Joyce Meyer's $23,000 Toilet:A Symbol Of The Prosperity Gospel

"Sen. Charles Grassley (R-IA), the ranking member of the Senate Finance Committee, has opened an investigation into the finances of six of the leading prosperity televangelists, Paula White, Kenneth Copeland, Joyce Meyer, Eddie Long, Creflo Dollar, Benny Hinn. Grassley is looking into whether these celebrity preachers abused their tax-exempt status by using proceeds to enrich themselves with luxury items like mansions, private jets, and fancy cars."

Quotation from The American Prospect

A concise definition of the prosperity gospel: A well-coiffed and designer-clad televangelist badgers his TV listeners to send him their hard-earned dollars so that God will in turn financially bless them.

Jesus Christ never promised his disciples earthly rewards -- only heavenly rewards. For what shall it profit a man if he gain the whole world, but lose his own soul? Mark 8:36

http://www.americanchronicle.com/art...rticleID=42538

Jesus Christ never promised his disciples earthly rewards -- only heavenly rewards.

Mark 10:30 But he shall receive an hundredfold [b]now in this time[/b], houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, [b]with persecutions[/b]; and in the world to come eternal life.

Let us not forget that there is nothing wrong in earthly rewards, what is wrong is where is your heart? In heaven, or on the earth?

It's clear that those who teach the WOF doctrine are of the earth earthy and mind earthly things. But we who are spiritual desire Christ our treasure. But while we sojourn on planet earth, the LORD will see that every one is blessed accordingly. Some with little, others not too rich and not too poor, and just a few with a lot.

But while we sojourn on planet earth, the LORD will see that every one is blessed accordingly. Some with little, others not too rich and not too poor, and just a few with a lot.

The bible says He supplies our needs only. Sometimes we may have a want which may be a need such as a vacation which I need about now.:-)

Philippians 4:19
But my God shall supply all your need according to his riches in glory by Christ Jesus.

This is how God feels about riches:
James 5:2
Your riches are corrupted, and your garments are motheaten.

Some who get saved are already rich and the bible cautions them concerning thier riches:

1 Timothy 6:17
Charge them that are rich in this world, that they be not highminded, nor trust in uncertain riches, but in the living God, who giveth us richly all things to enjoy;

.
I believe that if EVERY ministry, mega, huge and local would pay tithes themselves (take 10% or more) and put INTO the community, no one would need government help. But that's just my personal opinion. Could you imagine how much help there would be if mega churches did alone that?

I spoke with my last pastor about this and he told me that if they did that, they couldn't operate. I said, "Oh but you expect everyone of your members to operate like that."

This is from the REVIVAl email list:
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
INTEGRITY, ACCOUNTABILITY & the GRASSLEY INVESTIGATION
-by Lee Grady.

Six charismatic ministries are under the microscope as a U.S. Senate committee scrutinizes their spending practices. Is this from the devil—or God?

Depending on how you look at it, Sen. Charles Grassley is either a crusader for righteousness or a devil with horns.

Some Christians feared he was the latter this week when the Iowa lawmaker, who is the ranking Republican on the Senate Finance Committee, announced that he has launched an extensive investigation into the spending practices of six prominent charismatic ministries. As soon as news of the probe broke on Tuesday, I started getting calls from people who are worried that
Grassley is plotting to take away the tax-exempt status of all evangelical churches in America.

I have been assured by one of Grassley’s top associates that he does not have a hidden agenda, and he is not conspiring to deny anybody of religious freedom. What the senator does want is assurance that these six organizations are not taking money that was donated to charity and misusing it to buy mansions, plastic surgeries and other lavish perks.

“The Christian public should have demanded a higher level of accountability a long time ago.”

In letters that were made public on Tuesday, Grassley told Kenneth and Gloria Copeland; David and Joyce Meyer; Randy and Paula White; Creflo and Taffi Dollar; Eddie Long; and Benny Hinn that they have four weeks to send him a boatload of paperwork to prove they are in compliance with U.S. tax laws.

Grassley has been applauded in the past for blowing the whistle on financial abuses among secular nonprofit organizations including the American Red Cross. Now, because of complaints he has received from the public, the senator is turning his attention to these six ministries, demanding that they send him receipts
for expensive purchases, minutes from board meetings, audited financial records and detailed compensation figures, among other documents.

Each of the ministries received a letter asking about specific expenditures or questionable practices. Among Grassley’s requests:

** A receipt for the Bentley convertible that Florida-based television preacher Paula White reportedly gave to Texas pastor T.D. Jakes

** Information from Bible teacher Joyce Meyer about expensive furnishings in her Missouri headquarters—including a $30,000 malachite table, a $23,000 commode with a marble top and a
$19,000 pair of Dresden vases

** Paperwork explaining how Benny Hinn’s ministry purchased his $3 million home in Dana Point, Calif.

** Receipts and other records explaining how Eddie Long paid for his $1.4 million estate on 20 acres in suburban Atlanta

** Records about vacation trips to Hawaii and Fiji that Kenneth and Gloria Copeland took using their ministry plane

** Clarification from Atlanta faith preacher Creflo Dollar about his role in raising a hefty portion of a $2 million gift donated to Kenneth Copeland.

We charismatics certainly are in an awkward spot these days. At the same time that Oral Roberts University (ORU) is under the microscope for alleged financial mismanagement, some of the biggest names in our movement are now accused of bending tax rules and spending God’s money on themselves.

I am not going to rush to judgment in this case. I know that Meyer pumps hundreds of thousands of dollars into missionary outreach projects in many parts of the world, and the IRS recently notified her that Joyce Meyer Ministries is operating in compliance with tax rules. Hopefully her answers to Grassley’s questions will satisfy the Senate committee so she can continue her programs without interruption.

At the same time I can’t understand how some preachers can take their offerings with a straight face. How can anyone, for example, think that it is a wise use of God’s money to pay $10,000 a night for a hotel room on the way home from a foreign ministry trip?

Something needs to be said. Questions need to be asked. That’s why I refuse to demonize Grassley for launching this probe.

What is unfortunate about this investigation is that it had to be initiated by someone in the federal government. The Christian public should have demanded a higher level of accountability a long time ago. Why have we been silent when we know certain ministries are operating without a proper board of directors or without any accountability?

I’ve been praying about all the uncomfortable shaking that is taking place in the church today—from the embarrassing moral failures to the cavalier ministry divorces to the ORU scandal—and I sense that God is the one who is orchestrating these events.

I believe He is raising His holy plumb line over the church today. He is demanding that we come in line with His higher ways. He is decreeing: “I will have a holy people. I will expose greed, arrogance, larceny and corruption, and I will correct theological error that has led My people into materialism, selfishness and idolatry. The process will be painful, but in he end My people will be purified.”

I hope every one of these ministries can prove they’ve done nothing wrong. But if God wants to use a senator to help the American church clean up its act, then I say bring on the reformation.

~J. Lee Grady is editor of Charisma.
SOURCE: http://www.charismanews.com/

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glorytoglory wrote:

This is how God feels about riches:
James 5:2
Your riches are corrupted, and your garments are motheaten.

The rich man went to hell people

Gen 24:35 And the LORD hath blessed my master greatly; and he is become
great: and he hath given him flocks, and herds, and silver, and gold,
and menservants, and maidservants, and camels, and asses.
Gen 13:6 And the land was not able to bear them, that they might dwell
together: for their substance was great, so that they could not dwell
together.

One thing God does not do is prosper us so we can store up treasure on earth and go to hell...

I encourage everyone to listen to this message By David Kirkwood called the sheep and the goats.

[url=http://www.obeyjesus.net/component/option,com_docman/task,doc_download/gid,306/]http://www.obeyjesus.net/component/option,com_docman/task,doc_download/gid,306/[/url]

Spiritual Blessings in Christ - Jim

chandras wrote:
Gen 24:35 And the LORD hath blessed my master greatly; and he is become
great: and he hath given him flocks, and herds, and silver, and gold,
and menservants, and maidservants, and camels, and asses.
Gen 13:6 And the land was not able to bear them, that they might dwell
together: for their substance was great, so that they could not dwell
together.

This is the old covenant.

Matthew 6:33 But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all
these things shall be added unto you.

chandras wrote:
Matthew 6:33 But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all
these things shall be added unto you.

You forgot the previous verses:

19Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal:

20But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:

21For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.

22The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.

23But if thine eye be evil, thy whole body shall be full of darkness. If therefore the light that is in thee be darkness, how great is that darkness!

24No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.

25Therefore I say unto you, Take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat, or what ye shall drink; nor yet for your body, what ye shall put on. Is not the life more than meat, and the body than raiment?

26Behold the fowls of the air: for they sow not, neither do they reap, nor gather into barns; yet your heavenly Father feedeth them. Are ye not much better than they?

27Which of you by taking thought can add one cubit unto his stature?

28And why take ye thought for raiment? Consider the lilies of the field, how they grow; they toil not, neither do they spin:

29And yet I say unto you, That even Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these.

30Wherefore, if God so clothe the grass of the field, which to day is, and to morrow is cast into the oven, shall he not much more clothe you, O ye of little faith?

31Therefore take no thought, saying, What shall we eat? or, What shall we drink? or, Wherewithal shall we be clothed?

32(For after all these things do the Gentiles seek:) for your heavenly Father knoweth that ye have need of all these things.

III John 1:2 Beloved, I wish above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in
health, even as thy soul prospereth.

chandras wrote:
III John 1:2 Beloved, I wish above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in
health, even as thy soul prospereth.

Psalm 73:13
12Behold, these are the ungodly, who prosper in the world; they increase in riches.

III John 1:2 Beloved, I wish above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in

chandras, I am wondering where you are from?

Why asking?

II Cor 8:9 For ye know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that, though he
was rich, yet for your sakes he became poor, that ye through his
poverty might be rich.

Why asking?

Because modern American Christianty (or mystery babylon the great whore as the Bible seems to call it) is making the world drunk with the wine of her fornications such as the propserity gospel.

I am just curios where you live to see how far it has traveled. I do not mean this to insult you in any way. Hey, check out this 15 or so minute compilation called escaping the theology of Babylon and let me know what you think.

[url=http://www.freecdtracts.com/comps/carter_conlin_vs_joyce_meyer.mp3]http://www.freecdtracts.com/comps/carter_conlin_vs_joyce_meyer.mp3[/url]

In Christ - Jim

chandras wrote:
II Cor 8:9 For ye know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that, though he
was rich, yet for your sakes he became poor, that ye through his
poverty might be rich.

Are you saying He shed his blood so that I could have a gold toilet seat? :-(

Can you not post so many threads at once and give others a chance to respond to all your posting? Thanks.:-)

Intens4Him said

My favorite David Wilkerson quote (from one of those compilations) as best I can remember...

Quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The rich man went to hell people
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If that be the case for rich men, all Americans from the poorest to the richest, will all go to hell.

*
[color=996600][b]1Ti 6:5 Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself.

1Ti 6:6 But godliness with contentment is great gain.
1Ti 6:7 For we brought nothing into this world, and it is certain we can carry nothing out.
1Ti 6:8 [u]And having food and raiment let us be therewith content.[/u]
1Ti 6:9 But they that will be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many foolish and hurtful lusts, which drown men in destruction and perdition.
1Ti 6:10 For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.

Today in my email - someone sent pictures of children from other nations with no cloths and they were mere skeletons with just a small amount of skin over them.

Luk 6:24 But woe unto you that are rich! for ye have received your consolation.

It's time to come out of the Cast System !

Mat 25:41 Then shall He say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

Mat 25:42 For I was hungry, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:

Mat 25:43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.

Mat 25:44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee hungry, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?

Mat 25:45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.

Mat 25:46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal. [/b][/color]

edit:connecting verses.

Lkid wrote:
by glorytoglory on 2007/11/15 19:12:50

Quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

chandras wrote:
Gen 24:35 And the LORD hath blessed my master greatly; and he is become
great: and he hath given him flocks, and herds, and silver, and gold,
and menservants, and maidservants, and camels, and asses.
Gen 13:6 And the land was not able to bear them, that they might dwell
together: for their substance was great, so that they could not dwell
together.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This is the old covenant.

I don't get your point. Abraham is the father of faith. What does it mattter about being the old covenant

Old Covenant:

Malachi 3:12
12And all nations shall call you blessed: for ye shall be a delightsome land, saith the LORD of hosts.

God blessed the land as a testimony to the nations.

New Covenant:

Now we are God’s land:
1 Corinthians 3:9
For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.

Hebrews 10:16
This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;

Abraham did not seek after riches, God blessed him as a testimony. Not only for a testimony but God was giving the land to his people and that is why Abraham was rich. Abraham was to take possession of the land and it was by God making him rich and giving him all of these things. God also multiplied his seed. Through Abraham’s faith God made himself a people and gave these people a land through the faith of this man. Israel was blessed and still is in some ways because of the FAITH of Abraham and so are we. We have been saved by grace through faith in our Lord Jesus Christ and we are grafted in. This is our inheritance, our salvation through the precious blood of Christ Jesus by faith, the same faith as Abraham. We are not to seek after the riches of Abraham.

Maybe Joyce has sensitive skin... ever consider that?

Krispy

KrispyKrittr wrote:
Maybe Joyce has sensitive skin... ever consider that?

Krispy

Luke 6:45
A good man out of the good treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is good; and an evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is evil: for of the abundance of the heart his mouth speaketh.

The rich man went to hell people...

If that be the case for rich men, all Americans from the poorest to the richest, will all go to hell.

I agree, outside of another great awakening, the vast majority of professing Christians in America will go to hell. As Goerge Whitfield said in his classic, [url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/articles/index.php?view=article&aid=1010]The Almost Christian[/url] the love of money is one of the greatest reasons people remain almost saved. We need to allow the Lord to continually shine a bright light on our hearts (those of us raised in North America) and make adjustments to our use of unrightouss mammon.

Whether or not she sits on $23 000 throne should make no difference to me. If its something that she feels God wants her to have then leave her alone. But if they believe contrary respect them enough to walk away.

I will choose to mark and avoid these blatant ministers of the darkness and to warn others about them as Paul did. They bring shame and disgrace and open reproach to the name of Jesus. These false teachers have done great harm to me and many I love. Jesus Christ has set me free their bondage and deception and I will shout it from the rooftops if I am called to!

Beware of these people brother. Check out some of the links I posted earlier in this thread.

BTW - A great thread to help us remember how good we have it in America and how much more is required of us can be seen here. May we have open ears as the Lord continues to teach all of us how to love our neighbor as ourself.

[url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=20610&forum=35&0]https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=20610&forum=35&0[/url]

In Christ - Jim

glorytoglory... my last post was meant as humor.

So I guess joy and laughter is in my heart this morning. Thats a good thing, I suppose. :-)

Krispy

KrispyKrittr wrote:
glorytoglory... my last post was meant as humor.

So I guess joy and laughter is in my heart this morning. Thats a good thing, I suppose. :-)

Krispy

I am guilty of that in the past as well. I used to laugh because it's either that or cry but the Lord has convicted me of this. Sorry to come off so abruptly.

Make no mistake about it... I do not support Joyce Meyer in the slightest.

Krispy

... dont be a potty mouth.

:-P

We have a 2 yr old we're trying to potty train. I bet over the course of 4 boy's we've spent $2300 on diapers. So maybe a $2300 toilet isnt so far out there after all, huh?

I remember with our first son my wife was on the "all natural" kick... i.e. clothe diapers. Oh boy... what fun that was. Then boy #2 was born, and we bought stock in the Kimberly-Clark Company!!

...how did I get here? Anyway... Joyce Meyer.

Krispy

davym wrote:
but he was God's man! and one man with God is a great majority!

God bless.

I like that! :-)

The very scriptures prosperity preachers use to rob God is against them. In Malachi 3 God says they were robbers and it looks so holy when they preach on Malachi 3 and ask for the tythe but they are tything to themselves.

In verses 16-18 There is a blessing on those who not only do not participate in this theivery but recognize it as such. It also says that they were constantly speaking to one another (fellowshipping) and not participating. Talking about righteousness and holiness. God in turn gave them discernment and in v.18 He says that they will be able to discern between the wicked and the righteous because God is going to give them this discernment.

Malachi 3
1Behold, I will send my messenger, and he shall prepare the way before me: and the LORD, whom ye seek, shall suddenly come to his temple, even the messenger of the covenant, whom ye delight in: behold, he shall come, saith the LORD of hosts.

2But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:

3And he shall sit as a refiner and purifier of silver: and he shall purify the sons of Levi, and purge them as gold and silver, that they may offer unto the LORD an offering in righteousness.

4Then shall the offering of Judah and Jerusalem be pleasant unto the LORD, as in the days of old, and as in former years.

5And I will come near to you to judgment; and I will be a swift witness against the sorcerers, and against the adulterers, and against false swearers, and against those that oppress the hireling in his wages, the widow, and the fatherless, and that turn aside the stranger from his right, and fear not me, saith the LORD of hosts.

6For I am the LORD, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed.

7Even from the days of your fathers ye are gone away from mine ordinances, and have not kept them. Return unto me, and I will return unto you, saith the LORD of hosts. But ye said, Wherein shall we return?

8Will a man rob God? Yet ye have robbed me. But ye say, Wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings.

9Ye are cursed with a curse: for ye have robbed me, even this whole nation.

10Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the LORD of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it.

11And I will rebuke the devourer for your sakes, and he shall not destroy the fruits of your ground; neither shall your vine cast her fruit before the time in the field, saith the LORD of hosts.

12And all nations shall call you blessed: for ye shall be a delightsome land, saith the LORD of hosts.

13Your words have been stout against me, saith the LORD. Yet ye say, What have we spoken so much against thee?

14Ye have said, It is vain to serve God: and what profit is it that we have kept his ordinance, and that we have walked mournfully before the LORD of hosts?

15And now we call the proud happy; yea, they that work wickedness are set up; yea, they that tempt God are even delivered.

[color=660033]THE PEOPLE WERE MOURNING BECAUSE OF THESE ROBBERS AND IT LOOKED AS THOUGH THEY WERE ALL SET UP AND GETTING AWAY WITH IT IN V15 BUT THEN LOOK WHAT GOD SAYS TO THEM:[/color]

[color=0000FF]16Then they that feared the LORD spake often one to another: and the LORD hearkened, and heard it, and a book of remembrance was written before him for them that feared the LORD, and that thought upon his name. [/color]

[color=0000FF]17And they shall be mine, saith the LORD of hosts, in that day when I make up my jewels; and I will spare them, as a man spareth his own son that serveth him. [/color]

[color=0000FF]18Then shall ye return, and discern between the righteous and the wicked, between him that serveth God and him that serveth him not.[/color]

[color=660033]God is going to have a special book of rememberance for those who feared the Lord during this time and thought upon His name.The scriptures say that they spoke OFTEN about God to one another during this time of robbery.[/color]

16Then they that feared the LORD spake often one to another: and the LORD hearkened, and heard it, and a book of remembrance was written before him for them that feared the LORD, and that thought upon his name.

God is going to have a special book of rememberance for those who feared the Lord during this time and thought upon His name.The scriptures say that they spoke OFTEN about God to one another during this time of robbery.

The basic premise of WOF is wrong... they claim promises that God made to Israel. He didnt make promises to us of earthly wealth as Christians. Thats why we live under whats called a NEW COVENANT.

We, as believers in Jesus, can not rifle thru the OT and begin to claim promises made under the Old Covenant.

Really, what it boils down to is the twisted heresy of Replacement Theology. God has not replaced the nation of Israel with the NT Church. Israel is still in His plan, and He is still dealing with Israel... He hasnt written them off. That should be obvious by the very fact that they are in existence today. They are the only nation in the history of the world to cease to exist... and then come back into existence 2,000 years later.

Of course God said this would happen in His Word, so we shouldnt surprised. But it is quite remarkable.

So... basically... WOF is based on a wrong understanding of the difference between God's old covenant and His new covenant.

And it's based on greed, pride, lust and power too.... and throw in a little tax evasion for good measure.

Krispy

May God bless JM more and more , thank God.

I think I'll take the word of a missionary over that of JM anyday...

Can you please verify this information for us? I believe you, I just think it wise to have verification of this before people go out repeating this information... because it will get repeated for sure.

Krispy

May God bless JM more and more , thank God.

As long as she continues to be a heretic God will continue to NOT bless her. All of her worldly riches should not be mistaken as God's blessings... if that were true, then He sure has blessed Larry Flynt and Snoop Dogg.

Until she repents she will not be spiritually blessed, and thats the blessings that come from God.

Krispy

MY QUOTE:

The very scriptures prosperity preachers use to rob God is against them. In Malachi 3 God says they were robbers and it looks so holy when they preach on Malachi 3 and ask for the tithe but they are tything to themselves.

In verses 16-18 There is a blessing on those who not only do not participate in this theivery but recognize it as such. It also says that they were constantly speaking to one another (fellowshipping) and not participating. Talking about righteousness and holiness. God in turn gave them discernment and in v.18 He says that they will be able to discern between the wicked and the righteous because God is going to give them this discernment.

Malachi 3
1Behold, I will send my messenger, and he shall prepare the way before me: and the LORD, whom ye seek, shall suddenly come to his temple, even the messenger of the covenant, whom ye delight in: behold, he shall come, saith the LORD of hosts.

2But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:

3And he shall sit as a refiner and purifier of silver: and he shall purify the sons of Levi, and purge them as gold and silver, that they may offer unto the LORD an offering in righteousness.

4Then shall the offering of Judah and Jerusalem be pleasant unto the LORD, as in the days of old, and as in former years.

5And I will come near to you to judgment; and I will be a swift witness against the sorcerers, and against the adulterers, and against false swearers, and against those that oppress the hireling in his wages, the widow, and the fatherless, and that turn aside the stranger from his right, and fear not me, saith the LORD of hosts.

6For I am the LORD, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed.

7Even from the days of your fathers ye are gone away from mine ordinances, and have not kept them. Return unto me, and I will return unto you, saith the LORD of hosts. But ye said, Wherein shall we return?

8Will a man rob God? Yet ye have robbed me. But ye say, Wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings.

9Ye are cursed with a curse: for ye have robbed me, even this whole nation.

10Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the LORD of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it.

11And I will rebuke the devourer for your sakes, and he shall not destroy the fruits of your ground; neither shall your vine cast her fruit before the time in the field, saith the LORD of hosts.

12And all nations shall call you blessed: for ye shall be a delightsome land, saith the LORD of hosts.

13Your words have been stout against me, saith the LORD. Yet ye say, What have we spoken so much against thee?

14Ye have said, It is vain to serve God: and what profit is it that we have kept his ordinance, and that we have walked mournfully before the LORD of hosts?

15And now we call the proud happy; yea, they that work wickedness are set up; yea, they that tempt God are even delivered.

[color=660033]THE PEOPLE WERE MOURNING BECAUSE OF THESE ROBBERS AND IT LOOKED AS THOUGH THEY WERE ALL SET UP AND GETTING AWAY WITH IT IN V15 BUT THEN LOOK WHAT GOD SAYS TO THEM:[/color]

[color=0000FF]16Then they that feared the LORD spake often one to another: and the LORD hearkened, and heard it, and a book of remembrance was written before him for them that feared the LORD, and that thought upon his name. [/color]

[color=0000FF]17And they shall be mine, saith the LORD of hosts, in that day when I make up my jewels; and I will spare them, as a man spareth his own son that serveth him. [/color]

[color=0000FF]18Then shall ye return, and discern between the righteous and the wicked, between him that serveth God and him that serveth him not.[/color]

[color=660033]God is going to have a special book of rememberance for those who feared the Lord during this time and thought upon His name.The scriptures say that they spoke OFTEN about God to one another during this time of robbery.[/color]

I praise God for how He remembers His people!

Here's one article from "The Times Herald":

"Grassley also is targeting Joyce and David Meyer of Joyce Meyer Ministries of Fenton, Mo. Seems their purchase of a $23,000 commode with a marble top has caught the senator's attention."

http://www.thetimesherald.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071117/OPINION01/711170311/-1/RSS04

OK it's A $23,000 commode with a marble top.

Your right we have no proof she has this toilet. She has no doubt though used alot of money on alot of "things" she has no right to.

Actually I never said she had a $23,000 toilet.

I think I'll take the word of a missionary over that of JM anyday...

Amen Krispy

May God bless JM more and more , thank God.

To paraphrase Carter Conlon: if you can't discern the prosperity gospel, there's something wrong in your heart. There is a divison in your heart. If you can't discern that these [teachers] are not just off track but they are sent by the devil, if you don't realize the gospel that they're preaching is leading the hearers into destruction and that it's a devils gospel, if you dont realize this, it is a very strong indication that there is something wrong with your heart...

[From the sermon: Pigs in the Parking Lot]

Your right we have no proof she has this toilet. She has no doubt though used alot of money on alot of "things" she has no right to.

I don't know of anyone but the thread starter that suggested she had such a toilet... but we have undeniable proof that she is a heretic, she stores up treasure on earth and teaches others to do so also.

She is a minister of the devil who teaches that Godliness is gain. She is an enemy of the cross of Christ and except she repent blackest darkness is reserved for her. The apostle said from such a woman withdraw yourself.

In Christ - Jim

Do all rich people go to hell because they are rich?

Luke 12:15 Take heed, and beware of covetousness: for a man's life consisteth not in the abundance of the things which he possesseth.

Matthew 6:21 For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.

When Jesus said, "Blessed be you poor for yours is the Kingdom of God".(luke6:20)

Is Jesus referring to poor penniless people, or those who are poor in spirit? The poor in spirit of course(Matt5:3). All men are the same, sinners in need a of saviour. It doesn't matter who you are, sinner, saint, rich, poor, clean and unclean, we all need Jesus to save us.

It's foolish to say that the rich will go to hell and the poor will go to heaven. It's not your physical disposition that determines whether or not your salvation worthy, it's all has to do with God's grace and to Him whom He will have mercy on. That mercy extends to the rich and also to the poor.

ccchhhrrriiisss wrote:
Hi glorytoglory...

I wasn't directing my post to you. It was in response to the initial post of this thread. This has turned into a polite discussion about the modern prosperity message. However, I am concerned that we (collectively) might have "given an ear" to rumors or gossip that aren't based upon truth. This would cause us to be partakers to error or "false witness." I don't agree with the prosperity message, but I don't want to wander into the realm of gossip or slander.

:-(

Oh your so right.

It's heart thing, and not in the abundance of what he has.

It is in the abundance that we KEEP. According to Jesus if someone stores up an abundance rather then giving it to the poor it is proof they have a greedy heart.

Is Jesus referring to poor penniless people, or those who are poor in spirit?

Luke six is not the sermon on the mount. Jesus and all of scripture talk about how much easier it for the poor to enter into the kingdom. The massive and overwhelming number of counterfit converts in our rich western churches should not fool us. It is still harder for a rich man to enter into the kingdom then for a camel to walk through the eye of a needle. God has not lowered His standard to meet greedy and increased with goods American church-goers half way.

That mercy extends to the rich and also to the poor.

Amen, though see above quote.

In Christ - Jim

Do all rich people go to hell because they are rich?

No... it is harder for them to enter the kingdom because the richer you are the less you think you need God.

Before we condemn anyone we consider rich (and compared to many places around the world, our poorest would be rich by those standards!) remember that Abraham was one of the wealthiest people in the world in his time. Joseph had all of Egypt under his control. Solomon... there was none richer in the history of the world. David was rich beyond our comprehension. Job was not only rich once... God made him rich twice over.

And these were all men of faith, and one in particular was a man after God's own heart.

Scripture says it's "hard" ... but not impossible.

And while we're sitting around talking about how the rich find it hard to enter the kingdom, may I remind you that in order to post on this thread you must have a computer with internet access... now compare that luxery with the starving millions around the world.

We're all a tad hypocritical, are we not?

Krispy

KrispyKrittr wrote:

Before we condemn anyone we consider rich (and compared to many places around the world, our poorest would be rich by those standards!)...

We're all a tad hypocritical, are we not?

I don't believe we are because we are going BY our own standards.The way these people are living here in THIS country is not the standard, it's WAY ABOVE the standard.

God's highest will in the Bible is Prosperity.
I Timothy 6:17 Charge them that are rich in this world, that they be not
highminded, nor trust in uncertain riches, but in the living God,
who giveth us richly all things to enjoy;

If someone offers to you $1,00,000 worth of Toilet to you in the ministry do you accpet or reject?

chandras wrote:
God's highest will in the Bible is Prosperity.
I Timothy 6:17 Charge them that are rich in this world, that they be not
highminded, nor trust in uncertain riches, but in the living God,
who giveth us richly all things to enjoy;

If someone offers to you $1,00,000 worth of Toilet to you in the ministry do you accpet or reject?

You auction it off and give the money to those in need.

So, are you expecting JM to auction the TOILET!

chandras wrote:
So, are you expecting JM to auction the TOILET!

Brother may I suggest you slow down and spend more time joining in the conversation rather than typing up all of these threads? Maybe you could join in the conversation more. :-)

Anyways I'm done with this thread because like Chris said we really don't know what the deal is with this toilet.

RevKerrigan wrote:
www.False-Teachers.com

Thanks Kerrigan, I need to read some of these.Im not really that up on what's going on. In the past I have just tried to leave it alone but I think we should be aware afterall there are alot of people who will be coming out of these movements.Also alot of people I witness to are following after these preachers.