Forums - the Ishmael of Sermon Index

Brothers and sisters,

I am deeply grieved by much of the content I read in the forums of SI. The ungodly spirit in many of these posts is a horrible witness to an unbelieving world as well as an offense against God himself. Beloved, we are Christians, meaning like Christ. The mean and deliberate cutting nature of the arguments found here are indicting against you and very distasteful to readers abroad. This website has been a blessing to me for years, but these forums seem to be the Ishmael of this site. Many of these themes and posts are dissimilar to the nature of the site itself, and the godly writings and sermons posted in their respective categories.

These ungodly and heated debates over irreconcilable perceptions are futile, and vain. They do not mirror Christ Jesus by any means. If the posts cannot glorify God, please do not post them. Please check your heart, and if any post or response cannot be in the humble and meek Spirit of Jesus, it need not be posted for it is another spirit. Please do not contaminate this site with devilish reasoning and arguing over irreconcilable ideas. May the Lord lead us in all that we say, and post. Thank you.

Brother Derek Melton

Thank you brothers, for these posts. If I have ever offended anyone, or started ungodly debate, or responded in an ungodly spirit, I ask everyone's forgiveness. I know I have felt attacked a number of times, to the point of strongly considering getting off of SI. My only reason for ever coming to this site is to be built up in the Lord, and to find fellowship with others who are seeking hard after Him. A number of times my spirit has been brought low and and disturbed by what I have read and had posted in response to my posts. I pray that this site would remain of the highest caliber as befits children of a HOLY GOD...

A very timely admonition! Thank you for this important reminder, Pastor Derek!

I have not been here too long but enough to realize the same thing. I have thought that this should be a private forum and not public. What is the purpose for the discussion forum to be so public? This seems like a strategic mistake.

While I agree with the gist or thrust of the exhortation in the OP, I thought it was a little too hard on the brethren in general here. It seemed to come across as an expectation to be sinless or perfect in our posts. I understand that we are called to strive for perfection as Christians but at the same time we must realize that this side of heaven we will not attain it, no matter how mature or spiritual we are. Thus the need for patience and grace toward the newer brethren, as we are all growing in His grace and knowledge and wisdom. I think if we are too hard on the newer or weaker brethren it will discourage them from ever posting anything the Lord may lay on their heart.

To me, this forum has been a blessing in that it allows us to sharpen one another and grow thereby. And even in times of getting in the flesh in our posts, we can learn to correct those things and continue to grow in the Lord. While I think we should keep the standard high here as far as respect goes(which I think the moderators do a great job of), we must not place too high an expectation on those who post, for they will sin from time to time in their attitudes and words. The same goes for any relationship between two or more believers. We will stumble in our words and we need to show each other grace, even as the Lord showers His grace on each of us daily. Please understand, I'm not excusing grave sins in the Body, for His Word is clear that we must put out the fornicator, adulter, idolater, etc. But times of stumbling into sin in attitudes or speech should not be something to completely censor believers for. Just my two cents. Blessings to all.

Thanks brother for your timely admonition. Would Jesus have a blog if he were alive today? Certainly not. I once was about to draft a similar statement as you had but abandoned it because I felt I had not prayed enough and my love for the brethren was not pure.

As long as we have an open forum we will have contention and ungodly disputes. Many blogs read as the middle chapters in the book of Job.

We are anonymous and we do not know each other's lifes. There cannot be true accountability in a blog, be it Christian or not.

We cannot establish here what a godly eldership would do in a local church.
I do not see any facility in a NT church where we should entertain everyones opinion. On the other hand SI forums have been a great source of encouragement to me.

My question is whether it is theoretically and practically possible to maintain an open blog that is always edifying, that only promotes godly wisdom and feeds hungry and thirsty souls.

Would it be better not to have an open blog at all? I wonder what would happen if we closed the forums for a month or 40 days.
I would like to encourage the moderators to take brother Derek's rebuke serious and pray what to do about it. God's honor is at stake.

A couple more thoughts came to mind. The fact that people who belong to cults are allowed to post their heresies here makes it impossible for the lost world to see a pure witness of Christianity here. And even among Christians who don't belong to a cult there are false converts or hypocrites. Can we reasonably expect the world to see a pure expression of Christianity in these forums? Like narrowpath pointed out, in a local church setting it is much different.

What the world will see here is a mixture of Spirit-filled Christianity, heresy, worldliness, immaturity, etc. What the world has been able to see is true Christians argue, rebuke one another, apologize, forgive one another, and move on and grow. I think that can be a good thing. They see fallen humans who are growing in God's grace.

I think sometimes we give the world the wrong impression that as Christians we are completely sinless or holy without any faults. To the contrary I think we should not be afraid to let them know that we fail at times and continue to need to repent and receive God's mercy. That is not a license to sin, but an acknowledgement of our weaknesses as fallen creatures who are imperfect this side of heaven.

deleted by poster

Brother and sisters on SI,

I think sometimes we forget that there is another human being whom we are posting to instead of a computer. If we were face to face we wouldn’t speak to hurt someone’s feelings but it is so easy to post because we are not in their presence and many we don’t know them on a personal basics. A lot of times people are just venting in their posts and not really being able to portray themselves adequately and people reading are a lot of times misreading other peoples posts.

I have seen some arguing their point when actually their point is just one side to the equation. Some others can’t recognize the good in peoples post because they just want to prove that their own point of view as being better.

I apologize to any I have offended by being to sharp and I pray that when I post in the future that I will continue by thinking on how I would say it if I was face to face with that individual. I have spoken to many people face to face even when I disagreed with them but I was sensitive to their feelings and how I wanted to get them to see why I saw it differently in the spirit of meekness.

I hope that we can all communicate better in the love of God in the future and the next time someone posts something I or we consider to be offensive that we would pray and vision seeing that person face to face and write in the spirit of meekness to the other brother/sister as being right in front of us

I thank God for what I have learned from this site and the many fine Christian people I have met through their posting. I have learned to love people I have never seen and also people I disagree with at times. I have learned more patience with people and I have learned to forgive others more readily. I have learned to communicate better and to see people in a different light even though I feel that I fall short every now and then. I hope to pray more in the future and I hope the best for all on SI and thank God for this site causing us all to communicate to one another over the precious Word of God.

Blessings to all the people on SI whom I believe are some of the finest Christians anywhere who really love God and truly desired to love Him more than ever.

What I like about the forum is the exchange of ideas and beliefs. As one has already said, "Iron sharpeneth iron." This can be a good thing and helps to shape our understanding of truth. Though sometimes bluntness comes through instead of tenderness, this is part of not being able to hear the tone of voice and see the gestures. Some are only trying to argue, while others are trying to gain a more full understanding of various views. In it all, may we be humble before God and one another.

After contributing to and then helping moderate these forums for over the course of 5 years, I am convinced these walls are among the most blessed on the entire web. But just like in eveything, there is good and bad, purity and mixture, meat and bones, oil and water. The more mature in Christ are able to immediately differentiate and choose their course wisely; the less mature will stumble and offend and be offended. This is why God has ordained Christian moderators and administration to oversee and help direct.

This forum can be a tremendous means of blessing and edification from the eldest to the youngest, but only if navigated and used with discretion. There is a spiritual wealth to be discovered here that you simply can not find anywhere else on the internet. The key is knowing where to dig -- and, just as importantly, where not to dig. If you navigate these forums prayerfully and contribute judiciously and sparingly, God will reward your self-control with the gleaning of good fruit whereby your soul will grow. But if you find yourself contributing multiple times each day, on multiplue threads and topics, and getting involved in heated debates regularly, you make this place barren for yourself and others coming in for the first time. The Bible is full of warnings to the fool concerning his multitude of words and undiscipled tongue and the issuing of his opinions when he should instead keep silent. The same wisdom must be applied here, within in the forum walls, and if you make an effort to practice these principles you will see this place go from an Ishmael to an Isaac overnight.

Paul's post should be tacked somewhere...on the welcome board perhaps.

Unfortunately, there is a direct correlation between high quantity and low quality in this place. People who post rapidly and abundantly very rarely exhibit spiritual wisdom and edification, even when quoting scripture. The power of a post to impart the life of Christ is normally not present in the posts of a forum busybody. The authority of God is certainly not present in wrangling and debating and opinionating. Such behaviour imparts a certain barreness, a dryness - again, regardless of how prolifically scripture is provided.

How rare it is to find posts laced with true humility, compassion, and a thirst to seek God's own heart on the issue of the matter. How rare it is to find a poster who eschews debate and confrontation, who fears grieving the Spirit in exchange to be right. Believers here who choose their words wisely need only post meagerly, because the little words they do publish are powerful and strike a direct bullseye each time. Like Melchisidek, they suddenly appear, state the heart of God with authority, and then quietly bow out.

The quality of the forums for a public arena has been nothing but a miricale of blessing in the midst of a crooked and depraved internet and a christian internet full of worldly values and talk.

Amen! and Amen!

I have checked out the comments on secular sites and so many are so horrible. People get so angry; always assume the worst; do not read other people's post correctly, accuse them falsely of saying things they never meant. Mean, terrible mean! and then I think of how nice SI is I am thankful for a forum a person can go to and be edified!

Thanks, mods! and God bless!

ginnyrose

That is a very good post, Greg.

Today, I saw a headline today that said that "social networking" websites have finally overtaken pornography websites as drawing the most traffic on the internet. While I suppose that we might be inclined to think that ANYTHING is better than the evils of pornography, I think that the draw of social networks is demonstrative of the emptiness and loneliness of the people of this world.

Last year, I had a pop-up advertisement while shopping around for plane tickets. It was a movie trailer for the film THE SOCIAL NETWORK about the creation of the Facebook website. I was amazed at the words of the song that was being played.

I don't care if it hurts
I want to have control
I want a perfect body
I want a perfect soul
I want you to notice
When I'm not around
You're so very special
I wish I was special

This seems to be the cry of the people of this world. They are attracted to one another and deeply desire the attraction and attention of others. It is the new religion of this world -- the one where John Lennon "imagined" that there was no Heaven, no Hell, no religion. They imagine that this world is all that we have...and that the people are the most important thing. This is in direct contradiction to the truth that God -- and a relationship with Him -- is the central and most important thing in this life.

I read in the news this week that Facebook now has over 750 Million active users around the world. There is only about 300 million people -- elderly, adults, children and babies -- in the United States!

Facebook's headquarters are just a few blocks from our home. My wife and I like to take walks in the evening or morning, and we sometimes walk by the Facebook headquarters. I often wonder if they are even aware of the vast implications of the organization that they control. They have the ear of politicians, presidents and many others. President Obama has visited the area several times in the last year and has met with Facebook's founder a few times.

Why am I saying this?

The forums at SermonIndex are NOT meant to be a mere Christian social networking website. They aren't meant to replace the personal encouragement (Hebrews 10:24-25) that we are supposed to give and receive at a local level. It is not a place where we are supposed to "do God a favor" and vigorously propagate a particular stand on a controversial and sectarian doctrinal issue.

The purpose of this website is summed up by Greg in one word: REVIVAL. It is a desire to provoke an awakening in the people of God through the presentation of messages that many men and women of God throughout audio history have provided. As Brother Mike Balog once said, SermonIndex is a "gem" in the wilderness of this world through the provision of strong messages that provoke, encourage, challenge and serve as a wake-up call to the Body of Christ.

Greg and the moderators have clarified this in their description of the forums. This might be a bit lengthy, but it is worth reading again.

The Forum

Since it's inception, the forum here has been many things. A great fellowship, a fellowship of sorts while in it's unorthodox form and fashion often resembling both a battleground and a hospital. This can be both edifying as well as divisive. We hope to address a few of the misconceptions and concerns at the outset so that everyone will be on the same level footing as to what is acceptable and that which is not.

What it is not

It is not a 'chat room'.
It is not a place to bring an agenda regardless of intentions.
It is not a place for promotion of ones self, website or wares.
It is not 'denominational' while gleaning from many.
It is neither legalistic nor 'anything goes'.
It is not a place for politics, politicians, policy's nor particular support thereof. More on this below.*

What it is

It is first and foremost a privilege.
It is a gathering of saints now throughout the world. And that alone may be the most important factor to keep in mind at all times.
It is a place to share, discuss, listen, think and grow into all things in Jesus Christ.
It is bible based.
It is in aim and undergirding Revival. A Revival of God's thought. Of others and lastly, ourselves.
It is a longing for, praying for, a Revival of the same substance that is expressed through the many resources available here.
It is a seeking after the genuine and Sincere.
It is this foundation and focus while fostering a great freedom of discussion within some practical guidelines.

What you can expect

To be challenged unto growth in Christ
To be misunderstood at times.
To misunderstand others.
To be asked questions.
To be in the midst of some very experienced saints, not a handful who have walked with the Lord for many, many years.
To find like hearted Brethren as well as 'likemidnded'.
You will likely at some point be offended.
You will be blessed.
You may have your theology turned inside out and upside down.
You may have yourself exposed in way's you never thought possible by your own words and thoughts as well as by those who care for your souls.
To be prayed for.

What we expect

Conduct, consideration and charity. As illustrative, picture yourself entering a home for the first time. You are a guest. You are polite. You wipe the mud off your shoes before entering. You make an introduction. You carry yourself with respect to your host.

Hopefully, you get the idea here. We have found that hosting a forum has all kinds of inherent difficulties.

Communicating in this manner with so many different cultures, upbringings, education and lack thereof. To add even more weight is the place anyone of us may be in this walk as disciples of the Lord, we all were spiritual 'babes' in Christ at the inception of a new birth, an important reminder that needs to be reflected on often. We must keep well in mind that expression of spiritual matters is often difficult enough, sometimes even impossible. Let us bear with one another with patience and understanding.

What is not tolerated

Slander. Ill-will. Unnecessary accusations, comments.

The issue is one of order rather than control. We allow as much patience as possible for corrections and apologies. Please make your corrections with a follow up reply, rather than by use of the edit function. There has been a misuse of this in the past where whole sections have been removed from an ongoing thread, making it now disconnected, like removing pages from a book.

*Politics

We have found it necessary to curtail political discussion here for a variety of reasons. It is primarily out of step with the manner and thrust of Sermon Index in it's intention and we have found little good to come from an allowance of things based politically into the discussions.

It is inevitable that with an allowance of items and issues effecting us all by that which is happening in this present world that attributes of a political nature will creep in, this is understood. However, we will keep a very close eye on these things and may ask you to stop midstream or lock a posting if in our discretion we feel that it is out of place in the forum.

Conspiracy and Conspiracy Theory

We believe there is certainly a conspiracy afoot, that which is present since the fall of mankind in their enmity with God. What other websites or ministries may have of a variety of present theory as it relates to what the governments of the world are doing is too much in dispute to be presented here. The New World Order and One Government system is understood in a variety of fashion. What we will not allow is unscrupulous and un-scriptural notions and ideals to foster fear and paranoia to the saints. Our trust and yours should be placed firmly in God, not in the conspiracy of the world, the flesh or the devil. We will monitor these things in our best discretion but do not bring in ministries or other agendas devoted to these mandates.

What you can do to help

Be polite. Don't be rude to others.
Keep foremost in your mind the weight of responsibility you have with what the Lord stated;

Mat 18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.

As well as;

Mat 12:36 But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment.

The Lord is in our midst here and this whole resource is dependent on the Holy Spirit by those who have both brought all this forth and we hope by those who participate, first as brethren and as guests\\members.

Please, pray.
Pray before you post.
Pray as you write in response.
Pray, and ask the question of the Lord;
"Should I?"
Listen, give yourself a minute.
Pray one last time and pause before you submit.

Try and think of the ramifications of your thoughts and comments. Some things need not to be said. Some things can wait. Some things just as well do need to be addressed, but the manner may add more of a problem than be a help towards correction.

You may find it best to save some things that you have spent a considerable amount of time writing to a file to be brought forth at a different time.

There is a great deal more than could be said. These are all guidelines to make matters beneficial to all. It is a warm welcome we afford to all within these parameters. Make yourself comfortable, but keep your feet off the table. :)

Lastly

Ask questions and do your best to answer questions. Keep well in mind that often times a question is not necessarily pointed, but is truly a question. Just as well, it is especially frowned on to be jostling with each other by way of accusation towards each others intents and motives. Be forthright and honest.

"Play the ball and not the man."

Which translates to the issue being discussed. Keep to this and away from what we may assume someone is thinking. Again, ask a question rather than making an accusation.

A note about personal effrontery and offendedness. We have found since the inception of this site that many any item is misconstrued by accusation and presupposition upon motive and intent. It is far better to assume nothing by way of suspicion nor to accuse without factual information. Better to not accuse at all but in points of biblical doctrine a challenge may be forwarded to our interpretations, do not take it personally and do not make it personal. Control your emotions and keep before you the mandate of humility.

Do keep in mind that the moderators will do their best to discern where and when to intervene and more so that they are your fellow pilgrims and servants, just as fallible as each of us here. "Moderate" your own self and leave the moderating beyond that to those appointed to do so. If you find something that is out of place, that is divisive amongst the brethren, bring it to their attention and they will do their best to address it.

Confession

Yes! We welcome it and desire it. It is not embarrassment to admit when we have faulted or sinned, caused a disturbance, been mean-spirited, proud, but an extreme blessing to the community and before the Lord. No one will be shamed into anything here nor manipulated, but forgiven without equivocation upon repentance. Remember it is not to us that you are owing this when it is warranted but to the Lord first and foremost and then by extension those you have trespassed upon. Admittedly and unfortunately it is a rare thing to hear in these parts and we could but pray for more forthcoming on practical honesty, it builds character and exposes our pride, that most sinister of sins.

Summary

Jesus is Lord.
'We' do hold to a high view of His Majesty.
'We' have no particular creed other than that He be exalted above all.

Personally, I find a great deal of encouragement, challenge and spiritual growth through participation in the forums. One thing that is quite apparent is that we are all different. We come from different backgrounds, denominations (or non-denominations), beliefs, physical locations and stages of growth in our spiritual lives. Yet, despite our differences, most of us are extremely desirous for a move of God in our lives and in the greater Body of Christ.

I am not sure whether posting a lot or a little is a sign of spirituality or not (That seems like a carnal judgment). The conclusion I have come to is that it is always about content because I look at all the major posters and they happen to be on this thread saying that less is more spiritual. So there is a disconnect, isn't there? Sermonindex, rookie, abideinhim, Krispy, ccchhhrrriiisss, and many more on this forum (with over 2500 posts) would now be known as the most unspiritual because of their volume of postings. And those who post little have now been elevated to the status of "spiritual". So, I don't think I can agree with this. A forum is for posting and communicating and that is what you do. So, it's about content, to me.

With love,
Sarah

I am not sure whether posting a lot or a little is a sign of spirituality or not (That seems like a carnal judgment). The conclusion I have come to is that it is always about content because I look at all the major posters and they happen to be on this thread saying that less is more spiritual. So there is a disconnect, isn't there? Sermonindex, rookie, abideinhim, Krispy, ccchhhrrriiisss, and many more on this forum (with over 2500 posts) would now be known as the most unspiritual because of their volume of postings. And those who post little have now been elevated to the status of "spiritual". So, I don't think I can agree with this. A forum is for posting and communicating and that is what you do. So, it's about content, to me.

Just had to say a hearty Amen to that post!

This thread is a good call for repentance. Now, how shall I respond? Shall I grieve the Holy Spirit, or submit to Him?

I confess that I needed to read these convicting comments. The Lord has recently convicted me that I need to be careful about slander; i.e., I must repent of this sinful behavior. Praise the Lord for His discipline!

Hi Sarah,

I don't think that anyone is arguing that LESS is necessarily BETTER. Rather, like you said, it is more about the CONTENT (and often, more specifically, the spirit behind the content) that matters most.

I think that the point is to be careful about the content and spirit behind our posts. It is a forum...but not one that was created as an avenue to propagate a specific ideology that might conflict with or differ from what the ministry (SermonIndex) intended.

Nor do I think that the forums were created to be argumentative or to allow one person or group to present their views on a subject that is oft-debated among believers as if they are the ONLY views that matter.

So, yes, I agree that it is about content. However, it isn't JUST about content. It is about the spirit and attitude by which that content is presented. Is such content presented in a manner of humility and meekness, or is our presentation riddled with pride and antagonism?

Too often, I think, the latter is the case. I know that it has been true for me. This is why I believe that the Scriptures urge us to be "swift to hear, slow to speak and slow to wrath" (James 1:19).

That said: I must say that I have been extremely encouraged, challenged and blessed with insight from my experiences on these forums for about eight years.

Yes, there have been times of doctrinal conflict. There have also been times where some well-meaning person would be so incensed during a discussion as to label me a "heretic" or some other opinionated descriptor of what they felt my beliefs or eternal status might be. Those things often hurt. However, those experiences -- as ugly or misguided as they may be -- still serve as times of personal introspection.

The vast majority of my time in the SermonIndex forums has been encouraging and helpful during my journey with Christ and my personal spiritual growth. For that, I am exceedingly grateful!

So, yes, I agree that it is about content. However, it isn't JUST about content. It is about the spirit and attitude by which that content is presented. Is such content presented in a manner of humility and meekness, or is our presentation riddled with pride and antagonism?

Brother, I agree with you that we should shun fleshly pride and antagonism and seek to reflect humility and meekness. However, I also believe that there are times when a sharp rebuke is needed from true believers to others. And I am not too sure if a forum like this would never be a right place for that kind of thing. I know that one of my strong characteristics is being very blunt or frank. That sometimes leads me to stick my foot in my mouth. But at other times I believe the Lord has used it in a way that honors Him. The bottom line for me is to be led by the Spirit through prayer and the Word. If we stay close to Christ we will be sensitive to the Spirit's leading.

Mat 21:15 And when the chief priests and scribes saw the wonderful things that he did, and the children crying in the temple, and saying, Hosanna to the Son of David; they were sore displeased,

Mat 21:16 And said unto him, Hearest thou what these say? And Jesus saith unto them, Yea; have ye never read, Out of the mouth of babes and sucklings thou hast perfected praise?

Hi Sarah

I am not sure whether posting a lot or a little is a sign of spirituality or not (That seems like a carnal judgment). The conclusion I have come to is that it is always about content because I look at all the major posters and they happen to be on this thread saying that less is more spiritual. So there is a disconnect, isn't there?

This logic is interesting. I think it is flawed slightly because it doesn't take into account the length of time somebody has been a member. e.g. 2500 posts over a period of 1 or 2 years is a lot different than the same over a period of 5 or 6 years.

Unfortunately, there is a direct correlation between high quantity and low quality in this place. People who post rapidly and abundantly very rarely exhibit spiritual wisdom and edification, even when quoting scripture. The power of a post to impart the life of Christ is normally not present in the posts of a forum busybody. The authority of God is certainly not present in wrangling and debating and opinionating. Such behaviour imparts a certain barreness, a dryness - again, regardless of how prolifically scripture is provided.

This is tremendously wise advice and it shouldn't be lost.

Too often there are reactive posts with little thought of the consequences. This forum shouldn't be treated the same way the world treats an internet forum or social networking site. There is too much at stake. Young Christians especially browse this forum and are in the process of maturing. Let's not discourage them with our thoughtlessness and eagerness to 'make a point'.

We should keep the Judgment Seat before our eyes. Sadly, it's not a reality in many believers lives (something I find quite disturbing). They become a little law unto themselves and start pontificating on subjects they know little about. This is the height of foolishness and can only bring forth death no matter how 'sophisticated' their arguments may seemingly be.

David

by sermonindex

And might I add, some folks new and old just like to argue/debate their point till the cows come home, this edifies nothing or no one. I would personally like to see a private area were threads that are beginning to get out of hand could be moved to, and only the folks that have taken part in the debate/argument could enter after being moved. This could be so everyone that comes here to be edified or edify, could avoid even being drawn into a debate/argument that has got ugly. This place should be like Church, do some of you debate with others like you do here at Church? lets hope and Pray to God you don't. Whats really sad is, I have seen so many times folks that participate in one of these ugly debates come back and apologize many, many times. How many times must one apologize before you finally realize, I need to take a chill break and maybe just read for a month or so? If everyone when they signed on here would develop the attitude or feel that they are in Church, and not down at the local bar, the whole atmosphere of this place could change for the better. I like a good debate just as well as others, only difference is, the Christ in me knows when to stop the train and let me off.
God Bless
Mr. Bill

Hello MrBillPro,

Your tag lines:

"Regardless of how brilliant or how great one's intellect may be, God's Word is not understood by human wisdom or reasoning. It is only through the Spirit of God that the Word of God is understood.

Jesus said it is the Spirit of truth that teaches us all things."

Are wonderful! Praise Jesus

We live in a dark age in which apostasy abounds. We see loved ones, friends snookered into its whorl of deception. Since this is the case it behooves one to work to be an encourager to those who do want to serve him. A person can encourage faithfulness to the LORD, even to those you will disagree with on some points of doctrine.

1Corithians 14:1-5 NASB:

1Pursue love, yet desire earnestly spiritual gifts, but especially that you may prophesy.
2For one who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God; for no one understands, but in his spirit he speaks mysteries.
3But one who prophesies speaks to men for edification and exhortation and consolation.
4One who speaks in a tongue edifies himself; but one who prophesies edifies the church.
5Now I wish that you all spoke in tongues, but even more that you would prophesy; and greater is one who prophesies than one who speaks in tongues, unless he interprets, so that the church may receive edifying.

Notice the emphasis on prophesying - that of exhorting, edification, and consolation. This should be the goal of every Believer regardless where he/she is, be it on the forums, meeting the public or in any conversation with whoever.

This is the challenge I see in life and the older I get the more needed it becomes but so few are rising to it! But this forum does a great job in providing a platform where this can occur! Thanks, Greg, Paul, Robert, Mike, and Christian.

Young Christians especially browse this forum and are in the process of maturing. Let's not discourage them with our thoughtlessness and eagerness to 'make a point'.

It is amazing how many people fail to understand this principle, or take the time to seek God's heart on the issue. For instance, a non-salfivic doctrine is put forth, a rebuttal given, and a debate is suddenly born. The Holy Spirit departs, but every participant is too busy trying to be right to notice the departure. They see themselves instead as fighting for rightousness and doing God's noble work. But with God gone, everyone loses the authority to edify and the whole thing degenerates into a conglomerate of pride and emotion to win the discussion and display one's knowledge and exegesis of scripture relating to the topic. Not spirit, but carnality suddenly governs both the quality and quantity of the posts, and the thread just explodes into the equivalent of a religious feeding frenzy.

But what is does it matter if God is not there? What does anything matter? If God departs - regardless of how noble and inspiring the topic of choice may be - shouldn't we also depart, also counting it beneath us? If the Lord would say to touch not the unclean thing, it is easy to obey if what is unclean is also undesirable and ugly to carnal sense and logic. But very often the uncleaness God speaks of is cloaked in beauty and fragrance and logic. We find ourselves belaboring and pumping life into a corpse. Many threads are but fragranced corpses; though they be impressively clothed in the perfumed letter and on display with much fuss and fanfare, the life of God has departed.

The conscientious believer should therefore examine each discussion in the forum and decide which is worth his or her effort. Is this a living thread or a dead one? If we keep the litmus test of "Is the life and mind and humility and compassion of Jesus Christ being transmitted through this?" we will always be safe and operate in the living and in the light. But if you find frequently participating in theads that are being shut-down and buried for one reason or another, this may be a good indication of a misalignment of this principle.

May God bless with wisdom and guide us all in our participation here.

Paul

First of all Id like to say hello to Paul West, been missing u bro.

Now to the post, all I can say is I agree 100% with the poster for this is not about being safe or speaking whats on your mind, it is about Christians. I have mentioned this before, but we appear as the Pharisee which makes us no different than the hypocrites and rude vipers that jesus told them they were.

Let us not gag at a gnat and swallow a camel, this applies first nd foremost to myself.

In love family,
MOG

These kinds of things put a "chill" on the environment and it is the only conclusion I can come to why there is not more of a variety of people participating and not better topics

I will not answer your post on each point, but will suffice to say that as mods, we are just men, flawed like every other man. We have lives outside of this website, and don't always get around in time to deal decisively with an issue. We make mistakes, we let things slip. And when a person is banned, it is not an arbitary decision, but one which has been collectively considered and prayed over.

It is not our job to judge the veracity of theology and pet doctrines. We are neutral in this regard, even though we all have our personal beliefs and leanings in this matter. We instead moderate the tenor of the forum, the etiquette, and we try to make this place evangelically safe and sound and a blessing for all who come in -- from the oldest to the youngest in Christ. But, again, we are not perfect. We need your prayers, we covet them.

I'm sorry if the preceding post I wrote did not successfully address the point I was trying to make, and I understand your issue with it. You are justified and fair in every thing you said.

If we couldn't determine, or have the right to consider a thread or discussion as "dead' or "fruitless" (synonymous terms, btw), we would never be able to close it down and would always have to just let it run its course. But this is not what we do, for it is irresponsible stewardship. God has placed moderators and pastors and administrators and overseers in place and ordained them for a reason: to judge these very issues (as unpopular as it is) and take action for the well-being of all who participate. This is why we, as mods, desperately need prayer. We are mere men dealing with spiritual things that can have serious consequences if improperly handled or censored. We simply try to do our best, with what we believe is the mind of Christ guiding our decisions. Sometimes people get offended and leave; sometimes they are asked to leave. If the forum guidlelines are adhered to, there will be no issues. A mod reserves the right to lock a thread if he feels it is of no further edification. You can read this in the SermonIndex forum guidelines.

I was not disagreeing with you on that, Paul. Just demonstrating how different people interpret what we say differently.

God bless you.

by White_Stone Hello MrBillPro, Your tag lines: "Regardless of how brilliant or how great one's intellect may be, God's Word is not understood by human wisdom or reasoning. It is only through the Spirit of God that the Word of God is understood. Jesus said it is the Spirit of truth that teaches us all things." Are wonderful! Praise Jesus

Thanks! I guess if more folks could understand this, there would be a lot less long drawn out worthless debating/arguing around here. Don't get me wrong, some debating help us all learn, but some debates turn into spiritual warfare. Some I guess feel their intellect might surpass human wisdom or reasoning. Lol

And the Spirit of God convicts and enlightens the reader.
Amen!