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A New Country Song That Satan Must Be Proud Of

S
sermonindex

I was riding with a friend of mine yesterday, and on his truck CD player was a new CD by country singer Brad Paisley. I wasn’t paying much attention to it until a song called “Bigger Fish To Fry” came on. It features several other country singers, including Vince Gill… who is Amy Grants current husband. Interestingly, Mr. Gill cusses during the introduction of the song.

Anyway, the song is meant to be a funny song, but wow… Satan must be pleased with it. Satan would love nothing more than for people to think that “hey, there are plenty of people who sin worse than me! I’m ok, I’m going to heaven. I havent murdered anyone.” Forgetting that the scripture tells us that there are none who are righteous… “no, not one”. All have sinned and come short of the glory of God. If we break one aspect of the Law, we are guilty of all.

I like some of the songs Brad Paisley has put out. But this one shocked me. But then, this is how unregenerate sinners view themselves. They accuse us of being “holier than thou”, when most believers in fact understand completely that we are nothing! Meanwhile, unsaved people say “Well, I’m not as bad as this guy! God will let me in!” And they call us hypocrites?

Oh, and by the way… guess what song follows immediately after this one on the CD! The beatiful hymn “When We All Get To Heaven”. I’m not kidding.

Believe it or not, Brad Paisley claims to be a Christian.

Check out these lyrics and tell me if this isnt the greatest lie of all.

Krispy

[b]Bigger Fish To Fry[/b]
By Brad Paisley

[i]I said a bad word when I was a kid
mama said that I’d be sorry for the sin that I did
my daddy whooped me and the preacher said shame
and I tried like hell to change

and I cuss and I smoke
and I laugh at dirty jokes
minor vices man I know ‘em well
I’ve closed down bars
and I’ve lusted in my heart
my exes think I oughta burn in hell
but the devil, he won’t notice when I die,
don’t you figure
he’s got bigger fish to fry oh yeah

Politicians taking and bribes
crooked CEO’s are getting off with no time
christmas eve burglars stealin’ good childrens toys
(…can’t say chirstmas!)
holiday burglars stealin’ good children’s toys

and I cuss and I smoke
I laugh at dirty jokes
the minor vices, man I know ‘em well
I’ve closed down bars I’ve lusted in my heart
my ex thinks that I oughta burn in hell.
But The devil wont even notice when I die
ya don’t you figure
hes got bigger fish to fry

Theres gonna be a bonfire burnin,
an everlastin bar-b-que
but with all the bad stuff goin on
there ain’t gonna be room for me and you

cuz we cuss and we smoke
and we laugh at taylor’s jokes
(tell one Jim, you know youre old when your wife says ‘honey lets run upstairs and make love’ and your answer is I cannot do both)
some minor vices, man we know ‘em well
we’ve closed down bars and we’ve lusted in our hearts
our exes think we oughta burn in hell
but the devil, he wont notice when we die,
don’t you figure he’s got bigger fish to fry
ya don’t you figgure
he’s got bigger fish to fry
(pass the tarter sauce)[/i]

M
MSeaman

I have to agree. I get really irritated the few times when I hear secular music and they talk about God and Jesus, heaven and hell. The bad theology really makes me want to vomit. The really sad thing is people listen to these singers and their music and believe that what they say is Truth. Deception is everywhere. And with all the easy believism going on today, these people probably do believe they are saved. I mean really, all you have to do is repeat this little prayer and you are on your way to heaven...

:-?

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sermonindex

Here in the buckle of the Bible belt... everyone is saved.

Cuss all week, live like Jerry Springer rejects, get drunk on Satuday night down at the honky tonk, and show up for church on Sunday morning. I've seen it all my life, which was a huge reason why I purposely rejected Christ until I was 27.

All the while saying "Me and God, we got it all worked out. I havent killed anyone, I havent stolen from anyone. Hell is for people like Hitler... and people I dont like."

A lot of folks, especially here in the South, do have a certain respect for the "Good Book", and for Christian values... but they dont have a relationship with Christ. They think simply tipping your hat to the Lord is enough.

It's always baffled me how someone like Hank Williams could live the life he did, write the most lost and regenerate lyrics of anyone in his generation... and still write a song like "I Saw The Light". But I know so many people like that.

Interesting story I read once... Hank Williams was riding in a car around Nashville with Minnie Pearl and someone else, and they were all singing "I Saw The Light". Minnie Pearl noticed that Hank had stopped singing, and she noticed big tears rolling down his cheeks. She asked what was wrong, and Hank said "Cant you see?? There aint no light! It's all darkness!"

He died a few months later from heart failure do to alcohol and drug overdose... at the ripe old age of 27.

And the sins of the father are visited on the generations to come. Hank Williams Jr has been a substance abuser and alcoholic his entire life. He's married 5 or 6 times, has no idea how many children he has.

Hank Williams III is a foul mouthed substance abuser as well. His latest album is called "Straight to Hell".

If ever there was a family that needs prayer, this is one of them. We should all pray for them.

But this is a way of life down here for most folks. Live like hell all week, go to church and throw a five in the plate... do God a favor.

It really is the worst kind of deception because folks really think they are saved! They said a prayer at Vacation Bible School 30 years ago... zip zap, thats it. But instead of "go and sin no more" it's more like "go and sin some more"... come back on Sunday, get cleaned up... and then go get dirty again. It's ok, Sunday is wash day.

It's very difficult to witness to southerners because of this type of deception.

Krispy

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tjservant

I believe country music has done far more damage to Christianity than Rock ever thought about doing. Ozzy and his cronies never claimed to be a Christians.

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sermonindex

Good stuff [actually bad, but you get my point] krispy. This is the sad mindset of many "good people"... and it gets all the more dangerous when they start going to church and mix in a little Jesus with their good person mentality.

In Christ - Jim

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sermonindex

Actually, Ozzy does claim to be a Christian, but at this point in his life I'm surprised he even knows his own name.

Country has always had that element of church in it. I'm not sure why there is this deception engrained in the south. I blame the preachers. Music is a reflection of the culture. The damage was already done... country music has just spread the damage.

Obviously there is some really good, positive Country music. There are a few artists who really are living for the Lord. Paul Overstreet is one of them. Randy Travis is another. He was the number one country singer during the 80's and into the 90's until Garth Brooks came along. In the late 90's Randy Travis truly got saved, and he is really making a difference for the Lord.

It's a strange thing to me tho, when scripture is so clear on the subject of sin and salvation... yet people continue to define it any ol' way they want.

I saw a thing on 20/20 last week about hell. It was a really bad show about hell, obviously. But they had one segment about a preacher in Tulsa who was one of the rising stars in the Charismatic movement. He's been to ORU, been on the PTL Club way back when, and was a regular on TBN... (thats my first clue he wasnt right!)

He had a huge church in Tulsa... until he started preaching that there is no hell. Everyone goes to heaven. Even Hitler.

I sat there thinking "How do you come up with that when scripture is clear?"

The preacher said "I one day realized that the Bible was written by mere men. They were not as enlightened as we are today, so they wrote about their myths and legends... they gave their own interpretations of what Christ was teaching."

Thats it... in order to come up with "no hell", or to have your own definition of sin and salvation you must first reject the Bible as God's Word. You have to do that first. Once you do that, you are able to come up with your own "truth"... and whatever is your truth may or may not be truth for someone else.

People think that modern Bible versions are no big deal, yet I think that this preacher in Tulsa is a great example of where this attack on God's Word is leading us. If someone is completely honest, they have to admit that if you think modern versions are ok, and the KJV is ok, then we have to say that we dont really know where the true Word of God is today. In other words, our Final Authority has been lost.

So, even tho folks in the Bible belt do tip a hat to God... they have done nothing short of a wholesale rejection of God's Word... and ultimately called God a liar.

Krispy

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tjservant

Actually, Ozzy does claim to be a Christian

Thanks for pointing this out. I thought Ozzy always embraced his Godlessness.

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sermonindex

Thanks for pointing this out. I thought Ozzy always embraced his Godlessness.

Understand, when Ozzy called himself a "Christian" in Hot Parader magazine back in the late 80's he was of course not talking about Biblical Christianity. He has defined his own "Christianity".

For what it's worth, if you can make any sense out of what Ozzy is saying...

[i]I have a saying. 'Never judge a book by its cover'. I say that because I don't even know who Ozzy is. I wake up a new person every day. But if you've got a fantasy of Ozzy, who am I to say? I mean, if you think I sleep upside-down in the rafters and fly around at night and bite people's throats out, then that's your thing. But I can tell you now, all I ever wanted was for people to come to my concerts and have a good time. I don't want anyone to harm themselves in any way, shape or form-and my intentions are good whether people want to believe it or not. I'm not going to suddenly become a Jesus freak or anything. But I do have my beliefs and my beliefs are certainly not satanic.[/i] - Ozzy Osbourne

His beliefs are not satanic, yet he has made a 40 year career out of performing satanic music. Gee... I guess that would make him a hypocrite. Imagine...

Ozzy would be laughable if he wasnt so pathetic. Perhaps one day he will come to the realization that regardless of all he has done, Christ loved him enough to die for him anyway.

Krispy

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tjservant

Perhaps one day he will come to the realization that regardless of all he has done, Christ loved him enough to die for him anyway.

Well put Krispy.

There are many that have created their own Christianity…or should I say God. But there is hope for all. His love and grace are truly amazing

“May the Lamb that was slain receive His reward”

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adamdawkins

May the Lamb that was slain receive His reward

Amen - more and more in the light of this sort of thing the Lord is making this my only motivation for preaching.

I've got an even worse situation almost, similar in some ways to the situation in Southern America. Here (UK) no-one is Christian, so in my pentecostal church, because we're "not as bad as the Church of England" - we're fantastic in our own eyes. Even when I mentioned 'praying a prayer' doesn't save anyone, people will agree with me in word, and even say things like "The Christianity in Acts is the only true Christianity" - and yet the sermons I hear on Romans 8 and so on are totally out of context - the lengths we go to to hold on to our sin - and the lengths we must go to (crucifixion) to let go of it!

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sermonindex

Brother Adam... not to add to the list of things wrong with the Church of England (of course, the American Founding Fathers found much wrong with the COE too!), but ironically I received this in my email this morning...

[b]Church of England Documet Says Calling God "He"
Can Lead To Wife Abuse[/b]

[i]New Church of England guidelines for bishops and priests on the subject of domestic abuse warn that calling God "He" or "Lord" encourages men to beat their wives. The goofy guidelines, issued by the Archbishops' Council, urge pastors to make sure that sermons and hymns don't contain "uncritical use of masculine imagery." The document, which is fully endorsed by Archbishop of Canterbury Rowan Williams, says: "Domestic abuse is fundamentally an abuse of power, and many conceptions of God derived from the Bible and the Christian tradition have portrayed divine power in unhealthy and potentially oppressive ways" ("Outcry," Daily Mail, Oct. 3, 2006).[/i]

To blame God the Father and the Bible for man's sin is feminism and apostasy run wild. "The foolishness of man perverteth his way: and his heart fretteth against the LORD" (Proverbs 19:3).

Krispy

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adamdawkins

Indeed, I read that article in the UK recently. Perhaps if the C of E actually preached a God of Wrath we wouldn't have domestic abuse in our homes!

The C of E is gone - what breaks my heart is to see so many Methodist churches either going liberal or closing down - and to see a vaguely alive pentecostal church looking on and doing nothing.

I mean, I even heard someone say "we are all slaves to sin" in a sermon at my church, ARE? Surely 'WERE' is the point? And that's the 'Spirit-filled' Evangelical end.

60 Million People,
3% Church-goers --> 2Million
50% Evangelical --> 1Million

Who knows from there. If you search for Revival UK in Google, the second link is to a link of sincere Muslim Youth, who desire to obey 'God' in everything they do - except they have it wrong, and we don't tell them. Sorry, my sermon for this Sunday is coming out again!

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sermonindex

All is not lost on this side of the pond... but we're headed in that direction. The main problem with church in America is apathy. And apathy leads to apostacy.

Krispy

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adamdawkins

True, but from what I hear, I'm not sure I even your position - at least here we're not in a place where everyone thinks their saved, we're just in a place where people say "Where is your God" - in Psalm 42. Hence why our only solution in this nation is to have our soul 'thirsting for God'.

The problem is, the evangelical churches want revival, but by revival they mean church-growth, more people praying a prayer - etc. I have this odd feeling that when I move totally into that place of fear of the LORD and no care for the opinion of man, that I will probably be kicked out.

Oh well, His will be done.

If you can, please pray for me for Sunday when I'm preaching to my whole church, I don't get the opportunity often, and it's been a heavy week in my spirit - I think the Word is on Judgment.

We must continue to mutually encourage each other by our faith! Only the Lord can do what needs to be done!

Thanks,

Adam

S
sermonindex

The problem is, the evangelical churches want revival, but by revival they mean church-growth, more people praying a prayer - etc. I have this odd feeling that when I move totally into that place of fear of the LORD and no care for the opinion of man, that I will probably be kicked out.

May you be kicked out very soon, my friend! People here have the same idea about revival. They consider Rick Warren to be leading a revival because the numbers are there. It's not revival they have, it's church growth. When it's real revival the "posers" either get right, or they walk away.

If you can, please pray for me for Sunday when I'm preaching to my whole church, I don't get the opportunity often, and it's been a heavy week in my spirit - I think the Word is on Judgment.

Brother, I'll be sure to pray for you all weekend. If I wait till I get out of bed Sunday you will have already preached... time zones, remember.

May I be so bold as to make a suggestion? Something that goes hand in hand with "judgement" is personal holiness... holiness in every aspect of our lives. Preach holiness and judgement, brother.

Krispy

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sermonindex

May you be kicked out very soon, my friend!

Amen, and may God be glorified in your preaching...

In Christ - Jim

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ginnyrose

Krispy Wrote:

Here in the buckle of the Bible belt... everyone is saved.
A lot of folks, especially here in the South, do have a certain respect for the "Good Book", and for Christian values... but they dont have a relationship with Christ. They think simply tipping your hat to the Lord is enough.
It's very difficult to witness to southerners because of this type of deception.

Krispy, what you have here in the south is Calvinism gone to seed. Krispy, I have talked to too many to believe otherwise. And the devil does not care one twit what theological position you hold - you can be ever so religious on Sunday - but what you do otherwise is what He is interested in and he has succeeded quite well.

Now those lyrics you shared - I am sick! Get back! Phew, ugh! there it goes! hope you did not get splattered by my puke!

ginnyrose

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adamdawkins

may God be glorified in your preaching...

Amen!

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roaringlamb

Krispy, what you have here in the south is Calvinism gone to seed

Ginny, I am curious to see what you mean by this?

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sermonindex

Krispy, what you have here in the south is Calvinism gone to seed

I think Calvinism plays a part, but I think it's a mixture of "easy-believism" and a misunderstanding of "once saved always saved".

I do happen to believe in eternal security (otherwise known as "once saved, always saved"). I just happen to believe you have to be [b]truly[/b] saved first before you can be always saved.

Thats where "easy-believism" comes into play. They repeat a quick prayer... no real repentance, just a prayer thats more like a "get out of hell free" card. Then the person who "led them to the Lord" tells them can not lose their salvation no matter what.

I believe that, but the problem is... they were never saved to begin with!!

If someone appears to have lost their salvation, I am convinced they were never truly saved from the start. Something was wrong.

Krispy

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ginnyrose

Ginny, I am curious to see what you mean by this?

It is simply that [some] OSAS people say once you are saved it will not impact your lifestyle. So if you are saved, you can still live for the flesh and God will not judge you because you are still 'saved' and will still go to heaven. This philosophy is as widespread in the south as the fireants that plague our yards....

Make sense?

ginnyrose

C
CJaKfOrEsT


The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men [i]are[/i], extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican
[b]Lk 18:11[/b]

Not really sure why this comes to mind... ;-)

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roaringlamb

It is simply that [some] OSAS people say once you are saved it will not impact your lifestyle.

I see your point, but would also like to know if those who espouse such things preach the Gospel of that was preached by Clavinist men before such as Whitefield, Edwards, etc.

It seems to me that people pick and choose what parts of theology they like, and then throw out all the rest. Sadly, this has happened with much of Reformed theology. People like the perserverance part, but not the depravity or regeneration part.

I figured this was what you were talking about, but did not want to jump to any conclusions.

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sermonindex

you wrote:

It's very difficult to witness to southerners because of this type of deception.

why do you think that is?

Could it be that the south never really repented from the most satanic of sin visited upon this nation, by stealing a whole race of people from their motherland, packing them, chained onto boats, sailing for America, and then enslaving them, treating a HUMAN BEING as property, splitting off families, husbands from wives and children, and selling them as slaves, working them to death, whipping their backs open, breaking their bones, raping slave women, forbidding people to read, for the sole purpose that they not be able to read the Bible or worship, because slave owners were afraid that if a slave got to know the Word of God, his eyes would be open to the utter depravity of his master, WHO probably went to church every Sunday and worshipped in hyprocrisy, while he committed the foul sin of treating a fellow child of God as property.

Do you think that this might play into the deception of what some term the "Bible Belt"?, especially in fact of the light, not 40 years ago, we had to send in federal troops so that a black woman could attend a university,protecting her from the white southern mobs baying for her blood, sending in the Attorney General 40 years ago, so that blacks IN THE SOUTH, could be given the right to vote?

I know its been 144 years since the Emancipation Proclaimation, and in many aspects the black community in America is dysfunctional, but slowly they are healing, and I notice the prime agent of healing within the black community is the Church, plain and simple.

I didnt write this post to get you riled or to start an argument, but just to ask you that question. And if you say, "no, slavery had nothing to do with it", that's fine, you disagree, to which I in turn respectfully disagree, simply because one of the Gospel Messages Jesus carries is that of reconciliation, man to God, and man to his neighbor.

To heal as a nation, I think we should prayerfully explore the notion of racial reconciliation, and doing away with all the symbols of a repressive slavocracy that cursed our nation.

Lord love you.

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sermonindex

Hey, there's my boy Ne... uh, worm! Hope you're blessed brother. Interesting comemnts that require further pondering. Sadly, people of all colors are perishing in deception under our whorish north american church system though so Im not sure how far you can take what you said, I do see where you are coming from though.

be blessed brother - Jim

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sermonindex

but you must admit, that within the northern ghettos, sometimes the only Beacon of Light, That is Jesus, is preached from within the most humble of storefront churches.

True, some storefronts are hellish scams, but others are places where a young black man, fatherless, can be mentored, by a Spirit filled black preacher, who might be the only man he comes in contact with that isnt dealing, fornicating, gang-banging, etc.

in the urban center I'm in, in the worst ghettos, you see only two things, Harold's Chicken shacks and storefront churches, so many, sometimes three on a block, humble and plain, and when I see these, two things I feel...I praise and worship Christ, and realize that some of these people are so beaten down, that they have come to realize the only TRUE LIGHT is Jesus, and all they want to do is gather IN HIS NAME.

and when one goes to worship or a prayer meeting in some of these Churches, you can feel the holy desperation.......holy desperation is foundational to revival.

Lord love you too...stay safe.

I talked to our bro in Riverside, and it was joyous.

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ginnyrose

It seems to me that people pick and choose what parts of theology they like, and then throw out all the rest.

You got that right. All they like to talk about is love but fail to realize love is the flip side of the wrath of God on all sin which must be repented of if you expect to spend eternity with the LORD. When you come to the LORD repentance will be demonstrated by your lifestyle.

The lyrics shared by Krispy in the original post on thie thread do NOT demonstrate the mindset of a mind that has been redeemed by the Blood of the Lamb. This song stands in stark contrast to the songs written by Fanny Crosby, Ira Sankey, Homer Rodheaver, Issac Watts, and others. If you have no hymnal, go to a thrift store or a used book store and buy and old church hymnal and compare those old songs with the drivel you hear today that is called Christian. Notice the contrast.

Blessings,
ginnyrose

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sermonindex

This philosophy is as widespread in the south as the fireants that plague our yards....

Kudzo, I think, is a better analogy! LOL

Krispy

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sermonindex

Could it be that the south never really repented from the most satanic of sin visited upon this nation, by stealing a whole race of people from their motherland, packing them, chained onto boats, sailing for America, and then enslaving them, treating a HUMAN BEING as property, splitting off families, husbands from wives and children, and selling them as slaves, working them to death, whipping their backs open, breaking their bones, raping slave women, forbidding people to read, for the sole purpose that they not be able to read the Bible or worship, because slave owners were afraid that if a slave got to know the Word of God, his eyes would be open to the utter depravity of his master, WHO probably went to church every Sunday and worshipped in hyprocrisy, while he committed the foul sin of treating a fellow child of God as property.

Well... no. And yes. But then again... no.

America allowed slavery to happen, not just the south. The biggest port until the late 1840's for slave auctions was Philly, PA. Up until that time slavery was all over the US, not just the south.

As the north industrialized the need for slavery became less and less. There was no wholesale repentence of the northern states about slavery. It simply was not needed any more.

And regardless of what the government schools teach you, the War Against Northern Aggression was not about slavery... it was about taxes.

Now, having said all that, let me assure you that slavery was a scourge, and the war ended the right way for America. The philosophy of the Confederacy was flawed and never would have worked, and the end of slavery obviously needed to happen. It's unfortunate that it's taken well over 100 years for black people to get to where they are today... and this country has a long ways to go yet.

I think the south bears a guilty conscience about slavery. But the north is not without it's guilt either. We could talk about the carpet baggers after the war. We could talk about General Sherman's terrorism of the south, and the harm he wrought on innocent people.

It's all bad.

And once in a while I run into a yankee who wants to beat me over the head about slavery. I take exception to that... I wasnt there. I never owned slaves. I love people of any color. And to the best of knowledge my ancestors were poor dirt farmers who never even saw any slaves, much less owned any. When my ancestors fought in that War, they fought to protect their homes from terrorists like Sherman... not to keep slaves that they didnt have to begin with.

So... I kinda agree with you, but I kinda dont. I'm not taking up an argument with you, just dont think you have your facts straight. It's pretty common to blame the south for slavery when slavery in this country started long before the southern colonies were even settled. It started in the north. It began with enslaving indians, and then the British brought Africans in as trade... into NORTHERN ports... such as Boston.

Krispy

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theopenlife

Just to throw this out there for Ginnyrose, having lived amongst Southerners (and other similar humans) I don't see Calvinism having so much to do with it, as a hybrid theology.

Compare them to the five points...

Ask these people if they are radically separated from God by sin, extensively unwilling and unfit to approach Him. They will deny this!

They deny that God chooses His elect without regard for works, because they want to receive their own credit. Their God doesn't choose anyone, they chose Him!

They deny limited atonement ("Christ died for everybody equally" they say.)

The sometimes deny irresistable grace, if they perceive it as "God forcing" anything.

They definately don't believe that all true saints persevere in holiness and biblical faith to the end.

They are at best Antinomians, and often Arminian.

Not wanting to make a deal of this, but vindicating a misconception where possible.

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ginnyrose

Worm wrote:

Could it be that the south never really repented from the most satanic of sin visited upon this nation,

Worm, I do not know of any respectable Christian, even nominal ones who would say slavery was right. But you must also understand, the north had slavery as well, it was not only confined to the southern states. The Civil War was not about slavery; it was about States rights. If I recall, the stats say only 1 in 15 persons in the south owned slaves, and they were not all whites; Choctaws (an Indian tribe that lived in Mississippi) also owned slaves. The reason it was more widespread in the South was because it was more profitable because of cotton. And it should be noted that not all slave owners were brutal. Many were loved by their white owners. You can go to an old cemetery here and find blacks buried by their white masters. Having said all this, I must tell you what an old black man told me a few years ago when I interviewed him for the Mississippi Oral History program. He was a former officer of the local NAACP chapter: "I have lived in the south and in the north. The northern white people say they love the blacks but in actuality they hate the individual. The southern white in contrast says he hates the black [as a race] but in reality, they love the individual. " And he told me he prefers the latter.

Worm, the issue you raised is far more complex then a simple "since you had slavery, that is why deception is rampant in your part of the country." If you want to accuse and blame, I promise you there is enough to go around and no one will escape unscathed. When you stand before God Almighty on judgment day, God will not excuse your sinful behaviors because of some offenses that have come to your ancestors many years ago.

Blessings,
ginnyrose

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adamdawkins

It is simply that [some] OSAS people say once you are saved it will not impact your lifestyle. So if you are saved, you can still live for the flesh and God will not judge you because you are still 'saved' and will still go to heaven. This philosophy is as widespread in the south as the fireants that plague our yards....

I think this is the problem elsewhere too.

I happen to not believe in OSAS - but I don't think that OSAS is the problem the way that Whitfield, Edwards etc used to present it.

My concern is, in this country (UK) and anywhere - people pray a prayer - we tell them they're in, and that if they doubt they're in - it's from the Devil.

I remember last year we had a youth conference at our church and there was a response call at one of the afternoon meetings, a girl put her hand up, and then later got given a Bible and a book etc and got told "well done, you're saved..." etc.

I spoke to her later that evening, she knew nothing of the resurrection, nothing of repentance, didn't know why Jesus died, what we believed as Christians etc - she put her hand up to say 'I want to know more'.

I spoke to her further, I made it quite clear what a Christian was and wasn't, and just left her to think.

A week or so later we were at church and in our youth group the lady leading the group asked "Who here is saved, filled with the Spirit, speaking in tongues?", "Who here is saved but has never been filled with the Spirit?" and then "Who here knows they have never received Christ?"

The girl in question boldly (I thought) as the only person in the room raised her hand, and a youth leader lent over to her and said "no no, you got saved at the youth conference remember?"

I think THIS is the danger.

If someone lovingly came up to me (whether you believe in OSAS or not) and said "Excuse me, the Bible says to 'test yourselves' so I'd like to remind you what the Scripture says about the regenerate man, and I think you should consider carefully where you are before Him, and whether or not you're saved" -

I wouldn't be offended, I'd be grateful. If someone tells me I'm saved all the time when I've never received anything of Christ, nor been born again, nor had any hint of holiness or change about my life, I will definitely not be grateful for every time they talked me out of the conviction of the Holy Spirit when it comes to that Day.

I wonder if preaching of OSAS is ever really effective, because those that hold to "if you went astray, something was wrong to start with" would still preach the same message to the backslider as the Arminean, and I think that's where Wesley/Whitfield found their common ground. Ok there was a disagreement about 'if you were ever there' but the criteria and proof (fruit) for the truly saved man is the same. It's the magic-word prayer combined with OSAS that is so dangerous.

The Paul Washer video on the homepage covers a lot of this very well.

May the true Bride walk in such purity and holiness in these days, that 'easy-believers' are unable to hold to their false assurance in light of such a holiness.

T
tjservant

May the true Bride walk in such purity and holiness in these days, that 'easy-believers' are unable to hold to their false assurance in light of such a holiness.

Amen Brother!

A
adamdawkins

Quote:

May the true Bride walk in such purity and holiness in these days, that 'easy-believers' are unable to hold to their false assurance in light of such a holiness.

Amen Brother!

This reminds me actually of something I heard Art Katz say once, about how the blame for the rise of Islam and Islamic terror rested with the Church, because when they looked at the Church they should see a holiness and a righteousness that makes them jealous - that they find difficult to condemn.

But instead the see the whole of the West as the Church, because the Church is often as sensual and unrighteous as the World.

Slightly off topic I suppose, but worth sharing I think. Humbling.

G
ginnyrose

Kudzo, I think, is a better analogy! LOL

LOL

At least kudzo is edible! But fireants, ain't and they are in [i]my[/i] yard, back and front and around. My DH feeds them regularly but the pesky things refuse to die. Oh, they may get subdued but after a while there appears to be a ressurrection! lol About like sin.

ginnyrose

S
sermonindex

We dont get fireants too often up here in the mountains... but the other night we had a momma bear and two cubs come hang around our house for a few hours. We used spotlights and made all kinds of noise to drive them off... so what did they do? They climbed a pine tree. They were at least 65 feet in the air... about 20 feet from the house... just hanging out. I can only shoot them this time of year if they pose a threat, so I sat on our upper deck with a shotgun until 2am waiting for her to step foot on our lower deck. I could almost smell the bear roast! (It's a little on the greasy side, but oh man, it's very tastey!)

But alas... they finally came down and wandered back into the woods. Oh well... maybe next time!

Krispy

S
sermonindex

Not just Country Music. Where will it all end? Now that was a silly question!!!!

John Lennon once enraged Christians by claiming that the Beatles were bigger than Jesus. The Church of England is now recognising the pulling power of rock stars by recruiting Bono, the singer and lyricist of U2, in its bid to boost congregations.

A Church of England bishop is to preside at this country’s first “U2-charist”, an adapted Holy Communion service that uses the Irish supergroup’s best-selling songs in place of hymns.

D
deltadom

thats interesting

A
adamdawkins

The Church of England is now recognising the pulling power of rock stars

Ever since the Church of England abandoned the Gospel - it has had to look anywhere else for it's "pulling power".

I believe the U2-charist stuff has been going on in America for a while actually, I read about it ages ago. For the record, Bono is part of some Universalist movement and often 'preaches' about how great man is and about all of our potential and technology. At one gig in New York he repeated, like some mantra:

"Jesus, Mohammad, Jew - All true"

Reports of Christians at the event say even those who didn't what he was saying felt the bad shock-waves. Bono seems to be a true End Times preacher, just for the wrong side.

S
Smokey


Very interesting thread, thanks to all for the insights shared. Jesus continually warns of false teachers and deception as being rampant immediately prior to the onset of the tribulation time. If I strain a bit, I believe I can hear the coming hoof beats.
Come quickly Lord Jesus.
Blessings Greg

S
sermonindex

Ever since the Church of England abandoned the Gospel - it has had to look anywhere else for it's "pulling power".

Seems as thoughh for sometime we (in America) are also looking elsewhere for "PULLING POWER".

Many words in "Christian Rock & Roll and much of Christian Comtemporary Music are preaching "another Gospel"!....not to mention the music now in Churches that sound more like "chanting"...the same words over and over.

Has anyone ever Heard of:
The Old Rugged Cross or
Love lifted me or

Oh, that's about SIN,....that's right, we don't go there these days! I guess it's "Politically incorrect"....and now have clinics and drugs and 12 step programs to take care of that.


Love in Christ
Katy-did

A
adamdawkins

Seems as though for sometime we (in America) are also looking elsewhere for "PULLING POWER".

Suffice to say, I'm not actually part of the Church of England - but I think most Churches, even relatively evangelical churches do this. We're still keen to see success.

I preached last Sunday on what it would take to see the promise of 'Heavy Rain' (a prophecy) in our congregation. I said how I didn't want to see the thousands flock to our Church, but rather wanted to see us repent and become holy and leave the secret sin behind - God forbid our church be filled with more like us as we are!

Speaking of songs, there's a Hillsong song of which the Chorus repeats "I will worship you for who you are". The bridge is:

Holy
Righteous
Faithful to the End
Saviour,
Healer,
Redeemer and
Friend.

We seem to skip past "Holy and Righteous" as fast we can these days, and throw these words in to songs and sermons without any revelation - we want the Saviour Healer Redeemer Friend (Halleilujah) but we don't want the HOLY and RIGHTEOUS Saviour Healer Redeemer and Friend - as such we are still to much like the world - and such we seek a pulling power because:

1) We don't witness enough of the power of the HOLY Spirit and
2) We're not changed enough, nor have a desire enough to please God alone, to get beyond our 'results-based' church.

All of church is based on 'results' today. That's why that wonderful Reidhead sermon 'Ten Shekels and a Shirt' is so important.

I hear phrases like "If the conference in October goes well...of course the session will approve a Friday-night ministry..." - what sort of condition is that? We want results - I want Jesus.

S
Santana

people always compare themselves with Hitler and I think that makes them feel better.

But didn't Hitler think he's a good person?? In his mind, he's doing god a favor by cleaning up Germany.

I never met a person who didn't think they were good.

R
running2win

We want results - I want Jesus.

AMEN brother! I want both though as long as the results are because of a genuine outpouring of the Holy Ghost and not results from compromise.
But, even if I never see the revival I so long for I will still give this christian life everything I've got for my most excellent Jesus.
"Love so amazing, so divine
[b]Demands[/b] my soul, my life, my [b]all[/b]!"
Isaac Watts

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