What Is Growth In Christ?

There you go again tuc, Amen to all you wrote.

We don't receive a leaky bucket, we receive the whole bucket of Grace in Christ Jesus. I don't get part of the Spirit of Christ birthed in me I get Him as a whole person.
I don't get part of the Holy Spirit now and part later, I get the whole Person of the Holy Spirit. Paul said this takes a revelation of the mystery and that mystery is "Christ in you the Hope of Glory", and Jesus Christ also even brings the Father to make their abode with us.

My Labour or if you want to call it works, that is ok as long as we understand it is by His working in us that makes us perfect before the Father.

Colossians 1:25-29 Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, (((to fulfil the word of God;)))) Even the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints: To whom God would make known what is the ((((riches of the glory of this mystery)))) among the Gentiles; which is ((((Christ in you, the hope of glory:)))) Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may ((((present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:)))) Whereunto ((((I also labour, striving according to his working,)))) which worketh in me mightily.

This truly is our perfection, the mystery revealed in the mystery and the total and last fulfillment of the Gospel of the WORD Himself, Paul's Gospel; Christ in you the hope of Glory. Amen

Thank you brother tuc, The outside pressure from religion of works salvation is so draining, it is wonderful to hear freedom in Christ.

In Christ; Phillip

Can growth in Christ also be related to the promises of God?

2 Peter 1:4
he has granted us his precious and very great promises so that
THROUGH THEM
you may become partakers of the divine nature.

2 Corinthians 7:1
SINCE WE HAVE THESE PROMISES
let us cleans ourselves from every defilement of body AND spirit bringing holiness to completion in the fear of God.

1 John 3:3
And everyone who has this HOPE FOCUSED on him purifies himself, just as Jesus is pure.

The promises of God are the means to purity and holiness?

Amen to all three of you. It is so good and edifying to see Christ being lifted up.

David

Quote: """
I would like to contact you personally. I tried sending a message on youtube but got no response. Can you somehow give me your email or something?"""

530-218-4074

We are just as righteous as Christ is. This righteousness can not increase or decrease.
2 Cor. 5:21; 1 Cor. 1:30

Dear Brother,

Both the verses that you have posted does not mean what you are quoting. We are not already perfect. These verses give us hope that we can be made perfect. Again similar to your last post on Sin and morality, here also the fundamentals of your post are not correct.

2 Corinthians 5:21

He made Him who knew no sin to be sin on our behalf, so that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.

The verse clearly says that we might become the righteousness of God. In other Jesus became Sin so that we will receive righteousness from God. It never says that we are already righteous as quoted by you. This verse is a powerful verse that gives us hope that we will be called Righteous one day by God. Righteousness should always come from God, we cannot assume that we are righteous or already made righteous.
1 Corinthians 1:28:-

The base things of the world and the despised God has chosen, the things that are not, so that He may nullify the things that are, so that no man may boast before God. But by His doing you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption, so that, just as it is written, “LET HIM WHO BOASTS, BOAST IN THE LORD.”

The context of this verse is very important, please do not take it out of context to find a new meaning to it. In this context God has called those who are fools in the eyes of the world to be united with Christ Jesus who will become source of our Wisdom, Righteousness, Sanctification, and redemption. So it means Jesus is our only source, we cannot generate it by our self. This does not mean that we already have the wisdom of God, or Righteousness of God. It means he is our only source, so that no man can boast on his work.

I am NOT boasting in anything that I have ever done, am now doing or will ever do.

The fact is that God in Christ has made me completely righteous.

Christ Himself is my righteousness.

Jesus Christ is not only my only source, He is my Life.

I never said you are boasting, I don't know where you got this from. I said you misquote the verses to say something which it does not say.
You are simply adding to God's promises by saying I am already Perfected.

I welcome you saying Jesus Christ is your life, but it is for the world and People around you to see and tell that they see Jesus in you. Not for you to tell people that you are already like Jesus. Do you find the difference? If the people around you are telling you that they see Jesus in you then it means you are living like Jesus who never Sinned no matter how bad the trails were. So it is for your life to speak.

Rom. 9:30, "What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith."

Again you are misquoting this verse. Read it with context. With context it means the Gentiles were called to receive the righteousness of God though they did not seek for it in their initial life in which they did not know Christ.

If you take this verse literally like how you took then it can be taken as God has already made all Gentiles irrespective of accepting Jesus as Righteous. Because there is no condition specified here.

Brother I would advise you to read Bible carefully instead of misinterpreting it. Adding something to God's promise is equally dangerous like not trusting his promise. If you are willing to risk by adding to his promise then you can but please do not spread these false teachings.

If God has already made us all Righteous and that is the basis of Christianity as proclaimed by you then why is not a clear verse in Bible that directly states it? Why did Jesus, Paul, Apostles and all the Godly men of this age preach the spirit led life of attaining God's righteousness? Why can't they say just sit back and relax either.

Brother God never oversees our sins, even if you believe in Jesus or not. He will forgive our sins if we repent and ask him to forgive us in Jesus name. He forgives us not because we repented but because we came to him in Jesus name who has paid the praise for our sins publically. This does not mean God will stop seeing our future sins and will blind his eyes. If he does so then he is not a Just God.

Any real acceptable outward change must be the result of the exchange that God has already accomplished for you. Your old rotten, wicked, deceitful heart was taken away and replaced (exchanged) with His own heart. Now not only have His very Life but as a result you have a 100% clean heart containing His Devine Nature.

Lets look at the heart………….

The heart in the bible. Upon examination one can determine of what the Bible heart consists Jesus mentioned "understanding with their heart" Jn. 12: 40 Hence, the intellect or reasoning ability resides in the heart. The Bible speaks of the heart possessing emotion John 14: 1. Emotions such as joy, love, and desire are emotions said to emanate from the heart Jn. 16: 22; Matt. 22: 37; 5: 28. The expression "willing heart" is a reference to the will of man being located in his heart Ex 35: 5. The language "pricked in their heart" is an allusion to the conscience or that part of the heart that pains us when we do wrong Acts 2:37

After these scriptures are gathered and studied about the heart, we can deduce that the heart consists of the intellect or thinking ability; emotions; the will or volition; and the conscience. The heart is the seat, source, reservoir, and instigator of our thoughts, attitudes, desires, character, and motivation. Pr 4:23 Keep and guard your heart with all vigilance and above all that you guard, for out of it flow the springs of life. (AMP)

According to the bible the heart is the source and the seat of the mind, will and emotions in this modern time we would call this the soul…

After a time of fasting and prayer God revealed to me that in me sin remains, it Sin has so embedded itself into our nature that we are tricked into believing it is us but it’s not us… When you are born again its your Spirit that’s born again… God also let me know that there was a additional work he needs to perform in the believer…Your Soul (Stony heart) has not been dealt with and this is where Sin resides…

God also revealed to Paul this truth with these words “But I see” this speaks to me of revelation…. God revealed to Paul and when he saw it and he cried “who shall deliver me from the body of this death?” Rom 7:24

Roms 7:23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.

There is a dual work to be done in man one in the Spirit the other in the heart our soul…..

Ezekiel 36:26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away “the stony heart out of your flesh”, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

The scripture above sheds some light “the stony heart out of your flesh” this stony heart of the flesh has works these are…

Galatians 5:19-21 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, Envying, murders, drunkenness, reveling, and such like.

Paul calls it flesh, to deal with flesh it must be dealt at the source and the source Pr 4:23 is “the stony heart of your flesh”

Jesus’s words will also help us pin point the source. For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies: Matthew 15:19…

Getting back to growth until “the stony heart of the flesh” remains we will remain babes in Christ, carnal and walk as mere men because the Holy Spirit will be hindered because the flesh fights against God…

If Christ is in me and every man is presented perfect that is in Christ. Is Christ perfect? If He is now my spirit and without His Spirit in me I am none of His, then that part of me that is Christ by His Spirit that dwells in me is perfect. I don't see any other way for Christ to be in me and that which is Christ be perfect.

My soul is becoming perfect and I have not attained to perfection in my soul/mind yet, but we do have the Mind of Christ and again that part of my soul/mind is perfect also, if Christ is perfect.

My flesh will be perfect in the resurrection, not yet, but my body has been quickened to contain the full God complement of God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit. This is the One Spirit all believers are baptized into.

Paul is the only person who has this understanding of how the born again believer functions in Christ by the Christ in him.

New birth, old birth destroyed at the Cross, New Creatures in Christ.

I stand perfect before the Father perfect, because the Father does not depend on me for perfection, that is why He birthed the incorruptable Seed of Jesus Christ, The Father's Seed in me.

God has made by the Christ in me, Christ wisdom, Christ righteousness, Christ sanctification and Christ redemption.
1 Cor 1:30

I believe this is what tuc is saying, if I am oversteping anybodies boundries, please forgive me. This must come by revelation which Paul certainly has, which came into Him when Paul was knocked off his horse, spoken to out of Heaven by Jesus Christ Himself, blinded and sent to the person God had already prepared to receive Paul and send him on the fulfillment of the ministry Jesus Christ gave him, which Paul calls his Gospel the fulfillment of the Word of God.

In Christ: Phillip

Quote When Adam sinned he lost his union from God and died to God. He only had one nature or heart and it was completely contrary to God.

True Adam lost his union from God…Remember Adam was a being of three parts Spirit, Soul and Body… When Adam died to God it was his Adam’s spirit that died to God….

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Quote: When we are born again, we experience the taking away of that old self that we were in Adam and then we become a new creation in Christ. At that second we experience a completely clean and pure heart.

When we are Born Again it is man’s Spirit that is Born Again and we become a new creation in Christ…but the heart or soul is not clean and pure…

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Quote: We do still have a corruptible body and a mind that needs renewed, but neither of these are our true nature.

Right there your saying to me that you’re aware that something needs to change “mind that needs renewed”. In my previous post I pointed out that the heart in the bible was made up of the Mind, will and emotions…

Lets look at the mind in the bible and see where it puts it…..

Gen 6:5 And Jehovah saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

Gen 24:45 And before I had done speaking in my heart,

Gen 27:41 And Esau hated Jacob because of the blessing wherewith his father blessed him: and Esau said in his heart

Prov 4:4 And he taught me, and said unto me: Let thy heart retain my words; Keep my commandments, and live;

Prov 8:5 O ye simple, understand prudence; And, ye fools, be of an understanding heart.

Prov 15:14 The heart of him that hath understanding seeketh knowledge; But the mouth of fools feedeth on folly.

Now I could go on and on and on but the bible clearly states that the heart is where imagination thoughts words understanding and it seeks knowledge…

Brother Phillip,

My soul is becoming perfect and I have not attained to perfection in my soul/mind yet, but we do have the Mind of Christ and again that part of my soul/mind is perfect also, if Christ is perfect.

Though I do not agree with you entirely. I appreciate that you atleast understand that there is a need for renewal in us.

I don't really give much importance to what you think you will be when you stand before his judgment seat. But I really care about the need to live like Christ on your life on earth.

If you believe you are already Perfect then live like a perfect man who lived 2000 years ago (Jesus). If you believe you are not already perfect but you have received power to be perfect (Holy Spirit) as specified in Bible then live with that power that will lead you into a life of perfection. In both cases the need for Christlikeness cannot be neglected.

So Growth in Christ Jesus is to be more like Christ Jesus everyday. If you identify more Sin in you than what you know last year then you are growing.

My soul is becoming perfect and I have not attained to perfection in my soul/mind yet, but we do have the Mind of Christ and again that part of my soul/mind is perfect also, if Christ is perfect.

My flesh will be perfect in the resurrection, not yet, but my body has been quickened to contain the full God complement of God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit. This is the One Spirit all believers are baptized into.

Gal 5:24 And those who are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.

So what does this scripture mean? We know the body will change in the twinkling of the eye For the corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 1 Corinthians 15:53

Gal 5:24 must pertain to the soul which is described in the bible as the heart these words confirm it “passions and desires”

Prov 6:25 Lust not after her beauty in thy heart; Neither let her take thee with her eyelids.

Ps 78:18 And they tempted God in their heart By asking food according to their desire.

The bible clearly places the desires and lust in the heart. It’s the “stony heart of the flesh” that needs to be put to death…

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Quote: Paul is the only person who has this understanding of how the born again believer functions in Christ by the Christ in him.

If the Holy Spirit revealed it to Paul he the Holy Spirit can reveal it to you or me also…

Gal 5:24 And those who are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.

Quote: """So what does this scripture mean? We know the body will change in the twinkling of the eye For the corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 1 Corinthians 15:53"""

Gal 2:20 "I am crucified with Christ", never the less I live, YET not I, but Christ liveth in me: the life I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God."

Quote: """Quote: Paul is the only person who has this understanding of how the born again believer functions in Christ by the Christ in him.

If the Holy Spirit revealed it to Paul he the Holy Spirit can reveal it to you or me also…"""
Amen

He gave it to Paul to fulfill the word of God and give it to us. Just reading the word and it being revealed by the Holy Spirit are two different things. Paul said, when it pleased God, who chose Paul from his mothers womb to reveal His Son in Paul. It is still pleasing to God to reveal His Son in us also. "Ye must be born again"

In Christ: Phillip

Paul says, "I am crucified with Christ, nevertheless I live" (Gal. 2:20).

All through the Word of God we find that crucifixion precedes deep spiritual power.

Not only must God break down the sins of a sinner in order to convert him, but in those who are truly regenerated He must break down their wisdom, learning, prudence, their churchly training and prejudice, their narrow-mindedness, their knowledge, their righteousness.

It takes the Lord just about as long to break down a Christian man’s righteousness as to break down a sinner’s unrighteousness. Do not misunderstand me that God ever breaks down His own wisdom or righteousness or strength, but He breaks down that form of wisdom, righteousness and strength which sprouts and grows out of human nature.

Whatever originates in self, in the creature nature, must be crucified in order that the creature may be wedded to Christ through the Holy Ghost, and from that sacred union derive other wisdom, righteousness and strength infinitely superior to that of any creature.

We are to let go not only our wicked selves, but, also, our seemingly pious selves in order that we may take hold of God.

The Secret Of Spiritual Power By George D.

Excellent post, you have a clear understanding of scripture. But sadly it is reaching the ears of people who wants to hear only things that they want to hear. Truth is not their objective, only hearing pleasing things is their objective.

Any of these Posters who say that their life is already like Christ, let them look into their own life to see how it is compared to life of Christ. They either find million difference but still believe a lie that they are christlike already, because they think believing a lie is faith. Or they really do not know anything about Christ and think this defeated life is actually the life that Christ lived.

Matthew 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Romans 12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

Philippians 3:15 Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you.

James 1:4 But let patience have her perfect work, that ye may be perfect and entire, wanting nothing.

Who is our perfection?

Philippians 3:8-21 Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ, And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith: That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death; If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead. Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus. Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before, I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus. Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you. Nevertheless, whereto we have already attained, let us walk by the same rule, let us mind the same thing. Brethren, be followers together of me, and mark them which walk so as ye have us for an ensample. (For many walk, of whom I have told you often, and now tell you even weeping, that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ: Whose end is destruction, whose God is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame, who mind earthly things.) For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.

Perfect in Christ,not in self.

In Christ:Phillip

Quote: Any of these Posters who say that their life is already like Christ, let them look into their own life to see how it is compared to life of Christ. They either find million difference but still believe a lie that they are christlike already, because they think believing a lie is faith. Or they really do not know anything about Christ and think this defeated life is actually the life that Christ lived.

God spoke to me many years ago what he said was this “the church is dead” …..….

Quote: Now the truth of the Gospel message is that God has already provided the only solution possible for sin and mankind's condition once and for all. God Himself has done everything necessary for your complete and total salvation. There is NOTHING left out or lacking.

He has accomplished it ALL.

Christ has accomplished it all that’s true…..

But here is the lie the twist in the tail….

Quote: Growing in Christ is just the never ending discovery Of what He has already done.

The gospel message has been reduced to a “never ending discovery” there is no mention of dying to self and personal holiness… It’s made to sound like some Walt Disney Movie the “never ending discovery”

True, there is perfect holiness in Christ for the believer, but there must also be a holy nature received from Him.

Genuine Christians discover so much carnality, filth, and vileness in themselves this difficulty is not solved in justification, by recognizing that though completely unholy in ourselves we are holy in Christ, for Scripture teaches that those who are sanctified by God are holy in themselves

For without personal holiness "no man shall see the Lord" Heb. 12:14

As He which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation (behavior); because it is written, Be ye holy for I am holy" 1 Pet. 1:15-16

There must be a impartial compliance with the revealed will of God and departing from evil which issues from faith and love.

There must be that directing of all our actions to the glory of God, by Jesus Christ, according to the Gospel.

There must be a spirit of holiness working within the believer's heart so as to sanctify his outward actions if they are to be acceptable unto Him in whom "there is no darkness".

The faith of God's elect is unto "the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness" Titus 1:1. It is a faith which purifieth the heart (Acts 15:9), and it grieves over all impurity.

If "even Christ pleased not Himself" Rom. 15:3, how reasonable is it that we should be required to deny ourselves and take up our cross and follow Him Matt. 16:24, for without so doing we cannot be His disciples Luke 14:27.

If we are to be conformed to Christ in glory, how necessary that we first be conformed to Him in holiness: "He that saith he abideth in him ought himself so to walk even as he walked" 1 John 2:6.

"Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity" 2 Tim. 2:19 Let him either put on the life of Christ, or drop the name of Christ.

Awake thou that sleepest, and arise from the dead, and Christ shall give thee light Eph 5:14

True, there is perfect holiness in Christ for the believer, but there must also be a holy nature received from Him.

Are you talking about Justification here? If you are referring to only Justification then it is true. But our life does not stop with Justification, like the thief on the Cross(He died immediately after he was Justified). But we have a life to live on earth after Justification. So when youa are in santification phase you are not the same Blameless guy anymore.
Can you quote some verses to prove your above quote? I don't believe we are perfected or recieve perfect holiness when we are born again. We recieve it as we walk with Lord in our life by daily looking at the life of Jesus.

Quote: """I don't believe we are perfected or recieve perfect holiness when we are born again."""

Colossians 1:25-29 Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, to fulfil the word of God; Even the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints: To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory: Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus: Whereunto I also labour, striving according to his working, which worketh in me mightily.

He is our only true sanctification, our perfection is truly in Christ, by being born again we can see the things of the kingdom and know we are holy because He is Holy.

Joh 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
Joh 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
1Pe 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

There is no sanctification without Christ in us, for God has made Him our sanctification and this is our labour.

1 Corinthians 1:2-3 Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours: Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ.

Who has been made unto us sanctification?

1 Corinthians 1:29-31 That no flesh should glory in his presence. But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption: That, according as it is written, He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord.

In Christ: Phillip

Brother, Dont you see the verses you are posting are against what you are quoting?

warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we MAY present every man perfect in Christ Jesus

Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot SEE the kingdom of God.

Here again Jesus is saying until we are born again we will not have hope of entering the Kingdom of God. So he is talking about the first phase that we need to enter to even have a hope (see Kingdom of God). But Jesus is not saying that born again is the only condition for entering the Kingdom of God and once entered you will be there irrespective of how you live.

You and brother Tuc are taking one or 2 verses out of context and trying to explain a lie which the Bible never agrees with.

Paul says this is and was a mystery, which is "NOW" revealed to His saints. "Christ in you the hope of glory": whom we preach? This is our perfection. If we are seated in the heavenlies in Christ Jesus, we cannot be in God's presense unless we are perfect. It is the Spirit of Christ rebirthed in us that makes us Holy, not what we do. "without the Spirit of Christ we are none of His". God is Holy and perfect and He cannot accept anything less in His Kingdom. Being born again we can now see the things of the kingdom. This is the mystery Paul preaches in all his epistles, "Christ in you the hope of glory". NOW, revealed, not future revelation but NOW. We are perfect in Spirit now, we are being made perfect by the Holy Spirit teaching our minds to Mind of Christ which Paul also says we now have. We will be made perfect on resurrection when our bodies will be changed to be as His glorious Body.

Christ in us is our only hope of glory.

In Christ, seated in the heavenlies in Christ Jesus before the Father perfect, becoming perfect and will be perfect or we cannot enter the Father's House where Jesus Christ is preparing for us a place, "many mansions". He will finish His work He has begun in us. In fact by faith we are already to recon ourselves already there.

Phillip

God is Holy and perfect and He cannot accept anything less in His Kingdom.
or we cannot enter the Father's House where Jesus Christ is preparing for us a place,

the Holy Spirit teaching our minds to Mind of Christ which Paul also says we now have.

Good that you atleast accepted this, If we are sinners we cannot inherit the kingdom of God because we are not perfect or Holy. And God cannot accept anything below his perfect standard. When we are born again we confess our past sins and God forgives us and looks at us like a person who has not sinned. This is true and it is called Justification.

So now that we are Justified, if God is not going to look us at all as we are prefect (already) then why has he given us the Holy Spirit to teach us the way of Jesus? If there is nothing we have to do after Justification then why should we learn the life of Jesus from Holy Spirit.
It is beacuse God wants us to live like Jesus, he has enabled us with Holy Spirit to be Christlike. We are accountable for everytime we fall short of Christlikeness.

1 John 2 -1 :- My little children, I am writing these things to you so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous;

If God is not looking into our life after we are Justified then why do we need this Advocate for?
It is this advocate who pleads for us when we fall short of his Glory everyday to get us back on track.
So growth in Christ is to learn more about him from Holy Spirit and apply it in our life to Mature in Christ.

Our old man mind is what needs to be renewed and is ongoing by the Holy Spirit that dwells in our soulish part, mind, will and emotions. This is sanctification being done by the justification of Christ now being our Spirit in which by the Spirit of Christ we are perfect because He is perfect. Our old man spirit was ruled by satan and our minds were abused and missused and never able to attain perfection and must be renewed by the Holy Spirit to the mind of Christ. The incorruptable Seed of the Father, The living Word Himself is now our perfection, which is our new birthing, "It is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives in me", by His Spirit we are perfect in Spirit and becoming perfect in our soulish/mind by the Father sending the Holy Spirit to teach us in ongoing sanctification all that Jesus is that is in us, He prayed the Father that the Holy Spirit would be sent to us to remind us of all He is and says. For now we groan and our hope is on our newness of Life, perfect before the Father, now in Spirit by the Spirit of Christ birthed in us and becoming perfect by the Mind of Christ, which I have not attained yet, but I do press on in hope for the upward calling of God in Christ Jesus that my mind will some day be perfect just like the Mind of Christ. My groaning is the loudest in this flesh body I still live in and until it is planted in the ground or changed in the twinkling of an eye, My flesh will never produce fruit acceptable to the Father, because we are all still in Adam in the Flesh, that is why this corn of wheat can still die and be planted in the ground and on resurrection day it will no longer be earth bound flesh but a heavenly body like the body of Jesus Christ, then perfect.

All I can do with this body now is present it as a living sacridice to God, which is my reasonable spiritual service and labour in Christ.

So I am perfect in Spirit, becoming perfect in soul/mind and will be perfect on resurrection day, a complete offspring of God, not the first born Son, but a second born son of God into the body of Christ.

In Christ: Phillip

Our old man mind is what needs to be renewed and is ongoing by the Holy Spirit that dwells in our soulish part, mind, will and emotions.

The old man cannot be renewed. He is crucified with Jesus. The old man is dead.

Romans 6:4-

Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also SHOULD WALK in newness of life.
5 For if we have been united together in the likeness of His death, certainly we also shall be in the likeness of His resurrection, 6 knowing this, that OUR OLD MAN was crucified with Him, that the body of sin might be done away with, that we SHOULD no longer be slaves of sin. 7 For he who has died has been freed from sin.

So who is this old man? He is a man who was freely opening his house (our body and soul) for the desires of Flesh. Let’s take one desire Adultery. Now when we are born again we have a New Man, and the old man is crucified. This New Man knows that the desire of Flesh to do adultery is evil and against the word of God. So when the thief of adultery comes he does not open the door but fights against the thief. Now to win against the thief this new man needs strength. He gets it from Holy Spirit. Once the new Man overcomes the thief(by winning all the time), the Holy Spirit will show the new man other desires of Flesh that are inside us that needs to be thrown out, for example anger. So this cycle continues. And it is called Sanctification, where we become more Christ like each and every day. It is not a one day process.

Sanctification is a very important process, we are all in different stages of it. But we should all have one hope, when Jesus comes back we will be like him fully sanctified (1 John 3-9). If we do not seek to be Sanctified saying we are already perfect and God will not look at me anymore, then we are deceiving ourselves. We are not saved if we are not Sanctified, because Sanctification is a way by which we are Saved from the Power of Sin.

Quote: there is perfect holiness in Christ for the believer, but there must also be a holy nature received from Him.

1 Cor. 1:30 “By His doing you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption.”

Heb. 10:10-14 “By this will we have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. And every priest stands daily ministering and offering time after time the same sacrifices, which can
never take away sins; but He, having offered one sacrifice for sins for all time, sat down at the right hand of God, waiting from that time onward until His enemies be made a footstool for His feet. For by one offering He has perfected for all time those who are sanctified.”

Our postion in Christ.... We have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ by one offering He(Christ)has perfected for all time those who are sanctified....

Our postion in Christ.... We have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ by one offering He(Christ)has perfected for all time those who are sanctified....

1 Cor 1:30, should be seen with the context. In the context in which it is said, it means Christ is the source of our Wisdom from God, Righteousness, Sanctification and Redemption. Read it along with the scriptures before it, you will understand what I meant.

We are not Sanctified already, Sanctification is a daily process. We are in the process of Sanctification. When we are Sanctified (during his second coming) we will be perfect.

1 Peter 5-10:-After you have suffered for a little while, the God of all grace, who called you to His eternal glory in Christ, WILL Himself perfect, confirm, strengthen and establish you.

If we are already perfected then where is the need to Perfect us gain? This is not the only Scripture that I can quote, this is the scripture that God showed me today. The sufferring that Peter talks here is the Sanctification process. If you read 1 Peter 4 carefully, you will understand this process.

Also in my previous post I have explained Sanctification clearly.

We are sanctified totally in Spirit, perfect in Spirit because He is perfect, for we have the Spirit of Christ rebirthed in us. We are being sanctified in our soul/mind by the renewing of our mind to the Mind of Christ, we will be sanctified completely on resurrection morning. Jesus Christ is our complete justification, NOW. Sanctification is certain, now and ongoing.

Romans 8:9-14 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you.
(((((Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.))))) And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you. Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh. For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

Who is the first born of God, who are the second reborn of God.

Sanctified by the Spirit of Christ in us the hope of Glory.
Being sanctified by the Holy Spirit in mortifying the deeds of the flesh, by the incorruptable Seed of the Father, The Word, who is Jesus Christ Himself;
John 1.

Will be sanctified in our new bodies like His.

In Christ: Phillip

Thanks, everyone, for this good dialog. It may have been Watchman Nee, or possibly Major Thomas, that differentiated between our standing and our state. It seems that tuc was addressing our standing, and others may be viewing the issues from our (remaining propensity to sin) state. In any case, when God 'views' saved individuals He sees Christ in our place and, therefore, we possess all those things that tuc writes. That being so God is then fully able to interact with us with all the good will according to His good and loving nature.

Complete acceptance by God is a great thing, indeed!

- Dick

Thanks, everyone, for this good dialog. It may have been Watchman Nee, or possibly Major Thomas, that differentiated between our standing and our state. It seems that tuc was addressing our standing, and others may be viewing the issues from our (remaining propensity to sin) state. In any case, when God 'views' saved individuals He sees Christ in our place and, therefore, we possess all those things that tuc writes. That being so God is then fully able to interact with us with all the good will according to His good and loving nature.

Complete acceptance by God is a great thing, indeed!

- Dick