Authentic Fellowship

I know that this is not the first time or the last time that this topic will appear here at SI. Why? Because it is an essential precept of what a disciple of Christ will do. Fellowship is promised to those who abide in Christ.1John 1:1 That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, concerning the Word of life— 2 the life was manifested, and we have seen, and bear witness, and declare to you that eternal life which was with the Father and was manifested to us— 3 that which we have seen and heard we declare to you, that you also may have fellowship with us; and truly our fellowship is with the Father and with His Son Jesus Christ. 4 And these things we write to you that your joy may be full. 1John 1:5 This is the message which we have heard from Him and declare to you, that God is light and in Him is no darkness at all. 6 If we say that we have fellowship with Him, and walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth. 7 But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin. Many have discussed at length should we home church, should we mega church, should we not church, and the list goes on, and on, and on. Many speak of being hurt, frustrated, misled, or disillusioned. I myself have struggled in this area of my life for the past two years. Last Sunday it snowed up where we attend church in the mountains, so we decided to attend a church that we almost joined last year. We decided not to join because we live 45 miles away. The church is about 4 years old now and many of the congregation is of college age. Many attend the Master's College whose president is John McAurther (SP)?, a well know preacher out here in California. The other half of the church is of all age groups and background. The church has doubled this past year from around 200 now to 400. The Senior Pastor is in his 30s. I have met with this man and he truly has a heart for the Lord and His people. Last Sunday, we heard Pastor Brian identify that his church is not living, is not seeking to discover authentic biblical fellowship with one another. He normally teaches word by word thru the Scriptures and has spent the last few months teaching up to Genesis 17. Yet, he felt that he could no longer allow "church" to go on as it has. So he has spoken for the last two Sundays about what he sees happening in his own church. Listen to his first of two sermons thus far. He too wants to discover the power behind authentic fellowship which John speaks of in 1 John.http://copperhillchurch.org/sermons/Misc./christian%20community%20part%202.mp3In ChristJeff

I highlighted the 2nd of the two sermons in the first post. This sermon is the first of maybe a 4 part series concerning a church that is presently not seeing the fruits of authentic fellowship.Have you experienced, or have you been convicted by the same problems that this pastor reveals to his congregation?http://copperhillchurch.org/sermons/Misc./fellowship1.mp3In ChristJeff

Love is a symptom of authentic faithRookie, Your post along with Pastor Brian’s message was an answer to prayer. I had just today asked the Lord for more insight into this very topic. Can you believe it, my Bible was already open to John 15 – as if prepared for the message. Pastor Brian expresses his concern about the lack of love in the lives of "Christians", and he gave some hair-raising examples of the sad reality. Then he EXPLAINS love by using several scripture references. If I read 1 John correctly, I’d have to say that the issue is not merely to teach people what love means, but also to challenge people to examine their own standing with God. It seems that before there can be fellowship with one another, fellowship must be restored with God. In fact, perhaps that is the real problem. When people are properly restored to God, then love will automatically flow. Am I correct? Should people not be told that this lack of love is likely an indication that they do not have eternal life? From 1 John2:4 The man who says, "I know him," but does not do what he commands is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 23And this is his command: to believe in the name of his Son, Jesus Christ, and to love one another as he commanded us. 14We know that we have passed from death to life, because we love our brothers.24Those who obey his commands live in him, and he in them. 3: 9No one who is born of God will continue to sin, Anyone who does not do what is right is not a child of God; nor is anyone who does not love his brother.

These are very sobering messages. I believe Pastor Brian is about to see revival break out in this congregation.. LOL Greg

roadsign wrote:"It seems that before there can be fellowship with one another, fellowship must be restored with God. In fact, perhaps that is the real problem. When people are properly restored to God, then love will automatically flow. Am I correct? Should people not be told that this lack of love is likely an indication that they do not have eternal life?" So true. Love cannot flow when there is a block in the pipeline called sin. when we are filled with the love of Jesus we will love. Today many call us hateful when we denounce sin. But in reality, the most cruel thing one can do is be silent in the face of sin and allow that person to proceed without any warning. That is not loving at all. Jesus did not live this way and neither did the discilples. Yes, we need to be holy because He is holy without which no man will see the LORD!ginnyrose

Sister Diane wrote:I had just today asked the Lord for more insight into this very topic. Can you believe it, my Bible was already open to John 15 – as if prepared for the message. I have experienced this before on SI. That is, God is working to birth a thought or an understanding. I too, as I read a plea from Brother Mike and the concern for the nature of the fellowship that is occuring here at SI. There is a hinderance to authentic fellowship. It is no coincedence that my family attended this church last week. This topic is true for SI and also for my family's church. Is it not wonderful when God reveals His desires to His people. I have had my Bible opened in like manner at various times as you have witnessed to us today. This is the work of the Holy Spirit sealing us, assuring us that He is at work in our lives. This is truly the substance of life that brings joy of fellowship. It is this joy that brings strength to the fellowship of believers.God BlessIn loveJeff

Sisters wrote: Should people not be told that this lack of love is likely an indication that they do not have eternal life?" So true. Love cannot flow when there is a block in the pipeline called sin.This is so true, this is the core precept of everything that concerns salvation worked out by God in men and women. One must first love God, from that comes the ability or the enabling of one to love another as Christ has loved His church. But how, how are "people properly restored to God?" By what means are we born of God? By what means do we receive the inheritance, the authentic fellowship and its fruits? Pastor Brian has also come to a point where he knows that sin exists in his congregation. We all have witnessed this same stumbling block. We know and profess that everything good must come from God. Nothing good comes from the carnal mind, it is an enemy to God. Yet, we as a people here at SI and in our local congregations and home churches, a spiritual people fall far short of the joy that is spoken of by John in 1 John chapter one. In ChristJeff

Hope this continues to be developed here. Thanks Jeff, and everyone, hope to get a chance to listen to these messages as well.But how, how are "people properly restored to God?" By what means are we born of God? By what means do we receive the inheritance, the authentic fellowship and its fruits?

Another Brother came up to me on Tuesday and told me that he attended the Calvary Chapel Missions Conference two weeks ago. He told me of a movie that starts this Friday in theathers, "End of the Spear." He also shared with me his conversations that he had with various missionaries.He spoke of a number of times where the missionaries pointed him to the book of Jeremiah 1:Jer. 1:7 But the LORD said to me:\t“Do not say, ‘I am a youth,’\tFor you shall go to all to whom I send you,\tAnd whatever I command you, you shall speak. 8 \tDo not be afraid of their faces,\tFor I am with you to deliver you,” says the LORD. For him this was the Lord speaking to him about his fear of the people he might someday be called to minister to in Southeast Asia.I say all of this to share this next verse. When Brother Hua pointed to the above verse, my eyes settled on a verse just after this. Jer. 1:9 Then the LORD put forth His hand and touched my mouth, and the LORD said to me:\t“Behold, I have put My words in your mouth. 10 \tSee, I have this day set you over the nations and over the kingdoms,\tTo root out and to pull down,\tTo destroy and to throw down,\tTo build and to plant.” What became significant to me was this notion. God defined Jeremiah's calling in these words. "To root out and to pull down, To build and to plant."I had never thought about this Scripture until now. Now I see based on many of the thoughts that I share here at SI, that most of my time is spent rooting out and pulling down. The thread, "these days are evil" is all about rooting out and pulling down. I also must with all sincerity say, that there is alot of human trash in the thread. Yet, I as a rookie am learning. Something is being birthed in me by God according to the work that He has prepared. But how does this thought coincide with Authentic Fellowship? Again, I do not see very far ahead, but this I know. That much of what causes false fellowship is a result of not understanding how Satan's work permeates the lives of many believers in the church. The first work of God is to root out and pull down, then it will be time "To build and to plant."Think about what Pastor Brian says about how the world sees those who profess to be Christian. What fruit do they see? In ChristJeff

To root out and to pull down,We humans have a great fear of upheavel because it upsets our sense of security (as false as it may be) And so we go around fixing all the fixes that God is trying to break. there is alot of human trash in the thread. Yet, I as a rookie am learning. Something is being birthed in me by God according to the work that He has prepared.In general, we are afraid of "human trash", but I think that we need to get over that. God does not fall over, and we too should learn to accept this as part of the messy process. How can we learn that we are sinnners if we are always trying to squelch the evidence of it. That's like putting a bandaid on a sore because we don't want to face the cancer. When nice manners, - "let's all be nice" is more important than reality, we are moving AWAY from the possiblity of redemption. The verse: "Love covers over a multitude of sins" is not an invitation to denial, but an acceptance of our fallenness. Maybe we have to learn to fellowship together in the "garbage dump" rather than be obsessed about sterility. Diane

Sis wrote:Maybe we have to learn to fellowship together in the "garbage dump" rather than be obsessed about sterility. As one listens to Pastor Brian define through scripture, the different precepts of authentic Christian fellowship, one is convicted of the truth that you have stated above. It is the unwillingness to discover God's ways of learning to love, as He has given us in Scripture, this unwillingness results in sin of unbelief. The Scriptures speak of a treasure that is found in God that exceeds all that man might ever imagine. I see all around me, how the world gives their lives for the treasure that is seen. Yet, the Scriptures promise a treasure that is much more. Yet we are unwilling to allow God to root out and to pull down our gods, or thoughts, our beliefs that prevent us from grasping the promises that are of Him. He has declared the precepts of authentic fellowship, first with Him, and then with one another. Yet we shy away from bringing into the light, the "garbage dump" that is in us. We continually white wash the outside. God's precepts of authentic fellowship amongst the believers is designed to free us from the bondage of self. In ChristJeff

I just want to state that I am convicted by the Scriptures that Pastor Brian has taught on thus far. I am falling way short of the grace that is promised in authentic biblical fellowship. You know, we all complain that today's church pales in light of the example of the Acts 2 church. Yet, we are always deflecting the responsibility to the pastor, the elders, the denomination. Yet, we are really the first one on the list aren't we.In ChristJeff

We attended this fellowship again yesterday. Pastor Brian, knowing me from our search for a new fellowship, mentioned to me that some of you have emailed him during the course of the past two weeks. He was greatly encouraged by your prayers and exhortations. Yesterdays sermon spoke to the heart. The word of God is able to discern the intents of our hearts. The sermon likewise did not tickle the heart. I know your prayers are bringing forth a work in this particular fellowship. Please continue. I have been in Pennsylvania this last week and have not had time to continue in this thread. I am waitning for Pastor Brian to update yesterday's sermon before continuing.God Bless you all who have interceded!In ChristJeff

Please listen to Pastor Brian exhort the congregation to begin to seek to do what Christians are called to do.http://www.copperhillchurch.org/sermons/Misc./christian%20community%20part%203.mp3In ChristJeff

Act 2:42 And they continued steadfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers I guess that would be a good place to start and to see that worked out in practical application you only need really look a couple of verses latterAll fellowship has its center in proper doctrine, unity and love, and the application of that doctrine in real life , or a practical expression of the Lord Jesus Christ in our daily lives.BTW I love the phrase "simplicity of heart".Act 2:44 And all who believed were together and had all things common. Act 2:45 And they sold their possessions and goods and distributed them to all, according as anyone had need. Act 2:46 And continuing with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, they shared food with gladness and simplicity of heart, Act 2:47 praising God and having favor with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily those who were being saved. :-)

Brother Doug wrote:All fellowship has its center in proper doctrine, unity and love, and the application of that doctrine in real life , or a practical expression of the Lord Jesus Christ in our daily lives.Yes, this is the picture that is painted of the Acts 2 church. We have all known this truth. We have all dreamed of this church. Most have become frustrated with the fact that we ourselves have not found this type of fellowship in our midst. Why? Pastor Brian calls it sin. It is our sin. We ourselves fall short. Why don't we live according to the teaching of the NT church? In ChristJeff

Col 3: 16 Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom, teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord. Pastor Brian in his last sermon dwelled upon this Scripture. He asked the congregation, "How many of you are teaching and admonishing one another in the word of God? Is this happening in your local congregations?In ChristJeff

If we are not teaching and admonishing one another in our local congregations, then, using reverse logic, can we assume that the word of God has not become a fountain of living water in our own lives? In ChristJeff

1 Cor 10:16 The cup of blessing which we bless, is it not the communion of the blood of Christ? The bread which we break, is it not the communion of the body of Christ? 17 For we, though many, are one bread and one body; for we all partake of that one bread. Eph. 4:1 I, therefore, the prisoner of the Lord, beseech you to walk worthy of the calling with which you were called, 2 with all lowliness and gentleness, with longsuffering, bearing with one another in love, 3 endeavoring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace. 4 There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called in one hope of your calling; 5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism; 6 one God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all. Eph. 4:11 And He Himself gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers, 12 for the equipping of the saints for the work of ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ, 13 till we all come to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a perfect man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ; In these Scriptures, Paul teaches about the unity of the church that is brought about by the work of the Holy Spirit. This unity is not something that comes automatically. Yet the promise is there for those who endeavor, those who submit to what Scripture paints as the manifestation of Christ in the spiritual body of believers. We ourselves lack much of what Scripture paints of the healthy church of Acts 2. Many of the Epistles point to those things which the Apostles recognized as stumbling blocks to the growth of the church in the unity of Christ. We have been given freely of His blood and His Life. We have entered into a spiritual body. Yet we all cry for something greater, we all speak of the Acts 2 church. In our spirit we know that there is more. Pauls solution is that we need to: 16 Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom, teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord. Is this the key that opens the door to Christ? In ChristJeff

Have you ever considered what Paul meant by this: teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord. What is there in the book of Psalms that can be used to teach and to admonish? What is a spiritual song? How does Christ work through spiritual songs? Can we truly say we believe if we are living apart from fellow believers?In ChristJeff

Hi Sis,I followed your postings on the Discernment thread and then checked out the site you posted yesterday about the fellowship you are currently attending. Please continue to share. In terms of what you said here, yes Scripture teaches that the majority of churches are not perfect. The point of this thread is not to confirm this truth, rather it is to point to why we continue to experience the sort of things that you have testified of in this post. Based on your testimony, why do we outgrow churches? I too have experienced this. I too have experienced the "lording over" of the congregation. I too have experienced the quenching of the Spirit because of the "control people." Fear of losing control drives many crazy who are building the church in their own strength. But the fear that is of God is quite another thing isn't it?God BlessIn ChristJeff

Are not the Psalms the new song? Are not the Psalms the cries of the heart of a believer? Psa. 51:0 To the Chief Musician. A Psalm of David when Nathan the prophet went to him, after he had gone in to Bathsheba. Psa. 51:1 \tHave mercy upon me, O God,\tAccording to Your lovingkindness;\tAccording to the multitude of Your tender mercies,\tBlot out my transgressions. 2 \tWash me thoroughly from my iniquity,\tAnd cleanse me from my sin. 3 \tFor I acknowledge my transgressions,\tAnd my sin is always before me. 4 \tAgainst You, You only, have I sinned,\tAnd done this evil in Your sight—\tThat You may be found just when You speak,\tAnd blameless when You judge. 5 \tBehold, I was brought forth in iniquity,\tAnd in sin my mother conceived me. 6 \tBehold, You desire truth in the inward parts,\tAnd in the hidden part You will make me to know wisdom. 7 \tPurge me with hyssop, and I shall be clean;\tWash me, and I shall be whiter than snow. 8 \tMake me hear joy and gladness,\tThat the bones You have broken may rejoice. 9 \tHide Your face from my sins,\tAnd blot out all my iniquities. 10 \tCreate in me a clean heart, O God,\tAnd renew a steadfast spirit within me. 11 \tDo not cast me away from Your presence,\tAnd do not take Your Holy Spirit from me. 12 \tRestore to me the joy of Your salvation,\tAnd uphold me by Your generous Spirit. 13 \tThen I will teach transgressors Your ways,\tAnd sinners shall be converted to You. 14 \tDeliver me from the guilt of bloodshed, O God,\tThe God of my salvation,\tAnd my tongue shall sing aloud of Your righteousness. 15 \tO Lord, open my lips,\tAnd my mouth shall show forth Your praise. 16 \tFor You do not desire sacrifice, or else I would give it;\tYou do not delight in burnt offering. 17 \tThe sacrifices of God are a broken spirit,\tA broken and a contrite heart—\tThese, O God, You will not despise. 18 \tDo good in Your good pleasure to Zion;\tBuild the walls of Jerusalem. 19 \tThen You shall be pleased with the sacrifices of righteousness,\tWith burnt offering and whole burnt offering;\tThen they shall offer bulls on Your altar. First, what do we learn from this Psalm? Where do we hear this in the NT?Psa. 51:1 \tHave mercy upon me, O God,\tAccording to Your lovingkindness;\tAccording to the multitude of Your tender mercies,\tBlot out my transgressions. 2 \tWash me thoroughly from my iniquity,\tAnd cleanse me from my sin. 1 John 1: 6 If we say that we have fellowship with Him, and walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth. 7 But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin. How might the first few verses in Psalm 51 impact authentic fellowship?In ChristJeff

Psa. 51:1 Have mercy upon me, O God, According to Your lovingkindness; According to the multitude of Your tender mercies, Blot out my transgressions. 2 Wash me thoroughly from my iniquity, And cleanse me from my sin. In this prayer, David acknowledges that it is only God, whom through His mercy, provides the means by which fellowship is maintained. God grants repentance through the power of the blood to wash, to cleanse one of his sins. This is the essences of the power of the blood is it not? Without the blood, fellowship is broken.The words of David teach us that it is not the blood sacrifice according to the law of Moses, but it is in the power of God that washes us of our sin. But why is this, in essence, the foundation on which all authentic fellowship rests? John writes:1 John 1:3 that which we have seen and heard we declare to you, that you also may have fellowship with us; and truly our fellowship is with the Father and with His Son Jesus Christ. 4 And these things we write to you that your joy may be full. All true fellowship is rooted in the right relationship with our Lord Jesus Christ. From the Root flows the means by which we might have true fellowship, authentic fellowship with one another. John gives us the reason for writing this epistle to the churches under him. 4 And these things we write to you that your joy may be full. The promise of joy in authentic fellowship finds it's source in the right relationship that comes through the power of the blood. The power of the blood continues to cleanse us of our iniquity. Without the blood, our iniquity would seperate us from fellowship with the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. It is God alone who provides the atonement which David speaks of in Psalm 51. These few verses in the book of Psalms provides us with the understanding of where the joy of fellowship finds its root. In ChristJeff

In Psalm 51:3 For I acknowledge my transgressions,And my sin is always before me. 4 Against You, You only, have I sinned,And done this evil in Your sight—That You may be found just when You speak,And blameless when You judge. 5 Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity,And in sin my mother conceived me. Apostle John writes in 1 John 1:"If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us."How do the thoughts of David and John reveal to us the reality of our situation before God? How should our hearts be? David for a time chose not to look at his own heart. God sent Nathan to admonish him of his own hearts condition. In the letter that John writes, his focus is on fellowship with God and man. When he states that "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us," he is not speaking to teach about a doctrinal issue. He is attacking the condition of the believer's heart. Just like Nathan was sent to admonish David, John seeks to establish that sin in our own hearts must be dealt with. Does God exist for the pleasure of man or will man exist for the pleasure of God? The first view will permit man to hide his sin, the second view will cause men to reveal their sin. This is the root of what hinders or stimulates Authentic fellowship.In ChristJeff

David writes:Psalm 516 \tBehold, You desire truth in the inward parts,\tAnd in the hidden part You will make me to know wisdom. 1 John 2:1My little children, these things I write to you, so that you may not sin...3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments.6 He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked.In the thoughts of David and John, we find that David prayes that God reveal to him in his inward parts the wisdom of God. The reason for this prayer is that David knows that in himself there is no understanding. It is only through the grace of God working from the inside of David that he would know how to abide with God. John declares that same precept. John declares that it is only through doing His commandments that we can walk with our Lord. And we know that unless two agree they cannot walk together. It is only through the Holy Spirit teaching us in our inward parts, the secret place that we come to know our Lord as we obey His voice. Do you see that first we must learn to love God in order to have authentic fellowship with one another. it is only through Jesus's loving instruction will we ever learn to love as Jesus loved us. Sin seperates us from Him and our fellow believers. In ChristJeff

Psalm 5110 \tCreate in me a clean heart, O God,\tAnd renew a steadfast spirit within me. 11 \tDo not cast me away from Your presence,\tAnd do not take Your Holy Spirit from me. 12 \tRestore to me the joy of Your salvation,\tAnd uphold me by Your generous Spirit. 13 \tThen I will teach transgressors Your ways,\tAnd sinners shall be converted to You. Now listen to Job 33:25 \tHis flesh shall be young like a child’s,\tHe shall return to the days of his youth. 26 \tHe shall pray to God, and He will delight in him,\tHe shall see His face with joy,\tFor He restores to man His righteousness. 27 \tThen he looks at men and says,\t“I have sinned, and perverted what was right,\tAnd it did not profit me.’ In both of these Scriptures we see a common precept don't we? We see that God restores to man His righteousness. We find that when men experience this grace from God, it is this grace that brings one to tell others of what God has done in them. David says: 13 \tThen I will teach transgressors Your ways,\tAnd sinners shall be converted to You. In Job this is said: 27 \tThen he looks at men and says,\t“I have sinned, and perverted what was right,\tAnd it did not profit me.’How often do we, as we fellowship with one another, hear this testimony from one another? Are we really learning from God these precepts?In ChristJeff

1 John 1:1John 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. First we must understand that sin is the thing that prevents us from drawing closer to our Lord and one another. If we treat sin, if we say that the blood of Christ has covered our sin, and yet we live without a sense of needing Him to deliver us from the sin that seperates us, "we deceive ourselves." 9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. What does it really mean that He both "forgives us our sins" and is faithful "to cleanse us from all unrighteousness."What does God require? What does He expect from us?Psalm 51:17 \tThe sacrifices of God are a broken spirit,\tA broken and a contrite heart—\tThese, O God, You will not despise. Psalm 119:25 \tMy soul clings to the dust;\tRevive me according to Your word. 26 \tI have declared my ways, and You answered me;\tTeach me Your statutes. 27 \tMake me understand the way of Your precepts;\tSo shall I meditate on Your wonderful works. 28 \tMy soul melts from heaviness;\tStrengthen me according to Your word. 29 \tRemove from me the way of lying,\tAnd grant me Your law graciously. 30 \tI have chosen the way of truth;\tYour judgments I have laid before me.31 \tI cling to Your testimonies;\tO LORD, do not put me to shame! 32 \tI will run the course of Your commandments,\tFor You shall enlarge my heart. These two sections of Scripture point to the condition of the heart. What is it that God works into us who walk with Him? It is said that "He is faithful and just...to cleanse us of all unrighteousness." Why is this cleansing needed so desperately by David in Psalm 51, why is the writer of Psalm 119 so broken by this desire to be cleansed? In ChristJeff

Psalm 5110 Create in me a clean heart, O God, And renew a steadfast spirit within me. 11 Do not cast me away from Your presence, And do not take Your Holy Spirit from me. 12 Restore to me the joy of Your salvation, And uphold me by Your generous Spirit. 1 John 11John 1:1 That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, concerning the Word of life— 2 the life was manifested, and we have seen, and bear witness, and declare to you that eternal life which was with the Father and was manifested to us— 3 that which we have seen and heard we declare to you, that you also may have fellowship with us; and truly our fellowship is with the Father and with His Son Jesus Christ. 4 And these things we write to you that your joy may be full. A clean heart equals joy of fellowship with God and man. These two men have experienced something that causes them to want to be with God. They have experienced the joy of abiding in Him. The burden is truly light for those who learn from Him. Authentic fellowship will bring one to desire from faith to faith a growing joy of walking in the light. 1John 2:7 Brethren, I write no new commandment to you, but an old commandment which you have had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which you heard from the beginning. 8 Again, a new commandment I write to you, which thing is true in Him and in you, because the darkness is passing away, and the true light is already shining. Is the darkness beginning to pass away? In ChristJeff

Psalm 11814 \tThe LORD is my strength and song,\tAnd He has become my salvation. 15 \tThe voice of rejoicing and salvation\tIs in the tents of the righteous;\tThe right hand of the LORD does valiantly. 16 \tThe right hand of the LORD is exalted;\tThe right hand of the LORD does valiantly. 17 \tI shall not die, but live,\tAnd declare the works of the LORD. 18 \tThe LORD has chastened me severely,\tBut He has not given me over to death. 19 \tOpen to me the gates of righteousness;\tI will go through them,\tAnd I will praise the LORD. 20 \tThis is the gate of the LORD,\tThrough which the righteous shall enter. 21 \tI will praise You,\tFor You have answered me,\tAnd have become my salvation. 22 \tThe stone which the builders rejected\tHas become the chief cornerstone. 23 \tThis was the LORD’S doing;\tIt is marvelous in our eyes. 24 \tThis is the day the LORD has made;\tWe will rejoice and be glad in it. Have you ever found yourself singing on the inside? Has the object of that song been the Lord? In ChristJeff

Psalm 11814 The LORD is my strength and song, And He has become my salvation. 15 The voice of rejoicing and salvation Is in the tents of the righteous; The right hand of the LORD does valiantly. These few words should paint a picture for those who are searching for authentic fellowship. Oh what a thought to dwell on!Eph. 3:14 For this reason I bow my knees to the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, 15 from whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named, 16 that He would grant you, according to the riches of His glory, to be strengthened with might through His Spirit in the inner man, 17 that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith; that you, being rooted and grounded in love, 18 may be able to comprehend with all the saints what is the width and length and depth and height— 19 to know the love of Christ which passes knowledge; that you may be filled with all the fullness of God. In ChristJeff

Psalm 11816 The right hand of the LORD is exalted; The right hand of the LORD does valiantly. 17 I shall not die, but live, And declare the works of the LORD. One is not ashamed of the gospel, the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes. The writer of Psalm 118 cannot hide the joy that he has found in the Lord who gives him His testimony. All glory be to the Father and our Lord Jesus the Christ.In ChristJeff

Have you ever been in a fellowship where the people are praising God for working in their lives day by day? Have you ever been in fellowship with those who are suffering? Have you ever shared in their suffering? Have you ever shared in one anothers song? Have you found the joy of the Lord to be the center of the fellowship? In ChristJeff

Timothy was warned by Paul.2 Timothy 3:1 But know this, that in the last days perilous times will come: 2 For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, 3 unloving, unforgiving, slanderers, without self-control, brutal, despisers of good, 4 traitors, headstrong, haughty, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, 5 having a form of godliness but denying its power. And from such people turn away! 6 For of this sort are those who creep into households and make captives of gullible women loaded down with sins, led away by various lusts, 7 always learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.Has the joy of fellowship been fleeting? Have you witnessed these attributes in men of today's church? They are always learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth. These men have a form of godliness yet they deny the power of God? What is Paul teaching Timothy about? In ChristJeff

Whenever Paul, John, Peter, and the rest of the NT writers teach about fellowship with God and with one another they always point to sin as being the source of division between both God and man. In the book of Hebrews, the writer points out that sin hardens the heart. The source of that sin is found in unbelief.Heb. 3:12 Beware, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God; 13 but exhort one another daily, while it is called “Today,” lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. 14 For we have become partakers of Christ if we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end, 15 while it is said:\t“Today, if you will hear His voice,\tDo not harden your hearts as in the rebellion.”Look closely, at these words, "Beware, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God."Now look to Paul's warning to Timothy once again...2Tim. 3:1 But know this, that in the last days perilous times will come: 2 For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, 3 unloving, unforgiving, slanderers, without self-control, brutal, despisers of good, 4 traitors, headstrong, haughty, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, 5 having a form of godliness but denying its power. How does the unbelief spoken of in Hebrews and verse 5 fit together? (having a form of godliness but denying its power)In ChristJeff

What does this Scripture call for amongst the brethren?Heb. 3:12 Beware, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God; 13 but exhort one another daily, while it is called “Today,” lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.How many obey this teaching of Scripture? "but exhort one another daily,...?Why would God want us to do this? How do our lives reflect the picture that is painted in Scripture concerning Authentic fellowship?In ChristJeff

Romans 12:Rom. 12:3 For I say, through the grace given to me, to everyone who is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think, but to think soberly, as God has dealt to each one a measure of faith. 4 For as we have many members in one body, but all the members do not have the same function, 5 so we, being many, are one body in Christ, and individually members of one another. 6 Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us, let us use them: if prophecy, let us prophesy in proportion to our faith; 7 or ministry, let us use it in our ministering; he who teaches, in teaching; 8 he who exhorts, in exhortation; he who gives, with liberality; he who leads, with diligence; he who shows mercy, with cheerfulness. Rom. 12:9 Let love be without hypocrisy. Abhor what is evil. Cling to what is good. 10 Be kindly affectionate to one another with brotherly love, in honor giving preference to one another; 11 not lagging in diligence, fervent in spirit, serving the Lord; 12 rejoicing in hope, patient in tribulation, continuing steadfastly in prayer; 13 distributing to the needs of the saints, given to hospitality. God has given us gifts of the Holy Spirit, so that we can use them to love one another in the body of Christ. Through the use of these gifts we learn to love as Christ loves us. Do we do this? In ChristJeff

How many times have we read this Scripture?Rom. 12:9 Let love be without hypocrisy. Abhor what is evil. Cling to what is good. 10 Be kindly affectionate to one another with brotherly love, in honor giving preference to one another; 11 not lagging in diligence, fervent in spirit, serving the Lord; 12 rejoicing in hope, patient in tribulation, continuing steadfastly in prayer; 13 distributing to the needs of the saints, given to hospitality. How many times have we applied this Scripture?In Christjeff

About 2 years ago I was deeply involved with doing the things of ministry. I was an elder, a children's ministry leader, involved with ministry training, a facilities maintenance type person, and a student of a local bible college. I also had a full time job and commuted in Los Angeles about 160 miles a day. And finally I am a husband and father. I thought I was doing what Paul called on us to do as believers. Rom. 12:9 Let love be without hypocrisy. Abhor what is evil. Cling to what is good. 10 Be kindly affectionate to one another with brotherly love, in honor giving preference to one another; 11 not lagging in diligence, fervent in spirit, serving the Lord; 12 rejoicing in hope, patient in tribulation, continuing steadfastly in prayer; 13 distributing to the needs of the saints, given to hospitality. There came a point where I began to be upset with all the people I was involved with. No one seemed to be growing in maturity. No one seemed to care whether spiritual growth was occuring. I quit everything in frustration. I searched for churches in the hope that I might find someone like minded. That endeavor became fruitless. Then God brought understanding to me that what I sought, what I expected was not what is. I had this imaginary romantic idea of what His church should be. This idea was not of God but of my own carnal mind. It was all about what I thought. I look back now to see how foolish I was. I can know Scripture. I can be given understanding of spiritual things. I can be given stewardship of His calling in my life. Yet, if I have not learned to love as He has called me to love, I am a clanging symbol. What I am beginning to see are the words of Scripture which call one to live in this way....Rom. 12:9 Let love be without hypocrisy. Abhor what is evil. Cling to what is good. 10 Be kindly affectionate to one another with brotherly love, in honor giving preference to one another; 11 not lagging in diligence, fervent in spirit, serving the Lord; 12 rejoicing in hope, patient in tribulation, continuing steadfastly in prayer; 13 distributing to the needs of the saints, given to hospitality. This is a way of life that is declared by God for His people...yet I know that I am not alone in how I sought to give up on His people... I sought to run away from MY frustrations...What I have found is that there is a whole lot of lovin that must take place in my life...I must begin to do what Scripture say I must do...Have you tried to run away?In ChristJeff

I had this imaginary romantic idea of what His church should be. This idea was not of God but of my own carnal mind. It was all about what I thought.Me too!!Church is like marriage. At first we have stardust in our eyes - unrealistic and idealized expectations. A psychologist once said, "You have to first fall OUT of love, before you can start to really love." In other words, we have to get past our infatuations. But, sadly many bail out when they hit reality. They don't want to rough it out. In church, we might not "bail out" physically, but in our heart, we might hold others at arms length and withhold from being vulnerable. Thus we sabatoge authentic fellowship. Not until the honeymoon is over can learn to love as Christ called us to, free from the tenticles of idolatrous desires pulling on others. Rookie, I can relate to your journey. I hope you continue to offer such edifying posts.Diane

Rookie and Diane,I can't tell you how many times I have wanted to walk away. People would seem to love when things were going good but when the problems came they were very hard to find. The Lord had to teach me from this verse:1 John 4:1919 We love him, because he first loved us. KJVI began to see it as the principle of sowing and reaping. If I wanted to be loved at all times then I had to plant the seeds of love at all times. The more I sacrificed what I wanted for the benefit of others the more I saw them do the same towards me.Rookie thanks for reminding us. How soon we forget.Jeff

I began to see it as the principle of sowing and reaping. If I wanted to be loved at all times then I had to plant the seeds of love at all times. The more I sacrificed what I wanted for the benefit of others the more I saw them do the same towards me.Coming into this realization is seeing the Light - a divine revelation. It is what Christ taught, but it is hard to grasp, perhaps because it is so rarely modeled, and also because it defies our nature. I have come to see that fellowship is not merely a "thing" of the church, but is an integral part of all aspects of our lives.There are times when God himself calls us away from the walls of our church "fellowship" and draws us into authentic fellowship with himself. There we learn of his love for us - and there we learn to love as Christ taught and modelled.But, I see no merit in bailing out simply because we are unwilling to love sacrificially. Diane

Sister Diane wrote:But, I see no merit in bailing out simply because we are unwilling to love sacrificiallyThis is the point where we all at one time in the past or in the time to come, fail...we start out in our own strength. We come to a point where that strength fails us. We are all different, we are all cared for by our Shepherd...we all experience the Life that is brought to us in a way that reveals to us His ways...We are brought to understanding that reveals God to us...We are brought to a point where we hear the call of God in our lives. We count the costs...We find that the costs are impossible to pay in our own strength...God then shows us the way...one day at a time...The way is found in the day to day life with our Shepherd...Our Shepherd will call us to seek Him in how we are to do the things Scripture has commanded us to do...Rom. 12:1 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that you present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable to God, which is your reasonable service. 2 And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God. Rom. 12:3 For I say, through the grace given to me, to everyone who is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think, but to think soberly, as God has dealt to each one a measure of faith. 4 For as we have many members in one body, but all the members do not have the same function, 5 so we, being many, are one body in Christ, and individually members of one another. 6 Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us, let us use them: if prophecy, let us prophesy in proportion to our faith; 7 or ministry, let us use it in our ministering; he who teaches, in teaching; 8 he who exhorts, in exhortation; he who gives, with liberality; he who leads, with diligence; he who shows mercy, with cheerfulness. Rom. 12:9 Let love be without hypocrisy. Abhor what is evil. Cling to what is good. 10 Be kindly affectionate to one another with brotherly love, in honor giving preference to one another; 11 not lagging in diligence, fervent in spirit, serving the Lord; 12 rejoicing in hope, patient in tribulation, continuing steadfastly in prayer; 13 distributing to the needs of the saints, given to hospitality. Rom. 12:14 Bless those who persecute you; bless and do not curse. 15 Rejoice with those who rejoice, and weep with those who weep. 16 Be of the same mind toward one another. Do not set your mind on high things, but associate with the humble. Do not be wise in your own opinion. Rom. 12:17 Repay no one evil for evil. Have regard for good things in the sight of all men. 18 If it is possible, as much as depends on you, live peaceably with all men. 19 Beloved, do not avenge yourselves, but rather give place to wrath; for it is written, “Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” says the Lord. 20 Therefore\t“If your enemy is hungry, feed him;\tIf he is thirsty, give him a drink;\tFor in so doing you will heap coals of fire on his head.”21 Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good. To live this Life, to love as Christ loves, one must begin to do what these Scriptures call us to do...As one steps out in faith, Jesus will teach us how to perform what these commands demand of us...This is His work...this is our salvation...In Christjeff

Sister Diane wrote:It is what Christ taught, but it is hard to grasp, perhaps because it is so rarely modeled, and also because it defies our nature. It is hard to grasp and it does defy our nature, that is, our fleshly nature. Jesus taught:John 6:63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.The things that are of our flesh are the things that seperate us from fellowship with our Lord and with one another. We see very little of the unity that comes with following Christ. Authentic fellowship suffers primarily because we allow sin to remain. We have not put to death the deeds of the body by the Spirit. We continue to try to improve our flesh. But what does Jesus say about our flesh? "The flesh profits nothing," from the work of the Spirit. Our hearts are sick. We are weak. There is very little joy, there is very little victory, there is very little strength. This sickness of heart is a direct result of our lack of meaningful fellowship with our Savior...In ChristJeff

Pastor Brian taught from Genesis 22 this weekend...He talked about a life that most never see...http://www.copperhillchurch.org/sermons/Genesis%20Series/Genesis22.mp3Authentic fellowship finds it's root in this kind of life.In ChristJeff

Eph. 4:17 This I say, therefore, and testify in the Lord, that you should no longer walk as the rest of the Gentiles walk, in the futility of their mind, 18 having their understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God, because of the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart; 19 who, being past feeling, have given themselves over to lewdness, to work all uncleanness with greediness. Eph. 4:20 But you have not so learned Christ, 21 if indeed you have heard Him and have been taught by Him, as the truth is in Jesus: 22 that you put off, concerning your former conduct, the old man which grows corrupt according to the deceitful lusts, 23 and be renewed in the spirit of your mind, 24 and that you put on the new man which was created according to God, in true righteousness and holiness. Paul is exhorting the Ephesians to leave the sinful ways of the Gentiles. Unity comes to those who live by faith in Christ. The manifestation of faith in Christ overcomes the sin that exists in the congregation. It is the existence of sin which cause the Ephesian congregation to not enjoy what Christ has given to all believers. Sin divides our churches today. The ordinance of authentic fellowship is given to us so that sin may be rooted out. The church is the means that God has given to those who enter into this spiritual body. It has been declared by God that His house must be a house of prayer...This is the place where the sick of heart come to be healed...In ChristJeff

Continuing on in Paul exhortation:Ephesians 4Eph. 4:25 Therefore, putting away lying, “Let each one of you speak truth with his neighbor,” for we are members of one another. 26 “Be angry, and do not sin”: do not let the sun go down on your wrath, 27 nor give place to the devil. 28 Let him who stole steal no longer, but rather let him labor, working with his hands what is good, that he may have something to give him who has need. 29 Let no corrupt word proceed out of your mouth, but what is good for necessary edification, that it may impart grace to the hearers. 30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. 31 Let all bitterness, wrath, anger, clamor, and evil speaking be put away from you, with all malice. Listen to the sin that was present and being practiced amongst the brethren of the church of Ephesus...Why does this condition exist in the church of Ephesus?In ChristJeff

Why does Paul point out the failings of the church of Ephesus? Because this is not what God has called His church to be... Listen to Paul's description of what the His church will be...Eph. 4:11 And He Himself gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers, 12 for the equipping of the saints for the work of ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ, 13 till we all come to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a perfect man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ; 14 that we should no longer be children, tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the trickery of men, in the cunning craftiness of deceitful plotting, 15 but, speaking the truth in love, may grow up in all things into Him who is the head—Christ— 16 from whom the whole body, joined and knit together by what every joint supplies, according to the effective working by which every part does its share, causes growth of the body for the edifying of itself in love. In ChristJeff

Eph. 4:11 And He Himself gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers, 12 for the equipping of the saints for the work of ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ, Where are these men today? How many are like the ones spoken of in Luke 16 where God has given them stewardships yet they do not go in...One cannot lead where he himself has not gone before...he can only heal superficially..Authentic fellowship finds its source in the life of Jesus Christ. The shepherds must enter into the gate which is found in Jesus Christ.In ChristJeff

This past Saturday, I attended a men's breakfast at the Copperhill Comunity Church which is lead by Pastor Brian. What I witnessed was that men are beginning to testify about what God is doing in their lives. Not all the men, but there is a sense of growing that permeated this fellowship. The men are beginning to reap what is being sowed and watered by Pastor Brian. The testimonies are not of what one once experienced when he was saved, but what one is experiencing this last 3 months, these last 3 weeks, these last few days. It is this kind of "life" that stirs other to seek the water that has the power to change what we hope for...There is a power that is unseen, that God has determined for those who seek to be part of fellowship with others who have entered into the spiritual body of Christ.And finally, the shepherd seems to grow more humble as he sees how wonderful his Shepherd is. In ChristJeff

One man in the group, spoke of how he once lived in Hollywood California. He spoke of how his life has continued to change in the past three years. He testified of how he looks back and sees that in each passing year he himself recognizes the change that has come upon him. He looks at his life now with a hope of looking forward to what God is going to do in his life in the years to come. How many men do you know who are a "living testimony" of what God is doing, not what He has done?In ChristJeff

1Pet. 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to His abundant mercy has begotten us again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4 to an inheritance incorruptible and undefiled and that does not fade away, reserved in heaven for you, 5 who are kept by the power of God through faith for salvation ready to be revealed in the last time. Peter speaks of a 'Living Hope." How many have the testimony of a "living hope." How is our life a testimony of this 'living hope?" The man I wrote of has this "living hope."In ChristJeff