Reward

What should the christian's view of reward be? Most sermons/messages say we shouldn't be concerned with reward but should only serve period. Biblical?

"Will any one of you who has a servant plowing or keeping sheep say to him when he has come in from the field, 'Come at once and recline at table'? Will he not rather say to him, 'Prepare supper for me, and dress properly, and serve me while I eat and drink, and afterward you will eat and drink'? Does he thank the servant because he did what was commanded? So you also, when you have done all that you were commanded, say, 'We are unworthy servants; we have only done what was our duty.'" Luke 17:10

What I am receiving from this passage is that the reward of our work in the field is serving Jesus and eating with him, and it is amazing that he would condescend to allow sinful man to serve and eat at his table. He is so full of Grace.

What do we eat with him at his table?

But He said to them, "I have food to eat that you do not know about."So the disciples were saying to one another, "No one brought Him anything to eat, did he?" Jesus said to them, "My food is to do the will of Him who sent Me and to accomplish His work. John 4:32-34

Doing the will of our Father in Heaven is a wonderful reward. But the greatest reward of all is fellowship with the glorious Lord Jesus Christ. Our love for him and obedience to him go hand in hand like a bride and her groom.

In Luke 19:11-27, you have a variation of the parable of the talents, where each of the servants receives a minas. One generates 10 minas out of the one given to him, and another receives 5. The one who generated 10 minas was put in charge of 10 cities and received a rather verbose commendation from his master. The one with 5 received authority over 5 cities, though not quite as verbose a commendation.

I think there is some merit to considering that even though we all receive eternal life, such as the laborers in the vineyard got the same despite when they came into the vineyard, and unless my understanding is not correct (may God clarify it), there are degrees in what kind of glory we will receive, or what God will eternally entrust to us.

I admit I don't have all the details pointed out, and though even though no one person is more justified than another, and that all true servants will share in their Master's happiness, there will be some particular privileges given to some more than others. Two people with the same grace, and one does more, may probably expect to receive a greater glory than the other (though both will certainly receive great reward).

So should we work for reward? Well, it certainly shouldn't be the sole aspect of attention in our spiritual walk, but I would say that if Christ mentioned it in the parable, it is there for us to apply :)

GOD is our highest joy, our
exceeding great reward!!

GOD is our highest joy, our exceeding great reward!!

AMEN! I will sign on to that one.

I guess it seems to some more noble to say, "I am only serving and not expecting or thinking of any reward." But how many times is the reward in scripture part of the motivation for the doing? Consider even Jesus, who for the joy that was set before Him endured the cross and despised the shame... I think there is nothing at all wrong with reckoning the reward as part of the motivation.

I am very interested where this thread goes and evolves into, I have been left very jaded by the rewards based gospel. I grew up here all about storing up in heaven, giving our tithes and offerings and if we didn't we wouldn't be blessed, or sometime throughout the week something would happen that cost the same thing as the tithe the person didn't give. This brought about great condemnation on my part and also on many others in the church. I have come to a place of contentment that I deserve nothing at all so any amount of giving isn't really a credit to my name in heaven. I hear God spoke about as if He is a bank teller or some kind of investment worth putting your money into, because you will reap a large blessing in your business or life. My heart cringes at these statements. My response to those that believe in such a system is this, Isn't Jesus enough?

My heart cringes at these statements. My response to those that believe in such a system is this, Isn't Jesus enough?

I guess this is a textbook statement that got me pondering this question. Either this type of thinking is correct (we are wrong to look for reward) or the church is attempting to be more holy than Jesus.

Jesus brings up rewards, as mentioned, in the parable of the talents in which Jesus is commending diligent use of our gift and is the one who is bring up the subject of reward. Not only bringing it up, but using it to encourage our service.

Prov. 19:17. He who is gracious to a poor man lends to the LORD, and He will repay him for his good deed.

Here the Lord makes it clear that it is something that he wants to do and will do. If it was none of our concern, why would he tell us?

Paul said he was striving for the 'prize', for first place.

Abraham was looking for a city.

The disciples asked of their reward and the Lord promised 30-60-90 fold as opposed to a sharp rebuke for not seeing him as enough.

I care nothing for 'prosperity gospel' , 'best life now' nonsense, though if God chooses to bless a man in this life that is His matter. However the passage I'm thinking is important is the Bema passages in 1 Cor 3. Here Paul lays out the Judgement Seat of Christ in which the church is examined and reward given or lost, all without any mention of punishment.

I believe the believer should be looking forward to that day with anticipation of reward, for if that happens, the Captain of our Salvation will be glorified as would a coach of Olympic Gold medalists. Picture the joy of the Lord as He rewards His children for their godly life led. This is great motivation.

There is a balance between ungodly hyper humility that disregards as sinful the very things the Lord uses to encourage his church and the self-serving lust for recognition and material.

The hay and stubble will burn, but the precious works that are done out of love for God and neighbour (1 Cor 13), God will be pleased to reward, for it was His heart to ordain this great ceremony in the first place.

The first thing the Lord mentions after His promise to return?....

Re 22:12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.

Interesting thread. I haven't thought about this for a while.

Thanks for provoking my thoughts, friends!

Love in Jesus,

I don't believe this view makes one holier that Christ, on the contrary I deserve to the very least an eternity in hell. My motivation is not reward since I don't deserve one but it is the simple pleasure of serving God dispite reward. Ultimately Jesus is my reward and this is all I need. Many will stand before God and expect a reward they will have their good works held in mind and have it tallied how much reward they deserve. Bottom Line God is so outrageously Holy our works on earth are filthy rags and worth nothing. Will God give us a reward? I believe so but I don't think its going to be because we are so awesome and good but simply because God is so awesome and good.

I know the scriptures speak of reward but I just don't care if I get any or not. I just want to be with Jesus, now and in eternity. I don't know if this is a godly attitude to have or not. The only reason I like do good works is because I experience Jesus that way. I just want him. Not Sin. Not Rewards. Not my life. But his life, with Him, for Him, In Him and through Him.

In Martin Lloyd-Jones book on the Sermon on the Mount, he said (greatly paraphrased) that those who say they aren't greatly interested in their eternal rewards are basically pseudo-spiritual, and aren't adhering to the Biblical faith. Instead they were into some sort of warm and fuzzy sort of faith.

I know, not said nearly as well as Lloyd-Jones ever said anything. Forgive me for not having the quote on hand :-)

But you know, I think we generally don't think much about our eternal rewards because such a subject deals with the last days, and most of us would rather not touch anything to do with doctrines regarding the last days. So, because we are generally ignorant on the Biblical doctrine of rewards, we don't see any relevant application in the here and now regarding them.

But truth be told, I think if we gave more thought about our eternal rewards, we would find that they are great motivation towards doing effectual ministry and abounding in greater works. For example, I live a very active life. For a variety of reasons, I'm forced to work quite a few hours a week. But even with all of that, I still seek to actively engage in outreach to the lost, and ministry within the Church, leaving me little room anything else.

And I choose to do what I do, not only because I believe the Lord has called me and charged me to do these things, and I want to please Him in all things, but I engage in these things because I know ultimately, I will spend eternity with our Lord, who will richly reward me for the little labor I do now, in the ages to come. And I do these things, always conscience that the young man that I am, that I am giving up what many tell me is "the prime" of my life.

Yet I press on and throw my life away, knowing that I will be rewarded for my labor. I am willing to make the sacrifices I make, and am encouraged to make greater ones, because I am motivated by the ultimate payout in the ages to come, and the rich rewards which my precious Lord will yet give to me.

Such an idea might sound carnal or offensive to some of you. But I believe Jesus was serious when He told us to store up for ourselves treasure in heaven. If we should find no other reason to be interested in our eternal rewards, we should be interested in them simply because Jesus commanded us to store for ourselves treasures in heaven. Therefore, if you want to be in His will, store up for yourselves treasures in heaven. And in the process, look forward to actually receiving those rewards, and allow them to motivate you to sacrifice all the more. For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also. I'm pretty sure that's what Jesus said. :-)

Just some thoughts. A great subject.

This topic just makes me understand that I know very little about who I am in Christ other than a worm :) I am still young in this and are still moved by the wind, working on being grounded in Christ. It will take an eternity to thank God for His grace and forgiveness for just one of my sins let alone the rewards He wishes to bestow on us all.

I agree with ceebub that the bema seat passage seems to place an emphasis on degrees of rewards as a motivation to be diligent in seeking Christ and doing His will with all our heart. Another passage that comes to mind is 1Cor.9:24-27 where Paul exhorts us to "Run in such a way that you may win." He paints the picture of a disciplined athlete who's sole aim is to come in first place, taking great pains so that he may win that prize. In essence Pauls says there, "If those guys go to such extremes to be disciplined and diligent to win a perishable wreath/prize, how much more disciplined and diligent should we be in light of the eternal, imperishable crown that awaits us."

I thinks this thread is complimentary to the one on good works started by Jimmy. Great topic.

Does a Bride come to the wedding for her Bridegroom or for the presents?

The groom of course. But that question doesn't fit here,because the concept of rewards doesn't belong to a wedding analogy. It belongs in analogies to labor and justice.

It is unbiblical to serve the Lord in the present, and to suffer injustice for the present, without looking unto your eternal rewards as motivation in the present. Such would be contrary to the teaching of Scripture from cover to cover, and smacks of sentimentalism more than authentic Biblical spirituality.

Why do we reject the clear teaching of Scripture in these things? Let us rather reject the warm fuzzies of unscriptural sentimentalism.

To serve and suffer with the lord is to be adorned with righteous acts, a wedding garment, for the Bride. It is not about the presents. It is about being pleasing in the eye of the one you are to spend eternity with. "Let us rejoice and be glad and give the glory to Him, for the marriage of the Lamb has come and His bride has made herself ready." It was given to her to clothe herself in fine linen, bright and clean; for the fine linen is the righteous acts of the saints. Revelation 19:7-8

While that's nice, the Biblical faith handed down to the saints from the Lord teaches us that we are to find motivation in our eternal rewards. A simple reading of the Gospels teaches this. Indeed, it is unscriptural to not find them as motivation, and to look forward to them.

Does the Richest Man want his Bride to come to the marriage with thoughts of all the presents his Wealthy Father will give her?

Or does the Bridegroom desire his Bride to be consumed with thought of Him, and his Glory?

I'm sorry brother, but these questions are not within the Biblical world view. Reward is motivation.

"Behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to render to every man according to what he has done." Revelation 22:12

He is coming. The Bright Morning Star. The beloved Bridegroom.
His lips are like lilies, and our eyes like Doves. And from his mouth proceeds a sword to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart.

Neither the 1 Corinthians 3 passage

"Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers by whom ye believed, even as the Lord gave to every man? I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase. So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase. Now he that planteth and he that watereth are one: and every man shall receive his own reward according to his own labour. For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building. According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon. For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ. Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire." 1 Cor 3:5-15 (KJV)

Nor the 'Bema seat" passage

"Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: (For we walk by faith, not by sight:) We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. For we must all appear before the judgment seat (Bema) of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences." 2 Cor 5:6-11 (KJV)

State of even imply that rewards are motivation for us. They are plainly stating facts: "every man's work shall be made manifest" and "we must all appear".

The verses Oracio refers to in 1 Cor 9 do speak of running to obtain a prize or an incorruptible crown:

"Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain. And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible. I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air: But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway". 1 Cor 9:24-27 (KJV)

But in Phillipians 3 Paul clearly states what that prize is that he want to win:

"Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ, And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith: That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death; If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead. Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus. Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before, I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus." Phil 3:8-14 (KJV)

It won't be an Olympic medal ceremony in that day, for Christ alone will be exalted. God insists on it. Every knee shall bow.

Amen come Lord Jesus

Good thoughts Davidc and MyVeryHeart.
This issue of rewards is often slanted by our corrupt hearts…

When most people think of “rewards”, they think about it in a self-centered way. Let’s try to correct that thought; how about thinking about rewards in a God-centered way? I suggest that the passages that speak of “rewards” in the Scriptures refer to God-centered rewards, Christ-exalting and glorious in nature.

“Obedience” that is motivated by self-centered rewards does not glorify God. In fact, this goes against the heart of the Gospel, which is obedience compelled by the love that God has poured out on us.

The love of Christ compels us. Oh, that I might gain Christ!

A certain servant was told that he would receive a city from his master. But the servant said to his master "I would rather clean the floors of your throne room and be near you continuously than be in the city." The master said "my throne room floors are clean and do not need to be washed". The servant replied "Yes, but let me wash them nonetheless so that I may be continually washed by your presence". The master smiled and said "your heart is right", receive your reward.

If the promise of reward is not to serve as a motivation in the present time, then why does the Lord mention them?

And if we aren't to enjoy them, then why even give them to begin with?

I believe you guys are being too "mystical" in your outlook
It sounds spiritual, but isn't. Christ means to give us tangible rewards in the age to come, rewards beyond simply "being in His presence." They are very much tangible rewards, ones He actually means for us to actually "selfishly" enjoy. Things such as literally ruling over five and ten cities.

If the promise of reward is not to serve as a motivation in the present time, then why does the Lord mention them?

To judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart.

I'm sorry, that just doesn't make any sense to me. Could you clarify?

'Therefore repent; or else I am coming to you quickly, and I will make war against them with the sword of My mouth. Revelation 2:16

he who has an ear, let him hear

That wasn't very helpful.

A certain servant was told that he would receive a city from his master. But the servant said to his master "I would rather clean the floors of your throne room and be near you continuously than be in the city." The master said "my throne room floors are clean and do not need to be washed". The servant replied "Yes, but let me wash them nonetheless so that I may be continually washed by your presence". The master smiled and said "your heart is right", receive your reward.

Where is this from? It's beautiful

"If the promise of reward is not to serve as a motivation in the present time, then why does the Lord mention them?

And if we aren't to enjoy them, then why even give them to begin with?"

As I read the beattitudes I thought about this thread, Jesus tells us to do good works to be a light on a lampstand etc, for what though? To bring Glory to God. If our motivation is solely based on reward I don't really think I want that view or mindset. We are so indept to God on the blessing end of it there is absolutely no reason why God is obligated to bless us or even give us a reward. SO why then does he give good gifts? Is it because we are so wonderful and good He just can't help it? I think not I am a worm and deserve nothing. HE gives gifts simply because from this we are to bring Glory, Honor, and Praise to His name not because we are such lovely servants.

God has no obligation to reward you for your works, your works are filthy rags, He does though because He is so Good not because we are so good.

While that's nice, the Biblical faith handed down to the saints from the Lord teaches us that we are to find motivation in our eternal rewards

What kind of eternal rewards are you looking for Jimmy?
Gold? fame? riches? these are not eternal. Eternal life is to know Him. To BE fit to be with Him. What else is there besides Christ alone?

Where is this from?

Sgs 4:12

"A garden locked is my sister, my bride, A rock garden locked, a spring sealed up.

What else is there but being in Christ alone? The answer is all the other things He said He wanted us to inherit (e.g., ruling and reigning with Him). God himself thought we would enjoy those things otherwise He would never have presented them to us as a reward. It was His idea, not ours and as our Creator He knows perfectly well how to put us in a place of involvement in his work of, for instance, ruling and reigning with Him. We can enjoy Him in this certainly but, He never said we were just to stand before the beatific vision for all eternity and do nothing else.

Why all the discomfort about using the word "reward." Some of you say "but we do not deserve it" or, "God is not OBLIGATED to reward us." So what? He has said He will and even more that there are certain conditions that need to be met. To suppose that I can make any choice to meet any condition is considered by many to be a dreadful expression of pride. Again, He said it, not I.

Of course, He works in us to give us the desire and to assist us in actually doing what He calls us to do but if people did not make different choices there would not be different rewards.

As to what it will be like being that close to Him forever - I am not sure how many people understand that by experience even where we are now. Do you? Do you experience "joy unspeakable?" I don't. Sorry, just being honest.

If our motivation is solely based on reward I don't really think I want that view or mindset.

Of course, nobody has said that. Of course, the glory of God and knowing God and enjoy God forever are number one. But these things aren't the only thing we have going for all eternity. We have rewards that will be given, which when received, will bring glory to Him all the more.

God has no obligation to reward you for your works, your works are filthy rags, He does though because He is so Good not because we are so good.

Agreed. As Lloyd-Jones pointed out, even the rewards He will give us are but extensions of His grace.

"God is not OBLIGATED to reward us." So what?"

This was my point exactly God though not obligated to reward us chooses to not because we are good but because He is good and glorious. There is no obligation on His part to reward us but as a loving Father He does graciously, Why? Because He is crazy in Love with us even though our love is weak. Him rewarding us brings Him Glory, Honor, and Praise for being a Good God who loves His people greatly.

Are the rewards mentioned in Scripture man-centered, or God-centered?

Let us carefully consider this question. When we read parables like the Parable of the Ten Minas (Luke 19:11-27), should we take from it that we will literally inherit “cities”, or should we understand that Jesus uses this picture to illustrate the point that “to everyone who has, more will be given”? (You may also want to consider the fact that the Scriptures only speak of one city in glory: the New Jerusalem)

The passages that Davidc and MyVeryHeart have quoted concerning the nature of the rewards clearly show us that the rewards are God-centered and Christ-exalting, NOT man-centered and worm-exalting. Moreover, a self-centered rewards-based works-righteousness obedience is simply contrary to the glorious Gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ, whose love compels us to serve Him and at the end to say, “We have simply done our duty; we are unworthy servants.” (Luke 17:10) This is true humility before God; this is the only attitude that really glorifies our Lord. For everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, and everyone who humbles himself will be exalted.

I want to gain Christ! Oh, to be near Him! What is the greater reward?
1) More intimacy and closeness to my Lord in glory, or;
2) Being made governor of Decapolis, with a huge castle, and many servants, and great wealth, and twenty virgins, and much gold, and people singing your praises in the morning, and people washing your feet before you go to sleep, and all the other objects that your heart covets.

If the reward you seek is found in #2, I have bad news for you… your heart is full of idolatry. Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength.

In humble love,
Your servant, a worm like yourself, Oh wretched man

What kind of eternal rewards are you looking for Jimmy?

Whatever He will give me as part of living life forever in His kingdom. In His right hand are pleasures forever more. The Scriptures never seem to spell out exactly what these rewards will be. But they do say that some will be receiving more than others. We all won't have the same lot in the age to come.

"Agreed. As Lloyd-Jones pointed out, even the rewards He will give us are but extensions of His grace."

Brother Jimmy I am glad we have come to some kind of agreement on this, :) Or at least see each other a little more eye to eye on the matter.

Are the rewards mentioned in Scripture man-centered, or God-centered?

In a word: Yes!

KingJimmy,
An attitude of obedience exalts Christ above all things. It seeks His glory. In this case, your reward is found in being humbled before Him, like MyVeryHeart puts it.

An attitude of rebellion exalts oneself. It seeks self-glory. In that case, you have already received your reward.

I have no problem with what you just said. But that still does not take away from the fact that we will one day be given literal rewards in the age to come, and that these are tangible things that the Lord wants to bless us with and to enjoy for all eternity as we rule and reign with Him, in accordance with the measure of grace and out stewarding of that grace in the present age. And there is nothing wrong in finding motivation and comfort in knowing you will be rewarded according to the labor you undertook for the cause of Christ in the here and now. For as has been said, God is most glorified when we are most satisfied in Him.

For those that await a reward for their good works in heaven, may I ask what you will say the to Lord if He tells you, you get no reward?

there is nothing wrong in finding motivation and comfort in knowing you will be rewarded according to the labor you undertook for the cause of Christ in the here and now

Does the Bride awaiting the wedding take comfort in the presents she will receive?

For those that await a reward for their good works in heaven, may I ask what you will say the to Lord if He tells you, you get no reward?

I would be perfectly happy with that. But I have no such worry.

Does the Bride awaiting the wedding take comfort in the presents she will receive?

Again, and improper question. But if you are going to persist in asking it, truth be told, there is not a person alive who gets married that doesn't highly anticipate and look forward to the benefits of marriage. Having companionship, enjoying sexual intimacy, and ultimately bringing forth children are all major motivational factors for getting married. And in fact, it's really why we look to get married in the first place, is it not? Does anybody get married to simply get married? Of course not.

Does anybody get married to simply get married?

Yes, someone does. The Bride of Christ.

With all due respect Jimmy, are you married? I married my wife not for the benefit of marriage but because I simply Loved my wife, she didn't need to bring benefit to the table I just Loved her.

And Christ is so worthy of Our Love. He shed his innocent blood for us to be cleansed, to be a pure bride, without spot or wrinkle. Glory to his Name. Jesus Christ. The Bridegroom of Blood.

No. I'm not married. I hope to be one day, and almost was once. But in all due respect, please don't expect me to believe you got married simply to get married. Nobody does.

Biblically speaking, not even Adam got married to simply get married. Eve was created for the benefit of Adam, so that even in the Garden of Eden, Adam would not be alone.

Nobody does

The Bride of Christ does.

The motivation is Love brother, not benefit or gifts. I married because I loved my wife not because she was a benefit to me but because I loved Her and She Loved me. Her love was enough for me to marry whether she turned out to be a terrible wife or a wonderful wife, my Love for her wouldn't have been any different.

How can one be a benefit to an infinitely wealthy God? The problem I see with the rewards basis of this all is a motivation of being better or recieving more than others, This is the spirit I have seen operate in this line of thinking. Notice that the workers that worked at the beginning of the day recieved the same pay as the workers who started the very last hour? Would you be offended if Christ gave someone who did very little for His Kingdom gave that individual more rewards than you?

Yes, you married your wife because you loved her. But why did you seek to get married in the first place, instead of being single for life? You had motivating factors that caused you to seek out consider marriage for your life in the first place. Yes, you got married to her simply because you loved her. But you weren't entirely devoid of other motivations.

Again, I'm not saying that our motivation is primarily that of rewards. It's not. But to ignore the fact that the Bible exhorts us to be partly motivated out of our eternal rewards is to ignore a great Biblical truth. And truth be told, we will actually be given rewards in the kingdom of God. We will all receive a resurrected body and live eternally with Christ forever and ever, in fellowship with Him. But that's not the entire story.

Indeed, might I ask you that if this life was all there was, would you still serve Christ, even if after you died, you ceased to exist forever and ever? Thank carefully about that. How would you answer?

For the apostle Paul taught that if we have only hoped for Christ in this life, then we are above all men to be most pitied. Indeed, if the dead are not raised, Paul said: let us eat and drink, for tomorrow we die.

And indeed, I agree with the apostle. If there is nothing beyond this present life, and if all I'm going to do is black out when I die, as much as I love the Lord, I would probably just go the way of the rest of the world.

I know, that might sound frightful to you. But it is Biblical.

The true Bride loves the Bridegroom solely because he is Worthy to be loved. If the dead are not raised then the lamb who was slain was not worthy. For if Christ was not raised our faith is in vain and we are yet in our sins. Yet the Lamb of God, wool as white as snow, is Worthy! And whether we cease to exist for eternity or not we will chose to love him because he is Worthy! Amen!

Paul was pretty clear that His reward was Christ, Philipians 3:8 "What is more, I consider everything a loss compared to the surpassing greatness of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whose sake I have lost all things. I consider them rubbish, that I may gain Christ."

If I knew there was a God but I blacked out after death, Now if I knew of all that Christ did on the Cross for me dispite reward I would Love Him and Serve Him to death because He is worthy to waste a lifetime on dispite reward. HOWEVER We know there is eternal Life, We know there is unconditional, unaltered, unbroken, fellowship availible with Christ, FOR THIS should we rejoice.

But please tell me I know you are zealous for the work of the Kingdom. What if one that did nothing for the Kingdom recieve more than you in Eternity? Christ gives him a better and greater reward than you? Even more you know that you worked harder, suffered more, bleed more for the Kingdom of Heaven and yet this individual is given a greater reward?

Again This line of thinking though it says OF Course its not about the rewards leaves the individual open to this pride that they will get more in heaven because they are about the business of Christ. I deserve nothing Christ is enough and anything is not because I worked for it but because Christ is gracious enough to bestow it on such a wretch as me.

KingJimmy,
Do you feel like God owes you anything? If so, I have bad news for you... If not, then obedience really isn't motivated by self-centered rewards, but rather Christ-exalting love, which is the true reward of the saint.
Pray about this one.

So, for some of you, the two options are...
1) have no thought for reward because we're humble worms
2) have thought for reward because we're self serving selfish narcisists

First, if you have to repeat over and over that you're humble and a worm while berating a brother for pointing out that it was Christ himself that is holding out the rewards, there's a good chance that'l fall into the wood/hay/stubble category.

Second, I'd say there's a third category.

It is the bridegroom that takes the bride, not the other way around. We are a bride by grace. Therefore, there's no argument that choosing the bridegroom is on the same plane as works as a believer (Eph 2:8-10. The grace unto salvation comes first, then good works follow. They aren't the same. Works before salvation are filthy rags, works after are tried by the fire and either gain or lose reward).

God will not be in debt to any. We were saved by grace when we were yet enemies. We are rewarded for works while we are his sons. He only operates on one side of the balance sheet, we on the other.

That is why he will reward his people.

Any married person that claims no interest whatsoever in the rewards of marriage is a drone. Be honest.

It's not either/or. We loved him because he first loved us. Plain and simple. No true believer came to Christ out of their unpayable debt and pending doom for reward. But upon taking our seat at God's table and being adopted into God's family as sons, things change. We now are zealous for the glory of God and praise him all the more for his promise of reward for the works that come from his working within us (1 Cor 15:10 and Phil 2:13).

It's like a dad giving his son money for Christmas presents and then being glad for the gifts from his son to the rest of the family. A genourous, serving son will be rewarded by his father.

That is why we'll all cast our crowns at his feet, for he is the wellspring from which all our good came. But as Paul said in the verse above, we ourselves did labour and God saw it was good to reward us for that labour.

God is not a communist.

There is nothing wrong with eagerly anicipating that day, to be rewarded by the one we hold dearest. I can't think of a greater blessing.

Otherwise, as Jimmy pointed out, we are most miserable.

Any married person that claims no interest whatsoever in the rewards of marriage is a drone. Be honest.

Does the Bride come to the marriage of the Lamb for presents?

The groom offers to the bride both himself as well as the entire context of the life he has prepared for her. Paul said that participating in the work of God here and now was very rewarding. He did not merely stand and worship God. He worked actively cooperatively with the Lord in his work of reconciling the world to Himself. A bride is very happy working along side her husband in the place he prepared for her just as Eve was meant to be happy knowing her husband as they tended the garden together.

The word says that it has not even entered into the imagination the things God has prepared for those who love him. So is God Himself a "thing" that has been "prepared" for us? The faithful steward was given the immediate responsibility of handling the Lords accounts. Jesus said if he was faithful the Master would "put him in charge of all his possessions" (Luke 12:42). So now, knowing God alone is a possession which the faithful will manage.

Certainly knowing the love that passes knowledge and having a joy unspeakable comes from knowing Him. However, these verses suggest that part of our reward involves other things but some seem to say that to think about this is somehow selfish and somehow displaces our love for Him. In actuality, we know Him all the more as we participate in all His plans (whatever those might be)

I agree with Jimmy. The idea that loving Him alone is enough even if we do not live forever is not Biblical. Yes eternal life is "knowing Him" however, equal to that is the fact that we enjoy it forever. Besides, the eternity of the life apparently does matter and is motivating to us otherwise He would not have mentioned it so often to us. I also agree that people would not much care to follow Christ out of an utterly altruistic motive that is so pure that it does not take into account eternity. People would not endure persecution, torture, betrayal by family, and ultimately loss of the only life they would ever had unless they had the promise of entering the Kingdom at the end. "He that endures to the end will be saved" was said to encourage believers by, yes, a degree of self interest.

I have heard that "The tree of life" in the garden, the promise offered to us at the last of Revelation is just another way of saying knowing "Jesus." On the surface it makes sense. Jesus said he was the life and that eternal life consists of knowing Him.

However, when the original two trees of Knowledge and Life were presented to the first parents, each had a cost or reward. If this "Tree of Life" was merely a representation of spiritual life to be gained by obedience then the whole idea that they might have sinned and still eaten of it does not make sense. We who are dead in sin cannot experience spiritual life apart from the cross no matter what we do. However it makes perfect sense when the "Tree of Life" is taken to mean physical immortality. To live forever in a state of separation from God would be a horrible fate and not fitting. This explains completely why God, out of His mercy and justice would not permit them to do it.

I also agree that people would not much care to follow Christ out of an utterly altruistic motive that is so pure that it does not take into account eternity.

The Bride of Christ follows Him purely because she loves him eternally.

Part of the challenge in this discussion is miscommunication. For instance, when we think about "rewards", we often think about different things. Some people think of self-centered rewards, while others think of God-centered rewards. Some call the latter rewards, and others do not call it so.

I agree that we will be rewarded according to our works. However, we should carefully consider the nature of the rewards, as well as the origin of such rewards. Namely, the "good works" for which we will be rewarded originate from God's good purpose.
1) Ephesians 2:10 tells us that God has prepared these good works beforehand;
2) Philippians 2:13 tells us that it is God who works it in us to act and to will according to His good purpose;
3) 1 Thessalonians 5:23-24 tells us that God is the one who causes the sanctification, not man.

Consequently, God is not indebted to anyone. He is the one who causes us to serve Him according to His perfect purpose.

Moreover, what motivates obedience is God Himself, specifically Christ and His sacrificial love. As a result, the rewards that are offered by God are not rewards for our glory, but rewards for His own glory. Those rewards are God-centered; that is, drawing attention to the work of Jesus Christ, the worth of Christ, the perfect plan of God, how Christ built His church, how Christ conquered evil, etc. In other words, God will not have the angels sound the trumpets for Mr.Joe in order to tell everyone what fine works Mr.Joe has accomplished during his lifetime. No. Rather, the angels will sound the trumpets in order to let everyone know what glorious redemption God has fulfilled throughout the ages.

All in all, God does not owe us anything; He does not become more indebted to reward us as we "accumulate good works". His redemptive plan is accomplished on the basis of His love that He has poured out on us.

{edited for finality}

Like I said on my original response to this thread I am interested to see where this thread goes, I have definitely been helped understand this topic through our discussion whether we agree or not. :)

John Piper has coined a great term to describe what I believe is a proper view of how we as Christians should relate to rewards: Christian Hedonism.

[27] Then Peter said to Him, "Behold, we have left everything and followed You; what then will there be for us?"

[28] And Jesus said to them, "Truly I say to you, that you who have followed Me, in the regeneration when the Son of Man will sit on His glorious throne, you also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

[29] "And everyone who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or children or farms for My name's sake, will receive many times as much, and will inherit eternal life.

(Mat 19:27-29 NASB)

It looks like our Lord has in mind some very tangible rewards that are associated with the ages to come.

"And everyone who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or children or farms for My name's sake, will receive many times as much, and will inherit eternal life."

Anyone that left house and home recieved many times more of these things because they were apart of the Kingdom of God, if you only had 3 natural brothers but left them for the Kingdom you would then have hundreds of thousands of brothers and sisters in Christ. Christ is speaking of the universal family and its economy while on earth and then say AND will inherit eternal life. I have grown alot from this study, I really don't want it to go south by senseless arguments though. When you accept Christ you are adopted into His family which is far greater than earthly families and since we are Sons of the Living God we inherit the "farmers" as sons, But please note its by grace alone we are Sons of God.

I agree brother. I'm just saying, this is a very tangible thing, and something other than "being clothed with righteousness." As real as that is, you can't put your hands on righteousness. But you can the family of God, and the homes that come with them, both now and in the ages to come.

I was just trying to show a glimpse of what we shall receive when we are awarded.

The Bride of Christ follows Him purely because she loves him eternally.

Though I agree with the above statement as it stands, I disagree with the context in trying to use it to say that the church should care nothing of the rewards Jesus promises. The true church will not selfishly seek these things, and that should be obvious to a true believer. They are promised and we are told by Jesus to rejoice greatly in them. To muzzle the ox is wrong, to muzzle the children of God, worse.

Mt 5:12 Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you.

Shows reward for things we do. Says the reward will be great for persecution. We are told by Jesus to rejoice over the reward that is coming.

1 Tim 5:17 ¶ Let the elders that rule well be counted worthy of double honour, especially they who labour in the word and doctrine.
18 For the scripture saith, Thou shalt not muzzle the ox that treadeth out the corn. And, The labourer is worthy of his reward.

Shows a rebuke to the man who would take away reward from God's people that serve him well, especially in the word. Again, the Lord is protective of the rewards for his people.

Lu 6:35 But love ye your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for nothing again; and your reward shall be great, and ye shall be the children of the Highest: for he is kind unto the unthankful and to the evil.

Reward is shown to be given, it seems, for the kind of things that are not rewarded here, ie: loving enemies and giving to those who cannot give back. Again the promise of reward for doing certain things.

1Co 3:8 Now he that planteth and he that watereth are one: and every man shall receive his own reward according to his own labour.

The reward is shown as according to one's own labour.

The rewards are not due because the church selfishly demands them, as some accuse. The rewards are coming because God will be indebted to no one. He will joyfully reward those who labour in His work, His way.

Lu 6:23 Rejoice ye in that day, and leap for joy: for, behold, your reward is great in heaven...

Now I believe acknowledging how we define rewards is quite necessary. Anyone want to take a whack at that one?

Seems the scripture is very ambiguous intentially as to what the rewards are.

Seems to to me imho that the two main questions are

1) Should the church be encouraged with the prospect of reward ie, was that the Lord's intent with the many 'reward' passages?

2) What qualifies for reward (1 Cor 3)?

Now I believe acknowledging how we define rewards is quite necessary. Anyone want to take a whack at that one?

Excellent question.

I believe that the general nature of a Biblical reward is that whatever you have given up for the Lord in this life, you will receive whatever that was, but in abundance, in the life to come. For example, in the text quoted earlier Peter said he had left everything to follow Christ: homes, family, etc. And what did the Lord say Peter would receive for sacrificing such? Homes, family, etc.

I believe we see the same principle taught throughout all of the Scripture. For example, in Hebrews 11 it says that these in the hall of fame of faith left their cities, wandering out of them and keeping their eyes upon the heavenly city that is yet to come. Or we could see the same in the life of Job, who lost much before the "death" he underwent, only to have much more fortune restored to him upon his "resurrection." And we can see the same sort of theme time and time again throughout the prophetical writings, where God promised that whatever the gnawing locut devoured, God would one day restore-- and then some.

Thoughts?

I have read a book a long while back I don't even remember the title or author, but the individual says that God provides Restoration AND Restitution, which is precisely what Jimmy has pointed too. Though I believe this thing to be true it would be quite bold and prideful to walk into the throne room of God and demand restitution for all we lost while following the Spirit. Paul called the things of this world a big pile of poo so I suppose if you want paid back God is more than able :). My thought is when we stand before God in His Glory everything else will pretty much fall to the wayside.

We must remember that everything that we recieve in Heaven though is Pure Grace and that we cannot change the amount of Love God has for us by our good works. Job was restored and then some not because he was a great servant but because God loved Job and is a good Father.

I think for me I fear getting to the Judgment seat and realizing how much time I wasted on trivial things instead of exerting myself in seeking Him and His kingdom above all else. We all know there are different degrees of commitment to God among Christians, some more lukewarm than others, barely escaping the fire(1Cor.3:14-15), and others more on fire for God, building on silver and gold or precious metals. I don't want to be one of the ones barely escaping. I'm sure none of us in our right mind want that for ourselves. The best example we have is Christ Himself. For me next to him is Paul the Apostle, as far as an example of a high level of devotion to God we see in Scripture. Sometimes I wonder, is there any saint today who is that devoted or sold out to Christ? If there is, I haven't seen one, and I am challenged to follow those two examples, although I'm far from it at this point.

restoration and restitution

Amen, I like that saying a lot! It sent firworks off in my soul. And yes, it's all by the grace of God. We would not give up the things we do were it not of his grace from a to z.

I think for me I fear getting to the Judgment seat and realizing how much time I wasted on trivial things instead of exerting myself in seeking Him and His kingdom above all else

Amen brother. I hate to know that for several years, I allowed a relationship to distract me from undistracted devotion to our Lord, and storing up treasures in heaven. Indeed, some of the decisions I made then have had financial consequences that still linger with me today.

And I would not say so much that I'm fearful about that day, but moreso, I am angry over the decisions I made that I know ultimately robbed God of much deserved glory. And for what? A kiss. I'm determined with all of my heart to never let that happen again, even if it means I must be single for a longer period of time than I'd like (or my parents would like)

He could've been magnified so much more.

Please understand Jimmy, regret and condemnation are kissing cousins, that's what grace is for.

*edited for poor grammar :)*

No doubt. And I try to distance myself from them like the plague. Grace does abound.

I believe that Robert Govett, the 19th century Englishman, was on to something. The Millenial Kingdom (I think I mispelled that) is the reward of the overcoming believer.

I believe the overcomer promises to the churches in revelation speak to that. A number of the parables speak to that as well as it making sense of various scriptures (especially in Hebrews).

One in particular is about the example of Esau giving up his inheritance for the red soup. This has to do with giving up our inheritance in the Kingdom...our reward.

There is so much to say about rewards, but I'm not prepared right now to deal with it. Paul urged us to be careful that no one cheat us out of our reward (I don't recall the words he used.)

Its fine and noble to say loving the Lord is its own reward. Certainly there is nothing greater than knowing Jesus. We are apt to become discouraged and lose our perspective on the journey. Of course the Lord knew this
and has set rewards before us to motivate us.

If we win crowns we have something to give Him in person.
If we reign with Him we will be with Him on the earth, sharing this experience is quite a motivation if its real enough to you.