Contrast between Keith Daniels and Carter Conlon

The Scriptures are the key..., as Brother Keith has shown us.

"What saith the Scriptures?"

"And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape.

And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he hath sent, him ye believe not.

Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me." John 5:37-39

Oh Lord! Please work something in the Church, something sublime, something wonderful, something that hasn't been worked in many, many centuries now.

Oh Lord! Protect the Conference. Break through hard hearts. Work mightily in the midst. God bless and protect Brother Keith for his courage and integrity to bring such a message.

Oh Lord! Help us and guide us now. Helm me! Amen.

You wrote:
"In the Greenock conference we prayed much against ancient walls of division that kept brothers and sisters apart and their eyes off Jesus. This subject this morning is one such wall. Brother Carter Conlon is a good representative of the other ancient wall, that of the Baptism of the Holy Spirit, another great division that keeps mens minds and hearts off Jesus."

"There will come a time shortly where all brothers and sisters will stand together, the remnant, as Keith mentioned this morning, and they will stand in unity as the enemy makes his last stand against the poeple of God."

Amen Brother.

Be well,
Doug

I did not get to hear Carter Conlon, if anyone knows when and where his sermon gets posted, will you please share that me?

Thank you so much!
Lisa

Found it!!!

https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/mydownloads/viewcat.php?cid=1306

God bless us all!!
Lisa

I believe brother Frank's was a good summation of Carter Conlon’s message. Amen to the spirit of Brother Blaine's comments as well.

As for Keith Daniel, he did speak about “Calvinism vs. Arminianism”...

To explain:

When Calvinists and Arminians agree to work together, they usually also agree to NOT bring this long-standing disagreement between them up. It was VERY unusual and incredibly bold for Brother Keith to do this, in such a venue as that.

Augustine:

This rift within the true, believing Church of Jesus Christ has been with us for more than sixteen centuries now. It actually goes back to the days of the late 4th century Latin Father Augustine. Augustine, (Bishop of Hippo in Roman northern Africa), was evidently a brilliant intellect, who also said a lot of good and Biblical things. Unfortunately, and to the great sorrow of centuries, he also did not seem to be aware of the earlier Greek-speaking Ante-Nicene Fathers, nor the Greek New Testament, and was responsible for introducing several novel doctrines into the Church that have divided us ever since...

For example, Augustine was the first writer we have any knowledge of who taught Christians that they could join with the STATE in persecuting other Christians with different opinions. He was “reacting” against the Donatists. Again, as a “reaction” against the “Pelagians”, Augustine was the first we know of who taught an unconditional election of individuals to salvation,(and thus as well, the absolute, unconditional security of the believer, (which was a change of his opinion from his earlier writings on the conditional security of believers.)

Thus, Augustine emphasized and began to solidify for the first time a system of doctrine that is found nowhere in the earlier Greek-speaking Church fathers, nor, it is argued, is such a system found in the inspired writings of the Greek-speaking apostles either.

The REFORMATION:

A thousand years later, as a “reaction” against the Roman Catholic Church’s teaching that people “must earn their salvation through good works”, the Reformation “fathers” raised up SCRIPTURE and specifically St. Paul and his inspired doctrine of “the unmerited grace of God in the salvation of the believer, BY FAITH ALONE.” This was enough to counter this error of Rome, but to further bolster their position, they tragically also raised up AUGUSTINE and his doctrine and emphasis on “individual election” and the “unconditional security of the believer.” Then, where the Reformers held power in the STATE, they followed Augustine’s other merciless doctrine mentioned above...

All that being said..., many, many real and true Christians yet hold onto Augustine’s doctrines, as systematized by Calvin, his nephew Beza, and by the Calvinistic Synod of Dort mentioned by Brother Keith in his sermon. They sincerely believe that behind many of the teachings of Paul and other of the apostles, lies their System of “unconditional election”, “limited atonement”, “irresistible grace”, and “unconditional eternal security”, and they continue to divide the Church over their system to this very day.

Finally:

As I understand it, Brother Keith was seeking a restoration of the Church. He was seeking a restoration AWAY from the “reactionary” systemization of doctrines that the apostles clearly never systematized, and a restoration BACK to the plain, literal, inspired Holy Scriptures themselves, wherever they lead...

May God bless the reader.

Be well everyone,
Doug

We are supposed to love like Jesus but I’ve come to realize that just because someone gets “saved” and studies the word that doesn’t automatically mean they receive LOVE as Jesus had. As individuals, I believe we have to WANT TO love as Jesus loved, etc.

Check me if I’m wrong but isn’t salvation is our base line? The least required to get into heaven, “You must be born again,” and “I am the door,” etc?

I ask that because the Lord led me to study the parable of the ten pounds (Luke 19.11-27) this week and it seems to me that when He returns with His kingdom He is going to expect a RETURN on this salvation (our 1lb we were given), and will we be able to lay at His feet more than He gave us?

1. As in love, mercy, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness and patience (Gal 5.22-23)??

2. And will we be able to lay any gifts at His feet that He gave us? Did we even ASK for any?

The parable of the ten pounds have stuck into mind, I do not want to be an enemy of God (Luke 19.27), not being able to double or more of what He has given to me. If you think I'm wrong, I can handle it, let me know.

Just thinking about my two cents.
And God help us to DESIRE to gain more lbs in this life to give back to Him on that day,
Lisa

I totally agree, why would we ever want to compare two precious brothers that the Lord has seeded with His message in His way for this hour? Each part of the Body is so needed for our spiritual health. They both are beautiful vessels in the Master's hand. I recall Carter Conlon beginning his message with an admonition to be careful how we speak of the Bride. Many may not be aware of the rift in the Body of Christ because of doctrinal differences of Calvanism and Arminianism. Understanding of Church history helps so much in equipping us for Spirit led intercession. Both messages from these precious saints are vital for revival that will result in a unified purified Bride that will shine with the glory of our Bridegroom. May the Lord be glorified in each of us. Bless you all for your comments and love for Jesus our Bridegroom.

I don't even know what the first post said, all I know is that for me it was very hard to sit through the whole message. I'm sad to say the almost the whole congregation left by the time he finished it. I'm also sad to say that I didn't understand a thing, I think he was trying to present the contrast between all those views.But I would say that it's best to preach the word and exalt Christ, only that will bring edification and revival.

Canela...I was there and didn't notice the whole congregation leaving....Also, I counted from my notes 45 Scriptures that he quoted WORD-PERFECT.....I don't know about you, but I can't come close to doing that.....

I believe his intent was to say that there are plenty of Scriptures on BOTH sides of the issue, and that the CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST ought not to be DEVOURING themselves over it....

At least that is my humble take on the message....

"all I know is that for me it was very hard to sit through the whole message."

Canela - I neglected to say that this was my 2nd time to hear the message by Brother Keith. I heard it the first time when he was in Milwaukee 2 weeks ago. I won't say I had a hard time sitting through it, but he covered SO MUCH information that I had to work to absorb it all. This 2nd time was much clearer to me. I'm sorry, I should have said that in my last post.

mama27, I was not in Georgia, we watched the simulcast in Kansas.

Thanks for clarifying....I'm sure on the simulcast you could see people leaving - he was giving his lengthy Bibliography and had already gone over into the lunch hour. But there were still most of the people there.

mama wrote:
Canela - I neglected to say that this was my 2nd time to hear the message by Brother Keith. I heard it the first time when he was in Milwaukee 2 weeks ago.

Perhaps, I just don’t understand and I apologize for not understanding.

God bless,
Lisa

Lysa, he was preaching to different meetings....I didn't say the sermon was word for word, but that his quoting of the many Scriptures was word-perfect. Though the messages were very similar.

I have listened to half of Carter Conlon's conference message tonite - it was similar (so far) to the message he had given the previous Sunday at Times Church - showing the love of Christ in order to win people. I do believe God can put a burning message in a preacher's heart - one that he is compelled to share wherever he goes.

"Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever." Hebrews 13:8

"...What does it avail to discourse profoundly of the Trinity if you are devoid of humility...Surely profound words do not make a a man holy and just; but a virtuous life makes him dear to God. I would rather feel contrition than know the definition thereof..." (T. A kempis)

Kieth Daniels, did he not speak of men who can discourse so profoundly?_ and so fiercely depend their religion?

Carter Conlon, did he not speak of men,who really represent and do the works of Christ?

The doctrine of grace, for the glory of God, they are but can be just wonderful statements:

"Look at the heavens, and see; and behold the clouds, which are higher than you.

If you have sinned, what do you accomplish against him? And if your transgressions are multiplied, what do you do to him?

If you are righteous, what do you give to him? Or what does he receive from your hand?" (Job 35:5-7)

...That we will rather abhor ourselves and repent in dust and ashes.(Job 42:6)

Isa 58:2 Yet they seek me daily and delight to know my ways, as if they were a nation that did righteousness and did not forsake the judgment of their God; they ask of me righteous judgments; they delight to draw near to God.

Isa 58:3 'Why have we fasted, and you see it not? Why have we humbled ourselves, and you take no knowledge of it?' Behold, in the day of your fast you seek your own pleasure, and oppress all your workers.

Isa 58:4 Behold, you fast only to quarrel and to fight and to hit with a wicked fist. Fasting like yours this day will not make your voice to be heard on high.

Isa 58:5 Is such the fast that I choose, a day for a person to humble himself? Is it to bow down his head like a reed, and to spread sackcloth and ashes under him? Will you call this a fast, and a day acceptable to the LORD?

Isa 58:6 "Is not this the fast that I choose: to loose the bonds of wickedness, to undo the straps of the yoke, to let the oppressed go free, and to break every yoke?

Isa 58:7 Is it not to share your bread with the hungry and bring the homeless poor into your house; when you see the naked, to cover him, and not to hide yourself from your own flesh?

i pray that we will take note of what john weasly thought of the calvnist whitfield

i see people here are just causing agrument

between the two doctines

what i kick in the teeth , regarding unity in the body of christ
i love how cater conlon preaches , tho i dont agree with alll that he believes
and i love how keith daniels preaches ,tho i dont agree with all tthat he preaches

for the sake of unity brothers get over the wall

and join hands with true believes

and seek to have the understanding of our late presious brother weasly ,who rocked the world

please pemit me to say gently ,who never believed in the sign gifts

lets join under the blood

and pray for revivle

1. And, first, let us keep close to the grand scriptural doctrines which he everywhere delivered. There are many doctrines of a less essential nature, with regard to which even the sincere children of God (such is the present weakness of human understanding) are and have been divided for many ages. In these we may think and let think; we may "agree to disagree." But, meantime, let us hold fast the essentials of "the faith which was once delivered to the saints;" and which this champion of God so strongly insisted on, at all times, and in all places!

2. His fundamental point was, "Give God all the glory of whatever is good in man;" and, "In the business of salvation, set Christ as high and man as low as possible." With this point, he and his friends at Oxford, the original Methodists, so called, set out. Their grand principle was, there is no power (by nature) and no merit in man. They insisted, all power to think, speak, or act aright, is in and from the Spirit of Christ; and all merit is (not in man, how high soever in grace, but merely) in the blood of Christ. So he and they taught: there is no power in man, till it is given him from above, to do one good work, to speak one good word, or to form one good desire. For it is not enough to say, all men are sick of sin: no, we are all "dead in trespasses and sins." It follows, that all the children of men are, "by nature, children of wrath." We are all "guilty before God," liable to death temporal and eternal.

3. And we are all helpless, both with regard to the power and to the guilt of sin. "For who can bring a clean thing out of an unclean?" None less than the Almighty. Who can raise those that are dead, spiritually dead in sin? None but He who raised us from the dust of the earth. But on what consideration will He do this? "Not for works of righteousness that we have done." "The dead cannot praise Thee, O Lord;" nor do anything for the sake of which they should be raised to life. Whatever, therefore, God does, He does it merely for the sake of His well-beloved Son: "He was wounded for our transgressions, He was bruised for our iniquities." He Himself "bore" all "our sins in His own body upon the tree." He "was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification." Here then is the sole meritorious cause of every blessing we do or can enjoy; in particular of our pardon and acceptance with God, of our full and free justification. But by what means do we become interested in what Christ has done and suffered? "Not by works, lest any man should boast;" but by faith alone. "We conclude," says the Apostle, "that a man is justified by faith, without the works of the law." And "to as many as" thus "receive Him, giveth He power to become the sons of God, even to those that believe in His name; who are born, not of the will of man, but of God."

4. And "except a man be" thus "born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God." But all who are thus "born of the Spirit" have "the kingdom of God within them." Christ sets up His kingdom in their hearts; "righteousness, peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost." That "mind is in them, which was in Christ Jesus," enabling them to "walk as Christ also walked." His indwelling Spirit makes them both holy in heart, and "holy in all manner of conversation." But still, seeing all this is a free gift, through the righteousness and blood of Christ, there is eternally the same reason to remember, "He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord."

5. You are not ignorant that these are the fundamental doctrines which he everywhere insisted on. And may they not be summed up, as it were, in two words, -- the new birth, and justification by faith? These let us insist upon with all boldness, at all times, and in all places; -- in public (those of us who are called thereto), and at all opportunities in private. Keep close to these good, old, unfashionable doctrines, how many soever contradict and blaspheme. Go on, my brethren, in the "name of the Lord, and in the power of His might." With all care and diligence, "keep that safe which is committed to your trust;" knowing that "heaven and earth shall pass away, but this truth shall not pass away."

6. But will it be sufficient to keep close to his doctrines, how pure soever they are? Is there not a point of still greater importance than this, namely, to drink into his spirit? -- herein to be a follower of him, even as he was of Christ? Without this, the purity of our doctrines would only increase our condemnation. This, therefore, is the principal thing -- to copy after his spirit. And allowing that in some points we must be content to admire what we cannot imitate; yet in many others we may, through the same free grace, be partakers of the same blessing. Conscious then of your own wants and of His bounteous love, who "giveth liberally and upbraids not," cry to Him that works all in all for a measure of the same precious faith; of the same zeal and activity; the same tender-heartedness, charitableness, bowels of mercies. Wrestle with God for some degree of the same grateful, friendly, affectionate temper; of the same openness, simplicity, and godly sincerity; "love without dissimulation." Wrestle on, till the power from on high works in you the same steady courage and patience; and above all, because it is the crown of all, the same invariable integrity!

7. Is there any other fruit of the grace of God with which he was eminently endowed, and the want of which among the children of God he frequently and passionately lamented? There is one, that is, catholic love; that sincere and tender affection which is due to all those who, we have reason to believe, are children of God by faith; in other words, all those, in every persuasion, who "fear God and work righteousness." He longed to see all who had "tasted of the good word," of a true catholic spirit; a word little understood, and still less experienced, by many who have it frequently in their mouth. Who is he that answers this character? Who is the man of a catholic spirit? One who loves as friends, as brethren in the Lord, as joint partakers of the present kingdom of heaven, and fellow heirs of His eternal kingdom, all, of whatever opinion, mode of worship, or congregation, who believe in the Lord Jesus; who love God and man; who, rejoicing to please and fearing to offend God, are careful to abstain from evil, and zealous of good works. He is a man of a truly catholic spirit, who bears all these continually upon his heart; who, having an unspeakable tenderness for their persons, and an earnest desire of their welfare, does not cease to commend them to God in prayer, as well as to plead their cause before men; who speaks comfortably to them, and labors, by all his words, to strengthen their hands in God. He assists them to the uttermost of his power, in all things, spiritual and temporal; he is ready to "spend and be spent" for them; yea, "to lay down his life for his brethren."

brothers and sisters ,i dont like to talk about my self

but so nobody thinks im biast

can i mention with out forcing my convictions

i believe in the gifts of the spirit and baptism as a seconadry grace

bless us father through you holy begotton son

You wrote:
"I call for all those opposed to the Baptism of the Holy Spirit to lay down their opposition and to work hand in hand with their tongue speaking brothers and sisters in Christ."

Amen Brother!

Doug

amen

im not trying to be reactionary

but a call must be made to our tounge speaking brothers to except our calvinists friends and call them brothers

and agree to disagree
there is much tension on both sides of the fence ,that needs to be released

i dont think any one here is calling to hold hands with liberals, who we all no denie the spirit alltogether ,but have a mear form of godliness

let not the so called calvinists be blinded by the liberal carasmatic,towards the good spirit filled toung talker

and let not the belivers in all the gifts to so called carasmatics be blinded by the hyper and the liberal calvinists ,towards the spirit indwelt calvinist

heal us lord that we may be one , as you are one with our father and help us agree to disagree in love , for your names sake lord ,,for your names sake ,that the gentiles dont speak evil of you ,,,,,help us lord

You wrote:
"but a call must be made to our tounge speaking brothers to except our calvinists friends and call them brothers"

Amen! Help us all Lord to come into the unity of the Faith. Let it be so Lord. Amen.

Doug

may he casues us by is spirit to weep with verment crys to him who is able to save us out of this situation

casue us to lament please more lord more tears ,cause us to suplicate as a beggger for more of your spirit of unafication , and forgive my quralsom heart ,and help us be renewed in the spirit of our mind ,and experance the bond of peace in all ares of the body ,and in our life ,,,please lord have mercy ,,and lord gives us the strength to believe you will answer our prayers

help us fast this week father thank you and visit me with times of refreshing that comes from the presence of you lord

"I call for all those opposed to the Baptism of the Holy Spirit to lay down their opposition..."

This was one of the things David Ravenhill touched on in his Malachi message.

It was a very good word.