The Shaking of Things

Matthew 24:8

But all these things are merely the beginning of birth pangs.

1 Thessalomians 5:2-3

For you yourselves know full well that the day of the Lord will come just like a thief in the night. While they are saying, "Peace and safety!" then destruction will come upon them suddenly like labor pains upon a woman with child and they will not escape.

Hebrews 12:26-27

He has promised, saying, YET ONCE MORE I WILL NOT ONLY THE EARTH BUT ALSO THE HEAVENS." "Yet once more," denotes the removing of those things which can be shaken, as of created things, so that those things which cannot be shaken may remain.

Luke 21:11

and there will be great earthquakes

The Daily Express reported that in the last 96 hours seven great earthquake struck the Pacific rim of fire. Japan experienced three of these earthquakes. Magnitudes were on the high end of the Richter scale. Scientists are concerned that these earthquakes could give rise to a greater earthquake yet to come.

As I read this article, I could not help but think that God is giving us a warning. We need to look up for our redemption is drawing near. Scientists said that in the last decade the most destructive earthquakes occurring on this planet occurred. But also destructive earthquakes are occurring in a greater frequency. Almost as if a woman is with child.

I find it interesting that article uses the term "great earthquakes". This is a term that Luke uses in Luke 21:11. I use the New American Standard translation which is a word-for-word translation out of the Greek. This is not a contemporary translation.

Also the fact that there were seven great earthquakes may be of prophetic significance. For 7 is the number of perfection. Could it be that God is giving us a perfect warning that His Redemption is drawing Near.

Our brother Mark posted a thread where he had a dream. A dream of a woman riding a beast. The main message of the dreams seem to be that Jesus is getting ready to come soon. It seems that God is speaking to us personally as well as globally. It seems He is saying I am getting ready to come soon.

A short time ago I was sitting on my couch. I was reflecting in prayer before the Lord. The Spirit spoke into my mind saying you will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds with great power and Glory. At that moment all I could do was be amazed. I did not have a vision but only heard the Spirit speak into my mind that I would see Him come in the clouds with great power and glory.

Later that day I was at the bus stop reflecting on what I heard that morning. Again the Spirits spoke into my mind saying Jesus is coming soon. Be prepared to meet Him.

Brothers and sisters I believe our redemption is drawing near. Let us live our lives in expectation of His soon return.

Brother Blaine

Blaine

The ship has sailed, we have missed the train and the flight has left. Yup, it already occurred many years ago in
a magical and mysterious way, the times they have changed
and it's too late to say your sorry because everything is yesterday.

Bro your post reminds me of the old Larry Norman song. "I Wish We'd All Been Ready". It was pretty popular during the Jesus movement. I was converted during that time.

I don't know if you were trying to be funny. I am not a praeterist. I view the signs of Matthew 24, Mark 13, and Luke 21 to be birth pangs of the future, soon, return of Jesus.

When 7 great earthquake strike in the Pacific Ring of Fire in 96 hours. Then God is saying something. The question is are we listening.

I believe God in his mercy is giving us warnings. But at some point. He will withdraw his mercy. Then when he returns it will be too late for the unsaved.

I'm putting this out to the forum. Not to be an alarmist. But to remind us of the urgency of the hour. To remind us that we need to be about the business of speaking to our neighbors and friends about their need for Christ.

Brother let us be about that task and speak of Jesus to those who need Him. For our redemption is surely drawing nigh.

Bro Blaine

Bro I went back and read your post again. I almost said, "huh". Then figured you must have been poking some fun at the praetetist.

Yes Jesus Christ will return suddenly and unexpectedly, bodily and physically to Jerusalem and reign as King of kings and Lord of Lords for ever and ever. the Lion from the tribe of Judah glory and praise to God the Father, God
the Son and God the Holy Spirit.

But brothers do you attach any significance to the increase in destructive earthquakes?

PP,
God bless you friend. As far as The other threads where I mentioned context concerning the Day of the Lord are/were about Israel. To the ones who say all the OT Prophet's prophecies concerning Israel, her enemies, God's both using her enemies to bring her (physical Israel) to her knees to cry out to Him be part of spiritual (believing) Israel and also stepping in Himself at the end to defend her, save her, etc. have already been fulfilled or were fulfilled spiritually/metaphorically/allegorically/etc., but you have to deal with the fact that they come in the greater context (usually in the very same chapters clear references are made) that these things happen in the general context of "the end" or "the Day of the Lord", or "The Day of the Lord's Vengeance", etc. So God ain't done with Israel because He still hasn't come & both were spoken of in context of one another in the prophets. Make sense?
In Him,
Jeff

Brothers, respectfully, I would like to direct this back to the OP. Over 100 hours ago seven major earthquake struck the Pacific Ring of Fire. Scientists are believing that this could be a prelude to a major earthquake yet to occur in the Pacific Rim or another part of the world.

The signs that Jesus laid out to precede His coming would be great earthquakes. We are seeing an increase of great earthquakes occurring in greater frequency.

In going back to the verses which precede this thread. God is giving us a warning. A shaking is coming. We can sit in this forum and debate the particulars of this. But unless we look up from our keyboards we miss what is happening.

These earthquakes should be like the alarm clock going off. These earthquakes should remind us that soon He is coming. The question is. Are we listening? Are we listening to the groaning of creation? Are we listening to the shaking of the Earth?

Eph. 5:15-17

Therefore be very careful how you walk not as unwise but as wise making the most of your time because the days are evil. So then do not be foolish but understand what the will of the Lord is.

Respectfully Posted.

PP,
God bless you friend. Let me say First off, I believe again that 70 AD was a "type" of the first part of a dual fulfillment of a much greater fulfillment to come. But just for example, imagine if earthquakes & volcanoes got rattled off one after another & then Yellowstone went off? That would trump all other events of like kind EVER in history many times over (they recently discivered new reports of the magma chamber of this super volcanos is enough to fill the Grand Canyon 7 times).

But once again, Matthew 24 is set in one long talk from Jesus that at least definitely includes Matthew 24 & 25.

And in Matthew 24 he references Daniel again on "the abomination of desolation" spoken of by Daniel the prophet. In the greater context in Daniel, this is referring to "the Day of the Lord", or "The End" (not just "the Last days", but "the end"). And in verse 31 he says He will gather His elect from one end of heaven to the other? That happened somehow too already? And then he goes on to discuss it will be "as in the days of Noah". Why? Cause Noah's flood destroyed the whole earth & all in it, except the 8 "elect" on "the ark" of safety. That points to totality judgement (Ie "the day of the Lord's vengeance") not just Jerusalem. And then in 25 (remember there are no divisions in the original text) he goes to discuss the 10 virgins - 5 wise & 5 foolish. Clearly about the Lord's second advent/coming. And then the final judgement of the sheep & goats to heaven or hell laid out starting in 25:31.

This is all clearly showing the very end. The only way you can rightfully coordinate all of it in context without disregarding any of it is by hyper-allegorizing a lot of it, giving it "secret knowledge" meanings that only the Preterists "know" or "discovered", & interpreting everything through those lens created. Oh yeah, & ignoring the constant in context references to "the Day of The Lord" or even doing as the full blown hyper-Preterist (where it eventually must go to continue to look at passage after passage) and say 70 AD was the Day of the Lord & Jesus already came then. It's either that or ignoring it altogether. But neither really stand I believe, especially all the more as I study it more in depth, in context, in the original languages, etc.
God Bless,
Jeff

And also,
Respectfully, I don't even understand what you're saying about earthquakes?
1.) First, you say Josephus says there were horrible earthquakes in 70 AD (which I believe, but they were the mini-type of what comes at the end).
2.) Then you say Barnes says "earthquakes can mean political changes"? (The geopolitical changes in modern day match or exceed anything in history, & more/greater changes are ahead). Huh?

So which is it?

For one thing, I have no idea where Barnes gets that? The Greek word used there is "seismos". It is where we get the words, "seismology", "seismographs", etc. not once is it used in scripture to mean political changes but actual physical literal earthquakes. - to shake. earthquake, a shaking. It's used in this way in Matthew 24, 27, 28, Mark 13, Luke 21, Acts 16, Rev 6, 8, 11, 16, in the Septuagint - Greek Translation of the OT - Isaiah 29, Jeremiah 23, Amos 1, Zechariah 14,).

And besides that, it's in the context of famines (word there means exactly what it says, and how it reads in Agabus' prophecy concerning Jerusalem in Acts), pestilences (meaning great diseases that come initially from the animals), etc. To make this mean something else is irresponsible I think & leads you down by necessity a trail of "throwing stuff on the wall to see what sticks" translation/interpretation & its never ending & you can't make it all fit without saying we can't know the plain meaning of any thing. This to me is the main reason why Preterism is a dangerous way of interpreting the scriptures.
Just my 2 cents from my heart & my study,
In Him,
Jeff

And all of that Biblical interpretationally speaking on top of the fact that it's my understanding that modern scientists (seismologists, volcanologists, etc.) say the current day frequency of seismic activity is higher than any time in history, & that multiple fault lines & volcanoes are "due any time". So while 70 AD was I believe likely the greatest display of these things UP UNTIL THAT TIME, that was almost 2,000 years ago now & it's greater in frequency now than it was then (& now we have the knowledge to track those by accurate machines), & what's "due" to come at this point in many times over a greater magnitude/manifestation than anything in recorded history, probably since Noah & the flood (as it was in the days of Noah).

In March of 2010 a 9.0 earthquake struck Chile. The earthquake was so massive that it shifted the mass of this planet rotation by 2 or 3 inches. I believe that was the figure. But none the less the earthquake was so massive. It affected the rotation of the earth.

In March 2011 the earthquake that impacted Japan brought Japan and United States 6 feet closer to each other. It also impacted the rotation of the Earth period and shortnened solar day.

You can Google these two earthquakes and get the specifics. But though the rotation of the earth and the shortening of the solar day may be negligible to us. Earthquakes that can impact the Geo dynamics of this planet given how massive the Earth is. Such earthquakes would have to qualify as "great". A term that Luke uses in chapter 21 of his gospel.

So brothers I would say respectfully that God is speaking to us through the shaking of the Earth.

Brother Blaine

Right,
But 600,000 years ago, if you believe the old earth/gap theory, there were no humans on the earth. So God in prophecy would be speaking to what pertains to man, prophecy, His second coming, etc. So the fact that Yellowstone may have gone off 600,000 years ago (or any other earth calamities) doesn't change what God speaks of is coming on His time clock in the end before/at His return to the earth. All things (nature, man, prophecy) all work together under the sovereignty of Gods hand/will.
God Bless,
Jeff

It can be reasoned that there have always been earthquakes since the beginning of time. But the question is have the earthquakes increased in frequency and lower. I have posted of two great earthquakes that occurred in the last few years. Earthquakes of such magnitude that affected the geo dynamics of this planet.

Luke says that there will be "great earthquakes" which precede the return of Jesus. I believe the ones that struck Chile in 2010 and Japan in 2011 qualify as great earthquakes.

Also the fact of seven major earthquakes struck the Pacific Rim in a matter of hours should not be ignored.

God is speaking to us in the shaking of things. The question we must ask ourselves is are we hearing Him?

Brother Blaine

Right,
But go with me a little here brother: But if seismologists say they keep getting bigger, more frequent, more huge ones due, etc. & many of them are atheists, would anything at all possibly mean/qualify as anything to you? On top of that, if "we have always had earthquakes so it's no big deal", then why did Jesus speak of these things specifically in the context of birth pangs & then His return at the Day of the Lord? And honestly, doesn't scripture speak of those who scriptures say are "scoffers" who say "these things have always continued as they were & He has not returned"? I am in no way saying that you're a mocker or Scoffer, but I'm just saying these things have to mean something or ask why did Jesus even waste the time to mention it and then God have it recorded in Scripture (& we have to look at those scriptures & make sure we don't fall in the class of "scoffers" who "can't discern the signs of the times)? Basically what I'm trying to say is that if they are increasing in frequency and magnitude and there are many of the big ones due to go off at any time, not to mention that they are in as diverse of places as they have ever been or more, then give me an actual scenario that you can foresee that Jesus was actually referring to that could happen that would make you pause and think it was related to these prophecies at all whatsoever? The lens What many look through, unknowingly can be what is called "normalcy bias". It means "things have always been normal, so they must be normal now". It's the frog in the hot bath on the stove scenario & its tied to what Jesus said of those who scoff saying "these things have always been since the beginning of time" that God said was not good. That's the whole point. Are we looking to His second coming as the blessed hope, discerning the signs of the times, & doing the works He gave us to do?
God Bless,
Jeff

What would a "supernatural earthquake" or "supernatural earthquake frequency, intensity & geographical diversity" look like?

When the springs of the deep & the rain fell from the sky in Noah's day, it probably looked like a bad hurricane/flash flood/thunderstorm that just never stopped & was geologically/scientifically explainable (God creates the science behind the true science).

And when Jesus came the first time, He came in a feeding trough. Supernaturally, but missed by so many, except those looking at the prophecies & in expectation of their fulfillment.

My point is, what would make it "obvious" to you?

TMK,
I could elaborate more, but I will just lovingly caution you (& all of us) in this way: Just be careful of telling God "how it must look" in order to be "His fulfillment" of "His prophecies". 😊.
God Bless,
Jeff

Edited to add:

If you study out the "Bethlehem star" it is a perfectly "natural event" that happens every x-thousand numbers of years. The wise men knew it was coming & responded (it was actually the tripling together of 3 planets that created a "superstar" appearance - it also just happened again at the end of last year for the first time since then & the last time for hundreds or thousands of years). The maker of these things knew the end from the beginning & it is all "supernatural" in that God brought them into being just as they are. What I'm saying is if we are expecting "purple people eaters" & extra biblical phenomena to believe these prophecies, we will be disappointed, but not because God was untrue, but because we have attached our own expectations to these things. The wise men understood this. Do we?

How did they know? The study of the signs in the heavens & the words of the prophets...

Brothers I'm not saying this is supernatural. But there are earthquakes occurring in parts of the country where earthquakes don't normally occur. I'm speaking in places like Oklahoma and Atkansas. A few years ago Washington DC was shaken by an earthquake.

We think of earthquakes occurring on the West Coast. But earthquakes are starting to occur in parts of the country where earthquakes don't normally occur. This is worth paying attention to.

Also about the nature of birth pangs. They increase in frequeny. And become more pronounced. I think her brother Jeff can testify how about birth pangs. :-) He has six children with a 7th on the way. :-)

The birth pangs of the Earth are increasing in frequency and becoming quite pronounced. As I have been saying in my previous post. God is speaking. Are we listening?

Brother Blaine

TMK,
That's understandable how you'd think that, but that's not the case. It is exactly as I explained it. We know it now as "knowledge has increased" greatly & astronomers can by math run the clock back (or forward) & know exactly what happened. That's Biblical language, "God moved..." Because God ultimately moves, controls, & preordained everything. He created those orbits, cycles, times & seasons, etc. before the earth was even formed.
God Bless,
Jeff

Otherwise, how did the Magi know what/where/why they were following "His star in the east"?