up a movement of people who hunger and thirst for righteousness."

Righteousness, ( professing Christians' much needed righteousness, true love and holiness) , that's the miracle enough, just look around us !!

If signs and wonders and miracles bring about salvation, there will be no need for the only necessary miracles - The Cross with It's Shed Blood !!

i believe in miracles, but i don't think its a MUST. God pouring out His Holy Spirit, stepping down and moving the hearts to repentance is a MUST. Jesus perform many miracles, but it wasn't the miracles that lead people to repentance. the miracles shows that the kingdom of God is near you.

the welsh revival didn't have a big healing revival. what happend was that God stepped down and cut the heart, moving many to repentance. thats what we need!

I agree that we need "conviction" and repentance like that. -I already see these things in my ministry and, like you, I believe they are VERY important.

But to have true SCRIPTURAL Christianity it is very clear that we must have miracles as well. You can look right through the NT and you will always find that they had BOTH. I think we are wrong to aim only for Revival PREACHING. We need DEMONSTRATION as well if we are going to be like Acts.

Surely we can see this?

-Andrew Strom.

Smokey wrote:
Mar 16:17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;

Mar 16:18 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

I have put may faith out in verse 20 of this passage of scripture.Mar 16:20 And they went forth, and preached every where, [b]the Lord working with them, and confirming the word with signs following[/b]. Amen. In my reading of the scripture I [b]expect it to be so[/b] that signs wonders miracles follow the word. My thinking is, if I am preaching what Jesus wants me to preach then amen, let it be so...miracles, signs wonders.

If I do not have these things following and I have set my faith out for it, then I must not be preaching want Jesus wants. I find this personallly very freeing, it puts the owness for miracels etc firmly in the hands of the one who [b]confirms his word[b/], the Lord Jesus Christ.
Amen!

p.s. I do not get hung up over this position, I just get further on my kness. ;-)

But to have true SCRIPTURAL Christianity it is very clear that we must have miracles as well. You can look right through the NT and you will always find that they had BOTH. I think we are wrong to aim only for Revival PREACHING. We need DEMONSTRATION as well if we are going to be like Acts.

So if there are no miracles, the ministry isn't scriptural?

No - that is not what I am saying - as you will see if you read what I have written on this thread from the start.

I am saying that FULLY preaching the gospel must be done with the WORD and DEMONSTRATION also. In Scripture we find that the gospel was NEVER preached without miracles - from all that we can see.

So let us seek God for BOTH.

That is all that I am saying.

-Andrew Strom.

The thing that strikes me is that many on this site - like myself - have become so focused on 'PREACHING' as our major concern - that we have relegated "HEALINGS and MIRACLES" to a lesser place.

But it is a tremndous question, similar to unanswered prayer ... How come? Something from E.M. Bounds has been lingering for some time now about this other question and a whole lot of variables come to the surface; "Is it [b][i]I[/i][/b]? The semantics could go on and invariably faith is tested, patience, waiting, searching ... being searched. There is James' profound question; [i]" Ye ask, but ..."[/i].

Apologize if I can't make a smooth seque between the two, but what came readily to mind is what used to be mentioned here fairly frequently;

"Normal Christianity"

The sense is that when things are operating as they should or ought to be that what constitutes 'miraculous' is really quite normal. We are right back to the Ravenhillesque idea that we have become so sub-normal that the 'normal' is abnormal (Quite a leap of a paraphrase there...)

It is hard to put it this way, shouldn't we really be the [i]least surprised[/i], if things were following the course that has been laid before us, apostolically? As a matter of course, signs and wonders [i]following[/i] almost as an after thought? Thinking of Paul's reaction when the people wanted to in essence make him a demi-god of sorts ... Perhaps not exactley the right illustration. What I do notice throughout the apostles examples is what seems to be just a reporting of facts when it comes to these things, that it could be rightly said that they were taken for granted (Not to mean taken advantaged of). That they were expected without expecting them and not at all surprised when they did happen. That is surely a bit overstated and for us, bereft largely of seeing or experiencing them it would be quite surprising I am sure.

It is a large question, where is the authentic amongst the overweighted and imitated? Perhaps the Lord has withdrawn a great deal of it due to a wrong emphesis ... ?

Hi everyone.

Brother Mike,

But it is a tremndous question, similar to unanswered prayer ... How come?

When I was first converted to Christ I attended an Apostolic Pentecostal church. For those who may not know, there is [b]a heavy emphasis[/b] among Apostolics concerning the miraculous and the gifts of the Holy Spirit, but especially speaking in tongues. I know what it is to be among a group of people that are seeking/expecting to have the miraculous accompany their meetings.

So to the question [i]how come?[/i].

I think of these words from the Saviour

[b][color=660033] If I had not done among them the works which none other man did, they had not had sin: but now have they both seen and hated both me and my Father.[/color][/b]

I think...whoa. What then, would something like this mean for a people such as us, for instance in the US? I wonder too, what would it look like, even how would it reflect upon, God, if He were to visit us with such manifestations?

I think of what the Lord said of Israel

[b][color=000000] Because all those men which have seen my glory, and my miracles, which I did in Egypt and in the wilderness, and have tempted me now these ten times, and have not hearkened to my voice; Surely they shall not see the land which I sware unto their fathers, neither shall any of them that provoked me see it:[/color][/b]

We know also what happened to the generation that saw Christ

[b][color=660033] And the remnant took his servants, and entreated them spitefully, and slew them. But when the king heard thereof, he was wroth: and he sent forth his armies, and destroyed those murderers, and burned up their city.[/color][/b]

We might then ask: what of the pagan lands that see so much of the miraculous? Perhaps the reason is just that - they are pagan. If I remember correctly, Leonard Ravenhill said that China had a Gospel witness many hundreds of years ago. If that is true, look how long it was before they got it back, with signs following? Sort of reminds me of the [b]400[/b] years silence between Malachi and John. Maybe in that there is an answer for us too, perhaps what yet remains needfull for us is the same that was for them

[b]...make straight in the desert a highway for our God.[/b]

Some thoughts.

My first pastor - an old Pentecostal country preacher from the backwoods of Tennessee - operated powerfully in both the prophetic [i]and[/i] the miraculous. He preached the blood of Christ and was as humble and lowly as they get. He never went to a Bible college, and his English was very simplistic. He drove an old, beat-up car and wore inexpensive suits. He would go on very prolonged fasts, and call the worship leader, children's church ministers, and elders to do the same. It was during these times of prolonged fasting that the glory of God would fill the sanctuary like you couldn't imagine. Sometimes the presence of God was too strong for me to handle, too glorious, and it made it hard for me to breathe. When it got like this, the sanctuary would fill with a cloudy haze and devils would sometimes manifest. The church itself was very modest - about fifty people on a packed Sunday. But the congregation was humble, holy and materialistically impoverished. Lots of farmers and elderly women. Most of the younger parishoners were made up of ex-cons and drug addicts and whores saved through his street ministry.

Like I said, the man operated powerfully in the miraculous. Though never having been to a seminary, he could open up Zephaniah and Amos and preach with such wisdom, such anointing, such purity...people would openly weep and go to their knees in the middle of the message. Physical infimities and cancer were routinely healed, with doctors' negative test results waved the following week to a cheering congregation. The pastor would just sit in his chair and smile and weep. He was such a profound man of God. He made it a habit of going into the mountains of southern Mexico once a year to preach in the mud villages through an Indian translator. He would just set up a canopy on the top of one of the mountains, and preach repentance and trust that God would bring the people. During these meetings, people were spontaneously healed and saved. Notorious alcoholics were delievered and soundly converted. Feared drug lords and gunrunners would also get saved during these services and become preachers themselves, in service to the local pastors! This anonymous, unlearned country "pastor" has many awesome testimonies of God moving in those poor mountains; one even on video of a man born lame with deformed, twisted legs straightening out as the bones popped into shape. This same man now walks all throughout the mountains, preaching the gospel and telling people what Jesus did for his legs.

You'll never see this pastor on the cover of [i]Charisma[/i] magazine, nor will you ever see him begging for money on TV, embarassing God. He funds all his ministry and pastorate expenses through faith, and through his own pocket. I wonder how many others like him God has working undercover. I really liked this article by Andrew Strom, but I must say, brother, there are some men who have the balance you speak of. They are still here. Let us go and sanctify our lives for the Master's service, and do thus likewise. Surely, God has anointed and appointed us all to preach this glorious full gospel!

Brother Paul

Yes, I agree. These kinds of guys are around. Sadly, many of the ones who get a little "fame" these days soon become part of the "charismatic circuit" or
the 'Prophetic Conference circuit'. Before you know it, many are seduced by money and hype - or flakey "weirdness". So it is getting harder to find purity in the USA in these gifts. -Much harder.

But I am in touch with some whom I regard as moving VERY powerfully in these giftings. And I am committed from now on to make our meetings not just so "word" dominated - but WORD and SPIRIT BOTH. In other words - very strong in both those areas. I feel that our next meetings will have this - a joining of the two.

So I am quite excited.

God bless you all,

Andrew Strom.

When Jesus sent out the 72 and the 12 to minister, miracles were an integral part of the outreach. He instructed them (Luke 10) :-

[color=000099]... and heal the sick that are therein, and say unto them, The kingdom of God is come nigh unto you.[/color]

and notice the effectiveness :-

[color=000099]...I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.[/color]

These men hadn't even received the baptism of the Holy Ghost yet.

While the Bible is clear that we can present signs and wonders without Jesus ever having known us, it is also quite clear that signs and wonders are an important part of full ministry. It's no wonder Satan works so hard to introduce so much confusion in this area.

An important factor is that Jesus strictly separated financial interest from the ministering of the 12 and 72. Mixing personal ambition and ministering in gifts is a lethal mix.

PassingThru

Yes - that is true. But there are "pure-hearted" ones. It is still possible to find them. And if there can be a "joining" of these powerfully 'Spirit'-oriented preachers with the anointed 'Word' oriented ones - isn't it possible that a great move of God could result?

-Andrew Strom.

I immediately thought of a brother in Arizona whom I know moves VERY powerfully in these areas - without hype or any of the other nonsense. -Just pure power of God. -And already we are talking about ministering together.

I am in Arizona and would be interested in knowing who this brother is, if you don't mind sharing his name.

In Christ,

Ron

AWESOME article! It's so encouraging to hear people who see the scriptural importance of both the preaching of the word and the demonstration of God's power!! As far as one without the other, here is what Paul said....

1Co 2:4 & 5 - And my speech and my preaching were not with persuasive words of human wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power, that your faith should not be in the wisdom of men but in the power of God.

~~~It looks like if we have just preaching (without the demonstration of the Spirit and power), our faith rests in the wisdom of men, not the power of God!!!!! Doesn't that describe most of what's happening today??

Also, someone mentioned revivals beginning in prayer (which is where my own heart is right now). I was just thinking about Charles Finney (to use one example) and how important the prayer support was through Daniel Nash and how when "Father Nash" died, the revival cooled down considerably!

Father, send laborers (send me) to pray and seek your face for revival in this land!

I've been so convicted and challenged by the Lord lately on this very topic. I teach in a Christian school and I've noticed such a casual attitude in the students towards the things of God. I was discussing this with another teacher and I suggested that it's because these students are not seeing the things of God as real and powerful. It's more like we've turned these powerful truths into positive thinking messages. Not only are they not seeing them at home, but sadly they are not seeing them in church.

About a month ago I was so convicted by my 9 year old son. He had a painful planters wart, so I bought some over the counter treaments. One night as I was applying the treatment, my son said, "Mom, Jesus has been speaking to my heart. He said that I need to trust HIM, and If we use the medicine we're not trusting HIM for a healing." Man, was I convivted! Now, I've taught my childern that the Lord heals, but I've never actaully put my faith into action. I was really put on the spot. I swallowed hard and said "Okay then, if you do not want the treament I'll stand with you and pray for a healing."

As the weeks went by my son's wart grew and grew. Another one even started to grow on the side. My son's wart was so uncomfortable that he could only wear one pair of shoes. But my son stood on his faith. He reassured me that the Lord would heal his wart. I so wanted to trust the Lord, but I started to wonder if asking the Lord to heal a planters wart was such a good idea in the first place.

Today my son woke me up to show me the two holes in his foot where the planters warts used to be!!! Praise God! I know this is a simple illustration, but I can't tell you how deeply moved and convicted I've been by this whole experience!!!! I hate to use this expression, but I feel like the Holy Spirit has said "Put your money where you mouth is."

We need to be a church that demonstrates the power that we speak of!!!

In His Love,

Tina

Oh my ... This is tremndous sister,

Mar 10:15 Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child, he shall not enter therein.

It is very much profound Tina, thank you for sharing this.

Tinluke, thanks be to God for this testimony!

But He is reminding me that true miracles are very important and MUST ( that's a big leap of assumption on one's part)accompany the word.

Andrew, I believe that you have exposed a defect in the life of the church that aught to be raising many red flags: Why do we rarely see miracles accompanying our modern day preaching?
“And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; Mar 16:17

First of all, I believe that we have attached a Biblical term “preaching” to much that is not preaching at all – not by God’s standards. Preaching aught to flow from the power of the Spirit within – that same power that produces miracles, signs, and wonders. Most preaching (that I’ve experienced) is really the outflow of man’s own energies, desires, conditions, and expectations. Also, preaching today occurs under spotlights – sermons delivered to large gatherings, videotaped, televised, and accompanied with lots of entertaining features. We don’t even consider one-to-one proclamation via dialogue in the hidden places as preaching the gospel, yet it may very well be far more authentic than many sermons we refer to as preaching.

Why should we expect God’s work to be done under man’s conditions? Surely God is not a puppet on our strings, expected to dance for us under our spotlights, to make man’s efforts look real good.

Consider the situations in scripture (both old and new testaments) where miracles occurred. They were often in the remote places, AWAY from the spotlight of the religion audiences. Consider also the purpose of divine miracles: to bring conviction, to build faith, to manifest the glory of God to mankind for the purpose of salvation.

In the Bible God’s miracles seemed to occur when there was nothing else to trust as a “back-up” - no insurance plans, no health system, no guaranteed income, no government aid, no ambulance. Oh my, where really is our trust? Could divided hearts be one reason we don’t see miracles?

I myself was miraculously healed as a result of a behind-the-scenes prayer – actually at a quiet healing and deliverance retreat. The circumstances surrounding the event left absolutely no room for man to grab the glory. It was also in step with God's divine timing - after inner healing, transformation, and spiritual awakening (the greater miracle).

Here is another unique behind-the-scenes healing: One evening during a homeschooling function in my church, a lady, who had no reason to be there, approached me. I could quickly see that she was in deep distress. She told me she was suffering so much from a physical illness that she feared imminent emotional breakdown. That night she was actually headed for a different town, but strangely found herself in my church, and in my presence. I felt a Spirit power overwhelm me, and took her (on her approval) upstairs into the quiet, dark sanctuary to pray for her healing. Then I sang a few hymns to her. She was healed that night.

I share one more account - a divine miracle that occurred DURING a church service:

I was to be the worship leader, and sought the Lord for directions prior to that service. His answer surprised me. He said, ‘Be silent!” There were to be no comments, no spiritual words, no prayers; just the bare instructions. That evening God revealed his presence during the singing of some ordinary hymns. He had a reason for that: The church was about to get sucked into some heresy associated with the Toronto Airport Fellowship.

I’ll save the details for another thread someday, but for now point out that God wants our obedience, not our modern frenzied attempts to make God “show up”. He doesn’t even want our preaching! He wants our full surrender and our full trust – whether we are preachers or preachees.

Diane

Yes, you are right. Miracles and healings are so common in the New Testament that we just "scroll on by" and forget how essential it was that the preaching was accompanied by works of power. To them it was totally "normal". Powerful PREACHING - a 'must'. Powerful MIRACLES - a 'must'. Let's get back to that "one - two" combination! I truly believe that Revival in the West may hinge on doing this.

-Andrew Strom.

sis Tina and all
sis tina that was a moving testimony! indeed our Lor d is looking to put us to use in this regard but we oft lack the faith to follow through. our Lord has oft said to me that He'd use my hands to do all sorts of things. i believed it in my head but not in my heart. then one day we were going to visit my parents in d.c. a couple of months ago and our 2 year old was coughing pretty badly. we prayed and prayed and prayed and nothing happened. then we acknowledged we didn't know how to pray and turned it over to Him. We left for the airport and noticed the day after she had stopped coughing. She has had a couple of similar bouts since then. the first time we prayed over her and that was that, she was healed again. the second time we took her to the doctor and felt convicted because we didn;t show the same level of trust in God as before.

all this makes me wonder if we believe God in our minds only and not in our hearts also. clearly the word does say that signs and wonders followed the saints of old, we have come a long way from where they were in practise and so on, maybe we do only say we believe but are too afraid to put our money where our mouths are.

bro Paul

paulmcg1 wrote:
I'm not very learned in any of this but I just have a question, what about where it says a wicked and perverse generation seeks after signs?

Just wondering, not objecting or anything.

this was targetted specifically at the people who lived when Christ walked the earth. they knew who He was from the scriptures and still wanted Him to prove Himself. they had seen and heard of the miracles He performed and wanted more not so that they would repent but that they could get some benefit for themselves and not because they wanted to repent. for us i think it's not a matter of seeking after signs so much as it is the signs are testimonies to our Lord's hand at work.

Yes - some people think there is something "wrong" with people who believe because they see a miracle. But I think it is SUPPOSED to be "confirmation" of the word - and so people seeing miracles and then believing the word because of that - this should be happening all the time.

I wonder how many in "Acts" were converted through
seeing miracles. -Thousands, I bet.

-Andrew Strom.

I think the general problem today is complacency.
We do not see miracles because
a) we no longer expect them and
b) there is little or no power in our preaching.

Both these reasons stem from one thing which has been pointed out already on this thread: lack of total obedience to Him
Yes we pray and read our bibles but we are not soaked in the word and given over to prayer and fasting

My own preaching is weak and ineffective and I know this is because the time I spend out of God's presence far outweighs the time I spend in it.

As preachers of the word we MUST be given over totally to Him or else we are just going through the motions.

This is difficult, but we have to work while it is day, the night is coming where no one can work (Jn 9:4)

That may not be long away, we don't want to look back and think 'if I had known how short the time was I would have done more'

My 2 cents,

Ste

Just wondering outloud "where" most of Jesus' miracles of healing and deliverence were done? Clue--I'm not looking at towns or cities.

Dorcas said:

Jesus never asked anyone to commit to Him, prior to being healed or delivered….

He healed multitudes regularly

Andrew wrote:

I wonder how many in "Acts" were converted through
seeing miracles. -Thousands, I bet.

Surely God is not stingy with miracles - among both the saved and the unsaved!!! Consider his miracles in the desert: the cloud, pillar of fire, manna, water, protection from enemies, etc. Of course God did not send the miracles BECAUSE the Israelites had met God’s faith conditions. After all, they were all unbelievers – to the bitter end! The miracles should have convinced them that God was trustworthy. Yet none but two trusted. No doubt Caleb and Joshua learned from past miracles that God would continue to miraculously protect them in the Promised Land.

The tragedy was not the failure to notice the divine miracles, but the failure to see and then TRUST God.

I suspect that God is pouring out miracles today like never before in history. We just need to stand back and take a look and we’d see it. … or would we? Could one reason for our apparent miraclessness be that we fail to see and acknowledge the miracles God does send? Maybe we explain them away. Maybe they don’t fit into our expectations. Maybe God keeps us from knowing about the ones he does perform because of unbelief, or because of a tendency to flaunt them. Or maybe something else…

To never experience miracles surely has to be abnormal. Surely something is wrong. So perhaps - if this is the case, it would be worth seeking God for insight into the matter.

When God sends miracles, and sinners still refuse to believe, then the miracles themselves are a judgment against them. The miracles pronounce the guilt of unbelief. The miracles disqualify any excuse.

”God, I believe; help me overcome my unbelief.” Mk. 9:24

Diane

In regard to "miracles are a must", my question is for who? Jesus told His generation that they were wicked because they [b]sought after a sign[/b] (Matthew 16:4). We are told in God's Word that faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God (Romans 10:17). Have we forgotten that Jesus told the story of the rich man who went to hell and wanted a miracle performed so that his relatives wouldn't come to that place and the reply was that "if they would not listen to Moses and the Prophets (the Word of God), they would not be persuaded even if someone rises from the dead?" (Luke 16:19-31). Can people not be saved by believing the Word of God without witnessing miracles?

But here is what is interesting in God's Word: Miracles are a must - they must come because God has said that there is a coming counterfeit revival that will be accompanied by miracles (2 Thessalonians 2:7-12). Those who must have miracles will get their miracles - "because they did not receive the [b]love of the truth[/b] so as to be saved. [i]For this reason God will send upon them a deluding influence so that they will believe what is false[/i]" (2 Thessalonians 2:10-11).

I agree that there is to be demonstration of power in our preaching - but that demonstration is God's business and not ours. If He chooses to bring full-conviction without any miracle - so be it. Maybe what we ought to look for as an indicator or demonstration is whether or not our preaching sparked either a revival or a riot; did people get saved or did they get mad; were we persecuted for the sake of righteousness or were we spoken well of by all men.

Grace and peace
Olan

bro Olan

In regard to "miracles are a must", my question is for who? Jesus told His generation that they were wicked because they sought after a sign (Matthew 16:4). We are told in God's Word that faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God (Romans 10:17). Have we forgotten that Jesus told the story of the rich man who went to hell and wanted a miracle performed so that his relatives wouldn't come to that place and the reply was that "if they would not listen to Moses and the Prophets (the Word of God), they would not be persuaded even if someone rises from the dead?" (Luke 16:19-31). Can people not be saved by believing the Word of God without witnessing miracles?

i think the issue is that miracles always followed the believers and Christ said that the disciples would do these and even greater things because He goes to the Father. it is not that we are looking for miracles for the purpose of glorifying ourselves but rather that God glorify Himself. Also because Christ said that not only for the disciples, that work continues on and if we are not doing those greater things of which HE spoke, maybe something [i][b]is[/b][/i]wrong.

also we should consider that the generation in question which sought the signs didn't seek them for the purpose of then coming to repentance. they wanted a show while they continued on in their sin so we must be aware that they sought the miracles in a wrong spirit.

But here is what is interesting in God's Word: Miracles are a must - they must come because God has said that there is a coming counterfeit revival that will be accompanied by miracles (2 Thessalonians 2:7-12). Those who must have miracles will get their miracles - "because they did not receive the love of the truth so as to be saved. For this reason God will send upon them a deluding influence so that they will believe what is false" (2 Thessalonians 2:10-11).

this is true but we also can't forget that miracles did follow the early church, what about us? have we missed it somewhere? if there is a counterfeit revival with miracles and all, then we can be sure that there is a real one with real miracles from on High also so either way we can't get away from this issue.

I agree that there is to be demonstration of power in our preaching - but that demonstration is God's business and not ours. If He chooses to bring full-conviction without any miracle - so be it. Maybe what we ought to look for as an indicator or demonstration is whether or not our preaching sparked either a revival or a riot; did people get saved or did they get mad; were we persecuted for the sake of righteousness or were we spoken well of by all men.

i wonder if we really believe in our hearts and not just in our heads sometimes...i've been convicted of this because often times when God has said "do this" i balk. how many times have we heard His voice say "go lay your hands on this person" and we've not followed through? i don't think it was a small feat for the apostles to go about telling people "you're healed in the name of Jesus" that must have taken tremendous spiritual fortitude and i wonder if our reluctance to do the same (of lack of similar miracles with us) is a reflection of a lack of faith on our part. a lack in this faith which is to come from the word and the hearing thereof. are we dodging this so we don't expose our own faithlessness and stay in this state as opposed to coming out of it?

what good is it to say we have faith and not do anything with it? if we believe God like we say we do miracles shouldn't be a big deal. sis diane said God isn't stingy with miracles, if this is so (and we can assume it to be so) then obviously we are the bottleneck.

The miracles were done out in life, look at the great commission. If in American and in this time frame preachers are guilty of anything, it's the constant insistance of keeping the move of God within the four walls of a building. That way people who attend thier churches will stay dependent and never grow up to be and do the works of righteousness God has pre-ordained for them to do before the foundations of the world.
Simply put, take Jesus to the world and these signs shall follow.....That's based more on the faithfulness of God and not our faith, our faith is simply go...and these signs shall follow.... Dorcus---"Be in Him" ---same as "In my name", WOW!!!! what trust, what authority God has placed in each believer! ut we must all Go-- take Jesus into our world (work places, shopping centers, malls, gas stations, where ever life has us for the moment).

Praise Jesus!!!

i have a couple of general comments on this topic. i agree with the previous statement that in the last days there will be false signs and wonders. i believe that this is allready taking place. With talk of gold dust and gems being seen. These things seem to manifest among those who seek signs and miracles for the sake of excitement, emotion and titalation.

There are also however true miracles and wonders being manifest in these last days. i believe that God does these things today for the same reasons that HE did them in Jesus day. The primary reason for them were to bring the lost to conviction and salvation. i also believe that we should expect any miracle or sign to have A BIBLICAL PRECEDENT! Such as instant healing. It should not take the form of some phenomena such as the appearance of gold flakes in the air.

Jesus cammanded us to go and deliver those aflicted with demons and disease. He comanded us to do so in HIS NAME and for HIS GLORY. WE should do this and leave the results to God. We should expect this as a way that the Holy Ghost brings the lost to repentance. It should be viewed no differently than the preaching of the full gospel. The same as Gods Word shall never return void. Neither will HIS miracle be with out effect.

Yes Andrew we should expect these things. We will see these things. i have seen these things and they do bring revival.

Blessings Hisservant rich

Matthew 4:17

sis Dorcas

I believe that herein rests the difficulty western Christians find with healing or miracles..... many have no idea what it means to 'be in the Name of Jesus'. They don't believe they are living out His life, and that His Name is upon them from their head to their toes and to their core. They don't need to worry about not living in the Spirit .... because they don't expect to.... They don't expect to obey Him either. Their whole belief system is a bunch of meaningless words that doesn't affect them, which has little implication for the way they actually live out their life.... but, it makes them feel comfortable inwardly - to have a mental form of godliness. (This is religiosity, I think, rather than Christianity, and it should be recognisable to honest souls by its lack of liveliness within them.)

you have brought out an aspect of this that i hadn't intended to bring out because i hadn't thought about it. the name of Christ. i was thinking more along the lines of how the apostles themselves saw Christ doing miracles and had a hard time when He told them things and then all the unbelief and so on. it seems our Lord has brought the full picture to light by having you bring up the issue of the name of Christ by which all this is possible. it seems that you are right in what you said above that there is very little expected of us by way of living out the life of Christ.

i hadn't even reckoned with how hard it must have been for Peter to minister to those guilty of having Christ killed...but then again by Holy Spirit, God gives us grace to do all things.

God bless you sis