SMP

I understand only few people can answer this question.

Does God follow the stable marriage problem algorithm when it comes to match unmarried men and women.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stable_marriage_problem

Sorry,

I don't understand the question.

Could you word it differently please?

Thanks.

Joe,

Can you think of any Scriptures that support this theory?

I'm married. Are you?

It would be difficult to conceive of a woman being woed by the following, "Well, you and I are the last of the group, let's say we get married..." Seems rather cold.

Grace and peace,
Matthew

Hi Matthew,

I am not married. My question to break it into simple terms is such if a man rates a woman with a rating X on 1 characteristic and uses this to benchmark against other women. If this is how the POE (Process of elimination works), and the woman has her on parameters for men and implements her own version of the same thinking.

Then does God who foreknows this pre-arranges so that a man with perfect expectations and woman with perfect expectation are equally matched.

Look don't bother if this is giving you a head ache. I was just thinking casually the other day.

I know you guys have better things to do.

Math and the foreknowledge of God is colliding in my brain as I struggle with my life as a single man (age = 29)

Joe

Discerning the will of God for marriage seems so hard these days. I started to look at mathematical algorithms.

Does God follow the stable marriage problem algorithm when it comes to match unmarried men and women.

No. At least, He wouldn't follow the Gale-Shapley algorithm, because, as Wikipedia says, 'While the solution is stable, it is not necessarily optimal'.

Mike

I have been amazed over the years at how many people I have known who have adopted the deterministic attitude toward their marriages, which ended in divorce. I have seen quite a few say they had married the person "God had for them."

You can be deterministic through Romanticism as well, "They are my soul mate!"

You can be deterministic in the way you suggest...numerically driven statistical impetus.

None of these states of mind stem from the individuals determination to choose to love. Love is a choice, not some predetermined hocus pocus. Choose to commit to your spouse in love. See what God will do.

Bless you Joe. I had to read it three times, then read your response to understand what you were talking about :-)

No idea how to answer that question, but it has me thinking. Thanks!

My humble opinion is you better hear from God, instead of weighing out the pros & cons based on algorithms . It is what God has put together that counts, because what He puts together should never be severed.

The church has taken on the worlds standards when it comes to divorce, but this is not pleasing to God. Only in the case of unfaithfulness can you divorce, and then only for hardness of heart. So since it is a lifetime commitment, make sure you seek God and know that this is one that He has given to you, she will know the same thing.

Will you still have rough times, yes, very rough, but commitments are commitments and will stand the test of time. I have been married for 39 years and if it had not been for that commitment I would have divorced long ago. But I have found everything ebbs and flows. After weathering the 4 year disillusion mark, the taking for granted part, the I hate him mark, he is now my best friend outside of Jesus.

It is so funny we put up with our dogs puking and defecating on the floor, chewing up our best stuff, their never ending in and out routine, but we keep them for life. Hmmmm.

Make sure your choice is God's choice. I told my daughter that a good looking guy who treats you like dirt is not as good as a regular looking guy who treats you with respect and love. Beauty is fleeting but love is eternal.

Good advice, Goldminer...

I have been asked by several friends whether or not I thought that someone was "meant" for someone else. I always remind them that our spouses are part of that "free will" that God has given us. I remind them that Jesus and Paul the Apostle said that it would be better if we would NEVER marry (Matthew 19 and I Corinthians 7). However, it is obviously (and scripturally) better to marry than to constantly burn with passion (I Corinthians 7:9).

Yet, it is always good to find the Lord's acceptance of a potential spouse. We might not hear a "voice from Heaven" or "signs and wonders" that confirm that this ONE person is THE person that the Lord has chosen for us. However, I think that God will continue to offer His guidance while He ultimately leaves the choice/decision up to us.

I didn't want to get married during my teen years. I felt like it would be better for me to "save myself" to the Lord...and just move on from there. Oddly enough, there was quite a handful of young ladies who promised that "God told them" that they were supposed to marry me (while I was in high school and college)! It was difficult for me to explain that God had not told me the same thing...but some of them insisted! Needless to say, it was a difficult thing for them to know that I didn't feel the same way about them that they did about me. During high school, I often explained that I just didn't want to get married anyway.

However, I went on a missionary trip to the indigenous Tarahumara tribes in the rugged and pine covered Sierra Madre Occidental mountains of Chihuahua, Mexico. We would drive supplies and missionaries via trucks over treacherous mountain trails to Tarahumara villages. During one of those trips, we took a food break atop one of the mountains. I wondered off and ventured to a cliff. Thousands of feet below me were clouds. Across a sharp valley was another tall mountain just a stone's throw away. The sunset and sky were magnificent -- like a painting with various shades of oranges, reds, magentas and blues! It was literally breathtaking! At that point, I realized that I desired to share this with someone. I was aware that I was sharing it with the Lord...but He was the one who painted it to begin with. I just realized that I was going to need a woman in life to share my sunsets with!

Throughout college, I still had to distance myself from some girls who pretty much swore that "God told them" that they were supposed to marry me. It was a tough thing too...because some of those girls were wonderful believers and very pretty. I met a young woman at a Christian fellowship that met on campus. She was an extremely godly girl who loved God more than anything. She went from being an acquaintance to a good friend to a great friend. For the first time, I felt that my life would be incomplete without her. A few years ago, we were married! I am so glad that we did! She still takes my breath away! This has less to do with outer beauty and more to do with the beauty of knowing that my wife loves the Lord more than she loves anything else!

As for "algorithms" for marriage: I think that it is important to know that God is not confined to the knowledge or science of this world. He authored science, math and probability...but He is not confined to it. God can place square pegs into round holes (if He wanted to). Still, I believe that "free will" exists in EACH person even after marriage. The important thing is for the "free will" of the husband and wife to line up with the will of God in regard to marriage.

A few years ago, I heard about how the Dallas Cowboys used algorithms to select draft picks. The Cowboys would list all of the statistics of their team and competitors into computers. They included height, speed, arm reach, strength and variables. The first year that the Cowboys used this program (1979), the Dallas Cowboys used their first round draft pick to select Robert Shaw, a center from the University of Tennessee. They had two other draft picks in the first three rounds (Defensive Back Aaron Mitchell and Tight End Doug Cosbie). These were decent football players who enjoyed fine (albeit short) careers in the NFL.

However, the Dallas Cowboys and their computer algorithm "missed" a player that they could have selected: Joe Montana. The algorithm (and many teams) just didn't think that Joe Montana would succeed in the NFL. He wasn't especially fast, especially strong or especially tough. However, he is considered one of the greatest quarterbacks to have ever played the game and led the San Francisco 49ers on four Super Bowl championship teams during the 1980s. He could have replaced Roger Staubach, who retired following the 1979 season.

Why am I saying this? The algorithm can measure statistics -- and nothing more. It can measure the strength of a person...but not a person's determination. It can measure their speed...but not how quick they make decisions. It can measure a person's vertical leap...but not an ability to jump over adversity. It can measure the height of their body...but not the breadth of a person's heart. An algorithm just doesn't account for things that cannot be measured.

Compatibility in marriage is not measured by a set of "likes" and "dislikes." My wife and I do not have similar tastes in many, many areas! I like cooking...and she hates it! I like certain foods that she hates (and vice versa). I like hiking, camping, and long walks on the beach, while she prefers relaxing on a chair on the porch. I like the toilet paper to unroll "over the top" toward me...and she likes the opposite. In other words, while we definitely agree on most spiritual matters, there are plenty of things where we do NOT agree.

However, I am so glad to have married my wife! I look forward to an ongoing mystery and adventure with my wife! God willing, we will have children one day. Life will undoubtedly change quite a bit. However, I think that it will be a joy to have a godly woman mother my children! We are already determining how we will raise our children...and setting up some principles that we agree will be helpful and suitable for them.

Looking back, I am so glad that I didn't "settle" on one of those other girls who claimed that "God told them" that they were supposed to marry me. To be clear: I chose my wife. I pursued her. However, I did check in with the Lord to make sure that she was "a good thing." You know what? She certainly is!

Joe: As a former Math teacher, I understand your question (I think...:-)). Statistics were never my strong suit, but I think I can make my point anyway. Suppose you have n different criteria for a woman which must be matched perfectly for that woman to be a candidate for your wife. Each criteria has 2 possibilities, yes or no. The chances of any particular woman meeting all of those criteria would be pretty small if n is very big and statistical chances of you meeting such a woman would be something like 1 out of 2 to the nth power. So, the more criteria you have, the less chance you have of finding such a woman. If that particular woman you think meets all criteria has such a list, then your chances are slim to none I would say.

I am pretty sure that God's way of putting a man and a woman together are not at all related to mathematical algorithms. I am not totally convinced that God has a particular person picked out for you from the foundation of things, although I am sure He knows who the person you will marry will be.

I really think that such lists of qualifications can be a bad thing depending on the list. If it is a list of your wants and expectations then it shows you are looking for someone to please yourself, which is never good for a marriage because no person can meet all of our expectations all of the time. If the list is simply a list of things the Word of God states as the qualities of a godly woman and a good wife, then the list will lead you to a great woman and a wonderful wife.

Don't be frustrated. Learn to love God and seek Him above all things without worrying about a wife. Let Him know of your desire, and leave it in His hands. He has this way of bringing you such blessings as a wonderful wife in the most unexpected ways.

@Homeschooldad

Priceless. :-)

My wife says she does not know a woman alive who would be interested in any man who used mathematics and algorithms in order to determine who to marry.

I was going to come here and say exactly the same thing but you beat me to it!

If there would have been any males talking like this when I was a young person, the girls would have made fun of him and called him NUTS - back then we did not use the word weird, jerk, etc. And yes, it would guarantee him singleness for the rest of his life.

Women want to be regarded as a person, an individual who wants to be loved and cherished because of what and who she is, not because she fits some mathematical formula.

SIGH!

ginnyrose

The cloud that is sermonindex has seemingly spoken with one mind and with much wisdom...especially homeschooldad's wife HA! I suspect my wife would have said a similar thing.

Folks the problem is essentially this.

1. A choice has to be made.
2. For every Issac there are probably a 1000,0000 + Ishmaels out there

You want to do the will of God.

Very few people based on my research has heard a voice saying "Behold your wife".

Most people say you have to use wisdom. In my mind this is translated as

1. Define parameters
2. Look for the optimal match
3. Review results with EBs (Elder Brothers)
4. Look for peace , all factors taken into consideration
5. Hit the commit button and save the transaction.

1, 2 are definitely mathematical !

How do you know the person you are considering for marriage is God's choice. This is not easy. I have thought about this long and hard.

No. At least, He wouldn't follow the Gale-Shapley algorithm, because, as Wikipedia says, 'While the solution is stable, it is not necessarily optimal'.

PRAISE GOD FOR YOUR BRAIN BROTHER !

Brother Joe,

I read a book that I recommend to all the young people I know. It's called "Date or Soul Mate" by Neil Clark Warren. "How to Know if someone is worth pursuing in two dates or less."

It is all scientific and I think right up your alley!! There are lots of questions you must answer about you and then lots of lists for you to create your own list and religion is huge on his list.

It made sense to my mind and clicked with me. Wow, I wish this book had been written 30 years ago but it wasn't. I think it will be a great help for you in your search.

God bless you in your search,
Lisa

Thanks Lisa. I appreciate the practical nature of your advice.

I want to thank all who have contributed. I went for a walk and decided to leave the whole matter to the Lord. Since He is all knowing I am pretty sure He'll let me in when the time comes. Its Faith 101.

Signing off from Melbourne Australia. I love you guys ~!

I realise that you have signed off on this, but I simply couldn't resist. ;-)

For me, I think that the most important thing is to work out what it is that is important to you, and then see if that quality is in the woman you meet. Emotions, of course, are involved, and are there to be enjoyed, but decisions are best made with your head.

I wait till I have seen a quality that I would "prefer not be there", and then ask myself how important it is too me, and whether I can handle it being there, before I even entertain the possibility that this could be "the one". Another important factor, is whether or not I am what she is looking for.

I believe that it was Chambers who spoke of being led of God in such a way, that in the absence of clear directive, trusting that the way we are headed is in keeping with God's will. I often picture, as an illustration, a young child walking through a shopping center with his father. The father holds the child's hand, and the child becomes desensitized, of sorts, to his father's presence.

The child is captivated by something, and heads over to investigate, and often the father simply goes along with him. But there are times when the father has a purpose in mind, and he resists the child's deviation. Suddenly the child is made aware of the father's presence, and the fact that her was heading the "wrong way".

That is how I find that God interacts with me, in my day to day life. The challenge is to trust that He will act as required.

(Psalm 73:23-24, John 10:3-5)

Interesting but detached from reality. The SMP assumes a closed set of people seeking to be married.  In reality very, very few people exist in a closed set like this and even those who seem to dwell in something similar have the issue of unmarried individuals both older and younger who come to enter the set. Also the iterative process described in the theory does not exist in reality. 

My response to this querie is "seek ye first the Kingdom of God and all these things shall be added unto you." This mirrors many others replies. I am in a similar boat, two years ahead of you. I have noticed that I start to make good friends and then they go get engaged and I never see them again. So I need to make friends that are already stably married. ;)  

Crucified and satisfied ....

Bro Joe,

I know you’re crucified and satisfied but I wanted to add to the discussion about “soul mates” per se; there are none, in fact, many people out there I believe we can live with “IF WE CHOOSE TO LIVE WITH THEM in peace and harmony!”

Also, marriage will show you just how crucified and satisfied you are! I’m not talking about intimacy, marriage is made for intimacy but I am talking about when explosions start over something as simple as how a person squeezes the tube of toothpaste then it’s obvious who is crucified to the flesh or not!

FYI: Control freaks are NOT crucified and satisfied!!! In my humble opinion, if we choose to be crucified to “control,” we can just about get along with anyone.

You can make someone’s life a living hell or they can make yours a living hell if you do not find out if you and they are at LEAST willing to begin crucifying the control. Wives do not need controlled; they need to be led by love.

Anyway, just my 2 cents, God bless you!
Lisa

Thanks Sis. Lisa...

Please read my statement about "crucified and satisfied" in following context.

If what is available is undesirable and what is desirable is unavailable then I need to crucify the desirable so I can be satisfied with what is available.

Everyone wants to marry up. How feasable is this ?

Thanks brother your words are extremely liberating. I pray you will be richly blessed with a wonderful wife. May God bless your efforts in Japan.