tormented by demons need urgent prayer

Brothers and sisters in Christ i know i have posted many prayer requests about my situation. I appreciate all your concern for me and prayers, but i really need extra prayer right now. I feel as if i have demonic spirits afflicting my whole body day in and day out. Last week when i put my last prayer request i started getting better for a few days\\, but then to fall back into the bondage again.The last year has been like that for me with me sometimes maybe for a few days at most finding relief to sometimes a few hours. As some of you might not know my situation, over a year ago i had a back neck injury come out of nowhere and i began to have heavy swelling on my neck area a nd i was out of work for 5 weeks, the Lord miraculously delivered me completely from it one day when i asked him to take the burden from me. Then within a few days i began to feel something attacking my neck area again, not knowing what it was i felt like the Holy Spirit revealed to me i was under demonic attack, the only bad thing was that these attacks on my mind and body have continued for over a year now. They are not getting better. I for the past year have had a great fear on me that i was going to go paralized it seemed engraved in my thoughts that i could not get out of my mind, and still cant. I have prayed all day many days to no avail and still being tormented. Sometimes i can feel the affliction go from my back to my knees or ankles to my arms and legs. But lately it has only got worse.I am scared, i confessed every known sin i could think of, but the door does not seem to be closed. Please i really need extra prayer right now, it is getting really bad. IN Christ John

I'll definitely pray for you man, but have you seen a doctor yet?

besides a naturopath and the three hospital visits from a year ago no, but i am telling you i am not just being afflicted in my back but my mind, arms and legs, i feel to be demonic oppression. Anytime i try be forceful with these spirits and try to cast them out i get some relief, but then they come back even worse not long after that and the attacks become unbearable almost to the point where i have had to just tell God to fight for me and battle them and then i just wait on strength, that is hard waiting for strength. I am worn seeking the Lord about this, some days i seriously spend the whole day praying, almost the whole day, just walking around my house crying out to God. I been doing this for over a year. I have tried getting closer to God in his word to spending alone time with him, but i sometimes get stronger from that to only start getting afflicted throughout the day again. I need deliverance, but i have yet to get it, everything i have sought and everyone i have sought has been to no avail for me, i have felt spirits seem to afflict no matter where i go or what i do, i can just be in the car with my wife and getting afflicted or just walking around my house. I actually feel spirits come into my flesh it seemed a few times and have had felt something hit me in the back of my head and neck. I have tried figuring out what could be the cause of this and have prayed and asked God to tell me what it was but he has been silent, when i have asked how i opened the door. The only few things i thought was possibly when i was working at the assisted living place that i tried casting spirits out of people or the elderly who had dementia, i assumed they might have been bound by satan so i tried casting out spirits out of them some of them quitely. That i think could have opened the door to spirits coming on me.I was leading 2 bible studies at the time, going to school, and preached twice and i thought i was in Gods will, but then everything just fell apart. But, i have no idea what the issue is it could have been pride or my struggle with lust to. I dont know.

Though I have no doubt that demons can oppress us, I also know that many times we can blame demons for something that's naturally happening in our body. I think if you haven't been to a doctor for about a year, it would be worth checking out.

Of course continue to pray, but make sure that it's not something that medication won't fix before claiming you need deliverance (which is a whole nuther' kettle of fish).

The opposite extreme happens all the time. People just believe that they're healed of something that Christ hasn't healed them of, and they stop taking medication, or whatever be the case, and they reap the physical consequences of it, and then blame the devil, or blame themselves for lack of faith, when neither are the culprit.

I'll keep praying for you bro, but I would really consider visiting a physician if it's been over a year.

Sounds like your having panic/anxiety attacks. I have them frequently and I have pain in certain parts of my body as a result. Just the other day I went into the emergency thinking I was having a heart attack and my heart was normal, but the centre of my chest was in pain, I was having an anxiety attack. I get the same thing in my neck. I pray about it yes, and I take an anti nauseant like Gravol to help relax my muscles.

I hope that is all your experiencing. Not everything is a devil.

But as requested, my prayers are with you man.

"The only few things i thought was possibly when i was working at the assisted living place that i tried casting spirits out of people or the elderly who had dementia..."

One thing I do know about casting out devils is that just because it says that we can cast out devils in the bible doesn't mean that we have the right to. We must be led by the Holy Ghost to do these things.

Some of us get antsy because we want to live out the bible and we can't. We can't do it without the Spirit of God leading our every step. Plus, we need to be granted authority. Just because we have received the holy Spirit doesn't mean we have the authority to do what we want. We must be given authority to cast out devils and not everyone casts out devils.

It sounds like you've opened a door for these things to harass you. The scripture is clear brother,

1) Submit yourself unto God.

This means that you submit to His ways of doing things. You stop what you are doing, repent, asking God to forgive you for entering places that you had no business entering and

2)Resist the Devil.

This means that whatever hell has been sent to you that you stand your ground and stand you must calling upon the Lord for help. You can get everyone in the world to pray for you, but it still takes your Will to resist the devil and not give into the fear. Yes it's hard, it's hard to resist. Look at our Lord in the wilderness resisting the temptation of being able to turn a stone into a loaf of bread to eat, the bible says that He was very hungry. He could have done it, but than He would be no different than Esau who sold his birthright for a piece of nothing.

What we will pray for is the strength for you to stand, to resist the devil.

3)And he will flee!

The promise is that he can't stand it when someone is faithful to God and not to him. Satan is used to having people bend to his will, but then there is this "little flock" that just irritates him to no end. Satan comes with all his darkness and overwhelms the believer with temptation, as the resisting begins the darkness increases the temptation becomes almost unbearable and then like a flash of lightening, darkness flees because it can't comprehend it. It can't stay. It flees away until another set of circumstances bring it back to see if we learned anything from the last temptation.

As for your affliction,

"Many are the affliction of the righteous, but the Lord shall deliver us from them all."

I do recommend that you see a Doctor about your condition. It could be something serious it could be something that is not demon related. And whatever you do don't mention about demons attacking you, or he'll send you to a psychiatrist.

And then go and see one of the pentecostal variety ministries and find out which one of them deal in casting out devils and find out from them if your story fits in with any of their experiences they may have a word for you.

Good Hunting!

No, but industry is big here though a lot of pollution. I used to have panic attacks quite severely but not much these days, more anxiety than anything and my anxieties are spiritual in nature. I know why I am getting them. Thanks for asking and I will look into the Infrasonic. I wish Bible4life would answer, it would be nice to read of an update.

Hey guys no things havent got to much better for me, at times i get strong than i get weak again. At times i feel a great darkness over my mind too.

And then go and see one of the pentecostal variety ministries and find out which one of them deal in casting out devils and find out from them if your story fits in with any of their experiences they may have a word for you.

I would agree with all of Approved's advice save this. You will never find ONE account of a demon being cast out of a believer in the New Testament. NOT EVEN ONE.

You may be oppressed, yes. But needing something cast out of you? No. Unless of course you're not saved, which I don't think is the case. Even then your situation does not sound like anything in the Bible that needs "casting out".

All these Pentecostal so-called "deliverance ministries" are un-Biblical, and you'll just set yourself up for more confusion and/or trouble.

I have wondered to if i have been saved for a long time now, i for the past few years have asked the Lord to save me on many occasions if i wasnt saved and i have also have tried standing on my faith in Christ to no avail. Over the past few years i have also noticed that God's Spirit has seemed to depart from me a lot, and when i am getting attacked by the demonic spirits i seem to grow worse in my thought life and seem more corrupt.

You still don't sound like having any signs of possession, just oppression if anything. Also, if you've asked God to save you, He will. So I don't think it's a salvation issue either.

Like I said before, I would REALLY think about at least going to a doctor and seeing if there's anything medically wrong with you. If the doctors are still at a complete loss, let us know.

I'll continue praying for you.

Everest brother, you misunderstood me, I was telling him that he should go and see one of these variety churches who DO cast out devils, not cast devils out of him. Anyone who has had dealings with them would understand what bible4life was talking about and may give him a word or something. I say Pentecostal or some other group that believes in the power of God and the gifts of the Spirit. It doesn't have to be Pentecostal, but there is no sense in sending him to a Baptist or Methodist operation as they haven't a clue as they don't get involved in the gifts of the Spirit or casting out devils for that matter.

I have also tried standing on my faith in Christ to no avail.

It's time to pull your boots up and walk straight my brother. God is not a liar, He comes through for anyone who is standing by faith in Christ and He will NEVER disappoint anyone that is trusting Him. Know that!

To say, "To No Avail" means that God is a liar and does not hold to His promises.

"God is not a man that He should lie." If you are trusting Him, you can take that to the bank that He will see you through.

This is something that is rarely taught these days, just how powerful is the blood of Jesus Christ over your life?

He purchased you with that blood. It's not an in and out situation, you've been purchased, you are not your own anymore. Whether you succeed or flop all the days of your life, you belong to Him. The blood of Jesus Christ is more powerful than our petty problems.

If you want to get a good foundation under you concerning your salvation and the blood of Christ, the best place is among the Baptist Churches, they know more about the blood of Christ and your salvation than most other Churches. They will at least teach you that your salvation is not a feeling. Faith is faith.

Everest brother, you misunderstood me, I was telling him that he should go and see one of these variety churches who DO cast out devils, not cast devils out of him. Anyone who has had dealings with them would understand what bible4life was talking about and may give him a word or something. I say Pentecostal or some other group that believes in the power of God and the gifts of the Spirit. It doesn't have to be Pentecostal, but there is no sense in sending him to a Baptist or Methodist operation as they haven't a clue as they don't get involved in the gifts of the Spirit or casting out devils for that matter.

Alright, I gotcha. Thanks for clearing that up.

Hey guys, the last 3 days have been a little better. Actually two or three weeks ago i bought fish oil and bcomplex for my brain because i sought the Lord fasting 5 days that week and i sought the Lord in prayer like never before and i just didnt get better so i decided to just by myself some vitamins. The problem with me is i have believed the lies of the devil and in doing so have actually made things worse by believing them which has affected my health more and more. My biggest problem is in my mind, but their is also a struggle going in my spirit, i have been struggling with a spirit of laughter for almost 2 years now and when things in my spirit our just not right, their is just something wrong within me. But, as far as what wisdom have i taken and what i havent. I have made efforts in contacting jim logan and other deliverance ministers. They have prayed with me and given me wisdom. I have also learned t spend time in prayer and reading scripture on a more daily basis, even though the lst two weeks i have not everyday because i was overcome so much and got weary. But spending alone time with God i have done and at times i get stronger physically, but the word really has not affected me much spiritually, it is really has been dead most of the time to me, in the sense it is not going int my heart. I also have tried going through confessing every sin, asking forgiveness by Christ and renouncing the sins, many times through almost every sin i can think of. Their have been a few times where i have asked God solely to take the burden off of me because everything else i tried even me taking authority over the devil backfired and everyones efforts seem to not help, that the Lord strengthened me and a few times i thought i was back to normal. I am a very confused person right now, i dont know what to do, i have tried so much, i am sick of being tired and weak and being abused by the devil, but i dont have the strength like i use to.

The thing is i have been delivered in the past in some situations when most would have thought i should have got help, God had revealed to me i was under demonic attack a few years back when i started losing my memory out of nowwhere one week, i sought for help a whole week and nothing got better then when i stopped trusting everything else and began just trusting God i was delivered and then it started to come back a few hours later and then that was when the Lord revealed to me i was under demonic attack and i began resisting the devil and by the end of the week they ended up fleeing.I also over the past few years have been attacked with other various attacks on my body and mind, with almost hallucinations in my mind and losing reality of who i was a few years back, to getting attacked almost with blindness, attacked with attacks of fear or depression that i realized was a spirit of fear, not some chemical imbalance, somethings our physical, but many things our spiritual, and i was able to reject the spirit of fear and it left, others would have told me take these meds, though it doesnt sound like it, over the past 5 years i have learned a lot about the spiritual realm. The problem is with this past year i opened the door somewhere and these particular demons i opened the door to are very overpowering, it is possible about the seven spirits coming back into a person to make the state of the person worse before could of happened to me. Just knowing how bad it has been. I am almost 100 percent sure it is demonic, the reason i know that is that i have tried resisting these spirits over the past year many times and even rebuking them and at times i start getting stronger again physically and mentally and then these demons will come back full force and even worse when i fight against them bringing me into worse bondage, that is why i have found myself to have to really as of the last 6 months tried to just rely on God to fight for me because my effort was not working this time. Last year i did not have a prayer life at all, i was not in the word enough, i didnt have the armour of God on completely and i let my guard down.

John: It is very difficult to read your posts without paragraphs and punctuation, and they tend to ramble; squeezing ideas into others that is hard to sort out.

My suggestion; Slow down and think out your communication, and relate it in a concise and simple tone. I have compassion for your plight, as we have talked and prayed often.

Jesus said; " Peace I leave with you, My peace I give to you; not as the world gives do I give to you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid. "....

...and...."Love has been perfected among us in this: that we may have boldness in the day of judgment; because as He is, so are we in this world.

There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves torment. But he who fears has not been made perfect in love."

You must make contact with Jesus, and experience His love. Possibly your doctrine has led you top believe that the Holy Spirit does not manifest Himself; I do not know.

Have you been baptised in the Holy Spirit? Born again from above?..read Charles Finney, and his struggle, and his mighty baptism of Love he experienced. Many, many here have had the exact same experience; it is not all in the mind, or in the doctrine...it is actually in the Spirit.
I have, and every day experience Him, mostly in mercies. So have many brothers and sisters on this forum. You do not seem to find Him in this way.

I say this as reality, not judgment. You must trust in Him, and you must seek Him; another cannot do it for you, deliver you in faith to salvation. Others may pray that you be healed, but cannot walk your walk.

Have you received a dogmatic teaching that this mighty baptism is not of God, and from the devil? If so, repent , and trust God to give you this gift of the holy Spirit, that all of the apostles, and the multitudes of the early church received.[ I am not talking about speaking in tongues here..]

I do not witness this faith in your desperate posts, though I sympathize with your plight. Do not give up, but consider what I say. My hope for you John.

Hey Brothertom. My understanding at least of the baptism of the Holy Spirit was that once you are saved that the Holy Spirit comes to dwell in you and that it is possible the Lord will i increase the power of the Spirit in you with more revelation and strength, that God's spirit is infinite and unsearchable he can fill you with more and more of his Spirit. I have never experienced the baptism that you talk about, but am open to the real baptism not the one i have seen that produces people being supposedly slain in the spirit where they run around in circles out of control and speak in tongues in the congregation without an interpreter, or the supposed holy laughter. I dont think that is of the Lord. Some of the words of knowledge people get our simply not words of knowledge they are from either themselves or a false spirit. I on different occasions have had even a very sincere believer tell me my wife was getting a new job in two weeks and that never happened. Also i had a deliver minister say that what he was getting from the Lord was that i had a spirit of constipation, i was like okay that was not from the Lord. I even have gone to the international house of prayer where they were giving the weirdest words of knowledge about a kid with a fishing pole fishing and something about a young kid on skateboard, all off that is just not of the Lord. I truly believe their is a real baptism of the Holy Spirit, but it is not what we see in a lot of churches today and with the word of faith movement. I think a lot of it is just emotion caused by ourselves. That is just my opinion, i am very skeptical though seeing what i have seen or heard. What i hear about in John Wesley's time that sounds more real to me with people who fell to the ground unconscious because of conviction of sin.I have seen and been around a brother who was very strong in the spirit, but it produced great joy, righteousness, love for God and a love for others, and repentance, i believe that was real, he reminded of the early church by the way he lived and just how he was.But i do think their is a real baptism of the Spirit, just not the one that focuses on just speaking in tongues and the gifts that seems more self centered than God centered.

Hey brother i think what God did was show me through delivering me for the short period of time was to let me know what was going on and possibly so i could take up my defense against the devil, which when they tried to come back into my mind i resisted them, and actually what helped me resist them was remembering how Christ had all authority over the demons and that they obeyed him, that really helped me resist them, within a week the attacks basically stopped, here and their the devil would try again to come back, but i knew it was him. Before, i thought i really was losing my memory. I remember i had to call off two days of work because of the attacks on my mind. I barely could remember anything, but God came to my rescue. Most would have thought it was physical, but it wasn't. But, to your questions, no i have not praise God when a thought or event arises. I have a hard time praising God when my heart isn't meaning it. I mean not to say i haven't praise God when i have prayed at times or occasionally over the past year, but i have not used that technique since you wrote it. Their was one time while at work months ago, sometime last year that i was getting attacked extremely bad that i began to sing a praise hymn in tears and i did feel a peace come upon me for like ten minutes or so. Your second question, I actually a few mornings and nights have put on some worship music to go to bed to and also a deliverance prayer cd. This morning i tried to go to sleep listening to a sermon to.

I wanted to tell you guys something that happened today. As you all know i have been trying to figure out what was wrong with me exactly and over the past week i have had a few weird experiences that i am not sure what to think of.
My friend was talking to me on the phone last week and he had something about leaving our parents when you get married, and as you know i am still living with my parents. Well after he got off the phone with me i asked God if the problem was that i was staying with my parents and that he wanted me to leave and it was as soon as i said that i got strong out of nowhere physically, a little later that strength left me. So i really didnt think anything of it.
Then i was on the phone with a deliverance minister last friday and he was rebuking the demons bothering me and afterwards he asked me what my relationship with my parents was and i get really strange feeling and it was really strange like he had hit it right on the head. He also had said that their might be some generational curse. But, i prayed about it and nothing came of it.
Then today i started feeling a little better late tonight and my wife and i were talking about my problem and about me going to the doctor. She also was talking about how she missed the old me and everything. I was walking around the room and i felt something almost try to twist my head or my neck area and i just began to say what is the problem to God? what is causing this? My wife and i started of crying and i bowed my knee and prayed holding her hand while we cried together. We finished praying and she told me she felt a really good feeling. I went outside and i came back in and she told me she prayed to God that he would set me free and that if he wanted us to move out of my parents house that he would show her a sign by their being an m80 go off within ten minutes. And she told me that one went off and she felt these chills going down her body and she told me she had only felt that one time in her life and it was 5 years ago while in my old townhome she asked Jesus to save her and the same feeling she got then.

I am not trying to be superstitious, but just wanted to tell you what was going on in my life and was wondering maybe God is telling me i need to move out of my parents house.

Hey John, glad to hear that you're feeling a little bit better.

Two things really quick though.

One:

He also had said that their might be some generational curse.

This is completely un-Scriptural. Those indwelt with the Holy Spirit are not under any curse. I wouldn't listen to a single word by anyone who said you are, or even entertained the possibility. They don't know the Word of God if they promote such things. In fact, I would steer clear of the whole "deliverance ministry" racket all together, as it's not founded on Scriptural precedent. The only deliverance service that can be trusted is one that will guarantee your pizza within 30 minutes or your money back. Anything to do with delivering Spirit filled believers from demons will not be found in the New Testament.

Two:

I went outside and i came back in and she told me she prayed to God that he would set me free and that if he wanted us to move out of my parents house that he would show her a sign by their being an m80 go off within ten minutes.

Hey man, I'm all for God speaking to His children specifically and personally in a way that will relate to each one of us that we can understand. But I would be careful to take something like this as a sign. Asking for an M80 to go off on the 4th of July as a sign, wouldn't be too different than asking for snow in Alaska or Earthquakes in California as a sign. I mean, in the end I'll pray and trust that you and your wife will have the discernment to know if God has really spoken, but as a person who's not only seen friends and family members give loaded "fleeces" to God, but done the same in the past in hopeful ignorance, I would just be REALLY sure that this isn't outside the realm of wishful thinking. It's wise to be cautious about these kinds of things. As I've seen people make all kinds of funny choices based on "signs" such as these.

I'll continue to keep you in my prayers man, but so far the unanimous advice from those even with similar experiences to your own has been to prayerfully look into medical advice.

If nothing comes of it, then nothing comes of it. And we can move on from there, but you've received some sound advice so far.

On a related note, I have personally experienced demonic oppression from being involved in the occult. There were two distinct times that I believe I can place my finger one where I was demonically oppressed, even once to the point of beyond what I was feeling, another believer was actually able to see (not physically, but she perfectly could describe the darkness that was attacking me) the demonic oppression on me. When I was prayed for I didn't have anything "cast out" of me or anything like that. I simply had a pastor place his hands on me and pray for me, as the whole reason I was under oppression in the first place was because I had strayed from Christ and gone into the occult.

It left and did not return, until the second time when I again stepped out of the hand of Christ and pursued the occult, only for a moment. The same oppression returned, until I had repented.

The power of Christ is just that. Power. He doesn't deliver someone simply to let them instantly become oppressed again. We only see demons in the New Testament returning to abodes that were not instead filled with Christ.

There is of course, the oppression that Paul was under learning to trust in the sufficiency of the grace given to Him, but we don't see anything in the New Testament of someone being delivered for a matter of hours before the demons came back.

And like I said, although my experience is only valid in light of what Scriptures say on the matter, when I repented of my straying, and put my life back in Christ's hands, the oppression was permanently gone. Not just for a matter of hours.

Satan cannot do anything to you that God does not allow (look at Job).

I would strongly recommend listening to this message;

http://media.sermonindex.net/12/SID12025.mp3

I've posted it once before on here, and I have to say it's probably the best and most Biblically sound teaching's I've heard on the subject of demonic oppression, possession, and curses. It's very short, and to the point.

If you like it, I have a longer version by the same speaker on my computer that I can send you, that more or less just reiterates what was said, but just goes into greater detail.

i appreciate your wisdom that this might not be a sign. I wanted to point out the deliver minister did tell me that Christ's blood cleanses us from all our sin. But, i don't understand how it seems you guys dont seem to understand that i been having something actually hit me in my neck area and back area and it usually happens when i start resisting them. I remember one time when i started resisting them and i began to start feeling better and then something i felt push my head forward and tonight i felt something almost try to twist neck or something while i was walking around. I am not talking about just having a back problem or problem with my thoughts, i am actually talking about something afflicting me from the outside and i am actually feeling it happen. Something is dead set on hurting me.

Edit: I updated my post below and included a bit more info.

hey brother i am sorry for my tone earlier. I just wanted to say that their very well could be a problem mentally where i need to go see a doctor, but i was just pointing out the fact i have been feeling oppression on the outside with things hitting my neck and back area at times. Also my wife five years did asked to be saved, but really didnt see anything different since then that made me to believe she was, so i have always held that she wasnt, so tonight when she told me these things it was unsual. But, anyways guys i dont want to continue on with this much longer, i can only just seek the Lord and hope he delivers me. I would have to agree that the same seemed to happen with me is that i seemed to get oppressed when i began to fall into sin. I will listen to that sermon.

Tell me what you think of it when you do listen, John. If you want to speak off the forum my email is in my profile, and if you want to talk in person there are a few ways I can call the U.S. from here. Let me know, bro.

PS: I didn't pick up anything harsh in your tone or whatever, so no need to apologize for anything.

Trekker i have prayed about this and my house and even the people in it and those who use to live here. My wife and i do not do anything at all with the occult, my mom i pretty sure doesnt either, my dad the only thing i have seen him do is either mess around on the computer or watch tv, but he is fascinated with the supernatural like ghosts, aliens and bigfoot etc. My brother is someone on the other had i do not know, it is possible. My sisters use to live here to and actually i am in the room that they use to live in, i know they are also fascinated in the unknown and were big fans of the harry potter movie. I don't know if they ever did anything here while they lived here at all, i will pray about it again. As far as the people before we lived here i don't know exactly. Before Christ came in my life almost 9 years i did go to a psychic and brought a candle home that i used to pray with and did use to pray with angel tarot cards. Also i use to try to communicate with angels which would have been considered spirit guides, but i confessed those sins and renounced them and even got rid of the material. I don't know, pray for me about this. Yes i will try to listen to the advice already given.

That is what i am starting to believe that Christ is the only one to deliver me, he has many times, it is just this one trial he seems to be very silent. I actually was recommended battlefield of the mind by joyce meyer. I know that she is considered a false teacher, but it seems her book got a lot of praises and i noticed their is a lot of scripture verses that might be able to help me. But, anyways i can only just hope the lord will do something soon.

Double phone post.

Don't bother with Joyce. You hit the nail on the head that she is a false teacher. Her message is the same as E.W. Kenyon came up with that all the rest of the faith prosperity teachers promote.

I.E. Satan got the victory on the cross and immediately after the crucifixion Christ spent three days in hell where He became of one satanic nature with the devil until he was reborn in hell (I'm not making this stuff up either, Google it, crazy stuff).

You're going to get a lot more Biblically sound advice even on this thread than from a book written by someone with such a low and perverse Christology who said that, "Unless you believe Jesus went to hell, you can't go to heaven." (non-verbatim)

"He also had said that their might be some generational curse."

This is completely un-Scriptural. Those indwelt with the Holy Spirit are not under any curse. I wouldn't listen to a single word by anyone who said you are, or even entertained the possibility. They don't know the Word of God if they promote such things.

John is being oppressed by demons. He is probably riddled with fears and anxieties that only good solid foundational teachings from the word of God can alleviate those fears coupled with faith of course. If after being taught the word of God that he is still having issues, then something has latched unto him that needs to be "cast off" instead of "cast out". Besetting sins are hard to get rid of. They are the crutches that we keep because when the going gets tough we run to it for relief.

When John first posted on SI he had said that he had a certain sin that he had trouble getting rid of. Of course we know that he can't get rid of them, they are ALREADY gotten rid of, every person that has ever lived both sinner and saint the blood of Jesus Christ hath "taketh away the sin of the world, hence "Once For All".

He has probably fallen into this sin so many times that he feels alienated from God and feels like he is being attacked by devils. And I know what he is talking about. Condemnation is a real problem for many Christians. They feel that God hates them because they have failed to live up to being a Christian. Such nonsense only comes from the devil. Grace abounds further to grab us from that state and brings us back to where we belong. We need to understand that God loves us regardless if we sin or not. If God can love the world with all it's wickedness and filth, how much more now that we are in the family of God? If we fail God, God is not a mean ogre ready to cast us out. He didn't save us because we were perfect, far from it, He captured us because we need His help to become a son of God, but to become that we must first unload a lot of things that we have taken in as our "beloved" that is not God. Christ must be our crutch. We must run to Him when the going gets tough. To learn that takes time. Through sin and repent, sin and repent, and that stage where you no longer feel that God there, all those come into your life to shape you. None of it feels good, it's absolute misery. But it's geared to do one thing, run to God for change. It's the only way. Going back is not the answer, standing still is of no value, going forward to God is the only way for healing to take place and that is Gods way of getting our attention that even though we are believers, we still need to make the choice that God is our answer not our sin, not our pleasure, not a wife, not men, not money, but God.

Yes but why not explore it anyway?

Come come now, brother. That's not how responsible Christians handle the Word of God.

1 Corinthians 4:6

"Now these things, brethren, I have figuratively applied to myself and Apollos for your sakes, so that in us you may learn NOT TO EXCEED WHAT IS WRITTEN, so that no one of you will become arrogant in behalf of one against the other."

Why not just take the idea a little further? Acting like an "animal in the Spirit" isn't specifically spoken against in the Bible (even though the only time we see anything of the sort it's in relation to a curse, and has nothing to do with the fruits of the Spirit and a sound mind), so why not just give it a try? Where is the line drawn?

It's not drawn when we have guys like Todd Bentley kicking old women in the face with biker boots and claiming that it's the gift of healing. We just have to be open. Can't be found anywhere in Scripture, that's for sure. Why not just explore it a bit anyway? Bentley says it works after all.

For one to continue down the reckless path of this nature sets them up hook, line, and sinker to be the fulfillment of what was spoken of in 2 Thessalonians.

2 Thessalonians 2:11-12

"For this reason God will send upon them a deluding influence so that they will believe what is false, in order that they all may be judged who did not believe the truth, but took pleasure in wickedness."

If deliverance ministries and generational curses for Spirit filled believers where such big things, you'd think Jesus and the apostles would have at least mentioned it. Paul could have at least addressed say a chapter or so to it, (and the thorn in his flesh *WHICH HE WAS NOT "DELIVERED" FROM* has to be used in context to what he was speaking about, as it might have not even been a literal demon) since some men make it their ENTIRE "ministry". Yet, we don't see any examples of it.

Between "not exceeding what is written" and "just explore it anyway"... I think I'm going to go with Paul's admonition.

I know I know, Red Flag right?

Agreed.

I posted this to John:

You must make contact with Jesus, and experience His love. Possibly your doctrine has led you top believe that the Holy Spirit does not manifest Himself; I do not know.

Have you been baptised in the Holy Spirit? Born again from above?..read Charles Finney, and his struggle, and his mighty baptism of Love he experienced. Many, many here have had the exact same experience; it is not all in the mind, or in the doctrine...it is actually in the Spirit.
I have, and every day experience Him, mostly in mercies.

So have many brothers and sisters on this forum. You do not seem to find Him in this way.

I say this as reality, not judgment. You must trust in Him, and you must seek Him; another cannot do it for you, deliver you in faith to salvation. Others may pray that you be healed, but cannot walk your walk.

Have you received a dogmatic teaching that this mighty baptism is not of God, and from the devil? If so, repent , and trust God to give you this gift of the holy Spirit, that all of the apostles, and the multitudes of the early church received.[ I am not talking about speaking in tongues here..]

Bible4Life replied:Hey Brothertom. My understanding at least of the baptism of the Holy Spirit was that once you are saved that the Holy Spirit comes to dwell in you and that it is possible the Lord will i increase the power of the Spirit in you with more revelation and strength, that God's spirit is infinite and unsearchable he can fill you with more and more of his Spirit.

I have never experienced the baptism that you talk about, but am open to the real baptism ...not the one i have seen that produces people being supposedly slain in the spirit where they run around in circles out of control and speak in tongues in the congregation without an interpreter, or the supposed holy laughter.
I dont think that is of the Lord."

Brothertom's reply:... You say that you are "Open" to this Baptism, and you will not seek it I suppose, but yet immediately attack it as mostly giddy and false, and then justify your Dogma has how it has to be. IE: just growing more and more. This is the doctrine I was speaking of, the doctrine that says that all of the gifts are false, as is the Baptism. It is prevalent in the Baptist Denominations, and most Evangelical churches.

I said nothing of these bizarre manifestations. I spoke of Charles Finney, who received the real thing, and shook America at her roots with his holy ministry. His published account of his quest to find God is written in autobiographical style, and has been highly published.

Did you know that Charles Finney was in the ministry before this experience? He was a devout, praying Christian. He was not seeking it per-se', but the Face of God, because he knew he was lacking in his walk; he was desperate.

Did you know that after this mighty encounter of "Baptism of Love" that Charles Finney confessed that all of the years that he believed he was saved, were false; that he was not saved before that event?; Read the account.

Finney was desperate, as you are. He sought God in deep repentance; ashamed and religious, he laid in a secret place in a field seeking, crying out that God would meet Him. He did.

John, I have not bore witness of this Presence in you, in our many talks and prayers. You always express your torment and desperate need; continually. I do not think that man is able to help you; you must find this healing in God alone. Read Finneys struggle, and John Bunyan's too; very similar.

I could give you my testimony too; it is similar. God Baptised me in Love on a street corner over 40 years ago. I immediately began to share that love, and people were converted to Christ.

These evil spirits may be allowed to attack you, but not to remain so; they cannot dwell with the Holy Spirit, and they are not allowed to torment you.

"There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves torment. But he who fears has not been made perfect in love."

The Baptism of the Holy Spirit is the experience of perfect love invading the sinner; making him one in union with love. Seek God and repent unto brokeness and tarry there until He comes John, and He will. Jesus is waiting and wants you.

Between "not exceeding what is written" and "just explore it anyway"

I am telling John that I explored it and it was helpful. I am not telling you since you don't believe it. It helped me during my time. I had no devils cast out of me, or anything like that. God was in this, as I said, it helped me get beyond certain things. I wanted God and I was leery about anything that might look like it was deceiving.

You went right into casting out devils, and I didn't say anything about that, you just assumed that that is what I am talking about, I am not. I said "Cast Off" the besetting sin.

You seem to have opened your door to him, he's your project, then instruct him.

But John don't be afraid of the other, you'll be alright.

This is not about exploring how dogs bark or how people like to quack like ducks and slither around on the floor like a snake. That sir is not what I was saying.

No, I agree. You were not promoting any of those things. However, what you did promote was the same path that led people to these things. The "It can't be validated Scripturally, but try it out anyway because it worked for me" path.

That's how these things start. Even though as a Spirit filled believer we are no longer under any curse, we just "explore a family curse prayer"

It's just a prayer that is offered over the person to cut off anything that might be attacking him from his family line.

"I know Your Word says I'm not under any curse, but I'm just going to pray something to get the family demons off of me anyway, just in case Your Word can't be taken at full face value."

This is how one begins their journey down THAT particular aforementioned path.

You seem to have opened your door to him, he's your project, then instruct him.

Interesting way of wording it. I'm just troubled when I see any brother who's struggling given advice that doesn't fully jive with Scripture, no matter if it "works" or not. If I've misunderstood you then I'm quite sorry, but I've also seen you give others the advice of exploring something not found in the Bible on other threads in the past, so I'm taking my chances. No personal ill will intended, bro.

The Only way that any of us are going to make it in the days ahead, is to stay with Scripture Only.
I could never fault anyone for having that motive.
Our GOD will Bless and annoit that sole purpose when it's in our hearts.
HE is "The Word of GOD" and His Spirit is given for the sole purpose of leading us into all Truth and not to speak of Himself. Amazing mystery. His Spirit is The Spirit of Truth. John 16:13,14

Jesus Bless!

The Only way that any of us are going to make it in the days ahead, is to stay with Scripture Only.

I couldn't agree more.

Hey I just took a look at found your response today. I was going to give an update at first, but changed my mind, but i guess i will anyways. I did not pick up joyce meyers book after all, i don't think that is the issue completely. I don't know if my heart has become blind to the truth because of satan or myself and my sin, but i know that my faith over the past few years has slowly started falling from what it once was and the Holy Spirit i dont hear from anymore. I have been doing better trying to trust God alone, but my faith is really taking hit as i have got better physically and mentally.

The Greek word translated "possession", is actually "demonization". Why would the satanic possess and oppress the ungodly? The already have them. Their enemy are believers, true believers, who have at least a beginning of understanding of godly spirituality. By rejecting spirituality, the conventional church has also already resigned to a powerless form of godliness, and are generally outside the spiritual warfare that confronts the true believers.

If you like Greek studies, it's an interesting one to look up the word "ekballō" (to cast out) which is the word used when talking about those who had a demon dwelling in them that was cast out.

Check the usage in the New Testament, and see how many times that word is used in relation to demons in Spirit-filled believers.

Yet my question has still gone unanswered.

I'm just looking for a number.

But I'm glad you brought up Daimizomai (Strong's G1139). It's used 13 times in the New Testament. Despite what you said about mis-translation, it's more or less unanimously agreed upon to mean "under the power of a demon". Which would coordinate with what the Scriptures gave testimony to, about the person that was Daimizomai.

New tally, how many times was Daimizomai used for a Spirit-filed believer in the Bible?

Hint: the answer is the same as the one to my initial question.

Affliction is not something I'm arguing. I well believe that a Spirit-filled believer can be oppressed. Possessed is an entirely different subject, as it is addressed differently in Scripture as well.

I'm not arguing affliction, I'm arguing possession, which is where we see the power given and the need to cast out.

The two are highly related.

One of the problems is your premise about Satan and his forces not possessing the un-Godly. This will/cannot be verified by Scripture, as it in fact gives evidence to the opposite. And from this starting point you've had to repackage how the Bible defines oppression and possession, as the initial premise is not accurate.

I've checked the Greek. From MULTIPLE sources. And it most certainly does speak for itself. It's always translated (not transliterated as there is a difference) as to mean, "Under the power of a demon".

Having to speak multiple languages where I'm at, it's quite important to understand the difference between a "translation" I.E. "under the control of a demon" and a "transliteration" I.E. "demonized". There's good reason why all lexicons and every Greek scholar I've ever heard on the subject who actually knew what they were talking about translate it as "possessed". Simply because, that's what it's talking about.

Also in relations to demons we do see the idea of possession clearly used when Jesus references Satan and the demon possessed in Mark 3:27 and Luke 11:21.

You're using a Gnostic approach to get the Scriptures to say what you want them to say. This is not the Berean way.

To change the noun for demon into a verb, does not give any translator liberty to impose the English word possession on that verb. To understand the meaning of being "demoned" or "demonized" can only be understood from the rest of Scripture (of which there is abundant evidence) and practical experience. I have presented the general teaching of Scripture on the issue, and can do no more. I also have spoken from years of dealing with Christians suffering from this problem of demonic influences, from my failures and successes.

I agree that we have to use the rest of Scripture to come to our definition, however that's how this conclusion was come to. Like I stated before, the word for "cast out" and the word for "possessed" along with the pattern in described in Scripture does not line up with your supposition of what it is to be "demonized".

And the mistake continues to be the confusion (or so it seems) of the difference between a translation and a transliteration.

Here are some examples;

If you read the word television, what do you suppose is being referenced?

In Japan, if I said to you that I am grinding sesame seeds, what am I doing?

Twice I have asked a simple question, as to how many times we see someone who was "demonized" as you put it, (appearing 13 times in the New Testament) being used in reference to a Spirit filled believer. I also asked then how many times we see a Spirit filled believer having something "cast out of them". Since you've refused to answer both times and instead faulted me on how the question was asked I'll simply state the number of occurrences.

Zero. The correct answer is zero. It's very simple and straight forward.

And I'm hesitant, and don't mean this too harshly, but the Scriptural "evidence" you've given for your premise was extremely misconstrued, and borderline hatchet job. I would not consider anything contextually you've presented to line up with the way one is to rightly divide the Word of God.

My initial two questions were and are pertinent to the discussion. You can continue to ignore them, or refuse to answer because you do not like my perceived tone (which I apologize if it came off as aggressive or something of the like), or try and divert from them, but they stand nonetheless.

When you can find an example of either one occurring within the life of a Spirit filled believer in the New Testament, then we will have a discussion. Until then, I'm sorry to say that I find no Scripturally consistent substance to your claims.

As i have told some of you before over the past year i am struggled having evil thoughts towards others and i told you that i their was like a spirit of laughter towards others which i could not explain and i have hated these things going on in my thoughts and life. As i been reading the gospel of matthew it says that evil thoughts come from the heart of man and goes on to list of sins. I believe my bad thoughts are so bad because of my heart is wicked. I have been examing my heart for some time now even before i posted this prayer request and i know thought my problem is not just demons, but primarily it is the sin in my heart.
At one time i was not in bondage to sin like this and i walked with the Lord and had a love for people and obeying God, but now i am realizing that i don't have any love in my heart, i very selfish and prideful, hypocritical and self righteous judgmental and critical, hateful and angry, and the list goes on. Many of you might say well that is great your coming out and telling the truth into the light, but one thing you have to understand though i realize i am like this in my heart and my mind, but i do not have godly conviction over this the way i should. I hate in a sense, but i am not really broken over it, it disturbs me and makes me mad i am thinking this way and my heart is like this, but i am missing godly sorrow and conviction. I have sought the Lord about this to deliver me and at times i get slightly better, but then i fall again getting angry at someone or whatever sin it is and it seems i become even blinded even more than before. So i dont think this just demonic, i think this has been caused because of the sin in my heart and has been something that has got worse over the past few years. Please continue pray for me about this.