Is Gay Marriage a Step in the Right Direction?

Here is an audio sermon (55 minutes) related to the gay marriage issue. I have been forming some thoughts in response - it sure grabs my attention. I think he's right on, but before I say more, I'd like to ask you: Do you think this preacher, Bruxy Cavey, is echoing the heart of Christ? DianeIs Gay Marriage a step in the right direction?

You bet it’s a step in the right direction! It’s the fast track path for the arrival of the antichrist. Gay marriage like every thing else is here to expedite our Lord’s return. O Lord Jesus come even now! What bitter sweet days await us? Bitter indeed for all those who called the light darkness. Come Lord Jesus even now!www.paula4jc.com

It’s the fast track path for the arrival of the antichrist. Gay marriage like every thing else is here to expedite our Lord’s return.Sorry, You lost me. In what way does gay marriage "expediate" Christ's return/ or the "antichrist"/ or is it both? Do you think that gays are going to be the ones to whom Christ will reveal his mercy, forgiveness, and love? In the Bible it was often the sinners instead of the religious self-righteous who experienced Christ. Is that what you are referring to?Do you think that this preacher reflects the heart of Christ, and honestly helps us deal, not only with the issue, but also the PEOPLE? PS A stray thought just flashed through my mind: I wonder, are you responding to the message, or to your view of homosexuals? Diane

I do not have the authority to say whether or not this man is "echoing the heart of Christ" for to do so would be near judging him. Who am I to judge?I will say that I agree with him.Blake

Who am I to judge?Paul said, "Judge for yourself what I say." 1 Cor 10:15. These words are often spoken by Pastor Bruxy to his congregation. I understand from Scripture that it is our duty to judge carefully - ie to discern, use wise judgment. We gain good judgment when we walk closely with Christ and grow in our understanding of his ways, his mind, his will etc. This issue regarding homosexuals is mega within the Christian church, and I post it because I think it sheds some insight that we desperately need to consider. Diane

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To my understanding:Homosexuality is wrong according to the bible and to God's law.How come we are debating it? I do not see how it is in the right direction at all. I see it as ongoing sexual perversion

From reading some of the comments, I'd say that the title can be misleading. This is not a debate, but a carefully thought out sermon helping us to understand the issues around gay marriage. Since this issue is a major hot bed these days, I believe that we need to take time to learn about it, or we might do a lot of damage to the testimony of Christ. (which has been happening) This sermon is truely amazing - it gives carefully thought-out rebuttals to those who approve of gay marriage. It also compares homosexuality to other sinful lifestyles.I was very impressed with his answer to those who say that they are born with it. He brings forth another issue to consider. Diane

Paul said, "Judge for yourself what I say." 1 Cor 10:15. These words are often spoken by Pastor Bruxy to his congregation. I understand from Scripture that it is our duty to judge carefully - ie to discern, use wise judgment.This is a fascinating little body-swerve! The full quotation is...“I speak as to wise men; judge ye what I say.”(1Cor. 10:15, KJVS)The letter was written to the saints at Corinth who he describes earlier...“Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God.” (1Cor. 6:9-11, NKJV) The saints at Corinth 'used to be' people characterised by these sinful behaviours, but are clearly no longer so characterised. So it is written to, among others, ex-homosexuals etc.Secondly his word was to 'the wise' (phronimos) the thoughtful ones. He invites such to distance themselves from sins which destroyed Israel... immorality (1 Cor 10:8) , idolatry(1 Cor 10:14). His counsel to the thoughtful to 'judge what he says' is not a call to independent assessment of clear commands from God. It is part of Paul's manner of engaging the minds of those to whom he writes. He does not expect any 'thoughtful' ones among the saints at Corinth to arrive at a different judgement to his own on these matters. It is a way of saying 'you know what I am saying is right, if you think about it'.To set this verse up as a permission for everyone to come to their own independent conclusions on moral issues is a travesty of Bible exegesis. But I think those who use it as such are not the 'thoughtful' ones that Paul addressed his words to, but simply those who think they have found a good 'sound-bite'. In tearing this half verse from its context they are doing exactly what Peter refers to...“and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation—as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.” (2Pet. 3:15-16, NKJV)

I don't know what audience he was talking to. I just know that to isolate a single half verse 'judge for yourselves' is not good exegesis. When you say his audience is that same that Paul addressed do you mean people who 'used to be' what they are now no longer?

Hello...!Am I the only one who feels uncomfortable with the title of this thread?I understand the underlying message discussed in this thread, but I just wonder what the first impression visitors to this website might have when they read it."Gay marriage" and "right direction" seem like conflicting ideas in the larger picture of righteousness. Besides, I don't think that we should rejoice in sin (including legal sin) -- regardless if some think that it can speed the Lord's return. The Church should never quit taking a stand against sin -- even if it is unpopular or seems to be political in nature. :-)

I just know that to isolate a single half verse 'judge for yourselves' is not good exegesis. There is a context within Scripture and there is a context within a conversation. I was responding to a brother whom I sensed was reluctant to judge the preacher, I'm not sure why. If we refrain from an opportunity to develop good judgment, and don't even listen, think, study a topic, then we are in danger of making judgments ANYWAY - WITHOUT EVEN LISTENING TO THE MESSAGE!!! Only then we make bad judgments. In my understanding, practising judgment is not limited to the more spiritual people. Everyone must take this responsibility to develop discernment - to THINK. That is how we grow. To say, "don't make a judgment because you aren't mature enough" is dangerous. That's why people follow after cultish leaders - they let the "mature" ones decide for them. I think that the heading of this thread is misleading, so I will start a new one with a different heading. The original one works in Bruxy's church setting, as you will understand if you check out this unique church: The Meeting House(This page is a list of other sermons - and will help you get the drift.) I think Bruxy would fit in well with Sermonindex (my judgment)Philologos, I know that you have a very deep understanding of Scripture. So, I challenge you to consider Bruxy's sermon in the light of Scripture. Perhaps I'll see you again on my new and revised version of the thread. Diane

dorcas wrote:A very accoumplished presentation, which demonstrated a superb lack of ignorance of what is going on with the homosexual christian who are serious about pleasing GodThere is no such thing as a homosexual christian, nor are homosexuals serious about pleasing God but rather pleasing themselves (the flesh). They are being decieved into what they consider pleasing God.

ccchhhrrriiisss wrote:Am I the only one who feels uncomfortable with the title of this thread?Nope and I agree with you.

Quote:by ccchhhrrriiisss on 2005/8/30 14:50:54 Am I the only one who feels uncomfortable with the title of this thread?No your not...Intimate activity between, Men. Intimate activity between, women.Is too Gross, to even think about particularly that there is much perversion in the activities. It is sentiment; Christians shed sentiment when they become Born Again though the Holy Spirit of God. I will never come along side these activities and the ridiculous notion. That there is such a thing, as a formal marriage for them or there intimate acts, under Gods Heaven. It is all an abomination to God.The obvious seems to be missed; we were not created to do these despicable acts.We all know what the intimate act, was intended for.The people, who find themselves in that life, must be prayed for. So that they might, turn to him for release into the righteousness of God. Prayer is what we should all be doing; God requires this of us all. So that they might, have the breakthrough into the freedom of God. For their Salvation to, have their wonderful walk with God. Which is, free to those who will turn to Him. If we come alongside and encourage this behaviour we then deny them Christ and freedom. Who are we to deny them this? When they come through, they will see the hypocrisy.May you God, remove the curse that they put themselves under. That you would have Mercy upon them, that by Your Grace they would come to know you. Holy Spirit that you would deliver them, from the darkness. That Jesus you would so shine your light upon them, that they would see your wondrous Glory and Holiness and find their redemption in you. Amen. Hallelujah, Praise is to the Lord who died for all, to set all free to come through him before the Throne of God The Father. Amen.ellie

Ellie, I started this thread and later realized that the heading was very misleading. My apologies. I was inviting readers to listen to a sermon by that title (as you saw at the beginning of this thread). This is NOT an invitation to debate the issue, as that is non-negotiable. There have already been plenty of posts, along with many scripture, that express the evil of homosexuality and the coming judgment. The sermon addresses the issue of homosexuality covering many details and hopefully helps us know how to talk to them and help them leave their lives of sin. Just today in a Bible Study a single mom said that her teenage son (is gay) was looking for a church. Being a sensitive person, he first approached the minister and, “Is it okay if I come to your church? Even though I’m a homosexual? Each time he was told “No”. Now, this lonely messed up lad, who had no father, needed to see role modeled some well-adjusted and loving heterosexual people. Where would he be able to go to find this? Who will help?Maybe you have some helpful thoughts or experiences that you would like to share. Lahry started a thread where you can share any insights you may have. Maybe I'll see you there:Homosexuality and the Kingdom of GodDiane

Edited 3rd September '05Quote:roadsign wrote:This is NOT an invitation to debate the issue, as that is non-negotiable. There have already been plenty of posts, along with many scripture, that express the evil of homosexuality and the coming judgment.This is an open forum. My response in my thread, is as valid as any other and is being included as any other. If I wanted to put another thread on here about this subject, then I can do so.On the thread I have written, plain, simple, fact, truth.The boy, to care for him is to pray for him. Pray he will have a walk with God, having been released from his circumstance.Many people are released from things, thereby gaining access to God. Which he is entitled to doalso.He has the same right as all human beings to come as all human beings, into a life with God under Gods rules. Gods rules apply to all human kind thus making us all equal, in Faith to God.Quote:roadsign wrote:Maybe you have some helpful thoughts or experiences that you would like to share.Being Hetrosexual I would not have, experience of and the shareing of such of these matters. I believe that to be a nasty, snide, remark.roadsign WroteQuote:Maybe you have some helpful thoughts or experiences that you would like to share. Lahry started a thread where you can share any insights you may have. Maybe I'll see you there:I speak on threads I choose, not being given given permission by you or being told by you what I may choose.ellie