The Emerging Church IS NOW

I just finished watching the entire series—The Emerging Church by Roger Oakland. It was awesome, it was excellent, and I highly recommend it to everyone.

The study consists of 4 DVD’s given by Roger Oakland of Understand the Times at:
http://www.understandthetimes.org/newecdvdseries.shtml

The Emerging Church:
[b]Man’s Spiritual Journey[/b]

Part 1
DVD Information:
70 Minutes

Description: Throughout biblical history, Satan, the god of this world, has had a plan to deceive man. When man turns away from God and His Word, he will first begin to trust in his own reasoning and then turn to the gods (the fallen spiritual realm).

In The Emerging Church-Part One: Man's Spiritual Journey, Past, Present and Future, Roger Oakland presents documentation to show that:
Satan's three-legged stool plan, which was introduced at the Tower of Babel, is being reintroduced today. This plan is setting the world up for a one-world government, a one-world economy and a one-world religion just as Bible prophecy reveals will take place in the last days.

Satan’s Plan to deceive Man
The Tower of Babel Plan
The Last Days Peace Plan
The United Nations Three Legged Stool Plan
The Mother Earth Three Legged Stool Plan
The Vatican’s Three Legged Stool Plan
The Purpose Driven Three Legged Stool Plan
God’s Plan for Man

The Emerging Church:
[b]Road to Rome[/b]

Part 2

DVD Information:
70 Minutes

Description: According to Emerging Church proponents, the present postmodern generation can only be enticed to embrace Christianity through experiences and ideas which stimulate the senses. The experiences they recommend seem to be the same ones that Roman Catholic and Orthodox churches have always provided.

In The Emerging Church-Road to Rome, Roger Oakland presents documentation to show that many worshippers are being drawn into the Roman Catholic New Evangelization program without being aware of it. Icons, incense, candles, sacraments and images are preparing the way for the revelation of the Roman Catholic Eucharistic Christ.
[b]The new Evangelization Plan
The Roman Catholic Eucharistic Christ
The New Wave of Experience
Images of Worship
Ancient Future Christianity
A Return to Darkness
Where the Emerging Church is headed
The Biblical Answer[/b]

The Emerging Church:
[b]Road to Babylon[/b]
Part 3

DVD Information:
70 Minutes

Description: Central to the emerging church is the idea that one can get closer to God through contemplative mystical practices that are rooted in an experience-based eastern (remove mystical - redundant) religious spirituality. These practices have been introduced to both mainstream and evangelical Christianity through Roman Catholic monks and priests who promote what they call spiritual disciplines (which were originally practiced20by mystics and the Desert Monks of the third century).

In The Emerging Church- Road to Babylon, Roger Oakland addresses this fast growing emerging church movement, showing how it is seducing this generation and leading it toward a false one world religious system and a utopian kingdom of God that emerging proponents say will be established here on earth by human effort.

[b]Last days Spiritual Deception

New Age Spirituality and one world religion

Experience based Christianity and the serpent power

The Emerging New Light Movement

Emerging Church roots and promotion

Contemplative Mysticism and One World Religion

Christian Babylonianism

Biblical Warning with regard to Last Days Deception[/b]

The Emerging Church:
[b]Proclaiming the Gospel[/b]

Part 4

DVD Information:
70 Minutes

Description: Bible prophecy indicates that the last days before Jesus Christ returns will be characterized by a time of great deception. Based on current trends, it appears that the one world government, the one world economy and the one world religion predicted could soon be here. However, in the midst of this scenario, God is calling Bible-believing Christians to proclaim the gospel of Jesus Christ as our only hope to the whole world.

In The Emerging Church - Proclaiming the Gospel in the Midst of Last Days Apostasy, Roger provides the documentation to show we are living at the very time that the last days spiritual "strong delusion" is underway. While documenting the dangers and pi tfalls of the purpose-driven, emerging, and contemplative Christianity, Roger encourages Bible believing Christians to boldly stand for the truth and to be witnesses for Jesus Christ

[b]Last days spiritual deception in the name of Christ

Prophetic warnings from Old Testament Prophets for our day

Jesus Christ warned about the day in which we live

A global ecumenical social gospel is an enemy of the Gospel

A bloodless Gospel is being promoted that denies the cross

The timeless Gospel according to the Scriptures is our only hope

Jesus is coming soon!

Are you ready?[/b]

Sincerely,

Walter

:-)

Thanks for posting this brother.

-Jim

[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=idZCcg3MvEI]Roger Oakland-the emerging church pt 1[/url]

Walter, are you Jack Chick? you can tell me via pm.

Dear Kathleen:

You have stated:

"Sadly, I do agree with Allan. This looks like it has good material, but Jesus said," Freely you have received, freely give."

I just can't see the why someone would want to charge saints money when they have been "given" a message from the Lord."
xxxxxxxxxxxx

Kathleen, how on earth is Roger Oakland going to pay his staff, as well as himself? He used to have a Church as a Pastor long ago, but not anymore.

Do you tithe to your own Church?

The Bible tells us that we are to pay those who are over us:

I Corinthians 9:14

14 Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.

In other words, if a minister preaches the Gospel to his congregation, he is performing a service and should be paid for that service. How MUCH he is paid, should be determined by the elders of the church.

Roger Oakland was a Pastor of a Church, but has chosen the difficult job of being a “Watchman on the Wall” by alerting the Church of apostacy (that is worse now than it has ever been during my 60 plus years on earth), and the coming Great Tribulation, based upon his own studies.

Also, 1 Timothy tells us that the elders should be worthy of a double honor, that they are worthy of a reward.

1 Timothy 5:17-18

17. Let the elders that rule well be counted worthy of double honour, especially they who labour in the word and doctrine.
18. For the scripture saith, Thou shalt not muzzle the ox that treadeth out the corn. And, The labourer is worthy of his reward.

Roger Oakland's Ministry to the body of Christ is surely worthy of a reward. If you are concerned about paying for it, just deduct whatever you purchase from Roger from the tithe you pay to your Church.

Sincerly,

Walter

KathleenP wrote:
Sadly, I do agree with Allan. This looks like it has good material, but Jesus said," Freely you have received, freely give."

I just can't see the why someone would want to charge saints money when they have been "given" a message from the Lord.

God bless, Kathleen

To: Benbrockway

If I recall-- Abel brought the blood sacrifice,(the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof) and Cain brought the fruit of the ground. The sacrifice required by God was the sacrifice of a firstborn lamb, without spot or blemish.

But anyway, no one wants to nit pick here.

The great commission was given to each believer, not just Pastors. Pastors are included, but believers are not excluded. We are all in the soul winning business, we are all fishers of men.

As far as giving money to anyone for anything, whether it be the homeless man or woman on the corner, or my Pastor, or, my neighbor, or anyone, the Bible tells us to not let our left hand know what our right hand is giving. The Lord has blessed me with everything that I have, it is actually His, and not mine, and as such, he will replenish much more that what I can give away to those that come across my path.

"Give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again."

The Bible is also clear that a Pastor should be paid.

Now, I could reject God's command, and hold on tight to what He has given me, and not let go, but then--- I would not be able to help those people that He puts in my path each day, nor help support the Church that I attend, which supports Missionaries all around the World. And guess what? God would quit giving to me, because I was more concerned about myself than His Kingdom.

Matthew 25:14-30 describes God's reward for those that "hold on" to what He has given them:

14. For the kingdom of heaven is as a man travelling into a far country, who called his own servants, and delivered unto them his goods.
15. And unto one he gave five talents, to another two, and to another one; to every man according to his several ability; and straightway took his journey.
16. Then he that had received the five talents went and traded with the same, and made them other five talents.
17. And likewise he that had received two, he also gained other two.
18. But he that had received one went and digged in the earth, and hid his lord's money.
19. After a long time the lord of those servants cometh, and reckoneth with them.
20. And so he that had received five talents came and brought other five talents, saying, Lord, thou deliveredst unto me five talents: behold, I have gained beside them five talents more. 21. His lord said unto him, Well done, thou good and faithful servant: thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord.
22. He also that had received two talents came and said, Lord, thou deliveredst unto me two talents: behold, I have gained two other talents beside them.
23. His lord said unto him, Well done, good and faithful servant; thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord.
[b] 24. Then he which had received the one talent came and said, Lord, I knew thee that thou art an hard man, reaping where thou hast not sown, and gathering where thou hast not strawed: 25. And I was afraid, and went and hid thy talent in the earth: lo, there thou hast that is thine.[/b]
26. His lord answered and said unto him, Thou wicked and slothful servant, thou knewest that I reap where I sowed not, and gather where I have not strawed:
27. Thou oughtest therefore to have put my money to the exchangers, and then at my coming I should have received mine own with usury.
28. Take therefore the talent from him, and give it unto him which hath ten talents.
29. For unto every one that hath shall be given, and he shall have abundance: but from him that hath not shall be taken away even that which he hath.
30. And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

The blood bought child of God should never be "stingy", should never be "tight" or "cheap", but be focused upon God and His Kingdom, and the work He has given us to do.

Sincerely,

Walter

BenBrockway wrote:

DELETED

Waltern,

In response, I would like to point out a few things to add to the discussion. What was it that Cain and Abel offered as an offering? According to Genesis 4 it was the sacrifice of animals. So, what do we know now, concerning this? Well, Jesus Christ was the ultimate Sacrifice. We now no longer have to sacrifice an animal as an offering to God. We now go through Christ. So, because we now go through Christ, we are to "...offer our bodies as a living sacrifice..." (Romans 12:1).

I read 1Cor. 9:7-14 (and even through verse 19). Here is what I find interesting about the Scripture:

Paul says - "3This is my defense to those who sit in judgment on me. 4Don't we have the right to food and drink?5Don't we have the right to take a believing wife along with us, as do the other apostles and the Lord's brothers and Cephas? 6Or is it only I and Barnabas who must work for a living?"

Here is what I believe this portion of Scripture to be saying: They have the right to eat and drink just as much as the next guy. They also have the right to take a believing wife along with them to help prepare the food like some of the other apostles. However, they don't. Both Paul and Barnabas work for a living (outside of them preaching).

1Cor. 9:9-12 says: "9For it is written in the Law of Moses: "Do not muzzle an ox while it is treading out the grain."Is it about oxen that God is concerned? 10Surely he says this for us, doesn't he? Yes, this was written for us, because when the plowman plows and the thresher threshes, they ought to do so in the hope of sharing in the harvest. 11If we have sown spiritual seed among you, is it too much if we reap a material harvest from you? 12If others have this right of support from you, shouldn't we have it all the more?"

So, is it saying that they should have the right to earn some SUPPORT, too? Yes, but let's read on...

"12But we did not use this right. On the contrary, we put up with anything rather than hinder the gospel of Christ. 13Don't you know that those who work in the temple get their food from the temple, and those who serve at the altar share in what is offered on the altar? 14In the same way, the Lord has commanded that those who preach the gospel should receive their living from the gospel.

15But I have not used any of these rights. And I am not writing this in the hope that you will do such things for me. I would rather die than have anyone deprive me of this boast. 16Yet when I preach the gospel, I cannot boast, for I am compelled to preach. Woe to me if I do not preach the gospel! 17If I preach voluntarily, I have a reward; if not voluntarily, I am simply discharging the trust committed to me. 18What then is my reward? Just this: that in preaching the gospel I may offer it free of charge, and so not make use of my rights in preaching it.

19Though I am free and belong to no man, I make myself a slave to everyone, to win as many as possible."

They (Paul and Barnabas) did not use this right. They received what ever was given to them (not a tithe, not 10%, but what was given as a gift, an offering of whatever they (the church) gave out of love - and mind you much of this was food, not just money) (oh, plus they were traveling ministers, not "stick-to-one-church" pastors).

In verse 14, Paul says, "14In the same way, the Lord has commanded that those who preach the gospel should receive their living from the gospel. "
What does Paul mean by that? I think Paul ultimately means faith and trust in the Lord and also the two greatest commandments (Love the Lord your God... love your neighbor).
If you put your faith and trust in the Lord and do His will, you will be provided for. All your needs will be met. You don't need to ask congregations. You don't need to require a congregation to tithe. You just need to trust that you will be provided for(and not just financially. Food, clothing, car and home repairs included).

Paul then says, "15But I have not used any of these rights. And I am not writing this in the hope that you will do such things for me. I would rather die than have anyone deprive me of this boast. 16Yet when I preach the gospel, I cannot boast, for I am compelled to preach. Woe to me if I do not preach the gospel!"

Paul basically says in verse 15, "I'm not saying this so that you'll give to me. I'm not asking for the money." What do preachers do today? They preach tithing so that people will give more money. Preachers ask or require (I say require, because preachers basically say that a person MUST give if they want to be blessed by the Lord) that tithes be given.

In verse 17 and 18 Paul says, "17If I preach voluntarily, I have a reward; if not voluntarily, I am simply discharging the trust committed to me. 18What then is my reward? Just this: that in preaching the gospel I may offer it free of charge, and so not make use of my rights in preaching it."

Preaching it voluntarily without expecting money and trusting in the Lord is a preacher's greatest reward. Why? Because if they are doing God's will, they will be blessed fully and even abundently. A preacher shouldn't be in the position of, "Well I will preach about Christ's love to you, I will preach on God's desire for mankind to be saved and become the bride of Christ, but only if you give me your money." Which, by the way is basically what most preachers do today (in context, not necessarily by word of mouth).

He doesn't make himself a slave to anyone (not one single person), so as to win as many people to Christ as possible.

What do most pastors and churches do today?
What do they do? They say that you are a member of a church if you tithe. What does that make the pastor? It makes him a slave to the church and to the congregate he expects to tithe.

It is the pastor's sole responsiblity to win souls. That's it. Beyond that he must trust in God for his needs to be met. He must only turn to God for his needs to be met. He should not be turning to the congregation.

If he cannot rely on God to have his needs met, his church's electricity to be met, his church's upkeep to be met, or his traveling expenses to be met, then he is relying upon man to meet his needs. Being a pastor should not be a job, but a calling. If it is a calling, a salary should not be in place, but a practice of trust, faith and prayer.

1Timothy 5-17-18 says, "17The elders who direct the affairs of the church well are worthy of double honor, especially those whose work is preaching and teaching. 18For the Scripture says, "Do not muzzle the ox while it is treading out the grain," and "The worker deserves his wages."

The elders are worthy of double honor. The double honor is the pastor's and teacher's wage, according to this passage. And what I mean is the honor, itself. Not money, but honor.

Just my 3 9/10 cents.

Hello Wayneman:

Thank you for the youtube link. The problem is that you only get [b]9 or 10 minutes[/b] on most of the Oakland videos. Make sure you choose the 50 minute Oakland videos on youtube. [b]The four DVD’s that I was telling you about---each DVD is actually 70 minutes long, and have more information.[/b]

Roger Oakland has received death threats from those that he has exposed in these DVD's.

The longer 50 minute videos on youtube, as well as the 70 minute DVD's you can order will provide a better understanding of what is taking place--the preparation of the godless church, that will be led by the false prophet, that is now almost ready to march into the tribulation with those that it deceives at this time (that it is deceiving, right now--the very "elect"), those that will be "left behind".

Sincerely,

Walter

wayneman wrote:
You can watch three of these sermons for free on Google Video.

[url=http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=roger+oakland+emerging+church&emb=0&aq=1&oq=roger+oak#]http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=roger+oakland+emerging+church&emb=0&aq=1&oq=roger+oak#[/url]

To Benbrockway:

When I see the likes of Joel Osteen and Rick Warren, they deserve nothing as far as I am concerned. However, if I am under the authority of a very good Pastor, God’s Word tells me what to do. It does not tell me that I should pay them “double”, but it gives me direction in this regard. In fact, the Bible does not give us a simple formula to arrive at the proper amount. But when I examined the two key New Testament passages on this subject, I found they taught a principle of abundant generosity that was far greater than I had imagined.

The first passage is 1 Timothy 5:17, 18: The elders who direct the affairs of the church well are worthy of double honor, especially those whose work is preaching and teaching. For the Scripture says, "'Do not muzzle the ox while it is treading out the grain," and "The worker deserves his wages."

The connection of verses 17 and 18 shows us how highly Paul valued the ministry of the gospel. He says, in effect, So if even these deserve a fair wage, then how much is deserved by the one who works all the time in the highest and most important calling God gives? Certainly, his work is worth at least twice what other people get!

Perhaps we should not have used the word double but there it stands in Scripture, showing us how highly we ought to regard this important work. When I think how much it means to me to listen to the Word preached week after week, then I realize that the word double is not so extreme after all. Paul did not specify exactly whose salary the pastors was to be the double of, but it probably was not necessary in a society where the wage structure was much less complex than ours.

Isn’t the Bible saying to us that we should compare a pastor’s job with the most important jobs in society? Rather than comparing our pastors salary with the salaries of other pastors, shouldn’t we compare it with the salaries of doctors or lawyers or business executives, people who often earn double what ordinary working people earn? The Bible tells us the pastors job is at least as important as these and he deserves (is worthy of) pay similar to the pay these jobs receive.

Now it must be made clear the Bible does not tell us to pay our pastor a double salary. Rather, it says he is worthy of it. Perhaps there are some churches so small they cannot pay a pastor much at all. God does not command them to pay their pastor twice as much as the average pay in their community. He just says the pastor deserves that much and that is something the church should remember as it plans and grows. Or perhaps a pastor will simply refuse to accept that much. He and his family might even decide they should have a simpler lifestyle below their present income, as a witness against the excessive materialism of our society.

[b]Paul’s own practice is instructive here. Sometimes he took payment for his ministry, sometimes he did not. 1 Corinthians 9:1-18 and 2 Corinthians 11:7 show he found work instead of accepting money from the Corinthians, but 2 Corinthians 11 :8-9 and Philippians 4:15-18 make it clear he did accept support from other churches, and in 1 Corinthians 9:14 he stoutly defends that right. In fact, in 2 Corinthians 12:13 he tells the Corinthians they were less favored than the other churches, because they did not enjoy the privilege of giving to his needs![/b]

Of course, people will object that offering a high salary will entice some to enter the ministry for the money. In reply, the Bible has many other provisions for being sure that only the right people enter and stay in the ministry. (For example, the personal qualifications listed in 1 Timothy 3:1-7, 5:19-22 and Titus 1:5-9). Low pay, however, is simply not a requisite. Anyone who wants to argue that low pay is good for pastors must do so both without any clear scriptural support and in direct opposition to 1 Timothy 5:17.

I also feel that those who are not stingy in this regard, who do give freely to their Church and individual Missionaries, and anyone else in their paths receive extra blessings from God, and are rewarded monetarily while on earth, and receive extra blessings in heaven.

As far as George Meuller is concerned, he was an awesome example for all of us. He never asked for money from anyone, but made his plea to the Lord. And God, through the power of the Holy Spirit, touched and convicted the hearts of men of Meulers need, AND THEY GAVE HIM MONEY, AS WELL AS THEIR ESTATES WHEN THEY WENT ON TO HEAVEN. If the Holy Spirit does not convict your heart to give to your Pastor, or anyone else for that matter, then so be it. I find it odd that the Holy Spirit convicted many hearts to give to Mueller. In fact, over his lifetime, donations of $7,500,000 came to him from other believers.

Sincerely,

Walter

BenBrockway wrote:

waltern wrote:

DELETED

Waltern,

The points I made are this:

1. We are now no longer required to make an OFFERING of "material" things (i.e. animals, and money), which is why I brought up the example of Genesis 4. As stated in Romans 12:1, we are now asked to give our bodies (our lives) as a living sacrifice.

2. There isn't New Testament scripture that says that pastor's are to be paid and there are no new testament Scripture that says the believer must tithe.

Now, there are Scripture that essentially says "if the believer wishes to give a gift of food or money, they can certianly feel free to do so, but I will not require them to do so, because the gospel of Christ should be free..."

I would recommend reading George Muller's autobiography to understand my points, as well as reading the whole passages of Scripture you bring to this discussion.

Again, in your previous post you brought up tithing. Tithing is different then giving.

The Bible is also clear that a Pastor should be paid.

Please show me New Testament Scripture that says a Pastor should be paid.

In Christ,
Ben

[b]What is the three legged stool plan?[/b]

I wanted to shed some light in regards to the "three legged stool plan"as taught by Roger Oakland on his four DVD's on the "Emerging Church" and end time events, which we are all right in the middle of, as the false church prepares to march into the Tribulation, with Antichrist and the false prophet at the helm.

This is nothing more than an outline, that is still not complete. If anyone would like to finish it, please do so.

[b]The Babylonian System[/b]
1. Rebellion against God and His Word
2. A plan to join together economically
3. A plan to join together spiritually
4. God was angered by the plan
5. God stopped the plan

[b]Satan’s Plan for Fallen Man[/b]
1.Convince man not to pay attention to God and His Word
2.Convince man to pay attention to man and follow man and his methods & movements
3. Man will eventually seek after god’s (the false god's of the earth), instead of the One True God.

[b]Satan’s Last days plan for man[/b]
1. Deceive the World and the Church
2. Reconstruct the Babylonian plan for man
3. Bring back mankind together again
4. The god of this world plans to be king
5. Global political System
6. Global Economic System

[b]Three Legged Stool Plan
The last days plan that will seduce the world[/b]

This plan is not from God

This plan will be inspired by Satan

This plan will likely be in the name of the Savior, in the name of Christ

This plan will set up the religion of the antichrist.

God will destroy this plan

Four (4) plans by man for the future hope of man—all 3 legged stool plans

[b]United Nations Plan[/b]
Leg 1= global political cooperation
Leg 2= global economic cooperation
Leg 3=global spiritual cooperation

[b]Mother Earth Plan[/b]
Leg 1= global politics
Leg 2= global economics
Leg 3= global spirituality

[b]Vatican Plan[/b]
Leg 1= global political governance
Leg 2= global economic governance
Leg 3= global religious unity in the name of the “Eucharist Christ”

[b]Purpose Driven Plan[/b]
Leg 1= a public sector role
Leg 2= a private sector role
Leg 3= a faith sector role

The faith sector role= the Churches!

Rick Warrens 3 legged stool plan interview with Tim Russert on 12/24/2006
“A one legged stool will fall over, a two legged stool will fall over, and business and government alone cannot solve these problems. They haven’t or they would have. There is a private sector role, there is a private sector role, and there is a faith sector role. The third leg of the Purpose Driven Stool is the Churches." [The Churches equals the Faith Sector]

Sincerely,

Walter

DELETED

Ben posted:

"As far as everything else goes. I don't know what else to say to have you understand. My point is this, and I think it's pretty clear is that tithing is not a mandate. Which is my sole point."

Hello, Ben:

Let me ask you a question--- Do you ever give an "offering" when you attend Church? Our Church does not pass the offering plate around for donations & offerings. We have an agape box at the back of the building, and people who want to make an offering or donation are free to do so. Would you conisder doing something like that?

Sincerely,

Walter

Post deleted by Walter

[b]I Have been working on this, filling in the gaps--of interest to all is the Vatican Plan, and what the Pope has said publically since 2003.[/b]

Satan's plan to control the world and be worshiped as god by those on their way to hell:

[b]The Babylonian System-Found in God’s Word (Genesis 11:1-9)[/b]
1.\tRebellion against God and His Word
2.\t2. A plan to join together economically
3.\tA plan to join together spiritually
4.\tGod was anger by the plan
5. God stopped the plan[/b]

[b]Satan’s Plan for Fallen Man[/b]
1.\tConvince man not to pay attention to God and His Word
2.\tPay attention to man and follow man and his methods & movements
3.\tMan will eventually seek after god’s

[b]Satan's three Legged Stool Plan
Satan’s Last days plan for man[/b]
1.\tDeceive the World and the Church
2.\tReconstruct the Babylonian plan for man
3.\tBring back mankind together again
4.\tThe god of this world plans to be king
5.\tGlobal political System
6.\tGlobal Economic System

[b]Three Legged Stool Plan of Satan
The last days plan that will seduce the world[/b]
This plan is not from God
This plan will be inspired by Satan
This plan will likely be in the name of the Savior, in the name of Christ
This plan will set up the religion of the antichrist.
God will destroy this plan

[b]Four (4) plans by man for the future hope of man—all 3 legged stool plans—all inspired by Satan![/b]

[b]United Nations Plan
United Nations Plan, underneath a global flag, a “new world order”[/b]
Leg 1= global political cooperation
Leg 2= global economic cooperation
Leg 3=global spiritual cooperation

[b]Mother Earth Plan- Gaia (mother earth)- “a new look at life on earth”[/b]
Leg 1= global politics
Leg 2= global economics
Leg 3= global spirituality

[b]Vatican Plan
The New World Order and One World religion![/b]
Leg 1= global political governance
Leg 2= global economic governance
Leg 3= global religious unity in the name of the “Eucharist Christ”

While visiting Rome in November of 1996, I took a city tour. One of our stops was St. Peter's Basilica. My guide told me another name for St. Peter's was the “Mother of All Churches.” (Roger Oakland)

[b]FATIMA TO BECOME INTERFAITH SHRINE [/b]
Nov. 1, 2003 http://www.apocalypsesoon.org/world1.html

[b]Delegates attending the Vatican and United Nations (UN) inspired annual interfaith congress "The Future of God", held during October in Fátima, heard how the Shrine is to be developed into a centre where all the religions of the world will gather to pay homage to their various gods. [/b]

The Congress was held in the Paul VI Pastoral Centre and presided over by the Cardinal Patriarch of Lisbon José de Cruz Policarpo. The Shrine's rector, Monsignor Luciano Guerra, told the Congress that Fátima "will change for the better." Addressing Hindu, Muslim, Jewish, Orthodox, Buddhist and African Pagan representatives he stated:[b] "The future of Fátima, or the adoration of God and His mother at this holy Shrine, must pass through the creation of a shrine where different religions can mingle.[/b]

The inter-religious dialogue in Portugal, and in the Catholic Church, is still in an embryonic phase, but the[b] Shrine of Fátima[/b] is not indifferent to this fact and is already open to being a universalistic place of vocation." The Hindu representative Ansshok Ansraj, described how already in the Far East millions of Hindus are getting "positive vibrations" from visiting Marian shrines without endangering their faith. [b]Monsignor Guerra pointed out that the very fact that Fátima is the name of a Muslim and Mohammed's daughter, is indicative that the Shrine must be open to the co-existence of various faiths and beliefs. According to the Monsignor: "Therefore we must assume that it was the will of the Blessed Virgin Mary that this comes about this way." Traditional Catholics opposed to the Congress were described by the Monsignor as "old fashioned, narrow minded, fanatic extremists and provocateurs." [/b]

[b]For the first time in the 86-year history of Fátima all of the Pagan and Christian delegates were invited to participate in the Ecumenical celebrations. One of the principle speakers, the Jesuit theologian Father Jacques Dupuis, was insistent that the religions of the world must unite.[/b] "The religion of the future will be a general converging of religions in a universal Christ that will satisfy all", he said. The Belgium born theologian argued: "The other religious traditions in the world are part of God's plan for humanity and the Holy Spirit is operating and present in Buddhist, Hindu and other sacred writings of Christian and non-Christian faiths as well."

In an impassioned plea he said: [b]"The universality of God's kingdom permits this, and this is nothing more than a diversified form of sharing in the same mystery of salvation. In the end it is hoped that the Christian will become a better Christian and each Hindu a better Hindu."[/b] An official statement put out by the Congress called for a non-proselytising approach by all religions[b]. "No one religion can irradiate another", it said "or strengthen itself by downplaying others and an open dialogue is the way to building bridges and tearing down walls of centuries of hate. What is needed is that each religion be true to its faith integrally and treat each religion on the same footing of equality with no inferior or superiority complexes."[/b] It emphasised that the secret to peace amongst all religions is admitting that contradictions exist between creeds but to concentrate on what unites them as opposed to what separates them. Delegates agreed that religious shrines, including Fátima, should be revamped every 25 years to reflect modern day trends and beliefs. The Shrine of Fátima is about to undergo a complete reconstruction with a new stadium-like basilica being erected close by the existing one built in 1921.

[b]1/6/2007 Pope Benedict[/b] – “The need emerged for a new world order in economis and political spheres, but also and especially in cultural & spiritual spheres, that is, a renewed humanism. The reason that a new social, political & economic order does not work is because there is no spiritual renewal, if we do not find God.”

[b]1/8/2007 Pope Benedict urges todays wisemen to shape the world based on Christ- shape a “new world order” on spiritual values.[/b] Said that [b]wisemen of today[/b] are found in three (3) classes of leaders—Political Authorities; People of intellect and science; the leaders of the world’s faiths.[b] All three categories are important as the church continues its task of transforming the world. Article in Catholicview.com

7/25/2007 Pope Benedict XVI- Catholic News.com
“Creation vs. evolution is an absurdity. Benedict also says humans must listen to the voice of the earth”[/b]

[b]The Purpose Driven Plan[/b]
This is the latest "hope" plan for the earth
1.\tThe plan is being promoted by man
2.\tThe plan includes the P.E.A.C.E. plan
3.\tMany evangelical Christians are enlisting
4.\tThe plan is very ecumenical
5.\tThe plan deals with global economics

[b]Pastor Rick Warren and his 3 legged stool plan
The Purpose Driven Plan[/b]
Leg 1= a public sector role
Leg 2= a private sector role
Leg 3= a faith sector role

The faith sector role= the Churches!

Rick Warren’s 3 legged stool plan interview with Tim Russert on 12/24/2006 “regarding a plan to defeat the planets five (5) giants:
“A one legged stool will fall over, a two legged stool will fall over, and business and government alone cannot solve these problems. They haven’t or the woul’ve. There is a private sector role, there is a private sector role, and there is a faith sector role. The third leg of the Purpose Driven Stool is the Churches. The Churches equals the Faith Sector.

Anyone else want to help with working on this, from the Roger Oakland tapes, that can be found at youtube.com?

Sincerely,

Walter

adamdawkins wrote:
rreighe - I have Mr Oakland's book on the topic, I'm happy to post it to you if you want?

I know it's not a DVD, but it seems to cover essentially the same material.

Interestingly, Mr Oakland is speaking 9 miles from my house this Friday, I think I'll go!