Pastor resignation- looking for input

A pastor at a church I used to attend announced his resignation today. My sister still attends this church. I attended this church for about 9 years. We moved to another state. When I attended the current pastor who resigned was youth pastor and his 2 girls were very young.

A little side background- I noticed for the past year or so this pastor and his wife posting things on Facebook that I would call rather liberal theology, s well as some people who attend that church. It seemed a little strange because when I was there the church was pretty solid.

Anyways, today I was able to watch the service on line because I was told there was going to be an announcement so I was curious. I still know a lot of people in that church.

Essentially, the pastor said that he approached denominational leadership a couple of months ago and told them he could no longer agree with the doctrinal statement essentially stating that marriage is between a man and a woman, homosexuality is a sin, etc. He was told he could resign or be terminated, his choice.

He also said during his announcement that his 14 year old daughter is part of the LGBTQ spectrum. I guess this was common knowledge; I found out later that she does not want to identify with either sex. She is extremely intelligent science/math wise but does have some emotional issues. I gather she hangs with an unfortunate group of older kids(because she skipped a grade) who possibly consider themselves "woke” and endorse these alternative lifestyles. In my opinion a 14 year old knows nothing.

Now, I do have respect for this pastor for having the integrity to announce his resignation as he could not in good conscious endorse denominational positions.

But I am disappointed that instead of upholding plain biblical teaching on this issue, he chose to find other voices who try to make excuses for plain scripture or try to say the plain scriptures have been mistranslated or misinterpreted.

It also explains why I have seen his and his wife’s questionable social media posts I have seen over the past year.

So my question is what is a Christian parent to do if their early teens child comes and says they are homosexual or transgender or whatever? Is there a way to love your child without affirming their choice? I know in theory it can be done but in practice I don’t know how it would work. By the grace of God I did not have to deal with this regarding my own kids. In this case the daughter insisted on being called by a variant of her name that sounds neither male or female - "Li”.

It bothers me that this pastor and his wife immediately jumped to affirm her "choice” as biblical (They both should know better) rather than figuring out a different way to deal with it. But I don’t really know what the correct way looks like.

Meet the daughters need without condoning her sin.
Show her truth by telling her the truth and repenting of any wickedness in your own life.
Seek the Lord for wisdom and grace to endure. Seek the Lord daily with tears.
Be prepared to suffer for the truth whether it’s the reproof of the world or of the child who may eventual cut you off completely.

Study 1 John and 1st and 2nd Peter until it’s embedded into your soul and God has transformed your seeing. Do you love your child as Christ loves the Church? That pastor certainly doesn’t.

That is what’s so hard to understand. He is conforming to the child and the world which is exactly opposite of what we are told to do.

That's a baffling set of events you are describing. I've often pondered why the current apostate church in many ways seems to have risen out of the true church - they went out from among us to show that they were not part of us. That type of thing. Not in all circumstances and examples, but in many. Is it possible that in some strange and hidden way that these people and pastors were never really saved in the first place but had just chosen a good profession of sorts? I don't know the answer or pretend to. These things baffle me also.

Blessings good bro.

I always carry this scripture with me, because it says a lot about what will be happening in the later days.

2nd Timothy 3

3 But mark this: There will be terrible times in the last days. 2 People will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boastful, proud, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy, 3 without love, unforgiving, slanderous, without self-control, brutal, not lovers of the good, 4 treacherous, rash, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God”” 5 having a form of godliness but denying its power. Have nothing to do with such people.
6 They are the kind who worm their way into homes and gain control over gullible women, who are loaded down with sins and are swayed by all kinds of evil desires, 7 always learning but never able to come to a knowledge of the truth.

Todd, I wished I could elaborate more on your post, but I don't think I could possibly render any better thoughts than God did.

That scripture certainly applies Bill s well as the "tickling ears” passage.

Brother TMK,

The hour is fast approaching "for the word of God is living and effective and sharper than any double-edged sword, penetrating as far as the separation of soul and spirit, joints and marrow. It is able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart." (Heb 4:12)

Do you remember that man (pastor?) that was on here years ago that said this one verse in the Bible "proved" God approved of homosexuality? He had a son who tried to kill his self over his sexuality and he even wrote a book about it and had quite the following. He eventually left SI because he couldn't convert anyone on here.

Each one of us MUST 'receive the LOVE of the TRUTH... that we [and others] might be saved." (2 Thess 2:10-11ish)

We can love our child so much that we do not receive the love of the truth.
We can love our spouses so much that we do not receive the love of the truth.
We can love our own sin so much that we do not receive the love of the truth.
We can love our own life so much that we do not receive the love of the truth.

Pray for your former pastor to return to 'receiving the love of the truth.'

God bless you,
Lisa

Interesting topic, TMK. I'll remember this entire family and church in prayer.

There is a church going through something somewhat similar (albeit an opposite situation) just a few miles from where I live. I've never visited that congregation, but I had heard of the church in the past.

The pastor of that church had three children: Two daughters and a son. The church was growing and the pastor was apparently well-known (I searched for his name on SermonIndex and there were five articles about him).

His oldest daughter went to a Christian college. She even appeared as a contestant on the game show "Jeopardy." However, she eventually got caught up into sin. She first announced that she was "gay" and later "transgender."

This girl eventually moved out and ties were cut with her family. She ended up "marrying" another extremely liberal LBGTQxyz activist woman. The other daughter became a writer. The son remained in the home (or near the home).

Apparently, the son confessed to his father (in private) that he had struggled with some sort of sinful attraction to minors. The family kept it quiet. Sometime later, the son began volunteering at the church (as well as with a local sports league).

That son had never been accused of any impropriety, moral failure or crime. According to various news outlets, it was a private admission of a struggle that he revealed to his father for prayer and counseling. They thought that this would have been the end of it.

Somehow, the transgender child of the pastor learned about this situation. She used it as ammunition to try and destroy her father's career.

This woman wrote and published a letter -- sending it to the church's board, the school district (where he worked) and the local police department.

She and her "wife" (an assistant professor of English at the University of California, Berkeley) also created a website to shame her family and church. Her goal? She said that her father needed to resign from the church.

She participated in numerous internet message boards and via social media. In all of these things, their words came across as vindictive against their father.

As the situation became known, the pastor took a leave of absence from the church. The board agreed with this decision. Later on, he went public with the situation to the church, admitted that his not revealing his son's confession to the church was unwise and rejoined the church at the pastor.

This angered and agitated the embittered daughter. She grew increasingly vocal with her attempts to embarrass and destroy her own father (and family). Oddly enough, her radical "wife" would try to appeal to "spirituality" while admitting that she's an atheist.

Last week, the pastor announced that he was resigning from the church (despite many parishioners who wanted him to remain). From the point of view of many people, it seemed like the oldest daughter had a personal vendetta against her father and family for not accepting her lifestyle.

In fact, the eldest daughter and her "wife" actually celebrated their "victory." Given the close-knit LGBTQxyz community that they are involved with, their followers and friends gleefully gloated over her father's resignation.

While reading through comments on Twitter and elsewhere, I noticed that if anyone who tried to correct them, they would be met by the LGBTQxyz echo chamber of mockery and vilification. They could be condescending and hateful about Christians. However, anyone who used similar arguments about homosexuality would be labeled a bigot by those same hateful individuals.

It seems like the price that must be paid in this day and age -- if you stand for truth -- can be enormous. Perhaps the pastor that you mentioned was unwilling to endure criticism or love God even more than his own child.

This entire debacle (with both ministers) reminds me of the song CONSIDER THE COST by Steve Camp:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUN1-iBJPes

To obey is better than sacrifice
And the hearken than the fat of rams
For what will a man give for his own life
Houses or money or land?
There's a way that seems right to you
But in the end it leads only to death
But come unto Him all ye weary
Come and find your rest

Consider the cost of building a tower
It's a narrow way that you must come
For to do the will of the Father
Is to follow the Son
To love Him more than father or mother!
You will love Him more than even your own flesh!
To give all that you are, for all that He is
This is the gospel according to Jesus

Many will say "Lord, Lord" on that day
Look what we've done in Your name
"Oh, we've prophesied and performed many miracles
And Lord, even the demons obeyed"
Then He will will declare unto them
The most terrifying words of truth
He'll say "Depart from me ye workers of iniquity --
For I have never known you!"

Consider the cost of building a tower
It's a narrow way that you must come
For to do the will of the Father
Is to follow the Son
Will you love Him more than father or mother?
Will you love Him more than even your own flesh?
To give all that you are, for all that He is
This is the gospel according to Jesus

Oh, foolish man, how you built on the sand
Trusting in your goodness to save
For when the rains fall and the flood breaks the wall
You will be swept away
But blessed is he who builds on the Rock
Who takes Jesus as Lord to save
For when the rain falls, he will endure it all
Standing firm in His grace

Consider the cost of building a tower
It's a narrow way that you must come
For to do the will of the Father
Is to follow the Son
Will you love Him more than father or mother?
Will you love Him more than even your own flesh?
To give all that you are, for all that He is
This is the gospel according to Jesus

To give all that you are, for all that He is
This is the gospel according to Jesus

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUN1-iBJPes

Sometimes, the most difficult thing to do is the easiest -- to simply tell the truth. We must tell the truth -- THE Truth -- in face of all opposition. Even if it means losing the love of family members, friends or people that we don't want to lose, we must stand for Christ.

Lysa and Chris-

I certainly agree with both of your comments. I was reading Ps. 91 yesterday and I guess that applies to situations like this as well as situations involving physical danger, which is how it generally is applied.

Lysa- I don’t remember that gentleman you reference at all. It may have been before my time here but I’ve been here a while.

I’ve never heard that song before by Steve Camp- the lyrics are amazing.

Chris- your post highlights a theme that I have been thinking about, namely to what extent should a parent(in the case you mention also a pastor) bear the blame for the way their children turn out? One of the qualifications for elders is to "manage his household well.” Does that mean the pastor in your example should be disqualified? (As an aside, he never should have allowed his son to work with youth in the church given his admission- that was a gross error in judgment in my opinion).

We all have heard a pastors kids who go astray- it’s almost a cliche. Certainly the devil has a hand in this.

But the parents cannot always be blamed- or can they?

And I struggle with the practical side of things- how do you deal with the daughter in the situation. I described? She’s only 14.

Homosexuality is an unclean and perverse spirit that is readily discernible, even in a photo...

The pastor/father has total authority over it - the blood of Christ provides sufficiency. Perhaps he (dad) was unaware or was otherwise occupied...
That inhabitation by this unholy spirit took time to take root in this young lady, no matter how welcoming she might’ve been. Often this type enters in disguised as a comforting spirit in a time disparity, confirming the "right” to self-pity and the subsequent identity with it.
These spirits have no authority yet they deceive so as to garner a persons authority (autonomy) thru tricking them into yielding themselves to its promise of deliverance from perceived oppression or restrictions, due to rejection (usually by a father).
Fathers have an enormous responsibility before God to first themselves be wholly yielded to His direction and then to set not only an example but a context for their household. Everywhere the father/dad fails in this yielding unto the Lord, being stubborn or shortsighted, will be revealed as first hypocritical in himself and his service unto the Lord but also reflected in his children and all those whom abide under his covering.
I’ve seen this in my own household, wife and children....
But ALL PRAISE be unto God thru Christ Jesus for HE is faithful and has gone before and made escape thru repentance by the cross of Christ.
These deceiving spirits are subject and have no choice but to submit to the authority of Jesus, they flee instantly and can easily be bound.
James says, first submit yourself to the Lord then secondly to resist the devil and he WILL FLEE from you.

(My understanding) is that first receive the conviction and then respond with deep repentance allowing the Holy Spirit sway to do His work.
Then armor up, pray and fast, interceding before God continuously till this unclean spirit is broken, bound and cast out. No need to even address the daughter directly, she is an unwitting accomplice, rather go before the Lord of hosts and allow HIS authority to find seat of establishment in our heart and then His glory will shine forth dispelling the spirit of perversion.
So to be clear, don’t "react” to the presence of an unclean spirit by engaging with religion... rather "respond” to the Father in humble supplication. Jesus, Paul, Stephen, James, Peter all followed this narrow way, it’s right there for everyone to read/see 🙌🏽

Hi TMK,

Chris- your post highlights a theme that I have been thinking about, namely to what extent should a parent(in the case you mention also a pastor) bear the blame for the way their children turn out? One of the qualifications for elders is to "manage his household well.” Does that mean the pastor in your example should be disqualified? (As an aside, he never should have allowed his son to work with youth in the church given his admission- that was a gross error in judgment in my opinion).

We all have heard a pastors kids who go astray- it’s almost a cliche. Certainly the devil has a hand in this.

But the parents cannot always be blamed- or can they?

And I struggle with the practical side of things- how do you deal with the daughter in the situation. I described? She’s only 14.

If I had a child who had a deadly medical condition, I would do whatever I could to save her. I'd certainly pray and cry out to the Lord on her behalf. Yet, I'd do other things too. This might mean leaving a job or moving. I'd search the world for a cure.

If my children were starving, I would do whatever I could to change that situation. I would search desperately for a job that could allow me to feed them. I'd switch professions, relocate and/or do anything and everything to stop their suffering.

So, when I see the children of pastors who are falling away while their father tries to disciple the church, I can't help but think that it would be better for that pastor to step down -- at least temporarily -- and take care of his own family first.

OF course, I'm not saying that the pastor is to "blame." What I am saying is that the pastor must be RESPONSIBLE for his children. Aside from his own relationship with God, this is his first and greatest responsibility.

The verses that you quoted, I Timothy 3:4-5, identifies this need. In fact, the verse continues:

KJV: "One that ruleth well his own house, HAVING HIS CHILDREN IN SUBJECTION WITH ALL GRAVITY; (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)"

NASB: "He must be one who manages his own household well, KEEPING HIS CHILDREN UNDER CONTROL WITH ALL DIGNITY (but if a man does not know how to manage his own household, how will he take care of the church of God?)"

NIV: "He must manage his own family well AND SEE THAT HIS CHILDREN OBEY HIM, and he must do so in a manner worthy of full respect. (If anyone does not know how to manage his own family, how can he take care of God’s church?)"

The girl that you mentioned is 14-years-old. However, I strongly suspect that the issues within that girl's heart occurred before she turned 14. At the first sight of these issues, I think that the pastor should have acted differently on her behalf -- even if it meant losing his career.

I think that this is a major issue today. In both the situation that you brought up and the one involving the pastor who lives near me, I think that they might see things differently. This is because their "calling" is now a "job." It is their "bread and butter." I suspect that many pastors see their profession as a "responsibility" -- overseeing many other people.

This is a problem. The pastor's first responsibility is to his own family. This is why Paul said that it would be better "not to marry" -- because such a man has to consider the concerns of his family (and his sense of responsibility might feel divided).

As such, I think that it is important for a pastor to step away at the first signs of a serious lasting issue in his children. His focus should be on managing his family and providing care for that child.

No one would look down at a man if he stepped away from a job to care for a sick or dying child. Many states and countries even have laws that allow for this. The United States even passed the "Family and Medical Leave Act" so that a parent can look after a sick child.

In a spiritual sense, the pastor that you described has a spiritually sick child. That pastor -- at the first sign of a major ongoing problem -- should have taken a sabbatical (even if it resulted in losing his position). He might have to find another job or even relocate.

While he might not be to blame for that child, he is certainly responsible for her. The decision will ultimately be up to her. However, he must do everything within his power to fight for her soul -- even at the cost of his pastoral "career." It really is the heart of the matter.

Excellent thoughts Chris.

One thing I have decided is I will never judge parents based on how the children have grown up into. If our Children are Godly then it is absolute mercy of God, we cannot take any credit on this. There are times when we can clearly see the mistakes of some parents like how we see in this case. But even in those cases, we should not judge the parents.

While the mistake of the parents in this case of a Child associating herself with LGBTQ is very cleary, there are many things that are not visible to us. I basically feel that the parents have fallen to what is acceptable in the world. In the world it is acceptable for a child to associate herself with such groups, so we as a Christian parent should also accept them. This appear to be the mentality of the parents here.

How many Christian parents have accepted that it is normal for their children to take part in Prom nights with a person of opposite sex? How many Christian Parents have accepted that it is normal for their children to have a premarital sexual relationship? How are these things any different from this Pastor who accepted his child as LGBTQ? At least he has honesty to accept that his belief is contrary to what he sees in the Church.

Excellent points Sree.

Here is an email my dad sent to this pastor:
””””””””
I am only speaking for me now. K”” and I have not discussed what my message was going to be to you. I have given serious thought, prayer and consideration in my words to you. That being said, I shoot straight from the hip as you probably know and I will stand on the comments I make at all times.

I am truly sorry that Lily has chosen the LGBTQ path in her life. She is very young to be so sure that this is her lifetime destiny. Whatever has influenced her is basically coming from the evil and sin in this world. I cannot believe that God directed her on this path. Any born again Christian knows that this is wrong and evil in God’s sight. I know we love our children but love cannot overshadow the direction a child takes that is contrary to God’s teachings. As Christian parents we are responsible for overcoming evil when it attacks our family. We cannot give in to it and we must fight it with all the tools available to us. Calling Lily…. Lee is a big step in surrendering to sin. In your house under your roof your children live by your Christian biblical standards not standards adopted by a 14 year old child influenced by a sinful world. She is LILY!

Nowhere in the Bible can I find anything that condones men marrying men and women marrying women. In fact, it is clear that the female was made to be a help to the male and to share their lives as like minded couples that God approves of in the relationship. I was startled to hear you say that you had become tolerate of recognizing gay marriages. I believe you said that same sex individuals falling in love and living as married couples had some level of acceptance to our God. You know you cannot present a shred of evidence to support that idea Biblically. You are crashing and burning in your ministry if you choose to follow a path based on sinful practices that you choose to accept and tolerate. You don’t make the rules. God has already made them.

I think you have been straying doctrinally for a while now as you have wrestled with who you are and what you are choosing to become. What you are choosing to become is not a committed servant of God. You are trying to preach a different doctrine that is unacceptable to our God. I hope those who know you, respect you and wish for you to continue as a minister of the gospel will pray fervently that you return to preaching Godly biblical messages that do not allow any sinful thoughts or practices to be part of your message. If you truly believe that at some time you were called into Christian ministry then you must accept that you do not get to make the rules and preach what seems right for today. God has not changed the ages old message of salvation and living a Godly life. It is a simple message that needs no changes or influences to modernize it for todays world. If todays world does not fit then todays world is wrong.

I will pray for what your future holds.

Tragic.

I see where this pastor and his wife were embracing liberal theology. If this is the case then the fact that their daughter is living out the liberal theology, would it be remiss to suggest the parents contributed to her sin by embracing a philosophy that accommodated perversion?

Methinks this fellow should have been excommunicated instead of giving him the option to resign. Telling him to resign is just a slap on the wrist. Embracing perversion is damming to the soul - read Romans 1:32.

Sandra

How do you excommunicate a Protestant?

Agreed- thx Greg.

Brother Greg said...The idea of church discipline is very minimal in our day.

About church discipline:
First we should try and define what a modern day "church" is.
This could be an interesting topic...

And a question to the forum and moderators:
Recently someone posted a link to a Islam website in one of the threads, "God works in mysterious ways" by Drifter
The link is still there ! Why is this ??
Edit: clarified which thread I mean

You email the link to the user’s profile and Greg will remove it. I already sent him this one. Thanks for pointing it out.

Chris,

This story really bothers me - I can not get it out of my mind. It is so tragic on different levels - how could the dad be so powerless that would result in him caving in to his daughter's sin?

Then...

Then my aunt(actually, it was her husband that was my uncle, now deceased) died. Her oldest son wrote a beautiful piece, posting it on FB, about his mother and her parenting skills. Here is a quote: "You taught me to love God and to fear YOU if I didn’t." (Dave Schrock.) Been thinking about this: how is that children today run over their parents? Been thinking a lot about this....

Sandra Miller

"By the grace of God I did not have to deal with this regarding my own kids."

Before writing anything, the above statement holds true for myself. Because sin of/in any degree not manifesting in our own lives or the lives of our children, is but for the grace of God.

"Is there a way to love your child without affirming their choice? I know in theory it can be done but in practice I don’t know how it would work."

I think for me it might work this way;

Tears rolling down my face, on my face weeping before Almighty God on a regular basis, crying out for deliverance and salvation which He alone can give.

Not "jumping to affirm" this sin, or any sin for that matter, but speaking the truth in love. In love for the truth as well in love for their soul. To do less would be both a betrayal to God as well as their soul. It'd be a form of idolatry.

Yet I'd jump to their aid if I were called upon to do so. What I mean is that I'd be ready to bail them out so to speak, when I got a phone call. If they ever needed me in the midnight hour, I'd jump out of bed.

Jesus said, to love God with all our heart, mind, soul and strength. He also said, to love our neighbor as ourself. He also said, do unto others as you'd have them do unto you.

God Himself loves the just and the unjust by giving them both sunshine and rain. In such context I can be like God in my practically loving such persons. This extends even to my enemies, not just family members, friends, or those who love me.

Unless these words are more than merely words, you've not surpassed those pharisees to whom Jesus spoke.

Let us not love in word only, but in deed and in truth.

I had read this thread when it first appeared but I didn't post because I have a tendency to stay away when I feel there's any kind of politicizing going on. Also in showing compassion for the people involved, someone might misconstrue that as being in agreement with sin and I'm not.

Reading about this father, pained my heart. I had a whole write up but instead I think fewer words is better. Things aren't always as black and white as some people may try to make them out to be. God sees in totality. We only see in part. At the very least this minister was of integrity in confessing and stepping down. Personally I don't think this father can see any thing or anyone but his baby girl. Everything he's doing is because he's not ready to let go and surrender her to God. I didn't go through this one, but as a parent of a prodigal, I really get it.

The beauty of it is that God knows exactly where this dad is at because He's a Father too (whew!). What this family is going through is a very deep thing. My heart goes out to them. While other people may gossip and abandon this family, that's not who God is. I wouldn't be so quick to write this family off. God is not like man and it's not over until He says it's over...Selah

He and his wife just started an "open and affirming” church.

(((Caleb4life)))

Your post has encouraged me...praise God! Having a revelation of The Father has made all the difference for me as the parent of a prodigal and how I view and interact with other saints who are suffering. Thank you for understanding what I was saying.