Another False Revival: Bay of the Holy Spirit Revival?

I went to messianic dancing this morning and someone was telling me about this miracle revival in Mobile Alabama and as I skeptical of anything that is on the God Channel
http://www.bayoftheholyspiritrevival.info/nathan-morris-1/

this is there information are we getting the same thing as Todd Bentley

Revival History

Church of His Presence in Daphne, Alabama hosted “Open the Heavens Conference 2010.” On the last night, July 23rd, British Evangelist, Nathan Morris, was ministering as God’s Presence was ushered in. Notable healings took place and children began to be touched by the power of God. Pastor John Kilpatrick, former pastor and overseer of the Brownsville Revival in Pensacola, FL, stated it felt like Father’s Day 1995 when that historic revival began.

A spontaneous decision was made to extend the meetings at the Daphne Civic Center to see what God would do. Nathan and Shake the Nations team cancelled their flights to Hawaii scheduled for that weekend. Since then, attendance has grown as people have traveled from across America and other countries. To accommodate the crowds and meet regularly on Thursday, Friday and Saturday nights, the revival meetings were moved to the Mobile Convention Center in Mobile, AL.

This move of God has been called the Bay of the Holy Spirit Revival. Historically, Mobile Bay was named on early Spanish maps Bahía del Espíritu Santo, (Bay of The Holy Spirit). In 2008 a memorial historical sign commemorating the name Bay of the Holy Spirit was approved by the Alabama Historical Association and a Commendation was signed by Governor Bob Riley.

Since that miraculous night of July 23rd, hundreds have given their lives to Christ and been delivered by the power of God. Extraordinary miracles and healings are continuing each night. We are seeing the lame walk, the blind see, deaf ears open and diverse terminal illnesses healed.

We invite you to come and experience the Presence, Power and Glory of our Lord.

I am skeptical of anything out of Brownsville and John Kilpatrick. I need to see Doctors Reports before i believe that miracles are happening

1 John 4:1
1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

2 Thessalonians 2
7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work : only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. 8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed , whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: 9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, 10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish ; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved . 11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: 12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness. 13 But we are bound to give thanks

1 John 4:6 KJV
We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

I so want a true revival to put these false revivals to shame but I so want what is true! I had to fight on Wikipedia tooth and nail over Todd Bentley actually detailing what was really going on in Florida.
Then I am trying to fight with issues such as the Shack,

It is almost as a christian you have to tell people do not follow this and this because it is bad, I so wish people had more a love of the truth!

I also do not want to be like Andrew Murray who missed a revival. I so want a genuine biblical revival as Greg has put on the Semonindex Slogan!

2 Timothy 3:13 KJV
But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse , deceiving , and being deceived

My problem is with these False Revivals what damage it does to the Gospel and to non christians.

It is such a pain trying to refute Christians whilst trying to preach the gospel to non Christians

I love how Andrew Strom and others released books almost instantly refuting heresies such as Todd Bentley, what we need is Pamphlets that we can print out to refute things such as The Emergent Church (Rob Bell, Brian Mclaren, Steve Chalke, etc), Word of Faith Movement (Joyce Meyer, Benny Hinn,Creflo Dollar, Kenneth Hagin) and Toronto Movements (Heidi Baker and others), The Shack, Harry Potter, Yoga, Ecumenical Movement and so many others just in some of these!

I am so desperate for the True because it makes the False things look so dumb, it is like I have been lied to so much I am desperate for the truth!

I am sure many today would reject Paul, servant of God, called to be an apostle, when he and his group acted like they were out of their mind unto the Lord. 2 Cor 5:13.

Friend, I have to believe you are serious when you say you are desperate for the truth.

You could begin by ceasing your agreement with the enemy in accusing others. Join Jesus Christ in His constant intercession for them.

"Revival" may not be as neat and tidy as we are lead to believe.

Ruf

p.s. Someone said "neither will they be persuaded though one rose from the dead"

I think the biggest concern about this is whether the gospel is being preached. Forget whether there is healings or not. They can be lying signs and wonders. If there is no repentance of sins and all people are doing is looking for an experience then this will soon fail.

The last 'revival' I ever went to was the laughing mess back in the 90's with Rodney Howard Browne. It wasn't until after it was passed that I understood what was going on and I do have some stories along with it.

I have had my fill of 'church' and healings and such not longer 'move' me. Give me someone who preaches a stern heart pounding message of repentance to the point of weeping and I shall come and weep along side of him in repentance. That is really all I care about anymore. Repentance and a renewing of my mind and heart to understand what God is calling me to.

deltadom wrote:
I need to see Doctors Reports before i believe that miracles are happening

deltadom wrote:
I had to fight on Wikipedia tooth and nail over Todd Bentley actually detailing what was really going on in Florida. Then I am trying to fight with issues such as the Shack

God can seriously take care of himself! You do not have to accuse anyone of being wrong and help plaster it all over Wikipedia (Rufnrust is correct in this).

deltadom:
I am so desperate for the True because it makes the False things look so dumb, it is like I have been lied to so much I am desperate for the truth!

God bless you, brother
Lisa

Fear not, little flock; for it is your Father’s good pleasure to give you the kingdom. Luke 12.32

PS:

deltadom:
I also do not want to be like Andrew Murray who missed a revival. I so want a genuine biblical revival as Greg has put on the Semonindex Slogan!

deltadom:
I also do not want to be like Andrew Murray who missed a revival. I so want a genuine biblical revival as Greg has put on the Semonindex Slogan!
Which revival did Andrew Murray miss? By his writings, I thought he was a revival all by himself!!! Amen? That’s what we need to be! Look up his book called, “Divine Healing.”

Misquote Andrew Murray almost missed a revival because it was not he was expecting!

deltadom wrote:
I need to see Doctors Reports before i believe that miracles are happening
Be careful of what you say.

Is it wrong to want evidence as there have been so many false reports of miracles such as people like benny hinn and others!

I grew up in a school where the Toronto blessing was prevelant and had to fight in school and have been fighting against this thing since I was 14 or younger and had to explain to the people in my new school the crazieness of that.

I am not one who thinks that if the false is out there, there must be true bank notes if there are false ones.

I have spent hours on end analyzing what is false and so thankful for people like Greg and others who point me to the truth or it is I have so spent time with the real God that whenever something fake comes up in stands out like a sore thumb, to be in God Presence is the only way!
It does not mean that we should disregard the literature of past and present and people such as Athenaius who died to stop heresies from Arias.
Should we love Jesus and his word to the point where we can stand against things that pollute our church and cause damage not only to those that are within but those are without.
Such as the ecumenical movement or other things where you have to say Christianity is not this or this or this.
Where are the men of old who can stand up like People like Tyndale and others?

My heart longs for the true and the real! As it is so sick of what is not!

deltadom:
Is it wrong to want evidence as there have been so many false reports of miracles such as people like benny hinn and others!

I can tell you that I’ve seen a healing and the woman who was healed was not like those people on benny hinn saying ever so softly, “yes, I’m healed.” The whole block knew something happened to this woman and she herself threw off her wrist bandages. She had been touched by an almighty God and was healed!

deltadom:
I have spent hours on end analyzing what is false

deltadom:
Where are the men of old who can stand up like People like Tyndale and others?

deltadom:
My heart longs for the true and the real!

God bless you, bro!
Lisa

Since most everyone has their opinion of the Brownsville revival, whether they have been there or not, I am going to throw my two cents in.

The Brownsville revival was far from perfect, and I have never seen a move of God that was, because where the Holy Spirit is working, the enemy is busy attempting to discredit and counterfeit the work.

The gospel of Jesus Christ was preached at the Brownsville revival. Night after night Steve Hill preached strong messages that brought conviction of sin and many backsliders came back to the Lord, many people from all over the world were saved.

I witnessed the effect that this move of God had on my friends and the young people that were there at the meetings. They went forth from these meetings as bold witnesses for Jesus Christ in the streets of our city. Ministries came forth out of this revival that are still going on today and bearing fruit. I witnessed more of an anointing on the ministry that the Lord had put me in at the time that these meetings were taking place.

If you want to hear one of the teachers that ministered at the Brownsville revival and headed up the "Fire School" that trained young people for the ministry, listen to Michael Brown's teachings. These were some of the best teachings on discipleship that I have ever heard. The cross was preached. It wasn't just about all sorts of weird manifestations going on. Andrew Strom and others have thrown the baby out with the bath water by placing an emphasis on some of the strange manifestations while totally ignoring the good fruit that came out of this revival.

John Kilpatrick is a true man of God. He is a true pastor with a passion for revival and prayer.

The Word of God says that we are to prove all things. It also says that we are to hold fast to that which is good.

There have been many good men that have rejected moves of God because they didn't line up with what a revival was suppose to look like in their eyes. During the Great Awakening, Jonathan Edwards had some of the leading theologians of the day reject that great revival because they did not approve of many of the manifestations that were taking place. We can learn from history, the same thing is going on today.

Mike

Jesus-Is-God wrote:
Back on Topic - Are you men or women saying that you see nothing wrong with the website that DeltaDom posted ?

About the video I watched that he posted and Nathan Morris said a couple of things I have to agree with, “People ask me how I know it was God. I say, Believe me, when God’s power comes on you like that, you don’t need anybody to introduce Him. He introduces Himself.” I experienced that when Christ came to me.

AND what he said here, “The voice of God... it wasn’t audible, it was inside here. You see God when He speaks to you can reach a point that no man, no nothing can ever reach.” Yep, definitely, so true. I cannot argue with those things.

God bless you,
Lisa

Is 'this' how we need to "advertise" - and do we need to go to events like this to get "a touch" or "healed"?

A man is known by the company he keeps.

I know the quote is generally true but here’s another side to it: I love spending time with the girls at the jail; they are a lot more REAL than a lot of Christians.

I'm not impressed by "words", but by fruits and I truly have problems with "healers" renting accomadations for healing services on a web-page that is geared toward nothing but making money off of some gullible humans and gives at the bottom of the page "Related Videos" containing the likes of Benny Hinn and many other 'questionables'.

I trust that God is in control and that He knows exactly what He agrees with and disagrees with; I’ve seen Him take care of other people and I’m sure if this bothers Him, He’ll take care of it. Because I pick my battles to fight and let me tell ya that Sid Roth is not even in the top 100.

Don't we have any discernment left? -- to heed Jesus' warning to 'watch that we not be deceived' or Matt 24:24?

One of the battles that I do wage war against the part of Christianity that refuses to love the unloveable, no matter what form it takes.

God bless you too!
Lisa

May I share a private amusement I enjoy?

Man at his best state is altogether vanity. A vapor. Water poured out that cannot be gathered up again.

Most of us don't even have the bible memorized. Furthermore we have only studied portions, (we think thoroughly). The light we do have we see through a glass darkly.

Paul said it was given to him to preach the "unsearchable riches of Christ" From vanishing point to vanishing point He is God. The heaven of the heavens cannot contain Him. The heavens are His throne and the earth His footstool.

There is no searching His understanding. There are 4 chapters of questions God is asking Job, that Job doesn't seem to be able to answer.

The mountains melt like wax at the presence of the Lord. A fire goes before Him devouring His enemies. He is the High and lofty One who inhabits eternity whose name is Holy. etc......

This awesome God has come to us and made Himself known in Christ Jesus to rescue us! amen!

Now, back to my amusement.

We (me too) whose lives are less than the snap of a finger feel somehow that we are experts on the eternal unsearchable ways of God our creator and redeemer.

This makes me smile

Ruf

I just have two questions?

Why are they charging $20 for the DVD when the actual cost should be much less?

Why are they touching people to get them to be "slain in the spirit"?

I am not not Penticostal myself, and don't know any of the names mentioned like Sid Roth or the others because I don't watch TV, but I have listened to sermons on revival history and also read books and just don't see these two elements there. charging money, and touching people. In fact almost unanimously people testified that they had to step aside in order that God alone may receive the glory.

Thank you for this post JiG.
God bless.

Dear Deltadom: It is good to be wary. The bible says so. May God bless you and keep you safe from falseness even if you have to go it alone.

Linda

I watched that revival once on the internet Live.
and during thoose hours I was watching there was not a single word of repentence from sins.

Hi, i'm a newbie on the site. John Kilpatrick is the one who oversaw the Brownsville revival, which was certainly very strong on repentance from sins. I have watched several sermons from Bay of Holy Spirit that were very much about repentance. I would certainly not consider them at all similar to Todd Bentley. Kilpatrick is very concerned about personal, practical holiness. Bentley wasn't (obviously). Kilpatrick officially warned the church about Bentley's strange teachings before Lakeland fell apart. He is desperately hungry for God. There are plenty of things that i disagree with, but BHS is enough about Jesus and His presence that i take it seriously. Not only that, but the Delia Knox case is pretty hard to refute. Look it up on youtube. I think it's real.

My life was changed at the Brownsville Revival in 1995. After living a shallow Christian life, I was drawn into a closer walk with Christ that has never ceased until now. John Kilpatrick is a true man of God who is a father to Pastors and whose teaching is scripturaly sound.

im not at all impressed with what i saw on you tube regarding this ,actualy makes me want to cry when i see it with greif , and not with joy,, when i watch many sermons on sermon index i cry with joy , but not when i watched this new revivle

just reading the writtings of the old revivlests like weasly whifield , ect ,who i might add also produced phisical manifestion ,gives me entence quikening in my spirit

listing to sermons from wilkinson,conlon ,washer ravenhill
tozer all quiken my spirit , and make me tremble with fear and joy ,,,,,this men preached againsts this type of revivle

i remember crying wile watching a short sermon called weird manifestation by david wilkinson ,as david wept bitterly at the end of the sermon

i incourage everyone to watch the sermon called weird manfestation , if you beleieve that wikinson was a prophert of god

bless you all ,,,gazzer

Martyr
I am not an expert on revival. I am an expert on what aint revival...having been forced to watch the parade of self seeking ministries over the last few decades claim they were the last great revival. I promise you one thing. When and if God moves with revival on America it will be because his people turned their hearts toward Him...NOT BECAUSE OF THE NEWEST CELEBRITY PREACHER. And if God sends revival I can promise you they wont be selling a CD/DVD for a donation of $20USD to transfer this anointing to me so I can spread it just like Sid Roth. Remember the devil and his lying signs and wonders???? Remember the ones sent away by the Lord said "didn't we do many miracles in your name".....They did the miracles in His name....But He never knew them. Me thinks if Ravenhill where here in the flesh he would have some good snappy remark about whats going on in Alabama. So in his absence I'll pick a few quotes of his.... When did you last tip-toe out of the sanctuary? (When) you couldn't say a word to anybody (because) you were so overwhelmed (with the glory of God)...... I think one of the serious breakdowns in modern evangelism is this: it has offered too much for too little. What we do mostly is offer forgiveness. We need cleansing! There is no true conversion until a man takes up his cross.....If there's no brokenness in the pulpit, why should there be any brokenness in the pew?........No church is going to have a revival without a prayer meeting....Everyone wants revival. Do you know why they want revival? To fill up the vacant pews. Many revivals empty the church before it fil1s it. God wounds before He heals.....(and lastly)....You'lI get revival when you meet God's conditions (for it). Those conditions would be a broken contrite heart and a turning from sin and a turning to God. Do we see that at Alabama?

Just been checking out the website for this claimed revival go to Recent Posts Heavenly Domains Kings and Priest in the Market Place

Quote---If you are serious about soul winning with a great social connection provider or about your online business and fed up with having the headaches caused by web hosting problems. I strongly recommend that you Kings, Priest and Rulers of the Most High go to http://www.bayoftheholyspiritrevival.info/about/heavenly-domains/ and get this great hosting plan and any more domains you may need for yourself plus receive a host of additional freebies.

The post in fact the whole web site is nothing but a advertisment making money out of God...John 2:16 And said unto them that sold doves, Take these things hence; make not my Father's house a house of merchandise.

A true servent of God will know not use the things of God to make money....

If any one on here has doubts as to your salvation please go to Bay of the Holy Spirit Revivals web site (see link below) and say the pray and print off the "Born again birth certificate" and it will settle all doubts.

http://www.bayoftheholyspiritrevival.info/salvation/index1.html

surely this is enough to convince us all this is a true move of God

Enochh please read this scripture, then think of the website promoting this "revival"

2 Peter 2

1But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

2And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of.

3And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not.

As we look out at Christendom today; marketing is the name of the game. This marketing-mania we are seeing is more a meter of apostasy rather than progress. Sorry, Church but your merchandising is a sure sign of spiritual deadness.

Did the Early Apostles Try to Make a Living From Preaching the Gospel?

Everywhere we go, we hear ministers justifying their lust for gain and fleecing the flock of God. What was the attitude of the early leaders who lead the people of God by the example they saw in Jesus? Consider their own words

2 Corinthians 2:17 Amplified Bible

For we are not, like so many, [like hucksters making a trade of] peddling God's Word [shortchanging and adulterating the divine message]; but like [men] of sincerity and the purest motive, as [commissioned and sent] by God, we speak [His message] in Christ (the Messiah), in the [very] sight and presence of God.

Theyers defines peddling (kapeleuo) as

1) to be a retailer, to peddle,
2) to make money by selling anything,
3) to get sordid gain by dealing in anything, to do a thing for base gain,
4) to trade in the word of God,
5) to try to get base gain by teaching divine truth

Down through the years, those who made the greatest impact for the Kingdom of God were not Kings and Priests of the marketplace, as these who promote marketplace ministry want you to believe, but those who forsook all and followed the Lord. It was those who forsook houses, brothers, sisters, father, mother, wife, children and lands, for Christ’s sake, who received the hundred fold blessing of God. We are not talking about money. They received everlasting life as their inheritance see Matthew 19:29

Is there anyone, like Paul, afraid of bringing reproach on the gospel of Christ by seeking material gain in the name of Christ? Is there any integrity left among those who call themselves by His name in this generation? Are all defiled by greed? Is there anyone who preaches the gospel without charge?

As we look around in Christendom today, what do we see? Something is being revealed. Do we see those who share Christ's attitude toward mammon or do we see the lust for gain held by son of perdition? Do you see the son of perdition being revealed in the temple of God? Do you hear the sound of the moneychangers? Beware least they make merchandise of you, and he who sells you says, "Blessed be God, for I am rich!"

I actually went to this revival for no reason just cause I wanted to go to Alabama with my wife. No one touched me I did not feel good had surgery a week earlier, I did not know any of the songs so i was not into the worship, I was just at church cause I love god. When they did altar call I took my wife who had recenly given her life to christ she was a babtist, while they were praying for her something without anyone even talking to me or touching me came over me. I was filled with an unbelivible precense it was the most amazing love I've ever felt. My stomach could not stop shaking which is a miracle because I could bearly stant without it hurting due to surgery. I hit the ground and spoke in tounges without hearing or imatating anything. This is the real deal, I really feel sorry for you bro if you never get to meet got on earth, thankfully there is heaven. They didnt believe Jesus either. As far as trying to make money, the problem with trying to sale dvds and cd's it's because people wont give money unless they get something bad. I am very carefull I saw MARJOE trust me I test the spirits and this was real. MATHEW 9:34 But the Pharisees said, “He casts out demons by the ruler of the demons.”
Some people just dont want to believe. But god promised he would pour out his spirit in the last days. And this is it.

Joe, I would caution you. The devil can do all this: heal, make us speak in tongues, give us a spiritual high...

I AM NOT SAYING THAT'S WHAT HAPPENED TO YOU.

I am saying in the last days, all these sign hungry Christians are going to be lead astray.

The fact that these people DO NOT have sound doctrine should give you PAUSE!

Enochh wrote:
"If any one on here has doubts as to your salvation please go to Bay of the Holy Spirit Revivals web site (see link below) and say the pray and print off the "Born again birth certificate" and it will settle all doubts.

http://www.bayoftheholyspiritrevival.info/salvation/index1.html

surely this is enough to convince us all this is a true move of God"

This is sarcasm, is it not?

I believe some of the healings that happen are true. People are healed not by the Godliness of these pastors but because of the healed person’s faith in God. If a person who is in need of healing with full faith in God and this evangelist, goes to the evangelist believing if he is touched then God will heal him, then he will be healed. It is the person's faith that healed him. Anyone who takes credit on healing or any miracle on themself is not a man of God. But most of them in such charismatic movement take the credit on themselves to make money, which shows us they are not from God.
When Jesus healed someone he answered them back saying 'Go your faith has healed you'.

Quick question... if the person's faith heals them then can it be said that the healed person can take credit for their healing?

Also, if someone seeks a healing and they do not receive it does that mean the person did not have enough faith?

Good question and purposely did not answer them in my previous post. Since you want an answer from me here it is.
1. As you are an expert in it, Faith Comes from God . If you think from the healed person perspective, they had faith on the Evangelist and the evangelist healed them. According to them it is the evangelist who healed them. Proof – The blind man’s testimony when he was healed by Jesus.

2. Regarding the second question, if a person is not healed then most of these evangelists blame on the person that they did not have enough faith. But if the evangelist is true then he should know that this person did not have enough faith even before they tried to heal them. When Jesus healed someone he made sure he tested the faith of them before he did it. If they lacked faith then he did not heal them till they got faith. Proof - Mark 9 -23:

“But if you can do anything, take pity on us and help us.”
“‘If you can’?” said Jesus. “Everything is possible for one who believes.”
Immediately the boy’s father exclaimed, “I do believe; help me overcome my unbelief!”

I don't find any story in Bible where Jesus tried to heal someone and if does not happen he sent them back saying your faith is not strong.

Just as another component for you to consider in this matter-

Never did anyone who exhibited faith in Jesus ever walk away sick any longer.

In the scriptural record EVERY person who expressed faith in Jesus was healed.... ALL of them. There is NOT ONE SINGLE ACCOUNT of Jesus telling someone they needed to go learn a lesson, be used in their illness, wait until he perfected something in them, etc. If they expressed faith in Him they were healed! Every single time.

A person can do with that what they will...... but it is the scriptural record.

Caps used for emphasis on phrases only. No shouting was intended.

Blessings!

What about the dead people He brought back to life? Essentially He healed them... how could they exercise faith if they were dead?

I think in case of Lazarus, Jesus knew the faith of his sisters and how much they trusted him to heal him. Though they did not believe that he can raise him from dead, he did it to prove that what Jesus can do to people who love him. I believe it is for a greater glory of Lazarus.
In case of Jairus's daughter, again Jairus called Jesus to heal his daughter, but on the way his daughter died. Jesus raised her as a token of Jairus faith.

Hey Krispy-

You can't (and they couldn't) have normal faith for the resurrection of the dead. The reason is there is no specific promise given within God's word for resurrections from the dead. As you know faith only comes by hearing God's Word. There certainly are scriptures for physical healing... but not for resurrection. So it seems clear that resurrections from the dead are not in response to a persons faith.

The type of "faith" required for resurrection is the gift of the Spirit of "special" faith listed in 1 Corinthians 12. I would think gifts of healings would also be required or the individual might just simply die again.

Faith received and grown by constantly feeding on the Word is totally different from gifts of the Spirit. The gifts of the Spirit do not require faith... God just does it and they operate "as the Spirit wills" 1 Cor 12. However, faith can be built up if the Word is ingrained into us in areas that God has made promises to or for.

Blessings!

Krispy-

Again I say...Jesus NOT 1 TIME EVER told someone He would not heal them who exhibited faith in Him. I think I can pull up about 13-15 examples where Jesus exact words were , "Your faith made you whole" or words to the same exact meaning. Not one example otherwise.

As to "Pauls thorn"..it was certainly no sickness or disease. Paul tells us exactly what it was. He said it was the "messenger" (Greek- angelos) or "angel" of satan sent to strike him repeated blows. Go reread the book of Acts and track Paul's life from city to city and keep a log of what happens. He is assaulted one after the other... or struck with repeated blows. This is no sickness !!! It is a demon sent by satan to attack Paul, strike Paul, and attack him with repeated blows. That's what Paul said! An "angel" isn't a disease. It's an entity.

The erroneous thoughts that you have heard before on this topic also say that it was sent to keep Paul humble. ARE YOU KIDDING ME! When was the last time satan sent anything to keep someone humble...he knows that PRIDE will bring a fall... not humility. Humility causes one to be exalted.

Just let the text mean what it says and you will find much freedom there!

Blessings!

i dont recal timothy being heald of his frequent imfirmity

and paull didnt rebuk him becasue of hs lack of faith ,,but prescibed the use of a little wine ,insted of just water

its sipmle not gods will to heal every body at every moment

but solomon to assume that demons dont casue illness ,,is abold asertion

Again, not once did Jesus send anyone away that exhibited faith. Does that not catch your attention?

Paul's case was certainly no sickness or disease. It was clearly a demon.

In Timothy's case we have no idea why he had stomach issues from time to time. We simply do not know. We also have no idea if Timothy had faith. The text does not tell us. I agree with Paul... help people feel better. That is however a far cry from making the atonement of Jesus less than it was. To say Jesus did not pay the price for our full redemption is to make less of the the cross than it is - IMHO.

Again, there is NO EXAMPLE AT ALL of Jesus ever sending someone away sick that exhibited faith in Him. It never once happened in scripture. Why are Christians lining up to say Jesus does that to virtually everyone today?!?! It amazes me how people try to make a scripture fit their belief to help people stay sick as opposed to helping build faith to receive healing!

No one has mentioned it yet... but for the record we also have no idea why Paul left Trophimus in Miletus sick. One verse suggests he over worked himself... but it is not clear. So we don't know...let's build faith on what we do know and can see from scripture instead of straining at a gnat hoping to find a way to keep people sick.

Just let the text mean what it says!

Blessings

Murrcolr, you focus is way too much of what others are doing with their money, mammon is not money. Mammon is a love of money. There's a huge difference between loving money and having money. It's not up to you to judge how the man of God spends, thinks of spending or anything else that has to do with money. Can you have revival without money? Especially a large meeting? Absolutely not. Forgive me if I misjudged you or what you were saying.

Tylerharper9. You said, "Can you have revival without money? Especially a large meeting? Absolutely not."

Friend. Are you stating that God cannot move people to and in revival without money?

Can you have revival without money? Especially a large meeting?

Revival Defined

First, let me tell you what I mean by revival. An evangelistic campaign or special meeting is not revival. In a successful evangelistic campaign or crusade, there will be hundreds or even thousands of people making decisions for Jesus Christ, but the community remains untouched, and the churches continue much the same as before the outreach. In revival, God moves in the district. Suddenly, the community becomes God conscious. The Spirit of God grips men and women in such a way that even work is given up as people give themselves to waiting upon God. In the midst of the Lewis Awakening, the parish minister at Barvas wrote, "The Spirit of the Lord was resting wonderfully on the different townships of the region. His Presence was in the homes of the people, on meadow and moorland, and even on the public roads." This presence of God is the supreme characteristic of a God-sent revival. Of the hundreds who found Jesus Christ during this time fully seventy-five per cent were saved before they came near a meeting or heard a sermon by myself or any other ministers in the parish. The power of God, the Spirit of God, was moving in operation, and the fear of God gripped the souls of men - this is God-sent revival as distinct from special efforts in the field of evangelism

Example

They had arranged for me to address the church at a short meeting beginning at nine o'clock that night. It was a remarkable meeting. God sovereignly moved, and there was an awareness of God which was wonderful. The meeting lasted until four o'clock in the morning, and I had not witnessed anything to compare with it at any other time during my ministry. Around midnight, a group of young people left a dance and crowded into the church. There were people who couldn't go to sleep because they were so gripped by God. Although there was an awareness of God and a spirit of conviction at this initial meeting, the real breakthrough came a few days later on Sunday night in the parish church. The church was full, and the Spirit of God was moving in such a way that I couldn't preach. I just stood still and gazed upon the wondrous moving of God. Men and women were crying out to God for mercy all over the church. There was no appeal made whatsoever. After meeting for over three hours, I pronounced the benediction and told the people to go out, but mentioned that any who wanted to continue the meeting could come back later. A young deacon came to me and said, "Mr. Campbell, God is hovering over us." About that time the clerk of the session asked me to come to the back door. There was a crowd of at least 600 people gathered in the yard outside the church... Someone gave out Psalm 102 and the crowd streamed back in to the church which could no longer hold the number of people. A young school teacher came down front crying out, "O God, is there nothing left for me?" She is a missionary in Nigeria today. There was a bus load of people coming to the meeting from sixty miles away. The power of God came into the bus so that some could not even enter the church when the bus arrived. People were swooning all over the church, and I cannot remember one single person who was moved on by God that night who was not gloriously born again. When I went out of the church at four o'clock in the morning there were a great number of people praying alongside the road. In addition to the school teacher, several of those born again that night are in foreign mission work today.

Duncan Campbell if need more go to the link below....

http://www.openheaven.com/library/history/lewis.html

I've been reading and listening to sermons here in sermonindex by old revivalists and I love what I hear and read! God is so awesome.

But when I came to this forum, I found out that theres many fears and criticism against current revivals. I understand some of fears and I agree about some things, but in this I am wondering very much.

Would you dear brothers (and maybe sisters) listen to the word that is preached and consider then, if someone is sent by God or not. And also, in many recent 'revivals' that had some kind of weird manifestations and even weird sermons, there has been very much of good worship. I mean the heart that those people had for God. Worshipping Him with all of their hearts with humbleness and love. Isnt that awesome? For example Lakeland revival. Even though Todd Bentley wasnt preaching good messages from God, the worship was awesome very often, not because it was "beautiful singing" but because of peoples hearts.

But back to this Bay of the Holy Spirit revival. I've not been watching it often, but I've heard preaching of Nathan Morris many times. Even in Bay of the Holy Spirit revival. Nathan Morris speaks about surrendering to Jesus completely, yielding lives unto Him and being holy for Him. He speaks about holiness unto God, repentance, cross and blood of Jesus.. whats wrong with that, huh? :O

Nathan Morris has been a missionary as well (at least he has travelled around, even Africa, and preaching the gospel there) and while he preached the gospel, demons were manifesting in people and he told them to come out and they came out. Blind eyes opened, deaf eyes opened.. and huh, they are Africans! They know each other. Many believed because of those testimonies, because people KNEW that some people were born deaf and dumb or blind. They believed in Jesus!

With love, my brothers (and maybe sisters :) ) I say.. please, watch what God is doing. Dont look so much to what the enemy is doing, we should keep our eyes on Jesus and praise Him for His good works.

Jesus didnt heal to make people to believe. People believed in Him BEFORE they were healed. Jesus is saying it Himself. He says: "Your faith has made you whole." And I dont want to discuss about healing and faith, I just wanted to say what the Bible says about it. Jesus did not heal to make people believe in Him. He healed to show that God loves those people. He had COMPASSION for them, thats what Bible is saying to us. We should read it more. Jesus healed because He loved. He is same yesterday, today and forever. Doesnt that mean that His love hasnt changed and the way He expresses His love, hasnt changed?

Well, in my opinion: Lets look what God is doing, lets not fight against it.. and if theres something thats not from God, we can warn about it, but lets quit spreading fear, and lets start preaching gospel that makes hearts to turn to the Lord.

You know them from their fruits. Isnt that correct? We should see what fruit revivals are doing, then we know if they are from God or not. Of course there can be people, who are not perfect, for only God is perfect in everything, so if someone makes mistakes, lets correct them if they dont hear God who is correcting them, but lets love them, lets accept them even with their mistakes, and lets take a look what good God does in and through their life.

What do you think? If you make mistakes, and someone starts talking about you because of that, wouldnt you feel bad? Would you think that "well, I am not perfect. I made mistake, but why are those people still talking about me?"

Lets forgive each other, as God forgave us.

About the fruit.. if the fruit is new believers, believers with more surrendered heart and life to Christ, believers loving our Lord Jesus Christ more than their own life, believers praying more, reading their Bibles more.. having deep and intimate relationship with God through Jesus.. preaching gospel.. repenting.. is it bad fruit? Well, from their fruits you know them!

I am just a young man here and for sure I know less than you who are older than I, and I even make mistakes in my english writing, but please forgive me. I just see that its very important to start looking what God does and start praying instead of finding whats wrong with everything.

May God richly bless you, beloved brothers and sisters!

Anonymous,

You have just blessed me so much,by your sharing.

God bless you,

Elizabeth

* was just noticing, ....your post Anonymos,might have been wrote some time ago ,...?..Anyway ,I just read it ,And it was most refreshing.

@ jimdied2sin

YOU STATED ;

Lakeland was part of Gods judgment on America.

I RESPOND : Whether you put it on the finest china or a dirty paper plate... bologna is still bologna and this as big a chunk of it as you will ever read!

Regardless of how leadership, especially the elders from the local church in Lakeland, may have failed - there is no denying the incredible fruit that was born out in the lives of individuals that went there and sought God. I know this from first hand friends of mine who were there. They received from God in spite of the leadership failure of those deacons in that local church to sit a person down they knew was on the edge of seeing his family collapse.

This was a failure of leadership concerning the deacon board of that local church....nothing more, nothing less, and nothing else.

Learn the lesson and move on to not repeat it again. However, to insinuate it as a "judgement from God" is to be naive about the circumstances that actually happened there.

Sometimes when I listen to somebody testifying of miraculous healing, I think of all sorts of things - Is the person telling the truth? Did it really happen? Is he over-spiritualizing things? Do the doctors all agree? What about his spiritual life? Is he saved from sins? Does he have so much faith as to get miraculously healed? Did God really "touch" him or is it just his imagination? Etc. The above thoughts come when "somebody" is testifying.

And now I have a very dear friend of mine who is severly suffering from Lung cancer - and I am praying for what...a MIRACLE!.. regardless of how much faith he has, or how the miracle happens (in a neat way or dramatic unacceptable way), or his spiritual status - I just want God to do a MIRACLE for him!

God save me from my judgmental attitude and prejudices which come up when others testify of such miracles.

Friends,
1. There is no need to condemn or praise any preacher. We listen to whatever sermon we are led to listen to, keep it in our hearts, and come and search the Scripture ourselves and prove it and then believe it and hold to it. Remember those Bereans (Acts 17: 10,11) who did that even to Paul.

2. Zac Poonen in one of his messages says something to this effect - "Whatever I get from God first hand, I give it. But you receive it only second hand. Make sure you also pray/look for it and receive it first hand from God." Amen.

3. As to our "concern" on people being "misled" by some preachers (most preachers?), well first let's pray for all the shepherds who are called to (and also for those who merely claim to) lead the flock of God.

4. Personally, looking back - Along the way, I have listened to some sermons which "at that point of time" helped me in some way spiritually. But from now at this point, when I think about those sermons, I don't agree with all that was said. Nevertheless I don't want to condemn those preachers, because "at that point" it did help me in some way. About 10 years back, I read Benny Hinn's "He touched me", and I must confess that "at that point" it did help me to desire for a closer life with God. Perhaps NOW I may have a different opinion on some of the things - but "at that point of time in my life", it did help me. And I thank God for that.

5. I guess it's like that - as we run our race, at various points, we are led to some truth which helps us, but as we move forward and more light is given, we tend to despise the "poorer quality of truth" or the "wrong doctrine" that we got to know from somebody. We need not worry about that. It all works out right as long as we keep our eyes fixed on HIM. 'Cause HE IS THE TRUTH. And we know whom we have believed and we are persuaded that He is able to keep that which we've committed unto Him against that day.

Angelin

I am begining to think that revival, although it is a blessed experience, it is a terrifying and all consuming fire in it's begining stage.
Perhaps our flesh wants to skip stage one and go directly to stage two. Atleast I know I do.
blessings,
tim

@ brothertom and jimdied2sin

Wow guys. I don't think you actually read what I wrote.

JIMDIED2SIN STATED: " Lakeland was part of Gods judgment on America".

I RESPONDED ; Whether you put it on the finest china or a dirty paper plate... bologna is still bologna and this as big a chunk of it as you will ever read!

Obviously I disagreed with you assessment. However, your responses never dealt with that issue. I am in not by any means defending whatever happened at Lakeland. However, neither am I attacking them. Those ideas of defending or attacking Lakeland were not my point. My entire point in the "bologna" statement was that Lakeland is in no way "proof of God's judgement of America".

That was the topic I was speaking to.

Concerning the other thoughts...... The meetings started at a local Assembly for God Church that was having a couple of days meetings with particular emphasis on physical healing and prayer for the sick. However, the deacon board (functions same as a church council, elders, or similar group in other fellowships. In their incorporation papers they are called deacons and are responsible with the pastor for the general oversight of that local church) was aware almost immediately that Todd Bentley was in a perilous place in his marriage and bad things could happen in that relationship at any time. The meetings were held over because of the crowds.

It was at this point where they became aware of the potential break up of his marriage and his attraction to the intern Tessa. They made the choice to run the risk of keeping him up in front of the people and continuing the meetings. There was not, and still is not, any indication that any actual physical adultery took place. In fact the evidence indicates otherwise. However, the guys knew that the marriage trouble coupled with the attraction to the intern was a very real potential powder keg. This was what I was referring when I stated:

"Regardless of how leadership, especially the elders from the local church in Lakeland, may have failed .....and .....
This was a failure of leadership concerning the deacon board of that local church....nothing more, nothing less, and nothing else."

If they had merely taken their responsibility to be elders there to that local group of believers and sat Todd Bentley down there would have been no "Lakeland" , no public fall, and no consequential damage to the people. If the leaders of that church had fulfilled their responsibility to those people then this would not even be discussed. It was a leadership failure on the part of those men. I am sure they have this thought haunt their minds very often. As you can see this is why I made the statement-

"Learn the lesson and move on to not repeat it again".

So... I hope this clarifies my meaning. If the leaders had fulfilled their responsibility it would never have happened. Primarily this was a leadership failure. Lessons to be learned for sure. Hard ones. Ones that caused many innocent people to be hurt. However, let's learn them and move on. As bad as all that is it is a far cry from a blanket statement of;

" Lakeland was part of Gods judgment on America".

There is no evidence whatsoever of that. Your additional posts gave none to support it. If someone were to say "well the people were blinded... that is proof of judgment". Well... that is NOT what happened. A few people responsible for ensuring the character of those who minister to that congregation chose not to act on what they knew to be true. They felt that much good might be done... so lets take the risk and try to keep a close eye on things. No one else knew about the issues... but the local leaders there did and chose to ignore them rather than addressing them by sitting Todd Bentley down, and ending the meetings. That was a thoroughly unbiblical and destructive decision they made. CHARACTER is the PRIMARY issue. If they had remembered that... things would have been far different for all those involved there. But there is no evidence of an overall "judgement of God on America" revealed in Lakeland.

I dont understand why you keep talking about problems in LEADERSHIP of some revival?

I apologize my bad english and that it might seem that I was somehow saying this emotionally, but I say this with peace and love in my heart:

Lakeland revival was not about Todd Bentley. Devil himself tries to turn peoples eyes from God to Todd Bentley always when we are talking about Lakeland.

I was watching Lakeland revival when it came live from ustream and godtv, and I have, thanks to God, very sensitive gift of discerning spirits.

I tell you now what I noticed while I watched that revival live for MANY services.

I was wondering why people who were chatting while watching Lakeland revival, were telling that: "Wow, Todd Bentley is anointed man of God! This great revival began through him!" And they were painting a picture that Todd Bentley was THE ONE, and that without Todd there was no revival.

Well, I was wondering that VERY much. Because I felt no anointing upon Todd. God even let me see his heart. This is what I saw/felt: Todd was sincere, hungering after God. But he was away from God, and the enemy had misled him. Todd is not an evil person, but a misled person. He was fighting against religiousness, because he once knew some part of the heart of God and knew how religiousness with all its traditional things can kill real relationship with God.

But Todd wasnt aware of sin, and sin misled him. I felt that some kind of sin was in Todd's life even BEFORE adultery with his assistent. Before Lakeland revival.

I've forgiven Todd, and I think we all should. He is just a small human being.

I was VERY blessed through Lakeland revival, even here in Finland. I never visited Lakeland. I just watched those services live. What was blessing me, if Todd was away from God, and I knew it?

The presence of God in that worship blessed me! It was like the glory of God came upon me while I worshipped and seeked the face of the Lord with Roy Fields and the whole audience. Whats the glory? Its NOTHING to do with thing what some people say. The glory of God is.. how to say it... even scary? It made me shake on my chair because of the fear of the Lord, but same time I felt His awesome love and peace surrounding me and filling my heart and making me want to get more near to Him, to be as holy as He is holy, knowing that only He can do it. I had never hated sin as much as after this experience. I had never loved God as much as after this experience.

There WAS a move of God in Lakeland. Thats for sure. Even though, as always, demons manifest there also, and satan is trying to make people to look up to "leader" person of any revival, or, to make people look them down.. devil doesnt want us to seek God, he tries to distract us from doing it, by keeping some noise somewhere and that way looking at him.

Move of God there indeed was. But Todd Bentley wasnt part of it, only in one thing he was.. and it was speaking words that encouraged people to believe God for their healing, and some were healed. Not that many that is claimed, but I know some cases.

Huh, you believe doctors more than people who got healed? Wow.. that requires much faith to people, who may even be atheists controlled by some kind of demon. Not all, but for sure some are. I've met some doctors like that. They put you to mental hospital if you say that you believe that theres God, they consider it as psychosis. Here in Finland happened like that. Doctor said: "theres no God, theres no devil, you are in psychosis.. I want to help you, so I put you to closed mental hospital and I order you some antipsychotic medicines"

And maybe some people didnt have any paper from doctor BEFORE healing? For example, I got healed from some things just after I surrendered my life to Christ about 6 years ago, and I didnt have any paper from doctors before it. Well only one, but they dont believe Im healed of it, even though people who know me, see it. I had some kind of autism, but I was healed. Doctors say: No, it cant be healed.

Also my brain were healed. I didnt have any paper from doctor about that, because I didnt tell doctors that I inhaled butane gas, gas and glue when I was younger and I had brain damage because of that and I couldnt learn new things or remember things.. instantly when I surrendered my life under the Lordship of Jesus, I could learn and remember again. I know I am healed, without that I wouldnt be writing here in english, because I didnt speak english and I couldnt learn it.

Theres many healings that cant be confirmed by doctors, but which are real miracles. But I also know some cases that are confirmed by doctors, and I've seen the evidence.

But back to Todd Bentley and Lakeland revival. Todd Bentley was not, in any mean, the true leader of that revival. The true leader of that revival was Jesus Christ through His Holy Spirit. Unfortunately the devil also did there things, and nobody was bold enough to say about it. Anyway, fruit was mostly good and from God in that revival. I know it because I am one who was blessed through it, in very biblical and right way.

A few words about revival.... I think it was tozer who said that revival changes the moral climate of an atmosphere. I would have to agree with that statement. I know that when I TRULY came to Christ He began to do a major work in my life. It has been lasting fruit. It started with me yielding to Him and He began to do the stripping away of so many things. Honestly it hurt and it wasnt always joyful to my soul but it has yielded much fruit.

With all that said.... I live in Lakeland and have for 20 plus years. I have a house and land that's about ten minutes away from the so called church where all this mess started. First off, that is not an AG church. It's non denominational. What happened here in my city has seen NO lasting fruit of that so called revival. Was God here yes. But, not bc He was invited. Were there people honestly seeking God here,? Yes. But what happened here was not a moving of anythng but the flesh. Most of us on SI pretty much believe that the Lord works in spite of all the things happening here in America.

Hey gators52,

Hey brother. I am not looking to be argumentative at all over the details. In fact the thread is now hijacked from its original post and reverted to Lakeland. I guess that's ok since it is the same ball park.

However, on the affiliation of that local church you are mistaken.

YOU STATED: First off, that is not an AG church. It's non denominational.

I RESPOND; Well... as of 5 minutes ago they are still an AG church They have been for my knowledge a part of the AG for at least 25 years going back to the old Carpenters Home Church. I just now pulled them up on the national registry before typing this. I will now cut/paste their information directly from Assemblies of God National Church Directory. It follows now-

Ignited Church
Location
5859 US Highway 98 N
Lakeland, FL 33809

Mailing Address
5859 US Highway 98 N
Lakeland, FL 33809

Lead Pastor:\t Stephen R Strader
Phone Number:\t (863) 594-1750
Fax:\t (863) 859-0538
District:\t Peninsular Florida
Section Name:\t Lakeland

I then copied this directly from the Ignited Church Website-

"Ignited Church is an Assemblies of God ag.org church."

Yep, they are definitely a 100% AG church. Absolutely no doubt about it.

Then this is just from Wiki. In case anyone was unfamiliar with the church that started the original meetings. It follows now-

The Lakeland Revival or Florida Healing Outpouring was a Christian revival which began on April 2, 2008, when Evangelist Todd Bentley of Fresh Fire Ministries was invited to Ignited Church in Lakeland, Florida, by Pastor Stephen Strader. Bentley was originally invited to be in Lakeland for only five days but remained there for over six months.

George O. Wood, general superintendent of the Assemblies of God USA, of which Ignited Church is a member, issued a statement on revival in June 2008....

end wiki quotes

I am certain of the things I said about it just being a leadership failure for those guys. I'm not condemning them. But I do not want to ever see them, or any other church leaders, fail to make a persons character test be a true litmus before allowing them access to the sheep they are responsible for. Thus my statement to learn the lesson! Do not repeat it!

Bro soloman, my apologies. Regardless of what denomination they fall under that was not a move of God. The denomination isn't the issue. That wasn't my focus. There are about ten bars within five mile straight road driving distance and NONE of them closed down. Like I said NO LASTING FRUIT. leadership or not. It's more of a charismatic church anyhow. My main point was it was of the flesh and of the sons of the devil. Good intentions will still lead men to hell. Debate all u want about leadership. The topic was revival....

If it would help to hear testimony to the authenticity of this revival then I could give mine. I went to the Bay Revival when it was in Youngstown, Ohio. Now I've been a Presbyterian my entire life and because of that my view of churc was sitting in a pew and singing some old hymns, so the revival really looked strange to me a first. I can honestly say that the Holy Spirit truely does move in this revival and does many awesome things. God told me to become a pastor while I was at the revival, I saw many people recieve Jesus Christ as their savior, and my father, who has had bad ankles for more than ten years was instantly delivered. I believe the core of this is salvation. The fact that people are coming and receiving Jesus as the savior shows me that the Holy Spirit is moving and that this is a genuine revival.