Is Christ's Blood different than my blood?

[b]THE CHEMISTRY OF THE BLOOD[/b]

Jesus Sinless

The Bible teaches in addition that Jesus was a sinless man. Whereas all men from Adam to this day are born with Adam’s sinful nature and therefore are subject to the curse and eternal death, the Man Jesus was without sin and therefore deathless, until He took the sin of others upon Himself and died their death.

God has made of one blood all the nations of the earth. Even though Jesus, therefore, received His flesh, His body from a sinful race. He could still be sinless as long as sinful blood was not in His body. God provided a way whereby Jesus could be perfectly human according to the flesh and yet not have the blood of sinful humanity. That was the problem solved by the virgin birth.

[b]Origin of the Blood[/b]

It is understood by Doctors that the blood which flows in an unborn babe’s arteries and veins is not derived from the mother but is produced within the body of the fetus. It is only after the sperm has entered the ovum and a fetus begins to develop that blood appears. As a very simple illustration of this, think of the egg of a hen. An unfertilized egg is simply an ovum on a much larger scale than the human ovum. You may incubate this unfertilized hen’s egg, but it will never develop. It will dry up completely but no chick will result. But let that egg be fertilized by the introduction of the male sperm and incubation will bring to light the presence of live in an embryo. After a few hours it visibly develops. In a little while red streaks occur, denoting the presence of blood. And life is in the blood according to Scripture, for Moses says:

[b]For the life of the flesh is in the blood (Leviticus 1 7:11)

For it is the life of all flesh; the blood of it is for the life thereof
(Leviticus 17:14)

Mother’s Blood Separate[/b]

It is unnecessary that a single drop of blood be given to the developing embryo in the womb of the mother. Such is the case according to scientists. The mother provides the fetus with the nutritive elements for the building of that little body in the secret of her womb, but all the blood which forms in it is formed in the embryo itself. From the time of conception to the time of birth of the infant not one single drop of blood ever passes from mother to child. The placenta, that mass of temporary tissue known better as “afterbirth”, forming the link between mother and child, is so constructed that although all the soluble nutritive elements such as proteins, fats, carbohydrates, salts, minerals and even antibodies pass freely from mother to child and the waster products of the child’s metabolism are passed back to the mother’s circulation, no actual interchange of a single drop of blood ever occurs normally. All the blood which is in that child is produced within the child itself. The mother contributes no blood at all.

[b]God’s Wonderful Provision[/b]

How wonderfully God prepared for the virgin birth of His Son. When He created woman He made her so that no blood would be able to pass from her to her offspring. In order to produce a sinless man who would yet be the son of Adam, God provided a way whereby that man would have a human body derived from Adam but have blood from a separate source. Some have tried to answer the question, “How could He be sinless & yet born of woman?” by making Mary the “Immaculate Virgin”. That however, does not answer the question of how Jesus was sinless.

It is plainly taught in Scripture that Jesus partook of human flesh without partaking of the effect of Adam’s blood. In Hebrews 2:14 we read:

[b]Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood he also himself likewise took part of the same…..

You will notice that the “children” that is, the human children, are said to be partakers of flesh and blood, and then, speaking of Jesus, this verse says that He himself likewise took part of the same. The word “took part” as applying to Christ is an entirely different word from “partakers” as applied to the children. In the margin of my bible, I read that the word translated, “took part” implies “taking part in something outside one’s self.” The Greek word for partakers if KOYNONEHO and means “to share fully,” so that all of Adam’s children share fully in Adam’s flesh and blood. When we read that Jesus “took part of the same” the word METECHO which means “to take part but not all.” The children take both flesh and blood of Adam but Christ took only part, that is, the flesh part, whereas the blood was the result of supernatural conception. [/b]

Jesus was a perfect human being after the flesh. He was of the seed of David according to the flesh, but blood is that part of a man which is the divine addition. In the creation of man, Adam’s body was made from the dust of the earth, but God breathed into his nostrils the breath of life. Since life is in the blood, this act resulted in the formation of blood in Adam’s body, but the first Adam’s blood was corrupted and sin is in all mankind since God hath made of one blood all nations. In the last Adam and the second man, new and divine and sinless blood was produced in a body that was NOT the seed of Adam and by this resulted in the production of:

[b]Divine Blood[/b]

Conception by the Holy Ghost was the only way the virgin birth could be accomplished. Mary nourished the body of Jesus and He became the seed of David according to the flesh. The Holy Spirit contributed the blood of Jesus. It is sinless blood. It is divine blood. It is precious blood, for there has never been any other like it. It is:

[b]Innocent Blood[/b]

I have betrayed the innocent blood, Judas confessed in Matthew 27:4.[/b] Our Lord was innocent. He became like unto us in all things – sin only excepted; like unto us with one exception – instead of being conceived by a human father, He was conceived by a divine father. As a result, biologically, He had divine blood, sinless blood. Because this blood is sinless it is:

[b]Incorruptible Blood[/b]

Sin made human blood corruptible. Soon after death decay sets in, and it begins in the blood. That is why meat must be drained well of its blood. That is why embalmers place the embalming fluid in the blood. David said that Jesus’ body should not see corruption. Though He was dead three days and three nights, His body did not corrupt. Because He was sinless they could not put Him to death but instead He laid down His life voluntarily that He might take it up again. He arose by His own power, because death had no claim on Him except the claim of other’s sin, and when that was paid –

Death cannot keep his prey-
Jesus, my Savior;
He tore the bars away –
Jesus, my Lord.
Up from the grave he arose,
With a mighty triumph o’er His foes.

Sinner, have you received this Savior and have you been washed in His Precious Blood? If not, you are still under the curse and the awful sentence of death. Why not accept Him today and hear Him as He says:

God commendeth His love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died For us. Much more then, being now justified by His blood, we shall be saved from Wrath through Him (Romans 5:8,9)

[b]Jesus was the Messiah though the flesh of the line of Mary, and not the blood of the line of Mary. He was the perfect human, after the flesh of Mary, NOT THE BLOOD OF MARY.[/b]

Sincerely,

Walter

"He learned obedience by what HE suffered"

"Tempted in all manners such as we, but without sin"

This teaching of "The Divine Blood" removes the Free-Will of Jesus and then we cannot use HIM as our example - because then we can say - "Of course I cannot live or be as HE was - HE had divine blood and I don't"

Regardless of who wrote it and I do respect Brother DeHaan - Jesus was as human in every respect as we are. He "emptied Himself" so as to be our example.
There is no example that HE had it "all over us" because HE was more advantaged than we'll ever be ... that would contradict far too many Scriptures.

It also contributes to "modern genetics theories" that there are certain "sins" that are inherent in a person's blood - which does away with freewill as well.

Brother Walter, before I go off-line for now - I prayed my answer didn't upset you.

I have a tendency to just address the text and try to keep the member out of it for a reason -- that it isn't them who wrote these things or other things on other threads. I normally address the Author - because the Forum Member is not the author that I may not agree with and sometimes will do that, even when I do agree with the Author that a Member quotes.

I felt to come back to this thread to explain further, because this teaching has been around a long time and I've felt to give Brother DeHaan the benefit of the doubt by the date [1943] of this article.
That was a very sensitive time in the world's history, when it came to "blood types" - as we saw in Germany back then, sorrowfully, but coicidently - now again since the genome code was opened up and some supposed "blood typing the RH factor of the blood on the shroud" has become another craze and the myth that some hold to of "The Royal Bloodline [type]", Etc.

Jesus is called the last Adam, because Adam was born "innocent - though with a freewill". Jesus also was born "innocent" [as the Lamb of GOD] because He was born of the Spirit but also with freewill.

He came to make a way out for us from what Adam had done. The mystery is not in the "blood" but in HIS Obedience, even to the Cross - as the Sacrificial Lamb. Yes, HE was/is GOD, but while in the flesh - HE took our form 100% and did not speak or work "without the Father, through the Spirit". He never acted on HIS own. He laid aside His Deity and again, became our example - of how to walk totally dependent on the Father - to teach us to not walk on our own.

The Blood type comes from 'both' mother and father. It is formed in "the marrow of the bones". That is why today, tests can be run to find both mother and father of a child - matching both - whereas in 1943 for Brother DeHann, this genetic testing was not available - though testing blood types was. But he should have known that the blood is formed in the marrow of the bones - which is from both parents.

The other important thing about the blood of Jesus, Who is to one Day sit on David’s throne (Luke 1:32-33), had He been begotten by Mary’s husband Joseph, who was of the line of Jeconiah (Matthew 1:12,16), it would have contradicted this divine prediction but the physical descent of Jesus from David came through Mary, whose genealogy is traced to David through Nathan rather than through Solomon (cp. Luke 3:31 with Matthew 1:17).

Jesus came through the line of Mary, so that He fulfilled the OT prophecies of coming from David’s blood line. If Jesus’ blood is “God’s blood”, then Jesus could not be the Messiah prophesied in the O.T., because He could not have fulfilled those prophecies.

Catholicism and others believe this Divine blood theory and others like it - such as "Claiming the blood" in spiritual warfare and other excesses.

These others may explain better & further -

http://www.spurgeon.org/~phil/articles/blood.htm

http://home.sprynet.com/~eagreen/blood.html

http://www.christinyou.net/pages/bloodofchrist.html

Romans 8:29

Thank you for the information about today's science. What we are talking about is much more than a matter of "science", it is a matter of Scripture.

[b]However, within Him (Jesus Christ) was the fullness of the Godhead, bodily. (Col 2:9)--that is something you and I definitely lack![/b]

He acted through the power of the Holy Spirit, not His own God power that he laid aside. He had the Holy Spirit [b]without measure,[/b] we (Christian believers) have the Holy Spirit [b] with measure.[/b]

34. For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him. (John 3:34)

[b]He is our example, but we can never be like Him until the rapture, when we get rid of these bodies of flesh and blood. [/b]

50. Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.(1 Cor 15:50)

However, He who was sinless took on the sin of mankind, to take care of the sin problem forever.

[b]He was tempted as we are, but never ONCE sinned, by thought or deed. He never had one thought of lust, ever. Never one thought of anger at His own brothers or sisters, ever.[/b]

Christ is the "Seed of the Woman" as prophesized in Genesis 3:15.

Women do not have seed, men are the ones that have seed. Christ's seed was supernatural seed, supplied by the Holy Spirit. Jesus Christ is the "Last Adam", and we will not be like Him until the rapture.

[b]No matter how long we live down here on this earth, we will never be able to claim that we had one sinless 24 hour day on this planet. Only Jesus Christ can make this claim, and He was sinless His entire lifetime, even as a baby![/b]

We humans (all people, whether Christian or not) have all inherited the polluted blood of Adam. Eventhough we are saved, Adam's blood still flows through our veins. We still have thoughts of lust and adultery, eventhough we don't act them out. We all have thoughts of murder, eventhough all we do is get angry with our brother. Jesus did not have this problem, ever.

Not until the recurrection will we be like Him, will we be like Jesus Christ, when we receive new bodies of[b] flesh and bone[/b], in a new resurrected body just like the one that Christ has.

Luke 24:39-43
39. Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not [b]flesh and bones,[/b] as ye see me have.
40. And when he had thus spoken, he shewed them his hands and his feet. 41. And while they yet believed not for joy, and wondered, he said unto them, Have ye here any meat?
42. And they gave him a piece of a broiled fish, and of an honeycomb. 43. And he took it, and did eat before them.

[b]To be "saved" requires first "repentance", and then "belief" in Jesus Christ and the Work that He performed on the cross. Once we are saved, we are not clones of Jesus Christ, that never sin by thought or deed. Our santification requires continous prayer for repentance of our daily/hourly sin that we commit by thought or deed, and then by “belief” in Jesus as our Lord and Savior, and our hope of eternal glory. We Christians are nothing more than mud balls, until the rapture.[/b]

Sincerely,

Walter

Jesus-is-GOD wrote:
Brother Walter, before I go off-line for now - I prayed my answer didn't upset you.

I have a tendency to just address the text and try to keep the member out of it for a reason -- that it isn't them who wrote these things or other things on other threads. I normally address the Author - because the Forum Member is not the author that I may not agree with and sometimes will do that, even when I do agree with the Author that a Member quotes.

DELETED

Please, ChrisJd, reply with Scripture. Also, when did you get elevated to the position of Moderator on Sermonindex?

The Bible is clear, our position in Christ is imputed to us. We have the down payment, the Holy Ghost, that lives within our hearts, but we don't get the whole deal until the rapture.

What we see going on in the body of Christ today is nothing more than a misunderstanding of who and what the Christian believer is, and who and what God is.

We can do nothing on our own, yet today many Christians are puffed up, feeding their flesh, involved with prosperity error, Dominion Theology error, Blab & Grab it-name it & claim it error, and all types of other error-- error by worshipping through the flesh---and never ending Doctrinal error.

The reason? Today our Churches have told us that there are such people as "carnal christians", who eventhough they willfully sin after they have been "saved", they are on their way to heaven. This abomination has been taught as [b]doctrine[/b] for many years.

Paul Washer addresses these issues.[b][color=990000] Christians today are deceived when they think that they no longer need to be on their knees, in repentence and brokeness, and in prayer for their sin, after they have once been "saved", after they once received their "flu shot" of salvation.[/color][/b]

[b]The body of Christ today is 10 million miles long and 1 1/2 inches deep.[/b]

[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQ1BaClAQMg&feature=related]Paul Washer's thoughts on True Repentance & Justification[/url]

[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBdoS-gkqcA&feature=related]What does it mean to be Holy?[/url]

[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?gl=GB&hl=en-GB&v=WBl568p7aSY]Is there such a thing as a Carnal Christian?[/url]

Sincerely,

Walter

ChrisJD wrote:
Waltern,

I would like to urge you to consider the controversy that you have created multiple times since you have participated on these forums and to ask yourself why you continue to do this.

No matter how long we live down here on this earth, we will never be able to claim that we had one sinless 24 hour day on this planet.

These are your words and not Gods. You have multiple times interjected controversial topics along with your own opinons.

I want to urge you to take heed to yourself.

To Christinyou:

Here we are again, at opposite ends of the issue-- again!

Following is a sermon by Paul Washer that assures the believer that there is only one man that had no sin, and that is Christ Jesus. As Christian believers, our sins are forgiven, past present and future. However, 1st John takes us to a more perfect understanding of what the saved Christian is:

“If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.”— (1 John 1:8)

[url=http://media.sermonindex.net/14/SID14097.mp3]Paul Washer --Biblical Assurance part 2[/url]

Without the confession of our sin to God, in the life of the believer,[b] that continues after salvation,[/b] God has nothing to do with that person, and no relationship with them. They are the ones that Christ will say "And then will I profess unto them,[b] I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.[/b] Matthew 7:23

I challenge you to listen to the above sermon in it's entirety, Christinyou! It is addressed to you and your 3 "friends" (who usually always post in agreement with each other that the Christian believer has no sin to confess).

Sincerely,

Walter

Christinyou wrote:
Quote:

"""The Blood type comes from 'both' mother and father. It is formed in "the marrow of the bones". That is why today, tests can be run to find both mother and father of a child - matching both - whereas in 1943 for Brother DeHann, this genetic testing was not available - though testing blood types was. But he should have known that the blood is formed in the marrow of the bones - which is from both parents."""

Then the blood of Jesus Christ was both, all man through Mary and all God through God our Father.

By faith our Spirit is now the Spirit of Christ, born again of our Father's incorruptable Seed of the Word, who is Christ, and by the Holy Spirit, in Christ by being born again, without which no man can see the kingdom of God, for flesh and the blood of Adam cannot enter the Kingdom of God. We will have a new body like the body of Jesus Christ which will be flesh and bone, for the Blood of Jesus Christ was all shed for us, and Jesus Himself said, Luke 24:39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have. If Christ was resurrected with a body like ours, He would have to have the blood of the Father in His veins, not mans blood, refilled in His veins for all His blood was shed on the Cross and it had already separated to blood and water, the complete and final sign of death and this blood being the only blood that could take away the sin of the world, for the blood of man cannot enter the kingdom of God or take away sin, even the blood of all the animals sacrificed could not save from sin, only cover sin in the eyes of God, no new nature, by faith through Grace from the precious Blood of Christ shed for the whole world and to take away sin forever, once, for those that believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.

In Christ: Phillip

No remarks about the video of Paul Washer? It is almost an hour long. Since your post came minutes after my post, I know that you did not even listen to it.

You're analysis of what Washer has to say would be a very interesting post. I'm sure you would try to create wiggle room, but the Word of God allows none, and neither does Paul Washer!

This is the link, if God puts it on your heart to study:

[url=http://media.sermonindex.net/14/SID14097.mp3]Paul Washer--Biblical Assurance part 2[/url]

Sincerely,

Walter

Christinyou wrote:
How do we reconcile these passages in 1 John?

1 John 2:1-3 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world. And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.

And;

1Pe 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.
1Jo 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
1Jo 4:7 Beloved, let us love one another: for love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God.
1Jo 5:1 Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.
1Jo 5:4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.
1Jo 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

The first is; "if any man sin"
The second is; "whosoever is born of God"

The difference is the Christ in us cannot sin and He is who we are, "born of God" cannot sin, for His Seed remaineth in us. That is the Seed of Christ that cannot sin. But, we have an Advocate with the Father, "if any man sin", and in confession and, "cleansed from all unrighteousness", God is faithful and just to forgive us our sin and cleanse us from all unrighteousness, by the Christ that is in us.

So, delivered, already, cannot comit sin, being delivered, if we sin, confession, and will yet be delivered, the seed planted in the ground and in resurrection raised from death unto life in Christ Jesus.

2 Corinthians 1:10 Who delivered us from so great a death, and doth deliver: in whom we trust that He will yet deliver us;

Romans 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

If a man says he has no sin or has not sinned, He is a liar and the truth is not in him

In Christ: Phillip

Brother Philip, forgive me for using "and" instead of "or" in that one sentence.

Jesus had to have his mother's blood type because HE had to be from the Davidic lineage.

This thread did start with a "scientific" post, but I had no idea where it was leading up to.

But back to the blood --- I have my Father's blood type but my Father had his mother's blood type.

My post should have read, the mother's or the father's.

I assumed this was a thread about "Divine Blood" and that is what I was posting to.

I'm sorry Walter that you don't see all that HE died for - for us - though I ended my post with Romans 8:29 .

Jesus' example to us was to not lean on our own understanding or anything from ourselves, as HE didn't - but as it is repeatedly written - HE said, 'the words that I speak and the works do not come from Me but from The Father' --- that is what Romans 8 is pointing us to "walk in".

Have you been hurt by someone's "sinless perfection" doctrine?
I don't believe in sinless perfection but I do see where the "potential" to not sin is very much provided for us.

I wish you Peace, from my heart.

To christinyou:

Isn't that strange! I tried them after I posted them, and just now tried both posts again, and they both work! The MP3's are on the sermonindex site.

You will find the 2nd through the 5 th mp3's following, that are all dedicated to you, and your 3 friends. Or, is it 4 friends now, I.m not sure:

http://media.sermonindex.net/14/SID14097.mp3
2n message- Biblical Assurance

http://media.sermonindex.net/14/SID14098.mp3
3rd message- Biblical Assurance

http://media.sermonindex.net/14/SID14098.mp3
4th message- Biblical Assurance

http://media.sermonindex.net/14/SID14101.mp3
5th message-- Biblical Assurance

They all work, just like my other posts do and did.

Sincerely,

Walter

Christinyou wrote:
Sorry Waltern, but the Ip address sends and error report, only.

In Christ: Phillip

Have you been hurt by someone's "sinless perfection" doctrine?
I don't believe in sinless perfection but I do see where the "potential" to not sin is very much provided for us.

I do agree brother that we can and MUST walk in a pure conscience before the Lord with victory over known sin. Yet many of the varieties of the "sinless perfection" doctrine that are passed around today do more to hurt the cause of "holiness onto the Lord" then cheap grace ever could.

Peter said that, there is a way to 'wrest/pervert the Scriptures to our own destruction' - either way - legalism, sinless-perfection or easy-grace.

A human who chooses to not be victorious in Christ - would love any easy way out.

Rather than read ALL of Romans 8 - they'd love to just quote it in part - "no condemnation" - period and go along in the flesh, doing what they "think" is right and/or wrong and just confessing it over and over and over again.

Romans 8 is not saying that that is how we have to live.

It says plainly - that there is no condemnation [i]to them which are IN Christ Jesus, who walk NOT after the flesh, but after The Spirit ... and then continues on to expand on that "walk".

It is not anything complicated. I posted Romans 8 and showed Jesus' earthly life as our Example.

HE did not have it Over us - HE was 'our' Example of how to "do this walk."

Please - Count how many times Jesus said "My Father".
See how many times that HE said, "the words that I speak are not mine own but ...... "
And - "the works that I do are not mine but ......"
Look and see how many times it says that Jesus "looked up" into Heaven to the Father.
Total dependency on The Father - through The Spirit - as a little child.
Asking Father what to do, say, think and so forth.

With us, many or most times, He'll point us to something from His Word --- but it's just the question of 'taking that minute' to look-up in spirit and ask.

That's it!

Setting our minds on things above --- seated in Heavenly Places --- praying without ceasing --- Knowing, hearing and following The Shepherd's Voice so that we won't follow another --- as helpless little children or dumb sheep --- Looking Up --- having our minds washed by the cleansing of The WORD --- Trusting in the LORD with all of our hearts and leaning not unto our own understanding and in ALL of our ways, acknowledging HIM, so that HE shall direct our paths ... knowing that ALL things are working together to conform us into HIS Image ... not by our works but by that dependence of looking up in constant prayer to HIM by HIS Spirit to guide, teach, lead, fill us with HIS WORD ......

[b]Total utter child-like Dependence which is "Active Continuous Faith in HIM"[/b] and not upon ourselves to "perform" but to "be led" and filled with the mind of Christ in and by His Word and John 16:13-14.

Like a little child - leaning, listening, filled with His Word and obeying what we hear or read.

Eating The WORD of GOD and full dependence on HIS John 10 Voice by HIS John 16:13 Spirit.

Then HE gets all the Glory and our minds are so full of HIM, there will be less time to allow temptations to make a nest in our heads.

Remembering that "sin" is just missing the mark of HIS IMAGE and not just immoral acts.

It's The Image of The Son that The Father had planned through the First born.

Not humans constantly falling until they're bruised enough from each "sin" to finally stop that one "sin" --- one "sin" at a time.

I don't find this "keep trying and failing" walk in HIS WORD --- I see HIM as our Only Example of total dependency.
According to Romans 8 and the whole of the N.T. - there's not a mention of boasting nor constant failing.

He's given us "HIS faith" - we have the GOD given potential to be those called the Overcomers.

Not by might - not by power - but by His Spirit - 'through' [1 John 4:9] our child-like looking up in constant dependence on HIM - as Jesus did while here in human flesh, as we are.
Filled with HIS WORD and HIS SPIRIT - more than conquerors [i]through[/i] Him that loves us.
The goal set before us is being in that constant communion 'more and more' - taking every thought captive to the obedience of Christ - looking up and eating His Word.

It's not a mystery of "how to walk in the Spirit" - it's just our self-reliance that swings us into either legalism or easy-grace.

"Looking up" as Jesus constantly did - as a son looks onto his father - for guidance and to his father's words is not "works" - it's merely childlike or sheep-like Dependence.

The strife of Cain against Abel continues on -- though to follow HIS Example is so plainly written out for us about "dependence" -- but if we continue on being ignorant of HIS Dependent Example & keep on doing it our way [taking the credit [b]or[/b] the condemnation we feel] - we [i]will[/i] lose our Love.

1 John 4:17
Herein is our Love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as HE is, so are we in this world.

Know ye that the LORD He is God: it is He that hath made us, and not we ourselves; we are His people, and the sheep of His pasture.

So we thy people and sheep of Thy pasture will give Thee Thanks for ever: we will shew forth Thy praise to all generations. Amen! To Thy Glory.

Hi Brother. I know you are a peacable man, so I don't fear conversing with you.

This section of your first sentence isn't Scriptural to me - [i]"Praise God it is not my responsibility to be faithful.."[/i]

I did read the whole sentence but this segment is a statement in and of itself.
I see nothing of "obedience" in it - but the "confessing" part after the disobedience.

I see Philippians 2:13 in your post but not Philippians 2:12 that precedes it... just for one 'both/and' of our co-operative relationship with HIM.

Earlier today - off-line - I was trying to get some pictures into words and came up with this...
maybe you could look at it and see what I was seeing or not seeing ...

[b]Into HIS Image -

1 - Legalism = [i]us doing it alone.[/i] - vs - Easy Grace = [i]He'll do it all alone.[/i]

2 - Legalism = [i]thou shall not.[/i] - vs - Easy Grace = [i]nobody's perfect.[/i]

3 - Legalism = [i]I can and I did![/i] - vs - Easy Grace = [i]I can't and I don't have to.[/i]

What's wrong with this picture?[/b]

I perceive much confusion and strife here among some who are saints and others who are not, and some who may be, yet are caught here in this web.

Had hoped we wouldn't go into debating Calvinism vs anything other than, but I fear it has now.

This thread was mild compared to the one before it. :)

We were heading into a discussion on being conformed to HIS Image - 1 John 4:17 style - [i]beyond[/i] what some term as mere "obedience". To the "walking in the Spirit" addressed on the previous page.

The Last Days Overcomers are - I believe - going to be that step beyond mere obedience and will fulfill 1 John 4:17 in a way that we've only seen the likes of in the book of Acts and through the Apostles and first disciple's lives. Those Saints that Daniel spoke of.
We'll get there - HE said so.

Shalom to you & yours always!

These were just [i]some[/i] of the verses coming to mind for the Overcomers and these days and those to come -

[Knowing there are no divisions of chpts & vs ---]

[b]Hebrews 5:14 to Hebrews 6:1-3
But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who[i] by reason of use[/i] have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil. 'Therefore' leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God, of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment. And this will we do, if God permit. [/b]

[i]The Pressing-on, from mere "thou shall nots" to Living Sacrifices, willingly being poured out like a drink offering -[/i]

[b]Romans 12

1 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.

2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

4 For as we have many members in one body, and all members have not the same office:

5 So we, being many, are one body in Christ, and every one members one of another.

6 Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us, whether prophecy, let us prophesy according to the proportion of faith;

7 Or ministry, let us wait on our ministering: or he that teacheth, on teaching;

8 Or he that exhorteth, on exhortation: he that giveth, let him do it with simplicity; he that ruleth, with diligence; he that sheweth mercy, with cheerfulness.

9 Let love be without dissimulation. Abhor that which is evil; cleave to that which is good.

10 Be kindly affectioned one to another with brotherly love; in honour preferring one another;

11 Not slothful in business; fervent in spirit; serving the Lord;

12 Rejoicing in hope; patient in tribulation; continuing instant in prayer;

13 Distributing to the necessity of saints; given to hospitality.

14 Bless them which persecute you: bless, and curse not.

15 Rejoice with them that do rejoice, and weep with them that weep.

16 Be of the same mind one toward another. Mind not high things, but condescend to men of low estate. Be not wise in your own conceits.

17 Recompense to no man evil for evil. Provide things honest in the sight of all men.

18 If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.

19 Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.

20 Therefore if thine enemy hunger, feed him; if he thirst, give him drink: for in so doing thou shalt heap coals of fire on his head.

21 Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good.[/b]

Yes - thinking of 24/7 "Jesus Freaks" and if we've counted the cost - Alleluia!!

Amen!

Revelation 21:3-7

"And I heard a Great Voice out of Heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people, and God Himself shall be with them, and be their God. And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away. And He that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And He said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful. And He said unto me, It is done. I Am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.

He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his GOD, and he shall be my son."

Could we put this thread on re-wind back to page 2 where "walking in the spirit" and Romans 8 was being discussed and step beyond just our Salvation and cesstation of "known" sin and as the verses Hebrews 5:14 to Hebrews 6:1-3 move on to the meat of the Apostles teaching as seen in 1 John 4:17 or Paul's heart of desiring to be poured out as a drink offering and being able to say "follow me as I follow Christ".

Who here thinks HIS thoughts, directly from HIM spontaneously and speaks the very words from HIM at that second and has no thought of themselves, nor of competition with others nor thoughts of Self at all?

That's how Jesus was and where He's trying to bring us.

HE needs our co-operation though. This we can see in Romans 8 again...

[b] Romans 8:28,29 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose, 'for' whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.[/b]

When you are wronged by someone - get a flat tire - your boss yells at you - you spouse rejects you - your mother-in-law slanders you - any possible scenario in the negative that can happen in a day --- do you see that as HIM squeezing what is Truly Inside of you out to conform you to HIS Image or do you react towards "protecting self".
How many minutes of the day are spent on "self". Entertaining self - pampering self - thoughts of what self wants to do or not do - what self wants to do tomorrow or next week, etc..

HE was "self-less". HE only listened to The Father - FOR others.

His words and thoughts and actions were not HIS Own - He said!

Are we there yet? Do we realize that "all things" that we have assumed were for OUR "good" were not the "good" that we assumed - but to get "us" out of "us"?

Bringing my thoughts back to how are we getting the understanding of getting beyond the "us" of our Salvation and moving into that deeper water of the Example given us By HIM of a totally Self-Sacrificial Life - where none of it is us or for us or about us or from us - but being "as HE was in this world" ?

The scrunched up doodling I played with yesterday - regarding us going into that SELF-Less life into HIS very Image, I'll put below again.

Will we continue to run on our own intellects, emotions or on Divine Inspiration - and eat the whole of His Word on this topic, is all I'm trying to get a hold of. Beyond the Salvation verses - beyond cessation of known sin and onto "walking in the spirit" or .....

[b]Into HIS Image - [/b]

1 - Legalism = [i]us doing it alone.[/i] - vs - Easy Grace = [i]He'll do it all alone.[/i]

2 - Legalism = [i]thou shall not.[/i] - vs - Easy Grace = [i]nobody's perfect.[/i]

3 - Legalism = [i]I can and I did![/i] - vs - Easy Grace = [i]I can't and I don't have to.[/i]

What's wrong with this picture?

To Jesus-is-God:

I see your replied to first post. However, as usual, you never answered with Scripture to what has specfically been posted.

I posted the following, that remains unchallenged by your volumnous posts:

[b]It is plainly taught in Scripture that Jesus partook of human flesh without partaking of the effect of Adam’s blood. :

Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; (Hebrews 2:14)

You will notice that the “children” that is, the human children, are said to be partakers of flesh and blood, and then, speaking of Jesus, this verse says that He himself likewise took part of the same. The word “took part” as applying to Christ is an entirely different word from “partakers” as applied to the children. In the margin of my bible, I read that the word translated, “took part” implies “taking part in something outside one’s self.” The Greek word for partakers if KOYNONEHO and means “to share fully,” so that all of Adam’s children share fully in Adam’s flesh and blood. When we read that Jesus “took part of the same” the word METECHO which means “to take part but not all.” The children take both flesh and blood of Adam but Christ took only part, that is, the flesh part, whereas the blood was the result of supernatural conception.

Jesus was a perfect human being after the flesh. He was of the seed of David according to the flesh, but blood is that part of a man which is the divine addition. In the creation of man, Adam’s body was made from the dust of the earth, but God breathed into his nostrils the breath of life. Since life is in the blood, this act resulted in the formation of blood in Adam’s body, but the first Adam’s blood was corrupted and sin is in all mankind since God hath made of one blood all nations. In the last Adam and the second man, new and divine and sinless blood was produced in a body that was NOT the seed of Adam and by this resulted in the production of:

Divine Blood

Conception by the Holy Ghost was the only way the virgin birth could be accomplished. Mary nourished the body of Jesus and He became the seed of David according to the flesh. The Holy Spirit contributed the blood of Jesus. It is sinless blood. It is divine blood. It is precious blood, for there has never been any other like it. It is:

Innocent Blood

I have betrayed the innocent blood, Judas confessed in Matthew 27:4. Our Lord was innocent. He became like unto us in all things – sin only excepted; like unto us with one exception – instead of being conceived by a human father, He was conceived by a divine father. As a result, biologically, He had divine blood, sinless blood. Because this blood is sinless it is:

Incorruptible Blood

Sin made human blood corruptible. Soon after death decay sets in, and it begins in the blood. That is why meat must be drained well of its blood. That is why embalmers place the embalming fluid in the blood.[b]vid said that Jesus’ body should not see corruption. Though He was dead three days and three nights, His body did not corrupt. Because He was sinless they could not put Him to death but instead He laid down His life voluntarily that He might take it up again. He arose by His own power, because death had no claim on Him except the claim of other’s sin, and when that was paid –
Death cannot keep his prey-
Jesus, my Savior;
He tore the bars away –
Jesus, my Lord.
Up from the grave he arose,
With a mighty triumph o’er His foes.[/b]

Please respond by Scripture that refutes what is posted above, line by line, and verse by verse.

Jesus was the Messiah though the flesh of the line of Mary, and not the blood of the line of Mary. He was the perfect human, after the flesh of Mary, NOT THE BLOOD OF MARY.

Sincerely,

Walter

Jesus-is-GOD wrote:
"He learned obedience by what HE suffered"

"Tempted in all manners such as we, but without sin"

This teaching of "The Divine Blood" removes the Free-Will of Jesus and then we cannot use HIM as our example - because then we can say - "Of course I cannot live or be as HE was - HE had divine blood and I don't"

Regardless of who wrote it and I do respect Brother DeHaan - Jesus was as human in every respect as we are. He "emptied Himself" so as to be our example.
There is no example that HE had it "all over us" because HE was more advantaged than we'll ever be ... that would contradict far too many Scriptures.

It also contributes to "modern genetics theories" that there are certain "sins" that are inherent in a person's blood - which does away with freewill as well.

"...as usual..."

Have we been on another thread together?

I answered on page 1 - I won't take this to another level - the level that the other thread went to - that I wasn't on - but my second post on page one answered you.

I still am praying for you to enjoy His Peace and His Love.

Some Scriptures from Paul that were going through my mind yesterday - may seem like a lot here - but there are a lot more that maybe can post some other day.

I won't highlight or put any in bold print - I love Paul -

Phillipians 3:10 That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;

11 If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.

12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.

13 Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before,

14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.

15 Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you.

16 Nevertheless, whereto we have already attained, let us walk by the same rule, let us mind the same thing.

17 Brethren, be followers together of me, and mark them which walk so as ye have us for an ensample.

18 (For many walk, of whom I have told you often, and now tell you even weeping, that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ:

19 Whose end is destruction, whose God is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame, who mind earthly things.)

________________________________________________

1 Corinthians 9:19 For though I be free from all men, yet have I made myself servant unto all, that I might gain the more.

20 And unto the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law;

21 To them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law.

22 To the weak became I as weak, that I might gain the weak: I am made all things to all men, that I might by all means save some.

23 And this I do for the gospel's sake, that I might be partaker thereof with you.

24 Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain.

25 And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.

26 I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air:

27 But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.

Matthew 11:12

12And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force.

One more try.

YES - Jesus' blood can be called "innocent & precious" but if by "divine" you mean that HE had more of an 'advantage' over us, in how HE walked before GOD in obedience - again I'd have to say no.

HE remains our Example by His life in every way.

Hebrews 2:16-17 - Hebrews 4-5 - Philippians 2:5-8

Romans 8:29

[b]From Walter to Jesus-is-God:

My post consisted of the following Scripture.
“14. Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same;” Hebrews 2:14.

My explanation of the Scripture that was quoted:

You will notice that the “children” that is, the human children, are said to be partakers of flesh and blood, and then, speaking of Jesus, this verse says that He himself likewise took part of the same. The word “took part” as applying to Christ is an entirely different word from “partakers” as applied to the children. In the margin of my bible, I read that the word translated, “took part” implies “taking part in something outside one’s self.” The Greek word for partakers if KOYNONEHO and means “to share fully,” so that all of Adam’s children share fully in Adam’s flesh and blood. When we read that Jesus “took part of the same” the word METECHO which means “to take part but not all.” The children take both flesh and blood of Adam but Christ took only part, that is, the flesh part, whereas the blood was the result of supernatural conception.

Scripture further states that the Jesus Christ was made of the seed of David according to the FLESH , not the BLOOD. At no time does it mention His Blood, only His flesh.

1.Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God, 2. (Which he had promised afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures,) 3. CONCERNING HIS SON JESUS CHRIST OUR LORD, WHICH WAS MADE OF THE SEED OF DAVID ACCORDING TO THE FLESH; 4. And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead: (Romans 1:1-7)

The Bible tells us that Jesus birth was a mystery. However, if we examine the Scripture, we can see that Christ’s flesh came from Mary, and Christ’s blood was supplied by God through the Holy Ghost at his conception.[/b]

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Jesus-is-God, your response to my post--about what type of blood flowed through Christ's veins, the blood of Adam, or the divine blood supplied by the Holy Ghost-- you posted the following (that is not supported by Scripture):

"Jesus is called the last Adam, because Adam was born "innocent - though with a freewill". Jesus also was born "innocent" [as the Lamb of GOD] because He was born of the Spirit but also with freewill.

He came to make a way out for us from what Adam had done. The mystery is not in the "blood" but in HIS Obedience, even to the Cross - as the Sacrificial Lamb. Yes, HE was/is GOD, but while in the flesh - HE took our form 100% and did not speak or work "without the Father, through the Spirit". He never acted on HIS own. He laid aside His Deity and again, became our example - of how to walk totally dependent on the Father - to teach us to not walk on our own.

The Blood type comes from 'both' mother and father. It is formed in "the marrow of the bones". That is why today, tests can be run to find both mother and father of a child - matching both - whereas in 1943 for Brother DeHann, this genetic testing was not available - though testing blood types was. But he should have known that the blood is formed in the marrow of the bones - which is from both parents.

The other important thing about the blood of Jesus, Who is to one Day sit on David’s throne (Luke 1:32-33), had He been begotten by Mary’s husband Joseph, who was of the line of Jeconiah (Matthew 1:12,16), it would have contradicted this divine prediction but the physical descent of Jesus from David came through Mary, whose genealogy is traced to David through Nathan rather than through Solomon (cp. Luke 3:31 with Matthew 1:17).

Jesus came through the line of Mary, so that He fulfilled the OT prophecies of coming from David’s blood line. If Jesus’ blood is “God’s blood”, then Jesus could not be the Messiah prophesied in the O.T., because He could not have fulfilled those prophecies.

Catholicism and others believe this Divine blood theory and others like it - such as "Claiming the blood" in spiritual warfare and other excesses."

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
[b]
Walter Continues:
In my previous post, I asked you to respond by Scripture, and you pointed me to what you posted previously. This is it, nothing more than words and opinions, nothing more than hot air if it is not supported, if it is NOT BASED ON SCRIPTURE.

Please sir, respond with Scripture that supports your position--- that the blood in the veins of Jesus Christ was the same kind of blood found in Adam, the man of original sin!

Sincerely,

Walter[/b]

Jesus-is-GOD wrote:

"...as usual..."

Have we been on another thread together?

I answered on page 1 - I won't take this to another level - the level that the other thread went to - that I wasn't on - but my second post on page one answered you.

I still am praying for you to enjoy His Peace and His Love.

Hi Walter -

You left off part of my post from page 1

These others may explain better & further -

http://www.spurgeon.org/~phil/articles/blood.htm

http://home.sprynet.com/~eagreen/blood.html

http://www.christinyou.net/pages/bloodofchrist.html

Romans 8:29

And it appears that you missed my post just above yours here - so I'll post it again here ...

by Jesus-is-GOD on 2009/3/17 20:01:03

One more try.

YES - Jesus' blood can be called "innocent & precious" but if by "divine" you mean that HE had more of an 'advantage' over us, in how HE walked before GOD in obedience - again I'd have to say no.

HE remains our Example by His life in every way.

Hebrews 2:16-17 - Hebrews 4-5 - Philippians 2:5-8

Romans 8:29

GOD Bless HIS Saints ~

This was very good today - posted by SermonIndex -

[url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=27963&forum=45&0]by Oswald Chambers[/url]

[b]Walter’s response to Christ-is-God[/b]

The Word of God, the Bible, says something entirely different than your posted opinions, that are not supported by Scripture!

God has something entirely different to say in His Word, the Bible, than the conclusions you have made about the Blood of Jesus Christ.

[b]In Hebrews Chapter 9:20 we find the following:
20.\tSaying, This is the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you.

Compare the words of Christ concerning the blood of the new covenant (Matthew 2:28) with those of Moses concerning the blood of the old covenant (Ex. 24:8)[/b]

[b]In Hebrews 9:22 we find[/b] : 22. And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.
[b]without the shedding of blood[/b].

[b][color=000000] Many liberal Christians, who support the newer Bible versions, and a growing number of evangelicals, who also support the newer Bible versions, argue that references to “the shedding of blood” are merely metaphorical, the essential point being that a sacrificial death has occurred. Thus, they say, it was Christ’s death for our sins that was the redemption price for our salvation, not His blood-which, after all, was just a fluid, no different after being shed than before.The fact is, however, that there are many ways in which a man (or a sacrificial animal may die, but mere death is not enough.[/color][/b][b][color=FF0000] “The life of the flesh is in the blood’ (Lev 17:11) and ”without the shedding of blood is no remission”. No other type of death could purchase our salvation. Therefore, we have redemption through his blood” (Ep 1:7), He ”made peace through the blood” (Col 1:20), He “washed us from our sins in his own blood” (Rev 1:5, and we are now justified “through faith in his blood” (Romans 3:25)[/color][/b]

[b]Hebrews 9:22 (continued) is no remission[/b] [b][color=FF0000]Thus, without the shedding of Christ’s blood, there can be no salvation. It is conceivable that He could have died in other ways, but remission of our sins required not His death, but death through the shedding of His precious blood (1 Peter 1:19)[/color][/b]

Hebrews 9:24 For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the[b] figures of the true; [/b]but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us:

9:24 [b]figures of the true[/b] The wilderness tabernacle and the temple in Jerusalem were only “figures of the true” tabernacle. The latter is not only a structure in heaven, but in a sense is “heaven itself”

9:24 [b]now to appear[/b]
[b]There are three different “appearings” of Christ mentioned in Hebrews, using three different Greek words. Hebrews 9:26 speaks of the past appearing, when He appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself,” Hebrews 9:28 speaks of His future appearing, when He shall “appear the second time without sin unto salvation.” His present appearance, however, in is “heaven itself,” where He “ever liveth to make intercession for them. (Hebrews 7:25)

9:28 bear[/b] [b][color=FF0000]“Bear here is the same word as “offer up’ in Hebrews 7:27. Christ not only bore the penalty of our sins on the cross, but also offered up His sacrificial blood to the Father as proof--contrast: (Heb 9:24-25). Israel’s high priest offered up the blood of animals as an atonement for sins. Our High Priest offered up Himself.[/color][/b]

9:28 [b]look for him[/b] To “look for Him” means to expectantly wait for Him, knowing that He might come at any time. There is nothing is the whole scope of prophesized events in the last days that must be fulfilled before He comes. Many of these events could happen before His return, but none[b] must [/b]happen. We should “look for Him” everyday and “love His appearing” (2 Ti 4:8)

10:5 [b] he saith[/b] Hebrews 10:5-7 (supplemented by another quotation in 10:8-10) is an interpretive quotation from Psalm 40:6-8 confirming that the Psalm 40 is an important messianic psalm, probably depicting the thoughts of Christ as He was hanging on the cross.

10:5 [b]a body[/b]. ‘Mine ears has thou opened” (Ps 40:6) is here translated as “a body hast thou prepared me”. The openings in the ear of an indentured servant (see Ex. 21:6) indicated the intent of that servant to serve his master forever, as it were, hearing onlyt the voice of his master and doing only his will. This was a type of Christ, who willingly became a bondservant (Ph 2:5-8), willing even to die in accord with His Father’s will. But before He could do this, He had to have a human body, with human ears.

10:5 [b]prepared me[/b] The word [b]prepared[/b] [b][color=FF0000]here (Greek Kataritzo) is the same word translated “framed” in Hebrews 11:3. That is, God formed the human body of His Son with the same mighty power and wisdom with which He had formed the universe. This can only mean that the body of Jesus, like that of Adam, was a special creation, not formed by the normal process of genetic inheritance.[/color][/b]

Heb 10:6 [b]sacrifices for sin[/b] Compare (Psalm 51:16-19) and (Micah 6:7-8)

10:7 [b]the book[/b] The book of God had been written in heaven long before it was transmitted to men on earth, and this certainly included God’s great plan of redemption. Note Psalm 119:89; 139:16; then also 1 Peter 1:18-20; Revelation 13:8

10:7 [b]thy will[/b] The Lord Jesus Christ frequently confirmed the fact that He had come into the world specifically to do the will of His Father (Jo 4:34; 5:30; 6:38)

10:12 [b]sat down[/b] The high priests in Israel could never be seated while ministering (10:11), for their work was never finished. They could only enter the most holy place once each year, but Christ sat down at God’s right hand after offering one sacrifice for sins forever.

10:13 [b]footstool[/b] this refers to the promise of Psalm 110:1 which also speaks of Christ as “of the order of Melchisedec.”

10:16 [b]saith the Lord[/b] Again citing Jeremiah 31:33-34.

10:17 [b]remember no more[/b] There is a remarkable illustration of this divine “loss of memory” in chapter 11 of Hebrews. It recounts the great works of faith of Noah, Abraham, Moses, David, Samson, and many others, but never mentions any of their sins. “As far as the east is from the west, so far hath he removed our transgressions from us” (Ps 103:12). See (Micah 7:19)

10:19 [b]boldness to enter[/b]. Because of what Christ has done for us, we can come boldly (certainly not ARROGANTLY or PRESUMPTOUSLY, however) into God’s presence in prayer (Hebrews 4:16) & (Ephesian 3:12) We can also have confidence (same Greek waod as “boldness”) in witnessing for Christ (Acts 4:29, 31).

Sincerely,

Walter
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Christ-is-God said:
Jesus is called the last Adam, because Adam was born "innocent - though with a freewill". Jesus also was born "innocent" [as the Lamb of GOD] because He was born of the Spirit but also with freewill.

He came to make a way out for us from what Adam had done. The mystery is not in the "blood" but in HIS Obedience, even to the Cross - as the Sacrificial Lamb. Yes, HE was/is GOD, but while in the flesh - HE took our form 100% and did not speak or work "without the Father, through the Spirit". He never acted on HIS own. He laid aside His Deity and again, became our example - of how to walk totally dependent on the Father - to teach us to not walk on our own.

The Blood type comes from 'both' mother and father. It is formed in "the marrow of the bones". That is why today, tests can be run to find both mother and father of a child - matching both - whereas in 1943 for Brother DeHann, this genetic testing was not available - though testing blood types was. But he should have known that the blood is formed in the marrow of the bones - which is from both parents.

The other important thing about the blood of Jesus, Who is to one Day sit on David’s throne (Luke 1:32-33), had He been begotten by Mary’s husband Joseph, who was of the line of Jeconiah (Matthew 1:12,16), it would have contradicted this divine prediction but the physical descent of Jesus from David came through Mary, whose genealogy is traced to David through Nathan rather than through Solomon (cp. Luke 3:31 with Matthew 1:17).

Jesus came through the line of Mary, so that He fulfilled the OT prophecies of coming from David’s blood line. If Jesus’ blood is “God’s blood”, then Jesus could not be the Messiah prophesied in the O.T., because He could not have fulfilled those prophecies.

Catholicism and others believe this Divine blood theory and others like it - such as "Claiming the blood" in spiritual warfare and other excesses.

These others may explain better & further -

http://www.spurgeon.org/~phil/articles/blood.htm

http://home.sprynet.com/~eagreen/blood.html

http://www.christinyou.net/pages/bloodofchrist.html

Romans 8:29

Brother Walter, I LOVE Apologetics as much as the prophetic, but right off the bat I'm going to tell you that you have me all wrong and what I post all wrong.

I watched the "1 John 1:8" thread and felt 'that' should stay between you brothers.

I did notice your temper.

The "only" reason I came unto this thread was to expose the lie of the "Divine blood" heresy.

I do not see where you have exegeted [b]Hebrews 2:16,17[/b] - nonetheless Hebrews 4 & 5 nor the verse from Phillippians nor ANY that I've posted thus far.

You choose to believe in the "divine blood" theory because it gets you off the hook on obedience to HIS Example to "us"....
which was to stop all of our own thinking, planning, trying to follow HIM in our 'flesh', intellect, emotions and to "look up" as HE did --- Taking that Minute [or howeverlong] to ASK GOD for wisdom for "THIS" second --- walking "second by second" in Complete Dependence on God The Father - Through The Son - By HIS Spirit to guide, teach, lead and so forth - AS HE DID.
[again, not yelling but emphasis]

THAT has been my reply in every post since page one. I have no anger toward you at all and would love to continue to post with you but won't be able to.

Why is that so hard for you to see other's posts? I'm praying for you Brother. I call you Brother because I believe you are a Brother ... but just a Brother with an anger issue that needs to come under HIS control... by you surrendering your will to HIM or HIS.

I also am your SISTER.

Because I am a sister - I prefer not to get involved in certain threads - I don't "teach" - I "exhort" my fellow believers whenever possible to be Brave - Strong in HIM ALONE - and to be wholly and totally dependent on HIM as HE was on The Father, through His Spirit while here - setting that Example for us, in the flesh.

JESUS IS GOD !!!

THAT is our Foundation.

On that our futures stand - with 'that' understanding.

That Creator GOD was on that Cross dying for you.

That Creator GOD 'fully' took our form, to show us HOW to "look up to HIM" for Everything ... for as HE said .... "Without ME - YOU can Do NOTHING." ......... just as HE DID NOTHING without The Father by The Spirit, while here in the flesh, "fleshing it out", so to speak, [i]for "us".[/i]

Rather than teach Brother - maybe for now it wouldn't hurt if you were taught by other Brothers.

I can recommend that maybe we all - myself included always - to look at our Foundation - which is GOD - The Triune GODHEAD.

We "need" to start there - because if THAT Foundation is off - everything else that you or I try to build on any 'off' foundation will be 'off'.

Here's a reasonably good site for that - though there are many -

http://www.christinyou.net/pages/3divineonenesses.html

I will bow out of this conversation now, for three reasons. Number One - I am a female. [1 Timothy 2:12]
Number Two - [1 John about Love.]
Number Three - your temper scares me. [3 places in Proverbs.]

Again - I still am praying for you to enjoy His Peace and His Love.

Double Shalom with His Love to you from Him.

To Jesus-Is-God:

You mistake my love and defense for God’s Word as "anger", or "temper".

Your position that Jesus Christ has the same blood in His veins as Adam had is blasphemous, and is not taught in the Bible, and is hence false doctrine.

Your position that once the believer is saved, he never has to be on his face, in prayer, asking for forgiveness of his/her sins is also blasphemous and is false doctrine.

Jesus Christ was sinless, His entire life, from the cradle to the grave. That means that he never sinned once, by thought or deed. No human being, other than Jesus Christ, the God Man, with the blood of the Holy Spirit in his veins, can make that claim.

[b]I provided some links to Paul Washer, and asked that you respond to them. You never responded, so I will post them again.[/b]

I ask that you compare your doctrine, that you hold so dear, to that of Paul Washer. The Christian is saved through the blood of Jesus Christ. Once he is saved, to continue with his Christian walk, to continue in relationship with God & Christ, he is instructed to confess his sins on a daily basis, and He, who is faithful and just will forgive his sins.

Today, the Christian is calling out and praying for revival, but it is no where to be found. Today, the Christian is calling out for holiness, but again, it is no where to be found.

[b]Today, the Christian believer is full of himself, and is full of his own flesh, and is of no use for Jesus Christ. He is so “puffed up” he refuses to humble himself in the eyes of the Lord. He is more concerned about signs and wonders, and miracle healings, than he is with a personal relationship with God Almighty. In order to have this personal relationship, this personal walk, it is a requirement that the believer crucify himself daily, to step down off the throne in his heart, and give it to Jesus Christ, and at the same time take Christ’s place on the cross. That is the only way that Christ can ever use us, if we empty ourselves of our flesh.

These are the videos of Paul Washer. I challenge you again, as I did before, to compare your doctrine to what is presented below. Please, do respond, and lay it out side by side, like I have tried to do in my various posts with you and your "supporters":[/b]

http://media.sermonindex.net/14/SID14097.mp3
2n message- Biblical Assurance

http://media.sermonindex.net/14/SID14098.mp3
3rd message- Biblical Assurance

http://media.sermonindex.net/14/SID14098.mp3
4th message- Biblical Assurance

http://media.sermonindex.net/14/SID14101.mp3
5th message-- Biblical Assurance

Sincerely,

Walter

Walter, you are not speaking the truth of what's been posted. That's not healthy and you are not fighting for 'truth' but because you have a need to fight - for some reason.
You could have stayed on the "1 John 1:8" thread and made peace with the Brethren there, rather than start another, where again your anger comes out and the accusations are not appropriate.
The whole of my posts are on this thread.
Please understand that I do not want to continue with you, because no matter how we word things, you twist words and love sarcasm. That won't stop me from praying for you to find His peace, sincerely.

Hebrews 2:16-17

16For verily he took not on him the nature of angels;

[b]but he took on him the seed of Abraham.[/b]

17 [b]Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren[/b], that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Philippians 2:5-8 (King James Version)

5Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:

6Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:

7But made himself of no reputation,[b] and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:

8And being found in fashion as a man[/b], he humbled himself, and [b]became[/b] obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

... these were just two of the verses I posted.

If we say that the sin nature is "in the blood" we've missed something.

"Life" is in the blood but the "sin nature" is not said to be in the blood.

Adam was born innocent with a freewill but sinned.

Jesus, "the last Adam" was born innocent with a freewill as well - but HE lived in complete obedience, so that we can inherit His Nature now - not His blood in ours.

If we give Him "divine blood" than He cannot be our Example of obedience and the walk of dependence on GOD that HE displayed and we'll have that as our excuse for not "walking in the Spirit" as He did for our example.

I don't believe these articles I posted have been read neither.

Just in case anyone may consider reading more - I'll repost those links and the cross-references to the two Scriptures above can be seen in Hebrews 4-5 and elsewhere.

John MacCarther explains that it was the Death of Christ that is being signified when the Word speaks of His Blood being poured out - as the sacrifial Lamb and not for any mystical properties nor Divine - but of the Davidic to Abrahamic seed/bloodline, that gave Him no "advantage" over us in "obedience" to whatever the Father asked of Him - as our Example.

http://www.spurgeon.org/~phil/articles/blood.htm

http://home.sprynet.com/~eagreen/blood.html

http://www.christinyou.net/pages/bloodofchrist.html

http://www.christinyou.net/pages/3divineonenesses.html

Romans 8:29

I normally don't stay with a topic but this one is so important to our "walk".

Adam had neither mother nor father - so who's blood did [i]he[/i] have? The WORD of GOD tells us Jesus' lineage and "who's seed" He was born into, by GOD - to fulfill countless Prophesies of the O.T.. The seed of the woman.

Yes Jesus was fully GOD and Fully man - but there were no Divine properties in His Blood that affects "natures". The nature is not in the blood - but in Adam's choices and all mankind suffered and then Jesus' freewill choices - lest He could never be our Example, in all things, nor could we understand our compassionate High Priest in Hebrews.

Was reading other articles from this site while downloading e-sword and found this other.
Hope it helps.
GOD Bless!

http://www.christinyou.net/pages/bloodchrst.html

To Jesus-is-God, et al:

Below, in Scripture, in the book of Hebrews, you will find who and what Jesus Christ is. He is God incarnate, “Immanuel”, God with us. Born supernaturally by a virgin, impregnated by the Holy Ghost. The “Holy One” within the womb of Mary. A man without sin from the beginning. Entirely God, and entirely man, “the Son of Man” while He lived here on this earth with us.

[b]Please, compare this JESUS CHIRST, as described in the Book of Hebrews, found in the Protestant Bible of the Reformation, the Received Text, the King James Bible, that was passed down from the beginning by the believing Church to the "jesus" that you and your “supporters” have posted here, about who you think Jesus is, and your equality with Him.

As believers, we are merely son's of God, and that will only be ACCOMPLISHED at the rapture. "Flesh and blood CANNOT inherit the Kingdom of God". Right now, those that truly believe are being sanctified, waiting for the day, at the rapture, when we can be like Him. However, He is God, and we will be His sons, hidden with Christ in God (Col 3:3)[/b]

Psalm 51:5 tells us about King David, God's Anointed- a sinner, with the sin nature inherited from Adam flowing through his veins. :

5.\tBehold, I was shapen in iniquity; and in sin did my mother conceive me.

Psalms 71:22 tells us of [b]Jesus Christ, the Holy One of Israel:[/b]

22.I will also praise thee with the psaltery, even thy truth, O my God: unto thee will I sing with the harp, [b]O thou Holy one of Israel.[/b]

Sincerely,

Walter

[b]Hebrews[/b]

1.1[b]divers manners[/b] The Old Testament Scriptures were all from God, but He used many different writers over the ages and different manners of inspiration to write them. Whatever method was used, however-whether direct dictation or special revelation or the individual knowledge and ability of the writer- all were so guided and illuminated by the Holy Spirit that the words finally written down were as through spoken by God Himself- Spirit breathed Words directly from God.

1:2 [b]by his Son[/b] God spoke intermittently and partially by the Old Testament prophets, but finally and fully by His Son through the apostles (Heb 2:3)

1.2[b]heir of all things[/b] As Romans 8:17 tells us:” 17. And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.”-[b]joint heirs[/b] The Son has been given all the nations and the uttermost parts of the earth for “thine inheritance” (Psalm 2:8) He created all things and is “appointed heir of all things (Hebrews 1:2) This is a portion of what it means for us to be adopted children and thus to share His inheritance. See also (Ephesians 1:11, 14:1) (1 Peter 1:4)

1.2[b]Made the worlds[/b] The Son is the Creator of all things (John 1:1-3; Ephesians 3:9; Col 1:16). Here it notes that Christ created the “space/time” cosmos. He is Creator of time, as well as space and matter, thus beautifully reflecting the scientific concept of the universe as space/matter/time continuum.

1.3[b]brightness of his glory[/b] “Brightness” is from a Greek word used only here in the New Testament, literally meaning “off-flashing”. In cntext of both passage and modern astronomy, it couild well be understood as “radiation.” As the “express image” of the Father, the Son of God is alalogous to the life-giving rays from the sum. Just as the Father dwells “in the light which no man can approach unto (1 Tim 6:16), so can no man gaze long at the sun without being blinded. Yet, physically speaking, as the sun’s radiation provides both light and life to the world, so the Son is spiritually both the “light of the world” (John 1:14; 14:6; Acts 17:28)

1.3[b]Word of his power[/b] The eternal Son created all things by His omnipotent Word (Heb 11:3) (Psalm 33:6) and is now “upholding all things by the word of His power.” Note the remarkable relationship here between “things” and “power”, or in modern scientific jargon, between mass and energy. The atomic structure of our very bodies is being held together (or “sustained”) by mysterious nuclear forces or binding energies that keep the atoms from disintegrating into chaos.

1:3[b]by himself[/b]
The purging of our sins was accomplished solely “by himself;”, we have contributed nothing whatever to His great work of saving our souls.

1:3[b]right hand[/b] Out of the 21 references to Christ being at the right hand of the Father (the first being in Psalm 16:8), five occur in Hebrews (1:3, 13; 8:1; 10:12; 12:2)

1:4 [b]being made[/b] The Son, by His essential deity, is acknowledged as “Being” (Heb 1:3), but in His perfect humanity, He was “Being made.” He created all the angels, when He became man, He was made “a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death” (Heb 2:9), but now, having been “appointed heir of all things” Heb 1:2) in His glorified humanity, He is forever better than angels, even in His humanity.

1:5 [b]said he[/b] This is the first of at least 40 quotations in Hebrews from the Old Testament Scriptures. A perennial objection of the Jews has been that God has no Son, since He is one God (Deut 6:4), so the writer begins by showing their own Scriptures prove God to be both Father and Son. This particular reference is from Psalm 2:7, referring to God’s Son and also to His coming resurrection as the first begotten from the dead (Acts 13:33, Col 1:18)

1:6[b]and again[/b] this reference to the coming Son is from 2 Samuel 7:14. The terms of that particular promise to David had an initial fulfillment in Solomon, but its eternal terms could apply only to the coming Messiah.

1:6 [b]he saith[/b]From Psalm 97:7, where the angels are called “gods.” In the psalm, the “gods” are evidently fallen angels who have promoted pagan worship of themselves. However, its citation in Hebrews indicates that all angels, whether faithful or fallen, are commanded to worship the true God of creation, which means, essentially, to bow down to the will of God.

1:7 [b]he saith[/b] This passage is quoted from Psalm 104:4, the great psalm of creation, providence, and the flood. The angels were created as spirits, evidentially immediately after the creation of the universe, they have not existed from eternity. As the next verses assert, however, the Soan has been forever. Note again Hebrews 1: and Psalm 2:27, “Thou art my Son…”This prophecy was given a thousand years before the Son became man, yet He already was the Son.

1:8[b]unto the Son[/b] Christ is the Son of God[b] by resurrection[/b] (Heb 1:5a; Acts 13:33; Romans 1:4); [b]human generation[/b](Heb 1:5)& (Luke 1:33); [b]and inheritance[/b] (Hebrews 1:2; 1:13). In contrast to the eternal Son, angels are the sons of God by special creation (Job 38:7; Psalms 104:4-5)

1:8[b]he saith[/b] See (Psalms 45:6-7)

1:9 [b]God, even thy God[/b] The testimony of Psalms 45:6-7 as quoted here is clearly messianic; it is both addressed to God (note “thy throne, O God”—Heb 1:8) abd spoken about God (God hath anointed thee….”)…One person of the Godhead is speaking to another person of the Godhead.

1:12[b]thou art the same[/b] Although His creation is now decaying, the Creator and His Word remain the same forever (Heb 13:8; Matt 24:35; 1 Peter 1:24-25)

1:13[b]Sit on my right hand[/b] See Psalms 110:1. There are five references in Hebrews to Christ, the Son of God, at the right hand of God (Heb 1:3, 13; 8:1; 10:12; 12:2)

2:7[b]Lower than the Angels[/b] See also Hebrews 2:9.[b] The Son of God became Jesus, Son of man,by divine incarnation (Heb 2:14-16). He who was “ better than the angels” (Heb 1:4) was made a “little [that is, “for a little time”—33 years] lower than the angels. He who was the divine Word became Flesh (John 1:14); He who was “equal with God” became “a servant” (Philippians 2:7)[/b]

2.7 [b]glory and honor[/b] He was “obedient unto death” in His incarnation; therefore He has been given the “name which is above every name’ (Philippians 2:8-9)

2:8 [b]under his feet[/b] Even the angels are to be in subjection to man (Heb 1:4, 2:8; 1 Cor 6:3). The first man, Adam, was given dominion over the earth and all its creatures (Genesis 1:26-28) but sin intervened and it remains for the Son of Man, the last Adam (1 Co 15:45), to regain man’s lost dominion.

2:8 [b]all in subjection[/b] Jesus, as the perfect man and as Son of man, at times even during His first coming exercised His future dominion over the earth (Matthew 17:27) & (Mark 4:41). This was just a prophetic foreshadowing and evidence that He will exercise man’s dominion in all its fullness in the age to come. First, however, He had to purge our sins and eventually remove the great curse from the earth.

2:9[b]for every man[/b] Note that Jesus did not die merely for “the sin of the world” (John 1:29), but for [b]”every man individually[/b] Furthermore, as Paul says, Christ “loved me, and gave himself for me” (Galatians 2:20)

2:10[b]all things[/b] Compare Hebrews 1:1-3; Romans 11:36; Colossians 1:16-20

2:10 [b]captain of their salvation[/b] “Captain (Greek archegos) is translated “prince in Acts 3:15 and 5:31 and [b] “author”[/b] in Hebrews 12:2, speaking of Christ in all cases. These are its only occurrences. Thus, He is the [b]”Prince of Life”, the “Captain of our Salvation” and the “author…of our faith”[/b]

2:10 [b][color=990000]perfect through sufferings[/b] How could the holy God be “made perfect”? The answer is that, if He would also be perfect man, He must learn obedience to the will of the Father and true obedience can only be tested if it involves suffering. See (Hebrews 5:8-9)[/color][/b]

2:11 [b]sanctified[/b] For "sanctified”, read “being sanctified”.

2:12[b]Saying[/b] Here the writer quotes from Psalm 22:22 at the prophetic description of the very climax of Christ’s crucifixion sufferings.

2:12 [b]midst of the church[/b] In the Hebrew scriptures, this word is “congregation”. Thus, the little “congregation” at the foot of the cross, consisting of John and Mary and the other women, is called here a church (compare Matthew 18:17-20)

2:13 [b]again[/b] Apparently these two references are referring to Isaiah 8:17-18

2:14 [b]the devil[/b] the devil has “the power of death” in the sense that, through his first lie (continuing today in many forms of humanism and anti-theism), he tempted Adam to bring sin into the world, and therefore death into the world (Romans 5:12). He would seek to impose physical death on the whole human race if he could, although he can only bring about a particular death when God allows it some greater purpose (1 Cor 5:5) & (Job 2:4-6)

2:15 [b]deliver them[/b] Satan may have thought he had gained victory over God when God’s Son died on the cross, but that very death assured his ultimate destruction (Col 2:14-15) & (Rev 1:18)

2:15 [b]fear of death[/b] The redeemed child of God no longer nees to fear death, for to him “to die is gain” (Phil 1:21, Phil 1:23, 1 Thes 4:13)

2:15 [b]to bondage[/b] This pertains to our deliverance from spiritual bondage. See also (Romans 7:23-25) & ( Romans 8:15)

2:16 [b]seed of Abraham[/b][b][color=990000] Christ “took on him the seed of Abraham” by taking up residence for nine months in the womb of Mary, who was truly Abraham’s seed. Inherent sin and genetic defects, however, had been transferred through Abraham’s seed (originally from Adam and Eve) to all his descendents, including Mary, and they could not have been incorporated in ”that holy thing” created and placed in her body, for He must be “without blemish and without spot” in order to qualify as our Savior from sin. (see Luke 1:35 holy thing- it is striking that the embryonic Jesus in Mary’s womb must be called ”that holy thing”—not “the babe” or “the child” or something else. There is no human word to fit. Actually the word thing is not in the original—just “the holy”, or perhaps “the holy [one]”. See also Romans 1:3 & 1 Peter 1:19[/color][/b]

2:17 [b]like unto his brethren[/b] Christ had to be a true man in all points, from conception to death,[b][color=990000] apart from innate sin. This required a miraculous, virginal conception, but in every other respect he partook of true human flesh.[/color][/b]

2:17 [b]high priest[/b] This is the first specific reference to Christ as our High Priest, a theme which is prominent throughout the rest of Hebrews.

2:18 [b]tempted[/b][b][color=990000] In His humanity, JESUS WAS TESTED IN ALL POINTS LIKE WE ARE, EXCEPT FOR SIN. This does not mean that He was tempted to commit all kinds of sins, but rather that He was tested and proved in every way. He could not have actually sinned because: 1. He is God, and “God cannot be tempted with evil (James 1:13); 2) He is “the same yesterday, today and forever (Heb 13:8), so that, even in His humanity He did not cease to be God; 3) because of His miraculous conception, He had no innate sin, so that "IN HIM IS NO SIN” (1 John 3:5); 4) He did not need, as other men, to be converted, telling Nicodemius, ye must be born again (John 3:7)—not “we” or “they”. 5) God cannot fail in His creative purpose because He is both omniscient and omnipresent; if Jesus had sinned, salvation would have been impossible, and the Creator would have been defeated by Satan, a mere creature; this could not have been possible. He knew (as did His Father) that He could not sin, but men and angels did not know this until it had been demonstrated to them. That is why He had to be tested as proof positive.[/color][/b]

3:1 [b]Apostle[/b] this is the only time that Christ is called an apostle (meaning literall “one who is sent”). He was sent by the Father as the Apostle of our profession (John 27:18) & John 20:21)

3:1 [b] High Priest[/b] As an Apostle, Christ represents God to man; as our High Priest, He represents man to God.

3:4 [b]built all things[/b] From Hebrews 3:3 it is evident that Christ is the Builder of the cosmic house; from this verse, therefore, it follows that Christ is God. He is the one who created and made all things (John 1:3; Col 1:16)

3:7 [b]Holy Ghost saith[/b] Psalm 95-7-11 is under discussion in the section from Hebrews 3:7 through Hebrews 4:10, with the author drawing an analogy between the rebellious Israelites in the wilderness under Moses and the professing Jewish believers of his own day who were being tempted into Jewish legalism. Specifically he is quoting here (Heb 3:7-11) as an assertion of the Holy Spirit Himself. In Hebrews 4:7, he indicated that the author of the words was David, even though Psalm 95 carries no superscript of authorship (the same situation occurs when Psalms 2:1-2 is quoted in Acts 4:25-26). It is thus a significant characteristic of divine inspiration that a section of Scripture is attributed both to David and the Holy Spirit, even when the section seems officially anonymous.

3:9 [b]forty years[/b] It probably was no coincidence that God gave Israel 40 years to repent after Christ’s crucifixion before He sent the Roman army under Titus in A.D. 70 to destroy Jerusalem and its temple.

3:14 [b]partakers[/b] the word “partakers” in this verse is used in the sense of “fellows” or “partners.” Those who hold their confidence in Christ until the end demonstrate that they were true believers in Christ from the beginning, rather than shallow professors of faith without real understanding of commitment (see 1 John 2:19)

4:2 [b]the gospel[/b] The gospel is not just a New Testament revelation, for it was preached to the children of Israel in the wilderness, in types and prophecies at least. In fact, it is “the everlasting gospel” (Rev 14:6-7), and the first promise of redemption (Genesis 3:15) is commonly known as the “protovangel” (first gospel). In its essence, the gospel (good news) is the message that the Creator is also the Reedemer and coming King and that true faith in Him---faith which produces salvation—will also produce loving obedience to His Word.

4:2[b]mixed with faith[/b]It is vital to “hear” the Word, but then it is necessary to “believe” it as well (John 5:24) & (James 1:22)

Jesus-is-GOD wrote:
Was reading other articles from this site while downloading e-sword and found this other.
Hope it helps.
GOD Bless!

http://www.christinyou.net/pages/bloodchrst.html

Walter, you just proved again that you Do Not read anyone's posts. This is so sad. I'm not angry at you but I grieve for you cutting yourself by not attempting to understand your Brethren. That is a loss.

I won't teach - I'll just find Teachings by Brothers that will teach.

You are hitting on The Deity of Christ.

That is the 'one' Doctrine that I will defend to the death.

You are Again Mis-representing my posts and that borders now on Lying.

My 'only' difference with you has been on this Divine blood theory.

Jesus is and was Always GOD and you Know that I obviously believe that.

I have Never said that we are "equal" to HIM but have Repeatedly said that HE was our "Example" of how to walk this Christian walk. You have not understood the Scriptures posted on the previous page nor any other page - you'd rather fight - again - with anyone - me or any of the Brothers on the other thread. You are just contentious and insulting at any opportunity that you can find... and that is very very sad.

"HE IS OUR EXAMPLE" and you'll never rob me of that.

Please stop lying or misrepresenting my or anyone else's posts on JESUS -- for your own sake. You are becoming the accuser of the brethren with your mis-representations.
Read other's posts - please.

You have not read these that I've posted to your own loss - because again - you'd rather mis-represent other's posts by Not reading them At All.

http://www.christinyou.net/pages/3divineonenesses.html

http://www.christinyou.net/pages/bloodchrst.html

Here's another that I haven't posted yet, for your accusation that I claimed equality with Christ.

http://www.christinyou.net/pages/godandiareone.html

Did do you understand this Scripture that I posted on page 3?

[b]Revelation 21:3-7

"And I heard a Great Voice out of Heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people, and God Himself shall be with them, and be their God. And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away. And He that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And He said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful. And He said unto me, It is done. I Am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.

He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his GOD, and he shall be my son."[/b]

Love & Truth is essential for Salvation. Not loving the Brethren and not speaking the truth about what they've said is lying. Please be careful for your own sake.

Maybe this will be of more help to your understanding - The verses I gave toward the end of the previous page -

Please allow Wesley, Mathew Henry, Etc to explain these to you -

[b]Hebrews 2:16-17[/b]

16For verily he took not on him the nature of angels;

[b]but he took on him the seed of Abraham. [/b]

http://bible.cc/hebrews/2-16.htm - it is important to know Why HE took the seed of Abraham.

17 [b]Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren,[/b] that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

http://bible.cc/hebrews/2-17.htm

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[b]Philippians 2:5-8 [/b]

5Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:

6Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:

7But made himself of no reputation, [b]and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: [/b]

http://bible.cc/philippians/2-7.htm

8[b]And being found in fashion as a man,[/b] he humbled himself, and [b]became obedient[/b] unto death, even the death of the cross.

http://bible.cc/philippians/2-8.htm

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A non-regenerated man's spirit is "dead". That is the "death" that Adam passed onto us - not his "blood".

When they are truly converted - "born-again" - their spirit is quickened and infilled with Christ's Spirit and are called New Creations.

GOD is Spirit - HE breathed life into Adam - Adam experienced 'spiritual' death at the fall.

We inherited that deadened spirit - that is why we need to be born-Again.

Before Ascending Jesus breathed The Spirit into His Disciples.

The sin nature is the 'spiritual death' from Adam.

Our New nature is our spirit's being quicken - made alive IN Christ and With Christ's Spirit.

There is no need to hold to the divine blood theory, when Scripture is very clear that HE was made "in fashion as a man."

"He was made in the likeness of men" through Abraham's seed - the seed of the woman - so that all O.T. Prophetic Scripture about Who He would be could be fulfilled.

[b] John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

[i]...of water and of the Spirit[/b] — A twofold explanation of the "new birth," so startling to Nicodemus. To a Jewish ecclesiastic, so familiar with the symbolical application of water, in every variety of way and form of expression, this language was fitted to show that the thing intended was no other than a thorough spiritual purification by the operation of the Holy Ghost. Indeed, element of water and operation of the Spirit are brought together in a glorious evangelical prediction of Ezekiel ( Ezekiel 36:25-27 ), which Nicodemus might have been reminded of had such spiritualities not been almost lost in the reigning formalism.[/i] [JFB]

Even Calvinists believe that there must be "obvious fruit" that a person has been truly regenerated - Born Anew.

To Jesus is God, et al:

My problem with your doctrine, sister, is that I have difficulty with it from a Biblical perspective. From your posts, it seems to me that you continue to:

1. Deny your/our sin nature inherited from Adam. Eventhough you and I have been saved by grace, we have inherited a "sin nature" from Adam & Eve. The sermon on the Mount gives us a crystal clear understanding about the depravity of the mind and heart of man- it is deceitfully wicked. We are indeed saved by grace, by faith alone, but we are ALL still a work in progress until the rapture.

[b]The Old Testament teaches us of the types of Sacrifices that were required to "cover" sin .

The first type of sin that had to be atoned for was for our sin nature, inherited from Adam.
This was a mandatory offering

The second type of sin offering that was mandatory was for a Trespass Guilt-offering for both known and unknown sin.
This was a mandatory offering[/b]

To be a Jew required the two sin offerings listed above- one for our sin nature, and one offering for both known and unknown sin. Without actually taking part in these two Sacrifices of Leviticus, you would be expelled from the camp (& later the nation of Israel),along with your wife and children.

The next 3 sacrifices were voluntary, and were a picture of a deeper, more committed walk with the Lord:

Burnt Offering
Meal Offering These were in unison

Peace Offering--for a thank, a vow or freewill offering

Once we are saved, all of our sin is forgiven, and we are not going to hell.[b] But, we still sin by throught or deed. And when we sin, we are required by God to pray to God for Forgiveness.[/b]

[b]This is what I see is missing from your Doctrine.[/b]

Christinyou, one of your "supporters" on these threads, continues to post scripture over and over, and will never engage in dialogue with who he is positng against or even explain his postion.[b] He just posts scripure, and scripture alone, and is seemingly quite happy to never, ever have to pray for forgiveness for anything. [/b]

[b]If that is NOT your doctrine, then I would expect you to clarify that IT is NOT your doctrine on these posts. I have never seen you make that statement.[/b]

The only way that we can continue our close, personal walk with the savior is to pray for forgiveness for our sin. Our sin gets less and less with time because we are more and more into His Word, we are being sanctified daily. But we will always have a sin nature until we are raptured, and get rid of our blood, and receive our new, glorified bodies, like Christ's body, and get rid of our corrupt flesh and blood.

How can two walk together,unless they be agreed?
Amos 3:3

[b]I am not "lying" about your position, nor the position of those that have posted in agreement with you on this site. I am pointing out the positions that I see from your various posts is heresy.[/b]

There is a radio Talk Show in California with [b]Bob George, who teaches the heresy of never having to pray for forgiveness after being saved.If you are in disagreement with Mr George in this matter, then please clarify your position. What is it?[/b]

1st John goes into detail about this requirement of praying to the Father. John is talking to Christian believers, who have already been saved-

1:4. And these things write we unto you, that your joy may be full. 5. This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all. 6. If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth: 7. But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
8.[b] If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
9. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
10. If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.[/b]

Additionally, the Blood of Christ was understood by the Protestant Body of Christ in my youth. We had many "Songs about the Blood" that we all sang and understood when I was a boy, through my 20's. Now, those songs have been ripped from the hymnals by the liberals that have taken over our Bible Colleges and Seminaries. Even Biola University has ripped the blood out of their teaching and hymnals.

[b]In conclusion, please clarify your position. You know mine, I have tried to it make it clear & uderstandable. Please, explain your position to the best of your ability. with your own words, without links to other sites or sermons.[/b]

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

For many years I attended a Church that supported Home Bible study. We met with eight other people for over 5 years and saw results in the power of prayer for healing an inoperable brain turmor, and other great healings. These men & women would pray for anything, but they refused the requirement to pray for their own sin. Not openly, in front of others, no, but privately to God, our Fahter. One of things that always troubled me was the Prophecy given by some. It was not always correct, it did not always come true. When I pointed out the Old Testament requirement that one mistaken prophecy would require stoning to death, they paid no attention and got upset. It ended up being filled with the flesh, and of no value. These men & women could not put up with the preaching of sin in the life of the believer at our Church. They were only interested in places of worship where they could show off their gifts. That, my dear, is what troubles me with what I perceive your doctrine to be.

[b]If it is not, then please clarify it specifically, in your own words. If I am wrong about my understanding of your doctrine, I will be more than happy to apolgize for any misunderstanding.[/b]

God bless,

Walter

Jesus-is-GOD wrote:
Walter, you just proved again that you Do Not DELETED
.

Hi again Walter, I'm having to answer in the same way again, which again is sad, but you again are Mis-representing my posts that are here on these pages for any other Brother to read.

As far as this Scripture that you posted ---

[b]8. If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
9. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
10. If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.[/b]

Had you read my posts quoting Paul - you would have Known that I truly know this by John as truth for us.

Where I am not agreeing with you Now, from your last post - is that "we STILL have" Adam's Fallen Nature.

No, that is not true of the truly Regenerate.

We just have and still have and always will have FREE-WILL to do with our minds, thoughts, actions, words - whatever we so [b]choose[/b] to do --- to "walk after the flesh" or "walk after the spirit" .......... so we're right back to where I first posted Romans 8.

Jesus showed us HOW to "walk in the spirit" - which I posted on an earlier page where most of that post was "italized" [though that was by accident - I left it that way].

Romans 8:29