WARNING about VIDEOs - Urban

I just ran into this article - in the first few minutes of the first video that I started watching, Bentley began praying over the viewing audience - immediately I began to pray intensely in defense, and turned it off . . . forgive me for not saying anything sooner.

WARNING About VIDEOS
- Josef Urban

I just want to share a warning with you all about watching the
videos of this thing on the internet and of watching the videos of
those things related to it. Also of listening to the worship music.
Even of videos and music and such from people associated with
this that are of the same spirit.

I know a brother who was having serious spiritual attacks the day
after he watched a video of the revival and spoke against this, and
they persisted, until he prayed and broke the demonic curses and
they left instantly.

Also, last night a dark presence came upon my house after
watching a video. As soon as we prayed, it went away. And then I
knew there was truly something there.

A brother here also had the same thing happen to him last night
after watching these videos. He said a dark presence and a wicked
spirit entered his house and he and his wife both discerned it and
commanded it out and it left and that he too has been warned not
to watch these things any more.

There is something really powerful at work here and it's something
that the Word of Faith preachers haven't even fully tapped into.

Saints, be careful of these videos. I have personally had my severe
warning from the Lord not to watch them anymore, and these other
two brothers have also. There is more than just words in conflict
here, this is a conflict of spirits. So be warned, and be covered
with the blood of Jesus! If you must watch them for the purpose of
discernment, and for speaking against it specifically as is
profitable for the souls of men, then be covering yourself in prayer
for protection as you do, and when you're done, break all curses
over you and command any evil spirit to depart from your midst!

For those of you who have been watching it, and have embraced it
and are accepting everything that comes from this move and from
Todd Bentley, I believe you are potentially in serious trouble and
you really need to seek the Lord to open your eyes and renounce
everything that is not directly from the Spirit of God.

Matt replies:
Just chiming in to say I agree with you wholeheartedly. I've only
watched ~6 minutes of one video and had to turn it off. I felt the
Holy Spirit warn me not to ever watch again, His words to me
were "don't allow this into your home." After some prayer I know
this is truly a Word from the Lord.

[i]The following is attributed to C.H. Spurgeon in a sermon titled "Bought with a Price". It was qouted before by a member here and I found it also in this sermon at [b]the Spurgeon Archive[/b].[/i]

"Your body is another's, do it no injury. As for our spirit too, that is God's, and how careful we should be of it. I am asked sometimes to read an heretical book: well, if I believed my reading it would help its refutation, and might be an assistance to others in keeping them out of error, I might do it as a hard matter of duty, but I shall not do it unless I see some good will come from it. I am not going to drag my spirit through a ditch for the sake of having it washed afterwards, for it is not my own. It may be that good medicine would restore me if I poisoned myself with putrid meat, but I am not going to try it: I dare not experiment on a mind which no longer belongs to me. There is a mother and a child, and the child has a book to play with, and a blacklead pencil. It is making drawings and marks upon the book, and the mother takes no notice. It lays down one book and snatches another from the table, and at once the mother rises from her seat, and hurriedly takes the book away, saying: "No, my dear, you must not mark that, for it is not ours." So with my mind, intellect, and spirit; if it belonged to me I might or might not play tomfool with it, and go to hear Socinians, Ritualists, Universalists, and such like preach, but as it is not my own, I will preserve it from such fooleries, and the pure word shall not be mingled with the errors of men. Here is the drift of the apostle's argument—I have no right to injure that which does not belong to me, and as I am not my own, I have no right to injure myself."

Must concur with this. Have both noticed and made mention elsewhere of the same. More than a few have stated the same thing; That they should no longer watch any of this. Remarkable what our brother brought out from Spurgeon;

[i]I am asked sometimes to read an heretical book: well, if I believed my reading it would help its refutation, and might be an assistance to others in keeping them out of error, I might do it as a hard matter of duty, but I shall not do it unless I see some good will come from it. [/i]

Some here have done this hard duty for just these very same reasons and are now stating the very same thing, that they can no longer do so. Even reading of these events can be depleting and damaging ...

This leaves me with something of a dilemma. Had written a posting yesterday that had been somewhat bound up into silence for some time and felt some things needed to be said. Quite a bit of it on the matter of 'drunkenness' and it's appalling and unscriptural correlations to this ... shall we just call it what it is ... demonic spirituality with Christian overtones.

But in warning and still making use of that which Spurgeon mentions of helping it's refutation had gathered most of the postings extant to date and put the links altogether at the bottom. I had some misgivings all along and wonder now if the whole thing should just be taken down ...

[i]I am not going to drag my spirit through a ditch for the sake of having it washed afterwards, for it is not my own.[/i]

I could not bear to think of causing others even inadvertently to do the same. Hesitant to even provide the link.

What do you think Brethren?

I just wanted to to try to bring balance and state that I believe Josef's warning about those videos can actually be harmful and possibly damaging to many for the following reasons. I do not wish to “come against” Josef or this warning for there are many good things mentioned; but to bring balance and perspective to what was said. I am certainly all for warning people not to spend their time watching those silly videos for it serves no purpose and except for the case where one needs to to be able to warn others against them it is a waste of the precious time the Lord has give us. But I am against giving the enemy power and credit that he is NOT due, and doing this I believe can be very harmful to people's faith and even give the enemy an in that was not there before especially in this dark hour in which we live. So, this is not to say that we should spend a great deal of time watching those ridiculous videos, but we most certainly should not fear them or give the enemy power or credit that is undeserved. Here are three quick points for consideration and prayer.

1.I believe these types of warnings are giving people ideas that the devil and the enemy has some sort power and that he could gain some sort of foot hold or right to attack us because of some video on youtube or the internet. This simply is not true. But if we believe such nonsense then I believe we open ourselves up to it. Planting ideas and doubt and lack of faith in ones head can lead to someone opening themselves up to such things. Unless we are NOT covered by the blood (which true saints are day and night) or have sin and compromise in our lives we have nothing to fear. Remember the story of Wigglesworth when he woke up in the middle of the night and saw Satan himself standing next to his bed peering down at him? Wigglesworth simple said “Oh, it just you” and rolled over and went back to sleep. We are not to fear or be concerned about evil spirits, dark presences or Satan himself when we are walking with pure conscience before God and covered by the blood of Jesus, our response needs be nothing more in the face of a defeated and already whipped enemy then a mere - “Oh, it's only you.”

Behold, I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and OVER ALL the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by ANY MEANS hurt you. (Luk 10:19)

2.“There is something really powerful at work here” This also is not true. The only power Satan has is to deceive and make us think he has power. When we think he is really powerful, then he is because he has already deceived us. The Bible paints a picture of Satan like what I imagine to be like the wizard of Oz behind the curtain. When Satan is revealed everyone will say “That's him???” Just like everyone said “That's the great and powerful Oz.???” He wasn't powerful, just a scrawny old man with a bunch of tricks and deception. Satan's power (over a Christian) is a big show of deception too. Satan and every demon in Hell has already been defeated by the blood and resurrection of Jesus Christ. The battle is over and was won 2000 years ago with the FINISHED work of Christ on the cross. If the devil deceives us into thinking he has some sort of power or ability to harm us then he has won, our faith in Christ and His finished work on the cross has been compromised and he comes in like a flood. Don't let the devil fool you into to thinking that you have to be fearful and thus pray some extra prayers of protection and that you have to break off curses you may have received by watching a video. This is to say we serve a weak God who allows His children to be attacked and overcome by the already defeated enemy and curses from watching a video. It is to say that because God does not protect His children we must pray special prayers of protection and plea special pleas for the blood of Jesus, as if we are not already covered or not covered enough, and pray special prayers to break off curses. This not true – the word of God says -

No weapon that is formed against thee shall prosper; and every tongue that shall rise against thee in judgment thou shalt condemn. This is the heritage of the servants of the LORD, and their righteousness is of me, saith the LORD. (Isa 54:17)

I am not saying it is wrong to pray for protection, but I feel it should not be done out of fear, but rather should be a proclamation of faith like David prayed -

Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil: for thou art with me; thy rod and thy staff they comfort me. Thou preparest a table before me in the presence of mine enemies: thou anointest my head with oil; my cup runneth over. (Psa 23:4-5)

3.Conclusion - And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. (Mat 16:1Cool

This is not a picture of a defensive church not being overcome by the attacking army's of the enemy, as many believe. But rather the opposite. Gates are the defense to the entrance to a city, gates are never for attacking but for defending. This is rather a picture of the church attacking, storming and beating down the gates of hell and against such an attack the gates of hell WILL NOT prevail – GLORY TO GOD!!! We can walk right up to the gates of hell and smash them down through the finished work and victory of Christ on the cross. I refuse to counted among the Hebrew children cowering in fear as they peered upon the “supposed” might and power and chariots and giants that prevented them from entering the promise land, but rather be as Joshua and Caleb crying out “THE BATTLE IS WON, THE VICTORY IS OURS, LET'S TAKE THE LAND BY FAITH!!!” Or to be counted among the Israelites cowering in fear at the “supposed” might and power of the great Goliath, but rather be as David crying out, “WHO DO YOU THINK YOU ARE YOU UNCIRCUMISIZED PHILLISTINE TO DEFY THE ARMIES OF THE LIVING GOD – GIVE ME SOME STONES!!!!” My friends, the victory is ours, the battle is already fought and won, the enemy is defeated through the glory, power and majesty of Jesus Christ our Lord, His shed blood and resurrection, and His FINISHED work on the cross. We need not give the enemy any credit or power that he is not due. A dear sister in the Lord wrote me a warning as to what I would be “up against” if I were to go down to Florida to minister and preach. My response was – whether there was one demon there or every single demon in hell and Satan himself would make no difference – I would be up against an already defeated foe whether they appeared to be as big as Goliath or had ten thousand chariots, they have already been defeated by the King of Kings and Lord of Lords, Jesus Christ!

And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover. (Mar 16:17-1Cool

Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil: for thou art with me; thy rod and thy staff they comfort me. Thou preparest a table before me in the presence of mine enemies: thou anointest my head with oil; my cup runneth over. (Psa 23:4-5)

Yes, by all means let's not waste our time watching these ridiculous and silly videos for no other purpose but to gawk at like a bad accident by the side of the road. But at the same time by all means let's not give or attribute power and credit to the defeated and already whipped enemy. Let us rather be clothed in the righteousness of Christ, covered in His blood, filled with the Holy Spirit, with a clean conscience before God every second and every hour of everyday walking in victory and power over Satan, every demon in hell, sin, the flesh and this world through the FINISHED work and victory of Christ on the cross. Let us cling to Christ and walking in faith like, Joshua, Caleb, and David claiming and LIVING the victory which is ours through our Lord Jesus Christ. If the Lord tells you not to watch the videos – DON'T WATCH THEM!!! But at the same time do not fear the enemy but walk in the power and victory of Jesus Christ by faith!

For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.
(2Ti 1:7)

That he would grant unto us, that we being delivered out of the hand of our enemies might serve him without fear, In holiness and righteousness before him, all the days of our life.
(Luk 1:74-75)

For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
(Rom 8:15)

God bless,

Patrick Ersig

www.obeyjesus.net

"And he said, Hear thou therefore the word of the LORD: I saw the LORD sitting on his throne, and all the host of heaven standing by him on his right hand and on his left. And the LORD said, Who shall persuade Ahab, that he may go up and fall at Ramoth-gilead? And one said on this manner, and another said on that manner. And there came forth a spirit, and stood before the LORD, and said, I will persuade him. And the LORD said unto him, Wherewith? And he said, I will go forth, and I will be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets. And he said, Thou shalt persuade [i]him[/i], and prevail also: go forth, and do so."

1Kings 22:19-22(KJV)

Hi everyone.

I do not think the warnings here are given so that we should fear the power of the enemy or not take confidence in God.

A disciplined soldier does not take it upon himself to fight everywhere and at all times, just because he can, and can prevail. A wandering soldier like that might find himself fighting against his own Commander unawares.

My family and I were having a discussion earlier today about what is happening in Lakeland. With sorrow in my heart, I can tell you that we were caught up in these things throughout the 1990’s. All I can see now that came from it is much regret, dysfunctional and split churches, actual death to some leaders, nervous break-downs, broken hearts and the Name of God maligned. I have been there, participated and was seduced…all supposedly in the name of Jesus. How odd that His name was seldom mentioned during those time. I repent...

During my family’s discussion, I remarked that I wished someone in some type of authority had stood up before the congregation and said with a prophetic voice, “This is not of God!” But the stage had been set by those in leadership to ‘touch not mine anointed,’ and these were ‘signs to make you wonder’ type comments. Truly, I have been through it all and then some; laughter, gold dust, the teeth, feathers, oil and much more, and I will tell you truthfully, My family and I have paid a horrible, terrible price. We have had to go through much, much repentance with a broken heart before God. I only want Jesus, His word and His kingdom.

Not everyone is a ‘strong soldier' and strong in their relationship with God. I certainly was not as strong as I thought I was. It is amazing to me that my entire church including supposedly ‘strong’ leadership embraced this just because other pastors and leaders were entangled and they trusted them. It was a strong delusion from God.

God is faithful and we are now restored, but, oh, the price?

So, “I” will be one of the ones now saying to the weaker in the faith, “This is not of God!” It is not for you, you do not have to be seduced; run from it and don’t look back. Warn the brethren!

In closing I will post what I heard from an Art Katz message about this that I think he made in the early 1990’s when these deceptions started.

“…If this is not the lying signs and wonders that we have been warned would characterize the last days, when those lying signs and wonders do come, how will they be substantially different in form and appearance from what is now presently taking place? And how will we then exercise discernment that we are now incapable of exercising?"

"The church needs to be stirred up and we need to be called to a maturity. These are the last days and if this is not ‘That’ of which you have been warned, when ‘that’ comes that is the lying signs and wonders, will we recognize it?”

Art Katz
From: “Holiness or Blessing”
starting at 43:45

Discerning The Signs and Wonders

Keeping Our Focus On The Goal And Understanding The Season

God is sending a fresh wind of His Spirit across the world in this season of change. A vast vacuum exists in many of the people of the world, including most Christians. There has been a lack of the presence of God that has created a spiritual vacuum pulling upon God’s Holy Spirit to fill the void with the love and power of the presence of God to make new, heal, deliver, and transport God’s people into the next place of restoration of all things unto our God - the practical reality of the kingdom of God on earth.

God is Spirit who relates first to the spirit of man by His Spirit in the supernatural realm of the Spirit and then, flowing through the soul and body of man, manifests into the natural world to do His will from heaven on earth. Throughout much of the church and the world, there has been an extreme void of supernatural relationship to God in the Holy Spirit which has led to a lack of the manifested presence and life of God in the world.

In this season the hunger for the supernatural life of God has become acute. In recent Holy Spirit outpourings, tastes of the presence of God have been experienced and have stirred passion for the reality of the supernatural life of Jesus. The passion of the people for more of God has led to dramatic increase in supernatural occurrences and miraculous healings. Angels are appearing. Heavenly visions are occurring. Physical manifestations of trembling, shaking, and falling in the presence of God are occurring. Alcoholics and drug addicts are being set free and coming to Jesus. People are being born again and filled with fresh life of the Spirit of God. Visions of Jesus are seen by people in the Spirit. Signs and wonders are now being experienced much like in the time of Jesus and the first century apostles. Traveling revivalists, evangelists, churches, house churches, and schools are reporting dramatic increase in supernatural manifestations and miraculous healings.

What does all this mean? Why is it happening now? Where is this going?

Father, in the name of Jesus, we come to your throne of mercy and grace. We receive your mercy and grace. Father, we ask of You wisdom and understanding to discern the signs of this time, that we may not miss the glory you have prepared for those who love You. We open our hearts and minds to receive Your Holy Spirit and fire to enlighten and empower us to live in the fullness of Your presence and carry out Your will on earth as it is in heaven. Amen.

Many Christians have been trained to discern natural things but may have had little or no experience in discerning real supernatural spiritual things of God. Like many of the religious leaders in Jesus’ day, we may have skilled natural-mind understanding and discernment but may not be well prepared to discern spiritual things by the Spirit. Probably most of us have yet to even begin to grasp the vast reality of the Spirit of God and the great significance of the work of the Holy Spirit. And certainly, we may be clueless regarding the vast army of spirit beings called Holy Angels. These powerful ministering spirits sent from God to minister to the heirs of salvation may be a fearful mystery to many who lack mature discernment of spiritual things by the Spirit.

Mat 16:3: ....Hypocrites! You know how to discern the face of the sky, but you cannot discern the signs of the times.

Heb 1:14: Are they (angels) not all ministering spirits sent forth to minister for those who will inherit salvation?

The Greek word translated "signs" in the above verse is “semeion” and is also often translated miracles in the KJV. The Lord is speaking here about discerning supernatural miraculous happenings. We need to spiritually discern the “signs” of this time.

A lack of spiritual perception and full appreciation of the work of the Holy Spirit may cause us to improperly discern. The past focus and experience of the church of highly esteeming natural understanding of the Bible with a lack of full respect and grasp of the awesome place of the Holy Spirit has led to a weakness of spiritual perception and understanding. For this reason many cannot discern real signs and wonders from false. Sadly this often causes a rejection of the true by ascribing the work of the Holy Spirit to the devil.

Mark 16:17-18: And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; they shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

Discerning the True, the False, and the MIXTURE

Lack of mature holiness in a gifted person causes a mixture.

Mature holiness looks a lot like humility filled with love and spiritual power in a person with a pure heart and clean hands.

Unholy looks like pride with needful desire and natural strength in a person with an unclean heart and dirty hands.

A believer in process of becoming holy often will be a mixture of holy and unholy practices. This mixture is not uncommon in the leadership of churches and ministries of the church age systems.

Most believers in the church age have sought after leaders to follow that we could esteem highly. Unknowingly, we have often looked to a respected leader instead of looking to the Christ in the leader and have become followers of a man instead of Christ Jesus. We may have not prospered in our spirits and have been disappointed and mistreated because of the lack of mature holiness in the leader. Often, we then choose to blame the leader without understanding that we were part of the problem by our not following Christ. We can be led by the Christ in any person sent to minister to a current need and situation. However, we must not follow or receive from the bad part of a mixture. Follow Christ within by the Holy Spirit and follow Christ in man but do not follow another (John 10:4-5).

John 10:27 "My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me.

The false does exist and can be discerned by their fruits (Mat 7:16-18). However, what many have called false teachers, false prophets, false apostles, and false signs are not really false but mixtures. The false relates to the unholy (the harlot). The mixture relates to immature are partly holy (the adulteress). The true relates to mature holiness (the pure Bride).

The spiritual adulteress has a husband (Jesus) but is unfaithful to Him by seeking other loves. The fruit of the adulterated mixture is good fruit from God on one side of the tree, and bad fruit from the god of self and other gods on the other side of the tree. If we are NOT following the man, we can discern and partake of the good fruit of Christ and not partake of the bad fruit. However, if we reject the good fruit of Christ, we are rejecting God and His provision for us. Think about this, if it is a mixture there is some God in it. Instead of killing the wounded or immature adulterated believer and destroying the good fruit of God along with the bad, receive the good fruit and minister the work of Christ by the Holy Spirit from your pure heart to heal and edify (grow to maturity) the believer.

God is pouring out signs and wonders in this season for a reason.

The primary destination or objective of all God does on earth is the fullness of the kingdom of God on earth as it is in heaven. All things must be redeemed and fully restored unto our God. Fallen man and the fallen kingdoms of this world must become the kingdoms of our God.

Over two thousand years ago, an angel appeared to a virgin, and soon after the Holy Spirit overshadowed her and implanted the seed of God in her womb. A heavenly host of holy angels announced the birth of the Son of God and the process of the redemption and restoration of all things begun.

About thirty years later the Holy Spirit descended upon Jesus and the supernatural work of redemption and restoration of the kingdom of God on earth began. Jesus demonstrated the kingdom through numerous supernatural miracles including healings, deliverance, and raising the dead. He demonstrated kingdom authority over nature as he calmed a storm or walked upon the sea. Miracles, signs, and wonders made known the presence of God come to reclaim the kingdoms of earth.

The cruel work of enduring death on the cross provided for redemption of all who believe. His resurrection, ascension, and return in the Holy Spirit at Pentecost to indwell believers began the work of restoration. Jesus returned to earth in the Holy Spirit to indwell mankind and do the supernatural work through His people of restoring all things to our God. And again at Pentecost supernatural signs and wonders were poured out only this time through 120 waiting disciples. The mark and the tools of the work of re-establishment of the kingdom of God on earth are manifestations of supernatural miracles of healing, deliverance, raising the dead, angelic appearances, and many other signs and wonders.

I think you have figured it out by now. The reason for signs and wonders pouring out in this season is the return of the work of Jesus by the Holy Spirit to take us to the greater fullness of the kingdom. The movement toward the kingdom has been derailed for centuries by the age of man-centered religion and the lack of the real gospel of the kingdom. The return to the recognition of the massive work of the Holy Spirit began just over a hundred years ago and is now exploding into the earth. In this season we are only beginning to awaken to the reality of the Spirit of God empowering the pure, holy people of God.

Soon there will be little or no more of the adulterated mixture as holy men and women of God clothed in humility and burning with God’s glory will set the world on fire with the vast love and power of the God of heaven present on earth.

Rev 11:15: Then the seventh angel sounded: And there were loud voices in heaven, saying, "The kingdoms of this world have become the kingdoms of our Lord and of His Christ, and He shall reign forever and ever!"

Psa 72:19: And blessed be His glorious name forever! And let the whole earth be filled with His glory. Amen and Amen

Keep on pursuing love.
It never fails.

Ron McGatlin

www.openheaven.com
basileia@earthlink.net

I do not think the warnings here are given so that we should fear the power of the enemy or not take confidence in God.

I agree 110% but none the less they still may and can have such an effect, especially upon those who are weaker in the faith - like I said - just trying to bring balance - not to come against or discredit.

A disciplined soldier does not take it upon himself to fight everywhere and at all times, just because he can, and can prevail. A wandering soldier like that might find himself fighting against his own Commander unawares.

Again I agree 110% - we must not go rushing into battle unless we are [b]SENT[/b] by God - but if the battle come to us we are already the victors through faith in the victory of the finished work of Christ on the cross

Patrick
www.revivalarmy.com

[i]I do not think the warnings here are given so that we should fear the power of the enemy or not take confidence in God.[/i]

I agree 110% but none the less they still may and can have such an effect, especially upon those who are weaker in the faith

Brother,

It is those that the aim of the warnings are for primarily. The emphasis needs to be upon the damage that can be done and I do not know of a better representation than what mackaymarsh replied. Not to the same degree myself but many others have been through this mill and I have harped on the repercussions, the ramifications for years here. That is the great problem with this ... it goes on and on, sometimes for years after the thing dies down. I concur wholeheartedly with what is being warned of even taking this into ones system. We have to dislodge ourselves from where we may be today and peel back the years to when we were young and susceptible. I bought it in a great measure, many have, sincere and zealous and wanting to believe everything was "Of God". The onus needs to be on these leaders and yes I find it greatly paradoxical that those that ought to know better do not, carry it on, spread it, embrace it, promote it. They themselves are greatly deceived and would to God someone would indeed stand up in their midst and as was stated, denounce the whole thing in the strongest, most gut retching and heartfelt possible way.

No brother, hearing you all the same, the damage can be subtle, even the more mature of us can be caught unaware or unduly touched by the contagion. It is not a matter of strength but of keeping things from defiling our spirits.

Discerning The Signs and Wonders

AbideinHim,

This is no time to be giving place to doubt or 'possibilities'. If this idea of a mixture is true, we have both;

Gal 5:9 A little leaven leaveneth the whole lump.

As well as a matter of emphasis or balance to deal with. If this was a true revival with overtones of excess, which are often seen in true revivals, it might be one matter, "War on the Saints" was written towards this very thing. This is far beyond out of balance to even consider what good is in it.

God is sending a fresh wind of His Spirit across the world in this season of change ...

Nonsense. This is the vernacular that is never backed up with anything but sweet sounding sentiments and is trotted out year after year from these self proclaimed prophetic types.

Avail yourself of all that has been brought forward and I pray you are mature enough to both see through it as well as beg off of it when it becomes grievous enough.

Ironically and appallingly, this;

Alcoholics and drug addicts are being set free and coming to Jesus.

And rather that, it is yet another contortion and dare I say celebration of being 'drunk in the spirit'.

[url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=23445&forum=35&0]Not drunken, as ye suppose[/url]

As I said to watch for the sake of watching is wrong as it is a waste of time and most certainly we should denounce these things and warn against sure terrible deception. But such warnings as this that can be damaging to ones faith and gives the enemy credit and power where it is not due, instead of sticking to the Scriptural warnings of deception at hand and focusing on the victory of Christ are wrong on there own and need to brought back into balance. Sorry if you disagree.

{edit} As I said I am not coming against the original post, trying to discredit it or even disagreeing with it per-say, or saying that we should be watching these video - we should not - but rather I was trying to bring it into balance {edit}

Re-read the my original post and see if you get a clearer understand of what I am trying to say. Whatchman Nee talks a great deal on this very subject. I'll post some of his articles for your consideration.

God bless,

Patrick

www.revivalarmy.com

Hi again all,

"A wandering soldier like that..."

I'm sorry to take up anymore space here but I want to appologise for this comment. I don't think it was right coming from me. I don't want to seem to be something that I'm not, or somehow super spiritual as they say. I'm sorry.

I wish you all much grace,

Chris

The Lord suffered me last night to bear the weight of my own foolish heart by watching these filthy videos out of curiosity.

Knowing already that such a revival is no revival at all I took it upon myself to watch nonetheless.

I can only testify that Josef Urban is right.

These videos bring a power of darkness that must be fought off by the Blood of Jesus Christ.

As I lay myself down to sleep the vilest faces and words were placed on a screen on the corridors of my mind and my physical body was jolted several times with what seemed like an ungodly electricity .

I repent before the entire Body and and ask the Lord to forgive my foolish heart for even watching these demonic videos.

I will never again look at such things as they bring nothing more than the presence of devils.

Hello,

my own testimony is:

I also watched some of the videos and it made me actually feel sick. One night I would wake up and have these videos in my mind and I felt so sick that I actually had to vomit.
But I do believe we ought not to be afraid like Christisking said. God is more powerful.

Daniel

[b]Warning
WARNING[/b], ppr. Cautioning against danger; admonishing; giving notice to; summoning to meet or appear.

[b]WARNING[/b], n.

1. Caution against danger, or against faults or evil practices which incur danger.

Could warning make the world more just or wise.

Hear the word at my mouth, and give them warning from me. Ezek 3.

2. Previous notice; as a short warning. He had a months warning.

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One of the first verses of scripture ever commited to memory and taken to heart;

[i]Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.[/i] 1Co 10:12

And if there is any equivelant word of expresion that could be given and is given throughout scripture it would be the word [i]presumption[/i]. The primary emphesis here with these warnings is only that, not to presume and it might be also said not to presume too much even of the advesary himself as the flipside of this would have it, one way or the other. Putting the verse back into context it came from, it is in the middle, to go back to the train of thought that was started and forward to where it completes might give some content to draw from and apply in this situation. (Even back to chapter 9, as it preceeds [i]Moreover ...[/i]

[i]Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea; And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea; And did all eat the same spiritual meat; And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ. But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness.

Now these things were our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted. Neither be ye idolaters, as were some of them; as it is written, The people sat down to eat and drink, and rose up to play. Neither let us commit fornication, as some of them committed, and fell in one day three and twenty thousand. Neither let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed of serpents. Neither murmur ye, as some of them also murmured, and were destroyed of the destroyer.

Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.

Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.

There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.

Wherefore, my dearly beloved, flee from idolatry.

I speak as to wise men; judge ye what I say. The cup of blessing which we bless, is it not the communion of the blood of Christ? The bread which we break, is it not the communion of the body of Christ?

For we being many are one bread, and one body: for we are all partakers of that one bread. Behold Israel after the flesh: are not they which eat of the sacrifices partakers of the altar? What say I then? that the idol is any thing, or that which is offered in sacrifice to idols is any thing?

But I say, that the things which the Gentiles sacrifice, they sacrifice to devils, and not to God: and I would not that ye should have fellowship with devils. Ye cannot drink the cup of the Lord, and the cup of devils: ye cannot be partakers of the Lord's table, and of the table of devils.

Do we provoke the Lord to jealousy? are we stronger than he?

All things are lawful for me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but all things edify not.

Let no man seek his own, but every man another's wealth. Whatsoever is sold in the shambles, that eat, asking no question for conscience sake: For the earth is the Lord's, and the fulness thereof. If any of them that believe not bid you to a feast, and ye be disposed to go; whatsoever is set before you, eat, asking no question for conscience sake. But if any man say unto you, This is offered in sacrifice unto idols, eat not for his sake that shewed it, and for conscience sake: for the earth is the Lord's, and the fulness thereof:

Conscience, I say, not thine own, but of the other: for why is my liberty judged of another man's conscience? For if I by grace be a partaker, why am I evil spoken of for that for which I give thanks?

Whether therefore ye eat, or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God. Give none offence, neither to the Jews, nor to the Gentiles, nor to the church of God: Even as I please all men in all things, not seeking mine own profit, but the profit of many, that they may be saved.[/i] 1Co 10:1-33

There are many in the Body of Christ that are already taking sides concerning Todd Bentley and the events that are taking place in Florida. Some say that this is a world wide revival that is taking place. Others say that what is happening at these meetings is straight out of the pit of hell. I personally believe that the only side to take on this issue is the Lord's side. May the Lord give us His vision to see what He is doing, and His discernment so that we can prove all things and hold fast to that which is good.

Todd Bentley and the Lakeland Healing Revival?
by Joseph Mattera www.josephmattera.org

In the past week numerous people have contacted me to ask my opinion of the healing revival taking place in Lakeland, Florida with Evangelist Todd Bentley.
Evidently, Bentley started a crusade almost two months ago in a small church that grew so large they had to move to an arena that could accommodate over five thousand people. This revival is being covered every night by Christian television, with people coming from all over the world to receive a healing touch from God.
Although I have not been to any of their meetings, I have spoken to numerous people who have been in his meetings when he came to the New York City area, and also those who have viewed what is presently going on via television and the internet. Thus what I am saying in this article is not based on a personal knowledge of either Todd or his meetings.
Those I know who attended his meetings in the past were not very happy. They told me there was much hyperbole and weird manifestations replete with the usual charismatic antics that included spiritual “fireballs” coming from folks on his team, in which the recipients would then fall down under the power of God.
Those that I know and respect who were at these meeting, who also move much in the power and anointing of God, never fell down and did not think much regarding the authenticity of the “fireballs.” There were other things they said that are not necessary to go into now.
However, just because it is possible there is some questionable dealings in these meetings does not necessarily negate the authenticity of the faith of the people and the reality of God’s healing power. The Bible tells us that the Spirit is poured out on all “flesh” (Joel 2; Acts 2:19). So, whenever the Holy Spirit comes down He will always be mingled with fallen, fragile, issue-laden, fleshly people in which there is a mixture between what is really from the Holy Spirit and that which is really the quirks, foibles, and personalities of those ministering to the people. In spite of what many are telling me regarding these fleshly activities, I have no problem believing that people are really being healed and that this is a valid demonstration of God’s power.
Also, regarding the phenomena of what is happening: Todd Bentley came at the right time in America. Most of us in ministry get so bogged down with administration, dealing with problems of money, leadership, attendance, facilities, etc. that we often do not have our focus on the things of God necessary to see a full demonstration of His power and glory. Once in a while, God still finds someone that will believe Him to release a raw demonstration of His power that reminds the church that He really is an “ever present help in times of trouble.”
Also, because Bentley has tattoos, earrings, does not wear a suit when he preaches, etc., he will appeal to a large segment of the United States’ population (especially youth) that is sick of religious formalism, which has a form of godliness but denies the power.
One cannot help notice that in the past 30 years it seems that the United States has lacked the great healing crusades of the late 1940’s and 1950’s (much of it cut short because of doctrinal and moral scandal). With the exception of Benny Hinn, there is no one out there who can draw a huge crowd with a healing crusade. The Reinhard Bonnkes of the world understand this, which is why most of the powerful crusades are outside of the United States. Todd Bentley is now tapping into the felt need of this starved U.S. population.
Regarding whether or not this is a revival, I believe we need to be careful with our use of this term. In the 1990’s we had the so-called Toronto Airport revival and Pensacola revival. If we look at the historic use of the term revival, both of these experiences were not revivals but rather renewals. Toronto and Pensacola basically amounted to thousands of people coming to renew their passion for God (Toronto) and bringing backsliders back to the Lord (Pensacola). Unlike the first and second Great Awakenings with Whitefield, Wesley, and Finney, both of these movements had almost no affect on the cultural, religious, and secular atmosphere of their surrounding communities. Thus I would not call them true revivals but rather church renewal movements.
From what I understand, the meetings going on today in Lakeland are reaching outsiders (coming for healing) more than those who do not know the Lord that live in Lakeland, but I do hope that it can mushroom into a full-blown revival of faith that will result in thousands coming to know Christ as Lord and Savior as well as their healer.

God is very interested in our physical well being. If He wasn't Jesus would not have healed all of the sick that He did when He walked the earth. Healing is in the atonement. "By His stripes we are healed." The Holy Spirit has given gifts to the Church, and this includes the gifts of healing and the working of miracles. Many Christians are not healed because they do not put faith in Jesus to heal them and just accept the sickness and disease as coming from God.

AbideinHim wrote:

Many Christians are not healed because they do not put faith in Jesus to heal them and just accept the sickness and disease as coming from God.

You cannot truly believe that people are sick because they lack Faith? How do you explain Job? He had faith and believed yet he was still afflicted with sicknesses and diseases from the Lord.

This kind of teaching your talking about is dangerous. All the more, this sounds very much like WOF to me which best case is a false religion, worst case it is a cult.

some thoughts...

Jesus even healed people who dident believe, the man who was lowered down the roof, it says it was his friends belief that healed him.

he dident heal everyone, he was in the temple several times, and he must have walked by the beggar that stopped peter and john if my memory dont fool me, they healed him but Jesus dident. He probably healed thousands during his time on earth, but he dident heal everyone.

All healing is by the grace of God. We cannot do anything to be healed anymore than we can do anything to be saved. But the way that we receive from God is by faith. Check out the healings of Jesus and you will discover in many instances He said "your faith has made you whole". The Word says that Jesus could not do many notable miracles in His home town because of the unbelief of the people. I am not talking about faith in faith as has been erroneously taught by some, but faith in God that comes from hearing and believing the Word of God. Churches that teach healing have many more instances of healing than churches that don't because in the former, the saints have a living faith from hearing the Word of God concerning healing, and in the latter, there is no faith for healing because there is no Word being taught on healing.

We got a little off of the thread here, but there have been many healings reported at the meetings in Florida. Many people came to the meetings believing God for healing, and in fact did receive their healing. Regardless of what you think of Todd Bentley, God will heal people according to their faith to be healed. God will also heal His children by the gifts of healing being in operation, and when this spiritual gift is in operation, even a unbeliever can be healed.

We need to take our eyes off of men and put them on Jesus. He is the healer. He is the one that said that beleivers shall lay hands on the sick and they shall recover. Man cannot heal anyone but is only a vessel that the power of God can flow through. We lay hands on the sick, and God does the healing.

The bible says some can get healed who will not be in heaven, so we need to have that in mind that satan also can have power to heal and do all kind of counterfeit miracles and signs,

But what really matters and is far more worth then health is a Holy life.

You can have aids and be holy, and enjoy heaven for ever,you can enjoy health on earth perfectly and never be sick once, and mourn and weep in agonies of hell forever.

2Th 2:9-10 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

What is happening in florida is not of God, actually what is going on there has nothing to do with God what so ever except the say Jesus sometimes, that is about it.

We need to see it for what it is and say so. Peoples eternal souls are at stake.

The Word says that Jesus could not do many notable miracles in His home town because of the unbelief of the people.

Moe_Mac wrote:
Actually you got close, the word says he DID NOT, not he couldn't.
Matt 13:58
58 [i]Now He did not do many mighty works there because of their unbelief.

"And he could there do no mighty work, save that he laid his hands upon a few sick folk, and healed them." (Mark 6:5)

I must commend you brother for checking out everything in the Word. You are a good Berean.