IHOP is to be questioned.

IHOP has a long history of embracing unbiblical and wild manifestations, calling it all the Holy Spirit. Such as:

1. Touching people and knocking them over en masse in power displays and "impartations" of strange "anointings".

2. Wild convulsion like shaking on the floor, rolling around, growling like lions, barking like dogs, etc.

3. Anti-Scriptural visions and dreams, third-heaven experiences talking with departed saints, etc.

4. The "Jesus as lover" heresies perverted out of the Song of Solomon (and experiences of sexual interactions with this other "jesus" in visions and dreams)

5. Constant promotion of angels, and of visions and encounters with angels (without testing the spirits). -Even financial angels.

6. Gold dust and diamonds falling from the cieling and oil appearing on hands.

7. Trance-like worship beating pagan drums and moaning and shaking in such trances.

8. An extremely high emphasis on supernatural experiences and miracles without testing the spirits.

9. Very little repentance preaching among the leaders associated with the movement, no heart searching words that prick to the heart and bring about sound conversions.

10. Ear tickling prophecies, many of which have been documented and proven false.

The list could go on. I have read numerous testimonies of people, by their own words, who contracted demons through IHOP and associated movements and were tormented for a long time trying to get rid of them. You can probably pull up some of their testimonies online, published by Andrew Strom's email list.

I walked into an IHOP church a number of years ago and immediately discerned perverse spirits in that place. This was when I knew nothing about the movement and had nothing to go off of but the witness of the Spirit within me. I found out soon afterwards that many there were struggling with homosexuality, pornography and other sexual sins, and affairs were ripping apart the church.

At best, there is a tremendous mixture of true and false miracles, but there's so much false, we have no business of having anything to do with it.

Run for your life.

HI Guys,

Some of you may be surprised, or maybe not :) that for the whole of last year I attended IHOP. I am no longer there but feel reasonably qualified to give an opinion on this thread. For the most part, I saw nothing different that what one would expect at a Pentecostal church. There was the odd strange person, manifesting noise and attention attracting activity, but for the most part there was simply praising, preaching and prayer. I did not particularly care for the worship, finding it to be soulish, but I could say that about countless churches that I have visited. The preaching, for the main part, was very good, especially from Mike Bickle. Lou Engle was the strangest of all the preachers I heard there. I believe that it is their underlying teaching that it the most dangerous. Since the late 80s, Mike and his aquaintences, have considered themselves to be special, prophets for the end of times. They have succesfully convinced the mainly younger people that attend the church, that they too are part of a special generation. Its a form of dominionism that they teach. I believe it to be a dangerous teaching, although it is quite subtle.

I also believe that the leadership have zero discernment when it comes to the likes of Todd Bentley and so on. They would steadfastly refuse to condemn someone like Todd but they would be unapologetic for that stance. There is also a strange mixture of politics mixed into their teachings which plays into the dominionism, although many of their stands would be appluaded by many on this site. Its not so much what they believe politically per-se that it the problem, its because they believe that political influence is important to their future role in the world that makes it significant.

IHOP definately has a slightly cultish feeling to it, not because they control "their people," but because they believe themself to be spiritually elite, although I am very sure that the leadership would deny that. These guys do many things well, but ultimately I believe they will be a problem for end time saints..........brother Frank

When we consider error in the church at large, we must first consider what the standard is that we compare the fault with the true. In the christian realm, it is always the Bible, the word of God, that is the infallible authority in these realms, and the deeds and fruit that follow.

We must also understand that the nature of deception is always mixture...a counterfeit; a big hunk of truth, mixed in with portions of the lie.

IHOP is that. We derive the pure doctrines of the mechanics of the church from the writings from the Lord Jesus, and the apostles. Paul is undeniably chief in setting these doctrines forth, and remember, these doctrines always dovetail into the operations of the LOCAL CHURCH!

There is no variation from this in scripture. Pastors, Elders, overseers, bishops....I like Shepherds...are ordained by the Lord to feed, protect, and manifest Jesus's authority so that the Spirit rules within the church and is not quenched or sullied.

IHOP is not a local church; it is a para-church; a movement based group. Therefore, it has chosen to adapt it's own rules and methods that enhance it's mission. It's mission is to create a super-spiritual clan that will also be an offering of worship to the Lord in the purist sense; 24 hour, 7day, yearly and consistent worship until Jesus returns. Mike bickle believes that he has been commissioned to build the:

"THE RESTORATION OF THE FALLEN TABERNACLE OF DAVID"

ACTS 15:13
13. After they had stopped speaking, James answered, saying, "Brethren, listen to me.
14."Simeon has related how God first concerned Himself about taking from among the Gentiles a people for His name.

15. "With this the words of the Prophets agree, just as it is written,
16. AFTER THESE THINGS, I will return,
AND I WILL REBUILD THE TABERNACLE OF DAVID WHICH HAS FALLEN,
AND I WILL REBUILD ITS RUINS,
AND I WILL RESTORE IT,
17. SO THAT THE REST OF MANKIND MAY SEEK THE LORD,
AND ALL THE GENTILES WHO ARE CALLED BY MY NAME,'
18.SAYS THE LORD, WHO MAKES THESE THINGS KNOWN FROM LONG AGO.

19. "Therefore it is my judgment that we do not trouble those who are turning to God from among the Gentiles,

We see that the true restoration of the Tabernacle of David is simply the Church manifest; the body of Christ; the temple of the Holy Spirit. It is the local church, in all of her weakness and mercies, extending a Spirit filled hand to each other and to the world, until we all grow up into the fullness of Christ. She is weak, and yet strong...filled with infants, teen-agers, marriage troubles, bills, work and taxes; yet, at the same time, holy and powerful, as Christ dwells in Her. The weak have a home in Her.

Not so in a monastic order.

[ I will continue in 2 IHOP QUESTIONED.]

2.

IHOP?

IHOP is that. A neo-monastic order...with many of the accoutrements of the Catholic counterparts...the cloister; the nunnery; the MONASTERY, WITH ALL OF THEIR ERRORS! The super-spiritual society...the cutting edge, the Elijah generation.

1. Contemplative prayer. It is pagan in custom and historically. It is the Babylonian counterfeit to true prayer. It is inward, promoting mantra and guided imagery. It teaches to empty the mind, rather than pray by faith through the son of God seated at the right hand of the Father. It is pagan, and faithfully promoted by IHOP. It is a major error.

[ also aesthetic pagan practices such as "speech fasting", along with the "fasted lifestyle". It's Babylonian Catholicism.]

2. Rote, or repetitive PRAISE, done as exercise, rather than SPIRIT led by faith. Teams do SETS...over and over and over....usually 30-40 hours a week. This is deemed as WORSHIP, and it is not. It is aesthetic legalism; a counterfeit to true, free and often spontaneous praise...stemming from the heart, not the will, and a legalistic compulsion.

[2.] ...Much of this stems from the Catholic sub-doctrines of living a sacrificial life...the more you sacrifice the better. [ ultimately become a monk or nun]...always give more...and the more sacrifice the more pleasing you are to God.

[ IHOP fellowships Catholics, and particularly the "prayer cloisters" around the world. I have witnessed Nuns and "fathers" on stage with Mike in the early days of IHOP.["Have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of DARKNESS!"]...again...experience trumps doctrine..]

At IHOP the devotees are constantly flattered as BEING PRAYER MISSIONARRIES"..."FORERUNNERS"...and "FRIENDS OF THE BRIDEGROOM"...and bannered as the "one half of one per-cent" who devote all to Jesus....The super-spiritual few...like Elijah, and John the Baptist. It always promotes "HIGH SPIRITUALITY" and ends in "COLD LOVE", as all monasteries do. It is bondage, but these kids believe it. It freezes their spiritual growth in pride; believing they are something they are not.

3. The taking of Oaths. This is forbidden in the bible...and is used to control. It is actually called sacred by the IHOP mandate, and it is a document that you must sign, to be a part of her. IHOP demands that you swear this oath, with your signature. This controls the prayer room, the musicians, and the teams that perform. Often it is for a period of time..several months, a year, or whatever the requirement for the level that you buy into.

4. [ related to 3.] The selling of the ministry. You must pay IHOP to be there...and more or less, according to the level you attain. Beginners pay as much as 4500 dollars for a six month program. You must pay for teaching..and certain classes. The "students" are urged to solicit there friends and families and previous local churches for the cash, which in turn is handed over to the Ihop leaders.

The students are taught the methods of the fund raising missionary. Letters, pleas and speaking trips to get "supporters" on board, all for the "prayer missionary" that you have became. Professional beggary.

5. Women in authority over men. This is strictly forbidden in scripture, but yet is common practice at Ihop. There is a permissive attitude that has placed several women as leaders and teachers at IHOP; The "prophetic" especially, along with other departments. This has ,in my opinion, brought much confusion, to add into the already chaotic and cold.

IHOP summary.

Mike Bickle is the Father of IHOP. there is no dispute about this. He believes that he is commissioned to establish ihops around the earth, as a birthing mother; IE; KC-IHOP.

I consider Mike Bickle a friend, though am I by no means close to him; though I know him. I have communicated with him some, and I believe that to some degree, Mike believes that I hear from the Lord.

However, there is no direct line of communication with him at present; no e-mail, no address or telephone. I would admonish him as I have in these posts; if I could.

Mike is a man of integrity, as much as I have seen; of impeccable Godly character. No, Mike Bickle is not a "cusser", nor immoral in any way. I believe that he is sincere, and believes Ihop is in the center of the will of God.

Mike embraced the Catholic mystics long ago, as the "deeper life" saints; the real devotees to Jesus. Herein is the roots of apostasy. It's, as I have said, Mixture. The Catholic mystics heralded profound experience as their banner to Christian greatness. They speak of bliss, and transcendent power, and glory. Mike reasoned that to gain their experience, you must adapt their methods.

Thereby the monastery, Ihop, and Babylon enters. Jezebel is worshipped as Mary, the demons as saints, the Pope as satanic Caesar.....[ all hidden in the symbolism at Rome..]but the ends justifies the means. It is a spirit.

The end is the completely devoted Elijah company, and the fallen tabernacle of David established by them.[24/7/365 "worship" ] "Lets not let some archaic doctrines slow us down!" "IHOP IS NOT A CHURCH!"

It has been said that good intentions pave the roadway to Hell. Many, many thousands of young saints have been wounded and disillusioned at Ihops around the world. They come wanting to sell out to Jesus, with all of their heart, and find a cold, legalistic methodology that always keeps them just a fingertip away from finding the fullness of Jesus...so they strive on....a little more sacrifice....

No, they are not open to correction at all; hundreds have tried. It's the movement crusade mentality. "All detractors are just trying to derail us from our purpose...the ONE THING! we were created for!"..[ they hear it every day..]

Only the Lord can deliver IHOP into a pure purpose. I would like you to consider this. If the church, is not a home to the weak and helpless, it is not the church. The local church is the one Divine vehicle God has anointed to save unto the uttermost the weakest and smallest. Faith works by love, and Jesus always went to the one, the singular, as being as important to Him, as the crowds.

But with the weak...the working man who must labor 6 days a week to support his family, who cannot devote endless hours in music and prayer...with the house-wife who must attend to nursing her young, cooking and cleaning, to keep her head above water.....7 days a week....with the weak minded , with the untalented, with the aged and infirmed.......TEENAGERS , and the pressures of survival..

This is what the church is made of. People who must earn a living..who cannot abandon all to cloister..to be holy.

IS THERE A WAY???? "AM I LEFT OUT???"

IHOP by inference would say that you are. The bible, and the history of the remnant church would emphatically say that you are not. That is why the lord made his true church the way he did. Whosoever may come, "LET HIM COME!"

CHILDREN TOO.

I am reading a very old book that I bought recently at a used shop and the writer is telling the stories about how revival came in his day in the 1840's & 50's. I have read several chapters and the theme running through that is repentance, and praying until you get the flow of the Spirit. He spoke of preacher who had grown cold who substituted programs for the Spirit of God. What I was reading is exactly the same condition as we are in today. "Nothing is new under the sun". He'd meet with these preachers and if they were willing, they'd pray until God met with them and things became different in their services. He writes about the love of God being the foremost important aspect of the Christian walk. If the love of God isn't present in a persons life, soul winning would be a chore, but with that love, he had witnessed the Spirit of God moving upon people with ease and people dropping to their knees repenting without any prompting from the minister.

I don't know about you, but that's what I want.

by narrowpath on 2010/3/30 9:26:43

"The acid test is always, does it bring worthy and lasting fruit or not and is it initiated by God or by man. There are ministries that are doctrinally very sound and give to the poor and avoid contemporary fads but are still self initiated.

There are ministries that have the right appearance but do not produce lasting fruit.
There are also ministries that lack in certain areas but bring good fruit.

In God's Kingdom it is possible that a new convert who comes right out of the gutter and knows half a bible verse can bring scores to Christ whereas doctor of divinity with sound doctrine just brings death through human reason and fine sounding arguments."

Mat 15:13 "But he answered and said, Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up."

AMEN! Seated in Heaven; salted on the Earth.

to Xaris4u ,Miccah,Solomon101,Lysa,Goldminer,AbideinHim,snufalapagus

quote from your post !

(IHOP)they are ministering to God not me and maybe it sounds pretty to Him.
Mick Bickle and Lou Engels, and all that I can say about them is that they are men of integrity that have a heart for God.

To everyone,

How can I curse whom God has not cursed? How can I denounce whom the LORD has not denounced?
Numbers 23.8

This is wisdom.... in our trying to uncover the truth about a certain ministries, we NEED to be be sure we are not denouncing them based on "our" denominational and/or theological beliefs (differences) because we do not want to find ourselves denouncing someone that God has NOT denounced.

Because their eyes are steadfast on cultivating lifestyles that are authentically built unto putting the first commandment in first place.
God's great grace to you as you continue in that same spirit brother!

It is all said with a heart to see God move in an undeniable and supernatural way. I agree fully with your post. You have the balance.

If it withstands the furnace, then let it be. If not, then pray for eyes to open and the blind to see.

They're abiding passionate is to cultivate Psalm 27:4 hearts in servants of Jesus.

they'd pray until God met with them and things became different in their services. He writes about the love of God being the foremost important aspect of the Christian walk. If the love of God isn't present in a persons life, soul winning would be a chore, but with that love, he had witnessed the Spirit of God moving upon people with ease and people dropping to their knees repenting without any prompting from the minister.

I agree !!! what you had said !
I have visited IHOP-Kc few times and listen to their teaching, I am with them !

We are as a people commanded to judge fruit, and doctrine.

"Not going by what others have said or written on the Internet, do any of you KNOW beyond a shadow of a doubt that God has cursed or denounced this ministry? The word says "let your yea be yea and your nay nay;" so if you DON'T know for sure and you keep plunging ahead denouncing this ministry and others, God have mercy on you."..LYSA

In reality, those in peril may indeed be those who will not judge, or discern. The primary standard must be the Word of God, and the doctrine of the apostles derived from it.

There are some fundamental doctrinal errors that have been adapted at Ihop, that have born bad fruit. They are:[among others..]

1.The promoting of mystical and monastic practices, particularly "CONTEMPLATIVE PRAYER", which is not prayer at all, but a satanic counterfeit that is the same as TRANSCENDENTAL MEDITATION", using guided imagery, singular focus, mantras, repetition and the clearing of the mind to attain a spiritual state.

2. The monastic practice of continual repetitive prayers and praise...done by rote, or as duty. It is not spirit led, but man controlled, and no real worship at all.

3. The fellowship of others who also promote these errors, such as the Roman Catholic church, and other dividers who do the same.

4. The mandate of the taking of oaths to fulfill your duties to IHOP, along with the requiring of your signature. THIS IS FORBIDDEN IN SCRIPTURE!...and is the basis of LYSA'S quote, "Let you yea, be yea, and your nay, be nay!"...It was after the command NEVER to swear an oath.

5. The selling of the ministry...connected to the above. you are required to pay for your involvement at IHOP...up to $4500 for 6 months.

6. The setting up women as leaders and elders, who both TEACH, and exercise Authority over men. This is also strictly forbidden in the Church.

Is it all bad, or unscriptural? No, but it is mixture. "Do I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that God has denounced or cursed this ministry?" No. I don't think he has, and I believe that there are many good brothers and sisters there.

On the other hand, I never met the prophets of Mormon, or the children of Brigham Young, but I know that their doctrine does not match up completely with the Word of God. They confess that Jesus is Lord. Am I allowed to judge their doctrine, or their fruit?

Most that are devotees there are taught that all detractors have just not seen the light. This is not true. There are several mature saints here that live there now, and some that have been a part of the ministry there, that counsel avoidance. Andrew Strom has access to many, many young ones who have been wounded there, that he ministers too.

Perhaps you could talk to the many who have been severely wounded there? They exist. Could there be unscriptural control there?... and if there is, should we expose it, so others may see too? The early church Elders sure did.

Where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is FREEDOM.

Beware of HIGH SPIRITUALITY and COLD LOVE.

AMEN

I SEEM TO REMEMBER SOME OTHER PEOPLE THAT SEEMED TO BE DRUNK ACTS 2

JUST BECAUSE YOU DO NOT UNDERSTAND OR AGREE DOES NOT MAKE IT NOT GOD. EVERYTHING GOD DOES DEFIES COMMON SENSE.THIS IS THE SAME THINGS THEY SAID AT PENTECOST????

The original thread was" Is IHOP to be questioned?

Every Christian church should be, according to doctrine , teaching, and "de facto"; [ actual ] practice.

This means that say for instance, the Mormons, or the Jehovah Witness's may "SAY" they believe that Jesus is Lord, but in practice , or reality, they certainly do not.

In around 1965, the Catholic church had a revival, where hundreds of thousands of Catholic souls were "Baptized in the Holy Spirit, and spoke with other tongues...This was called the Charismatic Ecumenical Renewal......The CER.[edit:previously "revival"]

The Full Gospel Businessmen International received them as family, as did some other Pentecostal organizations, and the Charismatic movement was born. Many of those [perhaps MOST] steeped in Catholic Paganism , who were tongue speakers, remained in Roman Catholicism, as many do even today.

They remained practicing the wicked MASS, the confession of Sins to men, [the "priesthood"], the worship and prayers to MARY, the "SAINTS"...[ dead brothers and sisters..], and the veneration of the POPE, as JESUS's ONE and ONLY authority on this planet. [ and of course the Hierarchy of the Pope..]

What the TRUE CHURCH protected as sacred and most holy, Apostolic doctrine; the gospel of Paul, was defiled in One generation.

EXPERIENCE trumped sound Doctrine for the first time, and remained and was perceived as Christian. If you spoke in tongues, well, this was evidence that you had to be Christian. It is a colossal lie. It proves nothing.

I have layed out at least 5 areas where scripture is violated at IHOP.[ underneath in 3 posts..] They too, are yet connected to Catholic "prayer rooms", around the world. They practice a number of Babylonian techniques, that are not biblical, and are ascetic, and monastic. They are not spirit born or spirit led, or of faith. They are disciplines. disciplines will never change a heart unto Godliness.

The initial act of historical revival is secondary, even trivial to the greater end. Revival changes lives and the surrounding community. It brings a holy impact to whatever it touches, creating holy lives and loving lives out of vast corruption. The fear of the Lord is permeated in the community; Conviction falls on multitudes, and the lost are saved, and everyone sees it, and knows it.

The end of A REVIVAL that is validated by it's "MANIFESTATIONS" may be seen by the crude zoo like circus of Toronto, or the parade of the lies and demonic as hailed by Todd Bentley and Lakeland.

Ihop is a modern monastery/movement that creates a zeal for the Lord, but He has been swallowed up by it. There too busy doing the stuff.

BEWARE OF HIGH SPIRITUALITY, AND COLD LOVE.

What about the completion of the temple by Soloman. It says the ministers could no longer perform their ministerial duties because of the spirit of God . Sounds like they were fall down drunk. Also Jesus compares the spirit to wine ( the new wine ) Paul says don't be drunk on wine but be filled with the spirit. The word alcohol means demon spirits . Have you ever heard the ( we serve spirits at a resteraunt) I have personaly been so drunk in the Holy spirit that I rolled on the floor laaughing uncontrolably for over a hour. Why do you think people call us holy rollers. It is like the Spirit of God is tickling
me. Just because it was not discribed in enough detail or you have not experianced this your self does not mean it is not God. I personaly know a pastor who went to IHOP and was delivered from the trap of doing ministry by the ministries of men and flesh. He was genuinely repentive and changed. God does things with people or people react to God in
stange ways. Just because we do not understand does not mean it is not God. Most everything God has ever done people did not understand until God revealed it to them !!!!! These people are very serious about a deep allegaints to Jesus !!!! God bless brother with all my love

PS. check out who they are partnered with Larron
Conigham the founder of YWAM, Lou Ingles, they have been praying 24/7 for 10 years

oh God please...help us all.

or the very least Lord, let the moderators just step in...done. done. DONE.

To theet, from brothertom..

"have you ever been to ihop?!"

Yes, theet. I lived there, was there in the beginning, and visited a dozen times or more over many years. That does not necessarily make me an expert, but at least I have some hands on experience to offer my opinion, along with scriptural rebuttal, and here I have teachings from IHOP's own website.

You be the judge. If these practices and teachings seem to be scriptural to you; ignore my admonitions. I might add that I never intended this to be personal; it is not. Practice and actions define doctrine, not just statements that ministries claim. Along with 5 specific areas where scripture is violated,[ below in 3 posts] I submit teaching from their own website.

WAKE UP AND RUN!

Authentic Christian prayer is always outward, where by faith we commune with the Father , and His holy Son seated at the right hand of the Father. It is never inward. It is always aggressive, and exterior. It always stems from communion outward, where Heaven is real, where Christ is alive, making intercession with the Father for His desire and His own.

This is not about words; it is about practice. Of course the Babylonian New Age practice has been hammered into Christianese so that the gullible would accept it as Christian. It is not, and it is anti-christ. Other spirits [demon powers] eventually seep into the void of the mind to create a semblance of the Lord, to deceive you.

This is the age old practice of Babylon, and as it sits today in Hindi India today, it is called Transcendental Meditation. You transcend the earthly plane to the Spiritual, with the goal of finding Nirvana; A state where gods live in perfect bliss with the Universe. The Hindi holy men speak of this consciousness, and these beings.

This is exactly the practice of the Mystic Prophets of Roman Catholicism, who used these methods handed down to them, shrouded in Christian symbolism, but in practice, fulfilling a satanic worship order, thousands of years old.

The bread and butter of this practice, begins in the methods to transcend. Focusing on one thing, clearing the mind, GUIDED IMAGERY...IE: The imagination. You focus to see something, and god wants you to obtain it. This is the exact same way that Todd Bentley travelled to heaven in his chats with Abraham, Moses and Jesus. He also spoke of angels with bags of gold, and many other fantastical experiences.

Were they real?. In a way , yes. The question being, Were they of the Lord?...They were originated in the mind of the wicked demon. .......brothertom

This is an exert from IHOP's website; a teaching on Meditative Prayer.

Method #2
Choose a short story in Scripture.

Read through the story several times silently.

Close your eyes and acknowledge the Spirit who lives in you.

[Here is were the imagery comes in...]

"Use your IMAGINATION to IMAGINE yourself as one of the story characters or as an onlooker"...[caps mine]

...{Does this sound like King David, or Maharishi yoga?]...TOM

"Play out the story in your mind applying all five of your senses."[ IHOP"S WORD]

[...my words...]"Imagine a story in your mind, and it will be god, because that is how it works.

This is wicked claptrap, but deadly to the "BUYER." It is demonic Babylon, and you will be deceived if you receive it as truth."brothertom

Method #3..[ again, from IHOP's website on prayer.]

"We call this “Beholding the Spirit Within.”

The goal is to search for and feel God’s presence inside you, not necessarily to gain more understanding in God’s Word as with the first two methods.

Begin by gently praying a short passage of Scripture in silence while FOCUSING on the indwelling Spirit. The Scripture is used to quiet the clamoring of your soul and draw you to God.

!!!!!!It is the connection point, the springboard into the spiritual realm.!!!!!"

...[ directly quoted from IHOP]...caps mine.

SOUND FAMILIAR?

ALSO:

"Once you feel God’s presence, FOCUS on it in a concentrated way.

You will be able to notice His presence now; He has always been there, but now your attention is on Him within you."
IHOP

!!!!!!The outward senses are quiet and your surface thoughts are gone. You are beginning to be consumed by the Spirit.!!!!!!....IHOP............................

....[ another spirit..]...brothertom

IHOP TEACHES:...."In this time, feel the freedom to stay quiet. "

!!!!Silently ask the Spirit to show you a vision, or slowly and silently say to Him, “I love You. I love You. I love You.”!!!!!!
IHOP

This is how demonic revelation is attained, masquerading as Holy.

WAKE UP AND RUN!

by KathleenP

"Brothertom",

"This is quite frightening to read. Is this from a manual they have written?"
........................................................

Yes. This is from an official IHOP teaching site.
[ It has since been taken down. ] They did offer courses at IHOP U. on this very practice, and this may have been some of the on-line curriculum.

It is alarming to me also, Kathleen, but to some it seems offensive. It seems that some are very offended that these issues are being pointed out.

I think it is a good thing to know what you are getting into, and foremost to weigh all things beside the Scriptures.

You're telling me to run AWAY from the IHOP?!?

NO! I'm wanting to be running TOWARDS the IHOP!

Think about it man, where else can an American get such a great breakfast, anytime of the day or night, but at the International House of Pancakes?

Omelets, hash browns, golden and crisp, eggs, sunny side up, french toast, sprinkled with sugar, sausages in natural casing...and you want me to run away from that?

I'm sorry...i just can't. i dont mean to stumble you, but i just cant turn my back on the IHOP's of America, thats all i can say.

"I read what you quoted from the IHOP site and see nothing wrong with the use of the imagination while reading the bible, nor are they implying that your imagination and images imagined becomes "god" as you have claimed."....mguldner............

Let us be clear; this is not about just reading the bible. It is "Meditative Prayer; Contemplating scripture and applying your imagination visually, to attain revelation; even visions.. It is an ancient form of Prayer practiced in Hindi India and throughout the Bhuddist world today; Now! It is called; Guided Imagery."

Well, there is certainly nothing wrong with a creative imagination; it is a gift from God and can enhance every area of our life. When, however, it is elevated and received as a vehicle of revelation from God, and even touted to be one; there is a problem.

Then you enter into the occult world of ancient forms of witchcraft; IE:...the Babylonian Mysteries. There have been hundreds and hundreds of articles written that positively identify these practices as ultimately Satanic. The latest big stir came about with Todd Bentley, in Lakeland Florida, and his so called revival.

Todd became famous as he testified of a diminutive gal-pal angel, Emma, who carried around bags of gold, and the giant "Winds of Change" angel anointing him. He also spoke of visits to the heavenly realm; chats with Jesus and Abraham and Moses, and describes them in great detail.
He also was exposed as an adulterer, thief, and psychopathic liar at the same time...[ "Another resssuuurrrrection from the dead!!!"...35 in all...and "tens of thousands of healings.!"

The truth is; It was all in his imagination. It was all lies; without ONE verified healing...[ though there were several deaths documented though after his prayers for the terminally ill...Those that he "DECLARED HEALED."

This is the exact, identical practice proven to be taught and promoted at IHOP; there is no difference. Again, this is not personal. If I and others are correct in naming this as deception, then the practice of it will certainly lead you away from God, rather than to Him. Therefore, I submit another article from the perpetrators of these doctrines.
......

Todd Bentley's New Age Practice of Creative Visualization

by Joanne Panettieri

Editor, Kingdom Iconoclast

Dr. Dave Hunt writes in his book "Occult Invasion", (Harvest House Publishers, Eugene, OR, 1998) about Visualization:

"The concept is a form of mental activity called imaging. It consists of vividly picturing, in your conscious mind, a desired goal or objective, and holding that image until it sinks into your unconscious mind, where it releases great, untapped energies....

The idea of imaging... has been implicit in all the speaking and writing I have done.... But only recently has it begun to... be recognized by scientists and medical authorities.… 1 (Norman Vincent Peale, Positive Imaging )

This occult technique has invaded the church. Certain leaders have been teaching visualization for years. In his booklet, The Power of the Inner Eye, Robert Schuller (like Yonggi Cho and others) perverts Scripture by claiming that it advocates the occult technique of visualization. He writes:

In the May, 1985, issue of Psychology Today, there was a wonderful article entitled "In the Mind’s Eye." [It] deals with... visualization"

I have copied below a portion of Todd Bentley's article on an "Open Heaven". (found on his web site and in his own words!) In this article Todd is basically teaching Christians about astral projection.

Bentley states that “heaven is without the sickness, the sin, the disease, the death, the poverty, and the devil, that we have here. And since we [can and do] enjoy what God has created in the earth, then is there any reason why we can’t, as spiritual beings with spiritual senses, go places in the spirit and taste, see, and touch [experience the geographical beauty of] everything that God has created in the heavenly dimension? After all, everything we have in the natural/temporal realm is created out of the heavenly invisible realm in the first place!" ( Todd Bentley, Open Heavens Part 1 of 2.)

Again, proof that Todd is into many non-biblical new age techniques:

"Friends, I believe there comes a “place” where there is an invitation for each and every one of us to pray for spiritual understanding, for the eyes of our hearts to be opened, and for us to be filled with the spirit of wisdom and revelation. It’s an atmosphere where we can make ourselves available to receive solid teaching and guidelines from God’s word to help us exercise our spiritual senses. Also, it’s where we can learn to open and sanctify our imagination, and begin to have the eyes of our understanding enlightened (the mind’s eye) whereby we begin to touch the dimension of seeing—the dimension of visions, trances, dreams, and angelic visitation"

Todd believes that : "Why? One reason is because the “dimension of seeing” goes hand in hand with the seer anointing, and God wants to give us that anointing". And in Part 2 he writes: "Is there really an invitation to come boldly before the throne? Can I really have trances, visions, dreams, and visitations of the Lord? Be aware of angels? What do you mean, it’s my inheritance now?"

And yet again, Todd Bentley takes liberty with the Word of God because there is NO such anointing mentioned in the Holy Bible. Unfortunately for him and those that follow him, I fear that many of their experiences will be from the spiritual realm of the fallen angel kind!

Lastly, he teaches people that they must "sanctify their mind's eye":

"Just like an eagle flies way up high, and with his keen eyesight he sees far off into the distance, God wants you to be high “by setting your mind on things above,” and to have eagle-eyes—clear prophetic vision that sees far off. However, the first thing you must do is sanctify your imagination. If you’re going to have eagle-eyes you need to sanctify your mind’s eye by guarding what you do with your natural eyes"

Sorry, but I must have missed that class in Bible college... oh wait... "mind's eye"... that's NOT in the Bible!! The Bible teaches us to "cast down our imaginations" NOT sanctify them!.......J.P.

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Ministers have this idea that we need to adopt worldy entertainment to reach the youth.

The Holy Ghost knows how to reach the youth.

I come from a Pentecostal background and I do not consider these things that is going on at IHOP to be of God. However, there is in every group like this genuine seekers, and God may in some way minister through that mess. The healings that take place there I would like to know what kind of healings are being performed. I mean, people getting gold teeth and others throwing fairy dust and barking like my next door neighbours dog is not healing. I think the hysteria of the moment convinces people they've been touched, with all that Rock music being played it's no different than a tribal dance.

I enjoy a good Pentecostal meeting, I am used to the ones that have order and structure. There is a time for everything. I've seen people writhe on the floor, but it wasn't called a blessing, it was called a deliverance, when the devil was being cast out. When a preacher allows these things to happen as blessings, he is either fallen away from the truth or he is a devil himself masquerading as a sheep. I fear the latter.

In an earlier post I have also mentioned that I see no biblical precept to address the Holy Spirit in worship, prayer or petition.

I went to a prayer meeting recently where everyone gathered into a room to pray. Most were standing. They put on some Christian worship music that wasn't too bad only that it spoke more about the holy Spirit than Jesus. But I tried to remain open minded and just prayed to myself. People were sharing prophetically, one sang a hymn another read from the scriptures that type of thing. But everything went sour when the Pastor asked everyone to prophesy over anyone in the room. He said that no one should be not prophesying. Red Flags instantly went up and I thought, not everyone is gifted in this and secondly, the Holy Spirit operates these gifts through individuals as He wills. He approached me and asked if he would prophecy over me, I said no. He jumped back surprised. God only knows what would have been imparted.

I become the master and he does my bidding. I, I, I, I.

Even though these things happened, I did not feel in my spirit that the Pastor was trying to deceive anyone. I believe he is sincere, but sincerely wrong. He just needs correction.

Amos 9:11

Amos 9:11

"We are the Ones who will restore the fallen tabernacle of David!"....Amos9:11

Amos 9:11 is a mantra used as the banner to sacrifice yourself unto the Lord at IHOP, because Mike Bickle believes that He is fulfilling it. This fallen "Tabernacle" was originally King David's extensive worship organization that included 24 hour singing, prayers,and music unto the Lord.

So, the ultimate spiritual warrior, man or woman, is one who submits to the disciplines of this order. This is precisely what IHOP is; a spiritual order, not unlike the monasteries that existed long ago, that did exactly the same things.

Much of these duties are driven by the Catholic sub-doctrine that a "SACRIFICIAL LIFE" is the most pleasing to God, and thereby the more sacrificial, the better; the more pleasing to God. So, the drums of religious duty beat, people sign oaths to fulfill them, the "sets" are filled, and the sacrifice ascends to God, 24/7.

"After all, what could be more important than the restoration of the fallen Tabernacle of David?" It is this crusade; this religious duty that drives the gears, and hundreds and thousands have been sucked into them. "I am a prayer missionary!" They are flattered every day about how elite they all are, and about how they are the forerunners; those who give all; the Elijah, John the Baptist company.

This is what gives IHOP it's cult like appearances, and opens the door to it's elitist deceptions; the same way the monks of old cloistered themselves to become most holy; the monastic life of sacrifice!

It is a lie, you have been sold a false love. The fallen tabernacle of David is described below by the apostles! It is the gathering of the gentiles, the pagan nations, unto the Lord through Jesus, and the endowing of the Holy spirit through faith in Him..IT IS NOT THE DISCIPLINES OF A MONASTIC WORSHIP ORDER.! It is the church extended to;, "For God so loved the WORLD!"...not just the bloodline of the Patriarchs.

JAMES EXPLAINS IN THE SCRIPTURE.....
Acts 15:14

14. ""Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name.

15And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written,

16After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:

17 """That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, """and all the Gentiles,!!!!"""

upon whom my name is called!"" saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.

18Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.

19Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God:

The restoration of the fallen tabernacle of David is the Lord allowing all peoples into His tent; regardless of their bloodline, through faith in Jesus!

Beware of elite causes. The true gospel is for the weak, and needy, and yes, even the undisciplined. If it were not, then only the strong would be able to perform.

This spirit goes against the grain of truth and mercy, and spews up another way; religious performance.

avoid.

"If it is not of God, it shall be revealed. Worry not and let only he who has perfect doctrine and led perfect ministry cast the first stone."..Giggles

I ask you this, Giggles..."Am I my brothers keeper?". This the exact reason why we should, if we see our brother stumble, pull him out of a ditch, and if he is being deceived, rescue him. [ or try..] Not one of us is perfect either, but does that mean we should remain mute about error in the church, that could potentially harm multitudes by leading them away from God?

This thread is precisely about that...Is IHOP to be questioned? and judging the 8 pages so far, I assume the answer is a resounding YES! Our opinions are weighed out against fact, and Scripture.....comparing teaching and deeds with the Word of God.

Also, there is no one throwing stones, and there is no one Pastoring another. This is a discussion forum, where reason together and express our opinions, in light of the Word of God; the scriptures. Often it is a combined journey to the truth.

"....and [I] do agree that pastors should take care of their flocks, but no one here is a pastor to anyone else here and this is not a flock."...Giggles

But it is an avenue of exhortation, warning and reproof. There are literally hundreds of warnings here by highly esteemed men of God, and thousands and thousands of posts about a myriad of ministries and men. We compare according to the scripture, and hopefully the facts. This is a healthy thing, and honestly should be welcomed in a Godly ministry. Transparency is a fruit of living in the light.

We eat the meat, and spit out the bones. We , as a people, should not shy away from criticism, as long as it is biblically sound, and done in a humble and loving spirit.

Brother Tom the very scripture you quoted out of Acts was talking about division. Some of the people were trying to put a yoke that they nor their forefathers could carry. Like you brother Tom I do not think it is a good idea to base any part of your ministry or doctrine on any part of the Catholic religion. However I tend to agree with Mike Bickle's revelation of the scriptures more than I do of yours and many others in the body of Christ. No doubt there is idolatry,witch craft, hericy and serious corruption in the catholic church but is it any worse than TD Jakes voting for Obama or Joel Olstean saying he thought that Obama was a Christian and he was doing a good job. What about the masonic roots in the baptist churches or the once saved always saved doctrine that changes the grace of our God into a license for immorality. Not to mention the interfaith new age movement in the baptist methodist Lutheran Presbyterian and every other religion that is willing to compromise. Oh and what I consider to be the worse which you believe the pre-trib. rapture doctrine leaving the church fat lazy and out of breath. We the church are in desperate need of deliverance you are not exempt. We need to buy from the Lord salve for our eyes to see. We need to humble ourselves seek his face turn and then He will heal the church and our land . THE DELUSION IS IN THE LAND. The rebellion is occurring the anti-christ will soon be reveled. A disciple is a disciplined follower of Christ. Self discipline is a fruit of the spirit so disciplines are not bad if they come out of a love for Christ and allegiance to him and His word. Also angels will be used in the end times just like they always have.Daniel 12 With all my love brother I am praying for you with all the other saints who see through a glass darkly?!?!!!!!!!

Thank you dmoney for your kind exhortation. I too have a fondness for Mike Bickle's revelation of the scriptures. He is a gifted Bible teacher, well educated, a dynamic trustworthy leader, and possesses a brilliant and poignant intellect and add to this a heart for God, and impeccable moral integrity above reproach. However, this is not about his faith and fruit..[IHOP], as much as it about the purity of IHOP his ministry.

"A little leaven leavens the whole lump."

Galations 5:8

8. "This persuasion did not come from Him who calls you.

9.A little leaven leavens the whole lump of dough."

We are not to compare Men of God with each others like we would compare fat shiny apples with the shrivelled, bad ones.

"I tend to agree with Mike Bickle's revelation of the scriptures more than I do of yours and many others in the body of Christ." .dmoney

We compare any man with the purity of the heart of Jesus, and his compliance with the purity of the bright light of His Word. Paul was saying that poison grows, and will kill you, if you let it. You cannot have 98% holiness unto the Lord. It's like prophesying with a couple of pet mice in your pocket.

The Roman Catholic doctrines that we have discussed here, that are taught and acted upon that do occur at IHOP, will lead you away from God, not to Him. They will kill you, if allowed to flourish. Like Saul, we must be careful to obey the word fully, lest we be overtaken by partial obedience and victory, and lose the war. It is not a battle for the faith that we wage, but a battle for the PURITY of the faith. Satan knows this all too well.
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"Brother Tom the very scripture you quoted out of Acts was talking about division. Some of the people were trying to put a yoke that they nor their forefathers could carry. Like you brother Tom I do not think it is a good idea to base any part of your ministry or doctrine on any part of the Catholic religion. However I tend to agree with Mike Bickle's revelation of the scriptures more than I do of yours and many others in the body of Christ.".....dmoney....

Thank you brother for your compassion.

The bible talks extensively about eyes to see and ears to hear. It clearly tells us the way to gain that spiritual understanding needed to truly know God and the things of God. It is obedience to His will and commands which is love... Then and only then will God's spirit,THE HOLY SPIRIT , the anointing teach reveal or search the deep things of God. Then the prophetic mantle is made accessible to the believer because you are connected and can hear correctly the Spirit of the Living God. 1 Cor. 2:6-16 the mind of Christ and the deep things of God, John 15 being connected to the vine ( JESUS ) John 15:15 , being a friend of God, knowing everything the Father made known to Jesus, John 8:31 conditional to obedience-key word IF,John 7:17 conditional to surrendering to God's will. 1 John 2:26-27 the bible tells us that the anointing is able to teach us all things. It also tells us to remain in it. Love is the anointing because God is Love 1 John 4:16 There for the keys to the kingdom of heaven is a faith in Jesus that expresses it's self by love Galatians 5:6 So the real question is does IHOP teach salvation through Jesus Christ and to obey His command to love God with all your heart ,soul, mind and strength and to love each other as Christ loved you John 15:12-13 John 14:15-24 The answer to this Question is yes they do. They have a deep allegiance to Jesus and his commands even to the point of death.Proverbs 4:7 tells us how to get understanding. This is exactly what IHOP teaches total abandonment. Which is what Jesus said you had to do to be his disciple Luke 14:33-34 I was at the one thing confrance at the first of the year and I saw some things that I did not agree with so I requested to talk to the leader ship not to tear them down but to speak the truth in love. I did it according to Matt. 18 in privet . I was well received in a spirit of humility by the ministry leader Ed Hackett. He actually prophesied over my wife and I and was dead on. There was a confession that was recited and it had the catholic church in it. Because of serious false doctrine in the catholic church I believe that some one who knows Mike Bickle should talk to him about having a confession that seems to endorse the catholic religion. I do however believe that this is a christian brother there fore how ever you treat this man is how you treat Jesus Matt.25:40 and if you distroy his ministry 1 Cor. 3:17 may come to pass in your life. It is a fearful thing to fall in the hands to the living God. Mike bickle is adamant about addressing false doctrine or sin so I believe if some one knew him and wanted to talk to him he would be more than happy to talk. We are all a work in progress. I do not believe he is new age at all in fact he preaches against it. The bible says anyone who puts their trust in Jesus will not be put to shame. Mike Bickle and IHOP put their trust in Jesus with commitment to Gods word at the core of their prayer is to sit at the feet of Jesus to find out what God wants from them. HOW can we pray according to God's will if we do not know what it is about specific situations. Also they continually pray God's WORD. But the heart beat of IHOP is fellowship with God, to draw near to God. Didn't God say he would draw near to us if we draw near to Him. Do you think He is true to His word???

" I was well received in a spirit of humility by the ministry leader Ed Hackett. He actually prophesied over my wife and I and was dead on. There was a confession that was recited and it had the Catholic Church in it. Because of serious false doctrine in the Catholic Church I believe that some one who knows Mike Bickle should talk to him about having a confession that seems to endorse the Catholic religion."
Dmoney's testimony at IHOP "One Thing" conference.
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My brother, how could I belabor my point any more? A confession with the Catholic church IN IT? Could you PLEASE post that prayer confession? I didn't know that they had gone that far. [ publicly at least..]

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dmoney..
"The real question is does IHOP teach salvation through Jesus Christ and to obey His command to love God with all your heart ,soul, mind and strength and to love each other as Christ loved you John 15:12-13 John 14:15-24 The answer to this Question is yes they do.

They have a deep allegiance to Jesus and his commands even to the point of death.Proverbs 4:7 tells us how to get understanding. This is exactly what IHOP teaches; total abandonment."......... dmoney

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It is total abandonment to live a sacrificial life to the CAUSE, Mike's vision to be a forerunner; an Apostolic Prayer missionary. It is a NEO-MONASTIC order that emphasizes disciplines and duty to become that flame for God, and they use the exact Babylonian techniques that the RCC has used for millennia; and now evidently, according to your testimony, they are proclaiming the Catholic Catechism [ indoctrination ] over the vulnerable in prayer and Prophecy!

I don't know if I can say anything else. I'm stunned, frankly...that with this knowledge, and your apparent awareness of the Satanic nature of the RCC, and it's practice and doctrines ENDORSED and legitimized by IHOP; you continue to support them, and remain.

Are you being mesmerized by all the religious activity? Are you slowly being blinded? Is your hearing fading away? Brother...you know too much. Now your acting like your a part of them regardless of what they teach and do, because they are so "abandoned", and that is dangerous. They are abandoned to another gospel, and another spirit! can't you see that? It is a counterfeit religion of sacrifice and works. This spirit has cost many their eternal souls.

I am not sure ?You could see it in the archives of the one thing conference?

IHOP teaches to meditate on the word of God while praying. This is way off of what true new age or mystics teach.They have rejected almost all Catholic teachings . Remember all churches originated from catholic church God bless bro.

We believe that only the sixty-six books of the Bible are the inspired and, therefore, inerrant Word of God. The Bible is the final authority for all we believe and how we are to live. (Mt. 5:18; Jn.10:35, 17:17; 2 Tim. 3:16–17; 2 Pet. 1:20–21)

We believe that Jesus Christ is God incarnate, fully God and fully man; that He was conceived and born of a virgin, lived a sinless life, and offered Himself as a penal, substitutionary sacrifice for sinners. By His blood shed at the cross, He obtained for us eternal redemption, the forgiveness of sins and life everlasting. He was raised bodily on the third day and ascended to the right hand of the Father, there to make intercession for the saints forever. (Mt. 1:18–25; Jn. 1:1–18; Rom. 8:34; 1 Cor. 15:1–28; 2 Cor. 5:21; Gal. 3:10–14; Eph. 1:7; Phil. 2:6–11; Col. 1:15–23; Heb. 7:25, 9:13–15, 10:19; 1 Pet. 2:21–25; 1 Jn. 2:1–2)

We believe that salvation is by grace alone, through faith alone, in Christ alone. No ordinance, ritual, work or any other activity on the part of man is required or accepted in order to be saved. This saving grace of God, through the power of the Holy Spirit, also sanctifies us by enabling us to do what is pleasing in God's sight in order that we might be progressively conformed to the image of Christ. (Jn. 1:12–13, 6:37–44, 10:25–30; Acts 16:30–31; Rom. 3:1–4:23, 8:1–17, 31–39, 10:8–10; Eph. 2:8–10; Phil. 2:12–13; Titus 3:3–7; 1 Jn. 1:7, 9)

We believe that the Lord Jesus Christ baptizes believers in the Holy Spirit, in whom we are also sealed for the day of redemption. The Holy Spirit regenerates, forever indwells, and graciously equips the Christian for godly living and service. Subsequent to conversion, the Spirit desires to fill, empower, and anoint believers for ministry and witness. We also believe that signs and wonders, as well as all the gifts of the Spirit described in the New Testament, are operative today and are designed to testify to the presence of the kingdom and to empower and edify the Church to fulfill its calling and mission. (Mt. 3:11; Jn. 1:12–13, 3:1–15; Acts 4:29–30; Rom. 8:9, 12:3–8; 1 Cor. 12:12–13; 2 Cor. 1:21–22; Gal. 3:1–5; Eph. 1:13–14, 5:18)

We believe that the one true God exists eternally in three persons—Father, Son, and Holy Spirit—and that these, being one God, are equal in deity, power, and glory. We believe that God not only created the world but also now upholds, sustains, governs, and providentially directs all that exists and that He will bring all things to their proper consummation in Christ Jesus to the glory of His name. (Ps. 104:1–35, 139:1–24; Mt. 10:29–31, 28:19; Acts 17:24–28; 2 Cor. 13:14; Eph. 1:9–12, 4:4–6; Col. 1:16–17; Heb. 1:1–3; Rev. 1:4–6)

We believe that when Christians die, they pass immediately into the blessed presence of Christ, there to enjoy conscious fellowship with the Savior until the day of the resurrection and the glorious transformation of their bodies. The saved will then forever dwell in blissful fellowship with their great triune God. We also believe that when unbelievers die, they are consigned to hell, there to await the Day of Judgment when they shall be punished in the lake of fire with eternal, conscious, and tormented separation from the presence of God. (Mt. 25:46; Lk. 16:19–31; Jn. 5:25–29; 1 Cor. 15:35–58; 2 Cor. 5:1–10; Phil. 1:19–26, 3:20–21; 2 Thes. 1:5–10; Rev. 20:11–15, 21:1–22:15)

We believe that water baptism and the Lord's Supper are the two ordinances of the Church to be observed until the time of Christ's return. They are not a means of salvation, but are channels of God's sanctifying grace and blessing to the faithful in Christ Jesus. (Mt. 26:26–29, 28:19; Rom. 6:3–11; 1 Cor. 11:23–34; 1 Pet. 3:21)

We believe in the literal second coming of Christ at the end of the age when He will return to earth personally and visibly to consummate His kingdom. We believe that the Church will go through the Great Tribulation in great power and victory. We believe the Church will be raptured at the end of the Great Tribulation. We also believe in and are praying for a great end–time harvest of souls and the emergence of a victorious Church that will experience an unprecedented unity, purity, and power in the Holy Spirit. (Ps. 2:7–9, 22:27–28; Jn. 14:12, 17:20–26; Rom. 11:25–32; 1 Cor. 15:20–28, 50–58; Eph. 4:11–16; Phil. 3:20–21; 1 Thes. 4:13–5:11; 2 Thes. 1:3–12; Rev. 7:9–14)

We believe that Adam was originally created in the image of God, righteous and without sin. As a consequence of his disobedience, Adam's posterity is born subject to both imputed and inherent sin, and all humans are therefore by nature and choice the children of wrath, justly condemned in the sight of God, wholly unable to save themselves or to contribute in any way to their acceptance with God. (Gen. 1:1–3:22; Ps. 51:5; Isa. 53:5; Rom. 3:9–18, 5:12–21; Eph. 2:1–3)

We believe that the Church is God's primary instrument, through which He is fulfilling His redemptive purposes in the earth. To equip the saints for the work of ministry, God has given the Church apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors, and teachers. We also affirm the priesthood of all believers and the importance of every Christian being joined with and actively involved in a local community of the saints. We believe that women, no less than men, are called and gifted to proclaim the gospel and do all the works of the kingdom. (Mt. 16:17–19; Acts 2:17–18, 42; Eph. 3:14–21, 4:11–16; 1 Tim. 2:11–15; Heb. 10:23–25; 1 Pet. 2:4–5, 9–10)

We believe that God has called the Church to preach the gospel to all nations, to especially remember the poor and to minister to their needs through sacrificial giving and practical service. This ministry is an expression of the heart of the Lord Jesus Christ and is an essential part of the kingdom of God. (Isa. 58:6–12, 61:1; Mt. 5:1–7:28; 28:18–20; Lk. 4:18, 21:1–4; Gal. 2:10; 1 Tim. 6:8)

We believe that Satan, originally the great and good angel Lucifer, rebelled against God, taking a multitude of angels with him. He was cast out of God's presence and is at work with his demonic hosts to establish his counter-kingdom of darkness, evil, and unrest on earth. Satan was judged and defeated at the cross of Christ and will be cast forever into the lake of fire which has been prepared for him and his angels. (Isa. 14:10–17; Ezek. 28:11–19; Mt. 12:25–29, 25:41; Jn. 12:31, 16:11; Eph. 6:10–20; Col. 2:15; 2 Pet. 2:4; Jude 6; Rev. 12:7–9, 20:10)

Well, dmoney, could you also add to that, that the veneration of Mary, as the Mother of God, and that her position as MEDIATRIX; the mediator between man and God is nothing less than a Satanic lie, from the pit of Hell itself, and to be rejected and scorned?...and That praying to her, or exalting her, in worshipful way, is the same as exalting the Devil himself, and an abomination?

Can you , or the leaders of IHOP, also declare that the veneration and exaltation of dead men, no matter their earthly works, as Saints; and praying to them as co Mediators with Mary and intermediaries in the affairs of men is a wicked and unclean act of idolatry?

Can you include submission and honor to the Pope, and the hierarchy of the Pope of the Roman Catholic church as Satanic imposter's and frauds, and deem them as wicked for usurping the One and only exalted place reserved for Christ Jesus alone away from the hearts of men?

Can you, and will you, also reject those who hold to these wicked and unclean doctrines; as deceived, and false, both dead and alive, and mark them as servants of the Devil?

Can you, and will you also reject the PRACTICES and METHODS of these deceivers, particularly "CONTEMPLATIVE" , OR "MEDITATIVE" PRAYER, as a methodology of Babylon, and wicked, and evil, and summarily reject it also?

This is about leaven; poison. A little of it grows, until it ruins the loaf. Where do you stand?

"They have rejected almost all Catholic teachings . Remember all churches originated from [the] Catholic church. God bless bro." ...dmoney
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This is my point exactly. They HAVE rejected ALMOST all Catholic teachings. It's the ALMOST that bothers me. That's the minor detail that will destroy you.
...........Tom

" Remember all churches originated from [the] Catholic church." dmoney
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All Churches most definitively DID NOT originate from the Catholic church. The ones that did spring from Rome were labeled:

Babylon: MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND OF THE ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.

Revelation 17:1

1. Then one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls came and talked with me, saying to me,[a] “Come, I will show you the judgment of the great harlot who sits on many waters, 2 with whom the kings of the earth committed fornication, and the inhabitants of the earth were made drunk with the wine of her fornication.”

3. So he carried me away in the Spirit into the wilderness. And I saw a woman sitting on a scarlet beast which was full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.

4. The woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet, and adorned with gold and precious stones and pearls, having in her hand a golden cup full of abominations and the filthiness of her fornication.
5 And on her forehead a name was written:

MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND OF THE ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.

6 I saw the woman, drunk with the blood of the saints and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus. And when I saw her, I marveled with great amazement.

Rome has always been the nemesis of the true and holy church of Jesus, as she is today. Throughout HISTORY, she has murdered and tortured her, more than ALL of the other cults in the World combined! She has resisted the true Word of God at every turn, and our brothers and sisters, particularly of the Reformation, refused her advances, sealing their fate in their own blood, by the tens of thousands.

"IHOP teaches to meditate on the word of God while praying. This is way off of what true new age or mystics teach.They have rejected almost all Catholic teachings ."

I have documented from their OWN website that their teachings mirror precisely what the Catholic Mystics teach about Contemplative Prayer, and have shown that it is one and the same. The Same techniques of guided Imagery and focus within have been practiced for Millennia by the Buddhist and Hindi Satanic "holy men."

This whole thing about reciting your statement of Faith and saying that this is who you are is ridiculous and meaningless. Who you are is what you teach and DO! If it quacks like a duck, walks like a duck, and looks like a duck; IT'S A DUCK!

IHOP is a modern monastic order of the prophetic Catholic and Mystic ilk. It teaches that sacrifice and devotion is the way pleasing to the Lord,and the more devoted and sacrificial the better; thereby promoting an Elitist spirit that defies the Grace of God. It practices and teaches unscriptural and dangerous methods to do so, and will lead you away from God, while claiming to lead you into Him. It is a mixture.

Avoid. Return to the "old Gospel" of the Fathers. It may be boring, and not so hip, but in the end, you will not be defiled, nor fall into a ditch.

"" Remember all churches originated from [the] Catholic church." dmoney"

Wow! I suggest that dmoney , for starters, read "The Pilgrim Church." The Catholic Church, from its inception, has been an enemy to genuine Christianity.......brother Frank (Ex-Catholic)

When was it's inception. What was the date?

Hi dmoney, there is no actual date, but if you study the early church history, one could say the "Catholic church," really started after Constantine. Either way, its mid 3rd to mid 4th ad.........Frank

Brother Tom I do reject all of the above. With the exception of CONTEMPLATIVE" , OR "MEDITATIVE" PRAYER. To contemplate or meditate is a clear instruction in the bible. We are told to meditate on the word day and night. Just because the mystics meditate do we stop ? I think not . That is like saying because the devil corrupted music with rock and roll, all music is corrupt. We don't do that do we? We still praise God with music don't we? In fact the way Lucifer did it before he fell is still probably correct sense he was in charge of worship. Are we not to live a life of sacrifice ? Doesn't Romans 12:1 tell us to live as living sacrifices. The issue is the motivation and the allegiance we have. IF it is any thing other than Jesus we had better quit meditating. The bible tells us to cast down vain imaginations and anything that exalts it's self against God. Not imaginations that bring God glory or imaginations that Imagen the things in God's word. Ihop does not believe that everything is one ,or we enter into a higher state of consciousness they are trying to draw near to God through Jesus Christ. Doesn't the bible say to think on whatever is praise worthy excellent of good report . Is it not saying to choose to meditate on the things of God. The harlot or prostitute is any of God's people that sell themselves for a price just like the pharisees in the days of Jesus or the RRC with King Charlemagne in 800 THE HOLY ROMAN EMPIRE or all the churches that take faith based money from the gov. today with an agreement to not mention the name of Jesus while doing the thing they are being paid for. The harlot/prostitute has sold herself for money. If I were you I would be more concerned about the spirit of the world / materialism that is in the church, our kids being indoctrinated into the anti-christ system in public schools. Our president who's personal mentor was Saul Alenski on the preface of his book Rules For Radicals he says the first successful radical was Lucifer therefor all praise should go to Lucifer. The true harlot of today which will include all religions unified with the world gov. the UN. modern day Babylon.The true new age church With ALLIS BAILY, the Lucifer trust then the lucus trust and now the council on foreign relations by the way they control all of the world money systems. All Nations and religions coming together for a unity of tolerance one purpose ,world peace with no allegiance to Jesus which is God's word. Rev. 17:18 the only city that rules over the kings of the Earth is New York City because the UN. is located in it. It is actually this kingdom which is also the false prophet kingdom ( THE LAMB OF REV. 13 a lamb signifying a young nation that was christ like who rose to such great power that it had enough influence to influence the whole world),Rev.13:1-2 that causes the whole Earth to worship the Beast. The anti- christ kingdom ruled by ten kings( the EU. with only 10 nations who are full members with the power to VOTE under the modified Brussels treaty) , hence ten kings the power to rule or lead. Have you herd of the Alliance of Civilizational past in the UN. The EU. AND US are working HAND IN HAND to erect a global police system under the AOC.past in the UN. These are the initiatives past in the US under AOC. mandate The Real ID. Act past May 11 2008, the US passport with the viria chip in it , the twik card and many more I am sure we are not aware of. Brothers I am very aware of the of what the new agers the Illuminati are talking about. The differance is are we seeking the devil or God through Jesus. You have prophets and you have psychic one is taped into God the other the devil. However I appreciate everyone's input and I will keep a close eye on everything in this hour. I believe we all had better be in deep fellowship with God so we know his voice. The church is in desperate need of eyes to see I encourage all to pray earnestly for all the saints that God will give all who love him eyes to see and ears to hear !!!!!

yes that is it . God bless you brother . I pray that God bring His body on one accord! That we would claim nothing for our selves and He would replace all of our worldly mind sets with eternal truths that would leave us in awe!!!!!

I guess we will have to denounce every Christian school that charges, also if you put your signature on a mortgage you are in violation of scripture. DIDN'T JESUS SAY MY YOKE IS EASY. The perfect law that gives freedom??? GOD bless all the saints . Lord give your saints eyes to see.

I believe in God, the Father Almighty,
the Maker of heaven and earth,
and in Jesus Christ, His only Son, our Lord:

Who was conceived by the Holy Ghost,
born of the virgin Mary,
suffered under Pontius Pilate,
was crucified, dead, and buried;

He descended into hell.

The third day He arose again from the dead;

He ascended into heaven,
and sitteth on the right hand of God the Father Almighty;
from thence he shall come to judge the quick and the dead.

I believe in the Holy Ghost;
the holy catholic church;
the communion of saints;
the forgiveness of sins;
the resurrection of the body;
and the life everlasting.

Amen

Certainly the word Catholic can be interchange with universal, as in the ONE and only church of the Lord. Let us not digress in a battle of semantics. we are talking about the influence of the ROMAN Catholic Church of the Vatican, in Rome. The one Pilate feared that in NOT executing Jesus; the wrath of the judgment of blasphemy would fall on him, because Caesar was god almighty. The one and same the pharisees feared, that mockingly, if they let Jesus continue proclaiming Himself as Messiah, the anointed One, THE ROMANS WOULD COME AND "REMOVE OUR NATION AND OUR PLACE!"...because He would Prove he was "ONE WITH THE FATHER!"

This is the exact same religion, that has always been at war with god's holy seed, from ancient times in Assyria, Egypt, Babylon. Greece, and finally Rome.

So that we see that this Catholic order was really a religion; a means to honor God. It began a war with the church, and it hunted, tortured and executed several of the first apostles, and hounded the Church. Nero, the "KING GOD"...[ The title of Caesar] liked to use them as human torches for his evening parties...fed them and their children to hungry wolves, bears and lions..alive and squirming...as entertainment. It goes on and on.

Around the time of Constantine, the Roman CATHOLIC [ as they like to call themselves] priests, the priests of the worldwide Satanic worship order, walked through a shallow stream outside Rome, and declared themselves baptized into the Christian faith. They proceeded to hammer everyone of their feasts..[ Christmas, Easter etc.] and unclean doctrines and practices into christian vernacular.

The high holy satanic King-god, became the VICAR of Christ, and his plethora of organized Priests of Baal, became the roman catholic Priesthood, holding the exact same rites, on the exact same days, in the exact same manner, using Christianese...and changing things up a bit. The SATANIC QUEEN OF HEAVEN became MARY, the mother of God, and the major demons in this ancient worship, were worshipped just the same, on the exact days as millenia past, as SAINTS!

Everything was covered in symbols, just as it is today; but it is just the same as it was practiced 1000 years before Abraham. It is Satan worship, including the BAALS...the Lords of satanic order.

So back to IHOP. Is IHOP Catholic; No, it is not. The question is; do they PRACTICE Roman Catholic doctrine? The answer is YES; in several ways...and the sub-question would be, do they TOLERATE Roman Catholic doctrine...IE...fellowship the RCC and their luminaries, receive them as friends, and teach these doctrines . The answer is a resounding YES, sadly.

[ SEE 2nd cont.]

Hi Know -Him. I am not sure if this is the proper place to discuss this issue , perhaps another thread would be interesting. Yet since you asked the question and made a statement, let me reply. The term catholic, small c , meaning universal, was widely used before Constanine. The Roman Catholic system is something quite different and unique. As for the "Apostles Creed," it is so named because there was a myth that each Apostle added a piece to that creed. There is no proof of this and in fact the earliest we can date the creed as we know it today is 390ad.

There are so many myths out there about the Roman Catholic church. Brothertom is correct though, from its very inception, it has hunted down and killed all who would not conform to its ways. Any group that aligns itself with the Roman Catholic church or refuses to acknowledge that at its core it is an evil institution, is in serious error. Remember, there are over one billion Catholics on the planet, just over one sixth of the population of the world. When the Evangelicals signed a pact in the 90s that they would not "prozeletyze," Roman Catholics because they were brothers and sisters in Christ, it could well have marked the beginning of the end of the Evangelicals.......brother Frank

IHOP received much of it's devotional character that was derived by Mike bickle's belief that the Roman Catholic Mystics obtained a higher revelation. These mystics are openly promoted at IHOP, and are among Mike's list of top ten "Must reads".I will also add that Mike travelled to the Vatican, and had a meeting with the Pope.[ how intimate, I do not know..].

I will also add that Mike has ministered publicly with those of the Roman Catholic clergy. I have witnessed this personally, and IHOP does receive them. I confronted the leadership at IHOP about this, and was met with a; "well , their coming around; God is Love " response. IHOP believes that they are connected with several Catholic "PRAYER ROOMS" in Europe, and I have witnessed the leader, a Catholic NUN, a MOTHER SUPERIOR, from a European country, on the platform speaking; ministering. This is the "Toleration of JEZEBEL"

Revelation 2:20
"Nevertheless, I have this against you: You tolerate that woman Jezebel, who calls herself a prophetess. By her teaching she misleads my servants into sexual immorality and the eating of food sacrificed to idols."

You begin your journey into the Roman Catholic temple by bowing, and "genuflecting"...making signs, before an IDOL, a statue, of a bleeding Jesus; and then to the Queen of Heaven herself...

Mary:....Astarte; the demoness of all the World. Is this the fellowship of the Saints? It is pagan ceremony, presented as holy; and it is wicked.

We are commanded not to have fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness....
Ephesians 5:10-12
(New King James Version)

10... finding out what is acceptable to the Lord.
11 "And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather expose them."

12 For it is shameful even to speak of those things which are done by them in secret."

This shameful idolatry would surely qualify as [ an unfruitful work of darkness."

We are not to even let another with a perverted gospel into our homes, much less embrace them as ministry partners.

"But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed.

9. As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed.

10. For do I now persuade men, or God? Or do I seek to please men? For if I still pleased men, I would not be a bondservant of Christ."
AND!

2 John 1:9-11 (King James Version)

9. "Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.

10. If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:

11. For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds."

Certainly the perverted doctrines of Roman Catholicism would qualify as "TRANSGRESSION."

For those who minister and teach; We are to utterly reject them, and their word. Ihop does not do this, but receives them, and practices some of their methods also. this is corruption, and wicked. It is a leaven, no matter how small or insignificant you may seem it to be.

I wanted to bring back up the obvious violation of scripture at Ihop, and the "de-facto" [practices] behavior of the jist of their ministry. It is monastic in nature, driven bt the Catholic sub-doctrine of justification by works, and devotion. The more devotion and intensity of committment, the better, and the more pleasing to God .

This is the driving and compelling force that chains one to believe that they have become a "PRAYER MISSIONARY FOR GOD!" Young people are recruited, who are able to fulfill these Spartan duties, with the idea that they are part of this High Prophetic Call until Jesus returns. They are flattered often that they are a part of this elite and committed forerunner generation.

The worship sets are by rote, predetermined. They recite the sets, over and over, with some improvision built in. Cantor; responsive singing is done also in a methodical way, returning phrases and pieces of the person praying, with some improvision. This is called praise and prayer.

The prayers are in general confined to a set of 10 or 12 "Apostolic" prayers that Mike Bickle has set to follow; within the parameters, so to speak. Different nations, and venues are then addressed in intercession in that manner. These are by no means Spirit led, or generated. They are routine, and disciplined. They are in effect, performances. This is the offering of IHOP. It is patterned after the tabernacle of David; the same as the Catholic monasteries that did the exact same practices,... mimicking.

It is not born of the Spirit of God, as true worship always is.

They are big on fasting coorporately, some speech fasting, and extreme devotion...but it's discipline; not spirit led.

Colossians 2:22-23 (King James Version)

22.
"Which all are to perish with the using;) after the commandments and doctrines of men?

23. Which things have indeed a shew of wisdom in will worship, and humility, and neglecting of the body: not in any honour to the satisfying of the flesh."

Here are some of the scripture violated there.

1. Contemplative prayer. It is pagan in custom and historically. It is the Babylonian counterfeit to true prayer. It is inward, promoting mantra and guided imagery. It teaches to empty the mind, rather than pray by faith through the son of God seated at the right hand of the Father. It is pagan, and faithfully promoted by IHOP. It is a major error.

[ also aesthetic pagan practices such as "speech fasting", along with the "fasted lifestyle". It's Babylonian Catholicism.]

2. Rote, or repetitive PRAISE, done as exercise, rather than SPIRIT led by faith. Teams do SETS...over and over and over....usually 30-40 hours a week. This is deemed as WORSHIP, and it is not. It is aesthetic legalism; a counterfeit to true, free and often spontaneous praise...stemming from the heart, not the will, and a legalistic compulsion.

[2.] ...Much of this stems from the Catholic sub-doctrines of living a sacrificial life...the more you sacrifice the better. [ ultimately become a monk or nun]...always give more...and the more sacrifice the more pleasing you are to God.

[ IHOP fellowships Catholics, and particularly the "prayer cloisters" around the world. I have witnessed Nuns and "fathers" on stage with Mike in the early days of IHOP.["Have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of DARKNESS!"]...again...experience trumps doctrine..]

At IHOP the devotees are constantly flattered as BEING PRAYER MISSIONARRIES"..."FORERUNNERS"...and "FRIENDS OF THE BRIDEGROOM"...and bannered as the "one half of one per-cent" who devote all to Jesus....The super-spiritual few...like Elijah, and John the Baptist. It always promotes "HIGH SPIRITUALITY" and ends in "COLD LOVE", as all monasteries do. It is bondage, but these kids believe it. It freezes their spiritual growth in pride; believing they are something they are not.

3. The taking of Oaths. This is forbidden in the bible...and is used to control. It is actually called sacred by the IHOP mandate, and it is a document that you must sign, to be a part of her. IHOP demands that you swear this oath, with your signature. This controls the prayer room, the musicians, and the teams that perform. Often it is for a period of time..several months, a year, or whatever the requirement for the level that you buy into.

4. [ related to 3.] The selling of the ministry. You must pay IHOP to be there...and more or less, according to the level you attain. Beginners pay as much as 4500 dollars for a six month program. You must pay for teaching..and certain classes. The "students" are urged to solicit there friends and families and previous local churches for the cash, which in turn is handed over to the Ihop leaders.

The students are taught the methods of the fund raising missionary. Letters, pleas and speaking trips to get "supporters" on board, all for the "prayer missionary" that you have became. Professional beggary.

5. Women in authority over men. This is strictly forbidden in scripture, but yet is common practice at Ihop. There is a permissive attitude that has placed several women as leaders and teachers at IHOP; The "prophetic" especially, along with other departments. This has ,in my opinion, brought much confusion, to add into the already chaotic and cold.

brothertom

1 Thess. 5:17 Never stop praying.NLV
KJV  17Pray without ceasing.
APV 17Be unceasing in prayer [praying perseveringly];

   
Day and Night
When the nation is in crisis the remedy is day and night prayer.
Exodus 34:28 So he was there with the Lord forty days and forty nights; he neither ate bread nor drank water.  And He wrote on the tablets the words of the covenant, the Ten Commandments.
Leviticus 8:35 Therefore you shall stay at the door of the tabernacle of meeting day and night for seven days, and keep the charge of the LORD, so that you may not die; for so I have been commanded.”
Deuteronomy 9:18 And I fell down before the LORD, as at the first, forty days and forty nights; I neither ate bread nor drank water, because of all your sin which you committed in doing wickedly in the sight of the LORD, to provoke Him to anger.
Deuteronomy 9:25 “Thus I prostrated myself before the LORD; forty days and forty nights I kept prostrating myself, because the LORD had said He would destroy you. Deuteronomy 10:10 “As at the first time, I stayed in the mountain forty days and forty nights; the LORD also heard me at that time, and the LORD chose not to destroy you.
Day and Night was the remedy and atonement for the sin of God’s people
Esther 4:16 “Go, gather all the Jews who are present in Shushan, and fast for me; neither eat nor drink for three days, night or day. My maids and I will fast likewise. And so I will go to the king, which is against the law; and if I perish, I perish!”
Heart set on the Lord day and night.
Leviticus 6:11-13 11 Then he is to take off these clothes and put on others, and carry the ashes outside the camp to a place that is ceremonially clean. 12 The fire on the altar must be kept burning; it must not go out. Every morning the priest is to add firewood and arrange the burnt offering on the fire and burn the fat of the fellowship offerings [a] on it. 13 The fire must be kept burning on the altar continuously; it must not go out.
Joshua 1:8 Key Scripture: This Book of the Law shall not depart from your mouth, but you shall meditate in it day and night, that you may observe to do according to all that is written in it. For then you will make your way prosperous, and then you will have good success.
Psalm 1:2  But his delight is in the law of the LORD, And in His law he meditates day and night.
Psalm 22    1 My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me? Why are You so far from helping Me, And from the words of My groaning? 2 O My God, I cry in the daytime, but You do not hear; And in the night season, and am not silent.           3 But You are holy, Enthroned in the praises of Israel.
We desire day and night because He is holy, not because God should answer.
Psalm 42:2-4 2 My soul thirsts for God, for the living God. When shall I come and appear before God?[a] 3 My tears have been my food day and night, While they continually say to me, “Where is your God?” Joel 2 language, Psalm 2?
Psalm 77:2 In the day of my trouble I sought the Lord; My hand was stretched out in the night without ceasing; My soul refused to be comforted.
Psalm 88:1 O LORD, God of my salvation, I have cried out day and night before You.
Psalm 132:4 I will allow no sleep to my eyes, no slumber to my eyelids, until I establish a resting place for the Lord
Isaiah 21:8 Then he cried, “A lion, my Lord! I stand continually on the watchtower in the daytime; I have sat at my post every night.
Isaiah 62:6 I have set watchmen on your walls, O Jerusalem; They shall never hold their peace day or night. You who make mention of the LORD, do not keep silent,
Jeremiah 9:1 Oh, that my head were waters, And my eyes a fountain of tears, That I might weep day and night For the slain of the daughter of my people!
Jeremiah 14:17 “Therefore you shall say this word to them: ‘ Let my eyes flow with tears night and day, And let them not cease; For the virgin daughter of my people Has been broken with a mighty stroke, with a very severe blow.
Lamentations 2:18  Their heart cried out to the Lord, “ O wall of the daughter of Zion, Let tears run down like a river day and night; Give yourself no relief; Give your eyes no rest.
Pray continuously scripture 1 Thessalonians 5:17 Pray without ceasing…
Sacred space
1 Samuel 19: 18-24 18 So David fled and escaped, and went to Samuel at Ramah, and told him all that Saul had done to him. And he and Samuel went and stayed in Naioth. 19 Now it was told Saul, saying, “Take note, David is at Naioth in Ramah!” 20 Then Saul sent messengers to take David. And when they saw the group of prophets prophesying, and Samuel standing as leader over them, the Spirit of God came upon the messengers of Saul, and they also prophesied. 21 And when Saul was told, he sent other messengers, and they prophesied likewise. Then Saul sent messengers again the third time, and they prophesied also. 22 Then he also went to Ramah, and came to the great well that is at Sechu. So he asked, and said, “Where are Samuel and David?”   And someone said, “Indeed they are at Naioth in Ramah.” 23 So he went there to Naioth in Ramah. Then the Spirit of God was upon him also, and he went on and prophesied until he came to Naioth in Ramah. 24 And he also stripped off his clothes and prophesied before Samuel in like manner, and lay down naked all that day and all that night. Therefore they say, “Is Saul also among the prophets?”[a]
Samuel had made a sacred space of day and night unto the Lord that changed the atmosphere and everything that came close.
God’s attentive day and night
1 Kings 8:28-30  28 Yet regard the prayer of Your servant and his supplication, O LORD my God, and listen to the cry and the prayer which Your servant is praying before You today: 29 that Your eyes may be open toward this temple night and day, toward the place of which You said, ‘My name shall be there,’ that You may hear the prayer which Your servant makes toward this place. 30 And may You hear the supplication of Your servant and of Your people Israel, when they pray toward this place. Hear in heaven Your dwelling place; and when You hear, forgive.
1 Kings 8:59  (Key Scripture) And may these words of mine, with which I have made supplication before the LORD, be near the LORD our God day and night, that He may maintain the cause of His servant and the cause of His people Israel, as each day may require.
2 Chronicles 6:20   that Your eyes may be open toward this temple day and night, toward the place where You said You would put Your name, that You may hear the prayer which Your servant makes toward this place.
Nehemiah 1:6  please let Your ear be attentive and Your eyes open, that You may hear the prayer of Your servant which I pray before You now, day and night, for the children of Israel Your servants, and confess the sins of the children of Israel which we have sinned against You. Both my father’s house and I have sinned.
Nehemiah 4:9 (Key Scripture) Nevertheless we made our prayer to our God, and because of them we set a watch against them day and night.
Nehemiah 4:22  At the same time I also said to the people, “Let each man and his servant stay at night in Jerusalem, that they may be our guard by night and a working party by day.”
“On Earth as it is in heaven”, is our prayer.  If God is worthy of Day and Night worship and adoration in heaven then He is worthy of it on earth.
Revelation 4:8 The four living creatures, each having six wings, were full of eyes around and within. And they do not rest day or night, saying: “ Holy, holy, holy, Lord God Almighty, Who was and is and is to come!”
Revelation 4:8 The four living creatures, each having six wings, were full of eyes around and within. And they do not rest day or night, saying: “ Holy, holy, holy, Lord God Almighty, Who was and is and is to come!”
Revelation 7:15 Therefore they are before the throne of God, and serve Him day and night in His temple. And He who sits on the throne will dwell among them.
Isaiah 4:5  then the LORD will create above every dwelling place of Mount Zion, and above her assemblies, a cloud and smoke by day and the shining of a flaming fire by night. For over all the glory there will be a covering.
This is a future foretelling, possibly of a city of refuge type covering, where the Lord will dwell day and night.  Christ in us the hope of Glory, the knowledge of the glory of God shall cover the earth as the waters cover the sea.
It is the judgments of God to serve other God’s day and night.
Jeremiah 16:13 (Judgment Scripture to serve other God’s day and night) Therefore I will cast you out of this land into a land that you do not know, neither you nor your fathers; and there you shall serve other gods day and night, where I will not show you favor.’
It is the judgments of God to serve ourselves and or money.  Can’t serve both, one leads to life and the other to destruction.
Jonah 1:17 [ Jonah’s Prayer and Deliverance ] Now the LORD had prepared a great fish to swallow Jonah. And Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights.
Prophetic sign and type of Jesus’ intercession in the belly of hades/hell for three days and three nights.
Matthew 12:40 For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.
New Testament Scriptures and Applications
Matthew 4:2 And when He (Jesus) had fasted forty days and forty nights, afterward He was hungry.
Luke 2:37 (Anna in the temple) and this woman was a widow of about eighty-four years, who did not depart from the temple, but served God with fastings and prayers night and day.
Luke 6:12 [ The Twelve Apostles ] Now it came to pass in those days that He went out to the mountain to pray, and continued all night in prayer to God.
Luke 18:7 And shall God not avenge His own elect who cry out day and night to Him, though He bears long with them?
Luke 21:37 And in the daytime He was teaching in the temple, but at night He went out and stayed on the mountain called Olivet.
Acts 20:31 Therefore watch, and remember that for three years I did not cease to warn everyone night and day with tears.
Acts 26:7 To this promise our twelve tribes, earnestly serving God night and day, hope to attain. For this hope’s sake, King Agrippa, I am accused by the Jews.
1 Thessalonians 3:10 night and day praying exceedingly that we may see your face and perfect what is lacking in your faith?
1 Timothy 5:5 Now she who is really a widow, and left alone, trusts in God and continues in supplications and prayers night and day.
2 Timothy 1:3 [ Timothy’s Faith and Heritage ] I thank God, whom I serve with a pure conscience, as my forefathers did, as without ceasing I remember you in my prayers night and day,
Always Pray
Luke 18:1[ The Parable of the Persistent Widow ] Then Jesus told his disciples a parable to show them that they should always pray and not give up.
Luke 21:36 Be always on the watch, and pray that you may be able to escape all that is about to happen, and that you may be able to stand before the Son of Man.”
Ephesians 6:18 And pray in the Spirit on all occasions with all kinds of prayers and requests. With this in mind, be alert and always keep on praying for all the saints.
Philippians 1:4 In all my prayers for all of you, I always pray with joy
Colossians 1:3  [ Thanksgiving and Prayer ] We always thank God, the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, when we pray for you,
Colossians 4:12 Epaphras, who is one of you and a servant of Christ Jesus, sends greetings. He is always wrestling in prayer for you, that you may stand firm in all the will of God, mature and fully assured.
1 Thessalonians 1:2  [ Thanksgiving for the Thessalonians' Faith ] We always thank God for all of you, mentioning you in our prayers.
2 Thessalonians 1:3 [ Thanksgiving and Prayer ] We ought always to thank God for you, brothers, and rightly so, because your faith is growing more and more, and the love every one of you has for each other is increasing.
Philemon 1:4 [ Thanksgiving and Prayer ] I always thank my God as I remember you in my prayers,
Apostolic Vocation
Acts 6:4
and will give our attention to prayer and the ministry of the word.”
1 Samuel 25
David and the Wife of Nabal

2 Now there was a man in Maon whose business was in Carmel, and the man was very rich. He had three thousand sheep and a thousand goats. And he was shearing his sheep in Carmel. 3 The name of the man was Nabal, and the name of his wife Abigail. And she was a woman of good understanding and beautiful appearance; but the man was harsh and evil in his doings. He was of the house of Caleb.

4 When David heard in the wilderness that Nabal was shearing his sheep, 5 David sent ten young men; and David said to the young men, “Go up to Carmel, go to Nabal, and greet him in my name. 6 And thus you shall say to him who lives in prosperity: ‘Peace be to you, peace to your house, and peace to all that you have! 7 Now I have heard that you have shearers. Your shepherds were with us, and we did not hurt them, nor was there anything missing from them all the while they were in Carmel. 8 Ask your young men, and they will tell you. Therefore let my young men find favor in your eyes, for we come on a feast day. Please give whatever comes to your hand to your servants and to your son David.’”

9 So when David’s young men came, they spoke to Nabal according to all these words in the name of David, and waited.

10 Then Nabal answered David’s servants, and said, “Who is David, and who is the son of Jesse? There are many servants nowadays who break away each one from his master. 11 Shall I then take my bread and my water and my meat that I have killed for my shearers, and give it to men when I do not know where they are from?”

12 So David’s young men turned on their heels and went back; and they came and told him all these words. 13 Then David said to his men, “Every man gird on his sword.” So every man girded on his sword, and David also girded on his sword. And about four hundred men went with David, and two hundred stayed with the supplies.

14 Now one of the young men told Abigail, Nabal’s wife, saying, “Look, David sent messengers from the wilderness to greet our master; and he reviled them. 15 But the men were very good to us, and we were not hurt, nor did we miss anything as long as we accompanied them, when we were in the fields. 16 They were a wall to us both by night and day, all the time we were with them keeping the sheep. 17 Now therefore, know and consider what you will do, for harm is determined against our master and against all his household. For he is such a scoundrel[b] that one cannot speak to him.”

18 Then Abigail made haste and took two hundred loaves of bread, two skins of wine, five sheep already dressed, five seahs of roasted grain, one hundred clusters of raisins, and two hundred cakes of figs, and loaded them on donkeys. 19 And she said to her servants, “Go on before me; see, I am coming after you.” But she did not tell her husband Nabal.

20 So it was, as she rode on the donkey, that she went down under cover of the hill; and there were David and his men, coming down toward her, and she met them. 21 Now David had said, “Surely in vain I have protected all that this fellow has in the wilderness, so that nothing was missed of all that belongs to him. And he has repaid me evil for good. 22 May God do so, and more also, to the enemies of David, if I leave one male of all who belong to him by morning light.”

23 Now when Abigail saw David, she dismounted quickly from the donkey, fell on her face before David, and bowed down to the ground. 24 So she fell at his feet and said: “On me, my lord, on me let this iniquity be! …. ( She pleads with the King and finds favor with David)

36 Now Abigail went to Nabal, and there he was, holding a feast in his house, like the feast of a king. And Nabal’s heart was merry within him, for he was very drunk; therefore she told him nothing, little or much, until morning light. 37 So it was, in the morning, when the wine had gone from Nabal, and his wife had told him these things, that his heart died within him, and he became like a stone. 38 Then it happened, after about ten days, that the LORD struck Nabal, and he died.

39 So when David heard that Nabal was dead, he said, “Blessed be the LORD, who has pleaded the cause of my reproach from the hand of Nabal, and has kept His servant from evil! For the LORD has returned the wickedness of Nabal on his own head.”

And David sent and proposed to Abigail, to take her as his wife. 40 When the servants of David had come to Abigail at Carmel, they spoke to her saying, “David sent us to you, to ask you to become his wife.”

41 Then she arose, bowed her face to the earth, and said, “Here is your maidservant, a servant to wash the feet of the servants of my lord.” 42 So Abigail rose in haste and rode on a donkey, attended by five of her maidens; and she followed the messengers of David, and became his wife. 43 David also took Ahinoam of Jezreel, and so both of them were his wives.

Exodus 10:13

So Moses stretched out his rod over the land of Egypt, and the LORD brought an east wind on the land all that day and all that night. When it was morning, the east wind brought the locusts.

Exodus 13:21

And the LORD went before them by day in a pillar of cloud to lead the way, and by night in a pillar of fire to give them light, so as to go by day and night.

Exodus 13:22

He did not take away the pillar of cloud by day or the pillar of fire by night from before the people.

Exodus 24:18

So Moses went into the midst of the cloud and went up into the mountain. And Moses was on the mountain forty days and forty nights.

Exodus 34:28

So he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he neither ate bread nor drank water. And He wrote on the tablets the words of the covenant, the Ten Commandments.

Exodus 40:38

For the cloud of the LORD was above the tabernacle by day, and fire was over it by night, in the sight of all the house of Israel, throughout all their journeys.

Leviticus 6:11-13

11 Then he is to take off these clothes and put on others, and carry the ashes outside the camp to a place that is ceremonially clean. 12 The fire on the altar must be kept burning; it must not go out. Every morning the priest is to add firewood and arrange the burnt offering on the fire and burn the fat of the fellowship offerings [a] on it. 13 The fire must be kept burning on the altar continuously; it must not go out.

Leviticus 8:35

Therefore you shall stay at the door of the tabernacle of meeting day and night for seven days, and keep the charge of the LORD, so that you may not die; for so I have been commanded.”

Numbers 9:16

So it was always: the cloud covered it by day, and the appearance of fire by night.

Deuteronomy 1:33

who went in the way before you to search out a place for you to pitch your tents, to show you the way you should go, in the fire by night and in the cloud by day.

Deuteronomy 9:9

When I went up into the mountain to receive the tablets of stone, the tablets of the covenant which the LORD made with you, then I stayed on the mountain forty days and forty nights. I neither ate bread nor drank water.

Deuteronomy 9:11

And it came to pass, at the end of forty days and forty nights, that the LORD gave me the two tablets of stone, the tablets of the covenant.

Deuteronomy 9:18

And I fell down before the LORD, as at the first, forty days and forty nights; I neither ate bread nor drank water, because of all your sin which you committed in doing wickedly in the sight of the LORD, to provoke Him to anger.

Deuteronomy 9:25

Key Scripture “Thus I prostrated myself before the LORD; forty days and forty nights I kept prostrating myself, because the LORD had said He would destroy you.

Deuteronomy 10:10

Key scripture “As at the first time, I stayed in the mountain forty days and forty nights; the LORD also heard me at that time, and the LORD chose not to destroy you.

Joshua 1:8

Key Scripture: This Book of the Law shall not depart from your mouth, but you shall meditate in it day and night, that you may observe to do according to all that is written in it. For then you will make your way prosperous, and then you will have good success.

1 Samuel 19: 18-24 18 So David fled and escaped, and went to Samuel at Ramah, and told him all that Saul had done to him. And he and Samuel went and stayed in Naioth. 19 Now it was told Saul, saying, “Take note, David is at Naioth in Ramah!” 20 Then Saul sent messengers to take David. And when they saw the group of prophets prophesying, and Samuel standing as leader over them, the Spirit of God came upon the messengers of Saul, and they also prophesied. 21 And when Saul was told, he sent other messengers, and they prophesied likewise. Then Saul sent messengers again the third time, and they prophesied also. 22 Then he also went to Ramah, and came to the great well that is at Sechu. So he asked, and said, “Where are Samuel and David?”

And someone said, “Indeed they are at Naioth in Ramah.” 23 So he went there to Naioth in Ramah. Then the Spirit of God was upon him also, and he went on and prophesied until he came to Naioth in Ramah. 24 And he also stripped off his clothes and prophesied before Samuel in like manner, and lay down naked all that day and all that night. Therefore they say, “Is Saul also among the prophets?”[a]

1 Samuel 25

Death of Samuel

1 Then Samuel died; and the Israelites gathered together and lamented for him, and buried him at his home in Ramah. And David arose and went down to the Wilderness of Paran.[a]

David and the Wife of Nabal

2 Now there was a man in Maon whose business was in Carmel, and the man was very rich. He had three thousand sheep and a thousand goats. And he was shearing his sheep in Carmel. 3 The name of the man was Nabal, and the name of his wife Abigail. And she was a woman of good understanding and beautiful appearance; but the man was harsh and evil in his doings. He was of the house of Caleb.

4 When David heard in the wilderness that Nabal was shearing his sheep, 5 David sent ten young men; and David said to the young men, “Go up to Carmel, go to Nabal, and greet him in my name. 6 And thus you shall say to him who lives in prosperity: ‘Peace be to you, peace to your house, and peace to all that you have! 7 Now I have heard that you have shearers. Your shepherds were with us, and we did not hurt them, nor was there anything missing from them all the while they were in Carmel. 8 Ask your young men, and they will tell you. Therefore let my young men find favor in your eyes, for we come on a feast day. Please give whatever comes to your hand to your servants and to your son David.’”

9 So when David’s young men came, they spoke to Nabal according to all these words in the name of David, and waited.

10 Then Nabal answered David’s servants, and said, “Who is David, and who is the son of Jesse? There are many servants nowadays who break away each one from his master. 11 Shall I then take my bread and my water and my meat that I have killed for my shearers, and give it to men when I do not know where they are from?”

12 So David’s young men turned on their heels and went back; and they came and told him all these words. 13 Then David said to his men, “Every man gird on his sword.” So every man girded on his sword, and David also girded on his sword. And about four hundred men went with David, and two hundred stayed with the supplies.

14 Now one of the young men told Abigail, Nabal’s wife, saying, “Look, David sent messengers from the wilderness to greet our master; and he reviled them. 15 But the men were very good to us, and we were not hurt, nor did we miss anything as long as we accompanied them, when we were in the fields. 16 They were a wall to us both by night and day, all the time we were with them keeping the sheep. 17 Now therefore, know and consider what you will do, for harm is determined against our master and against all his household. For he is such a scoundrel[b] that one cannot speak to him.”

18 Then Abigail made haste and took two hundred loaves of bread, two skins of wine, five sheep already dressed, five seahs of roasted grain, one hundred clusters of raisins, and two hundred cakes of figs, and loaded them on donkeys. 19 And she said to her servants, “Go on before me; see, I am coming after you.” But she did not tell her husband Nabal.

20 So it was, as she rode on the donkey, that she went down under cover of the hill; and there were David and his men, coming down toward her, and she met them. 21 Now David had said, “Surely in vain I have protected all that this fellow has in the wilderness, so that nothing was missed of all that belongs to him. And he has repaid me evil for good. 22 May God do so, and more also, to the enemies of David, if I leave one male of all who belong to him by morning light.”

23 Now when Abigail saw David, she dismounted quickly from the donkey, fell on her face before David, and bowed down to the ground. 24 So she fell at his feet and said: “On me, my lord, on me let this iniquity be! And please let your maidservant speak in your ears, and hear the words of your maidservant. 25 Please, let not my lord regard this scoundrel Nabal. For as his name is, so is he: Nabal[c]is his name, and folly is with him! But I, your maidservant, did not see the young men of my lord whom you sent. 26 Now therefore, my lord, as the LORD lives and as your soul lives, since the LORD has held you back from coming to bloodshed and from avenging yourself with your own hand, now then, let your enemies and those who seek harm for my lord be as Nabal. 27 And now this present which your maidservant has brought to my lord, let it be given to the young men who follow my lord. 28 Please forgive the trespass of your maidservant. For the LORD will certainly make for my lord an enduring house, because my lord fights the battles of the LORD, and evil is not found in you throughout your days. 29 Yet a man has risen to pursue you and seek your life, but the life of my lord shall be bound in the bundle of the living with the LORD your God; and the lives of your enemies He shall sling out, as from the pocket of a sling. 30 And it shall come to pass, when the LORD has done for my lord according to all the good that He has spoken concerning you, and has appointed you ruler over Israel, 31 that this will be no grief to you, nor offense of heart to my lord, either that you have shed blood without cause, or that my lord has avenged himself. But when the LORD has dealt well with my lord, then remember your maidservant.”

32 Then David said to Abigail: “Blessed is the LORD God of Israel, who sent you this day to meet me! 33 And blessed is your advice and blessed are you, because you have kept me this day from coming to bloodshed and from avenging myself with my own hand. 34 For indeed, as the LORD God of Israel lives, who has kept me back from hurting you, unless you had hurried and come to meet me, surely by morning light no males would have been left to Nabal!” 35 So David received from her hand what she had brought him, and said to her, “Go up in peace to your house. See, I have heeded your voice and respected your person.”

36 Now Abigail went to Nabal, and there he was, holding a feast in his house, like the feast of a king. And Nabal’s heart was merry within him, for he was very drunk; therefore she told him nothing, little or much, until morning light. 37 So it was, in the morning, when the wine had gone from Nabal, and his wife had told him these things, that his heart died within him, and he became like a stone. 38 Then it happened, after about ten days, that the LORD struck Nabal, and he died.

39 So when David heard that Nabal was dead, he said, “Blessed be the LORD, who has pleaded the cause of my reproach from the hand of Nabal, and has kept His servant from evil! For the LORD has returned the wickedness of Nabal on his own head.”

And David sent and proposed to Abigail, to take her as his wife. 40 When the servants of David had come to Abigail at Carmel, they spoke to her saying, “David sent us to you, to ask you to become his wife.”

41 Then she arose, bowed her face to the earth, and said, “Here is your maidservant, a servant to wash the feet of the servants of my lord.” 42 So Abigail rose in haste and rode on a donkey, attended by five of her maidens; and she followed the messengers of David, and became his wife. 43 David also took Ahinoam of Jezreel, and so both of them were his wives.

44 But Saul had given Michal his daughter, David’s wife, to Palti[d] the son of Laish, who was from Gallim.

1 Kings 8:28-30

28 Yet regard the prayer of Your servant and his supplication, O LORD my God, and listen to the cry and the prayer which Your servant is praying before You today: 29 that Your eyes may be open toward this temple night and day, toward the place of which You said, ‘My name shall be there,’ that You may hear the prayer which Your servant makes toward this place. 30 And may You hear the supplication of Your servant and of Your people Israel, when they pray toward this place. Hear in heaven Your dwelling place; and when You hear, forgive.

1 Kings 8:59

Key Scripture And may these words of mine, with which I have made supplication before the LORD, be near the LORD our God day and night, that He may maintain the cause of His servant and the cause of His people Israel, as each day may require,

2 Chronicles 6:20

that Your eyes may be open toward this temple day and night, toward the place where You said You would put Your name, that You may hear the prayer which Your servant makes toward this place.

Nehemiah 1:6

please let Your ear be attentive and Your eyes open, that You may hear the prayer of Your servant which I pray before You now, day and night, for the children of Israel Your servants, and confess the sins of the children of Israel which we have sinned against You. Both my father’s house and I have sinned.

Nehemiah 4:9 (Key Scripture)

Nevertheless we made our prayer to our God, and because of them we set a watch against them day and night.

Nehemiah 4:22

At the same time I also said to the people, “Let each man and his servant stay at night in Jerusalem, that they may be our guard by night and a working party by day.”

Nehemiah 9:12

Moreover You led them by day with a cloudy pillar,And by night with a pillar of fire, To give them light on the road Which they should travel.

Nehemiah 9:19

Yet in Your manifold mercies You did not forsake them in the wilderness. The pillar of the cloud did not depart from them by day, To lead them on the road; Nor the pillar of fire by night, To show them light, And the way they should go.

Esther 4:16

“Go, gather all the Jews who are present in Shushan, and fast for me; neither eat nor drink for three days, night or day. My maids and I will fast likewise. And so I will go to the king, which is against the law; and if I perish, I perish!”

Psalm 1:2

But his delight is in the law of the LORD,And in His law he meditates day and night.

Psalm 19:2

Day unto day utters speech,And night unto night reveals knowledge.

Psalm 22

1 My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me?

Why are You so far from helping Me,

And from the words of My groaning?

2 O My God, I cry in the daytime, but You do not hear;

And in the night season, and am not silent.

3 But You are holy,

Enthroned in the praises of Israel.

Psalm 42:2-4

2 My soul thirsts for God, for the living God.

When shall I come and appear before God?[a]

3 My tears have been my food day and night,

While they continually say to me,

“Where is your God?”

4 When I remember these things,

I pour out my soul within me.

For I used to go with the multitude;

I went with them to the house of God,

With the voice of joy and praise,

With a multitude that kept a pilgrim feast.

Psalm 42:8

The LORD will command His lovingkindness in the daytime, And in the night His song shall be with me— A prayer to the God of my life.

Psalm 74:16

The day is Yours, the night also is Yours;You have prepared the light and the sun.

Psalm 77:2

In the day of my trouble I sought the Lord; My hand was stretched out in the night without ceasing; My soul refused to be comforted.

Psalm 88:1

O LORD, God of my salvation,I have cried out day and night before You.

Psalm 132:4

I will allow no sleep to my eyes, no slumber to my eyelids,

Isaiah 4:5

then the LORD will create above every dwelling place of Mount Zion, and above her assemblies, a cloud and smoke by day and the shining of a flaming fire by night. For over all the glory there will be a covering.

Isaiah 21:8

Then he cried, “A lion, my Lord! I stand continually on the watchtower in the daytime; I have sat at my post every night.

Isaiah 62:6

I have set watchmen on your walls, O Jerusalem; They shall never hold their peace day or night. You who make mention of the LORD, do not keep silent,

Jeremiah 9:1

Oh, that my head were waters, And my eyes a fountain of tears, That I might weep day and night For the slain of the daughter of my people!

Jeremiah 14:17

“Therefore you shall say this word to them: ‘ Let my eyes flow with tears night and day, And let them not cease; For the virgin daughter of my people Has been broken with a mighty stroke, with a very severe blow.

Jeremiah 16:13 (Judgement Scripture to serve other God’s day and night)

Therefore I will cast you out of this land into a land that you do not know, neither you nor your fathers; and there you shall serve other gods day and night, where I will not show you favor.’

Jeremiah 33:20

“Thus says the LORD: ‘If you can break My covenant with the day and My covenant with the night, so that there will not be day and night in their season,

Jeremiah 33:25

“Thus says the LORD: ‘If My covenant is not with day and night, and if I have not appointed the ordinances of heaven and earth,

Lamentations 2:18

Their heart cried out to the Lord, “ O wall of the daughter of Zion, Let tears run down like a river day and night; Give yourself no relief; Give your eyes no rest.

Jonah 1:17

[ Jonah’s Prayer and Deliverance ] Now the LORD had prepared a great fish to swallow Jonah. And Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights.

Matthew 4:2

And when He had fasted forty days and forty nights, afterward He was hungry.

Matthew 12:40

For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

Luke 2:37 (Anna in the temple)

and this woman was a widow of about eighty-four years, who did not depart from the temple, but served God with fastings and prayers night and day.

Luke 6:12

[ The Twelve Apostles ] Now it came to pass in those days that He went out to the mountain to pray, and continued all night in prayer to God.

Luke 18:7

And shall God not avenge His own elect who cry out day and night to Him, though He bears long with them?

Luke 21:37

And in the daytime He was teaching in the temple, but at night He went out and stayed on the mountain called Olivet.

Acts 20:31

Therefore watch, and remember that for three years I did not cease to warn everyone night and day with tears.

Acts 26:7

To this promise our twelve tribes, earnestly serving God night and day, hope to attain. For this hope’s sake, King Agrippa, I am accused by the Jews.

1 Thessalonians 3:10

night and day praying exceedingly that we may see your face and perfect what is lacking in your faith?

1 Timothy 5:5

Now she who is really a widow, and left alone, trusts in God and continues in supplications and prayers night and day.

2 Timothy 1:3

[ Timothy’s Faith and Heritage ] I thank God, whom I serve with a pure conscience, as my forefathers did, as without ceasing I remember you in my prayers night and day,

Revelation 4:8

The four living creatures, each having six wings, were full of eyes around and within. And they do not rest day or night, saying: “ Holy, holy, holy, Lord God Almighty, Who was and is and is to come!”

Revelation 4:8

The four living creatures, each having six wings, were full of eyes around and within. And they do not rest day or night, saying: “ Holy, holy, holy

Revelation 7:15

Therefore they are before the throne of God, and serve Him day and night in His temple. And He who sits on the throne will dwell among them.

Revelation 21:24

24 And the nations of those who are saved[a] shall walk in its light, and the kings of the earth bring their glory and honor into it.[b] 25 Its gates shall not be shut at all by day (there shall be no night there). 26 And they shall bring the glory and the honor of the nations into it.[c]

Brother Tom so you are telling me that if a catholic person comes to my church. I should not let him/her sit under my teachings. Isn't God's word for teaching correcting rebuking and training so the man of God would be thoroughly equipped for every good work or what about 2 Tim. 2:24-26. Doesn't the anointing brake the yoke. So you are saying do not let them sit under the corporate anointing ? The only thing that has the power to set them free.??? Take the teacher away. Brother Tom I have listened to a lot of Mike's teaching IT is biblically sound. I see no Catholic doctrine. Please show me the doctrine that is Catholic? Not just the way they pray. Because unless you pray with faith and love God will not hear you.

Isaiah 1:15 (New International Version)

15 When you spread out your hands in prayer,
I will hide my eyes from you;
even if you offer many prayers,
I will not listen.
Your hands are full of blood;

Isaiah 58:3-4 (New International Version)

3 'Why have we fasted,' they say,
'and you have not seen it?
Why have we humbled ourselves,
and you have not noticed?'
"Yet on the day of your fasting, you do as you please
and exploit all your workers.

4 Your fasting ends in quarreling and strife,
and in striking each other with wicked fists.
You cannot fast as you do today
and expect your voice to be heard on high.

please don't comment on the version of the bible that I use I like it better considering that King Jimmy was probably a mason as all the nobility of Scotland and England. Brother Tom you have denounced this ministry basically as one with the great prostitute. I do NOT believe This the case. I do believe there needs for clarification on their stance of the catholic religion. I know other men of God that will not attack another's religion just because they do not believe it is the best way to convert them. Would you attack a Muslim or would you be wise as a serpent and harmless as doves!!!!!

We must be careful that we do not devourer one another???

I would be the first one to say something if I thought it was demonic. I am a watchman . I pray in many of the same ways as IHOP . It started way before I knew who IHOP was. Just because I prayed and it seemed to be like the mystics prayed does that make me evil or wrong. I love Jesus. The test is do you give all to Jesus or do you with hold some from God. Gen. 22:12 Do you spend more money on you mortgage or on the kingdom of God. I bet Mike SPENDS MORE ON THE KINGDOM? Just a test? Do you give all?

"Brother Tom so you are telling me that if a catholic person comes to my church. I should not let him/her sit under my teachings. Isn't God's word for teaching correcting rebuking and training so the man of God would be thoroughly equipped for every good work ..?

Of course not, dmoney. 2 John 1:9-11 (King James Version)...The scripture below speaks of those teaching and bringing anything other than the gospel of the apostles, not those who may be in bondage to them. Yes, again, the Roman Catholic doctrines are evil, and we are not to receive those who minister them.
2 john 1:9-11
9. "Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.

10. If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:

11. For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds."

Certainly the perverted doctrines of Roman Catholicism would qualify as "TRANSGRESSION", and we are not to minister with them, befriend them, or associate with them in fellowship. The apostle John says that to do so, one would also become a "partaker of his evil deeds."

IHOP received much of it's devotional character that was derived by Mike Bickle's belief that the Roman Catholic Mystics obtained a higher revelation. These mystics are openly promoted at IHOP, and are among Mike's list of top ten "Must reads".I will also add that Mike travelled to the Vatican, and had a meeting with the Pope.[ how intimate, I do not know..].

I will also add that Mike has ministered publicly with those of the Roman Catholic clergy. I have witnessed this personally, and IHOP does receive them. I confronted the leadership at IHOP about this, and was met with a; "well , their coming around; God is Love " response. IHOP believes that they are connected with several Catholic "PRAYER ROOMS" in Europe, and I have witnessed the leader, a Catholic NUN, a MOTHER SUPERIOR, from a European country, on the platform speaking; ministering. This is the "Toleration of JEZEBEL"

Revelation 2:20
"Nevertheless, I have this against you: You tolerate that woman Jezebel, who calls herself a prophetess. By her teaching she misleads my servants into sexual immorality and the eating of food sacrificed to idols."

You begin your journey into the Roman Catholic temple by bowing, and "genuflecting"...making signs, before an IDOL, a statue, of a bleeding Jesus; and then to the Queen of Heaven herself...

Mary:....Astarte; the demoness of all the World. Is this the fellowship of the Saints? It is pagan ceremony, presented as holy; and it is wicked.

We are commanded not to have fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness....
Ephesians 5:10-12
(New King James Version)

10... finding out what is acceptable to the Lord.
11 "And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather expose them."

12 For it is shameful even to speak of those things which are done by them in secret."

This shameful idolatry would surely qualify as [ an unfruitful work of darkness."

We are not to even let another with a perverted gospel into our homes, much less embrace them as ministry partners.

"But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed.

9. As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed.

10. For do I now persuade men, or God? Or do I seek to please men? For if I still pleased men, I would not be a bondservant of Christ."
AND!

Certainly the perverted doctrines of Roman Catholicism would qualify as "TRANSGRESSION."

For those who minister and teach; We are to utterly reject them, and their word. Ihop does not do this, but receives them, and practices some of their methods also. this is corruption, and wicked. It is a leaven, no matter how small or insignificant you may seem it to be.

_____Tom____________

You said -Catholic sub-doctrine of justification by works, and devotion. The more devotion and intensity of committment, the better, and the more pleasing to God .

It says On IHOP's website that they are justified by faith through grace. They even say that what they do does not assist in any way.

What you are saying is a lie. It is as simple as that. That is the truth and I love you brother. Repent.

[ IHOP fellowships Catholics, and particularly the "prayer cloisters" around the world. I have witnessed Nuns and "fathers" on stage with Mike in the early days of IHOP.["Have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of DARKNESS!"]...again...experience trumps doctrine ...

in the early days

You are holding this man to an account on something that happened how many years ago???

You are forgetting the more important matters of the law justice mercy and faithfulness all of which IHOP teaches and practices. Luke says justice and the love for God. This is the heart beat of God and IHOP. You also say none of it is spirit born that is a lie. I have seen it.. I have been in it. They sing in the spirit . Flow in the spirit. Pray in the spirit. PRAYER Lead by the spirit. Some of the most anointed singers on the planet come out of IHOP : EDDIE JAMES , MISTY EDWARDS , CORY ASHBERRY just to name a few. There is a structure but it is just parameters to opperate within. They can move with the Spirit as he leads. God is a God of order is He not? Many of the things you are saying are not true. You see from far away . You have even testified to the truth of Mike Bickle's character which is fruit and Jesus said you shall know them by their fruit. Brother I personally know a pastor that was in sin . He had allowed h is ministry to become his God. He had begun to put his faith in his ministry which lead him to be corrupt. He began to make money motivated decisions with his ministry instead of God motivated decisions. He went to IHOP After about 1 hour the Spirit of God fell on him and his associate pastor and for several hours they wept and repented. I was friends with the pastor and knew them both very well. The devil does not drive out the devil. The devil does not set free from the lie of the devil. No kingdom divided against it's self can stand. "JESUS" Be careful do not touch God's ANOINTED? The bible says every tongue that rises up against God's anointed will be condemned. I love you brother I know you are wrong. He has g

"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

I use this quote all the time when I preach thanks . God bless bro.

Everything I have experienced with the IHOP team was humility love a commitment to the word and holiness. I have seen nothing but great fruit.

good teaching!!!

"You said -Catholic sub-doctrine of justification by works, and devotion. The more devotion and intensity of commitment, the better, and the more pleasing to God ".[BT]
..........................................
"It says On IHOP's website that they are justified by faith through grace. They even say that what they do does not assist in any way.

What you are saying is a lie. It is as simple as that. That is the truth and I love you brother. Repent!"
............dmoney
...................................................

I have been trying to tell you that what a person or ministry says about itself is virtually meaningless, it is the practices that they do, and the teachings they teach that define us all.. I have quoted from their own website, and from factual history, and my own eyewitness account. I have lived there, probably longer than you.

I have listed these practices and teachings below that are unscriptural, and shown scripturally exactly why; and defined How and why. You previously answered me with a 200 scripture spam, along with too many odd paragraphs to count.[ see below 7 or 8 posts ]

What I am saying is not a lie, and I am not condemning individuals. I believe that most at IHOP are sincere Christians, trying to please God. I have reiterated that I see Mike Bickle's integrity and honor before the lord as above reproach; but that does not excuse IHOP's lunge into the odd , rote and repetitive religious exercises that they take so much pride in as really being from the lord. AS I SEE IT, IT IS NOT!

I see deception afoot, particularly in their practice of inward meditation consisting of visualization, and focusing inward to gain revelation. It is Babylonian and cultish, along with the "monastic" life; "the fasted lifestyle'. They ordain women to teach and have authority over men, which is forbidden in scripture.

They promote the taking of OATHS to fulfill their commitment to IHOP..."A SACRED PLEDGE!", that must be signed by the devotee, to begin; IE: a contract. This is forbidden in scripture.

Their worship and prayer is practiced, and done over and over, and those participating must comply with by the rules, or they cannot pray. IHOP has all the accouterments of a modern monastic movement, complete with the extreme devotion of the ultra-sacrificial life: THE FORERUNNER!

They most definitely do fellowship luminaries of the Roman Catholic Church that carry their most foul and heinous doctrines, WHICH IS FORBIDDEN BY SCRIPTURE!

They in effect "SELL" the ministry, and charge for the brethren to participate. This is beyond scriptural; it is wrong.

In the face of all of that, I am a liar, and deceived, because IHOP's website said that they are justified by faith. Yes, I do need to repent, however for heart issues that I am constantly convicted of; not the reality of the seduction of IHOP by a wicked works based spirit.

True love is wanting someone saved from Hell, and delivered unto Jesus. I say these things for your sake, and others who may be helped to consider. Any ministry that is Godly should not fear those who may question it; but welcome it in a transparent way. Truth and Light are always united.

Thank you for all of you effort. I have looked at the info. you have put up . I agree I will have no part with RCC. I posted something on the scripture and doctrine forum about women teachers to get some clarification. You are welcome to join if you like. No doubt the body of Christ is in greater need of eyes to see than any other time in history, including you and me.

Daniel 11:33-35 (New International Version)

33 "Those who are wise will instruct many, though for a time they will fall by the sword or be burned or captured or plundered. 34 When they fall, they will receive a little help, and many who are not sincere will join them. 35 Some of the wise will stumble, so that they may be refined, purified and made spotless until the time of the end, for it will still come at the appointed time.

God bless you brother and all the other saints we will need it!!!!!

"Excuse me, Brother Tom, but this sounds absurd. Does this mean exactly like it sounds? One cannot pray [in their assembly] unless he pays? What kind of prayer are you talking about?" .ginnyrose

No, not at all Ginnyrose. There are several programs at Ihop that require fees , pay, for those participating. It is not unlike different Universities that charge fees. The "STUDENT" pays for his "education", in some cases $800 to $900 per month PLUS extra for certain classes. Some programs include board, others may not.

There is a full time paid clergy class there that do not pay, but are supported by the organization. There are sets performed by musical bands accompanied with 3-4 singers, and a prayer leader that are on staff. Anyone can pray from the audience [ in some venues] without being a paying student or staff member, as long as it is in the parameters of the apostolic model prayers.

I assume you are referring to my statement;
"They in effect "SELL" the ministry, and charge for the brethren to participate. This is beyond scriptural; it is wrong." I stand by that statement.

The overwhelming majority of those in IHOP must pay to continue to participate; to be full time prayer missionaries. They are taught to sponge off of the family, original churches and the public , and are taught to develop "ministry" letters to solicit steady monthly funds, as they are now on the mission field. They are now Prayer missionaries; the highest calling on Earth. They are taught that this is God providing for them, and of course, full time. You don't work. You are supported.

Because IHOP is essentially a "PRAYER and PRAISE" ministry, in effect, a devotee must "pay to pray". Many, many have left IHOP disillusioned because they couldn't raise the cash.

The holy church of the Lord Jesus never has, nor ever will charge money to receive you . The only pay required has been met by the blood of Jesus. IHOP is a machine now, requiring millions of dollars each year to operate. Mike bickle has publicly lamented about HOW "expensive" it is.

Everyone , on top of that, is "encouraged" to tithe, and give to the IHOP cause.

The undisciplined, the ghetto poor, the weak minded, the aged infirmed, the working single moms etc. are missing at IHOP meetings. They are not "trained", have the vast sections of time required, are not disciplined to do so, and are virtually non-existent. The young and the strong, the elite and willing...and this means youth...malleable; able to be molded, and idealistic are targeted.

The church is not the church if it is not the church of the weakling. The billions and billions of souls on the EARTH must be supported by a grueling 6 or 7 day work week, to survive. Many, that do even this, do not.

The ONE exquisite and perfect vehicle designed by God himself to meet the needs, spiritual and physical, is the LOCAL CHURCH, with all of the blood , sweat and tears, diapers and teenagers, bills and conflicts of marriage and life! The local church where "WHOSOEVER COME! and drink of the fountains of LIFE.....WHOSOEVER!..LEPERS, drunks, junkies, harlots and weaklings. In that community we participate in loving God and each other, and learn to reach out BECAUSE we love to a dying world.

THIS IS NOT A MONASTERY!...It is a family under God with weaklings in it like you and me. Ihop performs.

They are forerunners after all. Missionaries...Not.

This is the testimony of a former IHOP intern. You may read it, and others concerning IHOP on "THE GOSPEL MASQUERADE"...[WWW/WEB] It is somewhat lengthy, but very relevant, and worth the read.

THIS IS TYPICAL FROM MY EXPERIENCE. THERE ARE HUNDREDS AND HUNDREDS MORE.....

...........................
"There were many, many experiences that made me do a double take and say “what?” while I was at IHOP but that internal questioning was quickly explained away or rebuked by internship leaders. Once I began to deviate from IHOP’s teachings and study scripture on my own for answers to the internal conflicts I wrestled with, I began questioning the pseudo reality I had been conditioned to embrace.

Suddenly I saw the isolated red flag incidences as a seamless pattern of error and the veil of deception fell. I stopped rationalizing and justifying. Enough was enough and I was done and wanted out.

There are much more personal experiences than I can put into one single blog post, but here are a few I still recall pretty strongly.

1. Mandatory fasts which made me very physically ill. They would never admit to having “mandatory” fasts but when you don’t have any food available, close down the kitchen, give your cook the day off and don’t allow interns to hold jobs (so that they have money to go buy food if they aren’t participating in the fast) then that is called mandatory.

2. Being practically held hostage in the prayer room and told that it was required that I be there and I was not allowed to leave even though I did not feel well and wanted to go back to my apartment. I was told I needed to stay in the prayer room to be part of the “corporate anointing” and that I shouldn’t leave.

It was one of my “required” prayer room sets as an intern so I spent the remainder of that 2-hour set in one of the side prayer rooms in the back sobbing on the floor because I wanted to leave so badly and our internship leaders were standing by the door. You might ask “why didn’t you just force your way out and leave anyway?”

When you are part of cult where free, independent thinking is not condoned when you don’t comply with what is expected of you, very often guilt, manipulation and penalties are instated for those who resist. Interns who didn’t follow “the rules” of the internship were penalized through loss of privileges (such as loss of your day off, having to do extra work/manual labor, etc.)

3. The grip of control and micro-management increasing: greater demands and restrictions on interns (such as increased pressure to fast more to attain a higher pinnacle of spirituality) being told where we had to sit when in the prayer room, taught a model for how to pray, how to dance, sing, etc. Any form of worship outside of this model was not considered to be acceptable. It had to fit IHOP’s style and method to be admissible.

4. Mandatory journaling assignments which we had to do weekly and then we had to turn in our journals to be read by internship leaders

5. Seeing how controlled the prayer room was. Rather than having freedom to express my heart to the Lord, I was put in a box and told how I had to do everything IHOP’s way. I had reading and writing assignments whenever I was in the prayer room.

6. There was no alone time ever to really think, reason, test, question or process anything. We were run ragged from sun up to late into the night which always left me exhausted, depleted and burnt out.

7. Once when I got sick, my mother came to pick me up and internship leaders resisted letting me leave with her (even though she lived in town). My internship ‘com leader’ (short for community leader) objected and still impressed upon me the importance of going to the prayer room even though I was too sick to get off the couch. My mother said “she is my daughter and I’m taking her home and taking care of her. Period.”

8. The more leadership responsibility I was given as an intern, the more I got peeks into the “inside”. I saw the outer fringes of the internal operations of how IHOP functioned. I was on an IHOP dance team and sang as a chorus leader on a few worship teams. To dance, I had to follow a specific model that IHOP required.

To sing, I had to attend the briefing/de-briefing meetings before and after each worship set where I saw first-hand how carefully controlled that the seemingly “spontaneous” aspects of worship were carefully calculated and often planned ahead of time.

9. Another intern got deathly ill and it wasn’t until she ended up being hospitalized that internship leaders took seriously the fact she was sick. They accused her of faking an illness to get out of attending IHOP classes and time in the prayer room. This was told to me directly by that intern.

10. If I wanted to go anywhere off IHOP property (even to go see my family who lived in town) I had to notify internship leaders of my whereabouts at all times. I had no autonomy or freedom as an individual. Some leaders who were 19 (but were former interns which gave them elite status) were telling me where to be, what to do and when I was expected to be home.
I had to answer to them for everything. I was in my early 20′s and had lived on my own before so the feeling of suffocation and having no personal rights to space, privacy, independent thought, etc. was overwhelming.

There is much more but I think that’s a sufficient start to at least give you an idea of some of what was happening when I was at IHOP. It wasn’t until after I left that I began to see far more than I had been able to see when I was still involved.

The casual observer on the periphery won’t necessarily see the reality of all that is happening there because they are seeing the veil that IHOP has built to carefully cloak the truth of a lot of what really happens.

After I left, I realized how worn out and exhausted I was in every way imaginable. I spent days and weeks sleeping and physically healing from the trauma of the experiences I had just come out of and to let my body heal from the fasting and sleep deprivation. It took a long time for me to really start healing emotionally and spiritually and to begin putting pieces together.

Recovering from mental and spiritual abuse like that is a hard road and a difficult place to come out from. I did months of research after I left IHOP and the immediate dust had settled. I wanted to see the roots of the giant beanstalk that had sprouted up and choked the life out of everything in me.

I started going back as far into the history of IHOP as I could. As interns we were required to listen to 18 hours of audio CDs recapping all of the history of IHOP and the “prophesies” that led to it’s starting. I started researching on the internet about the names of the so called prophets of this movement and what they had come out of. That led me to picking apart a very carefully woven web of key players that all were connected to this massive organization.

I shared with one parent who e-mailed me about her own child at IHOP the importance of praying that the L-rd will open their eyes not only to see, but to recognize and identify the red flags of IHOP. The thing is, they are probably already seeing them, but rationalizing and excusing them away as isolated events rather than viewing them as a destructive pattern.

I pray that the Father will show those there who are truly seeking him the pattern of red flags…making them so obvious they can no longer ignore them.

My hope is that the young people there who are much like I was will begin to question what they see and compare it with what the scripture actually says…not how Mike Bickle twists and teaches it…and that they have the courage to identify it and reject it.

!!!!!! Those who oppose IHOP and speak out typically experience some kind of consequences or backlash. People are a commodity there. They are traded. When wounded ones leave, IHOP leadership doesn’t sweat over it…new and unsuspecting people who are ignorant of their dangerous devices but are hungry for emotionally-driven experiences and spiritual highs will come back in the same door the others left. It’s a revolving door of deception. !!!!!!

The deceptions of IHOP are treacherous and very real. Did G-d use that place in my life and work together for my good the devastation I experienced? Absolutely. But that is a testimony to the goodness of our G-d…not a stamp of approval on a place. Remember he spoke through a donkey and a burning bush. That doesn’t mean we should glorify donkeys and start worshiping bushes.

I’ve been asked many times how my eyes were opened to see what was happening at IHOP and how I got out, etc. I’ve thought about that many times and the simplest answer I can give is that I knew who my source was. G-d was my source of instruction, teaching, counsel, truth, etc. It was His voice I was seeking to hear and His approval I desired. IHOP wasn’t my source. So when the things I heard from the L-rd through prayer and studying His word were in conflict with the things I was being taught in IHOP it made the decision to leave an easier one.

It was traumatic and painful and I’m not going to minimize that. But it was the price of protecting truth and I knew that staying would have compromised what I knew was right and since my desire is to delight the heart of my Father, once He removed the scales, I was out.

My desire is to see people set free to live lives of healing and wholeness…walking in genuine love and pursuing truth. My prayer is that the things you read on this blog inspire you to that end.

Grace and peace to you.

"THE GOSPEL MASQERADE"...blog....Ariel

He answered, "Every plant that my heavenly Father has not planted will be rooted up. Let them alone; they are blind guides. And if the blind lead the blind, both will fall into a pit."

Matthew 15:13-14 (ESV)

and.....

"In the morning, as he was returning to the city, he became hungry. And seeing a fig tree by the wayside, he went to it and found nothing on it but only leaves. And he said to it, "May no fruit ever come from you again!" And the fig tree withered at once."

Matthew 21:18-19 (ESV)

and.....

"At that time the disciples came to Jesus, saying, "Who is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?" And calling to him a child, he put him in the midst of them and said, "Truly, I say to you, unless you turn and become like children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. Whoever humbles himself like this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven".

Matthew 18:1-4 (ESV)

and what did Gamaliel say?

"So in the present case I tell you, keep away from these men and let them alone, for if this plan or this undertaking is of man, it will fail; but if it is of God, you will not be able to overthrow them. You might even be found opposing God!" So they took his advice

Acts 5:38-39 (ESV)

he who has ears...

Solomon101: Here is another testimony you may peruse at "Slaughtering the sheep; wordpress". There are hundreds out there. Do you really believe that they are all softies, and just can't "cut the mustard" to real discipleship? I'm afraid you do. Here is a more mature married brother, and his experience......

Posted by James Jones on December 26, 2009

"Dear sad parent, I was 45 years old when I took a trimester at IHOP in '03 by the grace of God He led me and my wife away from that movement but it took about a year for me to realize it was a cult, and two years for me to see the whole prophetic, Apostolic, signs and wonders thing for what it is, DECEPTION.

I know exactly what you are saying about contemplative prayer being like T.M
.
But it doesn’t stop there, there is so much new age and Catholic mysticism mixed into the pot that it is one big hodge-podge of ecclesiastical witches brew.

In a prophetic class that was taught by Kirk Bennett one of our assignments was to take a scripture and repeat it over and over for two hours straight, praying it, repeating it until we got a revelation, this is nothing but a mantra, repetitious prayer, something we are not supposed to be part of.

At the time I thought something was wrong with me because I never got anything (but tired) unless it was by my imagination, but later I was pleased to know that I was being protected, that’s why it wasn’t working. I was a sincere man trying to answer what I thought was the call of God on my life and at the time I new very little about the prophetic movement, but I did see a power that I thought had to be God.

And how could twenty four hour seven day a week prayer and worship not be of God? Boy did I get an education. Your right about this being part of the great apostasy but it isn’t limited to just IHOP but you are probably well aware of it.

My wife and I actually moved down right behind IHOP in '04 from Wisconsin, thinking we were going to be part of that movement, but the Lord said no, but because of our close proximity, and boarding a IHOP student with us for a year, we learned some of the idiosyncrasies and things that they would not want others knowing.

We even took in a Chinese women in for two weeks who was a wreck after being part of IHOP for two years. IHOP staff was very uncomfortable her staying with us, they didn’t want their image tarnished in the neighborhood; they did all they could to try and wisk her away before we found out to much.

To much to tell, but the fruit is very bad. As for your son,..[ who was counselled to cur off all relationship with his mother by someone at IHOP...] I know that you are praying, my wife and I will as well.

I’m thinking of the scripture in 2Tim.2:24-26 zeroing in on part of verse 25-26 “if God perhaps will grant your son repentance so that he may come to his senses and escape the snare of the devil, having been taken captive by him to do his will.”

As I said the Lord led us out and we will be praying He will lead your son out, and that he will be better for the experience, as some one who can have a strong voice in warning others from such madness, perhaps because of my age young people don’t want to listen to me, but they may someone your son’s age.

Keeping sounding the alarm perhaps some will listen."
Jim

“I also have a feeling of concern that somethings not right.”
May I suggest you ask the Lord Jesus to show you what that “something” is, He will. May I also suggest you pray for your children and Church to be given a “love of truth” and that nothing and NO MAN be put on a pedestal in their lives. Pray that the Lord Jesus and His truth be first in their lives. Pray also that they just read the Sciptures instead of always studying Mike Bickle’s teachings.

We need the whole counsel of the Word to grow into maturity.

I believe your concerns and that feeling of something not being right is from the Holy Spirit, THE Spirit of Truth trying to lead you into the truth about what is going on.

Many errors have been exposed in regards to IHOP and Mike Bickle over the years and many people have come out from among them. Many others continue to follow in error and delusion. It is quite a confusing “swirl” when one is involved.

Yes, many young people are hungry for more of the presence of the Lord and desire to be wholehearted and the message Mike teaches really convinces one that doing the “one thing” as he defines it, praying 24/7 and fasting is the way to know the Lord in a deeper experiential way. These two biblical disciplines are emphasized to a extreme degree.

He is very charismatic and uses “loaded language” that grips the emotions, his vision for himself and his house of prayer is very grandiose. Like the Cults he also teaches his followers what kind questions they will most likely encounter by those on the outside and prepares them with “loaded phrases” that stunt real deep thinking, questioning and discernment.

[Solomom101...this is for you!] A common response a IHOP-er would give to someone questioning what they are involved in is, “Burning hearts make dull hearts uncomfortable.” The point being that THEY have the burning heart and YOU do not because you are questioning their teaching and practices which seem to contradict the Scriptures.

He believes God is changing the understanding of Christianity through his ministry in one generation. I find that quite astonishing actually, that Mike is the one who is chosen for such an exalted task. Where do you find this in Scripture? He is the one who tells of his experience in Cairo Egypt where he alleges he heard the “audible voice of God” who told him this.

I find it curious and wonder, “Did he test that spirit? Did he test that message? He tells many fantastic stories such as this that seemingly always somehow exalt HIM, HIS calling and HIS ministry. Dreams, prophesies and “encounters”, angelic and otherwise are sought after and emphasized. It is an unreal, hyper-spiritual counter culture.

Everything revolves around the house of prayer and Mike, and no one wants to “miss anything”. He has an amazing way to create a swirl of excitement. There are many spirits at work there.

I believe he draws people after himself and his grandiose vision all the while telling everyone, “It is what the Holy Spirit is doing at the end of the age.” He teaches the young adults they are going to be end-time “apostles” who will release the judgments of the Lord through prayer.

There is great elitism and selfish ambition at work. People circle around Mike and vie for his attention. Most of the foundational “blueprint” prophesies for Mike and IHOP came from Bob Jones and Paul Cain.

His ministry requires the time, finances and life of his followers. Many have signed a pledge called the “Sacred Trust”. There is a “devouring” aspect to his ministry.

If you measure the teachings of Mike Bickle against the plumbline of Scripture in context you will know where the error is.

I am writing from experience, I was part of it for some time. Mike Bickle does have some good teachings but there is a lot of mixture as well. The emphasis “appears” to be on a individual relationship with Jesus BUT the structure demands 8-10 hours a day in the prayer house plus administration hours all the while “raising” ones own support and when that doesn’t work finding gainful employment.

Many live at poverty level, go into debt because they cannot raise support, use welfare and stand in lines to get food. But they keep getting taught about “supernatural provision” and there are always lots of “glory stories” but not too many of the “gory stories ” are told from the platform.

Mike teaches his followers to live a “fasted lifestyle.”

I observed in myself and those around me, that we were not using critical thinking skills and examining everything we were being taught like we are told to by the Lord Jesus and writers of the NT.

As far as all the giving to the “poor” they say they are doing I would suggest you examine the financial statements (if there are any) before you just believe what Mike and his staff are telling you. In the past Mike has not wanted to be accountable to a true board, he has stated he wanted to run the finances of his ministry like Benny Hinn does.

He tends to surround himself with “yes” people, those he can easily control. Most people who tried to bring accountability didn’t last too long as that is not what Mike wanted.

Will people hear? If they are willing and have a love of truth, they will.

God Bless!
PS There are many articles here, also there very good articles at signofjonah blog site. Tricia Tillin of Banner

You may read these comments and testimonies at "End time Prophetic words....",search mike bickle and Ihop..
Tom

Solomon101 wrote...[ about sister's testimony who left IHOP determining it to be cult like..]

"I also think it is fair to say in view of Paul's treatment of Mark, after he quit and went home to mom as well, that Paul would tell THIS GIRL not only good bye but to also not come back until her thinking was straight! That was how Paul handled it.

The bottom line is this..we have a bunch of pampered, fat,spiritual babies in the United States. We are placating to the fleshly weaknesses instead of disciplining ourselves to the purposes of Godliness. In short we are producing soft civilians in the church as opposed to AN ARMY of the Lord!

Hat's off to IHOP...they at least seem to understand what Paul and John Wesley did... seems I recall Ravenhill making the very same point at one time also....even if the majority of our sissified panzy American Church does not."
........................Solomon101.......

Do you think there could be a hint of spiritual pride and elitism in this statement?

I have posted several testimonies, and my own experience, but I did not want to let this one go yet. This movement is affecting tens of thousands of young people world wide, and becoming a part of it is touted as being the deepest thing in God that you could be.

My friend Solomon101 is a good example what these young people are taught about themselves when they commit as a member. It is looking like a cult more and more each day, and it needs to be exposed and stopped, for it is also wounding more and more each day.

I say this to my friend Mike Bickle. You were called to build the church of Jesus; one at a time, in the nations of the EARTH....not an elitist monastic order that portrays works as devotion and sacrifice. This work is influenced by Babylonian practices that you touted as super spiritual in your devotion to the Catholic Mystics, and has deceived you. Repent before it is too late. Enough people have been damaged . It is pride, and not the kingdom of God, and it is Not pleasing to God, but to men;s religious nature.

It is a religious spirit.

i will re-post the Words of the Lord in regards to this thread full of divisness and rancor. i don't NEED to be paid attention to, but what does Jesus have to say about certain men calling each other over there disagreements over this ministry and that ministry,
one calls Christians "fat pampered spiritual babies", the other writes to the other:
"
"My friend Solomon101 is a good example what these young people are taught about themselves when they commit as a member. It is looking like a cult more and more each day, and it needs to be exposed and stopped".

this is just filthy rag palaber, and brings reproach upon the Body of Christ.

slander: "fat pampered babies"

the other slander: "it needs to be exposed and stopped"....and pray tell, how do you stop it?

pitchforks, stakes, tar oil. a noose, an M-16?

what does Jesus say about ministries that dont meet the mark:

what does Jesus say?
He answered, "Every plant that my heavenly Father has not planted will be rooted up. Let them alone; they are blind guides. And if the blind lead the blind, both will fall into a pit."

Matthew 15:13-14 (ESV)

and.....

"In the morning, as he was returning to the city, he became hungry. And seeing a fig tree by the wayside, he went to it and found nothing on it but only leaves. And he said to it, "May no fruit ever come from you again!" And the fig tree withered at once."

Matthew 21:18-19 (ESV)

and.....

"At that time the disciples came to Jesus, saying, "Who is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?" And calling to him a child, he put him in the midst of them and said, "Truly, I say to you, unless you turn and become like children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. Whoever humbles himself like this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven".

Matthew 18:1-4 (ESV)

and what did Gamaliel say?

"So in the present case I tell you, keep away from these men and let them alone, for if this plan or this undertaking is of man, it will fail; but if it is of God, you will not be able to overthrow them. You might even be found opposing God!" So they took his advice

Acts 5:38-39 (ESV)

he who has ears...

like insane people you keep going around and around, cemented in your "beliefs"

like pride soaked fleshlings, you refuse to hear the other over your own voice, which can only help to the be the "right voice".

This thread is a downright stench, look at the number of anonymous visitors, and this is your witness?

This is the kind of witness that is dragging this precious forum down to the depths with overwrought self-righteousness.

you wrote:

1: ""The bottom line is this..we have a bunch of pampered, fat,spiritual babies in the United States"

2."In short we are producing soft civilians in the church as opposed to AN ARMY of the Lord!"

any "army",maybe i'm wrong, and your referencing Ephesian type weaponry, but it sure smells to me like arms borne by an army, much like the demons of the Crusades, forgive me if i'm wrong.

3. "....even if the majority of our sissified panzy American Church does not."

"sissified panzy American church does not", that kind of unloving foul palaber speaks volumnes of where YOU are IN Christ. foul mouthed and dark hearted, and after all this, wouldnt the Holy Ghost prick your heart?

no. for you conclude:

4."Still stand by it whole heartedly"

ofr course you do, fore to humble yourself and repent these words, would admit you're wrong, and thats pride, in the economy of satan, pride is everything.

this thread should be shut, its just devolving into the pit.