I apologise to those who were looking forward to discuss the Kingdom of God with gladness in their heart, but found themselves in the midst of great controversy.
When I started the thread, I should have stated that I hold the view of amillennialism. I didn't, because I did not want it to be a discussion about escatology. I did not have any "hidden agenda" with this post, but simply wanted to share the experience and revelation of the Kingdom of God in our lives. Disclosing my view however would have saved all of you from much heart ache and puzzling about some unexpected responses.
I also apologise for not writing any posts (except the starting one) on this thread, but I did not feel "qualified" to do so.
Thanks everyone for posting, some of the posts were very heart warming to me, and some of them had valuable good teaching. I learned a lesson even from the controversy part.
God bless you,
Zsuzsanna
An apology
Sister you have nothing to apologize for. I believe there are some who should apologize to you for hijacking your thread. I believe you wanted a rich discussion without the contro.
I am taking a hiatus from posting on other threads except my devotional thread, Of the Persecuted. But I felt led to respond to your post. My sister you have nothing to apologize for.
Zsuzanna I do appreciate your posts. Don't let some ever discourage you from posting. Please jeep posting.
Brother Blaine
I too am amill in my kingdom convictions. But I call myself a nowmil. I believe the kingdom of God is in us now and will ultimately be consummated when Jesus returns. So I let Him fill in the blanks. :-)
Brother Blaine
You started the thread with the noblest of motives. I am of the premill view but you don't have to hang your head if you are amill. Normal standards of courtesy and etiquette were purposefully ignored by those who have come to be chronically rude and mean spirited. I hope you start another thread and there is no need to apologize. You had no hidden agenda that's just what others said. Bless you.
Yes I also apologies as well for not allowing the agenda to go forth unencumbered and without opposition to an anti-Christ spirit taking over.
Thanks for the encouragement.
Notdarkyet wrote :
///Yes I also apologies as well for not allowing the agenda to go forth unencumbered and without opposition to an anti-Christ spirit taking over. Rev you did good.
So sorry about that chief.///
and loving it
RE: ///and loving it///
Name calling and trying to hurt people , being rude and interupting discussions for no reason, using sarcasm in a mocking way ?
Is that what you are implying by : "and loving it" ?
Your heretic gang lost papa. sorry about that.
RE: ///Your heretic gang lost papa. sorry about that.///
Lost what ?
edit add : and what gang ?
Bro Greg ended the locked post with this :
RE: ///Towards personal attacks in this thread and claims of people hating jews, etc. Saints, please show grace, love and do not argue with each other by name-calling. This type of arguing is hurtful and does not bear witness of Christ's Spirit. We do not hold to an anti-jewish emphasis on SermonIndex to be clear.///
Lets all agree to abide by this.
As a person who took part in the previous thread on Kingdom of God, I have to say that this apology thread was very useful to me. In the kingdom of God thread, I could not understand why people were accusing the poster. Now I get to know about 'Amillennialism', a word I head only now! Blessed are the ignorant!
Little bit of googling gave me a picture of what it is. Having read about 'Amillennialism', I do not know what my view is called.
I believe that Jesus will physically rein over the earth for 1000 years. So I believe in Millennialism. But I also believe that the Church is a sample of that rule. Jesus is the head and ruler of the Church.
What does that make me? Is there a term for a belief of mine?
Personally I think any belief on things to come like Post or Pretrib, Amillennialism or Millennialism, should not separate us. New Covenant is not about predicting the future. It is about living the present by the power of God. Christ ruling inside us. If this is not happening, then even if we have a correct belief on the events of the future, it will make no difference on the day of Judgement.
Quote: "Sister you have nothing to apologize for. I believe there are some who should apologize to you for hijacking your thread. I believe you wanted a rich discussion without the contro."
Totally agree here, be encouraged ! The "hijackers " were the ones who disrupted it.
It concerned me that some of their posts were even allowed!
I can see a lot of humility and godliness in your posts which I can't see in the hijackers, maybe we need to pray for them.
By their fruit we shall know them - and now also also by their blogging.
May we all discover more and more of "the unsearchable riches of Christ," (Ephesians 3:8)
Be encouraged and be thankful that that the Lord is close to you - blessings!
Sree said:
"Personally I think any belief on things to come like Post or Pretrib, Amillennialism or Millennialism, should not separate us. New Covenant is not about predicting the future. It is about living the present by the power of God. Christ ruling inside us. If this is not happening, then even if we have a correct belief on the events of the future, it will make no difference on the day of Judgement."
Amen.
I was wondering what happened, I jumped into the thread when I saw what I believed was error to get clarification and several posts later all out war, to be honest I still do not fully understand what was transpiring and who all the players were since I did not even see the original thread on the Kingdom of God. I would recommend that in such a post as that where you narrow the comments to no teaching(theology) that you also start it off with some viable example, it is kinda like launching a boat in the direction you hope to travel. There is a wonderful little book on the mindset of the first century church by Justin Martyr called "We don't speak great things- We Live Them". Mark Felix's Octavius is a very wonderful little piece on what the world thought of the Cult call Christian and their (Our) God and the defense of such. Most of you can find it free on the internet I believe, personally I enjoy dusting off books and kicking back on the porch swing out back and reading real pages:)
The whole subject of The Kingdom of God is really a living out the power of God by the Holy Spirit in the world where we are, our little circle or sphere of influence and being as He (Jesus) was in this world. Our stewardship of those Heavenly resources in everyday life. I sadly fall short far to often.
To those who do not seem to get along? Let you Love cover a multitude of sins... DMiller
What about apologies from those who in a most disrespectful way hijacked the thread so as to be able to grind out their personal animosity toward others? Any hint of a small bit of an apology? I sense rather a type of gloating regarding the way they handled the thread. What of their culpability? Will we hear anything regarding this?
Yes they really should apologize.
Rev, between me and you we are one on this issue.
(and most other issues as well). No need to apologize whatsoever for pointing out the agenda.
"I was wondering what happened, I jumped into the thread when I saw what I believed was error to get clarification and several posts later all out war, to be honest I still do not fully understand what was transpiring and who all the players were since I did not even see the original thread on the Kingdom of God. I would recommend that in such a post as that where you narrow the comments to no teaching(theology) that you also start it off with some viable example, it is kinda like launching a boat in the direction you hope to travel."
Thanks for the advice. I did not define the topic and did not ask a starting question. It was not my intention to exclude theology or the scriptures when I said "primarily". I could have better put it as "not theoretical, but practical". I was preparing to share a testimony, but later refrained from posting as I realised that my view (opposed) was closely related to the topic, and also I already saw much wisdom in other posts.
I did not have an original post of the Kingdom of God. In an other thread where I shared my views I invited NDY to share his opinion and study the scriptures together... I do not have a fully formed escatological view, but some of the things I am certain of unless someone convinces me from the scriptures otherwise. : )
But escatology should not divide us, I fully agree with your satement:
"The whole subject of The Kingdom of God is really a living out the power of God by the Holy Spirit in the world where we are, our little circle or sphere of influence and being as He (Jesus) was in this world."
Unfortunately, the **outrageous**, and yes I mean outrageous, behavior by a couple has been allowed to continue by the moderator(s).
The only conclusion I can reach is that the moderator(s) could care less about extreme abusive and bullying behavior on a Christian forum.
Some of the comments on here are similar to what you read in the comments section of a worldly newspaper- perhaps worse. I expect heathens and pagans to behave like a**h***. But not Christians. Sorry there is no other word for it. Some words just fit perfectly. So it is what it is.
Nothing but trolling, outrageous conduct with no moderation other than the mildest warnings. I must conclude that the moderator(s) agree with this behavior in this case, for whatever reason, or don't see it, or don't care.
I am all for discussions where we may not agree. But discussions can be civil in disagreement. The days of witch hunts, iron maidens, and thumbscrews are over.
This is particularly true in matters that are truly debatable such as eschatological views. It has been stated by moderator(s) that the view of the forum is a literal 1000 year reign on the earth by Messiah. That's all fine and dandy. But that view has never been universally held, including by Puritan theologians and men like Matthew Henry whose commentaries really bear no equal.
I am certainly willing to admit that millenialism may be true, but there is absolutely no indication by those that hold that view that they just might possibly be wrong. To me that is the height of absurdity. How can a person be 100% sure about end times? The idea is ludicrous.
Accusations have been made here against a brother that he holds to the heresy of docetism. This is because he posted a quote on a whole other topic by a man who apparently was a docetist. This was not known when the quote was posted. This has all been explained, and unfortunately this person has been forced to defend himself against these absurd accusations and has stated he is not a docetist. Yet the outrageous abusive behavior is allowed to continue. Why? Again I ask why? I will tell you why. Because there is a difference of opinion on a debatable topic between these persons and two of them can't deal with it. It's worse that middle school kids on a playground picking on someone and believe me that can be pretty ugly.
But I thought scripture says "When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child; but when I became a man, I put away childish things."
So I ask again, why in the world is this behavior allowed to continue? Simply locking threads is not the answer because this vitriol spreads like cancer.
I for one am sick of it. I am sure everyone else is tired of it as well. Not sure what the answer is but it seems a couple of individuals' sole purpose in life is to destroy this forum.
So true they should be kicked out just like Blaine, Frank and Neil were a number of times. You know the solid guys. It would be my pleasure to join their company
There is a story that comes out of Mother Russia. I do not know if the story is true. It may be a parable. It may apply here.
The story is told of for men who were in prison for their faith in Christ. One man was a Russian Orthodox priest. The other man was a Catholic priest. The other man was a Baptist pastor. The other one was a Pentecostal preacher. Obviously these men came from different theological suasions. During the purges of Joseph Stalin and his hatred of things Christian. These men were imprisoned and sent to a gulag in Siberia.
Before this time these men did not know one another. But finding that they had been imprisoned in the same gulag. And put in the same barracks. They recognized the faith that each one had. These men called one another brother instead of comrade. These men begin to minister the love of Christ to one another and to their fellow prisoners.
The commandant of the gulag could not stand the Christian witness of these men. Repeatedly they were tortured. They were beaten. But the men continue to confess their faith in Christ. And continue to minister.
Finally the commandant ordered that these men be executed the next day by firing squad. On the last night these men celebrated their time together. They were not arguing about their theological suasions that they had come out of. But they were celebrating the Lord Jesus Christ period and rejoicing that they would be in His presence tomorrow.
The next day the commandant for the man to be tied. The guards were ordered to raise their rifles and execute them. During this time the men said that they forgave the guards and the commandant. They exhorted the guards and the commandant to repent and believe in Christ. There was such love shown from these men that at first the guards did not want to execute them. But the commandant threaten the guards and eventually they were shot and ushered into the presence of Christ.
Again I do not know if this story to be true. But Brothers think. If we find ourselves in a FEMA death camp. And we have different eschatological views over the return of Christ. Are we going to be discussing these things. But rejoicing that we are counted worthy to suffer for Christ period and encouraging our fellow prisoners. Even if we are marched to the guillotine. We know that eventually we will be in the presence of Jesus.
I have opened up a thread to try to discuss the reality of the kingdom of God in our midst. Is it not more important that we live out His kingdom in this day and time. Then disagree over when he's going to return. And how He's going to return. And what His kingdom will consist of.
Should we not be more concerned about pleading with others to come to Christ and fleeing the Wrath to come. Should we not be encouraging one another to be consistent and a faithful walk of obedience to Jesus.
I don't know what more to add brothers. But I would try to encourage us all walk in the spirit of love and humility toward one another. Better man the us have debated the kingdom of God and His soon return. I don't think they've come to the consensus either of how it's going to work out.
But the clear exhortation of scripture is that we walk in love toward one another. I for one have contributed to dissension in this forum. And this I repent of. My desire is to be conciliatory. To let my conversation be full grace. And to not give the devil an opportunity.
Again my brothers. Just my thoughts.
Brother Blaine
I agree with you 100% Bear. Absolutely. Hallelujah!
But soon very soon a certain someone is going to make a smartass comment to your post.
Let's just sit back and see what happens.
The hockey game is on and as a Canadian it is vitally important that I watch it.
(Except for the commercials) We could carry on tomorrow however.
Saints (I even grimace saying this word right now),
This type of language and comments and attitudes are unacceptable. How can you walk with Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit and talk and act in such ways? Is there no grieving of the Holy Spirit in your life? Don't you all realize that this is bringing great shame to the Name of our Lord.
I have been moderating and help serving believers on this discussion forum for over 13 years and I have never seen such childish, carnal attitudes and comments. It is not just one person but many.
This will not be allowed to go on, if this continues we will simply remove accounts of believers that continue to act in this way as this is a repeated attitude and sin.
At the bottom of every thread post submit box it is written:
All our communication matters in the Lord and we ask that you consider that all our words will be accounted for by God one day: Matthew 12:36, James 1:26, Colossians 4:6. Speak with gentleness, with a servants heart. Imagine our Lord in the same room with you watching what you say to other believers. Speak to edify and love others and choose not always to be right but rather right in your attitude of humility and humbling yourself. You can review the full SermonIndex Community Guiding Principles (opens in new window) for more thoughts on how to post on the forums. https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=44556&forum=13
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How can we say such things to each other as believers and the Lord see's these things, He surely weeps.
this thread is locked.