Smoking in the Ministry

I recently discovered a small Christian coffee shop in a town near mine. It is housed in a ministry called St. Matthias Mission. I was pleased to find that they have a sizable fellowship of young people which hang out there. They also provide for the needy in whatever way they can. I was excited about the prospect of getting involved, but the very first time I went there, I was choking on cigarette smoke. They weren't smoking in the front of the shop, but in a back room. I believe it is actually the ordained Episcopal priest who runs the place who is one of the smokers. I don't know that for sure, yet. However, I can't see myself having much respect for leadership who smoke cigarettes or even one who would allow it to go on in a place of ministry. How do you all feel about this? Sincerely, Dian.

I would write them a letter talking about respect, respect for nonsmokers who want to be healthy and respect for the temple of God, which our body is if we have the Holy Spirit of Jesus Christ. Matthew 18:15 says tell them privately first.That is despicable for Christianity. I hope you will take some action, at least tell them what God thinks about such things from a biblical perspective. If you don't speak out, don't complain about it. But don't gossip, tell the ones who are committing the sin first.Dear God, please forgive our sins, please guide spitfire to follow Your Holy Spirit of Jesus Christ to do what is right and speak Truth. You are Holy, your people must press into Holiness also to know You more. Help us draw closer to you more and more. Thank you Lord God for Your presence and hearing our prayers. In Jesus' name I pray, amen.

I am going to be real honest... i don't like smoke and I've never really smoked- and probably a year ago, I would have been offended by a christian place where they smoke.But.... lately the Lord has showm me sooo much garbage that i had hidden in my heart (worse than wanting to smoke- if you ask me) that I have no right to judge someone for a habit that is hard to break.I am not saying that smoking is ok. I am just saying that the Lord may be dealing with that person already- if not, then what we can do is PRAY!!! Pray that the Lord will help them overcome and show them that this is not healthy or right for them.Just because someone smokes does not mean they aren't a christian or are not really searching. I know a couple of wonderful guys here on SI that have had to give up smoking. God dealt with them in His time and His way.I guess right now, I feel too poor in spirit to be judging people when I know that i have done some horrible things myself. I have harbored feelings and attitudes in my heart that have only produced bad fruit. To me, this is worse than an "outward" act like smoking.In His love, Chanin

Hi Dian,How timely and interesting...After just coming back from a most incredible little journey, might have just a slight twist on all this. But first, as far as it concerns choking the people out, goodness, where is the respect for our brethren. I would be the first to raise a 'stink' about this and yes, as was mentioned in private, but also because...I am one of 'them', "Gasp", pun intended!Greg can attest and also appreciated his non-judgmental attitude about the whole thing while I was there the last two days.Being amongst our precious brethren on Saturday, these that are homeless and many who smoked...made me feel right at home on the one hand. On the other was the nagging albeit somewhat subdued at the present moment, knowing that I must part with my beloved flesh craving addiction. There is a couple others who I have spoken with who have struggled with this and maybe just some perspective. Have been under extreme conviction in the past year at times, or so I thought and still am somewhat unsure if that was really the root of what the Lord was trying to get at, at the time. I do know that I have often failed miserably trying to rid myself of these dreadful things on my own, in my own strength and even with much prayer... sighIt does seem that at times there are more pressing concerns to deal with than the ones 'we' think are important to the Lord at any given moment. Not trying to talk myself out of anything here. Have a full plate of concerns with all that is going on at home, domestically, financially, the state of the souls in my sphere of influence, IE: 'family matters'...But that doesn't change the fact that it is ...STUPID! What's that line? "If God wanted you to smoke, He would have put a chimney on top of your head" ?!So as far is it concerns ministry, there are first concerns that are far weightier than the chimney heads, but please... To subject the non-smokers to this in a in-closed room, goodness I can't stand that and I smoke. We quit doing that kind of thing in the house years ago especially after we found out the effects in can have on children, and that it is a great cause of ear infections for one... You cannot even smoke in any buildings out here bars included, I believe. Thought this was similar across the country.Anyway...a couple of butt's for ya... Welcome your prayers

I once heard a preacher say that he was asked if someone would go to hell if they smoked..his reply was "well, it will sure make you smell like it." Haha sorry if you dont think that is funny, i thought it was.

It's interesting that we would all come down quickly and say that one cannot be a crack addict and go to heaven, but cigarrets, which are a drug in the same fashion, are at times acceptable for Christians because society thinks it to just be a "nasty" habbit.

Mike your a good guy.

I probably came across pretty harsh when I placed that original post. I used to smoke, and I remember how difficult it was for me to quit. I remember getting down to one cigarette a day and still struggling just to stop with that. But, I do believe it is a big deal and it reveals the true state of our hearts. Just ask yourself, why do you smoke? Isn't it for comfort? A relief from anxiety and pressure, right? Isn't that God's job? So when we turn to something else for it, isn't that idolatry? Please don't get me wrong. I don't love smokers any less than non-smokers, but I do believe it reveals idolatry. It was true for me, and I honestly still don't think my heart is pure enough to be leading others. I always tell those who do submit themselves to me, I'm just one struggling person trying to help another struggling person. At least if we are going to continue in sin, let's call it sin. And if we call it sin, then let's face the fact that habitual sin disqualifies us to lead. Sincerely, Dian.And Mike, you know I love you, Brother. :-D

1Corinthians 6:12 All things are lawful unto me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but I will not be brought under the power of any.

Chaninlately the Lord has showm me sooo much garbage that i had hidden in my heart (worse than wanting to smoke- if you ask me) that I have no right to judge someone for a habit that is hard to break.That too true for me...

Chanin,How whole-heartedly I concur with you. For me, it is the height of hypocrisy to stand in judgment of a dear saint with a smoking habit while I shovel in Big Mac's, super size fry, and top it off with a smooth chocolate malt. All the while hardening my arteries to the place if I don't take heed I will check out early with work yet undone. Bad habit? for sure! And so are too many of my habits as well.In Christ,tony

For me, it is the height of hypocrisy to stand in judgment of a dear saint with a smoking habit while I shovel in Big Mac's, super size fry, and top it off with a smooth chocolate malt. All the while hardening my arteries to the place if I don't take heed I will check out early with work yet undone. Bad habit? for sure! And so are too many of my habits as well.It is not hypocrisy to call sin, sin. My judgement is concerning leadership. And to continue in habitual sin(let's differentiate), is different than our daily shortcomings. Habitual sin is a willful choice and a huge red flag of a life not in submission to Christ. That's my opinion. And honestly, I won't listen long to a fat preacher. Sincerely, Dian.

Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin. (Jam 4:17 KJV)Did you ever notice how private this verse was? There's only one person in it. Against thee, thee only, have I sinned, and done this evil in thy sight: that thou mightest be justified when thou speakest, and be clear when thou judgest. (Psa 51:4 KJV)Did you ever notice how private this verse was? There are only two people in it. The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican. (Luk 18:11 KJV)Did you ever notice how many people this verse has in it? One too many! ;-)

All, Charles Spurgeon smoked a pipe. Many men who were good, Godly smoked. I look at it this way, Matthew 7:1, " Judge not, that ye be not judged." (KJV) It should be between the individual and the Lord. I do not smoke and that is my conviction.I desire your prayers for me and my family in the days ahead. God bless you.

Great replies...As usual.Liked a lot that advice from Ron, thanks sir. Ultimately it does come done to that, especially in these type's of things.Also, am glad that Dian isn't backing down one iota here. Still can recall the conversations we had in this regard and to be even more honest about it all it is the last thing that I have yet to lay down that I know has to come to an end, surely there will be others, but of the remnants of on purpose stupidity deeply ingrained in the flesh...But, I do believe it is a big deal and it reveals the true state of our hearts. Just ask yourself, why do you smoke? Isn't it for comfort? A relief from anxiety and pressure, right? Isn't that God's job? So when we turn to something else for it, isn't that idolatry? Darn good question isn't it? Though it's somewhat vague, there was even more spelled out in prior conversation and I do need to revisit it again.But to answer just these questions..sort of?"Isn't it for comfort?" To the flesh"A relief from anxiety and pressure, right?" Yes, sort of. It doesn't fix any of those or make them go away, just the opposite can produce cravings so...."Isn't that God's job? So when we turn to something else for it, isn't that idolatry?" This is where I may differ. Another example that might raise a few eyebrows... I can be praying seriously on my face for long stretches at a time and get up go outside still carrying on in my prayers, sucking away on one of those things, starring up into the sky, praising God, musing, praying, thinking. I guess I just don't see a disconnect there or a 'replacement' for seeking God, not in the least. I guess I just don't see that it has anything to do with idolatry in that sense. It doesn't change my disposition in any way, give me a buzz, provide an escape or anything else in that sense. It's like food, you are hungry, you eat, you crave a smoke... It's an inbreed-ed habit reinforced through repetition and after 20 years it's pretty well ingrained. Sure that it differs for others, their reasons for doing so, many even for the reasons you mentioned.Now it's coming back to me, discussing about how the commonality amongst for instance those that are in rehab for say alcohol or drug abuse often are smokers. Maybe you could flesh this out again for others, it made sense to me at the time.It does seem to be different in that it doesn't alter your consciousness/mind in the way the others do.But all that is just by way of explanation and isn't intended to be a rationalization. Ironically enough, this new job is pretty darn stressful at times with the pace and demands even with the Lords peace undergirding it all and despite that probably smoke half as much as before...Just no time :-? But it still has to go, has to die, like the pride and unforgiveness and ways of the world and all the other things that the Lord requires of us individually. And I know this too He requires from me, in that sense maybe it is idolatry. I just keep putting it off because 'there are so many other things to deal with' a lame excuse that never flies, there will always be something to bump it into 'tomorrow'.Looking forward to more thoughts from others, especially one that I will be expecting soon ...And of course you too Dian. And you bet I know, I love you to sister. Let me have it, I know I am still wrong somewhere and a sneaky suspicion that this may be more of a spiritual issue than I know. Might just need some sense slapped into me.

Here's my perspective as an ex-smoker for close to three months.About two years ago, the Lord asked me "Do you love that cigarette more than you love me?" This was when I was outside smoking a cigarette. I said, I don't really think that's God and I rebelled, although I got some Christian books on the topic. For a short time, I conversed with one of those authors via Email.I began to spend a considerable amount of time praying about this and concluded that my behavior was a sin but I couldn't quit. It was a horrible time. I fasted. I cried out. No deliverance came. If we deliver ourselves, we tend to exalt ourselves.I mentioned this at our prayer circle at church and the pastor asked if they could pray for me. They prayed for me and God delivered me through the power of the blood of Jesus. I didn't break the power of the cigarette. Jesus did it, so there's no room for boasting.The power of the blood of Jesus is real and if we submit ourselves to Him, the victory is real as well. I believe that Jesus has the power to bind the strong man from any sin and break the power regardless of what the sin is.Another brother asked to vow to the Lord that I wouldn't return and he asked me if I was willing or willing to be made willing (as R.A. Torrey would say). I said yes. We prayed together and he warned me that the Lord would discipline me quickly if I went back to smoking.The next day I wanted a cigarette before I went home (around 3 p.m.) and I smoked that thing, my face turned green, and I just barely made it from the parking lot to the the elevator. I felt like I was going to pass out and all I could whisper on the elevator was "Thank you Jesus." That was the last cigarette.Victory over any sin is real but it's only in the power of the blood.I talked to my father about this a few weeks ago and he was glad that I finally got the "willpower." I told Dad no it wasn't my will power, it was the power of Jesus' blood over sin. He broke it. I couldn't do it. Victory over sin is not about trying harder because that's a flesh deal but it's submitting to Jesus and believing in faith in the power of His blood.As the Lord has been showing me through the powerful preaching that smoking is simply an area where the strong man (Satan) was not bound.Mat 12:29 Or else how can one enter into a strong man's house, and spoil his goods, except he first bind the strong man and then he will spoil his house.The strong man is bound as we do specifically what the Lord requires in that area of our life. That's probably the topic for another thread at another time.I see nothing wrong with calling sin for what it is as Dian did. What we have to be careful for is that we don't have the log in our own eye. Sin is always a manifestation of our rebellion to the Lord.I have a dear brother of mine suffering from gluttony (which has become life threatening) and he's not been able to break this from his life. If He is willing to submit fully to Jesus, Jesus will set Him free. Because I can readily see this sin, it doesn't make it more sinful than another sin which is in the heart (bitterness of heart, gossip, sexual sin, etc.). I pray that I never judge someone else's heart. I've done it before and it's a very grevious sin before the Lord.The power of the blood of Jesus is real folks. What we have to wary of is to compare ourselves to one another. The only people that did that were hypocrites, so we have to be very wary of drawing comparisons between ourselves.I know that Jesus is going to deliver you Mike from this stronghold. I'm certainly being disciplined (a disciple literally means a "disciplined one") by the Lord as he is binding the strongman in different areas of my life as I yield to Jesus.As far as frequenting this type of business, I'm not sure what I would do other than to pray. Then I would just do whatever Jesus told me to do, so I'm not quite certain what I would do in this instance.

Dian,Thank you for your insight, not too very long ago I would have enjoyed sparring over such matters. I have found some of your previous posts, reading them in order that I might come to know your positions and heart a little. I see, and sense your desire to live a life of Holiness before Him, without which no man shall ever see God. And so I commend you in this.I have bared my soul already today, in another thread, so endure my ramblings as I bare some more. Sadly for most of my Christian adult life I lived full of pride. Oh my how I had discernment, and loved to chat with others for the need for this Spiritual gift. Problem was, I had discernment that would find and expose everyone else's bad habits, bondages and sins but if any explanation was given at all concerning my own sins I referred to them as little more than shortcomings ect...It took myself being found guilty of gross sin, It took God having a great controversy with me, it took the power of forgiveness and restoration for me to see just how wicked all my pride really was.Awaking out of my slumber I saw afresh Prov 6:16-19 "These six things doth the Lord hate, yea, seven are an abomination unto him. A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, and heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief, a flase witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren."I know the thread concerns smoking in the Ministry, I believe these problems could be rectified if we could take seriously these passages I have quoted in Proverbs. So much would solve itself in some respects if we could find ourselves majoring in the majors.I look forward to future correspondence with you and others,In Christ,tony

Thanks Ed,Yours was the one I was awaiting. Praise God three months! Will take this all to heart brother

We all know in reality that smoking is not good, with health, for kids, even second hand, etc. We also would not be so disrespectful to smoke in a Christian church. Jesus teaches us the body is also a temple, calling His own body a temple, and told people to tear it down and He would rebuild it in 3 days (He did). Smoking ruins any testimony of Holiness, Righteousness, and Goodness, all things of God. It looks like hypocrisy for church people who call themselves christian and smoke cigarettes. Everyone knows cigarettes are very strongly linked with cancer and other horrible diseases, and to just not care about that seems very irresponsible. Loving christians need to be sensitive to their testimony of Christ and to others who may be looking for Christ. You don't know who is watching you as a christian, to see if you have something they don't or if you are just lying about Bible things, all talk and no action. I am an ex-smoker also, everything from tobacco to crack cocaine, I know the fleshly struggle, but God can change this if you ask Him and seek to please Him more than your flesh. Start by confessing your sins, then ask His help, and get yourself out of tempting situations as much as possible.All christians have to fight the flesh and fight this corrupt world, not just smokers. Read testimonies from christians through Voice of the Martyrs, in India christians get kicked out of their house for changing religions, they have no where to live, no food, starving children, and you are spending money to smoke up? Why not sacrifice your cigarette money to give bibles to China? To give tracts to India? Our brothers and sisters in Christ don't have in abundance like we do, help them to grow and evangelize. We need to share our blessings with those with none, and there are those with none if you look. I find in many churches in my neighborhood people making so many excuses to stay sinful rather than pressing in to Holiness and Godly living. That is a sad state of disobedience among people calling themselves God's children. I hope we keep pressing in to change and be more like Christ, and to allow God to sanctify us, make us Holy, because that is His wish according to the bible. To be christlike is to be holy, press in to holiness, because if we know God more, we will be more Holy, because God is holy.Crsschk, your openness is great, I hope you continue to be open, but also open up to God and allow Him to change this bad habit. If you are still smoking, I hope God will help you stop this. I will pray He will help you too, because for some, smoking ruins the Christian testimony, and we, as loving people, need to be concerned about Jesus Christ's testimony. For some things in my life, God has helped take them away from me as I confessed them to other people, either confessing my sins and asking for help and prayer, or by apologizing to those I've wronged. Recently, God has answered my long-requested prayer for me to stop watching gossip shows like Entertainment Tonight. I barely even did it, but I would be drawn in. Humbly, I confessed this to other brothers and sisters, and now I have not even looked at gossip since. I am so thankful! God has helped me not read trash magazines even when they were right in front of me. God has helped take away many sinful habits for me (in good time, but continually am being stripped of worldly things), as you continue in obedience to Jesus Christ's Holy Spirit and confess and forsake sins, He will take your bad habits and give you good ones. We need to fight the evil desires of the flesh.Dear God, please help our brothers and sisters in Christ on sermonindex.net who smoke cigarettes to stop. Please help them confess their sins to you and to whoever you need them to admit, and to ask forgiveness, and to rely on You for deliverance. Please help us to draw closer to You more and more, and please take away our bad habits and give us good ones as we seek to obey and love Truth, Holiness, Righteousness, and Jesus Christ's Holy Spirit. Thank you for answering prayers in accordance with the will of the father in heaven. In Jesus' name I pray, amen.I say give your cigarette money to Voice of the Martyrs, Gospel for Asia, or any brother, sister persecuted, starving, homeless. Give your cigarette money to God, use it for His glory. He can turn that money into evangelism tools if you let Him. I hope you do that. He promises some wonderful things in the New Testament, do your part in obeying Him, and He will help you.

Just a thought, ever noticed that people who know the most aout how a christion should behave are normally those who do'nt go to church but 'tried' it once.The weight of religion can crush the most well meaning soul. :-(

Thanks Jina,That aspect was something I didn't give as much attention to, though I do know it...Had forgotten about the principle of;Rom 14:21 It is good not to eat meat or drink wine or do anything that causes your brother to stumble. Something selfish lurking within if I can't see that. And indeed had very similar thoughts about doing just what you mentioned, VOM is of the rubber meets the road, the likes of which we know next to nothing about. Went to the store earlier tonight and the cost of a carton is over $40.00Thank you, will take this all to heart as well

I recently read an interesting article by Zac Poonen called Two Types of Blessings & Two Types of Curses, where I got this quote from:Just this that when Adam sinned he hurt only himself. But when Cain sinned he hurt another human being as well. There are some sins that we commit that hurt only ourselves. There are other sins that we commit that hurt others as well. God takes more seriously the sins which hurt others. If you smoke or drink or take harmful drugs or indulge in dirty habits or thoughts, or keep bitterness or anger in your heart, etc., you hurt only yourself. But if you gossip, speak evil of others, judge others, lose your temper at others, act in jealousy or bitterness or anger or hatred against others, or commit adultery or murder, etc., you harm those others too. Ask yourself what you are more horrified to hear - that a brother in your church got drunk or that a brother in your church spoke evil of another brother? Your answer to that will show you clearly whether you look at sin the way God looks at sin or not. Personally, I think that the key problem is that christians think that they have "rights". The only right we have, is the right to die the long (as in a whole lifetime) agonising death of the cross. Any moments of relief in this death, are a gift from God, not a right. I say this because I have no issue with anyone who smokes, only with people who excuse or try to hide their smoking. Just as I have no issue with people who lash out when they're hurting, only with those who think that it is acceptable to do so.Most people who smoke, aren't okay with it (I know I never was), and how many times do you here people say "If only I could give these things up." Smoking is addictive, it's real hard to quit, and anyone who says otherwise is taking the grace of God for granted. The only true way to quit, is to do it out of purpose, and not out of guilt. Don't stop smoking, become a 'non-smoker', and where your badge with pride. Otherwise, you'll spend the rest of your life yearning for the "comforts of Egypt".And for all those who bring the whole "you're the temple of the Holy Spirit", what about fornicating in the "holy place" of your mind? Which do you think is worse?Anyway, that's my two cents.:-)BTW - In case you're wondering I don't smoke. If you do, I wish you well in the battle you're facing.

Here's a true story. I friend of mine worked in an office and quietly lived God's life there. A teenage girl saw it and began to ask questions. Soon the teenage girl came to personal faith in Christ and began to walk as God taught her. Lots of things 'dropped off' but smoking persisted.One day the teenager said "I am going to pray about smoking". My friend was thrilled. The next day the teenager came back and said "I prayed, and feel it's alright to carry on smoking".what would you have done?My friend determined to say nothing but to pray for the teenager. Some days later the teenager said "I've been praying about smoking and feel God is telling me to stop." She ceased from that moment.What is the greatest moral in this story? That a teenager stopped smoking? Not at all, the greatest moral is that because an older Christian was prepared to wait God's time, a teenager learned to hear the voice of God.When God says 'quit' anything... you can and you must.

I told Dad no it wasn't my will power, it was the power of Jesus' blood over sin. He broke it. I couldn't do it. Victory over sin is not about trying harder because that's a flesh deal but it's submitting to Jesus and believing in faith in the power of His blood.I'm sorry ya'll. Please forgive me. I never mean to say that I think we can quit in and of ourselves. I never meant to hurt anyone by a religious demand. If you read my own testimony,found in the testimony thread, you will know that I don't believe we can do anything to make ourselves other than to cry out to God and maybe we can't even do that until he gives us the grace to do so. I will be praying for these folks, and for you Mikey. Ya'll don't be mad at me. I have the calling of a prophet, so I see everything in black and white. I'm just as brutal with myself. I just learned a new song by Julie Miller, Broken Things. Here are the words:You can have my heart, though it isn't new.It's been used and broken and only comes in blue.It's been down a long road and it got dirty on the wayIf I give it to you will you make it clean and wash the shame away(Chorus)You can have my heart, if you don't mind broken thingsYou can have my life, if you don't mind these tearsWell, I heard that you make old things newSo I give these pieces all to you.If you want it you can have my heart.So beyond repair, nothing I could do.Tried to fix it myself but it was only worse when I got through.But you walked right into my darkness and you speak words so sweetAnd you hold me like a child till my frozen tears fall at your feetRepeat ChorusI love that line, Tried to fix it myself but it was only worse when I got through. I've lived that. Love you all. Dian.

If we are going to be talking about idols or strongholds here then I would like to add my 2 cents :-) Actually this is what the Lord showed me about 3 years ago and also very recently.Adultery is having "another love". A stronghold, an idol, there are many things we can call it.The point is this: are we willing to lay it down forever? if we are not, then .....If the Lord asks us to give it up, can we, will we?If we won't or can't then our heart is divided.The Lord showed me once again this past week that He does not want us to have other loves. We cannot have Him and other loves too.What ever need that smoking is meeting in a person- the Lord wants to meet that need. He wants to be the one you turn to for relief and for comfort.What things or attitudes or behaviors have power over us? Those are idols or strongholds.I see this in my own life so clearly. I have had many idols and strongholds. Fitness, food, diet pills (otc), my body image. The Lord showed me these things 3 yrs ago, but it has taken along time to weed them out.Even lately He showed me that fitness was still my "other love". I had given it up completely a while back. But then when i thought I had control over it, I picked it back up because i thought i could handle it. It made me feel better and it was hard to stop everything 'fitness' in my life. I am associated with it. People know me for it. I saw over the last few months how I struggled with laying it down for good. I could think of tons of reason why I didn't need to lay it down. But just because I was unwilling to do so- God did not like that.So, He had to show me how He felt when we give ourselves to other loves. He is hurt. He wants to be the only source of our satisfaction, our comfort and our relief. He is to be our ALL.I saw how awful my heart was inside when I had been holding out on Him. I know He still loved me and was longing for me to reconcile myself to Him. He is jealous for us.We have to give up the right (as someone else already said) to do what we want. If we say we want to surrender all to Him, then all is everything. When the Lord showed me my heart idols and strongholds about 3 years ago, I layed them down as best as I knew how at the time. So right away I went about preaching a message of "getting rid of your idols". Yet, I didn't know at the time, that I had not clearly been delivered yet and was to even pick them back up and struggle with them later. I hate hypocrisy and I know the Lord hates hypocrisy and so I knew that the Lord would be strict with me. I could never give a message that I have not lived yet :-) So I see that i have to be very careful about pointing sin out to to other people. Like Tony, my gift is in discernment, and it is so easy to see other's sins. Yet, now I am learning to pray about them, and also look at my own self first and say, ok, where are you guilty? Do i have unforgivenness? do I have bitterness? am i holding back on God is some area. am I holding out on someone I am supposed to love?It is so hard when you have that prophetic calling. You want to be a trumpet blowing for God, yet we have to "live" our messages first. I really believe that the ultimate prophet we need to look at as an example is Jesus. He was the ultimate example for us. Until we become like Him, how can we say "repent!". Boy, this is hard.I have tried to type this post a few different times but still the message is so "not together" yet.We are all learning.These are mostly just thoughts right about now. :-) In His love, Chanin

The only true way to quit, is to do it out of purpose, and not out of guilt.When God says 'quit' anything... you can and you must.I can confirm these truths, and I can deny them. Let me explain. Just a few weeks after I was born-again I met my Pastor in a Christian bookstore. I introdcued myself and shook his hand, he was polite but left rather abruptly. I had just smoked a cigarette before coming in and immediately when he left I sensed that it had something to do with the smell of smoke on me (I later learned that he indeed has a strong aversion to the smell of cigarettes). Immediately I felt that my smoking was a bad testimony, something I hadn't really thought of in the few wonderful weeks since becoming a Christian. It wasn't so much a feeling of guilt as it was a sense that this was hindering my newfound purpose in life, to be a witness for Jesus Christ. I think it was the first thing in my life, following my conversion, that the Lord put His finger on and said, "this must go". But the way it was done was not in condemnation. It's difficult to explain but as Philo said, when God says "quit" you can and must. He provided the strength I needed to overcome. I walked out of that bookstore and tossed the packof cigarettes I had in the trash and have not touched one since, that was 3 1/2 years ago, praise God! Some can quit in their own strength, but I never would have outside of Christ. I won't say it was easy, I was physically sick for several days as my body screamed out for the nictone I had been feeding it for over 20 years. But the lord strengthened me through it and the thought of just wanting to please Him gave me hope. After just a week I wasn't even thinking about smoking anymore. Every once in a while the urge still pops into my head, kind of a reminder of the addiction that once held me, but it is rare. The Lord has given me great grace and delivered me from this addiction, I give Him the glory and I know that if He wanted me to remember what addiction was like I could just as easily fall right back into smoking. What's odd though is that having overcome that powerful addiction, I struggle to overcome overeating. I'm about 25 pounds overweight, a 25 pounds that I've been trying to lose for a while now. Not sure how the whole purpose vs. guilt thing applies here though, I do feel that being overweight is also a hinderance to my testimony but obviously not so great a hinderance as smoking, not sure why. I guess victory comes more or less easily in different areas for each of us, all I know is that our struggles with the flesh won't end this side of heaven. But I know Him who saves from the lusts of the flesh, and sin, and death, and hell, and Satan. In Him will I trust.In Christ,Ron

True Chanin,We surrender to the strongman when we seek comfort from that particular thing (or attitude) rather Jesus himself. (Our God is a jealous God.) There can be many areas and the Lord is specifically disciplining me in many of these areas now.Once the Lord delivers us from this as we submit and believe for him to deliver us, the strongman is bound from harming us in this way as long as we abide in Jesus. We abide in Jesus by doing what he says and as we obey Him, the strongman is bound.I can testify that the blood of Jesus can break the bondage of any sin because he has delivered me. I'm learning to abide in Jesus in specific ways and as he is teaching me to do that, than the strongman is bound and the fruit of the Spirit floods my soul (as I submit).The Lord is working in me on a lot of the heart issues (i.e. the internal things that are just as deadly as those things we can see with our eyes). Learning to be a "disciplined one" (i.e. a disciple) is most times a rather humbling experience.

the internal things that are just as deadly as those things we can see with our eyesAmen, Ed! I am also dealing with this as well. I think the internal, hidden hearts sins are much worse and harder to get rid of. Yet the Lord is so good to us to strip them away a little at a time. I am so grateful that He puts up with my "junk" for as long as He does. It must hurt Him terribly.It just shows me how awful I really am and how in need of a savior I am- all the time!In Him, Chanin

Wow folks!This is rich!Too much to take in so briefly, but indeed these jumped up and grabbed me;And for all those who bring the whole "you're the temple of the Holy Spirit", what about fornicating in the "holy place" of your mind? Which do you think is worse?Have had similar musings about how that gets bandied about in certain circles, but that cuts to the heart brother, well said and amen!My friend determined to say nothing but to pray for the teenager. Some days later the teenager said "I've been praying about smoking and feel God is telling me to stop." She ceased from that moment.Not to distract anything here, but this applies broadly as I am beginning to find out more and more, especially when a knee-jerk reaction is ready to launch... the tongue is a...What is the greatest moral in this story? That a teenager stopped smoking? Not at all, the greatest moral is that because an older Christian was prepared to wait God's time, a teenager learned to hear the voice of God.That this truth would be dwelt on and applied.SelahWhen God says 'quit' anything... you can and you must.Tis true...And that cuts as well...I thank you for it.Pray that this stubbornness will dieI can feel my flesh sniveling already.

Hi all,Some great stuff here. Can see that much of this pertains to myself on other habits/sins that are binding, entangling. I think we all deal with something along these lines at one time or other.It reminds me of a friend I had, that I had recently led to Christ. To my horror, I found out a few weeks later that she was still going out and clubbing and partying, but now with her "Christian" roommate. My first instinct was to tell her to stop immediately, but as I opened my mouth, I felt God stop me. It was like He put His hand over my mouth and said, "She loves me very much--just wait and let Me take care of it." And He did. Less than a week later, she came to me, confessing that God had showed her that HE disappoved of her behavior, and she had stopped it out of love for HIM.I am not saying that this is the case for everything. Lord knows there is a time and a place for speaking out, but, especially when it pertains to private sin (that which harms ourselves and not others) I think we need to be very, very careful and examine the sin in our own hearts.I have always been grateful that our church has been accepting of people who are not perfect. Every Sunday, we have people smoking outside the front door, putting out their cigarettes, and then going in to church. A seeming contradiction? I think not. Rather, a message, loud and clear that you do not have to be perfect to go to church--"Come just as you are". I think that is why our church is chock full of people that have been delivered from all sorts of things (drugs, alcohol, etc.). As far as I know, no one ever says anything to those who smoke. God sees us all. The secret sin that I walk in with that is less obvious to the eye is probably far worse than the more obvious smoker that I walk past at the front door. God is good to all of us, though. Many of the smokers get convicted and delivered and move on to be a quiet witness to the newer believers smoking outside the door. These men and women are a testimony to all of us that God takes us as we are and uses us, and in His own time He WILL deal with us and deliver us when we could not do it for ourselves.Crsschk, thanks for sharing. Be open to God's conviction, but don't let other Christians do the convicting for you. That is useless in overcoming addictions. It must be God and not yourself. I'm sure you know that already.Love you guys,Phebe

private sin (that which harms ourselves and not others)There is no such thing. Especially if I am a Christian, part of the body of Christ, nothing I do only effects me. If one member suffers, all members suffer with it.

Okay, I understand what you mean. Obviously, you didn't understand what I mean. I agree with you. Of course, if my habitual sin is keeping me in any way from Christ in any way then everyone else is effected because I am not allowing God to work through me towards others in the way that He desires to.However, what I meant was this: For example, recently at our church there was a situation with a guy and his girlfriend that were both in the ministry. They started having sexual relations and a pregnancy and abortion ensued. They confessed and were put out on discipline, counseled, and restored. The situation repeated itself, however. To make a long story short, after pursuing the Biblical model of discipline in the church to no avail, they were expelled. Now, there is definitely a difference between that and someone who smokes. Does God want us to stand up and speak against fornication in the church? Of course! Does He want us to stand up and condemn smoking as well? Probably not, or at least certainly not in every circumstance. I don't know the word for it, but there is definitely a difference. Fornication is something that you do to yourself and to another person and is likely to "spread around". Smoking (overeating, etc.) is something I am doing to myself. Now, of course these distinctions are not exact. For example, if I am an alcoholic, then I am destroying myself and probably my family as well. Smoking and certain other habits, however, while being wrong, are not mind-altering, and not having an immediate spiritually detrimental effect. I am not saying that we should never speak up on these things. What I am saying, though, is that we should be very careful to speak only as definitely directed by God if at all. Afterall, we are not confronting the offender to keep someone else out of harm's way. Why are we then? For our own pride, or to make ourselves appear more righteous? We just must be very careful and very aware of the sins in our own hearts that are so much less obvious to others.Phebe

Phebebird, you mention some good points. Our own prayer and obedience to Jesus Christ must also be first and done, and we prayerfully talk to each other. We do need patience and wisdom in all things. We also must seek to obey the first and greatest commandment, love God wholeheartedly. God knows who is pretending better than we, and He will sort all things out on judgment day. We don't have to rebuke every little thing, but we do have to prayerfully rebuke some times.Yes, there are sins, and part of christianity is actually teaching what is sin. John the Baptist was not imprisoned for saying "Repent the kingdom of God is at hand" He was imprisoned for telling the king his marriage was not right before God. Jesus was not killed for the sermon on the mount, He was killed for rightly calling the church leaders "hypocrites" Jesus says they hate Him because He points out their deeds are evil. When we know we are doing evil deeds, we must stop, repent, seek forgiveness and restoration and move along. Not defend the sin. Hate the sin, love the sinner.simply put, smoking in the temple of God, is sin. A nonchristian can smoke, they have bigger problems than smoking. They need to repent of ignoring God. The greatest commandment is to love the Creator. The bible says we all have sinned against God in this way, no one seeks after God. Seek restoration with the Creator through Jesus Christ, our sin offering, and yes, Jesus can help us break away from other sinful habits in good time. But after we become christians, we need to be moving toward God and away from sins, more and more. And it is right for christians to say "hey, dear brother, this thing is not good for you, let's pray and be encouraged to stop this. This doesn't please God." Jesus' words in Matthew 18:15 tells us to do so. We can speak against sin in love, and still love the sinner. It is just so often the sinner feels attacked and wants to fight against conscience and blames the other of being judgmental. That is not the fault of the brother obeying Matthew 18:15, it is the sinner fighting against Truth. We all need patience with each other in such things, though. Following Jesus is not easy for anyone, if it is, they must be new, seek to obey Matthew 18:15, and persecutions will come.But suffering and hardship in Christ is healthy, it leads to hope. "Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have gained access by faith into this grace in which we now stand. And we rejoice in the hope of the glory of God. Not only so, but we also rejoice in our sufferings, because we know that suffering produces perserverance; perserverance, character; and character, hope. And hope does not disappoint us, because God has poured out his love into our hearts by the Holy Spirit, whom he has given us." Ro 5:1-4Christians hate sin, love the sinner, just like God through our Lord Jesus Christ. But there is a day when His patience will finish and He will avenge His enemies. That is the Lord's work in His time. Love God wholeheartedly, the greatest commandment.

true indeed...wonder how many people read that...

Krispy,What you said was what I was exactly what I was saying. I hope you didn't think I was saying that smokers should be expelled or that moral sins were the same as something like smoking. I was saying exactly the opposite. I was giving an example to show that the two were different and that smoking, overeating, etc were different from sins that directly effect others (moral sins). Anyway, from your post it sounded as if you thought I was saying that the two were the same. Please know that I was not. I was replying to the post prior to mine. Read it if you get a chance.Phebe

that I don't believe we can do anything to make ourselves other than to cry out to God and maybe we can't even do that until he gives us the grace to do so.I see everything in black and white. I'm just as brutal with myselfDian, I can relate so well with your second comment and I lived/live the first.I smoked from ages 15-28---two packs a day. Before salvation I was quite the party girl----being in the military didn't help that either. Anyways, when I became born again, I had so much that needed to be purged from my life. The first to go was my Trucker mouth. The next was drinking..........first quantity, then to none at all (no condemnation to those who still drink in moderation----"I" just couldn't do it anymore.)......Then when I was pregnant with twins (didn't know it yet), I cried out to the Lord and asked Him to deliver me from this nicotine I could never quit before. I felt something "leave" me. It was the scariest/strangest experience, but then I NEVER went through withdrawl. It was all God, no Cindy----except I believe the Lord placed in me this aversion to smoking and I called out to Him for mercy and help.What I do know is the Christian walk is a process----a process of allowing the LORD to bring us to repentance of those fleshly things we are held in bondage to. He then "delivers" us----sometimes in very different ways. Some ways are seemingly easy, some we agonize through. I don't know how I feel about leaders in churches smoking. I suppose it certainly does show forth outwardly the overcomer's life, yet as many have already said, there are many "hidden" sins that we are held in bondage to that others never see....Even so, as we are made aware of those bondage issues, I believe it is up to us to "press in" and allow the Lord to do a work of conforming us....never excusing our bondages, always believing that ultimately bondages need to be loosed, not retained.........Blessings in Jesus, Cindy :-)

lastblast wrote:Then when I was pregnant with twins (didn't know it yet), I cried out to the Lord and asked Him to deliver me from this nicotine I could never quit before. I felt something "leave" me. It was the scariest/strangest experience, but then I NEVER went through withdrawl. It was all God, no Cindy----except I believe the Lord placed in me this aversion to smoking and I called out to Him for mercy and help.Just to explain something that I put in my last post, I'll repeat that I am a reformed smoker and so is my wife. Myself, I gave myself a week to quit, and God delivered me the next day, with no withdrawals. That was 10 year ago, and still no probs. My wife on the other hand, took a good couple of years until she stopped liking the smell of cigarette smoke. Now (8 years later) she wants to vommit when she smells it.I have spent my christian life "flip-flopping" between statements like, "Oh it's okay, just wait until the Holy Spirit convicts you", and "Don't you know that it's getting between you and God". My first statment has lead many into further bondage to this filthy habit, while to second has caused many to look down on smokers, themselves included many times. The issue raised here (by myself included) has seemed to have been "Forget about smoking, what about 'XYZ', why do we ignore that." While that is true, that doesn't take away the fact that smoking is a dirty habit. It is a violation of logic and nature. In the twentieth century, we say "ohh, poor little smokers", while Finney openly condemned it (even if only on the issue of poor stewardship of God's funds).I see everything in black and white. I'm just as brutal with myselfWe keep trying to reduce morality into "this isn't quite as bad as that", rather than saying "It's all sin!!!" I was just discussing with a friend how the world accuses christians of looking at the world in "black and white", where I believe that it's more like a precise shade of grey (#888888 in hexadecimal RGB:-)). Extremes are for the world, ours is the "straight and narrow path". Let's leave black and white to the Epicurians and the Stoics. Please take what I am saying in it's heart, as I am not trying to take away from my earlier post, that smoking is "real hard" to give up. God may help us, or He may leave us with our own "self control" alone. At the end of the day, it's none of our business, ours to only to trust and obey, and what is trust without the possibility of failure?Would I give this advice to everybody that I encounter that smoke? Of course not. I'd be more inclined to follow Bro Ron's earlier advise of using prudence in the given situation. Here on the other hand is a situation of the issue of "Leadership Smoking" being raised by people with discernment (well most of us anyway). I'm trusting that the people reading this are mature enough to prayerfully consider these words, rather than acting conpulsively on the matter, with "worldy wisdom".Personally, I have no real issue with "leadership" smoking. Let's face it, so many "leaders" are appointed by man ahead of their time, and as a result are not true leaders at all. Does that mean that we don't submit to them? Of course not, as all leadership is appointed by God (Godly, or ungodly). Do I have an issue with a true "elder/deacon" who smokes? Well, let's just say that I think that that is an oxymoronic statement.All I can say is, good luck to all in this battle.

Sexual sins are a direct violation of the 10 commandments... a moral law. Smoking does not.I've meditated on this statement all evening, and I have decided that I totally disagree. Smoking is idolatry and in direct violation of the first commandment, Thou shall have no other gods before me. Someone said that smoking isn't hurting anyone but themselves. I disagree with that also. It teaches others that compromise is acceptable.Why do I believe that smoking is idolatry? Because every god other than our God is a taskmaster whose sole motivation is for it's own purpose of which it forces it's servants through brute force, to obey. It does not control through love, but rather it's demand for worship is punishment. It's subjects are harshly treated slaves and their reward is death. Romans 6:16 says, "Know ye not, that to whom ye yeild yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?"Romans 6:17-18, "But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you. Being then made free from sin, ye became servants of righteousness.I am, at this point, only trying to get people to see that smoking is a serious sin. It isn't just a nasty habit. It's a violation of the first commandment. I know that everyone's argument is, "Well, what about your sins of the heart?" That is a sin of the heart of the worst kind. To me, all the bucking and rebuttal is the evidence in and of itself. This is huge to God. That's my opinion, and I believe it's how God sees it, too. Sincerely, Dian.P.S. That's all I have to say about that. :-D

I have spent my christian life "flip-flopping" between statements like, "Oh it's okay, just wait until the Holy Spirit convicts you", and "Don't you know that it's getting between you and God". My first statment has lead many into further bondage to this filthy habit, while to second has caused many to look down on smokers, themselves included many times. The issue raised here (by myself included) has seemed to have been "Forget about smoking, what about 'XYZ', why do we ignore that." While that is true, that doesn't take away the fact that smoking is a dirty habit. It is a violation of logic and nature. In the twentieth century, we say "ohh, poor little smokers", while Finney openly condemned it (even if only on the issue of poor stewardship of God's funds).Thanks Aaron,AndThanks Dian, still don't see it the same way personally as 'idolatry' and without trying to squirm out from underneath that what I mean is that it still seems sideways, but that is likely just some malfunction of the brain cells.Here is what I am getting at and will use Aaron's words here;" It is a violation of logic and nature. "Or in layman's terms.... Stupidity!How can anyone in their right mind defend something so unnatural that you have to 'learn' how to force the natural rejection of your body to the invasion of something so foreign to it? At the start it's like trying to eat while you are throwing up. Crass, but true. So there is no defending it, don't think I would recommend bashing ones head against a wall repeatedly either.I guess what I want to say is that if it were possible maybe it is worse than idolatry in the sense that if the Lord is requiring it from me and I say, 'no'... and that is where everything else comes into play. It is not and 'either/or' construct when we bring in 'other' "what about this and what about that's". As Aaron stated it is all SIN! Worth repeating;Jam 4:17 Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin. Not interested in a bob and weave around the issue. It is plain enough and not sure it is necessary to judge nor compromise, nor coddle the 'poor little smokers' (I do like that brother!) As it relates to the first fruits of this post and the question asked it seems plain enough to heed the Lords words first;Luk 11:39 And the Lord said unto him, Now do ye Pharisees make clean the outside of the cup and the platter; but your inward part is full of ravening and wickedness. Mat 23:26 You blind Pharisee! First clean the inside of the cup, so that its outside may also be clean. In all things shouldn't we apply the right criteria? Guess that's all I am saying in regards to idolatry and how it applies here.So this thread has taken on two primary faces, one in regards to what might be expected of those who's hearts need a thorough thrashing, is that not what really happens when we get exposed to The Light? Recall it made one man blind for a number of days.... Cleaning a cup without any scrubbing seems to be what we can often give out as the 'Gospel' anymore, so to wipe off the coffee stains first (ie. 'the smokers'/unbelievers/ babes, etc.) and then set them back on a shelf until someone comes along latter only to find the inside is growing mold....The other angle is to those like yours truly, the site jester here, who know better. I cannot give you one good reason for continuing to do this.And I am also painfully aware that and also a bit perturbed about the way this gets bandied about as well... That we can often say it hurts 'our' testimony or 'my' testimony. It's not 'my' testimony, it's His testimony.If I could get that through my thick skull into my heart...Somebody nail me to the cross.Please.

Somebody nail me to the cross. PleaseSorry can't help, but then neither can anyone else......but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. (Rom 8:13b KJV)It's another one of those very private verses. Only room for two people in it! :-D

To me, all the bucking and rebuttal is the evidence in and of itself. This is huge to God. That's my opinion, and I believe it's how God sees it, too. Yes, you may be entirely right Dian. I think most of us agree that smoking is sin---KNOWINGLY allowing poisons/toxins into your body----the end result being some form of harm to your body---whether lungs, esophagus or mouth/tongue. Nicotine and all the tars in smoking products are not healthy----period.However, with all "sin" issues, there is differing approaches/applications. All this topic is doing for me, is revealing the level of hypocrisy in me and in others. Some sins, we excuse away---thinking we will discuss the evils, yet let the Holy Spirit be the Holy Spirit. Concerning other sins (usually our "pet" issues) we come out strong against those. Myself, I am nothing but a mass of hypocrisy. I personally wish I could be consistant in my application (not view, because I do view sin as sin). We are called to depart from sin. This is a fact. The hard part of walking with Christ is----to call sin what it is and to season it with Grace and mercy...........Just my thoughts. Blessings in Him,Cindy

Somebody nail me to the cross.Dear Mike. About maybe 20 years ago, a man came to the church I attended and he preached a message that I have never forgotten entitled, Truth Is Never On Sale. The jist of the message was this: God doesn't have a bargain basement. You will never get anything from God at a discount. It's going to cost you the same price everyone else pays. That's top dollar. That's your life.I tell you, I spent years trying to "deal" with God. I had a dream, also about 20 years ago. I dreamed that I had been condemned to die. Both my pastor and my husband confirmed it. I was supposed to get in this shower stall which had a button installed on the wall. I was supposed to get myself soaking wet and then touch my finger to the button and it was supposed to electrocute me. Finally, I got in the shower. I was crying and wailing. I got wet and touched the button, and all it did was shock the ^&*% out of me. I went to my pastor and told him what happened. He said, "well, just get back in there and keep doing it till you're dead." That was the end of the dream.Moral, as I see it: You can't nail yourself to the cross, you can only submit yourself to God. If you keep trying to do it, all you will do is make yourself miserable and you still won't accomplish the task.Just a few days ago, God spoke to my heart and said, "Your first marriage ended because you wouldn't follow me to the cemetary. If this one ends, it will be because you did."That's all I need to know. Love you. Dian.

Dian, I am so glad you told us about this dream! I had a dream last year that three tidal waves came crashing down on me, one at a time. I looked up and behind me to see this big wave and knew I was to hold my breath and swim for the top. I did this each time, yet the third time, I couldn't make it back up to the top. I was under the water just thinking, "is this what it's like to be dead?"I have been fearful because I didn't know if this meant death to self or really my death. If it is really the death of "self" then I see that after two times of trying to swim up to the top on my own (in my own strength) that the third time I don't make it. I am thinking that these tidal waves are trials- which I am very familiar with by now. I don't know what number i'm on now, but i think I still have the third to go. Oh, help me Lord!In Him, Chanin

How many overweight pastors do you know? I dont see them getting expelled.Surely you dont think everyone that is "overweight" is a glutton do you?

Surely you dont think everyone that is "overweight" is a glutton do you?Josh,And in the same fashion, not everyone who has an unhealthy diet is overweight. I brought up this angle, our diet in an earlier post, and it was largely ignored. Maybe it would better fit another thread? But my purpose was/is that we might be as consistent and balanced as is possible with all that we label as SIN.According to the reasons given, that smoking is a sin because it is unhealthy, then I suggest we be consistent and apply this reasoning to other areas as well, such as diet.And if we are to argue that smoking is a bad testimony, would it be permissable for a saint to sneak out to the woods, to partake in private, so as not to be seen of other's?Have I made any sense whatsoever?And no, I do not use tobacco.God Bless,tony

I'm not going to get into this too much because I could go really deep. I have had problems with food and my weight- even though I was a personal fitness trainer. Actually this is why I became one so i would control my body better. This is not the answer either. You can't substitute exercise for not eating in moderation.Anyway, we have fleshly appetites- whether it be food, sex, drinking, etc... If we do not have these appetites under control- or under Holy Ghost control- then they are sin.Gluttony is most certainly a sin. It is mentioned quite a few times in the bible. If you have ever had a problem with your weight you will know that it can be an addiction and a source of bondage.Even if we are not in bondage to food, we are to show temperance in this area. I want to show others that Christ has control of my appetites, not me. And yes, it is hard. I know many, many people who are miserable because they can't get a handle on their food intake. They know they don't need any more- yet eat it anyway. They know it is not healthy for their bodies ( a gift from the Lord) yet cannot help themselves. I am at a normal weight- yet I stilll struggle with being obedient in this area. I want it for comfort and to make me forget my pain or my boredom or whatever- instead of taking it to God right away.Watchman Nee had an excellent writing on it. I can't rememeber what it was under, but it was about christians being able to have their bodies under submission. That things like sleep and food and comfort, should not rule us, but us them. That they are ok and healthy, but we have to be able to go without them too. Only those who are overweight know in their hearts if they have a problem with controling their eating habits. Whatever we eat or drink, or whatever we do- do all the glory of God.In Him, Chanin

Sorry...been following this since it's inception and thought I would throw in my piece.I had smoked for 13-14 years. I knew it wasn't pleasing to the Lord. One day I felt like the Lord turned to me, said, "You stay right here. If you want to continue to walk with me and grow in your relationship and knowing Me, then let me know when you quit. But until then you're not growing a bit. You won't move from this place. But I'm going on."That freaked me out and it made such an impact on me that I tend to look at that place as a beginning point (one of many) for the rest of where the Lord was taking me then and what He was preparing me for today.It's been 9 years almost. Praise the Lord.Blessings

I had smoked for 13-14 years. I knew it wasn't pleasing to the Lord. One day I felt like the Lord turned to me, said, "You stay right here. If you want to continue to walk with me and grow in your relationship and knowing Me, then let me know when you quit. But until then you're not growing a bit. You won't move from this place. But I'm going on."Josh, I'm so glad you said this. This is what I have said on many occasions. People are thinking it's not a big deal. It is so huge to God. I think smoking has become one of satan's most successful 'pulling of the wool over the eyes of people'. It will absolutely stop you from entering into the stable of God. I don't know how else to put it. My husband, who isn't a believer, just quit smoking about 5 months ago. I have spent hours upon hours in prayer for him. Someday I'm going to testify of how God taught me to pray. Anyway, I can actually 'see' with my own two eyes that he has broken loose from a tether in the spirit.I'm telling you all, it's a tether. It must be broken in order to move very far at all.Mike, I totally believe that you will be like a rock thrown from God's slingshot when you break free, Brother. You may not even have to build houses for a living anymore. Don't forget us when you become a bigshot, ok? Thanks Josh. I feel the same way about my own life since I quit smoking. Love, Dian.