I am curious to know who of you , on the forum, will continue to uphold those people who prophesied that Trump will have reelection and not call them false prophets?
It is very obvious that there is an infestation of false prophets masquerading in the churchn and the reelection has exposed them. When the church does not call them out and expose it it shows why the church, in America, is in the state that it is in.
John
The inauguration is Jan 20 and the Supreme Court said they will make their decision by Jan 22, two days after the inauguration. What if they rule in favor Trump? It makes no sense to me for them to make their decision two days after the date for the inauguration.
Meanwhile, if Trump is not reseated I wonder if the "prophets" will come up with excuses and perhaps blame the church and its lack of faith in responding to their prophecies. I will not be receiving it if they do.
Hi Docs
I did hear about that date and if I remember correctly its something like when a case is lodged it gets an automatic date of 30 days or so from the the day its lodged.This date is not written in stone its just a proceedure .so if the case was lodged on 22nd dec then it gets a day of 22nd of jan but this is open to change.
Also on ur second point I think i did make the exact same case about a month ago that I noticed some prophets trying to build an escape route for themselves which were the Church didnt pray it in and President Trump will get a second term just not this term.
After saying all this I still think this is not over and its very scriptural to say that God acts best and greatest when he is the last man standing like lazarus who was stinking and the Red Sea.
Their is also another few issues
1 Some Christians wrongly think Prophesy is not for today and wont come out and plainly say that but are secretly hoping Trump loses as to prove a theological stand point.
2 Some Christians wrongly have not supported Trump and have gone over like David to the Philistines and have offered support to the opposition thinking it was the right thing to do but it wasnt.
3 Some people have a warped view of persecution and have talked themselves into a frenzy over it and couldnt believe that God put Trump in office (which he clearly did in my opinion )to put a blocker on the said persecution.Nothwithstanding persecution will come but its not to be eagerly sought after but endured when it comes,
urs staff
I keep thinking of the clear and overwhelming scriptural evidence that this present evil age ends not on a high note for man and his progress. Nor does it end with the church overcoming and redeeming the institutions and cultures of this world. It ends with a time of tribulation such as never has occurred not ever will again and if this time was not shortened no life would survive. No amount of present revival, and I am all for revival by any means, will cause the church at that time to be able to circumvent around it. There is much talk of revival but so little talk of the circumstances that will accompany it. The last and greatest revival will take place during the greatest time of time of rejection and outright persecution the church has ever experienced. The present day "prophetic" stream seems to say little about this in my opinion.
My 2 cents worth.
Hi Deadn,
I agree in part but we have not been careful in seperating the wood from the trees and we have thrown the baby out with the bathwater because of our lack of diligence.
If I can make a few points
1.Just because we have an infestation of false prophets doesnt mean prophesy is wrong both forthtelling and foretelling .
2 False Prophets in the past,present and future or any charlatan will attach themselves to the part of the Church that believes in Spiritual gifts because it would benefit them nothing if they didnt as those believers are the only ones they can exploit.Importantly though it does not mean that prophesy is wrong .
3The New Testament clearly states that the purpose of Prophesy is to Exhort,Comfort and Console the Church and if we do not have Prophesy well the consequences are we cant Exhort,Comfort and Console the body in such a direct way from the throne of God.
4 When exposing false prophets we have to be careful because alot of these people are real Christians who we will see in heaven.However this issue must be dealt with as it is giving God a bad name,I do believe that strongly too.
5 Importantly if Trump wins in the end it doesnt mean all the people that prophesied or said he would are true prophets either
This is not over until its over so it premature by three days ,the three days Lazarus spent in the tomb and all seemed dead.Lastly Christians who want Trump to lose and are gleeful at the chance of it happening are on the wrong side,you are like David a great man of God who was willing to support the Philistines against his own.
If five years ago someone told me that we would have a President of the USA that was against Abortion,Supported Israel,The Nation state as God does,supported prayer and Christians being brought back into the White House ,Supported free speech and Christians who were persecuted,attended pray functions,mentioned Jesus as being Lord and got prayed over publically I would have been overjoyed because thats what we wanted right?
urs staff
Hi Docs,
I dont think its at all clear or overwhelming the evidence that the Church ends on a sour note.The evidence is that the Church ends without denominations like it was in the beginning and under Apostolic Doctrine again as it was in the beginning.
Again and Again their is a huge difference between the period of time called "The Great Tribulation" and Persecution and regular Tribulation.They are not connected at all.
The first half of the 7th week which is 3 and half years are great times for the Church as we come under the Ministry of the Two Witnesses who restore Apostolic Doctrine and Authority.This will be the greatest revival because of this restoration.
As for being involved in institutions etc we are to be involved as we are a restrainer on evil .What is the alternative ?allow Abortion because we dont elect Presidents who picks the right Judges?
By not being involved and changing things we are saying go ahead kill as many babies as you want....
Im sure thats not the right approach,just my couple of cents worth too ...God bless mightly
I didn't day the church ends on a sour note. I said its final ministry and witness will take place during the time of greatest trial it has ever known. It won't all be fun and roses at that point no mater what happens in the years preceding it.
Where does it say the church will come under the ministry of the Two Witnesses as they restore apostolic doctrine like it was in the beginning? It seems they are sent to prophesy against the Kingdom of the beast.
Meanwhile, what the OP posted needs to be considered. If it does not come out as many prophets have spoken we need not hang our heads and be reluctant to say there is only one main reason and that was false prophecies.
Here is my take on the whole incident.
As I have told in this forum multiple times, prophesying election results is not a new covenant prophecy. Not that God is incapable of doing an Old covenant type of prophecy. But a person like me who is part of a new covenant life and Church cannot accept such prophesy to be fruitful to the CHurch by any margin. Because I have witnessed and still witnessing real New Covenant Prophesy. But there are many Christians who do not even have a clue on New Covenant, they can rejoice and celebrate such prophesies!
Looking at the political picture, this is what I feel has happened. I would be happy if I am proven wrong. I post it not to bring a political view but to show a pattern of events that supports we live in the end time, awaiting persecution.
1. 2016 Presidential winner used the anger in a particular race who were totally ignored in the past 8 years. He served as a voice for them and they supported him and he won in 2016.
2. He tried to be faithful to his vote bank and since the majority of them are Christians, he stood for certain Christian values to retain the vote bank. (I wish I was wrong here).
3. Even when the huge issue of racism came, he did not fail his vote bank by voicing against them but still kept on hanging to it. Believing that the same people will back him up again in 2021.
4. Most Churches are filled with this race and hence they started raising this president as a God-sent answer to make America a God-pleasing country.
5. But the arrogant behavior seen in public by their elected leader and still the continuous support of the Church, has resulted in many to start hating him as well as the Church.
6. I sense people have now developed an aversion to Christianity and also to Christians as a result of the Church supporting this arrogant political leader.
7. Now that in 2020, this person lost. Though most Christians from his vote bank supported him strongly and still believed in him.
8. I see the purpose, God allowed this leader to continue from 2016 to 2020 is to bring this hatred upon the Church who lost their primary purpose and hence resulting in the persecution of true Church. The political platform (after election win) as well as general people mentality is clearly against the Church in 2021.
9. I believe God allowed the unsuspecting Christian leaders to be deceived by a Conman to bring persecution upon the CHurch. (I wish to be proved wrong here). This point is based on the scripture-
2 Thess 2:11- For this reason God will send them a powerful delusion so that they believe the lie, 12in order that judgment may come upon all who have disbelieved the truth and delighted in wickedness.
I developed the above theory based on observing the life of the 2016 President elect, the blind support that most undiscerning Church leaders gave to him and also seeing the rise in hatred for the Church. I clearly see a pattern here to start great persecution.
I wish I was proved wrong here. I actually prayed for a different election result in 2020 and rejoiced with the result in 2016. But I cannot deny what I have witnessed which is opposite to what I desired.
I apologize if I have hurt anyone by my views here. As I said, I will be happy to be proven wrong. This is just my observation of the sequence of events in the last 12 years that I lived in the West.
Hi Sree,
I cant even begin to express how totally wrong I think your analysis is but I will try.But this is what you believe and in the cold light of day have look at the facts.What actually happened not whether Donald Trump appears to be nice guy or not .The Anti Christ is going to be a hell of nice guy ,he wont appear arrogant or be protrayed as a racist though ,he will be loved by CNN,Msnbc and Nbc for his beautiful manner but by their fruits you will know them .
Clinton-Biden -Obama Democrats
Atheistic
Abortion (millions of dead babies)
Supported Planned Parenthood
Put in and Supported Supreme Judges that were for Abortion
Anti Semitic Hates Israel
No Borders(Babylon)
Socialist Economics that has kept minorities in ghettos
Supports BLM the founder patrisse colors says she is a marxist fully trained
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HgEUbSzOTZ8
Identy politcs,gender,race etc
Not to mention the greatest election fraud in the history of western democracy in 2020
Supports censorship of conservative values through CNN ,facebook and twitter and more
Could not care less about Christians
Then Compare to Trump
Pro Israel recognised Jerusalem as capital and confronted Israels enemies
Pro Life
Defunded Planned parent hood
Put in 3 supreme Judges that were Pro Life
Believes in the Nation State rather than one world government
Did More for African Americans and other minorities economically than almost any previous president
Best unemployment rate for African Americans for 40 or 50 yrs
Black College support
Free Choice of Schools for minorites which is critical economically for minorites
Brought Prayer back to the Whitehouse,allow Christian Pastors in ,supported free speech
Condemned Christian persecution
So what you are saying in my mind anyway is because Trump appears arrogant(i think hes bullish and rightly throws his wait around not arrogant) and you think he is racist (which he not) you think Christians should vote for Atheism ,Abortion etc
You then have concluded that because Christians have supported Donald Trump because he has done the right things that he is drawing persecution upon Christians.
The reason any right minded in my opinion Christian voted for Donald Trump is that it was an unexpected chance to get rid of Abortion ,to stop the spread of liberal communism, that he gave Christians a voice in the highest office against atheism and that he is a wealth creator not a career politician.
The Present Democratic party with the help of some republicans are the most spiritually evil group of people to have power since the foundation of the state .By their fruits you know them and their fruits are rotten to the core
I honestly think you should and I mean it sincerely reflect on who is best for Christians in the land ....and you will come to the only conclusion that democratic leaders hate Christians with a spiritual passion and Trump has delayed persecution not encouraged it.If Hillary was in power where would we be in 2020?
urs staff
Continuing on my previous post. I see the same pattern in India as well. As most of us know, India currently has a Hinduthva based government. But before this, the party that ruled India probably some 7 years back, were trying to please all people. In order to get the vote from minority (Muslims and Christians), they gave them many freebies, like a priority in Jobs, Government-sponsored trips to shrines like Hajj to Muslims and Israel to Christians, etc. As expected minority grabbed with both hands, but they did not see that the people around them the majority of Hindus are getting irritated by this minority appeasement program.
In the subsequent elections, the party that came to power totally ignored the minority vote and banked on Majority Hindus. They won convincingly. Now because of all these minority appeasement programs by the earlier regime, people developed an aversion for minorities. I have close friends and relatives who hate Christians. A strong sense came among people that only Hindus are patriotic. Also a hatred for secularism. I believe any government that does not respect secularism is doomed to failure.
Now with the Hindutva government in power and also the growing hatred among the majority for the minority religion, Christian persecution is inevitable. Especially fellowships like mine which are not backed by big denominations, they are soft targets in India now.
This raises the question, what should Christians expect or pray for from the Government? I believe this is where most Christians are going wrong. According to 1 Timothy 2,
First of all, then, I urge that requests, prayers, intercession, and thanksgiving be made on behalf of all people, 2 for kings and all who are in authority, so that we may lead a tranquil and quiet life in all godliness and dignity.
We are asked to pray for a tranquil and quiet life to worship our God in peace. This should be our only requirement from the government. Anything else can be a bonus but not a priority at all.
But in India, the nominal Christain community demanding extra freebies from the government has now caused so much hatred for Christians among majority Hindus. I see the same pattern in the USA as well. In the greed for a government that should hold Christian values, we have invoked so much hatred for Christianity among common people.
No government can be governed by Biblical principles. Sadly based on my observation the elderly Christians in the USA have this thought that the USA is modern Israel and hence it should be governed by the Bible. They will not openly admit it, but it can be easily discerned that they believe they live in a Christian nation and everything should be governed by the Bible. This is wrong, and such extra-Biblical expectation is the reason that people supported a wrong conman for the presidency.
If I can make a few points
1.Just because we have an infestation of false prophets doesnt mean prophesy is wrong both forthtelling and foretelling .
******It does mean more people are open to hearing false prophets and not test prophesy. Do you know of any true prophets today? I do not.
2 False Prophets in the past,present and future or any charlatan will attach themselves to the part of the Church that believes in Spiritual gifts because it would benefit them nothing if they didnt as those believers are the only ones they can exploit.Importantly though it does not mean that prophesy is wrong .
*******Again, can you name any true prophets today. I cannot.
3The New Testament clearly states that the purpose of Prophesy is to Exhort,Comfort and Console the Church and if we do not have Prophesy well the consequences are we cant Exhort,Comfort and Console the body in such a direct way from the throne of God.
*******The NT also says that the church was established on the foundation of the Apostles and the prophets. THis doesn't suggest continuing Apostles or prophets. Even Peter said we have a more sure word of prophecy in the scriptures and this was said after being on the mountain with Jesus and hearing the voice of the Father. He pointed back to the scriptures.
4 When exposing false prophets we have to be careful because alot of these people are real Christians who we will see in heaven.However this issue must be dealt with as it is giving God a bad name,I do believe that strongly too.
*********A false prophet is not a real christian. A real Christian knows the voice of Jesus and that doesn't have to be as a prophet. Can you name anyone in the OT who were of God and made false prophecy? False prophecy is taking the Name of the Lord in vain and that is a serious offense.
5 Importantly if Trump wins in the end it doesnt mean all the people that prophesied or said he would are true prophets either
**********Those who prophesied Trump to win.....and if Trump does win it doesn't mean they are Christians. Look at the doctrine that these so called prophets teach. None of it is orthodox. They have people going after other goes while keeping the Name of Jesus in there somewhere.
Question to all:
Who here on SI doesn’t hear from the Lord directly (personally) ?
"Question to all:
Who here on SI doesn’t hear from the Lord directly (personally) ?"
Are you asking about personal revelation? A voice? A vision type of thing?
I hear from God via the Word. Meaning, as I go about my business I find the Word coming to my mind when in certain situations and I will act accordingly.
5 years ago I had an illumination/revelation happen to me that changed the path I was on. I was out running and toward the end a voice spoke the word 'Seduction' to me and it started me. Then a mental image of pentecostal church and Jehovah's Witnesses came up and in an impression what I recognized was there is a part of the church that is spreading false doctrine and operating in false signs and wonders and there is a 'church' that calls itself the church and is false through and through............. this drove me to the bible and scriptures about the seduction of the soul were highlighted to me. As a result of this I learned to understand sermons better and I learned to study the bible more indepth.
Not even a year after this JW's came to my door and so began dialogue to this day. I also began to understand where the pentecostal and charismatic church went wrong and so I stay away from it. I Know that will be an issue with some. I was a part of the Assemblies of God for a decade. I didn't go looking for that illunination.
Hi Deadn,
I will pick out the most important point first which if I can some up as does Prophesy exist in the new testament church .....
Peters words do not negate Pauls words ,just adds to them.Paul clearly is talking about the gifts and that Prophesy is a greater gift and why it is so good.He is also clearly talking about an utterance not the written word which Peter is talking about.We cannot rip out New Testament scripture as if it doesnt exist.Paul says Prophesy is hugely important .Lets not rob Paul to pay Peter.Peter is not negating Pauls scriptures.So prophesy remains
1 Cor 14
2For he who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men, but to God. Indeed, no one understands him; he utters mysteries in the Spirit. 3But he who prophesies speaks to men for their edification, encouragement, and comfort. 4The one who speaks in a tongue edifies himself, but the one who prophesies edifies the church.…
Peter did not say prophetic utterance is not nessacary but that scriptural prophesy is sure because it has already come to pass or alot of it.
I Qouted
The New Testament clearly states that the purpose of Prophesy is to Exhort,Comfort and Console the Church and if we do not have Prophesy well the consequences are we cant Exhort,Comfort and Console the body in such a direct way from the throne of God.
You Qouted
*******The NT also says that the church was established on the foundation of the Apostles and the prophets. THis doesn't suggest continuing Apostles or prophets. Even Peter said we have a more sure word of prophecy in the scriptures and this was said after being on the mountain with Jesus and hearing the voice of the Father. He pointed back to the scriptures
ON APOSTLES AND PROPHETS IN THE CHURCH.
I do not believe we have Apostles like the 12 Apostles or Paul in the present day Church .However since the bible is cyrstal clear that all the 12 Apostles come from John The Baptist (and not Jesus)who came in the Spirit of Elijah I believe that Apostles will be restored to the Church in the end times by the Spirit of Elijah but this has not happened yet.We may have "sent out ones" in the present day Church but we do not have anyone with Apostolic Authority like the 12 or Paul
Prophets is a different story ,the scripture is talking about Old Testament Prophets .The Church is grafted into the tree and we clearly had new testament prophetesses and prophets in the early Church and their is no evidence to suggest this didnt continue.
ON WHETHER FALSE PROPHETS CAN BE CHRISTIAN
The answer is yes because prophesying falsely is a sin or in your words a serious offence and a sin can be covered by the blood of Jesus.So can a serious offence be covered by the blood yes.Will God take action yes.
ON TRUMP WINNING AND ORTHODOXY
All the people I have listened too personally saying Trump will win also are very Orthodox and love the Lord and are Christians going to heaven.
ON WHETHER I KNOW A TRUE PROPHET
Yes my Pastor ,he regularly gives me insight to things I need to know and help me with words from God.
On whether I have heard people on the internet say things that came to pass yes.
ONE OTHER POINT
Paul announced or introduced himself as I Paul An Apostle,he didnt say I am Apostle Paul and this is very important.He didnt call himself by his gifting like we do in the modern day Church when we introduce someone as Pastor David or Pastor Carter taking Times square as an example.This is unscriptural and has a very negative effect on the Church.
urs staff
Paul writes this about prophecy.
1 Cor 14:23 - Therefore if the whole church gathers together and all the people speak in tongues, and outsiders or unbelievers enter, will they not say that you are insane? 24 But if all prophesy, and an unbeliever or an outsider enters, he is convicted by all, he is called to account by all; 25 the secrets of his heart are disclosed; and so he will fall on his face and worship God, declaring that God is certainly among you.
Now imagine an unbeliever is coming to a Church, the Church is filled with people proclaiming who will win the election in the name of prophecy, will the secrets of his heart be disclosed? Will he fall on his face and worship God, declaring that God is among them?
I was once an unbeliever and idol worshiper who had no clue about Jesus and Christianity. If I had entered the CHurch like this then I will straightway walkout that these are lunatics and political fanatics! There is no God in their midst, my Hindu temples are better!
The one who has never heard such a high standard of New Covenant prophesy can appreciate such useless politically motivated predictions in the name of prophecy. But a person like me whom God has showed the real Church of God where my heart is getting disclosed by prophetic word will never accept such degraded predictions as prophecy. A blind can call a mouse an elephant but a person who can see will not! I am not blind to call such things as prophecy. My eyes have seen real new covenant prophesy.
Hi Sree,
A few comments
1.Who told you what God can reveal or not reveal?Are you God's Censor?
2 Who showed you or disclosed this "real Church of God"to you, how did he do it?and why should I believe you?
3 All true prophesy has only one standard ,their are not many standards and only a high standard can come from God
4 Is it better to have an Atheistic ,Abortion supporting ,Israel hating person to be President of the USA or President that supports Israel ,is Pro Life and has supported Christians and free speech more than any President in living memory?urs staff
Your Qoute
The one who has never heard such a high standard of New Covenant prophesy can appreciate such useless politically motivated predictions in the name of prophecy. But a person like me whom God has showed the real Church of God where my heart is getting disclosed by prophetic word will never accept such degraded predictions as prophecy. A blind can call a mouse an elephant but a person who can see will not! I am not blind to call such things as prophecy. My eyes have seen real new covenant prophesy.
Hi Sree,
Paul was making a point to the Corinthians whose meetings were getting out of control that they needed to be orderly,he wasnt degrading tongues or prophesy and showing how Prophesy was a greater gift than tongues and why it is a greater gift than tongues,urs staff
1 Cor 14:23 - Therefore if the whole church gathers together and all the people speak in tongues, and outsiders or unbelievers enter, will they not say that you are insane? 24 But if all prophesy, and an unbeliever or an outsider enters, he is convicted by all, he is called to account by all; 25 the secrets of his heart are disclosed; and so he will fall on his face and worship God, declaring that God is certainly among you.
Hi All,it is accepted by many we are in the last days,
What are these dreams and visions going to be about?
Joel: 17‘ In the last days, God says, I will pour out My Spirit on all people. Your sons and daughters will prophesy, your young men will see visions, your old men will dream dreams. 18Even on My menservants and maidservants I will pour out My Spirit in those days, and they will prophesy.…
ACTS 10
Look at acts 10 it gives names ,where Peter is staying and even where that house is.It is so specific that Cornelius can relay the message to his servants to carry out Gods instructions.God can be specific ,God can communicate anything he wants ,You do not have to an Apostle or Prophet, to have a vision,God chose Cornelius because of his prayers and gifts to the poor to carry out his wishes.
Then God reveals a spiritual truth to Peter in a vision.The vision is abstract to a degree and the Lord doesnt qoute any scripture to Peter.
Also the vision to Cornelius was about the future as he said when you go to Simon the Tanners house you will find Peter there.Thats in the future.
You cant limit God to what he can reveal or who he reveals it too .Cornelius was a centurion who didnt have the Holy Spirit .
If God wants to reveal what is about to take place in the USA ,he will reveal what is about to take place in the USA.God is all knowing and if he wants to impart some of that insight ,he can impart that insight,urs staff
ACTS 10
Cornelius stared at him in fear. "What is it, Lord?” he asked.
The angel answered, "Your prayers and gifts to the poor have come up as a memorial offering before God. 5 Now send men to Joppa to bring back a man named Simon who is called Peter. 6 He is staying with Simon the tanner, whose house is by the sea.”
7 When the angel who spoke to him had gone, Cornelius called two of his servants and a devout soldier who was one of his attendants. 8 He told them everything that had happened and sent them to Joppa.
Quote: No government can be governed by Biblical principles.
Nonsense
"Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God." Roms 13:1 ESV
Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you.
Hi Deadn,
I will pick out the most important point first which if I can some up as does Prophesy exist in the new testament church .....Peters words do not negate Pauls words ,just adds to them.Paul clearly is talking about the gifts and that Prophesy is a greater gift and why it is so good.He is also clearly talking about an utterance not the written word which Peter is talking about.We cannot rip out New Testament scripture as if it doesnt exist.Paul says Prophesy is hugely important .Lets not rob Paul to pay Peter.Peter is not negating Pauls scriptures.So prophesy remains
1 Cor 14
2For he who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men, but to God. Indeed, no one understands him; he utters mysteries in the Spirit. 3But he who prophesies speaks to men for their edification, encouragement, and comfort. 4The one who speaks in a tongue edifies himself, but the one who prophesies edifies the church.…
Peter did not say prophetic utterance is not nessacary but that scriptural prophesy is sure because it has already come to pass or alot of it.
And this happened in the early church as the church was being established. When church history is read you don't find any of the church fathers talking about speaking in other tongues. Why is this? I suggest that it is because the gift has passed away? I don't believe anyone has the gift of tongues today. Tongues, initially was the Book of Acts but somehow, today, it gravitated to being a heavenly language and has been used by many to see themselves as being super spiritual as a result. Do you see tongues in church history?
I QoutedThe New Testament clearly states that the purpose of Prophesy is to Exhort,Comfort and Console the Church and if we do not have Prophesy well the consequences are we cant Exhort,Comfort and Console the body in such a direct way from the throne of God.
If this is the case then it voids out the bible and tells us the bible is not enough for us today. Do you agree with that? Can God not use the bible to direct us, as a body, in a certain way?
You Qouted*******The NT also says that the church was established on the foundation of the Apostles and the prophets. THis doesn't suggest continuing Apostles or prophets. Even Peter said we have a more sure word of prophecy in the scriptures and this was said after being on the mountain with Jesus and hearing the voice of the Father. He pointed back to the scriptures
ON APOSTLES AND PROPHETS IN THE CHURCH.
I do not believe we have Apostles like the 12 Apostles or Paul in the present day Church .However since the bible is cyrstal clear that all the 12 Apostles come from John The Baptist (and not Jesus)who came in the Spirit of Elijah I believe that Apostles will be restored to the Church in the end times by the Spirit of Elijah but this has not happened yet.We may have "sent out ones" in the present day Church but we do not have anyone with Apostolic Authority like the 12 or Paul
"I believe that Apostles will be restored to the Church in the end times by the Spirit of Elijah but this has not happened yet"
Where does this come from?
I suggest that the NAR people have created such a concept. Nowhere in scripture is this taught. In fact Paul calls out a group of 'super apostles' as false apostles. The NAR claims to be a group of super apostles and they have been demomstrated to be false prophets and apostles. They dabble into mysticism and are not grounded in the Word at all.
Prophets is a different story ,the scripture is talking about Old Testament Prophets .The Church is grafted into the tree and we clearly had new testament prophetesses and prophets in the early Church and their is no evidence to suggest this didnt continue.
Can you reveal, in church history, where there are prophets and prophetesses after the cannon of scritpure is closed? A lot of this stuff came back in the 1800s and in that century a lot of cults developed as well.
ON WHETHER FALSE PROPHETS CAN BE CHRISTIAN
The answer is yes because prophesying falsely is a sin or in your words a serious offence and a sin can be covered by the blood of Jesus.So can a serious offence be covered by the blood yes.Will God take action yes.
In the OT a false prophet was to be stoned to death. Would that person be of God if that was the case? Today we don't stone false prophets but it is evident that false prophets are doing 1 0f 2 things. Following their own heart or following a different spirit. This means they are not trusting in Jesus and therefore they cannot be Christian. Remember what Jesus said in Matthew 7?
21 "Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’
ON TRUMP WINNING AND ORTHODOXY
All the people I have listened too personally saying Trump will win also are very Orthodox and love the Lord and are Christians going to heaven.
Are these people speaking prophetically or just from their own personal judgment? I question anyone who maintained that Trump would win given the evidence around him. i.e. Gop people saying there was little evidence of much fraud. GOP governor or Ga and Az for 2 examples. William Barr another example.
ON WHETHER I KNOW A TRUE PROPHETYes my Pastor ,he regularly gives me insight to things I need to know and help me with words from God.
On whether I have heard people on the internet say things that came to pass yes.
Your pastor is not prophesying to you. He may be giving you Godly insight and counsel but he isn't prophesying. He is doing what Proverbs exhorts us to do and that is a good thing. He is a Shepherd.
ONE OTHER POINT
Paul announced or introduced himself as I Paul An Apostle,he didnt say I am Apostle Paul and this is very important.He didnt call himself by his gifting like we do in the modern day Church when we introduce someone as Pastor David or Pastor Carter taking Times square as an example.This is unscriptural and has a very negative effect on the Church.
The bible does say the Spirit gave some to be this and that. Pastors are a gift to the church BUT the issue comes when that pastor is a wolf in sheeps clothing.
I would like to point out a few reasons why conservative Christians supported Pres.Trump.
When Trump was elected in 2016 he promised to "drain the swamp" meaning - clean up corruption that characterizes politicians. Hence, the opposition from the "swamp". Pres.Truman said if any politician gets wealthy while in office, he is corrupt. Many politicians have been enriched by accepting bribes, kickbacks thus perverting common sense.
There has been a move to normalize perversion in popular culture by penalizing Christians who will practice their faith in the marketplace. Christians have been sued, arrested for discrimination because they refused to bake cakes, photograph, etc. for those who celebrate same sex unions. Living out ones faith against perversion - homosexuality - could get you in trouble. We saw rollback in this with Trump's administration but expect it to accelerate with Biden at the helm.
Pres. Trump was pro-life whereas Biden and company are pro-death at any level.
Fifty plus years ago Russian communists declared they will take over the USA in 1973. It did not happen then but they went underground infiltrating the educational systems, legal systems that worked to limit our freedoms, pervert the gospel message in churches by introducing a different gospel - and the church fell for it in the name of love and justice.
This entire philosophical system is demonic. The reason Trump was so hated was because he could not be bought - he did not need their money - he donated his income from the US government to charity. He took only $1.00 a year for legal purposes.
On the issue of racism- this issue was becoming history until Michelle Obama inflamed it which then became the mantra for the Black Lives Matter group. But one never heard them address the abortion issue among blacks who had the highest abortion rates among the people in the USA. And these discontents would provoke incidents.
In recent years we have seen a distortion of reality in the news media. We are at the point where Russians used to say they will read the news paper reports on what is happening but then assume the opposite it true. This is where we are at with popular news media.
Conservative Christians expect persecution from the gov to accelerate to levels we have not seen but will be similar to what is happening in communist countries.
This in my opinion and what I have observed during my sojourn on this planet for 73 years. Some may disagree with me, but I am grieved as I see the rank apostasy that bedevils most churches and how they cooperate with the acceptance and normalizing of sin. Many of us expect God's judgement to fall on this nation but we felt like we were given a reprieve these last four years and now we expect it to accelerate.
Sandra
Hi Deadn
You are selecting what part of the early church you want to keep and what you want to throw away.
ON APOSTLES AND PROPHETS IN THE CHURCH
ACTS
The qualification for being the twelth Apostle is that you had to have come under the ministry of John The Baptist or you could not be part of the 12.The ministry of John The Baptist is the ministry of Elijah.
The Two Witnesses are the Ministry of Elijah in the Final book.They come and restore the same things Elijah restored and John restored which is the twelve stones or twelve apostles.Mount Carmel and Pentecost are the same thing in essence and point directly to the Two Witnesses and how God deals with Jezebel and the AntiChrist.
ON WHETHER I KNOW A TRUE PROPHET
No my pastor is prophesying because thats what he says he is doing .
ONE OTHER POINT
You missed my point calling some one by their gift is a form of wrong authority .
ON TRUMP WINNING AND ORTHODOXY
On Christians who say their is no evidence ,they either went out of their way to avoid seeing it,they chose to believe the false prophet of the Main stream media over other Christians or they secretly have a problem with Trump but wont admit it because its petty .Have you seen the evidence in the Legislatures?The sworn testimony of people who saw the fraud,the stopping of the count,the partial audit in Arizona which said 3% of votes were switched ,the audit of the dominion machines in wisconsin and all the other stuff.
Do you rather listen to CNN ,MSNBC AND OTHERS than your own brothers and sister in Christ.Bill Barr lied ,he lied all year about releasing the John Durham report.He is not a Christian but Kayleigh mcanany is and Mike Pompeo are .I would trust Kayleigh Mcanany a brilliant spokesperson,Lawyer and Christian,a true sister in Christ than CNN ,Bill Barr and Kamala Harris.
ON WHETHER FALSE PROPHETS CAN BE CHRISTIAN
We dont do Stoning for Sinning in the New Testament ,thats outlawed .False Prophesy is wrong but it is a sin and in being a sin it can be covered by the blood.
Peter and Paul are doomed because they prophesied in Jesus name .If the qualification for being doomed is that you prophesy.The Scripture clearly doesnt meant that EVERYONE who Prophesied or Cast Out Demons are going to hell.
Perhaps those who say that Prophesy is not for today are they themselves prophesying falsely?
ON THIS POINT
I QoutedThe New Testament clearly states that the purpose of Prophesy is to Exhort,Comfort and Console the Church and if we do not have Prophesy well the consequences are we cant Exhort,Comfort and Console the body in such a direct way from the throne of God.
If this is the case then it voids out the bible and tells us the bible is not enough for us today. Do you agree with that? Can God not use the bible to direct us, as a body, in a certain way?
Dont blame me blame Paul ,if you think Paul is voiding out the bible thats not my fault its Pauls.Paul should shut his mouth because he doesnt know what hes talking about and Paul should stop voiding out the bible by writing scripture .Of Course I agree God Uses the bible but he also uses Prophesy that is always in line with Gods written word.Without the Holy Spirit breathing on the words of the bible it just becomes a dusty old book with no inspiration.How possibly could Paul saying that Prophesy is needed for exhortation,consolation and ediification negate the bible.How could edification from the Holy Spirit through prophesy unedify the Church?
urs staff
Hi Deadn
I am convinced we are in the last days and scripture says that men and women will prophesy .The last days can not mean any other thing other than the days from early church until the very end .For instance the last days cant mean 1st century and not every other century after the first days .It doesnt say they will prophesy for some of the last days and then you are on your own,it doesnt say that God wants to communicate for some of the last days but the nearer we get to the very last day he will have nothing to communicate .
In the last days, God says,
I will pour out my Spirit on all people.
Your sons and daughters will prophesy,
your young men will see visions,
your old men will dream dreams.
18
Even on my servants, both men and women,
I will pour out my Spirit in those days,
and they will prophesy.
urs staff
Nonsense"Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God." Roms 13:1 ESV
Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you.
Romans 13:1 talks about Christians subjecting to government's not government subjecting to the Bible! Totally irrelevant!
In the great commission, Jesus commanded his disciples to reach all nations (or races) but baptize only believers there. A nation itself cannot be baptized. Childish to even think of such an explanation! Gospel should be preached in all nations but no nation can be run by Gospel message! It is not the purpose of the Gospel.
There is no Christain nation period. All these elderly American Christians (usually of a particular race) should come out of their dream that America is a Christain nation. NO, it is not and it will never be. No nation on this earth can be governed using the Bible. Sermon on the mount is not for the government to follow but individual believers. Mixing state and Church is the birth of Babylon explained in revelation. The church cannot and should not be involved in any politics whatsoever.
A Christian can have political views nothing wrong about it. But a Church should have nothing in association with politics. Can we imagine Jesus calling Herod to preach in his Church? Herod was at his time a much-appreciated leader. He built synagogues and was well praised as a God-given leader for Israel. But he ended up beheading John the Baptist and played his role in crucifying Jesus.
Any Church involving in politics or predicting and preaching on the political result is a Babylon, doomed to be destroyed. Run out of its midst if you still have ears to hear.
Hi Sree,
On the one hand we have An Atheistic ,Abortion Supporting,Israel hating Candidate and on the other hand we have a President who proved through his actions To be Pro life ,Israel supporting and supportive of Christians and you are saying that latter category should not be supported because h shows signs of Arrogance.
You have also said anyone who supported the President is under delusion.Can you not see the complete contradiction?
This statement might as well come from CNN ,its actually racist and ageist.It also goes against one of the Principals of the old testament which is respect for older people because of their wisdom.
your qoute
"There is no Christain nation period. All these elderly American Christians (usually of a particular race) should come out of their dream that America is a Christain nation."
God clearly has put Nations in place as a boundary to the spread of Sin which is explained in the tower of babel story.So its clearly not that the nation is Christian but clearly that the nation is in fact a nation thats important.
Nobody thinks that the US is a Christian nation but that the country was formed and its laws were formed to encourage freedom of worship.
Your qoute
The church cannot and should not be involved in any politics whatsoever.
Without the Church we would have 9 surpreme court judges that would support Abortion.Now because of Christian support with people who voted for Donald Trump and are part of his team we have 5 judges who are PRO LIFE .If Christians werent involved with politics this would not happen.So would you rather see Christians not involved with politics and Abortion in the country or Christians involved in politics and No Abortion Sree??
Yours staff
Hi Deadn
I am convinced we are in the last days and scripture says that men and women will prophesy .The last days can not mean any other thing other than the days from early church until the very end .For instance the last days cant mean 1st century and not every other century after the first days .It doesnt say they will prophesy for some of the last days and then you are on your own,it doesnt say that God wants to communicate for some of the last days but the nearer we get to the very last day he will have nothing to communicate .In the last days, God says,
I will pour out my Spirit on all people.
Your sons and daughters will prophesy,
your young men will see visions,
your old men will dream dreams.
18
Even on my servants, both men and women,
I will pour out my Spirit in those days,
and they will prophesy.
urs staff
Peter said this was fulfilled in the Upper Room. What confuses me with this is 'all people' part of it. This isn't just something that is happening in the last 50 years. A lot of people seem to want to suggest that but in this day so many people are claiming visions and dreams and prophesy but none of it lines up with what we see written in the Word. Meaning they are either false in meaning or ambiguous and those people who seem to want some attention will tell you about theirs. Elijah list is filled with this nonsense.
On the one hand we have An Atheistic ,Abortion Supporting,Israel hating Candidate and on the other hand we have a President who proved through his actions To be Pro life ,Israel supporting and supportive of Christians and you are saying that latter category should not be supported because h shows signs of Arrogance.
You have also said anyone who supported the President is under delusion.Can you not see the complete contradiction?
Staff, you clearly do not understand my posts or you are confused with different points of view in this forum. Let me clarify my stand here.
I believe a Christian can have a political view. If we both sit together then we both will agree politically more than disagree. This shows who I support. I do not want to be public about my political views in a Christain forum. I said here that I rejoiced in the 2016 election results and desired the same in 2020. Discussing or debating on political views is not appropriate here. I have no problem even if we differ in our political views. That is perfectly fine. So you can prove nothing by justifying your political stand which is also similar to mine!
Nobody thinks that the US is a Christian nation but that the country was formed and its laws were formed to encourage freedom of worship.
One of the main reasons I live in the USA is for the freedom of worship that I see here. This is my only reason to rejoice with the 2016 election results and sad about 2020 results!
Freedom of worship should be for all, including Hindus and Muslims. There is no Freedom of worship in a country run by Hindu laws, the same as one run by Sharia laws. Similarly, there cannot be one run by the Bible. While I want Hindu and Islamic majority nations to not enforce their religious laws on people, how can I support the USA enforcing Christian laws on its people? I cannot do it with the right conscience.
The reason you do not find any problem in running a country by the Bible is that you have not witnessed how a country turns out when it is run by a religious book. I have witnessed it. You and I may agree that the Bible and Christian principles are different from Hindu and Sharia law. But for a common man, it is all the same.
Also, Christianity is not given for a nation to follow. It is for us individuals to follow and thereby influence a nation. Not the other way round like how Sharia law is forced on its people by the nation. This is where you and I are differing.
I do not expect the USA to be run by any Christain principle. I will come to sensitive subjects like abortion later. I want the USA to be run based on humanitarian principles and support freedom of religion by separating government from all religious groups including Churches.
Without the Church we would have 9 surpreme court judges that would support Abortion.Now because of Christian support with people who voted for Donald Trump and are part of his team we have 5 judges who are PRO LIFE .If Christians werent involved with politics this would not happen.So would you rather see Christians not involved with politics and Abortion in the country or Christians involved in politics and No Abortion Sree??
This is where you and I differ. Please read it multiple times. We both agree that abortion is evil. But how do we handle this problem? You believe the Church should back the politicians who fight against this evil. I beg to differ here.
We fight against any social evil either it is abortion or LGBTQ by not going in the way of politics, but by influencing individual people. The way I live as a light in my neighborhood should influence people to not abort their babies. The way I love my children and provide for them should challenge the unbelievers around me to change. The way the Church preaches a higher standard should change the community from the way of sin to the way of righteousness.
I came to the USA as a practicing Hindu. I am now a disciple of Jesus. I credit Christianity in the USA for my conversion. But it is not the Christianity forced on me by the USA but the Christianity that I saw in the church I accidentally stumbled upon. It is the life of a few Christians whom God made me meet that changed me. As a Hindu, I was a supporter of abortion and LGBTQ, but now I am not. The change did not happen because I was forced by the political stand of the USA, but because of my conversion by the Gospel, I heard in the USA.
I believe we greatly limit God when a CHurch backs a political leader and believes that he is the only hope to fight such social evils (abortion, LGBTQ, etc). God does not need a politician to do it. He is powerful enough to bring the Change if we live like the light that he desires us to be. If you and I are shining the light of the Lord in our community then we can change this nation.
Any Church or its leader who takes a political stand and predicts the winner openly in a Church is building Babylon. He is not building the Church of Jesus. He has not faith in God and does not even know God.
Calling such degraded political predictions as Prophesy is a height of stupidity. It is degrading the gift of prophecy. Prophesy is a way higher standard than a political prediction. It is to build the CHurch by convicting the people. My motives were convicted when I attended a Church as an unbeliever by prophetic words, not by political predictions (1 Cor 14:23). Such degraded predictions cannot save souls but will only take the listeners to hell. I have no doubt about it.
It is because the Churches in the USA have failed to be the light that they needed to support a political leader to influence the nation. This is not God's purpose at all. He wants you and me to do it without any influence of politics.
"Question to all:
Who here on SI doesn’t hear from the Lord directly (personally) ?"
The above was/is a rhetorical question....
"And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.”
In truth none of us "knows” what is about to transpire,... yet we each believe a particular thing based on the faith we were given and moreover what we did (how we invested) with that "talent” -
Having said this, my personal belief is that the whole world will be astonished by what will quickly transpire and it’s not gonna be for everyone,... the truth never was received by all, nonetheless everyone is subject to Him.
Brothers and sisters is this not exciting? Do you not feel the spirit within you at peace and yet stirred?
Glory to God for He is faithful 🙌ðŸ»
To be more precise, I James Fletcher Whaley believe that what is currently and subsequently occurring will produce a harvest like has not been seen in ages (millennia) and we all would do well to prepare ourselves to be in position to share the gospel of the Kingdom of God, extending the hand of fellowship and inviting those, whom will have had the paradigm by which they view reality shattered and irreparably scattered to the winds, into the Kingdom . For they will be disparaged and without hope yet we possess hope and (I believe) will be given opportunity to give answer for why we have such a hope ðŸ™ðŸ» in doing so, our faith will become a lamp unto the feet and a light unto the path of those that seek Him 😇
It’s gonna be BIBLICAL 💯
Hi Sree,
Everytime you want to shy away from answering my posts you say "i am confused or dont understand your posts".I am not at all confused about your posts but you have no biblical logic in my opinion regarding Prophesy.You want to limit God and put him in a prophetic box.God you can talk to the Church about a and b but not c.
Come on Sree you will never get rid of Abortion by influencing non Christians and influencing people is what politics is all about.You know that.God is clear that he will judge Nations and one of the jugdements on the US will be over Abortion.Influencing non Christians will may stop the odd abortion here and their but it will never ever get rid of it at State level.
Why bother changing a nation when you say a nation cant be Christian.
You want to CENSOR God on what he can say about the future.He is God nobody can stop him telling people about the future.Censorship of God is totally unscriptural.
Why was important in Daniel for God to layout exactly what Kingdoms arise and fall to the very end right through the New Testament until the end times.
Anyone Christian in my opinion who voted for Joe Biden a man who supports Abortion ,is Anti Israel and for Open Borders(A thing God hates) and the Gay agenda did so out of ignorance ,delusion or bitterness .They find themselves like David standing shoulder to shoulder with the Philistines ready to fight against God's people,urs staff
Hi JFW,
We are in a postion where only a move of God will change things 180 degrees and this move will be biblical .Look at the Christians after Pentecost .They werent enthuased because of persecution but because of a move of his Spirit.
Christians will be moved because they will see the Justice of God in a mighty way.
Your Qoute
Having said this, my personal belief is that the whole world will be astonished by what will quickly transpire and it’s not gonna be for everyone,...
urs staff
I am not at all confused about your posts but you have no biblical logic in my opinion regarding Prophesy.You want to limit God and put him in a prophetic box.God you can talk to the Church about a and b but not c.
Again you are wrong. I have never ever said that God cannot predict the future. I am not the one putting God inbox.
1 Cor 14:3 - 3But he who prophesies speaks to men for their edification, encouragement, and comfort.
New covenant Prophesy is not predicting the future, it is to encourage, edify, and comfort the Church. There is no way anyone will be edified by predicting the next political winner! Let us go deeper about what Paul says on prophesy.
1 Cor 14: 23 -Therefore if the whole church gathers together and all the people speak in tongues, and outsiders or unbelievers enter, will they not say that you are insane? 24 But if all prophesy, and an unbeliever or an outsider enters, he is convicted by all, he is called to account by all; 25 the secrets of his heart are disclosed; and so he will fall on his face and worship God, declaring that God is certainly among you.
If the pastor is predicting the next president in the Church in the name of Prophesy, now if an unbeliever comes, will the secrets of his hearts be disclosed? Will he fall on his face and say that God is in the midst? Can you answer this question honestly before God?
Absolutely not. No one in the right mental frame of mind can believe that such predictions qualify the prophesy mentioned in 1 Cor 14:25. Again one can twist the verse to comfort oneself but I have no need to defend scripture here.
Please read the below passage at least 10 times so that you can understand what I am trying to say.
A prophecy that discloses the secrets of the heart (1 Cor 14:25) is a way higher standard than a political prediction. To the person who has never tasted such a higher standard of prophecy in the Church, this political prediction can be a great thing. But not to me. I am not naive or spiritually foolish to believe that this is a new covenant prophesy that the apostles spoke about.
I am not saying God cannot predict the future, but I am saying God has given a higher prophecy in New Covenant which surpasses the lower Old Covenant standard. Anyone who tasted this cannot fall for such degraded and perverted prediction by unregenerated pastors!
If God has promised us a higher standard of prophecy, why will he give a lower degraded one? Suppose my father has promised me to gift a private jet, he will not give me a bicycle instead. He sure can buy a bicycle but he will first give me what he has promised. God has promised a greater gift of new covenant prophesy, let's not degrade it by listening to such deceived pastors and Christian leaders who have no clue on New Covenant.
Again for a person who has never seen an airplane, it is very difficult to believe that people can fly. In the same way, for a person who has never tasted a real new covenant, it is impossible to convince that there is a higher real new covenant prophesy. I am not blaming you for being deceived. It is just pure blindness! That is why you struggle to even come closer to the standard I am trying to show here.
Come on Sree you will never get rid of Abortion by influencing non Christians and influencing people is what politics is all about.You know that.God is clear that he will judge Nations and one of the jugdements on the US will be over Abortion.Influencing non Christians will may stop the odd abortion here and their but it will never ever get rid of it at State level.
Why bother changing a nation when you say a nation cant be Christian.
This is your unbelief. It is you who is censoring God and putting him inbox. The root of all sin and sinful stand is unbelief. Peter stood on the day of Pentecost and could change the hearts of over 2000 people if few apostles can do it why not a country like the USA with so many so-called Churches and Christians do it? Just plainly accept that these are nominal Christians who have no clue about the new covenant! Worthless Churches that need political support to stay than the power of God! Shame on American Christianity if this is what you believe it is!
Heathens called the early Christians "These who have turned the world upside down have come here too." (Acts 17:6). If few spirit-filled Christians could turn the world upside down, then why not a Christian majority nation can? Why do we need an arrogant political leader to spread fake Christian agendas in USA.
You want to CENSOR God on what he can say about the future.He is God nobody can stop him telling people about the future
Again a strawman argument, I never said that; there is no place I said God cannot predict the future. It is things like this that clearly proves that you have not read my posts here nor cared to understand. Please understand alternate perspectives before posting yours. This is the reason I kept ignoring your posts. If you do not change such behaviors then there is no point in having a discussion.
Hi Sree
WHICH IS TRUE ?
"I have never ever said that God cannot predict the future"
OR
"New covenant Prophesy is not predicting the future,"
GOD Predicts nothing because God is outside of time .He knows whats going to happen thats different.
ON ABORTION
Sree you need to up your game because you are not doing a a very good job stopping Abortion.How many babies need to die before your influencing is going to work?how many more years?
Again any Christian who voted for Joe Biden who supported abortion and is anti Israel over Donald Trump who is Pro life and Pro Israel are either deluded,ignorant or bitter.
Prophesy is not airplanes,bikes or cars ,it comes from the heart of God and is all of a the same high standard.
If anyone on this SI wants persecution so much please take a plane over to North Korea and let us know how you get on and dont want to live in a democratic country which has Christians like Kayleigh Mcanany in positions of power.
urs staff
Does ""New covenant Prophesy is not predicting the future," sound to you that "God cannot predit the future"? There is a vast difference between the 2 and I have explained the difference in my previous post. I cannot keep posting the same thing if you are not concerned about reading.
Sree you need to up your game because you are not doing a a very good job stopping Abortion.
It is not just my job to stop abortion. It is the job of every so-called Christian to be a light. Jesus said, "you are light of the world" (Matt 5:14). If every Christian including you can fulfill this standard then we can drive all the darkness away. Darkness is deep inside the heart of man, abortion is just one way it is getting expressed.
Sadly based on your post you have no faith in Jesus to be a light that can drive the darkness. I believe in an all-potent God. My Jesus is different from yours!
If a person believes in an impotent God who cannot make him a light then let him put his trust in any politician and a worthless Church that predicts which politician will win.
Hi Sree,
If you dont want to answer the post thats your choice.
Jesus can be a light to political leaders too and political leaders including presidents can become Christians while in office.
In my opinion you have but wont admit it an unhealthy opposition to President Trump who has been the very best President for the US and US Christians for a very long time.
My faith is not in the imperfect person President Trump but in the God that put him in place.
As all Christians do I also long for the Justice of God.
This election was a complete fraud and a total injustice.Where the evidence was laid out in front of the Legislatures who chose the electors it was truthful and honest and compelling,Anyone who didnt take the time to look at the evidence laid out will have to rely on CNN,ABC etc .These people are false prophets urs staff
be quick to hear and slow to speak , you all speak to much ,
Hi Brothagary,
Thank you for that very uplifting and edifying word that means and edifys and uplifts nothing!Could you explain what you mean or dont bother if you dont want ,urs staff
what it means , it means nothing to you ...
First a quick word about the original question:
"who of you , on the forum, will continue to uphold those people who prophesied that Trump will have reelection and not call them false prophets?"
This doesn't even apply to me, I didn't listen to them in the first place.
"...it shows why the church, in America, is in the state that it is in." . Not quite.
The main problem are the false Gospels. The Apostle Paul warned already about them! Now they are everywhere, we are not concerned, we don't even seem to realise it anymore.
Here is something I wrote 4 years ago after Trump got elected:
"The Ekklesia is His (Jesus')Bride and He wants it spotless.
So we might have to go through fire in order to be refined before the Lord can return. Therefore the future might not bring what we might hope and expect. "
Maranatha ! Come Lord Jesus come !
Markus
After reading through this thread, I would like to point out what the Word of God has to say about certain thoughts shared in this thread...
First,
In the book of Job we find that God selects all leaders. He instructs them and if they hear, He blesses them. If they reject Him He replaces them.
Secondly,
In the book of Daniel, God describes the devolution of earthly governments. One man rule is superior, but in the process of time, the government of iron and clay rises in the end which is inferior to all other forms of earthly government.
Third,
God has an eternal plan which He works out over the span of history. We are given many examples of men He raised up in certain times and places to accomplish His work. This is found though out the Scriptures.
Fourth,
Jesus taught us that we are to look at the fruit and season in which we have been place by God to live. We are to observe and then discern the times.
What I have observed, knowing God chose Trump to lead this nation in this time and place, I believe I can see a growing division between those who are of darkness and those who are of the light. And those who have hidden in the darkness hate that their deeds are being brought out into the light. I also see President Trump's role in these times as a work determined of God to show us that if our hope is in man it will lead us to desperation and confusion. So what does the very middle of Scriptures tell us?
Psalm 118
8: It is better to trust in the Lord than to put confidence in man.
9: It is better to trust in the Lord than to put confidence in princes.
And finally we as Christians should strive against evil..
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