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Does the Holy Spirit Elect Popes? ...

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Rahman

Flipping thru the channels last night i came across Pat Robertson just in time to hear him say, "Lets all pray the Holy Spirit leads the Cardinals in choosing the correct Pope" ... Yikes! That short circuited my brain for a minute as scripture tells me the bed of the harlot is a very dangerous bed to be in ... What's going on that it seems so many "big name" Protestants now, after JP II's death, are somehow lending spiritual credence to the RC system, or am i being overly prejudiced here? ...The Complete List of Popeshttp://www.ourladyswarriors.org/articles/popelist.htm

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Angyl

Is it any wonder? Remember there is to be a marriage of the worlds religions as our world winds down. The REFORMATION WILL END and we will come full-circle back to a single denomiation with the whore that is the Catholic church. You are right to wonder why the "superstar" protestant leaders are kissing up to the Catholics and their faith after JPII's death. You don't win muslim converts by praising their hellish religion, you do it by pointing out the severe error in their doctrine. The only reason for giving praise to a false religion is either because you admire it or because you want the followers of that faith to admire you.Pour the wine. It's time to get drunk.

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sermonindex

Does the Holy Spirit Elect Popes? ...Do cows jump over the moon?What's going on that it seems so many "big name" Protestants now, after JP II's death, are somehow lending spiritual credence to the RC system2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;This is John Wesley's commentary on this verse... very interesting indeed, and I think it answers your question completely:2Th 2:3 - Unless the falling away - From the pure faith of the gospel, come first. This began even in the apostolic age. But the man of sin, the son of perdition - Eminently so called, is not come yet. However, in many respects, the Pope has an indisputable claim to those titles. He is, in an emphatical sense, the man of sin, as he increases all manner of sin above measure. And he is, too, properly styled, the son of perdition, as he has caused the death of numberless multitudes, both of his opposers and followers, destroyed innumerable souls, and will himself perish everlastingly. He it is that opposeth himself to the emperor, once his rightful sovereign; and that exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped - Commanding angels, and putting kings under his feet, both of whom are called gods in scripture; claiming the highest power, the highest honour; suffering himself, not once only, to be styled God or vice - god. Indeed no less is implied in his ordinary title, "Most Holy Lord," or, "Most Holy Father." So that he sitteth - Enthroned. In the temple of God - Mentioned Rev_11:1. Declaring himself that he is God - Claiming the prerogatives which belong to God alone.Krispy

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sermonindex

The REFORMATION WILL END and we will come full-circle back to a single denomiation with the whore that is the Catholic church. Not for me... my spiritual roots run clear back to the 1st century. I do not consider myself Protestant... I'm remnant. But we discussed that on the other thread. (And I know you agree, Angyl)Krispy

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rookie

God is in control of all things. For some the election will mean judgement and for the remnant it is mercy and grace. God raised up Cyrus to destroy Babylon. Before that God raised up Babylon to destroy Israel. But through it all there was a remnant saved by the mercy and grace. We are called to discern light from darkness. God has already accomplished His will before the foundations of this world. In ChristJeff

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sermonindex

Can you elaborate, Rookie? Not sure I'm following you...Krispy

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rookie

Job 3421 \t“For His eyes are on the ways of man,\tAnd He sees all his steps. 22 \tThere is no darkness nor shadow of death\tWhere the workers of iniquity may hide themselves. 23 \tFor He need not further consider a man,\tThat he should go before God in judgment. 24 \tHe breaks in pieces mighty men without inquiry,\tAnd sets others in their place. 25 \tTherefore He knows their works;\tHe overthrows them in the night,\tAnd they are crushed. 26 \tHe strikes them as wicked men\tIn the open sight of others, 27 \tBecause they turned back from Him,\tAnd would not consider any of His ways, God works through all the wickness of man and for those who love God He will work all things for their good. What men meant for evil God will preserve His people. God set all men in their place. In ChristJeff

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Rahman

Angyl and Krispy,it's like they've lost there ever lovin spiritual minds ... What mind of Christ?Krispy i totally understand where you're coming from re: the RC church, the Protestant Church and the "remnant" ...

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Rahman

Hey brother Jeff! ... Hmmmm ... i know that God has all under control ... So are you saying that God does in fact elect all popes, or that He may step into human history occasionally and select one to a special purpose ... i have a hard time believing that God actually "elects" error, but no trouble understanding that He already knows what a man will chose to do and uses that to the benefit of his plan, as in God didn't cause Judas to betray Christ but He knew He would ... Am i making any sense?And doesn't God "elect" vessels of mercy and just "select" vessels of wrath, or am i just playing with words here?

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sermonindex

I want to thank God right now, that He led me to His Son, and that the men whom I model my walk on are such men as David Brainerd, John Sung and Frank Bartleman.

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ZekeO

:lol:

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sermonindex

Rookie (Jeff), Do you believe in free will? From your post it seems like you are saying that God causes all things to happen and that we are not much more than objects being moved around.Angyl and Krispy, Do you pray the Lord's prayer? "Thy kingdom come thy will be done on Earth as it is in Heaven." Why bother if you are going to be raptured before everything and most everyone is to be destroyed in the apocalypse? Apparently, from what I can understand of your beliefs, no matter what we do to make the world a better place and no matter how much we turn the other cheek and love our enemies, the vast majority of humans are doomed to everlasting hell. God is a God of Love and if the Holy Spirit is involved in the selection of the Pope, I'm sure Catholics and all of the world will be blessed.Bubbaguy

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rookie

Brs. Rahman and Bubbaguy,I do believe in free will. The Scriptures teach that God places men in positions. It is the men who err and walk away from God. Job 34:21 \t“For His eyes are on the ways of man,\tAnd He sees all his steps. 22 \tThere is no darkness nor shadow of death\tWhere the workers of iniquity may hide themselves. 23 \tFor He need not further consider a man,\tThat he should go before God in judgment. 24 \tHe breaks in pieces mighty men without inquiry,\tAnd sets others in their place. 25 \tTherefore He knows their works;\tHe overthrows them in the night,\tAnd they are crushed. 26 \tHe strikes them as wicked men\tIn the open sight of others, 27 \tBecause they turned back from Him,\tAnd would not consider any of His ways, I believe as the Scripture teach that God gives witness to all men. In verse 27 we learn that it is man who walks away, "Because they turned back from Him, and would not consider any of His ways." In terms of the pope and the catholic church, I believe God uses them to declare Jesus Christ to the world. Do all listen to Him, no. Do all Protestant's listen to Him, no. I just don't see the catholic church as the whore of Babylon. I believe the whore represents men's love of money. The financial institutions that man has created are the creations of men. All kinds of evil comes from the love of money. Matt. 6:24 “No one can serve two masters; for either he will hate the one and love the other, or else he will be loyal to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and mammon.Luke 16:9 “And I say to you, make friends for yourselves by unrighteous mammon, that when you fail, they may receive you into an everlasting home.The whore of Babylon lived long before the church age. In ChristJeff

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disciplejosh

Psa 75:4-7 "I said unto the fools, Deal not foolishly: and to the wicked, Lift not up the horn: Lift not up your horn on high: speak not with a stiff neck. For promotion cometh neither from the east, nor from the west, nor from the south. But God is the judge: he putteth down one, and setteth up another." Dan 2:20-21 "Daniel answered and said, Blessed be the name of God forever and ever: for wisdom and might are his: And he changeth the times and the seasons: he removeth kings, and setteth up kings:"Dan 4:17 "This matter is by the decree of the watchers, and the demand by the word of the holy ones: to the intent that the living may know that the most High ruleth in the kingdom of men, and giveth it to whomsoever he will, and setteth up over it the basest of men."I think I follow what 'rookie' is saying. These are the scriptures that kept popping into my head as I read through this thread.

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sermonindex

Angyl and Krispy, Do you pray the Lord's prayer? "Thy kingdom come thy will be done on Earth as it is in Heaven." Why bother if you are going to be raptured before everything and most everyone is to be destroyed in the apocalypse? Apparently, from what I can understand of your beliefs, no matter what we do to make the world a better place and no matter how much we turn the other cheek and love our enemies, the vast majority of humans are doomed to everlasting hell.Yea, well... that happens when one believes the Bible is literal and real. Can you honestly tell me that you think the world is getting better? We should do all those things you mentioned, so that we can rescue as many as we can.But watch the evening news... it's rather sobering.God is a God of Love and if the Holy Spirit is involved in the selection of the Pope, I'm sure Catholics and all of the world will be blessed.I'm sure "Catholics and all of the world will be" led further astray... sadly. I take no pleasure in saying that.Krispy

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Angyl

God is a God of Love and if the Holy Spirit is involved in the selection of the Pope, I'm sure Catholics and all of the world will be blessed.Presumptuous of you. God's ways are NOT your ways. Just because God puts his hand in something does not mean that immediate good will come of it. He raises tyrants and hellish doctrine as well as good and bad men.The next Pope, like every Pope before him, will be a witness to hellish, man-made doctrine responsible for leading many to hell for putting their faith in the wrong thing.At BEST, he is a deceived fool.At worst (for example, the current forerunner for the job, who is ON RECORD stating that you don't have to believe in Christ to go to heaven), he is a bona-fide, card-carrying member of Satan's chorus.How anyone who thinks that a man who has dedicated his life to the false witness of the Catholic church can be a "BLESSING" to the world is beyond me. Ultimately, such a man and his faith must be a curse.

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sermonindex

How anyone who thinks that a man who has dedicated his life to the false witness of the Catholic church can be a "BLESSING" to the world is beyond me.Angyl... bubbaguy does not believe in a literal interpretation of scripture, as you and I do. Therefore I can see how someone with that point of view would have a toleration for such religions as the RCC.Dont be too hard on him, I've seen little glimmers of hope in some (not all) of bubbaguy's posts.Krispy

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Rahman

Brother Jeff you wrote;"In terms of the pope and the catholic church, I believe God uses them to declare Jesus Christ to the world ... I just don't see the catholic church as the whore of Babylon ...The whore of Babylon lived long before the church age"Hmmmmm ... interesting ... i'll not launch a long campaign trying to convince you otherwise as your own salvation as a non RC certainly doesn't depend on your view on RC and the pope, altho i'm not so sure for an actual RC ... If you feel led you might want to check out my following post ...

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Rahman

To any who are interested in a comprehensive and startling history and discovery of satans Babylonish world religious system from Nimrod's Babel, to it's culmination as the harlot Babylon the Great spoken of in the book of Revelation, then listening to this 12part series "Scarlet Threads, History of Mystery Babylon - by Bob Faulkner" is a must! ...By the time you get thru Part 3 (The Church's First 300 Years) it'll begin to rip the covers off of satans influence into Christ own Church via the Roman church then, and on through 12 expose it in the Protestant church now ... Sinister!Easter and Christmas will never be the same to you again, even if you already know they're paganly tainted!Scarlet Threads, History of Mystery Babylon 1 - 12Bob Faulknerhttp://www.sermonaudio.com/search.asp?keyword=scarlet

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sermonindex

The whore of Babylon lived long before the church ageI've never heard that before. Since Revelation was written in the beginning of the church age, and it pertains to future events... how is it that the "whore of Babylon lived long before the church age"? Thats not very chronological...Krispy

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Rahman

Andrew Strom says NO to the RC Church and JPII ...https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=5238&forum=35

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Rahman

Krisp you wrote;"how is it that the "whore of Babylon lived long before the church age"? Thats not very chronological"OK you've called it, now are you gonna shed some light on it? ... Huh ... huh ... Hold up ... Wait a minute ... OK i'm ready ... 8-) PS - The sermon series link i provided really gives an excellent explanation of how the Church of Rome became the RC of the Revelation ...

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disciplejosh

any comments on the previously posted scriptures?

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Rahman

Brother Josh,i was looking thru a Commentary regarding the scriptures you gave and it seems to me they are speaking of promotion in a governmental/world power/rulership arena, which i have no problem with in that i know scripture call governmental authorities God's "ministers" ...Brother Lahry wrote this on his thread "Danger in the forums":https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=5232&forum=35Quote:"With God all things are possible". Yet too often, we tend to judge the feasability of something by our own perception of it's possiblity". Now i know that God operates in both sovereign and permissive will, which i came to a conclusion a while back is all sovereign really ... i totally believe that God allows governments to operate however they will operate as long as it fits His plan, and i know that He'll step in and sovereignly move things to His plan when ever He wants, but i will certainly be learning something totally new if God does in fact elect to power a false leader to a false religion that misleads multitudes ... Somehow that just doesn't fit the modus operendi of the same God who said that He wished all men to be saved ...i'm trying to keep an open mind here via brother Lahry's thread, but i can see God allowing such evil (via satans election/selection of false religions demigods) to power, i can't see Holy Spirit, the Spirit of Truth, operating in any kind of way to the election of the spirit of untruth ... Do you believe this to be the case, and if so please explain it to a brother ... :-? Lord God by your Spirit please reveal your truth here to us as we know that your ways are higher than our ways, in the name of Jesus, as it is your will i pray ... Amen

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