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ISIS Kill List Names 15,000 Christian Americans Targeted for Death

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sermonindex

http://townhall.com/columnists/bethanyblankley/2016/08/04/isis-kill-list-names-15000-christian-americans-targeted-for-death-n2201586

According to a report recently made public, early this year, ISIS specifically identified 15,000 Christian Americans for death and instructed jihadists already in America to begin widespread murder.

The Kill List report comes in the wake of ISIS already publicly warning American and British Christians that "they were next.” British police last week publicly warned its 5.4 million Christians to be on alert and in some areas increased security.

But,Circa News reports that the FBI did not notify American Christians who are on the ISIS "Kill Lists.” On its website it states:

"The FBI did not alert numerous Americans that they were placed on secret Islamic State kill lists or notify their local police about the potential dangers, a lapse in the government's efforts to combat the terrorist group's evolving strategy to target everyday citizens.

"To date, the terror group that goes by the acronym ISIS has published on encrypted web sites several hit lists naming more than 15,000 people it would like to see killed by sleeper cells or lone wolves in New York, Texas, Florida and California.”

Circa News was able to obtain copies of some of the lists and several individuals named on the lists. In Texas, for example, Circa News contacted 24 people marked for death. Out them, 22 had no idea that there was such a list or that they were on it.

It is believed that the list was purportedly created from an Internet search of church directories.

Michael Snyder of Charisma News remarked that the FBI did inform him that he and his wife are on the list. After further research, they discovered that his pastor and other members of his church were also on the ISIS Kill List.

Leaders of Christian organizations and Christian pastors should contact their local FBI and law enforcement to investigate if they are on the list and also request that security measures be taken to protect their congregation.

Despite the warning, good news does exist. Snyder pointed to a Detroit News article that describes how a 21 year-old Islamist from Dearborn Heights, Michigan, Khalil abu-Rayyan, decided that because he couldn’t commit Jihad overseas””he would find a mega-church in Detroit.

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forrests

Thanks for sharing! I plan to mention this to the brother who pastors a little church I've been attending- and seriously consider coming out of the "above ground" church all together (again). It may be time to go "underground" here in the US.

(I would also recommend removing yourself from all social media and deleting your accounts - especially if you are open about the Lord and there are also personal details and information on it as well. I felt the Lord leading me away from such platforms and by the grace of God started walking away from them a couple of years ago. I do not have any social media profiles right now, and I am thankful to Jesus that I don't. I'm not being legalistic- just recommending the saints to exercise serious caution.)

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Heydave

Isn't going 'underground' and removing the visibility of Christians exactly what these people want?

Did Paul or any of the apostles go 'underground'? Maybe directly after Jesus was crucified, but not after Pentecost.

There may be reasons for believers to go 'underground' when the state itself is persecuting, but to cave into fear at terrorist groups such as this just gives them the result they seek, imo.

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forrests

by Heydave on 2016/8/5 6:14:30

Isn't going 'underground' and removing the visibility of Christians exactly what these people want?

Did Paul or any of the apostles go 'underground'? Maybe directly after Jesus was crucified, but not after Pentecost.

There may be reasons for believers to go 'underground' when the state itself is persecuting, but to cave into fear at terrorist groups such as this just gives them the result they seek, imo.

I disagree. I see an "underground" church in the book of Acts and in the epistles. I see Jesus telling His disciples to flee persecution. If you feel that the Lord is calling you to something different - then by all means obey. But I sense that the Lord has been "hiding me away" in many ways and that I am called to "fly under the radar" to a degree. If "lone wolf" terrorists may be shooting up churches or targeting Christians, I don't believe I am scripturally obligated to put a big red target on the backs of my wife and children by continuing to attend a traditional church. We can also be "wise as serpants" and meet in homes and evangalize as led by the Spirit (like they did in Acts).

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Heydave

Quote: "I see an "underground" church in the book of Acts and in the epistles. I see Jesus telling His disciples to flee persecution."

Can you show mw the scriptures on this please (i.e in regard to this type of persecution).

Thanks,

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sermonindex

This is for each one to take before the Lord I believe. I don't think it's to the point of the one extreme of say getting rid of My Instagram account on which I share about Jesus & the Gospel daily. But if someone else does, that's fine. I could see it getting to the point where we want to be wise as serpents & not ruin chances to be around to share Jesus with those the Lord leads us to, but I don't see us as "there" yet personally. But if someone else feels so led, then so be it, I have no judgement on them for this.

I do have a question: for everyone on the forum - can we say this is a clear evidence of coming (or arriving) persecution and/or judgement? Is that not becoming clear yet without it being called "fear-mongering"? Some see it coming sooner than other (prophets prophesy it when no one can "see" it, why they were once called "seers", watchmen on the wall see it coming from off in the distance because they are watchful and alert, but some are so adamant against these warnings they can then even refuse to see it even as the arrows are flying over their heads over the city walls & troops breach the city walls.

I have shared for a long long time that I believe Islam will be used in the hands of the Lord like He said in the OT "my servants, the Assyrians" to accomplish His will of waking up a mostly sleepy &/or immature church in the West. And I think part of our calling will be to help those confused make sense of it, show our ability to draw on God's grace through Jesus by the Spirit, not love our lives to the death, & yes, even search our hearts concerning loving even our enemies & praying for those who persecute and despitefully use us. This, I believe, is still in the beginning stages & will continue to ramp up and increase in the days ahead.

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docs

/This, I believe, is still in the beginning stages & will continue to ramp up and increase in the days ahead./

Along with growing anti-semtism and the further isoloating and ostracizing of Israel.

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sermonindex

The only such admonition in scripture is when Jesus is sending out the disciples & says, "if they persecute you in one city, flee to another...and if they do not receive you, shake the dust off of your feet...." This is disciples, apostles really, being sent out as missionaries, if you will, to places other than their home for evangelism/ministry, & if they aren't received in one place, they are told to flee elsewhere. This isn't "stay at home where you already love, tell no one you are a Christian, give no visible or verbal indicators of it to anyone anywhere, & run and hide up in the mountains..." There is a difference. And even then I can see a time coming, of Jacob's Trouble - The Great Tribulation, where the bride is hidden away in the wilderness and protected for a season, and then afterwards is still overcome by the enemy (to those who would say "NO, WE ARE OVERCOMERS!" I would say the answer to what seems contradictory Bible is always more Bible - the scriptures say the bride will be hidden away for a season in the wilderness and protected & then will be overcome in this life by the enemy. I believe this to be the first 3.5 years vs the second 3.5 years of the time of Jacob's trouble). So let each one be convinced of these things in his own mind, search the scriptures, & be prepared to share Jesus at all costs, lay down their lives and comforts, take great risks for Jesus, flee if the Lord so leads, & be living as walking "witnesses" (from the Greek word Martyrias from which we get "Martyrs") even now. Of course, if you think all of this already happened in 70 AD, that sounds like gibberish to you and you can just kick your feet up & ignore it all because "every since His coming things go on as they always have..." & you can wait to just "be secretly raptured" (if you're pre-trib) which is escapism, or you can just wait around doing nothing different if you think the next event is Christ's imminent return (if you are a Kingdom Now Dominionist) & ignore all that I just said from the scriptures. Don't get me wrong, of course even if we die we win, "but to the one who has understanding and will teach many" in these last days, we will "know our God and do great exploits". I believe that, even if we are having to flee and hide to do it. That may not happen as soon as I think in my lifetime, but I think it certainly may. Especially looking at the prophetic eschatological scriptures, what's going on in the Islamic world and in Israel, & based on all of the birth pangs Jesus spoke of to look for beginning to come to pass, at least in the infancy stages. No one knows the day nor hour, but the fact is, America "could" even get devastated by internal Islamic terrorists & even Nuked from Russia/China/N Korea/Iran before all of these final events get fully cranked up anyways. Either way, the message is to "be ready". Have your lamps full of oil burning and trimmed, shining brightly, eagerly awaiting (the correct translation from the Greek of "hastening") the Lord's return and the culmination of all these things! That's not fear mongering either. I think it's actually exciting that we live as close to the return of the Lord to the earth as we do! Anyways, God Bless,
Jeff

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Yes Docs, absolutely. The "controversy of Zion" will be more of a forefront issue in the days ahead other than just a theoretical atherial theological discussion relegated to the replacement theologians, many of whom stand in support of those who oppose Israel. The issue of Israel & God's purposes will be a much more prevelant issue in the days ahead

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And by that I am speaking of the disciples in thought of NT Wright, Philip Mauro, Stephen Sizer, & the modern "Christ at the checkpoint" crowd. While I love Palestinian Arabs as much (or more) than they do, their movement is riddled with propaganda, lies, etc.

Interesting to note, the apostate "ministry" of World Vision (the same one that came out for gay marriage a couple years ago and then "retracted" it when they lost a ton of donors) just got exposed. They had a representative over Gaza named Mohammed (a Muslim) who was funneling funds given for "Palestinian Arab Christians" to the terrorist organization, Hamas. These people and the foolishness of much of their position I believe will come to light and be exposed in the days ahead.

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If you are a pastor or ministry leader in the USA you can check your name here to see if you are on the list:

http://counterjihad.com/are-you-on-the-list/

I believe they have the updated new list of 15,000.


this scripture is soon coming to pass, it will not just be ISIS who is targeting believers in the West:

Matthew 24:9-10 New International Version (NIV)

9 "Then you will be handed over to be persecuted and put to death, and you will be hated by all nations because of me. 10 At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other,

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ThyKingCome

I went to take a look at it and you have to leave your full name and e-mail address just to "look" at the list. I'm sure the Apostle Paul would be on this list if he were alive today. Our best defense is staying close to Christ, ready for His return and being in the will of God. Our days are numbered by the Almighty, not I**S.

Love to you Brethren.

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sermonindex

I agree. If you study it out and see the validity in an Islamic Antichrist (as opposed to some European leader out of nowhere), you see it's related closeness is possibly nearer than we might now see.

And by the way, it was $40 MILLION that poor (but naive after World Vision already showed its true colors from the top down) mostly Christians have to World Vision only to have it fun need to Hamas in the Gaza Strip for rockets & support to attack Israel, dig tunnels, etc. Wow. That's what happens when they are "infiltrated" because the naivety & anti-semitism of heart is so deep that appointed Muslims named Mohammed over Palestinian Arabs to protect them from that big bad wolf Israel. In a vote, Most of the Palestinian Arab Christians would MUCH rather be under the rule of Israel again rather than Hamas (or the PLO in the West Bank). That's a fact.

Check this short 8 minute YouTube clip out from Dr. Michael Brown dispelling the lies and propaganda that even many naive Christians are swallowing whole like many German Christians did Hitler's programs a lies:

The Truth about Israel, Islam, & Palestinian Christians
https://youtu.be/Ur7cBt_nrAg

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sermonindex

And for those looking for a Roman European Antichrist & saying an Islamic Antichrist perspective is "just some new fad" or "a Lone Ranger theory" or whatever, please feel free to check this out as well. Or those saying Gog is Russian & not Turkish. I think good brothers (Frank, I'm thinking of you brother) may be surprised to find out how much meat is actually on these bones both scripturally & historically all the way back to even the early church.

Joel's Underground Episode 48, Is Gog the Antichrist? A Historical Perspective.
https://youtu.be/Aef-ieQmsWY

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forrests

by Heydave on 2016/8/5 7:07:01

Can you show me the scriptures on this please (i.e in regard to this type of persecution).

I will attempt to do so, but may I first ask what you mean by "this type"?

I see ISIS as an aggressive self-recognized (antichrist) government/state that is seeking world domination and the elimination of Christianity (among others) and murders and tortures people in the most brutal fashion in order to achieve its goal...

I also don't see anywhere in scripture that there are some forms of persecution that we can/should flee or exercise caution toward and others' which we are forbidden to... Can you show me this precept in the word of God?

Thank you.

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Heydave

Brother Forest,

I am not the one claiming any justification from scripture for hiding from persecution. I think the onus is on you to give evidence to your statement that the NT teaches us to flee persection and go underground. As the subject at hand is a about this particular Islamic group which is operating in a sporadic, limited way in the West. It is fighting against anyone who is not part of their sect, not just Christians , that is what I mean by 'this type'. Even if they end up having worldwide domination as you suggest, they are certainly nowhere near that at present.

My opinion is that those who are in countries such as North Korea, where the state is actively persecuting Christisns wholesale and preventing the gospel being preached are in a very different situation than you or I are at present. If we end up in a similar situation, then as others have said, going underground may well be neccesary to maintain an effective church for the gospel to be spread undercover, but we ARE NOT there now!

If Christians take your postion and hide in fear of ISIS, we would probably be the only group to do so. What testimony would that be to others like Jews, Kurds, Yazidis, or even your average worldly person who they hate and have killed? What does that say about our faith? I'm sure if an Islamic terrorist read this he would be laughing in contempt and see it as weakness and to his mind show we do not believe what we claim to be true.

I'm not judging you as an individual, but questioning the premise that Christians should withdraw from being a 'city on a hill' and a 'lamp on a stand' in the face of such threats.

We can certainly find evidence in scripture where the apostles escaped death and capture, but we don't find they went 'underground'. They just escaped one particular situation so they could pop up somewhere else and carry on their very public evangelism. Did Stephen go underground? Did Paul cease preaching and being well known because of a hostile reception? Rhetorical! Were not all but one of the apostles martyred?

Jesus said that those who live a godly life will be persecuted. Have we in the Western church become so soft that we think persecution just involves being disliked and not getting a promotion? Our brethren in many nations currently face very real danger because they are faithful to their Lord, but the majority of these would not consider hiding and meeting in secret unless they were forcef to, i.e. it becomes illegal.

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forrests

You seem to make a lot of assumptions about my position and jump to a lot of conclusions regarding it. I wonder if you are really concerned with hearing me out and discussing what I am actually saying or not...

I perceive that this is not a discussion that I want to engage in any longer. Farewell.

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sermonindex

,
Brothers I do not believe there is a one-size-fits-all strategy when one is dealing with persecution in different nations. When you look at the Open Doors Watch List which contains the 50 top countries where persecution is evident. The strategy of going underground in nations like North Korea and Eritrea will differ from those nations that are at the lower part of the list were persecution is not so extreme.

In each country the believers will have to depend upon wisdom of the Holy Spirit in terms of how they react to the persecution in that nation. Consider the words of our Lord Jesus below.

Matthew 10:16-23

"Behold, I send you out as sheep in the midst of wolves; so be shrewd as serpents and innocent as doves. But beware of men, for they will hand you over to the courts and scourge you in their synagogues; and you will even be brought before governors and kings for My sake, as a testimony to them and to the Gentiles. But when they hand you over, do not worry about how or what you are to say; for it will be given you in that hour what you are to say. For it is not you who speak, but it is the Spirit of your Father who speaks in you. "Brother will betray brother to death, and a father his child; and children will rise up against parents and cause them to be put to death. You will be hated by all because of My name, but it is the one who has endured to the end who will be saved.

"But whenever they persecute you in one city, flee to the next; for truly I say to you, you will not finish going through the cities of Israel until the Son of Man comes.

Our Lord Jesus is laying forth a broad strategy that believers will employ in different ways depending on the persecution intensity of the situation they are in. There will be times that they will have to escape and go to another city. But He also indicates that they will possibly be taken before the authorities. And in that time they are to depend on the Holy Spirit of what to say. But again the Holy Spirit Will instruct the believers what to do in each and every situation of persecution. Our hearts are to be yielded to Him in submission to receive His wisdom in the persecution situation we are in.

Personally I am not worried about my name being on the list of jihadist to take out. But I see a far greater danger here in America. Someone could very easily engage me in a conversation about what the Bible says about homosexuality. My words to them could be gentle and wise. The conversation may be conciliatory. But the person I'm engaging the conversation with could very well be a member of the LBGT community. Thus I could be charged later on with a hate crime. My Bible or new testament could be construed as a hate book.

It is my understanding that already in Canada the Bible is considered a hate book. And pastors are being charged with hate crimes if they speak out that homosexuality is a sin.

I think it's only a matter of time before America will follow suit. I do not think it far beyond the realm of possibility that men such as John MacArthur or Paul Washer would be taken out of their respective churches in handcuffs to a waiting government SUV and charged with a federal hate crime. Yes they would be declaring the truth that in the eyes of Jesus homosexuality is a sin. But in the eyes of society they would be arrested for preaching hate against a particular group.

Our brother Frank always reminds us that those believers in times past were persecuted because they spoke the truth of Jesus Christ. This I see is the more immediate concern that will bring about the persecution of believers in America. And this will require wisdom from God to us on how we will stand and respond to speak the truth of Christ.


As usual these are always my thoughts.

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sermonindex

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Though I am not fearful. I'm certainly mindful of the hostile environment the followers of Jesus are experiencing in America.

In times past a pastor could preach passages the dealt with the issue of homosexuality being a sin in the eyes of God without fear of government prosecution. But because of the hate crime laws I don't think pastors will have that freedom anymore. Not unless they are willing to risk Federal Prison.

Even to state one's convictions that marriage in the eyes of God is between a man and a woman can probably Land one in jail. As LBGT might construe this as inflammatory language against their lifestyle.

I think these issues are far more pressing up on believers today then what ISIS conceivably may do to us in the future.

Again these are simply my thoughts.

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forrests

by bearmaster on 2016/8/5
Our brother Frank always reminds us that those believers in times past were persecuted because they spoke the truth of Jesus Christ. This I see is the more immediate concern...

I'm sure you are aware that the hatred that ISIS (and Islam) has for Christians is due to the Truth of Jesus Christ...

1) Jesus is the Son of God.
2) Mohammed is not a prophet of God.
3) One cannot achieve justification through "submission" or any fleshly law...
And, 4) Islam is therefore a "false way"...

This makes ISIS terror/persecution aimed at Christians a direct result of "the truth of Jesus."

Also, you say (regarding the state and homosexuality):

I think these issues are far more pressing up on believers today then what ISIS conceivably may do to us in the future.

I am not denying the potential and very real threat coming from the state and regarding the issue of "homosexuality" (as it's called by the world, God has less polite terms for sin, but I'll go with their word for our purposes here) - but what "ISIS may conceivably do to us in the future" seems a bit naive...

ISIS (as well as "fundamental Islam" in general) has successfully inspired many "lone wolf" attacks, and more than a few here in the US. Not the least of them the attack on the perverse "nightclub" in Orlando...the San Bernardino mass shooting...a beheading in Oklahoma...

Here is a link of what "the world" even recognizes as linked to ISIS: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_terrorist_incidents_linked_to_ISIL

And I'm sure there are more and many that were thwarted. And there is no doubt many more to come:
http://www.vocativ.com/333894/isis-video-threatens-christians-in-the-u-s-canada-australia/

http://www.newsmax.com/US/isis-threat-convert-islam/2015/10/06/id/694901/

Respectfully, brother, I don't see this as either a threat not linked to "the truth of Jesus" or as one yet distant and improbable...

Knife attacks, running people down with trucks, beheadings in broad daylight, and much more have already been happening all over the western world...and they are calling for the targeting of Christians and the "booby-trapping" of their homes and the like...

I am simply calling my brothers to be "as wise as serpents", that's all.

Blessings,

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sermonindex

Just food for thought: in Revelation it speaks specifically of the martyrs who were beheadedfor their testimony in Jesus. Who is in the earth for the last 2,000 years whose actual "holy book" & doctrine (& practice) it is to behead believers? As much as I am aware of all of the evils of the Roman Catholic Church during the inquisition, one must admit that burning alive was clearly the preferred method if you will of such? Or, is there some illuminati, NWO, European or Russian practice of beheading Christians? No. Who is the only people whose primary doctrinally taught and practiced (by the tens and tens and tens of thousands) method of killing believers is by beheading: Islam. Not saying it may not change in the future, but it's going to have to come mysteriously and suddenly out of absolutely nowhere & institute mass beheadings in the whole earth to even begin to compare to the last 1,400 years of beheadings by Mohammed, his successors, his family, & his followers to this day. There are a thousand other scriptural reasons why this fits more precisely once you really dig in and relook at the scriptures & history without the echo chamber of modern prophecy guys from the popular echo chambers, but this is a short & quick one to consider.

Islam also hates and wants to slaughter the Jews & take Israel & especially Jerusalem, which is also not totally insignifigant.

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sermonindex

Bearmaster wrote

"It is my understanding that already in Canada the Bible is considered a hate book. And pastors are being charged with hate crimes if they speak out that homosexuality is a sin."

I live in Canada so I can speak to this. While there have been a few cases of this it is not an issue. In order to get into hot water here you have to be the Westboro's down there.

Christianity is a joke in Canada, it's forgotten, kicked to the corner, considered naive and old fashioned.

Churches are just trying to keep the lights on. With few exceptions you don't have to bring a bible to church here it's more like a prop. It's a social club where parents talk about their kids schooling. Praise and Worship is vibrant and then everyone goes to sleep for the message.

Canada is the land of a thousand races and a million opinions, the government is laughed at, beer and the weekend are the prime objective and no one has any right to speak to anyone in a corrective, suggestive or factual manner. Personal opinion is considered as good as fact, no one knows or cares where we are or where we are going as a nation, no one cares about ISIS hit lists or anything serious for that matter, I can't understand half the people I encounter in my day to day and they become offended if you try to tell them and everyone has their face buried in their cell phone looking at who knows what for who knows why!

The upside is we hate guns and don't shoot each other, you don't have to lock your doors, everyone leaves everyone else alone, cops are respected, political campaigns are conducted by civilized human beings ( Trump is nearly dispised) and all the health care you will ever need is free for everyone.

BTW I would vote for Trump, like Europe we have a lot of what he is trying to stop. The multicultural Utopia will never work. We have lost our identity in Canada.

Marc mc

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forrests

I came across this this morning:
http://www.breitbart.com/national-security/2016/08/05/north-carolina-man-charged-supporting-islamic-state/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+breitbart+%28Breitbart+News%29

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sermonindex

Marc,
I heard Joel Richardson say just the other day that he sat with one of the largest mega church pastors in Canada recently. He said the guy said there are 4 journalists that come to every service & take notes. And if something is said that crosses a Canadian law line on what they are and aren't supposed to say under Canadian hate speech laws and what not, they know it will be in the papers the next day & lawsuits will follow. The pastor told Joel that we shouldn't think we are so far behind. That It could be just a single digit number of years away in the USA as well based on what they saw just prior to such laws there and what they see in the USA political/religious/supremes court/legal scene & horizon now. I don't live there, but this is what the pastor told Joel.
God Bless,
Jeff

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sermonindex

Here is a list of Canadian Mega Churches ( if you could call them that) a two second glance at the denominations reveals they are as harmless as the mouses that run around when the lights are off. Simply go to their websites and watch a few sermons for proof.

( i don't know anything about the Hartford research, I just used the link for the research numbers) most churches here have less that 200 sleepy saints.

http://hirr.hartsem.edu/megachurch/canadian-megachurches.html

I'm sure Joel is telling the truth but it is a more than isolated instance. And out side a local paper in that city no one cares. The non believers, Athiests and universities here have taken the most effective path at disqualifying the church and it's message, IGNORE IT.

There is no persecution for being a Christian here. Laughed at yes, persecuted.....no. You might be pushing a theory but I have never even heard the bible connected with hate speech until today.

Marc mc

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sermonindex

Actually, I read the Canadian law that was passed on preaching homosexuality as a sin being pinned as Hate speech like 1+ years ago. I don't know about the list you sent. I will take Joel at his word. No reason to lie.
Anyways,
God Bless,
Jeff

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sermonindex

Our Canadian brothers and sisters may want to take a look at this article below.

Albert Mohler
THE BIBLE AS HATE SPEECH? GAYS WIN BIG IN CANADA


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Americans have historically been pleased to have Canada as our northern neighbor. The border between the United States and Canada is often described as the world's longest and most peaceful--and visiting Americans find most of Canada pretty much like home, with just enough quaint differences to make a visit interesting.

All that is about to change, and some Americans are about ready to dig a moral moat alongside the border. Our basically peaceful northern neighbor has experienced a huge personality change, and not for the better. Liberal Canada is turning itself into radical Sweden.

On Tuesday, the Canadian House of Commons defeated a motion defining marriage "as the union of one man and one woman to the exclusion of all others." The margin of victory was small, but the bill failed just the same, and the media quickly claimed the vote as an endorsement of homosexual marriage. [see Washington Post]

An provincial appeals court in Ontario legalized gay marriage this past summer, ruling that denying homosexual couples the right to marry violated "the dignity of same-sex relationships." Hundreds of homosexual couples quickly took advantage of the ruling, and Prime Minister Jean Chretien chose not to appeal the court's ruling. The bill proposed by the Canadian Alliance party was the only hope of reversing the decision and prohibiting gay marriage. The bill's demise means that homosexual marriage will almost surely be legalized throughout the nation.

Cardinal Jean-Claude Turcotte, Archbishop of Montreal, condemned Parliament's action: "If marriage simply become a union of two persons who love each other, must we then permit marriage between a brother and a sister? Between a father and his daughter? Between a mother and her son?"

Conservative Protestants also sounded the alarm. The Evangelical Fellowship of Canada released a statement expressing disappointment in the vote and promising a vigorous debate on the issue in coming months. It may be too late.

Janey Epp Buckingham, the group's director of Law and Public Policy claimed that "millions of Canadians oppose the redefinition of marriage, and president Bruce Clemenger asserted that the marriage issue is really not about rights at all, but about legal definition and public policy. "If marriage is reduced to merely a contract between two people, its distinctiveness will be lost and it will be hard for the government to refuse including other types of relationships."

Tuesday's action in Parliament was bad enough, but the very next day the House of Commons moved to include homosexuals under hate crime provisions. Bill C-250 was sponsored by homosexual MP Svend Robinson, who told the media that his bill would "recognize that just as we say it's wrong to promote hatred or violence directed against racial or religious or ethnic minorities, so too, should we say its just as wrong to promote that hatred or violence directed at gay or lesbian people." [see Toronto Globe and Mail]

Others see the bill very differently--as an attempt to silence Christians by criminalizing anyone who quotes the Bible's passages against homosexuality. Brian Rushfeldt of the Canada Family Action Coalition explains that Canadians opposed to homosexual marriage "are already being accused of 'hate' speech by homosexual activists.... When C-250 is passed into law later this fall, the activists will begin to insist on prosecution to silence their critics with criminal sanctions." The bill now moves to the Senate and must eventually receive royal assent to become law. Both sides now expect the bill to become law by the end of the year.

Celebrating his legislative victory, MP Robinson declared, "I feel proud to be a Canadian." He has every reason to cheer, for the gay and lesbian agenda took unprecedented strides forward in the past week. He appears to be on the winning side.

All this may take their American neighbors by surprise. Many Americans are unaware of the fact that Canada's public life is radically secular when compared to the United States. Canada is pioneering a post-Christian culture, with liberal sexual mores and a hostility to Christian conviction.

In 1997, a Saskatchewan Human Rights Commission board of inquiry fined a Christian businessman $4,500 for running an advertisement in The Star Phoenix newspaper that simply listed four biblical passages that condemn homosexual behavior [Leviticus 18:22 and 20:13, Romans 1:26 and 1 Corinthians 6:9]. The ad did not even provide the actual text of the verses. Two stickmen holding hands were pictured in the advertisement, with the international negative symbol [a red circle bisected by a slash] over the figures. The board ruled that the symbols, when combined with the biblical citations, "would expose or tend to expose homosexuals to hatred or ridicule." According to this Canadian agency, the Bible is now hate speech.

Canada's Christians have plenty of reason to worry. Sweden has moved to make all anti-homosexual speech a criminal offense, including sermons or Bible readings that condemn homosexual behavior. Pastors can be fined and cited for unacceptable sermons. Canada's legal system is moving quickly in the same direction--and with the same arguments.

The whole idea of hate speech has a dubious basis in the law. Hate crime legislations set certain groups apart as deserving of special protections. Christians do not defend physical violence against anyone--homosexuals included, and call for the full prosecution of any who would resort to violence or asault. But to label certain forms of assault hate crimes assumes that the motivation to harm one person is more criminal than the motivation to harm another.

When hate crimes are extended to speech, the government sets itself up as a judge of what language or speech is legal or illegal. The logic of the legislation is clear--no criticism of homosexuality is allowable, whatever its form or basis. This would cover not only epithets thrown at homosexuals, but sermons in Christian pulpits against homosexual bahavior.

The move to silence the pulpit represents the ultimate aim of homosexual activists. In the end, the biblical condemnation of homosexual behavior is the great obstacle to the normalization of homosexuality and all other sexual "lifestyles." So long as a significant portion of the population claims allegience to the Bible, gay activists face an insurmountable obstacle to full acceptance of their sexuality.

If the pulpits can be silenced, and if the Bible can be set aside as a dangerous, hate-filled text, the path to full acceptance and normalization is wide open. Preaching and teaching against homosexuality simply cannot be allowed. Many fear that the Canadian legislation would make biblical preaching a crime.

Americans will watch our northern neighbor with increasing wariness and concern. Homosexual activists here would like to see similar legislation passed in the United States. In the meantime, Canadian Christians had better wake up. The Word of God is about to be labeled as hate speech--and telling the truth is about to become a crime.

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I was just about to post that same article Bear! 😊 Albert Mohler is pretty well respected across the board too & the law is the law regardless of who you are or what you say or think is/isn't going on. Seems strange that I down here in the southwest knew about this for a long time, but Canadians aren't even aware of it?

*When I re-read the post, I just felt inclined to say that I didn't mean for that to come across badly if it did - FYI.

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http://culturecampaign.blogspot.com/2007/12/pastor-found-guilty-of-hate-crime.html?m=1

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Subject: CULTURE NEWS: Supremes Rule Bible as 'Hate Speech' in Canada


http://culturecampaign.blogspot.com/2013/03/supremes-rule-bible-as-hate-speech-in.html?m=1

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I knew I had seen and read all of this. Didn't realize it had been 5 years though. Man I lose track of time!

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Because its paper, it's on the books but no one cares. From years ago. A couple of churches ranted about it and the liberals ( your DNC) took it to court and got a law changed. But no one cares because no one preaches it. They don't preach anything that will risk a single dollar or offend a single member. It's all seeker sensitive, milky toast, feel good psychobabble. Other than the Penticostals it's rare to even see an alter call. And preach the blood? The paster would spend all day Monday on the phone with unhappy members.

Believe what you want and I can't make it any clearer than I have. In 25 years as a believer I cannot recal a single paster ( half of the ones in my city are friends of mine) ever saying the word Homosexual from the pulpit. And I have not heard of this issue in person, on the news or in the papers.

As for the gay agenda! Our Prime Minister and most mayors in the large cities walk in the gay parade wearing rainbow shirts, hats waving the flag. This year they flew the rainbow flag at our Parliment building. No one said a word or gave it a second thought. It's over they won.

marcmc

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http://www.christiantoday.com/article/street.preacher.guilty.of.using.threatening.language.by.quoting.leviticus/50564.htm

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Bro I just posted some links to some articles where pastors have been arrested or fined for quoting the Bible regarding homosexuality.

I'm sure if you do some Googling you will find more cases up there in Canada.

From what I have read about your Canadian Prime Minister. Obama would be a conservative next to him. I'm sure that whatever hate laws are on the books in Canada will be strengthened and more will be added under his reign.

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Brethrwn are more immediate concern is not whether our names are on an ISIS hit list. Our immediate concern is that the United States government is moving to silence the witness of believers in America. Our immediate concern is that the American church will soon be entering persecution. And our immediate concern is that we have to deal with taking up the cross of Jesus Christ to go through the fires of persecution. Our immediate concern is that we have to cultivate intimacy with the Holy Spirit in order to survive the times that we will be going through.

Donald Trump is not going to save you. The only one who will save you will be the Lord Jesus Christ. Thus we must cultivate intimacy with Him.

Thys let us flee Babylon and fkee to Jesus. Again let us flee Babylon and flee to Jesus

Simply my thoughts as I see things unfold pointing to the soon return of Jesus Christ.

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Your missing the point, I have said you can get into trouble and a few have. But 99.99999% of Christians and pastors have never, will never or won't say anything about Homosexuals in church so the law is meaningless. Your five google hits aside. Lawn watering violations are a bigger news report up here. But I guess to a hammer everything looks like a nail.

I can't say it any clearer! It is a non issue up hear. Peace out.

Marc mc

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Marc,
I don't know if Joel was just talking to this pastor or also spoke in his church. I am quite sure Joel didn't preach a milk toast message. He preaches on the cross, martyrdom, laying down your life for the Gospel, Islam, missions, sin hell, repentance, faith & obedience - the Jesus Gospel. Anyways, some say "you guys are always crying wolf" or "to a hammer everything looks like a nail", but brother, respectfully in retrospective reverse, to one who is in a room with no lights on, even turning on the lights won't get them to open their eyes. I got a recent testimony, we got law issues, court cases, articles from Al Mohler citing actual cases & laws, etc. but the whole "nothing to see here folks, your eyes & ears deceive you" thing doesn't come across all the way as the full story. Sorry. I ain't looking for their to be false laws, false court cases & false testimonies from brothers I respect not to embellish or sensationalize these things. I'm just not going to stick my fingers in my ears when I do see them and say "I can't hear you, I can't hear you, I can't hear you" either. 😊

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Jeff our Canadian brother might have been making reference to me. I was the one that posted the links to the various stories about about saints who were arrested or fined for quoting the Bible in the land of the maple leaf.

Canada is already ahead of the U.S. in that respect. I am not aware of any American Pastor who has been arrested or fined "yet" for preaching the Bible. But I am sure it will soon come.

Simply my thoughts bro.

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