Obama: America is 'no longer Christian'

Obama quote, "If (my daughters) make a mistake, I don't want to punish them with a baby."

I don't think the public as a whole can deal with a heart like Obama, not because he is part African, [u]but because he does stand for righteousness[/u], but he also needs votes and money, lots of money and supporters.

Greetings EJG

In your last post you wrote....
I don't think the public as a whole can deal with a heart like Obama, not because he is part African, but because he does stand for righteousness,.......

Did you mean to write because he dose not stand for righteousness? I just thought I would clarify because Mr. Obama is not a man that stands for Godly Biblical righteousness. I am praying for him though to repent and come to the Lord just as I am for all who are lost.

God Bless
MJ

TheophilusMD wrote:

I don't think the public as a whole can deal with a heart like Obama, not because he is part African, [u]but because he does stand for righteousness[/u], but he also needs votes and money, lots of money and supporters.

The underlined statement is quite a surprise to me.

As it is to me.

Clarification IS needed when someone claims that a person that supports abortion is somehow part of righteousness.

Hi ejg...

Dear brother, I noticed that you made a comment indicating in the Rick Warren thread regarding how we should remain non-political. However, you went on to dig up two seperate month-old threads and make political comments. For some of us, there is a fine line between politics and our spiritual discussion. For others, there is no line at all. I've noticed that there has been a tendency to accept the thoughts of some that can be construed as "political" in nature (such as beliefs regarding how utterly non-involved we must be with our earthly citizenship)...but any rebuttal of such thoughts are often viewed as "political." Perhaps the solution is to not discuss the personal beliefs and issues that would cause a heated political discussion [i]in the first place[/i]?

I don't think the public as a whole can deal with a heart like Obama, not because he is part African, but because he does [u]stand for righteousness[/u], but he also needs votes and money, lots of money and supporters.

:-(

Hi natan...

Natan4Jesus wrote:

I await this website's leaderships answer, as I happen to agree with Brother EJG, [b]because I know Senator Obama, [u]I know he is a righteous man[/u], I know that he loves Jesus[/b].

As for Senator Obama being a "righteous" man: It may help to remember that there is none righteous (no, not one). But you said that you [u]know[/u] him? Have you asked him how he can remain so righteous when [url=http://my.barackobama.com/page/content/womenissues]he opposes ANY limits on abortion[/url]? Have you asked him how he could attend a congregation for 20 years that preached racially divisive "Black Liberation Theology" rhetoric -- and a church that [url=http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,954683,00.html]does not embrace the deity of Christ[/url]? How does he "righteously" promise to use the office of the President [url=http://pride.barackobama.com/page/content/lgbthome]to promote and enforce acceptance of homosexuality[/url]? How can he be so "righteous" when he "[url=http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/30/us/politics/30obama.html?pagewanted=all]admits to uncertainty about the existence of an afterlife[/url]?"

I'm not trying to attack Obama; rather, I just want to question your own words. Obama might be a nice guy. He may even be a sincere guy. But "righteous" is probably out of the question -- just as it is for all of us.

lets be authentic here

Lets. Do we not know you Natan as someone else?

Hi natan…

Yes, Chris, they have made it clear that the focus of this website is on Jesus and the need for revival, but I will say this again, the genesis of this thread is entirely political in nature, and furthermore, I think.....no, I know that is disingenious of you to say that you are not attacking SENATOR Obama, right after you rake him over the coals, for socio-political issues, that even the Republican Party is not serious about ending.

Brother, the issues that I raised were in response to your claim that Obama is a “righteous man.” I simply questioned how a man with the particular beliefs could be deemed “righteous” when NONE of us are righteous. You might want to read my post again. These are not “socio-political” issues any more than “murder” or “fornication” is a socio-political issue. It is a SIN issue that has plagued this nation for years. I didn’t mention the Republican Party…and I don’t care to comment on your claim that they are “not serious about ending” such horrendous evil practices. I merely wanted to respond to your claim about righteousness.

The thread was created by Greg in response to an article that he read. The individuals here are not commenting on the political of the matter…but the stated beliefs of the man who could possibly become the President of the United States of America. We aren’t attacking his politics. We are questioning his beliefs.

and rebuke me for my views, which is fine, we can agree to disagree, no problems with that, but for folks to say "no political posts", when in reality, I feel its really "no political posts that dont jibe with the party line".

I’ve often wondered just what Paul was meant to accomplish in his journey to Rome. Our Lord told him that he “must testify” in Rome – the capital of the largest empire on Earth (Acts 27:24). But what was he supposed to say? Was he supposed to ignore sin – or expose it so as to cause the leaders to realize just how lost they were? But I have seen a great deal of believers in this day literally preach that we should not speak about sin – but focus on God. Even many modern churches prefer to neglect any mention of sin, so as to “focus on what people can do rather than what they can’t.” In the end, we have a bunch of people who continue to do what they shouldn’t do and claim that anyone who tells them otherwise is “judging” them.

I don’t believe that Paul went to Rome to be a politician (or even political). However, I imagine that some people accused him of it – just like they accused men like Martin Luther and George Whitefield. I believe that Paul probably preached to them a message similar to the message he preached elsewhere. I imagine that this included a message about sin and the penalties of living in it. The Word tells us that Paul exerted his influence even into “Caesar’s household” (Philippians 4:22). John the Baptist also preached to political leaders. He preached to Herod about the sinfulness of adultery (which led to his imprisonment and subsequent execution). Some of the prophets in the Old Testament preached to kings and were killed. Others preached to kings and influenced entire nations and kingdoms of this world (like Moses, Jonah, Samuel, Nathan, Isaiah, Esther, Joseph, Daniel, Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego). I don’t believe that they neglected to mention sin. Rather, it is through the exposure of sin (what is against the Law of God) that reveals our separation from God. A great tool of the devil has been to cause people to think that they are alright as they make excuses for their sin.

Abortion is a terribly horrendous sin. It is probably one of the greatest sins of our age – outside of neglecting a relationship with Christ. Homosexual practice is a sinful and shameful practice. Persecution of worship is just as sinful today as it was in Esther or the prophet Daniel’s day. These are not “political” issues. These are SIN issues that some people try to legislate and force upon a nation. Yes, they are every bit as sinful as racism, hate, bigotry or neglecting the poor. However, I don’t know of anyone who makes excuses for any such sins. However, this modern age has produced a group of people who selfishly would prefer to MURDER unborn babies or parade their grotesque sinful nature in front of children than to have someone tell them what is right or wrong. And why should this not surprise us? The first commandment in the Satanic Bible is to “do what you will.”

So when I described the beliefs in which Senator Obama promotes himself, I am not taking a “cheap shot” at the Senator. Rather, I am exposing the sinful practices of which the Senator has embraced as “fundamental human rights” – even though he often considers himself a Christian (who happens to have attended a church for 20 years that preached against the deity of Christ). Why did I include these beliefs in the first place? Because of your proclamation that Obama is a “righteous man.” So, in a sense, you brought it up.

I just dont believe that the founding fathers envisioned a theocracy, which is what I discern that some in the church would like to see in America. Be careful of what you wish for, you might get it.

Brother, I apologize if this might have made you uncomfortable. I do not wish to raise the issue of “politics” in this thread. In fact, I didn’t even bring it up. To me, this is an issue of SIN. I am not trying to influence you “politically” one way or the other. I simply wanted to question the rationale of calling a man “righteous” who continually proclaims his belief in the slaughter of unborn babies as a “fundamental human right.” Personally, I feel the liberty to vote in elections and ballot referendums. There are issues that matter to me far more than others (like abortion, restrictions on practices and expressions of faith, and forced homosexual acceptance). But I do not see this as becoming “engrossed” in politics, but rather allowing my Christian beliefs to follow me into a voting booth. I feel a responsibility to my wife, future children and neighbors to raise my voice in opposition to legislated grotesque sinfulness.

Please forgive me if you thought that this was a “slight” upon you or your beliefs. However, I disagree with your assertion that this was an “attack” on or a “raking over the coals” of any candidate or political party. And I certainly will continue to pray for anyone (including both candidates) who could possibly be raised to such an office in the government that could affect so many – including the lives of over millions of unborn babies over the course of the next four years or more.

You know who I am, you know exactly who I am

you know who I am. say it.

Disclosing the nature of your personal and private correspondance with Mike Balog was wrong. It was hurtful and undeserving. I could have unmasked you here at the very beginning, back when you were quarrelling with Brothertom, but I held my peace, hoping, somehow the root of bitterness had finally been dealt with.

Please, brother, let's just move on to greater and higher things. We want you to stay, and we love you.

you know who I am. say it.

[i]And there came a traveller unto the rich man, and he spared to take of his own flock and of his own herd, to dress for the wayfaring man that was come unto him; but took the poor man's lamb, and dressed it for the man that was come to him.

And David's anger was greatly kindled against the man; and he said to Nathan, As the LORD liveth, the man that hath done this thing shall surely die:

And he shall restore the lamb fourfold, because he did this thing, and because he had no pity. And Nathan said to David, Thou art the man.[/i]

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber.

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Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;

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No sting of conscience to portray oneself as someone else. To feign indignation - To come in some other way. To speak of authenticity without being authentic.

To love the truth and hate every false thing ...

Evil imaginations are they which are to be cast down. That means even those suspicions that which are not based on evidence. The worlds thinking is built upon this very fabric. To take two bits, build an air castle and then take up residence within it's walls. Become familiar with it's furnishings, it's ambiance, it's cracks and faults, the mud prints on the floor, the dust in the corner - How it will react to the elements of the seasons, everything about it all known in such fine detail. Only that the whole thing is a great illusion, an imagination.

So it is that we will guess, speculate- devise evil where none exists or worse 'prophesying' such notions as fact. Great sweeping generalities.

If we are not going to be honest here there is no point in going any further. That the internet is the home of anonymity has no bearing on this sites mandates. Gods word and the life of Christ demands honesty at the core of our being, there is no other way around it. You are who you are and not some else despite whatever moniker is used as a member name.

To put us in the position of having to guess, having to wonder if you are somebody that has been removed from the site in the past - what disposition at the core are you operating under? We recently had a more brazen attempt at this with a member who had been removed resuming under his old name a year later, as if nothing had transpired - never once asking to be reinstated.

There are some very misconstrued imaginations of what level of tolerance and patience is offered here. The [url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?viewmode=flat&order=0&topic_id=14144&forum=13&post_id=&refresh=Go]MUST READ: SermonIndex Forum Disclaimer / Community Rules[/url] that is set here as a guideline is not a hard and fast, strong arm of the law, didactict set of rules per se but a guideline. That it can be abused in the same way that agonized the apostle Paul speaking of the presumption of grace, God forbid!

To presume upon what we may or may not allow, to presume upon forgiveness - To do as one pleases, to come in some other way in some other guise is to miss what is at the core of all these great dead examples have left us here.

I am not happy at all at this unveiling, I had hoped I was wrong, there is every possibility that you Neil were someone else albeit with an uncanny resemblance. Will not play this game, this site is not a game or a place for playing them. It is not a chat room or anything goes as had been stressed before. If we allow one to sneak in in this manner then others find it justifiable to do the same as I now just caught a glimpse of Grannyannie attempting to reestablish herself here jumping over to grab the link for the disclaimer.

Will leave room for your response.

There is an epitome of filth even on this website, but it is dressed up, with a suit and tie, and a pair of shined shoes and articulate conversation.

This is precisely why political discussions are off limits here, but even so, it does not excuse unfair generalizations like the one you put forth. Your searing invective does nothing but stir up more invective from others. If you are this disgruntled, why subject yourself to further disappointment? Unless, of course, you're just wanting your opinions to be heard - in the same way you object to others putting forth their own.

Personally, I have never considered the United States a Christian nation, but rather a nation that has always been politically tolerant of any and all religions that do not cause civil problems.

As a matter of fact, the United States was a place for those being religiously persecuted in other nations from its very inception. Catholics being persecuted in Britain and Jews not accepted any where else in the world were relatively safe to practice their faith in the United States. Asian faiths and other worldwide religions have always been allowed to be practiced in the United States. Sometimes there were problems between faith based social practices, such as the Mormons encountered, but overall the U.S. has always been a country for all faiths.

So, in Obama's specifying Christianity, Obama has made the decision to highlight one religion as a negative. No Christian would ever draw that kind of negative attention to the faith.

Look, I love America. I love this country. I love little league baseball and pop warner, and I love the 4th of July. I love the Star Spangled Banner, I love our history....but....as a believer in Christ I cannot say that America is, or has ever been, a Christian nation. That we AS A NATION have pleased God because our founding fathers believed in Christian morality? No, God, in his providence has chosen to bless us and use us for His purposes, but that does not mean we, AS A Nation, ever pleased Him,no more than Assyria, Babylon, or any other nation he used for his purposes, pleased Him.

I think you are right, as a foreigner, i see often that american christians much more then any others many times, has a idol of pride/love to their country. Even touching on it will stir something in americans.

But there is no such thing to be found in the NT. "my kingdom is not of this world" But since the deception around year 300, i believe this deception is one of the greatest throughout christian history, even more then the "easy belivism" or "get rich" heresy's, is this deception of Christianity and state combined.

When we look what this doctrine has done and the millions that has died from these doctrines. we has to see that it is not what God established in the NT.

the anabaptists during the reformation got it, the christians who where martyred during the first centuries got it. sadly we dont, we so occupied building paradise on earth that we even fight among ourselves about it.

[i]"See how these Christians love one another!" these Christian kingdoms, that are tearing out each other's bowels, desolating one another with fire and sword! these Christian armies, that are sending each by thousands, by ten thousands, quick into hell! these Christian nations, that are all on fire with intestine broils, party against party, faction against faction! these Christian cities, where deceit and fraud, oppression and wrong, yea, robbery and murder, go not out of their streets! these Christian families, torn asunder with envy, jealousy, anger, domestic jars, without number, without end! yea, what is most dreadful, most to be lamented of all, these Christian Churches! — Churches ("tell it not in Gath," — but, alas! how can we hide it, either from Jews, Turks, or Pagans?) that bear the name of Christ, the Prince of Peace, and wage continual war with each other! that convert sinners by burning them alive! that are "drunk with the blood of the saints!" — Does this praise belong only to "Babylon the Great, the mother of harlots and abominations of the earth?" Nay, verily; but Reformed Churches (so called) have fairly learned to tread in her steps. Protestant Churches too know to persecute, when they have power in their hands, even unto blood. And, meanwhile, how do they also anathematize each other! devote each other to the nethermost hell! What wrath, what contention, what malice, what bitterness, is everywhere found among them, even where they agree in essentials, and only differ in opinions, or in the circumstantials of religion!

Who follows after only the "things that make for peace, and things wherewith one may edify another?" O God! how long? Shall thy promise fail? Fear it not, ye little flock! Against hope, believe in hope! It is your Father's good pleasure yet to renew the face of the earth. Surely all these things shall come to an end, and the inhabitants of the earth shall learn righteousness. "Nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they know war any more." "The mountains of the Lord's house shall be established on the top of the mountains;" and "all the kingdoms of the earth shall become the kingdoms of our God." "They shall not" then "hurt or destroy in all his holy mountain;" but they shall call their "walls salvation, and their gates praise." They shall all be without spot or blemish, loving one another, even as Christ hath loved us. — Be thou part of the first-fruits, if the harvest is not yet. Do thou love thy neighbor as thyself. The Lord God fill thy heart with such a love to every soul, that thou mayest be ready to lay down thy life for his sake! May thy soul continually overflow with love, swallowing up every unkind and unholy temper, till he calleth thee up into the region of love, there to reign with him for ever and ever!

John Wesley[/i]

KrispyKrittr wrote:...actually I cant remember the last time I wore a suit, tie and shiney shoes. I'm a jeans and football jersey kind of guy.Krispy

Actually I picture Krispy in a #24 Nascar Jersey. and yes jeans, sorry Brother I saw an opening and I took it, but you know Mr. Bill Loves ya!:-P

KrispyKrittr wrote:

PS You're other post, Bill, was very good.

Thanks Brother! as Earl Thomas Conley said, once in a blue moon I'll do something right. :-)

Hello ejg

because you for instance, you research posts from others and then "paste it" back into peoples faces

I offered that in peace, but now, and as usual you respond with a "dipstick" response such as you did, when i am only stating how many individuals feel, not just me.

You wont see it mr west because u have also an agenda.

U r gonna say I am not listening, and i am going to say that U aren't listening.

I do not have to change a topic, I am a man

From time to time I come back to get a word of encouragement

Hope all is well with you and yours, it's been a long while....be encouraged by the Cross, and It alone. We all fail sometimes. I remember I was once encouraged by one of your posts, early in that one morning, "Fear not, believe only" from the Word of God.

Why debate over the things of the world to a point of strife? So not worth it.

Paul has been a fair moderater here on SI since you left. Take care Neil, you and yours have been in my prayers often and will continue to be. I'm thankful for y'all.

Sorry brothers,had I interrupted unseemingly.

mamaluk

We are to redeem the time. Can a thread be redeemed? That is my heart here.

On the one hand, political discussions can get jammed-packed with the flesh “even” with Christians. Sigh. That alone would be a reason for a rule. Big sign. On the other hand, Christian beliefs are not just for believing, not just for conversation at the kitchen table (as Ravi Zac. would put it). They are for walking out, for acting upon, for informing the laws we write, for guiding our behavior with neighbors, etc.

[u]On race[/u]: (earlier in this thread) If you are white and have been harmed by black people, I am truly sorry. If you are black and have been harmed by white people I am truly sorry. Surly you cannot think that it is because of the race of those that hurt you, that you were hurt? Think this through BIBLICALLY. Selfishness, bitterness, revenge, adultery, murder, stealing, etc. are not unique to race. What does it mean BIBLICALLY to be offended by someone’s comment? Is someone trying to restore someone?

You might have been born in the flesh in 1960, white, female, American, Presbyterian, etc., but at some date you were born again. Born of the Spirit of God. And it was not an American Spirit or a black spirit or a female spirit. Get the picture.

Can we see sin in any professing Christian’s life (behavior)? Sure. Can they see it in our life (behavior)? Sure. So what is the thing to do? Think it through BIBLICALLY.

[u]Politics[/u]: What is it except man thinking through what is good and evil, right and wrong, and devising a way to rule himself? Efforts after ruling others? Are there NO LESSONS in the Bible, I am speaking to born-again Christians, on how that goes? And why it goes that way? Are there NO DIRECTIONS in the New Testament on how it should go for a Christian in any political structure?

[u]A Democratic Republic[/u] (American form of government) I have thought about that, off and on, over the years. These thoughts include:

As far as history goes, this American form of government is definitely an experiment, as the founders said and the use of Biblical principles is transparent.

My most recent thought is that I do not think it is possible for a democratic republic to survive without the majority of the voting governed to be ruled by a Biblically based (not my-opinion-based) view of right and wrong. Think it through BIBLICALLY. How else do we avoid “everyone doing what is right in his own eyes,” selfishness and remain a democratic republic? At least on the surface it looks like without that characteristic, government goes to socialism exactly as others have written and socialism does not abide religion (external, absolute, truth claims). There are only two “equalities”/“brotherhoods of man.” Has anyone read Brother’s Karamadzof? (spelled?)[edit: That is why I pray for revival]

A recent immigrant from Iraq that attends my church said to me the other day, “The problem is that in my country, democracy doesn’t work because everyone immediately used freedom to steal and kill and anything they wanted. We need a Sadam but one that is benevolent and moral.” This person is paralyzed by freedom, even at choosing what to eat from a menu. Thinking through the question of “What should I do now that I can do what I think.” overwhelms them. Both the husband and wife are paralyzed with internal contradictions. For example: The husband said what he wanted most to do was to make as much money as possible as soon as he could. He cannot practice dentistry immediately in America. Had to leave the country or be killed because he translated for Americans. When I said selling crack could get a lot of money quick it took him a day to think that through. His wife, also a dentist, was outraged at being lumped in with social service clients that “don’t even want to work, just want to steal money from the government.” She is now wrestling with the fact that both their parents send them a lot of money to live here but they do not report that and accept support (so far).

Surely there is a way to discuss such things as [b]Obama: America is 'no longer Christian'[/b], without jam-packing the discussion with our still not dead flesh.

I can thank even all of you for helping me practice several Biblical principles. And thank you Paul West. What a difficult (hard spiritually) service you give. I am one among oh so many that appreciates your labor. I thank God that SI is not a democratic republic. At this point, as posts fly up in record-breaking speed, the thread seems exhausted, just as it was before it was re-posted. Personally, the likelihood of being edified in a struggle through a “political” discussion is kinda low. SIGH. I already know my flesh cannot successfully rule myself and devising a political government to do that, apart from God, will not help.

Oh Krispy,

Your a great guy at least you admit when you've might have made a mistake. Your last comment was pricless. ;-)

I have read almost all of this thread and found it very interesting how poeple could get so out of sorts over words. I would tend to agree with some of the commments made by those that have been around for a long time they had some great things to say regarding the subject under discussion.

May we all realize that though it is very interesting to discuss these political things it really has little to do with the [b]Real[/b] reason we are on this earth. God sets up the governments and tears them down.

One thing I have learned by reading these forums is that you can learn how to communicate and not offend or get offended over the text of another person that you can't even see.

I really should comment on the topic at hand. Whether you would want to pick apart Barrck Obama or John Mcain for their stand on certain issues that pertain to their party. One of them will be president and whoever that happens to be. They are considered a minister of God (Rom 13:4) and therefore we should have faith in God that He is going put in who he deems neccesary. We in turn should pray and seek after God.

I know that my post sounds a little naive and simple. Oh well you have to start somewhere.

Something that I found really interesting some made a comment about Greg posting "political" threads. Well He is a canadain do you really think that he would care who was elected in the US? :-P It kinda made me laugh.

mamaluk wrote:
Paul has been a fair moderator here on SI since you left.
mamaluk

Yes he has! I came unglued on him the other night but one thing different we did, is we both saw a little fault in our responses and admitted it like two good men should and moved on and did not get hung up on it. This is all it takes, and this is what God Loving Brothers and Sisters should do.I hate to see anyone get banned, because even though we are all good folks here we all need to vent at times, but just Pray a little before then vent and if you do that I know our "very forgiving" Mods will understand. :-)

I want to thank the moderators that have taken on the responsibility of monitoring this website. I think that for the most part you have allowed freedom for various opinions, and have continuously attempted to steer the posts back in the right direction when they have gotten off track.

Anytime that we get into politics there will be disagreements, and as Christians our main interest should be in the kingdom of God, praying that "His Kingdom would come, His will would be done on earth even as it is in heaven."

We are instructed in the Word to pray for our leaders, and yet we spend much of our time criticizing them. God is in control, and there is no leader that is over a country unless God allows it. Many times God will give the people what they want as happened to Israel when they wanted a King, when the Lord wanted to be their king, so they got a Saul instead. Clinton was elected because the majority of the people thought he could fix the economy. One of the major issues that Americans ought to be looking at is what kind of Surpreme Court judges would the next president appoint to the bench. I believe that it would be a disaster if Obama is elected because he will appoint the most liberal judges that he can find. We know the damage that was done in the 60's and 70's from the liberal supreme court. Now the court is evenly split, and a good conservative judge could possibly overturn abortion. John McCain favors the appointment of conservative judges.

Please forgive me for getting off into politics. Our faith should never be in a man or a party, but we better be praying about this election which is only a few months away now.

Anyone want to discuss the KJV???

Oh dear Krisp!! Brother of KJV !! :) Let's!

but just Pray a little before then vent and if you do that I know our "very forgiving" Mods will understand.

yeah, Mr Billpro!

I remember when I first joined SI, I went through a great deal of turmoil, (perhaps due to my own sense of insecurity and fearfulness ) whenever I saw folks debating, I would be very stressed. Surely I have my share of agreements/disagreements with everyone at one time or another, even with the moderators. But,this I have come to know, that both brothers Mike and Paul do love our Lord and His saints, and have always done their best to bring this forum to His glory. For this, I'm grateful and encouraged.

Pride, dear brothers and sisters, it's always pride, that trips us over, causes ourselves and others grief and turmoil. I remember Mike B. in the past, I'm not sure if he has been lately, would always remind us to be watchful of pride, while Paul has always reminded us to pray (humble ourselves before God, in my thinking) before posting. All but to what end, I'm sure, to the glory or our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To the honour of This Name and to the testimony of His righteousness before the readers.

Yeah, let's do everything heartily towards our Lord, and exhort one another daily, redeeming the time...

Thank you Mike B.,Paul, Krisp, Joan, MrBill...and all of you who love our Lord, for your testimonies on SI.

In Christ,
Margaret

Thank you Mike B.,Paul, Krisp, Joan, MrBill...and all of you who love our Lord, for your testimonies on SI.

And we are also thankful for you Margaret. Your heart comes through and is a balm and a fragrance to this precious place, dear sister.

MC

Precious brothers and sisters on SI:

Although I have not posted lately due to being quite busy I still just have to check in from time to time to see what is going on and read some of the latest lines from some of you whom I have grown to love and respect over time, and some of those who have joined lately whose words reflect a desire to please God.

I have to add my appreciation for the way the moderators have tried to keep these forums on track and the transparency with which they have to write. It is one thing to write under a psuedonym and quite another to be front and center all the time with every word and every motive examined and reexamined by folks from every quarter, many of whom as this thread has revealed, with an axe to grind or stones to throw.

We know that leadership comes with that as a part of the territory. But then, as Krispy, Compton and others that have been around for a long time no doubt have observed... with all the sharp barbs that have been aimed at our brothers, there has been an increased level of maturity that is precious to observe, especially when you have had to sit back and be a non participant for a while.

And even folks who defend KJV grow a little over time also ;-) .

God bless you all... there is something uniquely precious about this site, and therefore we can expect more and more attempts to disrupt the unity... but how pleasant and blessed and precious to see it guarded and defended and maintained with the sacrifice of ego.

Clint

Truly wonderful.

Only on SI.

Hard situations, flesh out everywhere. Go away and pray and when you come back.....

It’s a LOVE FEST! Glory to God! We are all such a mess but we truly love Him. And what a JOY JOY JOY it is to be “stuck” with loving one another.

This thread has rejoiced my day.

(I just couldn’t resist posting this. :-D :-D :-D :-D ) Ok, I'm calming down. :-)

[b]1Ti 2:1-8 -[/b]

Here is, I. A charge given to Christians to pray for all men in general, and particularly for all in authority. Timothy must take care that this be done. Paul does not send him any prescribed form of prayer, as we have reason to think he would if he had intended that ministers should be tied to that way of praying; but, in general, that they should make [i]supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks:[/i] supplications for the averting of evil, prayers for the obtaining of good, intercessions for others, and thanksgivings for mercies already received. Paul thought it enough to give them general heads; they, having the scripture to direct them in prayer and the Spirit of prayer poured out upon them, needed not any further directions. Observe, The design of the Christian religion is to promote prayer; and the disciples of Christ must be praying people. Pray [i]always with all prayer[/i], Eph_6:18. There must be prayers for ourselves in the first place; this is implied here. We must also pray [i]for all men[/i], for the world of mankind in general, for particular persons who need or desire our prayers. See how far the Christian religion was from being a sect, when it taught men this diffusive charity, to pray, not only for those of their own way, but for all men. Pray for kings (1Ti_2:2); though the kings at this time were heathens, enemies to Christianity, and persecutors of Christians, yet they must pray for them, because it is for the public good that there should be civil government, and proper persons entrusted with the administration of it, for whom therefore we ought to pray, yea, though we ourselves suffer under them.

[i]For kings, and all that are in authority[/i], that is, inferior magistrates: we must pray for them, and we must give thanks for them, pray for their welfare and for the welfare of their kingdoms, and therefore must not plot against them, that in the peace thereof we may have peace, and give thanks for them and for the benefit we have under their government, that [i]we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.[/i] Here see what we must desire for kings, that God will so turn their hearts, and direct them and make use of them, that we under them may lead a quiet and peaceable life. He does not say, “that we may get preferments under them, grow rich, and be in honour and power under them;” no, the summit of the ambition of a good Christian is to lead a quiet and peaceable life, to get through the world unmolested in a low private station. We should desire that we and others may lead a peaceable life [i]in all godliness and honesty[/i], implying that we cannot expect to be kept quiet and peaceable unless we keep [i]in all godliness and honesty[/i]. Let us mind our duty, and then we may expect to be taken under the protection both of God and the government. [i]In all godliness and honesty.[/i] Here we have our duty as Christians summed up in two words: godliness, that is, the right worshipping of God; and honesty, that is, a good conduct towards all men. These two must go together; we are not truly honest if we are not godly, and do not render to God his due; and we are not truly godly if we are not honest, for God hates robbery for burnt-offering. Here we may observe,

1. Christians are to be men much given to prayer: they ought to abound herein, and should use themselves to prayers, supplications, etc.

2. In our prayers we are to have a generous concern for others as well as for ourselves; we are to pray for all men, and to give thanks for all men; and must not confine our prayers nor thanksgiving to our own persons or families.

3. Prayer consists of various parts, of supplications, intercessions, and thanksgivings; for we must pray for the mercies we want, as well as be thankful for mercies already received; and we are to deprecate the judgments which our own sins or the sins of others have deserved.

4. All men, yea, kings themselves, and those who are in authority, are to be prayed for. They want our prayers, for they have many difficulties to encounter, many snares to which their exalted stations expose them.

5. In praying for our governors, we take the most likely course to lead a peaceable and quiet life. The Jews at Babylon were commanded to seek the peace of the city whither the Lord had caused them to be carried captives, and to pray to the Lord for it; for in the peace thereof they should have peace, Jer_29:7.

6. If we would lead a peaceable and quiet life, we must live in all godliness and honesty; we must do our duty to God and man. [i]He that will love life, and see good days, let him refrain his tongue from evil, and his lips that they speak no guile; let him eschew evil, and do good; let him seek peace, and pursue it,[/i] 1Pe_3:10, 1Pe_3:11. Now the reason he gives for this is [i]because this is good in the sight of God our Saviour[/i]; that is, the gospel of Christ requires this. That which is acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour we should do, and should abound in.

II. As a reason why we should in our prayers concern ourselves for all men, he shows God's love to mankind in general, 1Ti_2:4.

1. One reason why all men are to be prayed for is because there is one God, and that God bears a good will to all mankind. There is one God (1Ti_2:5), and one only, there is no other, there can be no other, for there can be but one infinite. This one God [i]will have all men to be saved[/i]; he desires not the death and destruction of any (Eze_33:11), but the welfare and salvation of all. Not that he has decreed the salvation of all, for then all men would be saved; but he has a good will to the salvation of all, and none perish but by their own fault, Mat_23:37. He will have all to be saved, [i]and to come to the knowledge of the truth[/i], to be saved in the way that he has appointed and not otherwise. It concerns us to get the knowledge of the truth, because that is the way to be saved; [i]Christ is the way and the truth, and so he is the life.[/i]

2. There is one Mediator, and that mediator gave himself a ransom for all. As the mercy of God extends itself to all his works, so the mediation of Christ extends itself thus far to all the children of men that he paid a price sufficient for the salvation of all mankind; he brought mankind to stand upon new terms with God, so that they are not now under the law as a covenant of works, but as a rule of life. They are under grace; not under the covenant of innocence, but under a new covenant: [i]He gave himself a ransom.[/i] Observe, The death of Christ was a ransom, a counter-price. We deserved to have died. Christ died for us, to save us from death and hell; he gave himself a ransom voluntarily, a ransom for all; so that all mankind are put in a better condition than that of devils. He died to work out a common salvation: in order hereunto, he put himself into the office of Mediator between God and man.

A mediator supposes a controversy. Sin had made a quarrel between us and God; Jesus Christ is a Mediator who undertakes to make peace, to bring God and man together, in the nature of an umpire or arbitrator, a days - man who lays his hand upon u both, Job_9:33. He is a ransom that [i]was to be testified in due time[/i]; that is, in the Old Testament times, his sufferings and the glory that should follow were spoken of as things to be revealed in the last times, 1Pe_1:10, 1Pe_1:11. And they are accordingly revealed, Paul himself having been ordained a preacher and an apostle, to publish to the Gentiles the glad tidings of redemption and salvation by Jesus Christ. This doctrine of Christ's mediation Paul was entrusted to preach to every creature, Mar_16:15. He was appointed to be a teacher of the Gentiles; besides his general call to the apostleship, he was commissioned particularly to preach to the Gentiles, [i]in faith and truth[/i], or faithfully and truly. Note,

(1.) It is good and acceptable in the sight of God and our Saviour that we pray for kings and for all men, and also that we lead a peaceable and quiet life; and this is a very good reason why we should do the one as well as the other.

(2.) God has a good will to the salvation of all; so that it is not so much the want of a will in God to save them as it is a want of will in themselves to be saved in God's way. Here our blessed Lord charges the fault: [i]You will not come unto me that you may have life[/i], Joh_5:40. [i]I would have gathered you, and you would not.[/i]

(3.) Those who are saved must come to the knowledge of the truth, for this is God's appointed way to save sinners. Without knowledge the heart cannot be good; if we do not know the truth, we cannot be ruled by it.

(4.) It is observable that the unity of God is asserted, and joined with the unity of the Mediator; and the church of Rome might as well maintain a plurality of gods as a plurality of mediators.

(5.) He that is a Mediator in the New Testament sense, gave himself a ransom. Vain then is the pretence of the Romanists that there is but one Mediator of satisfaction, but many of intercession; for, according to Paul, Christ's giving himself a ransom was a necessary part of the Mediator's office; and indeed this lays the foundation for his intercession.

(6.) Paul was ordained a minister, to declare this to the Gentiles, that Christ is the one Mediator between God and men, who gave himself a ransom for all. This is the substance of which all ministers are to preach, to the end of the world; and Paul magnified his office, as he was the apostle of the Gentiles, Rom_11:13.

(7.) Ministers must preach the truth, what they apprehend to be so, and they must believe it themselves; they are, like our apostle, to preach in faith and verity, and they must also be faithful and trusty.

III. A direction how to pray, 1Ti_2:8.

1. Now, under the gospel, prayer is not to be confined to any one particular house of prayer, but men must [i]pray every where[/i]: no place is amiss for prayer, no place more acceptable to God than another, Joh_4:21. Pray every where. We must pray in our closets, pray in our families, pray at our meals, pray when we are on journeys, and pray in the solemn assemblies, whether more public or private.

2. It is the will of God that in prayer we should lift up holy hands: [i]Lifting up holy hands[/i], or pure hands, pure from the pollution of sin, washed in the fountain opened for sin and uncleanness. [i]I will wash my hands[/i], etc., Psa_26:6.

3. We must pray in charity: [i]Without wrath[/i], or malice, or anger at any person.

4. We must pray in faith [i]without doubting[/i] (Jam_1:6), or, as some read it, [i]without disputing[/i], and then it falls under the head of charity.

Matthew Henry ([i]Italics[/i] extant)

what would Jesus do ?,what Jesus would do certainly is Not what Obama is promoting . nor would Jesus act like Obama acts . so just how is Obama, or anyone else. to be considered righteous . anyone who thinks that Obamas righteousness, is the righteousness of God, in Christ Jesus, IS SERIOUSLY SELF DELUDED on just what God calls righteous. you really have nothing beyond yourself to say about obama nathan. because it what you say here is not what Jesus would say of Obama.

natan4Jesus,,,, i have only seen 2 maybe 3 of your posts here in this thread. i do not look at many posts here in this forum . but of the ones i have looked at ,th 2or 3 i have seen of yours seem to be devisive,arguminative,strife filled. All because YOU have taken the devils bait of offence. you have become easily offended. what you are offended over is a man that has put the truth up on here about ,what could be the next president, but won't be, of the united states of america. Obama getting as far as he has, has only reinforced the problem with the social disfunctions that our trying to attack the moral soundness of the truely righteous that live in america. It is of utmost importance that those who are righteous in Christ Jesus ,have a say and be envolved in politics and every in other GOD ORDAINED means of securing the greatest good to God and the universe. being on the right side of God will cause a person to be on His side when voting for those in authority over us in government. natan seek peace and pursue it Obama is not the peaceful choice for the world or america, or for God. get over your offendedness it does not become a Christian