fashionista sister

Perhaps those who are not meek and not separated from the world need your fellowship.

While Jesus was having dinner at Levi’s house, many tax collectors and sinners were eating with him and his disciples, for there were many who followed him. When the teachers of the law who were Pharisees saw him eating with the sinners and tax collectors, they asked his disciples: "Why does he eat with tax collectors and sinners?” On hearing this, Jesus said to them, "It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners.”
Mark 2:15-17

I'd highly recommend you give this brief article a reading;

https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/articles/index.php?view=article&aid=697

After you have read it, pray and ask the Holy Lord Jesus and His Holy Spirit shall direct you.

I do think you're headed in the right direction.

Give no place to that counsel which would cause compromise in your own life. Eve listened to that counsel for 1 second too long. She should have done what we are told to do, "avoid!"

Evangelism and fellowship are two different species!

Don't be deceived!

Note: Read Titus 2 and see the example the older women are to set for the younger. Find some women like them, and make them your companions.

Mark 2:15-17 - - - - does not address your question, but...
1 John 2:15-17 - - - does.

There’s always a convent!

You can fellowship with these women and not love the world. Red herring.

How can you love these fellow believers by shunning them? You will never earn the right to speak into their lives if you treat them like dirt.

Emestiu,

Please do not heed neither those men nor women who have been feminized by the American culture.

Please don't take to heart that counsel which is not from above.

When you begin to hear insults and accusations thrust at you, know that you must cease hearing such ignorant compromising feministic philosophy trying to pass itself off as wisdom from above.

The convent remark reveals the heart behind it. There are those who mock and make jest at those who would please God by pursuing holiness of life. Avoid them! They are in need of a sharp rebuke. God Himself will deal with them in due time.

Evangeline-

Read carefully. I did not say YOU were treating them like dirt. Shunning a fellow believer because they are less mature is treating them like dirt.

The convent remark was a rhetorical statement- that means it was not meant to be taken 100% seriously. It was not even directed at you.

The idea that we should shun fellowship with other believers who may be less "spiritual” than ourselves is foreign to the NT and quite frankly is sinning.

34 "A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. 35 By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.”
John 13:34-35

The issue on the table is whether Evangeline should fellowship with Christian women who dress fashionably.

If y’all think the answer to that question is "no” I think you are very badly mistaken.

I posted this poem I wrote earlier this year, but figured I'd post it here now as I think it's appropriate;

Once upon a time
In a church far away
There sat six young women
In the pew one Sunday

They whispered to each other
As the preacher preached away
And after it was over
They all went their merry way

The next Sunday they returned
And did a repeat of the last
They boasted to some others
How at church they had a blast

Now every Sunday morning
With many many friends
They make it a tradition
To go with all the trends

Their fashion and their pomp
Is quite a sight to see
It spread to all the women
The church has been set free

The preacher had been silent
Not wanting to offend
Now if any one takes notice
You lose another friend

Once upon a time
It was understood
That preaching wasn't relative
But rather for our good

Now everyone agrees
It would not be polite
For the preacher to in-sin-u-ate
That some things just ain't right

And now the sign upon the church
Reads come just as you are
All are welcome in this place
We've even got a bar

Do not judge us any more
We all cast in our lot
If you do you have no love
A True Christian you are not

It is growing late you see
And when this first began
We couldn't see the consequence
That this would have on man

Let me live just as I please
And don't come to my church
We have freedom can't you see
Stop being such a lerche

Everywhere in church-land now
It's a common sight to see
The women have no modesty
They're all dressed like Sandra Dee

So remember not to criticize
You might incur their wrath
Just shut your mouth and go sit down
And follow the new path

Red herring. You can love your brothers and sisters without being consumed by the world.

Be on your guard; stand firm in the faith; be courageous; be strong. Do everything in love [charity]. 1 Corinthians 16:13-14

Per Matthew Henry: He advises them to do every thing in charity, v. 14. Our zeal and constancy must be consistent with charity. When the apostle would have us play the man for our faith or religion, he puts in a caution against playing the devil for it. We may defend our faith, but we must, at the same time, maintain our innocence, and not devour and destroy, and think with ourselves that the wrath of man will work the righteousness of God, James 1:24. Note, Christians should be careful that charity not only reign in their hearts, but shine out in their lives, nay, in their most manly defences of the faith of the gospel. There is a great difference between constancy and cruelty, between Christian firmness and feverish wrath and transport. Christianity never appears to so much advantage as when the ****charity of Christians is most conspicuous when they can bear with their mistaken brethren, and oppose the open enemies of their holy faith in love, when every thing is done in charity, when they behave towards one another, and towards all men, with a spirit of meekness and good will.****

"Do everything in love" 1 Cor. 16:14

AMEN! AND AGAIN I SAY AMEN!

Go now, and in sincerity with a fervent and pure love from your heart, follow His Spirit as you read the following;

From the article I posted a link to:

Evil company is to be sedulously avoided by the Christian lest he become defiled by them.

"He that walketh with wise men shall be wise; but a companion of fools shall be destroyed" (Prov. 13:20).

Nor is it only the openly lawless and criminal who are to be shunned, but even, yea especially, those professing to be Christians yet who do not live the life of Christians. It is this latter class particularly against which the real child of God needs to be most on his guard: namely, those who say one thing and do another; those whose talk is pious, but whose walk differs little or nothing from the non-professor,

The Word of God is plain and positive on this point:

"Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away" (2 Tim. 3:5). This is not merely good advice, but a Divine command which we disregard at our peril.

Alexander McLaren comments on 2 Timothy 3:5

I do not suppose that these words need much explanation. ‘Godliness,’ in the New Testament, means not only the disposition which we call piety, but the conduct which flows from it, and which we may call practical religion. The form or outward appearance of that we all understand. But what is the ‘denying the power thereof?’ It does not consist in words, but in deeds. In these latter epistles we find ‘denying’ frequently used as equivalent to abjuring, renouncing, casting off. For instance, in a passage singularly and antithetically parallel to that of my text, we read ‘denying ungodliness and worldly lusts,’ which simply means throwing off their dominion. And in like manner the denial here is no verbal rejection of the principles of the gospel, which would be inconsistent with the notion of still retaining the form of godliness; but it is the practical renunciation of the power, which is inherent in all true godliness, of moulding the life and character - the practical renunciation of that even whilst preserving a superficial, unreal appearance of being subject to it.

...every Church of God on the face of the earth has a little core of earnest Christians, who live the life, and a great envelope and surrounding of men who, as my text says, have the form of godliness, and practically deny the power thereof. Widespread, and all but universal, this condition of things is. And so let each of us say, ‘Lord! Is it I?’

The more completely a professing Christian has lost his hold of the substance and is clinging only to the form, the less does he suspect that this indictment has any application to him. The very sign and symptom of spiritual degeneracy and corruption is unconsciousness, as the great champion of Israel, when his locks were cropped in Delilah’s lap, went out to exercise his mighty limbs as at other times, and knew not, till he vainly tried feats which their ebbing strength was no longer equal to perform, that the Spirit of the Lord had departed from him. The more completely a man’s limbs are frost-bitten the more comfortable and warm they are, and the less does he know it. If a man says, ‘Your text has no sort of application to me,’ he thereby shows that it has a very close application to him.

...let us cherish a clear and continual recognition of the reality of ‘the danger Forewarned is forearmed. He that will take counsel of his own weakness, and be taught by God’s Word how unreliable he himself is, and how strong the forces are which tend to throw his religion all to the surface, will thereby be, if not insured against the danger, at least made a great deal more competent to deal with it. ‘Blessed is the man that feareth always,’ and that knows how likely he is to go wrong unless he carefully seeks to keep himself right.

Rigid, habitual self-inspection, in the light of God’s Word, is an all-important help to prevent this sliding of our Christian life into superficiality...‘Watch! for we know not what may be going on underground unless we have a continual carefulness of inspection.

You seem to be advocating disfellowshipping from every other believer you deem to be less spiritually enlightened than yourself. Are you?

"Are you?"

You ought to know the answer to that Todd.

I do not think any other believers reading my posts have come to that conclusion.

I'd recommend you go through the series, "Behold Your God."

Then what in the world ARE you saying? If you would speak plainly rather than in riddles perhaps it would be a little more clear.

You seem to be telling Evangleline to not associate with fellow believers who dress fashionably. If that’s not what you mean, what do you mean?

I apologize for my lack of clarity. I have no intention of frustrating you or anyone else.

I suppose that because I understood what I was saying, everyone else did. And I thought the article to the link I posted, and Alexander McLaren's comments were self explanatory.

So, let me state it plainly, we have fellowship with any and all true believers.

Yet, if there be those who profess that they know God, and yet their lifestyle shows the contrary, I must take caution. And I may even need to take some measures, such as not becoming very intimate with such persons, risking being labeled legalistic or as being judgmental.

God alone knows the hearts of all, and He knows them that are His.

I must come to some conclusions though, and act as I believe God would have me.

Thanks for the clarification and I don’t disagree.

Todd wrote
You seem to be advocating disfellowshipping from every other believer you deem to be less spiritually enlightened than yourself. Are you?

by savannah
"Are you?"

You ought to know the answer to that Todd.

I do not think any other believers reading my posts have come to that conclusion.

It's fascinating how this age old issue is still being visited. Trust me, it took me at least 50 years to come up with the following conclusion:

The issue that may interest God most is our own hearts. After all, we hinder our ability to influence others when we distance ourselves because of repulsion - or we view them from our lofty position of self-righteousness.

Evaluating the motives of others is tricky apart from building a relationship of mutual respect.

Let's admit, most people dress and behave as they do because it is simply the environment they are immersed in. Whatever a person does or experiences repetitively becomes right to their conscience. Thus their habits may feel right. And likewise, it may feel right for us as God's chosen ones to be critical without compassion or mercy. That's a bad environment we may be immersed in too!

The best way to pray for others is to give ourselves to the Lord. We let Him shape us into vessels which He can use in the lives of others.

It's the old speck and log scenario. Wouldn't you agree?

Diane

I would definitely agree with you. Wonderful way to put it.

Lisa

Thank the Lord for the internet, or we wouldn’t even have had the opportunity to debate this. I don’t ever remember this being brought up in church, or any church socials, but maybe I missed church that day. Yep Diane, the ol speck and log thing, matter fact, you don’t see that scripture that much here, I wonder why.

Luk 18:9-14  And he spake this parable unto certain which trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and despised others:  (10)  Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.  (11)  The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.  (12)  I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.  (13)  And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.  (14)  I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.

Gal 6:1-4  Brothers, if anyone is caught in any transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of gentleness. Keep watch on yourself, lest you too be tempted.  (2)  Bear one another's burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ.  (3)  For if anyone thinks he is something, when he is nothing, he deceives himself.  (4)  But let each one test his own work, and then his reason to boast will be in himself alone and not in his neighbor.

2Timothy 2:24-26  And the Lord's servant must not be quarrelsome but kind to everyone, able to teach, patiently enduring evil,  (25)  correcting his opponents with gentleness. God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth,  (26)  and they may come to their senses and escape from the snare of the devil, after being captured by him to do his will.

James 5:19-20  My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back,  (20)  let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins.

Act 26:12-19  King Agrippa, one day I was on my way to Damascus with the authority and permission of the chief priests.  (13)  About noon I saw a light brighter than the sun. It flashed from heaven on me and on everyone traveling with me.  (14)  We all fell to the ground. Then I heard a voice say to me in Aramaic, "Saul, Saul, why are you so cruel to me? It's foolish to fight against me!"  (15)  "Who are you?" I asked. Then the Lord answered, "I am Jesus! I am the one you are so cruel to.  (16)  Now stand up. I have appeared to you, because I have chosen you to be my servant. You are to tell others what you have learned about me and what I will show you later."  (17)  The Lord also said, "I will protect you from the Jews and from the Gentiles that I am sending you to.  (18)  I want you to open their eyes, so that they will turn from darkness to light and from the power of Satan to God. Then their sins will be forgiven, and by faith in me they will become part of God's holy people." (19)  King Agrippa, I obeyed this vision from heaven.

I took psychology in school. At the time it intrigued me. The study of the inner workings of the mind is quite an undertaking. And after all is said and done, you get a masters degree, and you become a master of the mind, imagine that!

The old spec and log scenario post reminds me of a psychology 101 class. The only difference is that you've introduced God's Word into the equation. Something psychology cannot do, and at the same time rightly divide that Word.

The self-righteousness card is always pulled by those who want to make sin lighter than it is. Yet we are told in the passage to first remove the log in our own eye, and then we are in a position to help another with the removal of the spec in theirs.

Worldliness and being conformed to the fashion of this world is no small matter. 1 John 2:15-17, among many other passages, is so very clear on that point.

A brief testimony will suffice. A young lady, who has been in a fellowship of believers for 5+ years shows up on Sunday in her usual attire. She receives the usual response from the other men and women in the congregation. She is invited on this particular Sunday to join another family at at one of the brothers house for lunch. The brother asks a woman who knows her quite well if she would consider stopping at home first and changing what little clothes she is wearing before joining us for lunch.

You see, the brother is the father of some young men and women. The decision by the father was not to offend his own family by welcoming this seductive, provocatively dressed woman into his home. He chose to risk offending the woman rather than his own family.

It's the old self-righteous christian scenario. Wouldn't you agree?

Luk 7:36-50  One of the Pharisees asked him to eat with him, and he went into the Pharisee's house and reclined at table.  (37)  And behold, a woman of the city, who was a sinner, when she learned that he was reclining at table in the Pharisee's house, brought an alabaster flask of ointment,  (38)  and standing behind him at his feet, weeping, she began to wet his feet with her tears and wiped them with the hair of her head and kissed his feet and anointed them with the ointment.  (39)  Now when the Pharisee who had invited him saw this, he said to himself, "If this man were a prophet, he would have known who and what sort of woman this is who is touching him, for she is a sinner.”  (40)  And Jesus answering said to him, "Simon, I have something to say to you.” And he answered, "Say it, Teacher.”  (41)  "A certain moneylender had two debtors. One owed five hundred denarii, and the other fifty.  (42)  When they could not pay, he cancelled the debt of both. Now which of them will love him more?”  (43)  Simon answered, "The one, I suppose, for whom he cancelled the larger debt.” And he said to him, "You have judged rightly.”  (44)  Then turning toward the woman he said to Simon, "Do you see this woman? I entered your house; you gave me no water for my feet, but she has wet my feet with her tears and wiped them with her hair.  (45)  You gave me no kiss, but from the time I came in she has not ceased to kiss my feet.  (46)  You did not anoint my head with oil, but she has anointed my feet with ointment.  (47)  Therefore I tell you, her sins, which are many, are forgiven””for she loved much. But he who is forgiven little, loves little.”  (48)  And he said to her, "Your sins are forgiven.”  (49)  Then those who were at table with him began to say among themselves, "Who is this, who even forgives sins?”  (50)  And he said to the woman, "Your faith has saved you; go in peace.”

A survey was conducted recently. Churchgoers were asked,

What's the difference between a christian and a non-christian?

They all answered,

"Nothing"

savannah, was that survey conducted on CNN or MSNBC?

No. You'd not believe it if it were told you where!

It doesn't matter, I serve God in a different way, I don't pay to much attention to what man say's, man only takes away from my focus on God.

You took the words right outta my mouth...

Thanks Mr. Bill

AMEN to all the Scriptures which have been posted!

I'd like to add to that list of Scriptures, because "All Scripture is inspired by God. All of them are useful for teaching, pointing out errors, correcting people, and training them for a life that has God's approval." 2 Timothy 3:16

1 Corinthians 10

1But I want you to know, my brethren, that all of our fathers were under a cloud and all of them passed through the sea. 2And they all were baptized by Moses in the cloud and in the sea. 3And they all ate one food of The Spirit. 4And they all drank of the one drink of The Spirit, for they were drinking from The Rock of The Spirit, which was with them, but that Rock was The Messiah. 5But God was not pleased with the multitude of them, for they fell in the wilderness.
6But these things are an example for us that we would not be lusting for evil, just as they lusted. 7Neither should we be Servants of idols, even as also some of them served, according to what is written: "The people sat down to eat and to drink and they arose to play." 8And neither should we commit fornication as some of them fornicated and twenty three thousand fell in one day. 9Neither should we tempt The Messiah as some of them tempted and serpents destroyed them. 10Neither should we complain as some of them complained and they were destroyed by the destroyer. 11But all these things that occurred to them were for our example and it was written for our admonition, for their end of the world has come upon us. 12From now on, whoever thinks that he stands, let him beware lest he fall.

by TMK
The issue on the table is whether Evangeline should fellowship with Christian women who dress fashionably.

If y’all think the answer to that question is "no” I think you are very badly mistaken.

Should Evangeline fellowship with Christian women who dress fashionably OR should she call out every sister around her who enjoys dressing fashionably?

Evangeline, you never stated if they dress fashionably and yet modest or if they dressed fashionably with a lot skin showing. I believe that would set the stage better.

First, we are salt to a lost generation in our churches (without calling them out). If we are always setting others straight about Biblical womanhood, why do we need the Holy Spirit, if we do it so effectively?

But I did want to humbly bring to the forefront that I have seen a few discussions started by you that seem to elevate you in the area of Biblical womanhood and how others are failing in your eyes. If I am wrong please forgive me.

The Mark 2:15-17 when Jesus dined with sinners was Jesus Christ was proclaiming the Gospel to people "needs to be change and transform" yet...

I believe I've shared this with you before but we need to give others as much time as God has given us and is He finished with you yet? No? Then guess what, He's not finished with others either!!

Evangeline, God loves those fashionista's just AS MUCH as He loves you.

God bless you,
Lisa

I asked an older minister who I admire greatly how I should deal with an individual in our congregation (I am an elder)that had a similar issue as the one described in the beginning of this post.

His statement/question to me was and is quite helpful:

"Are they coming into the light or are they departing from light?"

This man pastors a very godly congregation (different than the one I am involved with) and his philosophy is to be very patient and longsuffering with those who are growing (coming into the light), giving the Holy Spirit time to work with them and bring them into all truth. His posture towards those who are departing light is much different. He, in his own words, is very "severe" with them. This man is very kind and gracious but very serious about building a local church that is a proper testimony to God on earth.

FYI-I post very rarely but appreciate this site and the discussion forum much.

That is the wisdom from above!

Am blessed by it, thank you for sharing

I agree BJ- that was good.