WHAT HAS BECOME OF AUSTRALIA?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jiHoDiH5CQ

They were overtaken by a communist regime... plain and simple 🤷🏽”â™‚️
Much like what is happening in Europe (GB, France, Greece, etc..) and in America and all over the world-
Australia was heavily influenced by Chinese monies and substantial immigration from CCP which softened/delayed their response to being infiltrated, not recognizing the true nature (demonic) of the threat because they were being lied to about and at the same time distracted from the reality they were entering in to. This can only happen when we forsake the light of Christ for the "light” of the world, for (((ALL))) that is in the world is the lust of the eyes, the lust of the flesh, and the pride of life-

I have stated before and will continue to state,...
This is a worldwide takeover (powergrab) by a demonic principality under the guise of a medical emergency, which itself was created for this purpose and to this end. Not only has this been clearly stated by those whom are ideologically aligned in graphic detail since at least 2011, tho had been planned many decades before.

I understand that many of my brethren will scoff and write me or my words off as a conspiracy theory or the rantings of a derelict but... I will not deny what my eyes see nor will I be silent about it.
The "Church” has shown itself to be so weak, so blind, so hard of hearing and hard of heart that by and large has "taken a knee” before the altar of the idols of science, wealth, pleasure, and power.
Again this is the greatest breakdown of the "church” in the past 1000 yrs and it’s happening on our watch!!!
I would be remiss if I failed to, or stopped short of, stating clearly to the "church” ... R E P E N T!!! and do the works meet with repentance... else you will likewise perish 🔥

Borrowing partly from a medical conference yesterday,... "If you view this as a medical emergency you will react as a victim,... of you view this as a war you will respond as a warrior”.

Fear and Faith both require you to believe what you can’t see... choose wisely 🙏🏻

You wrote;
" What's happening in Australia and all around the world is according to God's sovereign will”

In your view, God is causing or in control of and effectively directing these events ?? (including but not limited to the brutality of child trafficking, child porn, industrialized abortion, perpetual lies and misinformation, etc..)

Not trying to put words in your mouth, rather hoping to better understand your position and the limits thereof if any-

What is happening in Australia and throughout the world is very concerning.While I agree with many things the Bishop said, I believe he is missing the point.

Here is my conclusion, most might disagree: it is about the wrath of God !The wrath of God is a theme that runs through the entire Old and New Testaments.
God was angry with Sodom and Gomorra because of gross immorality.
Most importantly for us:
In the wilderness, God was angry with His rebellious people. Moses told them: "Remember! Do not forget how you provoked the Lord your God to wrath in the wilderness. From the day that you departed from the land of Egypt until you came to this place, you have been rebellious against the Lord. Also in Horeb you provoked the Lord to wrath, so that the Lord was angry enough with you to have destroyed you” (Deuteronomy 9:7, 8). Through the centuries God was angry with His people because they rejected His word and worshiped idols.

"These things happened to them as examples and were written down as warnings for us, on whom the culmination of the ages has come..." (1 Cor 10:11) But we ignored the warnings.

There are times when "God abandoned them to do whatever shameful things their hearts desired..."(Romans 1:24)
Or He can be directly involved, He caused it to rain (Gen 7:4)

Here is Daniel's Prayer for His People again:
Daniel 9v4 And I prayed to the LORD my God and confessed, "O, Lord, the great and awesome God, who keeps His covenant of loving devotion to those who love Him and keep His commandments, 5we have sinned and done wrong. We have acted wickedly and rebelled. We have turned away from Your commandments and ordinances. 6We have not listened to Your servants the prophets, who spoke in Your name to our kings, leaders, and fathers, and to all the people of the land.…

Proverbs 9:10 "The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom, and knowledge of the Holy One is understanding..."

Blessings
Markus

//But to no avail as a hearer on this site use the remark to describe the God of election and predestination as "monstrous"//

I’m the guy who called it monstrous and will continue to do so.

Why not just answer Fletcher’s question which has nothing to do with predestination or election?

It was/is a simple question in hopes to understand what you were saying ...
🤷🏽”â™‚️

Please don't get off-topic !
Can you try and discuss this privately ?

The situation in Australia and around the world is serious.
That's where our focus should be.

Indeed🙏🏻

Here’s what happens next according to the historic pattern of persecution-

1. Stereotyped
2. Vilified
3. Marginalized
4. Criminalized
5. Open Persecution

It’s not for me to tell you where we are in these 5 phases or for you to assume based on observations and experiences alone, ... ask the Lord yourself. Commune with Him bringing these things to Him to be resolved in you first and then in others.
We would regret missing opportunities the Lord laid before because we were distracted with matters of the world.

Regardless of our doctrine, we are one in Christ 🙏🏻
Now is not the time to bicker and divide over personal matters, this is happening on our watch and I believe that our God can and will use us to address the root (spiritual) ... IF we will tend to His business and not be consumed with the worlds business.

Leonard Ravenhill once said; " if we don’t start concentrating in prayer, we’ll be praying in concentration camps”

He could see it coming decades ago because he had the light to see, like Elijah prayed for Elisha to see and the Lord opened his eyes and all his fears vanished... save that of the Lord -

I’ll be totally honest and say, it’s already much worse than we think and what happened in Australia is just the progression of what is happening everywhere those seeds (tares) were planted. Now they’re coming to harvest and we get to grow along side them till the separation on the threshing floor.

It wouldn’t hurt to re-listen to David Wilkersons prophesy from early in his ministry where he points out that the persecution coming to the modern church is not from without but within... and those being persecuted would not be given the dignity of suffering as Christians, but would be stereotyped as bigots, homophobic, racists, intolerant, etc. and not as followers of Christ.

Today that could easily translate into any number of vilify-able groups, our culture embraces this very practice even in the church...

But like brother Wilkerson, I believe that the Lord will move in His people 🙏🏻

Just to highlight how bad it is here in Australia. I spent four hours in jail yesterday and now have a criminal record because I refused to wear a mask and I was on my way to a march to demonstrate against what is happening here. No joke!

May God continue to give brother SteveHale and others in Australia the boldness and courage to stand up for the truth in the face of such opposition! May God raise up voices of truth all over the earth to proclaim TRUTH which is the only thing that can set men free. I thank God for such groups as Frontline Doctors here in the USA and other such doctors and scientists who are proclaiming the truth about the biggest hoax that has ever been played out on a global scale to enslave the entire planet. If we sit back and let it happen we are complicit in the evil. THANK GOD for the bishop in the video and the many others who are proclaiming the truth. Last year I had C19 and pneumonia at the same time. Doctors were doing what they could, but God is the healer. I am alive because many people petitioned God for my healing. This effort to divert the trust of people away from God and make us dependent on an ever changing group of elite "scientists" and doctors who ignore all other research but their own is ever showing itself for what it is: LIES LIES LIES!!! The story keeps changing because the unchanging Creator is ignored.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vi545JuW2WU

Discouraging to hear this dear brother but not all together surprising-
Will continue to pray for Australia that the message of repentance is preached to the wayward and intercessory work be done by the faithful 🙏🏻

Aussie’s are strong, gritty, resilient people but apart from the Lord they are powerless before the controllers of the global supply chain as are we all 🤷🏽”â™‚️

A warning preached in 2008
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7UyZYpeReY

THIS IS SO SAD! They are having it out in court in Australia right now to decide if people can leave the house for a purpose that is permitted and then engage in activity (political discussion) that is not permitted.

WHAT HORRIBLE TYRANNY!!!!

https://vimeo.com/event/1162227

He is basically complaining about his church and church building. He is asking and pretty much demanding that the government let him do what he wants so things can go back to normal. This is where many are still asleep on. "NORMAL" is not something God or the Bible promises us. The fact that we have COVID around should be something to wake us up, but instead we waste time complaining. For all those that are sad and complaining about your church buildings, read this:

Matthew 24 Jesus left the temple and was walking away when his disciples came up to him to call his attention to its buildings. 2 "Do you see all these things?” he asked. "Truly I tell you, not one stone here will be left on another; every one will be thrown down.”

The brothers and sisters in the bible met at home, outside, on the hills, and also at the temple. But today you demand to meet in the temple. Imagine Jesus demanding that. Imagine Jesus saying he cannot do ministry without his Temple building! WOW.

Normal is not something that is here or will come so move on. SADLY this brother missed that in his bible.

This is whats coming next:
2 Timothy 3 1
But mark this: There will be terrible times in the last days.

Excellent JRG.

Do you imagine Paul would have given up on one of the churches he planted?
Not necessarily the building, (assuming they owned it) but not also excluding it from the body of believers that meet there.
Likewise could you imagine the government storming in on the Jerusalem council where Paul was being called to confirm his gospel, demanding that the place be shut down due to a medical crisis and the apostles just folded their hands and walked away?? James and Peter??

When reading the book of Acts, I find divinely inspired boldness like has never been in a man and with that a certain resistance tempered by discernment founded in fellowship with God, salted with prayer and served in the spirit by the grace of the living God.
And in no way whatsoever do I find passivity on the part of those commissioned, not once after Pentecost. Their fear had been extinguished by the fire from above and they with faces set like flint, went about doing the Lords will even when that meant "breaking the law” for which they were repeatedly persecuted and ultimately martyred .

So while what you say is factual in that at the birth of the church, their means were modest and in general lacked a cohesive network until the epistles were completed, the forming of which is the establishment of said network, That after this network (body) was formed, we, the current members, would do all to preserve. For many in the modern world, this is the only means of having a hope of being discipled... as such these places themselves do in fact represent the freedom to gather which is explicitly described as being compulsory to defend for membership of said body as we are commanded to obey all laws save those that prevent gathering to worship- full stop 🤷🏽”â™‚️

So when the same government delay the enactment of an unlawful edict so that the secular world can gather over 350,000 for a festival in Chicago but brothers and sisters are being ridiculed and even denied the freedom to gather en masse then their logistical ammo has run out as that is an unjustifiable unequal treatment under the law. Which if left unchecked will result in being sequestered in our homes not even being able to gather in homes or public spaces just like Australia where the preacher you mock is living under duress along with millions of other brothers and sisters -
My bible tells me to identify (empathize spiritually) with them so much so to be able to effectively pray, interceding and offering supplications in the spirit on their behalf and those of their captors. Because our weapons are not carnal but mighty for the pulling down of strongholds and ANY knowledge that exalts itself against Christ Jesus. This is not a judgment of you, nor your position, that’s you... for me, if I spend my time mocking those my God enlisted me to cover in prayer and protect, whilst passively defending the obvious application of the law against the church, I would tremble dear brother and I mean that with all humility and earnestness🙏🏻

Excellent Fletcher.

See, I can be fair. 😎

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SEENy8TJgNs

Senator Malcolm Roberts

Isaiah 10:1-4

Doom to you who legislate evil,
who make laws that make victims””
Laws that make misery for the poor,
that rob my destitute people of dignity,
Exploiting defenseless widows,
taking advantage of homeless children.
What will you have to say on Judgment Day,
when Doomsday arrives out of the blue?
Who will you get to help you?
What good will your money do you?
A sorry sight you’ll be then, huddled with the prisoners,
or just some corpses stacked in the street.
Even after all this, God is still angry,
his fist still raised, ready to hit them again.

It’s getting harder to get reports coming out of Australia that aren’t official lies put forth as fact, but the few I’ve read and watched seem that the situation has grown more intense and oppressive- with people in and around Sydney being locked down and even videos of police helicopters circling like buzzards instructing people to return inside their homes, even read reports that now fines up to $5000 are being levied against those found to be in violation... can you give an update as to wether these reports have any merit?

In any case, their are many of us that are with you in prayer and supplication 🙏🏻

It seems that South Africa has fallen into a bleak situation after Zuma’s arrest and now in the absence of those like Keith Daniels (a restrainer) the forces of humanism are organizing to usher in a "godless solution” whereby SA will come under control of a form of communism in hopes of escaping/preventing further destruction. These manufactured crises are being implemented to destabilize and displace people in order to offer relief in the form equity (communism) 🤷🏽”â™‚️
Remember our brothers and sisters there as well as they face unimaginably harsh conditions. 🙏🏻

G'day brother Fletcher,
Everything you have heard is true and more. The police now have the authority to shut down businesses if the owners of the business are not adhering to the health mandates. A business owner not far from where I live was arrested and taken by the police out of her shop for not wearing a mask in her own business. In saying that most businesses have been made to shut. Only those deemed essential are allowed to open. Those helicopters are out night and day but not where I live as I am on the outskirts of Sydney. You are right about the fines as well. I personally have been fined $1500 and spent four hours in jail for standing on a railway platform without a mask. I am going to court on the 24th of this month for the matter. I refuse to pay the fine and will do time in jail instead.

I could keep going on and on about what is happening here but the big question is why. Australia is a Godless nation and becoming more so everyday. In a nut shell we have said to God we do not need you. God has seemingly taken His hands off us to show us how we go without Him. The church here in general is ineffectual, impotent, feeble, powerless and lame. Even the ones that were preaching the truth before corona have now shown they do not believe what they preached. Are now hiding away in there houses. There are a few exceptions, but very few.

Habakkuk 3:2

Lord, I have heard of your fame;
I stand in awe of your deeds, Lord.
Repeat them in our day,
in our time make them known;
in wrath remember mercy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ozdu06E0WLE

It’s somewhat surreal, with few people (here) really not knowing what’s happening in Australia as mostly people are at the mercy of the media to inform them and tho it’s mentioned the story is not covered ... as such most people here just think that y’all are experiencing an "outbreak” with a few radicals being arrested. As such most people simply lack the information to grasp the magnitude of what’s actually taking place, especially with their attention presently focused on Afghanistan. With so much going on it seems people lack the ability to take it all in... 🤷🏽”â™‚️
But for those that do, we stand with you 😇

Will continue to pray🙏🏻

Well what is happening in Australia is something of a disaster. On one hand we have a health issue that is a threat to everyone (covid-19), on the other hand we have politicians that are not working entirely for the people and thirdly we have people equally being rebellious against public health orders. Put the three together and you end up with a disaster.

First point - we have outbreaks coming across the country with no real plan to deal with it other than lockdowns. What the governments are doing are pushing a suppression/eradication approach trying to get it to an unattainable zero cases per day. Unfortunately the lockdowns are crippling so many people given cost of living in Australia is ridiculously high and people can't work. This is leading to isolation and is destroying the well-being of many.
Yesterday, Melbourne turned over 200 days combined (2020-2021) with the harshest restrictions anywhere in the country. New South Wales has only just started adopting the same level of restrictions because their outbreak has blown out of control, worse than what Victoria suffered last year. Vic had a peak of 700+ infections a day last year for a short time and New South Wales has just hit 800+ daily. Sadly these take a long time to drop.
These restrictions are that you must stay within 5km of home unless you are going to get groceries, basic exercise and you must wear a mask inside and outside. 1 person a day can caregiver but if you get pulled over by the police you must be able to prove it.

For a nation of our size I do actually believe the health leaders when they say our health system will struggle if it gets under too much strain. I believe this is a real health threat but the fear being spread isn't helping anyone.

I feel for New South Wales because based on the current strategy because they will be in lockdown for months still. I know from experience.

Second point - our state premiers appear by many to be over zealous and at competition with each other. One state went into lockdown over 5 new infections. As soon as one state has major outbreaks the state becomes a social pariah and the media and premiers really push that sentiment. The premiers fight like little children taking pot shots at each other over what they think the other should be doing. There is no unity in our government over here. On top of this when it comes to helping secure vaccinations to help protect people from the danger of the virus; they keep pushing the vaccination agenda while the governments are short handed on them and that has caused more political fighting. Other politicians avoid questions about who is accountable for some of the mistakes made and speak to the people on press conferences daily (about an hour long) with little respect.

Third point is the people. Some of Australian culture has this attitude of "nobody will tell me what to do". Many carry on about their rights to be taken off them. They don't understand God has allowed us the non-Christian leadership we have asked him for. Many are ignoring health advice because they don't want to be told or have had enough. Health authorities have given the guidelines to try and combat infection spread but sadly many deliberately break those rules. Sadly as a result law enforcement has (over) reacted harshly in response.

It really is an unwinnable situation. I work as a social worker and the emotional damage this is doing in our communities is massive. The longer this drags on the worse these issues compound. Especially given it would seem we have no long term plan.

Something occurred to me a while back and I’ve been watching out for it, to see if it was indeed the case-
I noticed that the people who sit in my chair (barber) had seemed to have been "segregated” from one another... not physically so much as through information, which appears to have led different people to completely different conclusions about the same event/events, meaning they were unable to communicate about a thing because they hold fundamentally incompatible/conflicting perspectives, not because of anything they themselves experienced necessarily but because they were told two different stories about a thing. For example in Alabama the vaccine roll out would serve as an example of various people groups receiving competing narratives based on their demographics ultimately leads to different decisions regarding its use. This has served to polarize the population here, effectively segregating them. Wether thru mainstream or alternative or even social media outlets or some combination of them all, I have and am witnessing this occurring. Every "group” has their "go to” sources to which they are dependent on to receive updates, effectively creating "echo chambers” where the members are so saturated with the same narrative being reinforced that they are literally unaware of the other perspectives except for when their group says something about another group, which is generally vilifying causing further divisions. This weakens our communities and even families in some cases, which leads to an almost cult-like adherence to the ideals of the group even though the adherents don't necessarily agree on every issue.

I pose all this to ask if you had noticed, or witnessed or remember anything like this being done in Australia?... even before the totalitarian measures emerged?

having seen this today,... it seems it’s not a conspiracy theory anymore 🤷🏽”â™‚️

https://rumble.com/vlle3a-powerful-australia-is-leading-the-way-into-global-tyranny.-resist-covid1984.html

G'day Fletcher

I see it more of a spiritual thing rather than a " what sources of media you are watching. Weather thru mainstream or alternative."

I have a bit to do with a few churches around my way, and know christians far and wide.Through all that is happening I have only been surprised once. A brother close to eighty years old that has gotten vaxxed and seems to believe all of the propaganda. Other than him all the strong believers I know are somehow awake to what is happening. I believe they that have the mind of Christ and are being led by the Holy Spirit are aware of what is going on.

It's a bit like in the near future when the son of perdition is revealed, the same people will be awake. It does not really matter what sources of media they are watching.

Blessings Steve

What propaganda are you refering to?

Open your eyes brother! I shouldn't have to explain!

Don't be so rude.
There is many things discussed in this thread. I was wondering to which part you referred to.

Brother, I was not being rude. It is a warning to open your eyes!

In Love
Steve

Respectfully, i feel you were. I asked you a question which was a reasonable to clarify what you were refering to but instead you told me to open up my eyes.

How is that not rude?

Well that’s actually very encouraging to hear!
If most of the brothers and sisters in Christ there are aware, then that will surely translate into fervent effectual prayer 🙏🏻

Also it’s good to hear that the different media narratives weren’t as effective inside the church there as they are here... where there is somewhat of an addiction to it,... wether inside the church or not and it’s very polarizing.

Now with unlawful actions (vaccine mandates) being outsourced by our current administration to the private sector ( a fav of fascist) just like in Italy back in Mussolini’s day, we will be put to the test here in America and we shall soon see if we are indeed the United States or something else.

Will continue to give thanks and lift you all up in prayer,
If there are a something specific that you would like us to pray for, please don’t hesitate to say ?

Edit to add;
I’ve seen where NSW is a place known for having the strongest Christians in all of Australia, as such you have the strongest men of faith, the strongest communities, the strongest families, a place where the church is very healthy and that’s why they were trying to break you all first so as to demoralize the rest of the nation, hastening their compliance... while I’ve never been there, I have heard this from people who live there and noticed that was the location in your profile 😇

Through all that is happening I have only been surprised once. A brother close to eighty years old that has gotten vaxxed and seems to believe all of the propaganda. Other than him all the strong believers I know are somehow awake to what is happening. I believe they that have the mind of Christ and are being led by the Holy Spirit are aware of what is going on.

Respectfully, are you saying that all who do not see as you see (re: this covid-19 situation here in NSW) are weak Christians, do not have the mind of Christ and are not led by the Holy Spirit? Seems to me like you are redefining the foundations of our faith and the work of the Holy Spirit.

G'day Jade,

Do you think any of the apostles would take the vaccinations? Do you think Jesus would take the vaccinations?

If so would they take them because the government had told them to? Or because they were scared to die?

Blessings Steve

Grace and peace to you dear brother and to all who are holding steadfast to our anchor.

...by two immutable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us:
19 Which hope we have as an anchor of the soul, both sure and stedfast, and which entereth into that within the veil;
20 Whither the forerunner is for us entered, even Jesus, made an high priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec

You wrote; "It's a bit like in the near future when the son of perdition is revealed, the same people will be awake. It does not really matter what sources of media they are watching."

Yes agreed 100%
- yet there is still a hope that some will turn ✝️
Hoping to at least make people aware of the severity and the urgency of the matter, and encouraging them to pray.

//If so would they take them because the government had told them to? Or because they were scared to die?//

If you got bit by a rabid animal would you take the rabies vaccine?

If you were told you had a ticking time bomb clog in a coronary artery would you get a stent?

Your argument is nonsense. Jesus healed folks but he couldn’t get to everybody. I suspect if Jesus cut himself with a saw in the wood shop he may have put some ointment on it. He praised the Good Samaritan for doctoring the mugging victim.

Sadly Steve you've chosen to ignore my question still. One I asked which isn't a stupid one. It doesn't mean I'm blind and I need to 'open my eyes' or wake up. In wisdom, to clarify is wise to make sure you are of the same understanding with the course of the conversation.

Going back through your posts though I'm sensing a belief about other believers that concerns me, that anyone who has a different view than yourself to be weak. Please think about that. You've made a couple of accusations that I can see, or at least that's how it reads. You've criticised an old man for taking the vaccine and commented once strong preachers for 'hiding at home'.

I really dislike the fact our churches are closed as well, and in comparison I find it even more disappointing that in Victoria that even brothels are given priority to reopen over other community services which shows the wickedness of our state. Over time as the virus is less of a threat people will be able to resume meeting. Online services can help but often seem 2 dimensional as it lacks fellowship and unfortunately I'm seeing many drop off from my church and that does concern me. But just because pastors aren't out breaking the stay at home orders doesn't make them weak as there is the mandate to protect vulnerable people in the case of a potentially dangerous transmittable virus. Just because other Christians are concerned about the well-being of others and spreading a virus doesn't make them un-trusting of God.

I also sense you believe anyone who takes a preventative vaccine is a fool and believing the lies of the world. If you wish to forego getting the vaccinations then that is your choice but you have no right to judge someone else's trust in God for deciding to take it. Their actions are between them and God and God allows us to use medical science to help make us well or protect ourselves. Taking the vaccine doesn't mean you don't trust God.

What is happening though is our government is scared, doesn't know what to do and are panicking (because they don't trust God) while trying to maintain their own agendas and it isn't working. It's happened again and again through history.

You don't need to warn me to open up my eyes, I am well aware that there is some wicked stuff happening and I'm well aware of a few different narratives being pushed by our politicians and media. You only have to read my prior post.

We are of the same faith. We serve the same Lord and are saved from our sins equally. We're on the same team, so if I've misunderstood you please forgive me and discuss it through with me. It just feels to me that you're on the attack.

Thanks

C’mon,... you know that’s not a comparable situation, ointment to an experimental vaccine???

Besides that it misses the point,.. which is you’re either in favor of forced- coercion or you’re not 🤷🏽”â™‚️
In every analogy you cited, you included the option of choice... that is the point dear brother! The citizens of Australia have (including our brothers and sisters in Christ) have lost that option,... even for their children ???

We all know the risks with a virus, but no one knows the long term effects of this treatment (and please don’t attempt to buttress w/fda approval as tho that somehow makes coercion ok) and as such it is criminal to compel, threaten, vilify, marginalize, even criminalize non-compliance. Full Stop

Please consider this point-
It would be openly a sin for a Christian to coerce anyone into anything, no?
We can preach, plead, pray, etc... but we cannot coerce -
If being coerced, then for them to comply is to take part in another mans sin if it is a violation of their faith. So this effectively criminalizes the practice of their faith.... this is persecution 💯 and we will be judged by God if we remain silent like the Germans-Europeans in late 30’s 🤷🏽”â™‚️

Honestly brother Todd, irregardless of an opinion on the shot... do you think those whom are pushing this are gonna stop? And if people refuse compliance, what do you imagine those in control will do with the population of people who don’t comply?
They can’t very well allow them freedom of movement,... have you considered this and are do you find concordance with the inevitable "incarceration” of the Christians and others whom are finding this is their current fate?

Edit to add;
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=gwDnIjYCxdc

Brother Todd, would you support this man being denied the right to refuse and be subsequently coerced?
Because that’s where this is going and already is in many countries around the world -

I’m not talking about mandatory vaccines. I see a vaccine as medical treatment just like the other treatments I mentioned. There is zero spiritual component to it, other than praying about it. If there is no check from the Lord a person is allowed to use their own wisdom and common sense which in Christians is informed by the Spirit. I have no idea why some Christians like myself and many I know have no issue with the vaccine while others do. I suspect politics and misinformation play into both sides, although personally I am conservative politically. A person who does not avail himself of available medical treatment has the right to refuse but does so at his peril. I am reminded of the story of the man trapped on the roof of his home in floodwaters, and refuses the aid of boats and helicopters because he is waiting on God to save him.

Yes agreed but that isn’t the issue at hand as this thread is about what is happening to Australia... not sure why you’re (seemingly) avoiding that ?

Hi Steve,

There is God's righteousness and there is self-righteousness.

Do we become righteous before God by refusing to wear a mask and refusing to take the covid-19 vaccine?

Blessings

Respectfully, are you the voice of ***** all ***** the people in Australia?

G'day Jade,

So you do believe Jesus and the apostles would wear a mask and take the covid-19 vaccine?

I think we already had endless of those debates, I don't think they will resolve anything.
Jade: how do you see the situation in your country. I mean more in general terms.I'm just interested in your view not in debating it.

Blessings, Markus

Well I know this thread is not really about vaccinations but I work in healthcare and just found out today that all healthcare workers in NY are now mandated to get the vaccination by October 7th. There is a shortage of workers where I work and I'm hearing the mandate may cause some to quit and cause a further shortage. I'm probably going to quit my job/career as well.

I'm against this particular vaccination because of many of the surrounding events but not against vaccinations in general (although I prefer not to take any).

Are some of the people who are against vaccinations in this thread also against taking medications and vaccinations in general? This is the feeling I'm getting reading through some of the posts.

Steve wrote:
"G'day Jade,

So you do believe Jesus and the apostles would wear a mask and take the covid-19 vaccine?"

Irrelevant. Covid-19 didn't exist then so it's impossible to tell precisely. Your argument is akin the argument "could God make something so heavy he couldn't lift it?"

God gives us doctors and I've consulted with mine and I trust his judgement on all this and he explained how the vaccine works and was made.

Platy, I generally prefer not to take them when possible but I'm not anti either. In Australia there is a push for health care workers to get it which to me seems smart.

You mentioned you disagree because of events. What are you referring to?

The surrounding events which include everything that has happened in 2020 until now. Which are basically the recent elections (how covid-19 became political), the massive amount of media lies, big tech manipulation/lies, the so called "fact" checkers which are obviously biased, etc.

Now all these are pushing for the vaccination. They are offering people money and cheeseburgers to take the vaccination. You think they care about people's health so much?

The most obvious thing is that this is a major money maker so it may be that these pharmaceutical companies may be cutting these corrupt politicians some deals to get people vaccinated. Do I know this for a fact? No. Do I have common sense? I would like to think so.

Then you have communism/socialism/BLM, feminists, LGBT, and a whole assortment of other misguided groups. All these groups are very pro vaccination and pro "science".

There clearly is something not spiritually right here. Yes I know the vaccine is not a spiritual thing. Its just a neutral thing like a band aid. But something is seriously amiss here.

I would recommend a book to read. New Evangelicalism (I think that is the title) written by Paul Smith (Chuck Smith's brother). The book was written probably around a ten years ago and its actually about the emergent church. But since it is an "end times" book he does have some interesting quotes in a chapter by the Rockefellers and other elites about a push for a one world government (which I'm sure most of here have read).

Here is another "surrounding event". The attack on nationalism. The liberal media doesn't like nationalists like Trump, Boris, and Modi. If you are nationalist then that means you are a racist, or a bigot, or small minded, or ignorant/uneducated. Nationalism stands in the way of globalism (one world order).

The covid-19 virus and the vaccination are now tied into all these things. When people are talking about control and manipulation they are probably thinking about the things that I've mentioned above.

Here is another thing that came to mind. Here in NY small businesses were being locked down and many went out of business. Amazon and many other corporations got much richer during this pandemic. Its basically a transfer of wealth from the common people to "elites"/rich people.

Small restaurants went out of business but many of the corporate restaurants made profits during the pandemic.

I noticed this and came to this conclusion on my own before I read it anywhere.

This is just one effect of the lockdown. Transfer of wealth which is basically a transfer of power.

Edit: Adding the following:

Jeff Bezos (Amazon CEO) made tens of billions of dollars during the lockdown. Did you know he owns the Washington Post? Did you know the Washington Post supports the lockdown and is anti Trump?

This is a conflict of interest when it comes to all these mandates.

Hey was about to go to sleep but I was just looking through the book I had recommended to look through those quotes.

The title is: New Evangelicalism: The New World Order.

I'm going to type out one of the quotes which some may find interesting.

This is from chapter 11 New Evangelicals in the New World Order.

"1962 - Council on Foreign Relations member, Nelson Rockefeller, gave a lecture at Harvard University saying that there is "a new and free order struggling to be born...There is a fever of nationalism...but the nation-state is becoming less and less competent to perform its international political tasks...These are some of the reasons pressing us to lead vigorously toward the true building of a new world order...with voluntary service...Sooner perhaps than we may realize...there will evolve the bases for a federal structure of the free world."

Ok time to go back to sleep.

You wrote;” Respectfully, are you the voice of ***** all ***** the people in Australia?"

No ma’am, not my intention....
however I do have eyes to see and ears to hear and a mouth to speak when my faith is criminalized anywhere in the world and the reason I’m taking it so personally is because it’s the establishment of the state doing it in a world leading nation that, from its inception has protected and even fought to ensure those rights that are now being stripped bare, which will inevitably lead to the faithful being persecuted 💯

Again, no offense intended towards you unless of course you support these measures and if so,... WOE UNTO YOU WHO CALL EVIL GOOD, REPENT while there is still light in your eyes ✝️

Hi Markus,

I prefer not to give a personal view as I do not know everything and do not have all the answers and therefore my view may be incorrect.

Let us turn our eyes to Jesus and see Him only.

Christ, His power, and the power of His life in us --- this is the only truth/reality, the only real rest and peace for us.

Blessings

Hi Steve,

There was no covid-19 then.

But in Rom. 14, there was a huge disagreement about eating unclean food.

Paul accepted both groups.

Rom. 14:16-17 ”“
Therefore do not let what is for you a good thing be spoken of as evil; for the kingdom of God is not eating and drinking, but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit.

v. 13 ”“
Therefore let us not judge one another anymore, but rather determine this”” not to put an obstacle or a stumbling block in a brother’s way.

Comment:
-----------
The kingdom of God (sovereign rule of God) is not about taking or not taking the covid-19 vaccine but is righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit.

Just saw a headline that Australia’s daily cases topped 1,000.

Florida just topped 26,000.

Not to go against what you are saying TMK. It may be rising indeed but from past observations I'm a bit skeptical until further research.

I remember there was a period when cases were rising in various places (states/countries) and the media would do their hysterical reporting. But when I looked into it I saw that the amount of people getting tested were rising on a parallel level. The more people you test the more positives you get. That was dishonest reporting.

Unfortunately it looks like there is no recent data for Florida testing rates from looking at google's stats.

Interesting how they like to pick on Florida and Texas also. California's rates have been pretty high recently too.

The real stat we should be looking is the hospitalizations and even better than that is death rate but who knows how accurate these are.

I'm looking at NY's stats on google's site. They removed the testing rates graphs. That is interesting because it was there before.

Not sure what you are talking about Platy. My mom and dad live on FL. It’s really bad there right now with hospitalizations and deaths.

Obviously the more people get tested the more positives there will be. The percentages don’t change. 10% positive for 10 people tested is 1. For 1000 it’s 200.

The point I was making was the media was reporting increase in cases at one point but they left out that there was a increase in people getting tested. That was dishonest reporting. They obviously are biased to report higher numbers.

I'm not arguing there isn't a problem just be careful with these "reporters".

Isn’t obvious more people are getting tested with Delta? I personally know far more people who have been tested than all last year, and know way more folks personally who have it. I knew one personally last year.

Demographics are different. 1029 is a lot for New South Wales. Remember in contrast Florida has the same populace as roughly all of Australia.

"Demographics are different. 1029 is a lot for New South Wales. Remember in contrast Florida has the same populace as roughly all of Australia."

This is a good point. I was pointing this out to someone last year when covid began on the way google was presenting their stats. They had the U.S. as ranked #1 and that was based off of the total amount of cases but they never had a column for showing the stat for how many cases per 1,000,000 or 100. U.S. was not #1 it was probably in the top 10 but not #1 when it came to being the worst hit for covid. This was also dishonest. Personally I think it was a political move to make Trump look bad. It was that kind of stuff that leads people like me to take everything I hear with a grain of salt.

Correction to the last post. Google did have the amount of cases per 1,000,000. The problem was they were ranking the countries by the amount of total cases which resulted in the U.S. being #1 on their chart. That was the deception.

"Isn’t obvious more people are getting tested with Delta?"

That is the point I'm making. If more people are getting tested then the cause of the increase of numbers is that more people are getting tested. The number we need to be looking at is the death rate followed by hospitalizations.

I see what you are saying. From what I can tell a lot of the concern, at least here, with case numbers is:
- the longer we'll be in lockdown and the longer people will be driven into debt and poverty
- people are too impatient and want to live life as normal
- that while lots of people will recover, vulnerable people they care about might die
- the media and government are pushing the idea that if you get infected and pass it on to someone else, whether it's a stranger or family member, that their death is your fault.

In FL, there were 389 confirmed deaths from Aug. 20-26.

However, new cases have plateaued as they have in other southern states so Delta has peaked or has nearly peaked as was predicted.

The positive test rate dropped from 23% to 17% in FL in a week.

461,000 were vaccinated in FL last week. Everyone is seeing friends and family getting sick and sometimes very sick. We have a good friend who was just admitted with Covid pneumonia here in NC. Unvaccinated. She is embarrassed and regretful about that.

You wrote; " Everyone is seeing friends and family getting sick and sometimes very sick. We have a good friend who was just admitted with Covid pneumonia here in NC. Unvaccinated. She is embarrassed and regretful about that.”

Are you suggesting that the "vaccine” would have prevented this?

Yes! Maybe not illness but the vast majority of serious illness and death.

Not attempting to argue the point, however you may have been sorely misled by the information you’re consuming....
Two months ago Israel had the highest vaccination rate of any industrialized nation (over 80%) and for weeks now the US has a level 4 travel advisory due to the spike and subsequent hospitalizations (severe cases) of the population with rate of vaccinated hospitalized persons over 60% with some reports being over 70% 🤷🏽”â™‚️ So that’s not really a success rate one would be obliged to tout which is to say in any other circumstance would be considered wholesale failure -

Those numbers are not true. Here in NC the unvaccinated are 15 times more likely to die from Covid.

Nationwide the percentage of vaccinated persons who require hospitalization is around 1%.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/08/10/us/covid-breakthrough-infections-vaccines.html

The link requires me to buy a subscription to read ...

In any case here’s a report from back in June, where the numbers were being accurately reported and are obviously higher now (travel advisories)

https://www.visiontimes.com/2021/06/30/covid-19-israel-full-vaccinated.html

This was the point I made earlier in this thread, we are segregated by our chosen sources of information - your sources say one thing, mine say another 🤷🏽”â™‚️

At the end of the day, we will be known by how we love one another, it’s not loving to force or coerce someone into violating their conscience much less their faith, so to idly stand by while this is happening on a worldwide scale is sin, no way to avoid it- No matter a believers stance on a particular medical treatment, to have it forced or to have one coerced by removing the opportunity/ability to have access to employment, education, housing, food, credit, etc... is in every conceivable way, unloving and as such a sin.

Is that something we can at least agree on, (having scripture as our common source) ?

I can agree with that.

The very sad thing is that folks are dying who are asking for vaccines on the death beds gasping for breath. But I do agree that vaccines should not be forced.

Hi All
I was looking at video earlier on CDC numbers
0.9 percent of the dead had no comorbididities such as obesity
and a 2.3 i think had 1 comorbidities
but if you had 2 to 5 it jumped up around 30 percent
and higher the more you had.
If the governments had pushed fitness it would have saved lives
Also the top 3 medical issues with those who died were in this order Obesity ,Anxiety disorders and diabeties .
It was surprizing that Anxiety disorders was more dangerouus than diabeties.

Also every 5 yrs older you get the chance of death doubled and it was a 60 -40 men to women ratio
urs staff

Interesting staff.

It would seem the government would be better served by mandating exercise and proper diet instead of vaccines.

The anxiety one is a little strange. I’ll need to look further into that.

There is less money to be made for pharmaceutical companies by promoting diet and exercise.

I've come across a number of people who lowered their cholesterol just by using diet (steel cut oats, fiber rich fruits/veggies, etc.). I even had a family member (age 60+) who had cholesterol slightly above 200. Using a healthy diet alone it was lowered to mid 100's in about six weeks. I remember reading a study that if you keep your cholesterol below a certain number you will probably never have a heart attack. But some doctors will prescribe medications immediately.

Anxiety as a risk factor probably is related to stress which compromises the immune system.

Edit adding the link to the cholesterol article:
https://nutritionfacts.org/video/optimal-cholesterol-level/

Btw I recommend that site to everyone. Stay off the meds. ;)

Hi TMK,
here is a link of the video i watched

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cccSHUckGSQ

urs staff