Are the "Gifts of Healings" for today??

Are the gifts of healings for today? It is a gift i really desire more than any other and have prayed for but have not received. I don't understand what good it does for me to have a heart of compassion and mercy when i am powerless to help any of the suffering people around me. There are so many people suffering so greatly. Such extreme suffering.
Has anyone here ever seen any evidence that this gift is still for today? And/or could it be that if a person has even an OUNCE of pride that God will not give them certain gifts because it would go to their head? Although if that is the case, what explains the preponderance of tongues, though it is the least of all the gifts? Thank you for your consideration and thoughtful comments on this matter.

Trekker: In short, yes. All nine gifts of the Spirit listed in 1 Cor. are for today. I have seen most of the nine gifts in operation. There are a couple of truths about the gifts of the Spirit that I think it is important to note.

The gifts are given "severally as He wills". I do not believe that a gift of the spirit is anything at all like a "gifting" that a person has resident in his person. I may have a gift for music and can play music well. That gift is resident in me. I do not believe the gifts of the Spirit are the same. God may at some point us me in the gift of prophecy. That does not mean I am a prophet or that I can prophecy all of the time. I have been used in the gift of the word of knowledge. It was a blessing and strength to the person who I ministered to. But I do not walk around having "words of knowledge" all of the time for the gift is not resident in me. However the Holy Spirit is resident in me and He can use me in any of the gifts as He wills to minister to others.

The gifts are used out of the compassion and love of God. Of this I think you have an understanding. We are told to covet earnestly the best gifts, but then we are told immediately the proper motive behind that strong desire to be used in the gifts of the Spirit.

I personally believe that one must have received the baptism of the Holy Spirit before they are used in the gifts. The gifts are supernatural. They are not operations of our own mind, will, and emotions. It was the Acts 2 experience that filled the church with supernatural power. Before that time they had operated supernaturally as Jesus had empowered them to do so, but in a very limited manner. But when they had received power after that the Holy Ghost was come upon them they began to walk routinely in the gifts of the Spirit.

Hope that helps.

According to Hebrews Jesus Christ is the same yesterday today and forever.

According to the 4 gospels, He healed ALL who came or were brought to Him. He was hindered by the UNBELIEF in one account where He only healed a few "sick folk".

We should base our belief system on the Word, not our experience.

Go for healing all the time every time and do not give up!\\

Russell

KK wrote:
People make these claims... that God wants to heal every disease and illness (as long as we have enough faith, thats the escape hatch for when it doesnt happen!)... but they dont think through what they are saying.

I also believe that the sick rarely have faith (now wait...) I say that because they are so sick. I don’t believe that it’s necessarily the sick person’s fault for not being healed. I think of the sick friend in the Bible, his friends had faith FOR HIM. And Christ healed him because of THEIR faith.

I don't understand all the details of what goes into being healed but I know even if I have the gift of healing, I am NOT the one doing the healing, God is. That is why I would never attempt to go through the hospital laying hands of everyone praying for their healing; this is where people get messed up... healing is a gift but God is definitely the healer.

I also think that sickness goes much deeper than just a cancer cell or an infection and that we must be careful what we say to the sick and discouraging them. And it's up to us, who are healthy, who must seek God’s will for those when they can’t for themselves.

God bless,
Lisa

I can understand where you are freind. Is the gift of healing still for today? The gift of healing is a spiritual gift that God gives to whomever he wants. This doesn't mean that this gift is going to be prominate in their ministry all the time. The next time they minister they might have another gift instead of healing.

I believe your real question may be falling under the heading of can I receive healing from God? Then I will tell you that yes healing is for you, here's why.

God never changes. He is the same yesterday, today and forever. His word will never change, "Heaven and Earth shall pass away, but Gods word will never pass away".

By who's stripes were you made whole? Jesus's stripes.

(qoute): "It is a gift (I) really desire more than any other and have prayed for but have not received. I don't understand what good it does for (ME) to have a heart of compassion and mercy when (I Am) powerless to help any of the suffering people around me.(/qoute)

When I re-read this again, the Holy Spirit pointed this out to me, re-read what you wrote above. Do you see the (eyes.. I)It is a gift that you desire why?
Whhether God ever gives you a spiritual gift or not you should always have a heart of compassion and mercy.

If I were you I would seek love. Love is the driving power of all the gifts. You can't love with out Christ in you.

i wonder if the gifts are as you mentiond not something that can be done all the time as you say with the gifts of healing

why is it most toung talkers practice the gift of praying in toungs whenver they will and recieve the edafication accoringly ,,but it is not the same for healing you say

is that a contradiction ,,in the way gifts operate

i believe in the gift of prophecy ,to proclaim gods word to a body of believers , even to predict future events for edafiction ,,,and if a prophert is mature and right in the site of god ,he will operate with this gift verry regular even daily or weekly ,,does not the gifts of healing operate like this as well in certaint gifted healers

and im not talking about beni hinn,,

Brother,

I have personally witnessed healings and have been healed myself. There are many fine Christians that are going home prematurely as a result of sickness and disease. If we know that it is God's will to heal, and there are many scriptures that support this belief, then we can pray in confidence to God, knowing that if we ask anything that is according to His will that He hears us. Faith is not some magic formula. It is not mind over matter. It is just taking God at His Word.

Since God's will is to heal the sick because Jesus did only what He saw His Father do, and a great part of our Lord's ministry was healing and deliverance, then we have to ask the question: why are we not seeing more healings today when it is desperately needed? The problem is not with God but it is with us.

If we had to be perfect before God gave us a spiritual gift, then His grace would be based on our performance and not on the finished work of Christ. The Spirit of God disepenses the gifts as He sees fit, but the Word does say that we should desire spiritual gifts. Yet healing is not only a gift but is a privledge for every believer to participate in, because the Word says that "believers shall lay hands on the sick and they shall recover." This is not some special class of Christian but is available for all believers. If we would have more child like faith then I beleive that we would see more healings.

Mike

QUOTE: " because the Word says that "believers shall lay hands on the sick and they shall recover.""==ABIDEINHIM

And yet no one was able to lay hands on Paul and heal him of his thorn in the flesh, and Paul also had to leave Trophimus sick at Miletum. (II Timothy 4:20), unable to heal him.

Thankyou for many thought-provoking and interesting comments on here.

QUOTE: "I personally believe that one must have received the baptism of the Holy Spirit before they are used in the gifts."==TWAYNEB

You have not explained what you mean by this statement. Am i right in assuming you mean an EXTRA filling of the Holy Ghost, aside from just what we receive at the moment of salvation? A special, greater filling which equips a person for MINISTRY? And does this happen only when i am perfect enough to be used in ministry or only when i have enough faith for God to trust me, or ?? Someone made the comment that we don't receive the gifts based on our performance, yet most Christians can't even get prayers answered precisely because of their sin (aka performance). So i think performance DOES enter into it; i highly doubt God is going to give the gift of prophecy to a Believer who suffers greatly from the sin of pride or some other besetting sin, for example. Can you just imagine what someone beset with pride would do with the gift of prophecy, or healing, or miracles? And i've seen a lot of pride in the church, including pastors. I think pride is ALWAYS near, trying to trip us.

"And yet no one was able to lay hands on Paul and heal him of his thorn in the flesh, and Paul also had to leave Trophimus sick at Miletum. (II Timothy 4:20), unable to heal him."

Brother,

How are you sure that Paul's thorn in the flesh was a sickness or disease? The Word of God says that this thorn in the flesh was a messenger of Satan to buffet him because of the many revelations that he had received to keep him from being exalted but always looking to the Lord to receive His grace to overcome.

Mike

Hi Trekker,

You wrote:

You have not explained what you mean by this statement. Am i right in assuming you mean an EXTRA filling of the Holy Ghost, aside from just what we receive at the moment of salvation? A special, greater filling which equips a person for MINISTRY?

While I can't speak for twayneweb, I do beleive this is what he was referring to. It's explained in Acts 19:

While Apollos was at Corinth, Paul took the road through the interior and arrived at Ephesus. There he found some disciples 2 and asked them, “Did you receive the Holy Spirit when[a] you believed?”

They answered, “No, we have not even heard that there is a Holy Spirit.”

3 So Paul asked, “Then what baptism did you receive?”

“John’s baptism,” they replied.

4 Paul said, “John’s baptism was a baptism of repentance. He told the people to believe in the one coming after him, that is, in Jesus.” 5 On hearing this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 6 When Paul placed his hands on them, the Holy Spirit came on them, and they spoke in tongues[b] and prophesied. 7 There were about twelve men in all.

These men had already repented, yet something was lacking in their life and Paul asked them a simple question "did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?", they were honest and said no.

And does this happen only when i am perfect enough to be used in ministry or only when i have enough faith for God to trust me, or ??

It happens when you believe the the Lord is good and in being good He wishes to share Himself with people who ask, well the Lord said it better than I ever could:

If you, then, though you are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father in heaven give good gifts to those who ask him! ~Matthew 7:1

QUOTE: "Brother,
How are you sure that Paul's thorn in the flesh was a sickness or disease? The Word of God says that this thorn in the flesh was a messenger of Satan to buffet him because of the many revelations that he had received to keep him from being exalted but always looking to the Lord to receive His grace to overcome. Mike "==ABIDEINHIM

What is your point? Whether sickness, disease or affliction it was physical and Paul ASKED FOR HEALING from it. The original statement to which i was referring with this topic was the statement that Christians can be healed by the laying on of hands, etc.

You have not explained what you mean by this statement. Am i right in assuming you mean an EXTRA filling of the Holy Ghost, aside from just what we receive at the moment of salvation? A special, greater filling which equips a person for MINISTRY? And does this happen only when i am perfect enough to be used in ministry or only when i have enough faith for God to trust me, or ?? Someone made the comment that we don't receive the gifts based on our performance, yet most Christians can't even get prayers answered precisely because of their sin (aka performance). So i think performance DOES enter into it; i highly doubt God is going to give the gift of prophecy to a Believer who suffers greatly from the sin of pride or some other besetting sin, for example. Can you just imagine what someone beset with pride would do with the gift of prophecy, or healing, or miracles? And i've seen a lot of pride in the church, including pastors. I think pride is ALWAYS near, trying to trip us.

On the day of Pentecost the 120 in the upper room had already put faith in the atoning work of Jesus Christ. Their rebirth was accomplished. Yet they were to wait until they were endued with power from on high. It was the power that Jesus said in John was with them but would be in them. Later in the book of Acts, Paul ministers to a group of believers and asks if they had received the Holy Ghost since they believed. These believers were then baptized in the Holy Spirit, a distinct work apart from salvation.

I think when someone says that we do not earn the gifts it is in the sense that we do not do anything to merit being used in a gift. For example, "I have not told a lie for three years and I have read by Bible regularly so surely I qualify to be used in a gift of the Spirit." This is a very different thing from understanding that God will use someone that He can trust and that has positioned themselves by becoming useable.

Finally, I would like to interject as concerning Paul's thorn. You seem to make the assumption that it was a sickness or physical ailment of some sort. I don't believe, if we study scripture carefully, that we can make that assumption. Paul says the thorn was a messenger (angelos) of Satan sent to buffet him. This would be demonically inspired persecution rather than physical illness, especially given the context of the statement. Not that I am dogmatic, but I think scripturally it is more likely to NOT be sickenss than to be sickness.

As to why some are not healed even though I believe it is God's will that all be healed. We can ask a parallel question and perhaps answer the question. Why, when God desires that none should perish but that all should have eternal life, are there those who are not saved? Could it be that faith is one key element? Could it be that there are other reasons why someone might not receive healing?

hi yes everything is for today exept being good enough to be used od God.pray for all to be healed. some get healed and some do not. more get healed than when you do not pray and believe.i have many testimonies of Gods healing power even some happened while kidding around and acting like a nut.i have also had a dream and went to the hospital to pray for a dear friend in tears,trembling ,assured and nothing happened. don't try to figure it out in your weak mind and let God be God.jimp

hi, compassion; the head of medicine came to our church and told this story. (tampa general) he was working on a very young child who was sick unto death and while in a code red , all themeters went flat .he continued to try but to no avail,so the nurses and others took all the equipment off of the child. the doctor said he picked up the child and began to sob and as he began to pray;while overwhelmed by compassion for this now dead baby, the child began to cry and was completely healed.jimp

Quote: "Sounds like you already have some gifts. Do you know what Compassion and Mercy fall under? The gift of Helps.
The gift of Helps is deep and wide, there is more going on in this area than the obvious gifts and few people realize they have this gift because the things that are done under this umbrella are rarely seen and exploited."==APPROVED

I believe mercy is a gift all by itself. I always think of Helps as the gift of serving others (physically so to speak). ALL Christians should have mercy and compassion though, otherwise how can they call themselves Christians?
To be without compassion is to be hardened-- and probably self-righteous in most cases. Well, whatever it is, i don't like it at the same time that i do like it. I mean, it hurts to hurt for other people and to desperately want to help them yet being powerless to do so yet at the same time i would not want to be cold and hard either, as i once was to some extent many decades ago.

Sure, people will spew sermons about how you can have power in intercessory prayer but when you have prayed and prayed for years and nothing really changes, even offered yourself to suffer in the person's place or perhaps your very life, then that is powerlessness.And i'm not the only one who feels the powerlessness (so if anyone reading this gets uptight and self-righteous then they need to get honest first before responding). No one is helped by those who want to play Pretend.

Anyway, thanks for your thoughtful comments Approved.

QUOTE: "hi, compassion; the head of medicine came to our church and told this story. (tampa general) he was working on a very young child who was sick unto death and while in a code red , all themeters went flat .he continued to try but to no avail,so the nurses and others took all the equipment off of the child. the doctor said he picked up the child and began to sob and as he began to pray;while overwhelmed by compassion for this now dead baby, the child began to cry and was completely healed."==JIMP

That's a beautiful story. Reminds me of Elijah and the woman's son. Most doctors would not cry, as they are so detached and hardened(nor do they pray,although some do go to churches... of varying religions)--at least the ones i meet--so my guess is he is a true Believer.

The event DOES indeed glorify God (and edify the saints) but
please tell that doctor next time you see him to please cry over the adults TOO, as the dead baby probably would just have gone straight to Heaven. : )

Thanks for sharing that.

QUOTE: "Trekker: In short, yes. All nine gifts of the Spirit listed in 1 Cor. are for today. I have seen most of the nine gifts in operation."==TWAYNEB

Twayneb, are you SURE? The problem i have with these claims is that from what i have seen in the churches very few (actually NONE) pastors or elders actually bother to OBEY the LORD and TEST the spirit behind the "gifts". The primary examples would be with the manifestation of Tongues and also of Prophecy, two gifts easy to counterfeit.

Please share with us some of the evidence or testimonies you have of SEEING them in operation, in detail. I would be particularly interested if you have seen a GIFT of healing.
Thanx.

Trekker: You bet brother. You see, it is entirely possible for a miraculous manifestation to originate from something other than God. However, the fact that this is possible should not dissuade us from readily accepting and walking in the reality. The fact is that much money has been faked, but that does not dissuade me from readily accepting and using real money. You get the idea.

My great grandfather was a man mightily used of God. On one occasion he was in Mexico to minister. He was supposed to speak with an interpreter. He know NO Spanish at all. As he stood to teach he began to speak in tongues. He preached the entire message in fluent Spanish.

I know a 15 year old girl who last summer was on a mission trip to the Dominican Republic. She also did not know Spanish, was usually shy, and had recently received the Baptism of the Holy Spirit. She was with a street ministry team and was asked to pray for a native who was having back troubles. She began to pray with an interpreter but then began to pray in tongues. Her eyes were closed and when she opened them she saw the interpreter and the native staring at her in wonder. They told her she had just prayed for healing in his back in fluent Spanish.

My cousin and I were called on to pray for a young man at church camp who had, one week earlier, shattered the bone in his ankle and who was in a cast using crutches. He said he believed God would heal him and would we pray for him. We did. He walked out of the chapel without crutches. Two hours later we found him without a cast, playing a very rough game of basketball. He was completely healed.

Also a church camp I was called on to pray for a young lady who was carried into the chapel unconscious. We did not know what was wrong and she was totally unresponsive to any kind of stimulus. I began to pray. I felt the Holy Spirit moving on me and began to pray in tongues. I suddenly shouted, "come out, come out, come out". She immediately regained consciousness and began looking around, wondering what was going on. I found later that a boy at the camp was heavily involved in the occult and had prayed that she die that day.

I have seen a woman regain a sense of smell that she had burned out in a cooking steam accident when she was eight. He had not smelled a thing for 40 years. No one laid hands on her. It happened instantaneously during a worship service as we all sang praises to the Lord.

I recall one time that I missed it. A message in tongues came forth in a meeting. The room was silent as people prayed for the interpretation to come forth. I felt a strong leading to speak, but I did not know what I was to say. I wrestled for a minute or so. It was awkward to me. Suddenly a man across the room began to speak and had the interpretation. My burden to speak left me. I know that God wanted me to exercise faith and begin to speak. I know He wanted to give me the interpretation, but I was weak in faith and did not obey. I had to repent of that.

At a meeting the Lord gave me a word of wisdom for a young lady that I know. I approached her mother and asked if it was OK for me to share. I then told the young girl that God had revealed to me that she was struggling with whether to stand strong in Him or to compromise with the world. The particulars that I shared were precisely what she was dealing with. God had me share with her that if she would continue to stand strong, that He would empower her and bless her.

On another occasion I was in a service at a local homeless shelter. A man was sitting at one end of the room. Something about him caused a reaction in my spirit that I did not totally understand. I moved to the opposite end of the room so I could watch him and pray about why I was feeling as I was. The Holy Spirit gave me a word of knowledge. He said, "He is involved in eastern religion." Later I spoke with a person who worked at the shelter. I asked her if she know the man. She replied, "Oh yes! He has been coming in here lately. His name is _____ and he is a Bhuddist." I am still not sure why God gave me that information since He did not then tell me what to do with it. Perhaps it was to strengthen my faith. The meeting gave the man a knowledge of the truth and an opportunity to repent.

Another man I know was diagnosed last October with colon cancer. He had been experiencing problems and had went for a checkup. In January he went to a Bible College in Texas. He called me, rather excited. He said that during a worship service God had dealt with his heart about healing. He had decided earlier to trust God and had not sought further medical treatment. He said a warm feeling went through his body and he felt he had been healed. He went to the doctors in Dallas to be checked out. They could find no trace of cancer and thought he had been misdiagnosed. But they sent for his records from Missouri and were dumbfounded. The diagnosis had been spot on accurate. He had been healed in a moment from colon cancer.

These are events close to me that readily come to my mind. I know of countless more that have happened to or through people that I know.

Just because a gift may seem easy to counterfeit does not mean that the gift itself is to be held suspect. We are told to covet earnestly the best gifts. It should be our earnest desire to be used of God to minister to others. This desire should flow out of the heart of God.

The other issue is testing the spirits. The question is, how do we do that? It is a combination of walking close to the Lord and being very sensitive to His speaking to us and spending time in the word of God so that we have the word deeply rooted in us. This allows us to filter what we see and hear through the double filter of the word of God and the leading of the Holy Spirit.

QUOTE: " I am still not sure why God gave me that information since He did not then tell me what to do with it."==TWAYNEB

Thank you Twayneb. I think i recall you sharing the first two stories a while ago on another thread. That is a lot of experiences for one person. Those sorts of things don't happen around here where i am. But i can relate to your story about the Buddhist and how God revealed something to you about him without you knowing what or why. A similar thing happened to me when one winter day i was walking down a street on my way to work and this squad car came out of an alley to my left and slightly ahead, across the street. The cop inside had a strange, cunning smile on his face, like a cat who had just swallowed a mouse. I wondered why. He paused at the entrance to the street, looked both ways for traffic, then turned onto the street going north past me (i was walking south). As his squad came roughly even with me i just naturally glanced again at him, this time from the side, he was closer, and when my eyes lit on his face there was an immediate and very loud, very sudden, unmistakable check in my spirit from the Lord. It was like a shock, and it felt like a warning of danger; it was clearly communicating to me that there was something bad about that man/cop but i did not know what. I had never had any such experience around any cop ever before in my life and i have lived in a number of different towns and cities and have even met some pretty mean cops from time to time as many of them tend to have severe anger and rage issues. But those i tended to pray for. This particular man seemed the sly sort to me, untrustworthy, but that is all i know, for i have never met him nor had i ever seen him before nor since (nor do i ever want to, i knew that immediately). I do not know what he is guilty of, just that he is guilty of something and i reckon it must be pretty bad for the Lord to warn me to stay away from him when He has not even warned me to stay away from anyone else like that ever before in my entire life. I just can't figure it out and i dont think i shall ever forget it because to this day it has me totally perplexed. Never before have i ever received such a check in my spirit like that in all my life and i cant reason why God would do that when i didn't (even to this day) have any contact with the man. Once upon a time i had received a milder, softer check in my spirit when my eyes lit upon two young women walking together holding hands at a conference and i instantly knew they were lesbians, but even that check was not loud or warning like this one...that one was more of a grieved spirit. I am just a naturally curious person and it just bugs me to no end wondering what on earth could have prompted God to warn me like that.

QUOTE: "Brother what you shared was utterly incredible. And I trust these experiences were not in a third world country. Well two of them were. So how can we see more of this in our lives?.......Bearmaster."==BEARMASTER

I'm beginning to think we need to move down to Missouri. I hate the state i live in anyway so i been a thinkin a long time where could i move to that would be better, if indeed i ever could. Well sounds like Missouri has it goin on, both in the church he described and also they have lotta rodeo down there in Branson so i could kill two birds with one stone (or lasso two bullriders with one rope)...lol

Brother what you shared was utterly incredible. And I trust these experiences were not in a third world country. Well two of them were. So how can we see more of this in our lives?.......Bearmaster.

Brothers: The answer is not to move to Missouri. :-) Although I do like where I live.

First, Jesus told His disciples to tarry in Jerusalem until they be endued with power from on high. Jesus had taught them previously that the Holy Spirit was with them but would be in them. He said that greater things than He did, they would do because He was going to the Father. The context of that statement is the fact that He was leaving but was going to send another comforter, the Holy Spirit.

Pentecost was that event. After that there were several times in the book of Acts when a person received the gift of the Baptism of the Holy Spirit. John told his followers that the one that came after Him would baptize in the Holy Spirit and fire. Paul in 2 Cor. 2 speaks of the power that was on his ministry through the Holy Spirit.

I believe from scripture, and I have experienced, the baptism of the Holy Spirit as a definite work of grace apart from and subsequent to salvation. I believe this Acts 2 baptism is essential to empower us for ministry, both natural and supernatural.

Second, I believe that we will walk in the power of God in direct proportion to our submitting ourselves to Him in sanctification and holiness. I am not talking about modes of dress, jewelry, head coverings, etc. I am talking about a separation from the world and its way of thinking and doing things, and a separation to God and His way of thinking and doing things. This consecration touches every area of our lives. When we consecrate ourselves to Him and ever increasingly surrender areas of our lives to Him, we will find ourselves being obedient in what may seem trivial or silly ways, but ways that make a big difference in how we relate to God. It is a matter of obedience. It is not holy living out of our flesh in an effort to earn miracles, but rather obedience out of love that opens us up as useable vessels for the Lord.

Third, I believe faith is involved as it is in every part of our walk with the Lord. If you don't believe God will use you in the gifts of the Spirit, then I can almost guarantee that you will not be used in the gifts of the Spirit. We are instructed to covet earnestly the best gifts. It is interesting to study those words in the Greek. It is to be a desire of our heart, but 1 Cor 13 shows us that it must come from a motivation of the love and ministry of God toward people, not out of the desire to be something special because you have been used. It is a bit funny to think that the tool would boast against the workman using the tool right?

hi, our services and thought patterns are somewhat contrary to what happens in services where healings happen. there is a word in the bible we never talk about and that word is importunity... we are to knock and keep on knocking,seek and keep on seeking etc.i ten second prayer over a crippled person;who took an hour to get to the meeting, just does not produce the results and frankly i have seen more healings after the minister gave up and then were moved with a heavenly compassion held someone in their arms and started to weep over the condition of the person he just had no results praying for.as i said before when i was in mexico ministering with bro.ost i prayed for a man in our 10 second fashion and bro. ost told me to stay with that man and pray untill healing was manifested. and after a while we had the results.there are times of instantaneous healings. but to answer your question , yes the gifts are for today... the greatest gift is salvation and this gives us eternal life while healings and other things die.jimp

Good one! i have also seen a healing after I gave up in mexico. My own. I nearly died in mexico when I was 18, and there was nothing anyone could do about it. I really gave up and went on my knees to pray more seriously than ever before. And woke up the next morning to still see another day alive. I've got some serious poison in my bloodstream and still was sick for another 2 weeks, bleeding from every body opening and even just by touching my skin. But the moment I started praying changed the movement of the poison, it got stopped flowing towards my heart visibly and miraculously. I'm thankful there wasn't any doctor around, otherwise maybe I wouldn't have turned to Jesus for help. Thank you Jesus, you saved my life!

I have noticed that in discussing the many different kinds of giftS of the Spirit, when it comes to healing, the Word of God is translated with the plural.

For example in Romans 12:6 and 1 Cor 12:4, a plural refers to the many different types of gifts. I understand gifts to be grace (imparted enabling). Somewhat differently, 1 Cor 12:9, 28, and 30, it is giftS of healing and healingS.

This is my understanding and it fits my experience and witness of the grace of God. It is silly to ask why someone doesn't go and heal all people in the hospital if they "have" the gift of healing. Grace always seems to me to be tailor-made.

You experienced what is called discernment of spirits. It is one of the gifts of the Holy Spirit listed in 1 Corinthians 12:10. You recieved knowledge from the Holy Spirit that the man contained or was oppressed by an evil spirit. You may not know wh you recieved it but I can imagine you have prayed for him many times. Maybe he has become a Christian through your prayers.

hi, the gift is discernings of spirits.no big deal.pray for everyone to be healed . some will surprise you and be healed with your mighty faith. if you do not pray few will ever get healed . be moved with compassion and more will be healed . most of the time, when someone got healed , i was surprised.jimp

QUOTE: "You experienced what is called discernment of spirits. It is one of the gifts of the Holy Spirit listed in 1 Corinthians 12:10. You recieved knowledge from the Holy Spirit that the man contained or was oppressed by an evil spirit. You may not know wh you recieved it but I can imagine you have prayed for him many times. Maybe he has become a Christian through your prayers."==DRHUMM

I don't know. All i know is he is a bad man but i dont know what he is guilty of but it must be something out of the ordinary. I reckon i prayed for him, can't recall, but it wasn't many times if i did. The Spirit was instructing me to stay away from him is all i know and that is fine with me!

Trekker: I am not sure what you experienced was the gift of the discerning of Spirits in operation or if it was simply spiritual discernment. (The one is more in the realm of the Holy Spirit making known to you what type of spirit you are dealing with, the other is your born again spirit (in communion with the Holy Spirit) not bearing witness with the spirit you were dealing with) Or perhaps it was simply the Lord speaking to you and you listening to what He said. Either way, the important thing is that you obeyed the Holy Spirit as He spoke to you.

My understanding of "gift of discernment of spirits" is that if you have it then you are able to identify exactly the identity of the spirit. Am i right on this? For example, if i met a man who had a spirit of divination i would know not only that he HAS an evil spirit but i would know what kind: a spirit of divination. That is what i understand that gift to be. Admittedly there have been times where i met someone and i just knew the person had a "Catholic" spirit in them (for lack of a better term) and to be Catholic though i could not tell you how i knew it, and this was later confirmed to be true. And there have been times when i would meet someone or walk into a room and knew a certain person was a born again Christian just by looking at their face/countenance/eyes. Probably most Christians experience the same thing though. I think every Christian gains both experience and discernment in these things over years. But as to the event in question,no, i would not say that i experienced any "discernment of spirits" at that time because i was not able to identify what sort of spirit the man might have IF ANY in that brief flash of passing. In my mind it was simply the Lord communicating to my Spirit an urgent warning that day.

Trekker: I think you are right about the nature of the gift of discerning of spirits. However one does not "have" the gift if I read 1 Cor. correctly but rather one may be used in this gift "severally as He wills". In other words, I do not believe there are people who have a resident gift of discerning of spirits that walk around continually discerning every spirit. I believe when the Lord desires to use you in that gift He will impart to you that supernatural knowledge.

Trekker wrote:
Are the gifts of healings for today? It is a gift i really desire more than any other and have prayed for but have not received. I don't understand what good it does for me to have a heart of compassion and mercy when i am powerless to help any of the suffering people around me. There are so many people suffering so greatly. Such extreme suffering.

Just because someone has the gift of healing, doesn’t mean that every person they lay hands on will get healed; it’s still Christ our all in all that does the healing. And if we haven’t met the conditions (and the prayee as well), then no one is getting healed. It’s not just one secret ingredient that gets people healed, I believe it’s a combination of things; perhaps desperation on their part and faith on ours?? I’m not sure. I’ve prayed for people and they’ve been healed and then “I” tried the exact same thing on someone else and it flopped big time!

“I” was seeking that formula and there isn’t one except obedience to my death of my formula seeking and faith in Jesus Christ. So, I have decided that the “I” has gotten the way. If there is a lack, I truly believe that it is not on God’s part but on mine. I’m just trying to be honest here with what has worked for me and what hasn’t.... if there is any “I” whatsoever, it’s never worked and thank God for that. TO GOD BE ALL THE GLORY!

You are headed in the direction, my friend, compassion and mercy is a huge part of what we need to lay hands on the sick and faith to see them healed.

So keep being faithful in the little things like secretly rising early to pray and seek HIS presence and reading HIS word and you will be rewarded openly!

God bless you,
Lisa

QUOTE: "Just because someone has the gift of healing, doesn’t mean that every person they lay hands on will get healed; it’s still Christ our all in all that does the healing."==LYSA

Good point, which is born out in the testimony of Rees Howells Interecessor.

QUOTE: " In other words, I do not believe there are people who have a resident gift of discerning of spirits that walk around continually discerning every spirit. I believe when the Lord desires to use you in that gift He will impart to you that supernatural knowledge."==TWAYNEB

Hmm. Not sure what to think. It doesn't really make sense to call it a "gift" then does it?? I mean, when something is truly a GIFT, you don't give it and then take it back; a gift is something you keep. Otherwise it is just a LOAN. I don't know whether to agree on that or not...

I guess this is how I would explain how I see it.

1Co 12:4-11
(4) Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit.
(5) And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord.
(6) And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all.
(7) But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.
(8) For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;
(9) To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;
(10) To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:
(11) But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.

I guess one good question to ask would be, to whom are these manifestations of the spirit given? If God uses me to impart a word of wisdom, is that a gift given to me, or is it a gift given to the person for whom the word of wisdom is intended? Am I no just the vessel through whom the gift was delivered?

There is one verse here in 1 Cor. where these nine manifestations are referred to as gifts. Another reference may be found in Eph. 4. The term gift here is charisma. I think the term manifestations in the sense of manifestations of the power of God to men by his grace fits the context given verses 7 and 11. In other words, I do not believe, for instance word of wisdom, is a gift that I have been given that I now carry around as one would the gift of a new wristwatch. Rather it is a gift of the manifestation of God's power given to men to minister God's grace, mercy, love, and compassion that can be made manifest to that person through me at what time God purposes to use me (divided severally as He will). And if the gift is really the ministry to the person in need and I the channel through which God gets His grace to that person, then verse 11 takes on an entirely different flavor.

You might not agree with my take on it, and that is perfectly OK. The important thing is that we position ourselves before God so that He can use us to minister to others through the gifts of the Spirit. I really think God desires to minister through the gifts much more often than we allow Him to do so. The hunger to walk close to Him so that I can readily hear His voice and be available for Him to use me is growing stronger and stronger within me.

God bless you brother.

twayneb wrote:
In other words, I do not believe there are people who have a resident gift of discerning of spirits that walk around continually discerning every spirit. I believe when the Lord desires to use you in that gift He will impart to you that supernatural knowledge.

Trekker responded:
Hmm. Not sure what to think. It doesn't really make sense to call it a "gift" then does it?? I mean, when something is truly a GIFT, you don't give it and then take it back; a gift is something you keep. Otherwise it is just a LOAN. I don't know whether to agree on that or not...

If I could discern every single spirit, why should you or anyone else want to? There comes a certain amount of laziness when one person is able to do it all and someone else is absolutely fine with sitting back and letting them do it! God doesn’t want that either. As a church, we are supposed to operate as a fine well-oiled machine, everyone doing something but not one person doing it all.

Pride is a huge factor in this as well, if you knew that “trekker” could heal any person He laid his hands on, whether they wanted it or not (and believe you me, some people don’t want to be healed for various different reasons), and if everyone flocked to you that did want healed – how could you stay humble and lowly? It’s very sad to say but some well-meaning soul would come along and convince you to take it on the road and then onto TV only to help all those people who can’t come to your meetings and not to be famous.

With gifts comes complete trust that the Operator knows what He is doing and that operator is ultimately not you or me.

God bless you brother as you seek the Giver of all gifts!
Lisa

QUOTE: "Rather it is a gift of the manifestation of God's power given to men to minister God's grace, mercy, love, and compassion that can be made manifest to that person through me at what time God purposes to use me."==TWAYNEB

Thanx Travis. I understand, but yet i don't. I mean, to me that is still the same thing as my definition of the spiritual gifts: you are still carrying around with you the ABILITY or the open channel. It's like carrying around a gardenhose and all that is needed is for God to turn the water on. Then begin watering whatever is in the garden, albeit God has chosen which plants to water cuz He won't turn the water on till you come to the plant he desires to water.

Pray tell, what is the gift of "word of Knowledge" and how does it differ from "word of wisdom" and prophecy?

hi, i was amazed to see the hose used as an example for that is exactly what we are God is the giver of the gift(they are the gifts of the Spirit)we are the hose and the one healed is the receiver of the gift. it is the same thing with the annointing or anything else that stems from God. michaelangelo was an artist (god) he used good brushes to paint with (us) and the art is the result of his gift.jimp

i like that have you ever seen what hapens to a hoses when it is turned on full blast,,,it moves where the water wills it ,,that hose is dead and hollow untill the water gives life to the hose ,dead in sin ,till the water of the word gives life ,and propels it ,,,it is god who works in you both to will and to do for his good pleasure

no dead hose can come to me unles my heavenly father draws him with the water of his spirit

I can explain these three gifts in the way I understand and use them.
A word of knowledge is knowing a specific detail about someone that you would have no way of knowing in the natural. Many things can be observed for example you see someone who looks pale you know they are sick. Maybe a person looks worried, that is seeing in the natural. A word of knowledge might tell you what they are worried about. This is trusted information given to help not to hurt them or show off. This gift is used in conjunction with the others in ministry or while interceding. This gift could be how the Lord might show you where something is that was misplaced.

The word of wisdom is used closely with the word of knowledge. When you receive a word of knowledge you need to know what to do with it. For example: I was praying for a man and the Holy Spirit told me the man had an anger problem. I asked the Lord at that time how I was to minister this piece of info. It was a confidential lcation and he was not exposed to anyone else. I was instructed to tell him what I heard from the Lord. This led to some other ministry helping him to repent of the anger and recieve healing for some hurt and disappointment in his life.

Prophecy is a word given to bring edification, exhortation(encouragement) and comfort. This definition is found in 1 Corinthians 14:3. Paul encouraged us all to desire to prophesy - 1 Corinthians 14:1. A lot of people prophesy to one another without knowing they do. Surely most of us encourage others in their faith or speak comfort when going through a trial.

When we read through the Gospels we see Jesus doing all these things. He had a word of knowledge about the woman at the well. He knew she had had many men in her life and was living with one and not married. He did not spring this on her right away, He used wisdom in the communication. He later speaks words of comfort and exhortaion. Of course this is rather simplified and He was talking of other things here too. But overall if you pull the stories apart you see how the Jesus portrayed all 'the gifts" in action all of the time. The Holy Spirit moves through believers in much the same way.

The Lord will give us what we need and what we ask for. We serve a great God who shares Himself with us. I constantly find it amazing how much He loves us and wants to help us.

I like the garden hose analogy. Trekker, I guess this is how I would explain that analogy. I, as a Spirit filled believer, am a garden hose. I am an open channel for God to use to minister to others. The gifts of the Spirit are like the water that flows through the hose. God is in control of knowing what plants need to be watered and it is He who turns the spigot on and off as far as the gifts of the Spirit are concerned. One day He may send a word of knowledge down the hose and another day He may send a gift of healing. All of these gifts come from the same Spirit, although the manifestations and operations of these gifts vary. I have been given the gift of the comforter, the Holy Spirit. God then works through me in the gifts of the Spirit. Does that analogy help with what I am trying to say?

Drhumm did a great job, I think, of explaining the difference between the three gifts you asked about.

I like your example of a garden hose flowing with the gift that is needed unto the plant that needs it. This speaks of the ability of the Spirit to bring different gifts through the same believer not just one. Many believe they have just one gift but I believe we can experience them all when open to the flow of the Spirit. I may use your example if you dont mind.

QUOTE: "A word of knowledge might tell you what they are worried about. This is trusted information given....'" For example: I was praying for a man and the Holy Spirit told me the man had an anger problem."==DRHUMM

Thankyou for this but it still leaves me wondering what real difference there is between that gift and the gift of prophecy. For example, in I Samuel 9:19, the prophet (seer) Samuel says to Saul, "...and i will tell thee all that is in thine heart". This seems to describe what you just gave as an example above, and yet also prophecy, so what is the diff?"
Thank you.

QUOTE: "A lot of people prophesy to one another without knowing they do. "==DRHUMM

This i know to be true, and have experienced it for myself. And frankly i find it scary. It would be better if one could say, "Thus saith the LORD..." rather than prophecy to someone unknowingly, that we both (the prophecier and the listener) could walk in holy fear and not take any word given for granted or dismissively, forgetting and going our way/.

QUOTE: "We serve a great God who shares Himself with us. I constantly find it amazing how much He loves us and wants to help us."==DRHUMM

I have never experienced that. Please pray for me that i might experience it. IF God loves me so much as you say He does, why has he never comforted me when i have been traumatized? Am still looking for the right day to schedule my nervous breakdown and hope i am not alone on that day.

QUOTE: "I have been given the gift of the comforter, the Holy Spirit. God then works through me in the gifts of the Spirit. Does that analogy help with what I am trying to say?"==TWAYNEB

Yes, this helps Travis, thank you. Makes sense. : )

Trekker,

May I recommend to you the best book on this subject I've ever read. It is only 128 pages and was first published in 1931. Written by Henry W. Frost, who was the first National Director of the China Inland Mission(now OMF International)and who was a personal friend of the missionary Hudson Taylor.

I know there are many books on every subject including this one,but as I said,this is the best book I've ever read on this subject. I think it is the most balanced,logical and concise treatment of this subject. I'm not the only one who has said that it's the best book they've ever read on this subject. David Martyn LLoyd Jones was asked many times to write a book on this subject, but he said,

"Henry W. Frost has already dealt with the matter in what I regard as a final and conclusive manner."

He also said about this book,

"This is easily and incomparably the best book I have ever read on this subject."

He(D. Martyn LLoyd Jones)writes the Introduction to the 1999 edition of the book with the Foreword being written by Joni Eareckson Tada.

The title of the book is, "Miraculous Healing", Why Does God Heal Some And Not Others.

In chapter 10 of his book Mr. Frost writes,

"To me it is a blessed experience, if sickness has come, not to turn first to a physician, but rather to God; to put myself wholly at His disposal, either for sickness or health; to enquire what He would have me do in seeking for healing; to ask, if the circumstances suggest this, that He will heal miraculously to seek, lacking such healing, to know His mind in respect to healing of some other sort; and finally to accept the issue of His will, whatever it may be, not only submissively, but also in trust and with praise. This order of procedure, it seems to me, is a happy one for the saint to take, because it puts God first, gives Him opportunity to work and gives Him the right-of-way all through. In taking a course like this, sometimes God has healed me miraculously; and, if not, has either used in my behalf the physician and his medicine, or given me extra grace to welcome and endure the sickness. As touching this last, it is to be remembered that the Word not only says, “The Lord for the body,” but also, “The body for the Lord” (I Cor. 6:13); and, if I mistake not, this indicates that our bodies are to be put and kept at God’s disposal for whatever He may choose for them."

Here is a review of this book,

"This book by Henry Frost is an especially even-handed treatment of the subject. Though first published in 1931, the book is still extremely relevant and applicable today. While he refers to some sicknesses in rather outdated terms, the substance of his book is not hindered by this in any way. Real wisdom is timeless and cuts through difficult and complex issues with clarity, simplicity, and equity. Miraculous Healing is a book of such wisdom. The clear logic with which the Scriptures are applied to the subject at hand is wonderfully helpful. Martyn Lloyd-Jones, probably the greatest and most influential preacher of the last century, said this, “Henry Frost has dealt with the matter in what I regard as a final and conclusive manner.” The book is only 128 pages, but you will not find a more direct, theologically sound, well-reasoned treatment of this topic in books three times its length. Notably, Mr. Frost's entire book is written in a true spirit of humility and Christian love. It is a model of Christian argumentation. If you have any uncertainty on this issue, do yourself a favor and read this book."

"Frost's method is as follows: He begins by telling in detail, specific situations in which God did heal people. This is followed by the same thorough descriptions of similar situations in which God did not heal. Then he begins to give various relevant observations, comparing the situations and drawing conclusions. Next he looks at the lives of two prominent teachers of miraculous healing (A.J. Gordon and A.B. Simpson). These men had taught it was always God's will to heal (as many still teach today), and Frost examines their own experiences with sickness. From there he moves on to weigh some of the most common statements made by those who believe God's will is always for healing. Next, he considers the best arguments for this position and answers them biblically. Then Frost spends a chapter providing a biblical perspective for divine miracles in the age in which we live. This is followed by a well-rounded explanation and application of Christ's sovereignty regarding the issue at hand. With all of this considered, he then spends one chapter making various practical and spiritual deductions followed by a chapter of general conclusions in which broad principles and truths are stated in ways that can be applied to specific cases and needs. The book concludes with a personal testimony involving the author's own experiences with the subject. Highly recommended!"

I hope this is a help to you and others as it has been to me as well.

by Trekker
QUOTE: "A word of knowledge might tell you what they are worried about. This is trusted information given....'" For example: I was praying for a man and the Holy Spirit told me the man had an anger problem."==DRHUMM

Thankyou for this but it still leaves me wondering what real difference there is between that gift and the gift of prophecy.

I don't mean to be so blunt as honest but we are beating a dead horse here trying to explain all the in's and out's of these gifts because truthfully #1 we don't know all the in's and out's (and anyone who says they do is lying) and #2 the natural mind cannot comprehend or understand them.

This is where you receive a gift and by faith exercise in it, brother!

God bless you!
Lisa

QUOTE:"The title of the book is, "Miraculous Healing", Why Does God Heal Some And Not Others."==SAVANNAH

Thank you Savannah, i will consider it.

QUOTE: "I read "Christ the Healer" some years ago, and would recommend it to those interested in the scriptural study of it."==BROTHERTOM

Thank you BrotherTom, i have read books similar to that one already, along with "Rees Howells, Intercessor" which has a few accounts of diving healing. Interesting stuff to say the least.

I wanted to reply to Trekker's questions. I have not been online the last few days so I am slow in responding.

You stated several interesting questions although I dont know if there are always definitive boundaries in the area of gifts. Many times in a ministerial situations you see a combination of the gifts used altogether. The example from 1 Samuel is a gift he had as a prophet. This operated in Jesus all the time, he was aware of the root problem in the hearts of men. Samuel walked in the office of a prophet. The office of a prophet and the gift of prophecy is different. The gift of prophey brings exhortation, edification and consolation. That is why many prophesy and are not aware of it. Some people will always give you encouragement in your walk with the Lord. They may be walking in the gift of prophecy while doing it or it may be an extension of their testimony or even a positive personality.
I dont worry about defining what gift is operating I just let them move through me. This takes some effort. We seek the Lord, we yield to the Spirit, we learn to hear His voice and then we must ultimately take the risk and actually speak out what we are recieving. There are no hard fast rules for learning in this area. We walk by faith not by sight. We walk in the Spirit by seeking His will and yelding ourselves to Him so He can move through us.
I would also add that initially this was not very easy or comfortable for me. I was always anxious I would do it wrong, or not hear correctly. I also felt a lot of performance pressure. I got free from these things through fasting and prayer.
I have given many prophecies without announcing a thus saith the Lord. One of the reasons is that I give words to unbelievers when so led. I do not want to intimidate them and I trust the Lord is wooing them to Him. I believe the Lord leads me through a combination of the gifts of the Holy Spirit to know what to do. For example: I told a man who happened to be Jewish that he would not remain in the business he was in but move to another. This went against my own mind at the time. He was a school principal and I had no reason to think he would want to be anywhere else. About 2 years later I ran into him at a resteraunt and he came and told me he had left education and was working as a businessman. I was surprised when he thanked me. I have no idea what the Lord is doing in his life but have to believe that the word will serve the Lords business.
As for the request for prayer for recieving comfort after a trauma I must certainly will. Have you ever received comfort straight from scripture? I have had many traumas in my life and I feel compassion towards you. Sometimes I have been led to scriptures that helped comfort me and helped me to recieve healing fom wounds. I do not take this lightly and you will be in my prayers from now on. You strike me as someone with a sense of humor. I like that.

QUOTE: "Have you ever received comfort straight from scripture?"==DRHUMM

No sir, i can't much say that i have, except in the most minimal way. For example, one time when i read the verse where Jesus says to Mary in the garden, "Woman, why are you weeping?" that gave me some small comfort but not for what i have been facing the past decade.

QUOTE: "I do not take this lightly and you will be in my prayers from now on. You strike me as someone with a sense of humor. I like that."==DRHUMM

Thank you dear, kind brother. That makes me smile. I very much appreciate the prayers. And yes, you perceive correctly, i am a person with a sense of humor, normally....; )

When I was first learning to hear from the Spirit I would ask the lord to lead me to scripture that would help me understand my circumstance or help me with negative emotion. It sounds like you have had a rough decade and I am sorry for that. Without support it is hard to keep plugging along, and I am praying for an undergirding for you. I find it interesting the scripture that brought you some comfort. Mary cried because she thought she had lost Jesus and He could not help her anymore. I think this scripture is telling you that the Lord cares for you and is concerned about your heartache. Makes me wonder what else He wants to say.

QUOTE: "I find it interesting the scripture that brought you some comfort. Mary cried because she thought she had lost Jesus and He could not help her anymore. I think this scripture is telling you that the Lord cares for you..."==DRHUMM

To me the scripture was saying to her that she had no reason to weep, even though she thought she did; she thought she had lost all but she had not lost anything and had gained salvation. But this verse does not apply to my current trauma/situation AT ALL, although it was mildly helpful in other situations. As for "a rough decade", truly, truly i wish that i had not ever been born; it had been better if no one in my family had ever been born.

I am sorry it has been so difficult for you. I am praying for you. I appreciate your prayers for me.

Ok, thank you, and yes i will pray.